# ING Direct



## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

Happy New Year everyone!

I'm trying to get my money situation back in control, which means looking at my banking habits.

Has anyone used ING Direct for savings or credit? If so, how are you liking it? Pros and Cons?

Thanks!


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

Yes, good question.
I'd like to know as well.


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## fcp101 (Mar 30, 2005)

I used an ING saving account to hold the profit from my house sale until my new house was finnish. Had no problems, setup the account online, sent them a void cheque from my TD account so I could transfer funds. Everything has been great so far. I've even set up another saving account for my son. The only problem, and I wouln't even call it a problem, was that when it came time to transfer a large sum back to TD for my house closing I had to call them, couldn't do it online.


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

how does one deposit cheques into a branchless bank?


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## jmlachance (Nov 6, 2005)

Used them so years ago for GIC's. Good rates. My wife also wants to set up some accounts for herself and the kids. 
Cons: If you live in a smaller community, you don't have access to your money the instant you need it. It has to be transferred to your other bank account ( at least that's the way it was at the time). If you live in a bigger community like Toronto, you may have access to their interac machines or other banking venues. Foreign bank:does the money go out of the country..?
Pros: You don't have access to your money as easily as a brick and mortar bank.
Interest rates are higher, at least 1-2% more


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## fcp101 (Mar 30, 2005)

You can withdraw money from anybank machine, but for deposits you have to transfer it from another account (TD, Royal Bank, CIBC, etc) they do have a branch on University Ave. downtown Toronto.


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

fcp101 said:


> You can withdraw money from anybank machine, but for deposits you have to transfer it from another account (TD, Royal Bank, CIBC, etc) they do have a branch on University Ave. downtown Toronto.


so i would deposit business cheque in my regular acct. and then x-fer them to my ING acct. via internet?

that's sort of what i do now for business -> personal, but all within the same institution


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## fcp101 (Mar 30, 2005)

Thats right


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

okay, so what about a 2 day delay in transfer? Does that still exist?

And dooes your first deposit have a minimum?

Macspectrm I think you can drop a check into the deposit drop box if you're near a branch.


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

Does anyone have a line of crdit with them?


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## Heart (Jan 16, 2001)

I have ING and have for about 5 years now...
In 2000 they were offering 5% interest - wish they still did.

I use ING for my Savings, a place to accumulate the extra and get a decent return on it ( via the better than average interest rate ).

You can access the money but it does take 2-3 days to transfer between ING and TD.

I have set up 3 accounts and automatic weekly deposits from my TD account.

I love ING and highly recommend it, for your SAVINGS account. Meaning the money that you only move around once and awhile, but that is OK, if you have a SAVINGS account that is to easily accessible you may not be able to actually save. :love2:


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## Heart (Jan 16, 2001)

I do not use ING for a mortgage or line of credit.

I do use ING for my car insurance but that was set up via my insurance broker, they were the cheapest and that is what the decision was based on.


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

hmmm, so it's kind of like withdrawing from paypal then... unless I go to the branch directly? Luckily there's only one here (ithink) and it's at least a 45 minute walk from my place. My goal is to save so that could be good.

Thanks Heart!


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## Jordan (Jul 20, 2002)

I have a savings account, mortgage, credit line and a RSP at ING.
Depositing money (transfer) there is usually a 10 day hold.
Transferring money from ING to a bank account is about 2 days.
The Mortgage took a bit to set up because they kept "misplacing" our application.
But otherwise I'm very happy with ING.


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## MannyP Design (Jun 8, 2000)

MACSPECTRUM said:


> how does one deposit cheques into a branchless bank?


Hasn't this been answered in a previous post of a similar topic recently? Or did you ignore the link I posted for you last time? 

http://ingdirect.ca/en/movingmoney.html


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

« MannyP Design » said:


> Hasn't this been answered in a previous post of a similar topic recently? Or did you ignore the link I posted for you last time?
> 
> http://ingdirect.ca/en/movingmoney.html


short term memory

if that flash presentation is any indication of their services I'll stick with my credit union
that presentation is horrible


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

I prefer to walk into my local bank branch and talk to real people. That by the way is still possible here in Alberta. That is except if you want to talk to a man. They're all females these days.


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## SLaw (Jun 5, 2004)

Does anyone know how's ING Direct compare to President Choice Financial? PC seems offer good rate on their saving acct too


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

Jordan said:


> I have a savings account, mortgage, credit line and a RSP at ING.
> Depositing money (transfer) there is usually a 10 day hold.
> Transferring money from ING to a bank account is about 2 days.
> The Mortgage took a bit to set up because they kept "misplacing" our application.
> But otherwise I'm very happy with ING.


Why would DEPOSITING money take 10 days? If they know your account they should easily recognise it and put it through?

Oh! And Jordan, what's your experience with the line of credit? Anything I should watch out for? Anything different than other banks?


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## shoe (Apr 6, 2005)

PC and ING are direct compettors both offer virtual banking without fees and have the same intrest rate on savings accounts Presidents Choice banking is a part of CIBC they offer a master card and Presidents choice points that can be used to buy Groceries, ing dosent offer any points but hey do have a sign up your friends $13 bonus for every friend you get to open an account. PC has machines at all the loblaws/Zerhs ect locations as well as a person you can talk to in the "branch" I belive you can also make your deposits with drawls from any CIBC machine as well without any problems or fees. My ex gf used to work for Presidents Choice Finacial in 3 depts so I heard alot about their call center, branch, and loan opperations.

Shoe


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## MannyP Design (Jun 8, 2000)

MACSPECTRUM said:


> short term memory
> 
> if that flash presentation is any indication of their services I'll stick with my credit union
> that presentation is horrible


Oh yeah? Let's see your credit union's flash presentation!

I thought so.


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## William (Jan 5, 2004)

I have, and have had for years, an ING Savings Account, but I use it only for certain special transactions. I depend instead on a combination of two other banks. One is President's Choice, on which I depend for day-to-day banking, but in which I keep as little money as possible, since even its so-called "Investment Savings Account" pays hardly any interest, and even less on its "Chequing Account." On the other hand, I can pay an unlimited number of bills electronically, or by cheque, for free. Deposits and withdrawals are easy (and free) because President Choice's account holders can use any CIBC ATM to deposit cheques (or cash) and to withdraw cash, also for free. (This is amazing: if I understand the matter correctly, CIBC account holders pay fees for ATM withdrawals). Transfers from/to Savings/Chequing accounts are also free. Or more precisely, are paid for by foregoing all but minimal interest on either of your accounts.

For a real savings account (i.e. paying a reasonably good rate of interest), I bank online (and if necessary by mail) with Achieva, an on-line credit union in Winnipeg that few people seem to have heard of, but which is has consistently paid (and is currently paying) the hightest rate I have seen anywhere, namely, 3.25%). Deposits into Achieva can be made either electronically (from President's Choice or any other bank), or by mail. Cheques and transfers are free. (I think they charge for bill payments, but that does not affect me.) One of the most important advantages of Achieva is that it has credit union status. And in Manitoba, all credit union deposits (and the interest thereon) are government guaranteed WITHOUT LIMITATIONS. This alone is worth keeping in mind.

I trust this helps, singing crow.


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## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

I can second for President's Choice Financial. 

I've done my banking there for years, and have been quite happy with their service. If you want less access to your money, that's another matter, but if you don't want to pay bank fees without giving up the most commonly used services, go with PCF if you can.


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## holy1 (Sep 14, 2003)

I use PC for cheuqing and icici bank for savings. ICICI is an indian bank that pays 3% on savings + 20$ signup bonus. Been with them for 6 months and have had no problems.


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## Sonal (Oct 2, 2003)

Question for PC Financial users--can you transfer easily between other CIBC accounts?

My business account is with CIBC. Right now, I pay myself a salary by transferring the money online. I'm considering moving my personal chequing account, but haven't figured this one out yet.


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## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

Not sure, but CIBC is probably treated like any other bank because PCF is run quite separately (except their mutual funds). Ask them, but I suspect it would require the standard interbank tranfer.


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

A lot of info here! 

Sonal pretty much asked the same question as I was going to ask, only my checking account is with TD, and I'm not ready to let that one go, and the PC website doesn't seem to answer the question. PCF for good reason I'm sure, seems to be very PC focussed. I'm really not interested in the point program - I don't use larger grocery store unless I'm desperate, liking my neighbourhoods bucher and fruiterie. I'm also interested in something long standing and ING Direct seems to have been around for decades.

My next visit will be to the Winnipeg Acheiva.

I want my decision to be fore the long term, not something I'll try then change. I've been with TD for 17 years and for the most part have been happy with thm up until their fees changed when they merged with CanadaTrust. So any and all oerspectives are totally welcome!

Thanks again!


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## Jordan (Jul 20, 2002)

singingcrow said:


> Why would DEPOSITING money take 10 days? If they know your account they should easily recognise it and put it through?
> 
> Oh! And Jordan, what's your experience with the line of credit? Anything I should watch out for? Anything different than other banks?



I'm not sure why the 10 day hold, I have a generous amount in my RSP and savings but yet they hold. I moved to a small remote community where I had to deposit my paycheque in the local bank here, transfer to ING, then transfer to TD where I pay all my bills and stuff. If it wasn't for the extra cash in the account I would have to wait the 10 days to transfer to TD.

Credit line, I just transfer what I want into my TD account. They do put a minimum payment on what you borrow, I borrowed $8000 one time and the minimum was about $300.


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## William (Jan 5, 2004)

Sonal said:


> Question for PC Financial users--can you transfer easily between other CIBC accounts?.



Yes, on-line.


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## SLaw (Jun 5, 2004)

William said:


> Yes, on-line.


You can transfer $ between accounts within CIBC or PC, but I don't think you can transfer $ between CIBC and PC accounts


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## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

Most banks should have a standard online interbank transfer (not sure about charges).


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

I'll call them all and check it out. What I want to hear about is what the website's and comercials don't tell you... the people's real experiences.


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## mr.steevo (Jul 22, 2005)

Hi singingcrow,

I just wanted to pipe in to say that rather than going to ING I chose to move to a bank that offered high interest savings accounts. I'm with Citizens Bank of Canada and chose it due to its ethical policy

https://www.citizensbank.ca/Personal/AboutUs/CorporateSocialResponsibility/

Their "high" interest is around 3% but I dont' know how that compairs to ING. Still, something to consider. Make money AND do some good.

s.


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

Checked it out mr. steevo and there seems to be a national bank, where I can do deposits/withrawals, not a five minute walk from my door. I don't know if that's a good thing or not (the withdrawal part of course).

Interesting concept. I'm going to call and talk to a human being about it all and see how it compares to ING.

How long have you been with them? Any problems? And do you tranfer to any other banks?


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## RobTheGob (Feb 10, 2003)

SINC said:


> I prefer to walk into my local bank branch and talk to real people. That by the way is still possible here in Alberta. That is except if you want to talk to a man. They're all females these days.


I *hate* having to go to a branch. It even bothers me that I have to walk past the dude at 7-11 when I'm going to the ABM...


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## Sun Dog (Jan 4, 2004)

If anyone wants that $13 referal bonus (where you get $13, and I get $13) just email me. All I would do is email you a signup advertisment from INGs website, with a referal code in it. When you call to set it up, you use that code, and we each get the bonus. Just email me, it's VERY simple.
[email protected]


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## ThirtyOne (Jan 18, 2003)

Resurecting this thread for a reason.

I'm looking to consolidate, and I've had a look at Achieva and Outlook Financial (both Manitoba online credit unions) and like what I see. They're compelling enough to want to make me ditch ING.

My question is this: what's the experience accessing either of those two banks (Achieva and Outlook) online on a Mac with Safari? I do about 99% of my banking online, and being able to access my accounts online is imperative. Does anybody have any experience? Their sys req pages suggest some really antiquated Mac browsers, and I'm afraid to open an account only to find out later that I can only get to my cash on a Windows machine running IE.


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## SkyHook (Jan 23, 2001)

.


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## Ariell (Mar 28, 2005)

*I give PCFinancial the thumbs up*



singingcrow said:


> I'll call them all and check it out. What I want to hear about is what the website's and comercials don't tell you... the people's real experiences.


singingcrow, I can understand your hesitation. When a friend first suggested I use PC Financial I was equally skeptical -- "I don't know. A supermarket bank???!  That just sounds really hokey." But I researched it, I took the plunge and I couldn't be happier. Five years later, I can honestly tell you I LOVE using PCFinancial. (How often do hear someone say that about _their_ bank?) I don't have a single bad thing to say about them. I have never wanted to do any sort of transaction that I couldn't do at PCFinancial. I only wish I knew about them earlier.

So here is my real experience....

I currently have a chequing account, a savings account, a Mastercard, and a line of credit with PCF.

I was using TD for years & reluctant to switch because like you, I thought it was 'safer'. It's not by the way. PCFinancial is underwritten by CIBC so it's the same as just using CIBC and therefore no more or less safe.

At TD, I was paying a monthly service charge plus transaction fees for going over my measly monthly limit. I was probably paying somewhere between $10-15/month in fees. That's alot to pay for 'security'.

At PCF, I get great interest, I pay no monthly fees, no transaction fees, no fees to pay bills, no fees to get new cheques, no fees to have cheques delivered to my home, no fees to use PCF or CIBC ATMs. In short I pay nothing. Why on earth would I want to bank anywhere else?

The only fee I've ever had is when I haven't been paying attention and my balance drops below 0. It used to just be a %, so maybe 50 cents but now I think the charge is $4 plus a percentage so it works out to maybe $5 but hey, that's just my own stupid fault. 

I use the chequing acct. for all my daily banking (deposits, bills etc) then transfer as much as I can to savings. There is NO hold time for deposits or transfers.The only hold is when you *transfer from* your savings account.. A 2 day hold I think. Which is actually kind of good because it makes you less likely to touch your savings.

Currently, the interest on savings accts. is 2.9%. Sure, I've thought about ING but I think their current rate is 3% so it's not enough for me to bother. 

And personally I kind of like the PC points thing. You accumulate points for each transaction so even if you don't do your food shopping there you accumulate points. And you can use it for other things. This summer for instance, I got $50 worth of flowers and plants for my garden using my PC points.

While the interest on the chequing acct. isn't going to make you rich, getting any $$ at all sure beats paying $$!

Their rate on the line of credit is prime + 1.25% so 6.5% currently. Let me tell you, getting that puppy was one of the smartest things I've done. A couple years ago, I had about $5000 on my credit cards (a couple big car repair and vet bills the main reasons) and while I was paying more than the minimum, I just couldn't get ahead. So I got the line of credit, paid off the credit cards and then whenever I did need to use the credit card again, I immediately paid it off with my line of credit. Now I just have $450 to go to get the line of credit down to 0. Woohoo! 

[Edit: they refer to the line of credit as a borrowing account in case you're looking for it on their website]

A credit card is great if you pay your montly balance in full. But if you're not, it doesn't make sense to pay up to 19% interest. Do yourself a favour. Consolidate. Pay it off with a line of credit. You'll be paying almost 2/3 less in interest.

The line of credit is tied into your banking card (you access it under 'savings' when using ATM or instore debit) should you need to access it . I try to never do this, but there have been a couple times I needed to. You can also transfer $$ easily to or from your line of credit by phone/ATM/online banking.

And although I've never used these services you can do all the typical things you can do in a 'real' bank like get a money order, bank draft, travellers cheques, etc. These of course are not free (though I think the TC are and you just pay a courier fee).

I know sometimes people stick with their old banks because it's just what they've always done and making that mental shift can be hard. So even though they know they're paying alot they like knowing they can go into a branch and talk to a 'real person'. But there's almost always a big line up to do this and you're paying alot in service fees to cover the cost of this. You can talk to a real person in any of the kiosks within Loblaws (I think they're open kind of typical 'bank' hours) plus their phone support is available from 7am-midnight. I've never seen a line-up in the kiosks and my experience with phone support has been that the wait times are always quite short and the people are actually polite.

The only recent issue I've had with PCF is with viewing my bank statements online using Safari. It used to work and everything else with online banking was fine, but that was an issue. Their tech support kind of sucked in trying to resolve it. You can read more in this thread here. You'll see that you can just use the debug menu in Safari or use Opera, or eek, even IE.

Other than the problem with viewing statements, I've been nothing but happy with PCF. Great interest, no fees, easy and totally convenient. In short, they rock. They blow all the 'major' banks out of the water. I would never ever switch back to a major bank again.

But that's just me. I totally understand that PCF won't meet everyone's needs. However, I strongly encourage you to do the math and not just stick with something because it's what you've always done.

OK, I think this post is long enough. Good luck!


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

LOL! Long enough? Yes, and everything I was looking for. In fact, I haven't sent my money off to anyone just yet, since my time got shorter to invest in looking at all the facts - this is good, it means business is growing - soooo....

Thank you for taking the time Ariell. I'm sure it took you a very long time to type it all out, but be assured, it will probably be used to help many more than you can imagine. You answered all my questions and more!

Take Care


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

This will be shorter I promise 

An associate in a similar business to mine has used PC banking and has nothing but praise for it.
I've heard the same from other clients.

The downside is no "branch" which we need for some of the variety of transactions in our business - otherwise I'd be there in a heartbeat. Canada Trust has been good to deal with while the CIBC retail nothing but grief. Glad we're well away from them.

Since PC banking depends on CIBC it goes to show the "respect level" retail customers get from management in the two organizations.

Often seems to me CIBC could care less .....they'd rather blow there brains out in Argentina 
Loblaws on the other hands wants your business.

Good post Ariell :clap:


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## webwiz23 (Dec 10, 2005)

i dont know if anyone has offered this but a PC banking account would offer the same intrest in a savings but with more accessablility. plus for a savings account it takes 1 day to transfer the money into your checking. so it gives you a think it over time.


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## firefly! (May 15, 2005)

*Help me, help you!*

A poor student's 2 cents: I think a good setup is to have a no-fee PCF chequing account and an ING savings account. Currently the interest offered by ING is 3%, and it is offering a $13 referral bonus. So, If you find this post useful and are considering signing up for an ING account, please pm me  

While Achieva and Outlook offer higher interest (~3.25%) savings accounts, they are less flexible when you want to be able to transfer money. So, what I would do is keep a low floor amount for everyday use in the PCF chequing account, and transfer the rest to your ING savings account. When the need arises, I believe ING offers you unlimited transfers, so you can transfer as needed. If money mobility is not an issue for you, then vy for Achieva or Outlook (they allow you one free transfer/debit per month); otherwise, I would go with ING. If you have savings in excess of $5000, which you know you will not need to dip into in the short-term, you should be looking at investing them instead to earn a higher return. 

I currently have the CIBC no-fees unlimited chequing account, but it requires maintaining a minimum balance of $2500. If you like to do your banking at a branch and be serviced by a teller, that might an option to consider. I, however, find online banking more convenient (no queues, etc.) and can't afford to maintain the minimum balance, so I'm going to switch to PC and deposit perhaps 700$ there while transferring the rest to ING. 

Whatever your banking decision becomes, remember to live long and prosper!


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

Thanks Firefly, definitely something to think about...

TD just sent me, and others I'm sure, a notice that our transaction fees are going up to $0.65 from $0.50 for all additional transactions over my plan. I'm not impressed. When they merged with Canada Trust the basic fees stayed the same, but now I have 10 transactions instead of unlimited green machine transactions and 5 ATM transactions. I guess the time has come to leave, although I have to say they do provide very good customer service.


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## razz (Sep 21, 2003)

I've been using ING for a few years now. I have both a high interest savings account, and a line of credit. No problems whatsoever.


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## ALICIA21 (Dec 17, 2008)

singingcrow said:


> Happy New Year everyone!
> 
> I'm trying to get my money situation back in control, which means looking at my banking habits.
> 
> ...


great article. I will bookmark this


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

Two words: Credit Union.

Don't fool around with fake banks we have in this country, online or bricks and mortar. With a Credit Union, you own a share, so they have to do their job because you are one of a few thousand bosses that their salary depends upon...


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## JoshuaP (Oct 13, 2009)

I noticed on *ING DIRECT Canada: Get $25 when you open an Investment Savings Account, RSP, Tax-Free Savings Account, or GIC* that ING Direct Canada is offering a sign up bonus of $25 when depositing $100 initially. So I thought, I’ll sign up for an account and get the $25 sign up bonus.

Cheers!


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