# Can I be forced to take a vacation, and is it a sneaky way of firing me?



## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

I'm just curious.. seems a little strange to me...

My boss is _suggesting_ that I take 2 weeks off. I normally don't take vacations, except for a day here and there.

Am I required to take these weeks off if my employer asks me to? Normally, I prefer to save most of the vacation days as a bonus pay in case my employment is terminated, since I don't make enough to have any savings. At this point, I have around 3 weeks worth.

I'm also a little suspicious with the '2 weeks' thing, since that's the required time they would need to give me if they were to be letting me go. Would this be some sneaky way of trying to get out of paying termination pay?

Advice is appreciated..


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## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

If you don't want a vacation, don't take it. Feel free to mention to your boss that you aren't making enough money to afford one...

However... if the suggestion comes because she thinks you're stressed out, or something that you're not telling us.... well.....


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

I have been stressed, and I think it's been noticeable to people in the office recently, not that I've done anything in particular. I suppose I could actually use the time off and summer is a good time for it.. I'm just a little suspicious since I've never been asked to take time off before.

Thing is, I mentioned that I'd prefer to take 1 week instead of 2, and my boss replied (all through email, always like this), he'd prefer if I take 2 (I have carry over from last year).. so that's where my suspicions are coming from.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Many workplaces dislike very much when their employees carry too much vacation time, and many, even unionized workplaces, specifically forbid carrying over more than one year's vacation into the next year. It's a common business practice to ask employees to use up their vacation. If they ever do let you go, there is less expense at the end of it, yes. But more likely they know that an employee who doesn't take vacation is more likely (on average, and nothing to do one individual) to be stressed and cause problems at work or require a bunch of sick time for stress at some point.

Offer to take the 3 weeks in 1 week increments, starting sooner rather than later, and specify which weeks now, in writing. When your employer agrees, that should assuage your fears. Make it two weeks in the next 2 months if you are uncomfortable using all 3 now, and say you'll take the 3rd week soon after. Employers also know that workers bank a lot of vacation time when the worker is planning to leave, giving them either a buffer between finding other work or double pay if they find it right away. You can make your employer happier by taking the time off.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

Where I work they don't like vacation pay-outs for unused vacation days and pretty much suggest that those days be taken before the fiscal year ends otherwise they are lost. My employer does not allow banking of vacation days which could be transferred into the next fiscal. They do however give us a vacation payout for overtime hours.

In your case it could be as simple as a change in policy regarding vacations.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

HowEver said:


> Employers also know that workers bank a lot of vacation time when the worker is planning to leave, giving them either a buffer between finding other work or double pay if they find it right away.


This is why I've been holding onto them. Honestly, I'm not happy where I am and there seems to be no opportunity for advancement, so I've been hanging onto these to help when I leave.

So what I need to know is, am I required to take them, or can I opt out and hold onto them?


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## CanadaRAM (Jul 24, 2005)

Check the labour laws in your province, but if the employer is paying you vacation pay, they can usually insist that you take it.

In BC: 

Government of B.C., Labour & Citizens' Services, Employment Standards Branch, Annual Vacation Fact Sheet



> An employer must make sure an employee takes all vacation within 12 months of the employee becoming entitled to it. Within these 12 months, the employer has the right to say when the vacation will be taken.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

CanadaRAM said:


> Check the labour laws in your province, but if the employer is paying you vacation pay, they can usually insist that you take it.
> 
> In BC:
> 
> Government of B.C., Labour & Citizens' Services, Employment Standards Branch, Annual Vacation Fact Sheet


Pretty much the same from Labour Canada:
Pamphlet 3 - Labour Standards - Annual Vacations


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## fjnmusic (Oct 29, 2006)

If you're stressed out, you probably should take some time off. Better than blasting a customer and getting fired. See how you feel after a couple of weeks. Of course, you could just ask your employer directly why they want you to take some time off. If it is for your mental health, then good. You can not be legally fired for medical reasons, no matter how much time you need off. Just make sure you have a doctor's note that suggests you need time off and for how long. The employer does not have to agree with the assessment but they do have to honor your doctor's note. Repeat: you can not be forced for medical reasons.

Sounds like your employer is trying to do you a favor without spelling it out. It may be very good advice. Everyone needs a holiday now and again.


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

fjnmusic said:


> Of course, you could just ask your employer directly why they want you to take some time off.


Agreed. Forget about beating around the bush. Ask your boss why he or she is insisting you take time off.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

It's true, like I said I could actually use the time off to chill out.

What I'd like to know is, hypothetically, can they give me 2 weeks notice on the last day before my vacation and use that time as notice thereby getting out of providing me with 2 weeks pay?


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## Sonal (Oct 2, 2003)

To the best of my knowledge no--even if you are on vacation, they need to pay you for that time.


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## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Given the new info you've shared.... maybe you should take those two weeks vacation now, and look for a new job....


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

CubaMark said:


> Given the new info you've shared.... maybe you should take those two weeks vacation now, and look for a new job....




Probably not a bad idea... I've been procrastinating long enough.


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## CanadaRAM (Jul 24, 2005)

In BC:



> # No compensation is required if an employee is given advance written notice of termination equal to the number of weeks for which the employee is eligible. Please note that this notice MUST be in writing.
> # An employee can also be given a combination of written notice and compensation equal to the number of weeks’ pay for which the employee is eligible.
> # *An employee cannot be on vacation*, leave, temporary layoff, strike or lockout, or be unavailable for work due to medical reasons during the notice period.


However you could be given working notice when you come back -- that is, they tell you in writing 2 or 3 weeks before the firing date, and you continue to work those 2 or 3 weeks for normal pay. Then no severance pay is required.


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## fjnmusic (Oct 29, 2006)

kloan said:


> It's true, like I said I could actually use the time off to chill out.
> 
> What I'd like to know is, hypothetically, can they give me 2 weeks notice on the last day before my vacation and use that time as notice thereby getting out of providing me with 2 weeks pay?


As I said before: see your doctor before you do anything else. You may well need more than two weeks if you are not well. How do you sleep? Has your appetitie changed? Do you worry alot? Do you feel depressed or anxious much of the time? 

Having a doctor's note will make you golden. If you take a leave for medical reasons, including depression or anxiety, you can not be fired, and must be provided a reasonable amount of time to get back on your feet when you return to work. I repeat: _it is against the law for you to be fired when you are on a medical leave_. But see your doctor first. get a referral to a psychiatrist if necessary. If you don't take these steps, you could certainly be fired.

There is no time line for healing when it comes to a medical leave, Healing takes as long as it takes. Does your company have a health plan? I took two and a half months off from job this year and did not lose any pay, and I returned to my job when I felt ready to handle it again. It's definitely worth investigating.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

While I could go that route, I certainly do have enough cause for it, I'd rather not go through all the trouble. That, and the kind of job this is and the situation I've been in, time won't heal these issues.. only change will.

I think the best course of action at this point is to take the 2 weeks vacation, use it to chill out, work on my resume and look for a new job.

As long as they can't use that vacation time as 2 weeks notice, or would still have to pay additional termination pay, then I'm not overly concerned if they do drop the ball the day before I leave for my break.


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## MikeyXX (Aug 2, 2008)

You earn vacation pay. The idea is that you take 2 weeks off and you've "earned" the pay over the year and they'll pay you during the 2 weeks (or whatever your vacation is).

So if you have all this banked, I wouldn't worry about it. They OWE you the time/money. If they want to give you 2 weeks notice, that's a separate issue.


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## winwintoo (Nov 9, 2004)

If you need medical attention get it now. Don't leave this job and take your medical problems somewhere else.

You've been given sound advice here. I've been through it. Changing jobs only helps for a little while but pretty soon the problems come back.

Depression is a real illness. It doesn't mean you are a bad person. If you're having personality issues at work, it could be a symptom of depression. You are not depressed because you have a bad work situation; you are not coping well at work because you suffer depression.

One of the symptoms of depression is denial. And it's true what they say, the person who is afflicted is always the last to know.

Go to your doctor. If I'm out to lunch, I will apologize. If you are angry after reading this post - that's a clue.

Margaret


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## BReligion (Jun 21, 2006)

I know someone already said this, but a lot of employers don't like to make payouts, it costs them more money than your taking of vacation.

For example if you are taking vacation, and they aren't paying someone to fill in your spot, i.e. just having your regular work divided among other employees/waiting for your return it definitely costs them less. 

They might even be trying to be proactive. It will cost them more in the long run if your stress level burns you out, and you go on a LOA due to stress rather than taking some vacation now.

One thing we used to do to eat up our vacation and OT banks (which we couldn't get paid out for either), was short weeks in the summer and at Christmas.

Take your weeks vacation now, then when you come back, take off the next 5 Fridays, to eat up the second "week".


BReligion


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

I'm not depressed, just want to make that clear.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

"Many workplaces dislike very much when their employees carry too much vacation time, and many, even unionized workplaces, specifically forbid carrying over more than one year's vacation into the next year." I agree with HowEver. I know that we are only allowed to have up to 30 days of vacation that can be accumulated. This does make some sense, since in 31 years I have taken about 60 vacation days in total, and they would owe me over two years of paid leave.

Lars also has a reasonable point with his suggestion that you "Ask your boss why he or she is insisting you take time off."


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

that is a good point, and I think I will


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

And if she is adamant, get her reasons, in writing.

Then you have something to hang on to, should your suspicions become fact.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

(he) 

thanks for the replies.. we'll see what happens.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

I hope you have a good vacation.

We are going on vacation this week. It will be nice to get away from The Hammer for a number of days, and get some fresh, clean air, as well as some time at the beach...


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Thanks, u too! 

Didn't get notice yesterday..

Now to relax for a few days, then get started on my resume and look for a new job!


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## lostchild (Jul 25, 2005)

i've heard of people who aren't sure what to do with their 3 week vacations, so they just go back to the office while on vacation.....

weird folk. 

consult your HR Manager/Rep

employers want you to take vacation. if anything happens related to stress/health, doesn't look too good in court!


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Also, they have a chance to see if anything untoward is going on, if you know what I mean.


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