# MacBook Air ! "the world's thinnest notebook"



## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

*.*

;


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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

*yes!!!*

YES!!

thank you!! The Keynote was getting a bit boring..!

Anyone know when we can order in Canada???


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

*More Wow!*

oh man!! the size is amazing! 13.3" too!!! wow!

--
MacBook Air is 0.16" to 0.76". The thickest part of the MacBook Air is thinner than the thinnest part of the Sony. It fits inside a envelope
--


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## tacsniper (Aug 27, 2007)

that is insane!!! I can't imagine throwing that macbook air across the campus with ease!


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## Phat Bastard (Jan 3, 2003)

The connector between the monitor and base looks pretty damn ugly in that first picture!!


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

How much does that little beast cost? and what are it's specs?!

Yar! I'm going to be all over this one for my new laptop!


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## tacsniper (Aug 27, 2007)

now lets see the price!


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## Artofilm (Mar 31, 2006)

The picture on the top of this page isn't the MacBook Air, thats their competitor, the sony Vaio.


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## Cor roC (Jun 20, 2007)

Where can I watch the Keynote?


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## krug1313 (Apr 27, 2007)

That was the Sony you posted. OMG.. It is a beauty.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Picture fixed.

Another:


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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

i wish i could watch this live!


Did they mention battery life?....


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)




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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

Think this will be it? the student pc-laptop killer?!


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

$1799 Us.


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## Phat Bastard (Jan 3, 2003)

Thanks for clearing up that issue with the picture! That thing didn't look at all like something Apple designed. 

Now the real Macbook Air looks beautiful!!!

$1799 is quite pricey for the specs you're getting...so you're definitely paying a premium for size and sexiness.


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## thejst (Feb 1, 2005)

meh. crippleware.


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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

if that is 1799$ USD... jeez that's a lot... then what are the MBP's? I hope they lower the price...

I guess you're paying for the slimness. Not the speed.


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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

*apple.ca*

Apple.ca has been updated.. nice pictures there of the machine..

At least the external drive is a superdrive.. 

I will probably order one tonight.. 

I wonder how well Bootcamp will work with this ?


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## JAGflyer (Jan 10, 2005)

What is a PATA hard drive?
What is a solid state hard drive
Why is one $3200 for a 13", 1.8ghz, 64 GB HD (solid state?)


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## tacsniper (Aug 27, 2007)

VNJ85 said:


> if that is 1799$ USD... jeez that's a lot... then what are the MBP's? I hope they lower the price...
> 
> I guess you're paying for the slimness. Not the speed.


don't expect any price change on MBP as its a completely different product. This will definitely be the student killers as its so thin, its an asset in our backpacks with those huge textbooks in it as well. You just watch, some rich kids will have this laptop in the next 2-3 months and a lot of them will flock to Apple, FS, BB in August to buy this macbook air! This makes the other "laptop" looks like a desktop!


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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

Typical they never mention battery life anywhere... (or do/did they?).


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

psxp said:


> Apple.ca has been updated.. nice pictures there of the machine..
> 
> anyone know if the external drive is DVD-R or CD-R ??


The name SuperDrive has been given to DVDRW drives. 

No FireWire ports which sucks but I'm glad they kep the 13.3 inch screen and didn't go smaller. Looks like a engineering marvel. A customer built CPU by Intel is probably making the other PC manufacturers wonder...

Personally, I'm more excited about the NAS drive.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

VNJ85 said:


> Typical they never mention battery life anywhere... (or do/did they?).


They did. 5hrs.


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

The MacBook Air is slow (in comparison to what is available), under featured, and overpriced. The MBA is unique, and cool, but at the same delivers little. You gain practically nothing at all except the loss of 2 pounds in comparison to the MacBook. (And MacBook's are already physically small as is.)

I understand the MBA is targeting a different kind of clientele, but I'm certainly not blown away by it (or its line of pricing). It will appeal to some, but hasn't won my vote just yet.


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## Eric0 (Nov 22, 2007)

I am so tempted to sell my Macbook Pro and buy one of these.


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## irontree (Oct 28, 2006)

My vote for worst product name ever! Air???? Like the running shoe?

*oh and BTW it took me forever to get in "server too busy" LOL what's it running on? An Atari 2600???


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

JAGflyer said:


> What is a PATA hard drive?
> What is a solid state hard drive
> Why is one $3200 for a 13", 1.8ghz, 64 GB HD (solid state?)


PATA is a standard ATA drive that's been around since the beginning of time.  (Slower than SATA.) PATA, ATA, IDE are more or less all the same thing.

SSD's are hard drives with no moving parts, and better performers than conventional ATA/SATA hard drives. (And less likely to break as they experience less wear and tear.)

SS drives (SSD): Solid-state drive - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.

_"A solid state drive (SSD) is a data storage device that uses solid-state memory to store persistent data. An SSD emulates a conventional hard disk drive, thus easily replacing it in any application. The actual definition of solid-state refers to the use of semiconductor devices rather than electron tubes, but has been adopted for the use of this more modern technology. *With no moving parts, a solid state drive largely eliminates seek time, latency and other electro-mechanical delays and failures associated with a conventional hard disk drive*._"

One of the models costs $3248 because Apple premium pricing is in effect.  The newer, tiny processors, combined with a SSD, are much more expensive than conventional CPU's and SATA hard drives, hence the price jump. The 1.8 GHz processor alone is several hundred more on top of the 1.6 GHz processor.


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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

Heh... i'll have a cheap chuckle the first time someone comes over to me and says they just got their MBA.

and yeah MBA for a product name... I would prefer MBL-MacBookLite or i dunno somehting different...


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

We should also note that the MacBook Air comes with 2GB of RAM standard because the entire amount of RAM is built-in to the logic board/non-upgradable. There are no RAM slots. 

In other words, it sucks if any of the RAM goes bad.


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## sadd3j (Aug 24, 2004)

Yea.. sounds more like a shoe than a computer.. Just don't see where this notebook goes.. more expensive but underpowered.. The MBAir targets those who's ONLY concern is size. Power/Price are out the window.


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## Megs_29 (Sep 25, 2007)

Wow.. he wasnt kidding about the SSHD being pricey...

$3248.00 FOR THE 64GB SSHD!!


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## da_jonesy (Jun 26, 2003)

Lars said:


> One of the models costs $3248 because Apple premium pricing is in effect.  The newer, tiny processors, combined with a SSD, are much more expensive than conventional CPU's and SATA hard drives, hence the price jump. The 1.8 GHz processor alone is several hundred more on top of the 1.6 GHz processor.


The pricing on the SSD is VERY disappointing. Flash memory is falling in price. For example.

USB 2.0 FLASH DRIVE - 8GB Product Category - USB STORAGE DRIVES. factorydirect.ca Computer and Electronics Liquidator is your New and refurbished computer peripherals retail and wholesale computer liquidation source. 6 Stores in Ontario, Canada.

That 8 GB flash drive is $39.99 if you do the math, 64 GB would cost about $320

Apple is way way off the mark on the SSD pricing.


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## elmer (Dec 19, 2002)

$1000 for SSD is funny, but people paid a lot of premium for black Macbooks and things like that, so I'm sure they'll sell some. It's a real milestone.

They should sell lots of Time Capsules with this, which may be a good strategy.

Anyway, it's kind of interesting because ... I guess the USB Superdrive will be essential if you want to run Windows?


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## Starkicker (Jun 12, 2007)

I'm in the market for a new laptop (coming from a 5 year old, 8lb Dell notebook tank). I was itching to buy this, but now I'm not so sure. I just need a laptop, I know in the last 5 years I've only used the cd-rom drive maybe 5 times (to reinstall XP ). I'm not sure if this is the laptop for me, either way I was getting the higher end MB or this, and the price difference isn't THAT bad between the two.

Those of you who know the zen of Macs, would this be a good buy for n00bs like me who have zero Mac OS X experience? I need a laptop as I plan to back to school later this year, but in all honesty, the 2 pound difference in weight between the 2 would hardly be noticable I think (for me anyways).


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

Megs_29 said:


> Wow.. he wasnt kidding about the SSHD being pricey...
> 
> $3248.00 FOR THE 64GB SSHD!!


It's $3248 for a better model, not just for the SSD. (1.8 vs. 1.6.) But yes, the upgrade to the SSD on the 1.6 is a $1024 option.


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## satchmo (May 26, 2005)

MacBook Air = G4 Cube

Apple's next flop. At $1900 (cdn), you've got to be kidding. It's sexy as hell, but unless you are a gadget head, or need absolute portability, save $700 and get a MacBook which has more features and speed.


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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

ehhh So how would Time Machine work?


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## elmer (Dec 19, 2002)

da_jonesy said:


> That 8 GB flash drive is $39.99 if you do the math, 64 GB would cost about $320
> 
> Apple is way way off the mark on the SSD pricing.


This drive is much higher density and probably faster as well. It's also on the leading edge of consumer products. I don't think it's a weird price at all.


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

Starkicker said:


> I'm in the market for a new laptop (coming from a 5 year old, 8lb Dell notebook tank). I was itching to buy this, but now I'm not so sure. I just need a laptop, I know in the last 5 years I've only used the cd-rom drive maybe 5 times (to reinstall XP ). I'm not sure if this is the laptop for me, either way I was getting the higher end MB or this, and the price difference isn't THAT bad between the two.
> 
> Those of you who know the zen of Macs, would this be a good buy for n00bs like me who have zero Mac OS X experience? I need a laptop as I plan to back to school later this year, but in all honesty, the 2 pound difference in weight between the 2 would hardly be noticable I think (for me anyways).


If this is your first Mac, don't buy a cut-down, over priced MBA. You're better off with _any_ MacBook model. As your first Mac, you may want more options and at least an optical drive that isn't sitting outside your computer.


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## Marc P. (Feb 9, 2003)

*Very disapointed...*

It's tiny, great!, but.... no Firewire, no hdmi (... where's Blue ray, hd video??), ho hum!

I'll wait for the next one, thank you very much.

Marc P.


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

Wow, that is pricey. 

That said, I'll probably get one, so anyone who wants to buy my brand new MacBook I got at Carbon a few days ago (1.5MB of RAM) make me an offer via PM. Don't need the bread, but looking to deal. 

Did they say when these babies would be in store?


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

Marc P. said:


> It's tiny, great!, but.... no Firewire, no hdmi (... where's Blue ray, hd video??), ho hum!


It's an ultra-portable, not a workstation.


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## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Hm. I wonder if the external SuperDrive will work on any Mac? (speaking as the owner of a 1st-gen MacBook with a CD-R drive)


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## Principal (Nov 28, 2004)

*big bezel*

that things got a bezel the same size as my imac, geez!


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## elmer (Dec 19, 2002)

Marc P. said:


> no Firewire,


Continuous backup to a 1TB 802.11n NAS kind of replaces the backup and extended storage application of Firewire.

But a lot of camcorder users will have to think twice. Huh - I guess WiFi camcorders are another spinoff.


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

elmer said:


> This drive is much higher density and probably faster as well. It's also on the leading edge of consumer products. I don't think it's a weird price at all.


Agreed. The largest Transcend internal solid-state drive listed on Amazon is 8 GB for $186. Add about $200 for 1.8" format.

Still, prices should keep dropping. The HDD option is probably a 1 or 2 year stopgap.


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

I wonder if the rumoured dock is still in the works, or if the idea was stillborn. It's hard to see what a dedicated dock w/ screen would add that you can't get by simply plugging in a monitor and connecting to other peripherals wirelessly (or not). Especially since the Air doesn't seem designed to be a primary computer.


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## yeeeha (Feb 16, 2007)

guytoronto said:


> It's an ultra-portable, not a workstation.


That's the aim of the Macbook Air (MBA). You install the bare minimum apps and tools when you are on the road with MBA.

Notice that the 80GB HDD is a 4200rpm PATA drive.

No ethernet port?? What if you go to a place with no wireless connection, the MBA might be fairly crippled connecting to a LAN and the Internet.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

cool because of it's size but basically all it is, is a MB with the superdrive removed to makes it smaller. If I was a mortgage broker or investor and always on the go meeting clients and such; I might buy one. My MB is small and not very heavy to carry.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

I'd much rather lug a 3 pound AirBook around campus than this MBP 15... :clap: I have been waiting for something like this since the last Duo was available. :clap: This is even better than the PB 12... :clap: 

Thank you Steve.... You must have been tapping in to my dreams/fantasies/hallucinations. :clap: 

I want it. I want it. I want it......... :clap: 

Because of this I'll even forgive SJ for the iPhone fiaso... :clap:


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## chas_m (Dec 2, 2007)

Lars said:


> You gain practically nothing at all *except the loss of 2 pounds* in comparison to the MacBook.


I'm not really defending the MBAir here, but um ... I think that's rather the _point_ of the MBAir??

The processor speed is largely moot, with 2GB RAM standard it WILL do what the average person wants done fast and lovely. 80GB is big enough for most people as well.

The geeks and nerds will focus on what it doesn't have, but if you look at it from a consumer perspective, particularly a reasonably flush consumer (Apple's target market), this thing presses a LOT of their buttons and is a fully capable machine. I'm predicting it will do well, not as well as the MacBook but pretty darn well.


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## Mr. Fartleberry (Dec 17, 2005)

satchmo said:


> MacBook Air = G4 Cube
> 
> Apple's next flop. At $1900 (cdn), you've got to be kidding. It's sexy as hell, but unless you are a gadget head, or need absolute portability, save $700 and get a MacBook which has more features and speed.


I concur Satch. I'd rather have an expandable one inch thick Toughbook for field use. The whole thin thing doesn't turn me on. I wonder how fragile these things are. And boy, they sure like that price point don't they?


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## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

satchmo said:


> MacBook Air = G4 Cube
> 
> Apple's next flop. At $1900 (cdn), you've got to be kidding. It's sexy as hell, but unless you are a gadget head, or need absolute portability, save $700 and get a MacBook which has more features and speed.


I agree. This a classic example of a solution in search of a problem. Not even the Jobsian Reality Distortion Field can save this one. Frankly I don't see where the market is for this product. I don't even buy the convenience angle to this thing. I don't know about anyone else, but it's been a long time since I've heard anyone say "gosh I'd buy a notebook, but they are just too darn heavy and thick." 

With the MacBook Air you get the same amount of storage and processing power, fewer options on peripherals, the equivalent of $50 in bonus RAM and a slightly fancier trackpad...for $700 more than a typical MacBook.

That said, one thing is for certain with the MBA. 

It is guaranteed to make your cash vanish...into thin air.


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## Cor roC (Jun 20, 2007)

I just watched the Guided Tour Video of the MBA.... the new trackpad features are diggable. 
Any chance they'll be able to update my MBP to do those kinds of tricks (zoom, swipe, rotate), or would they have to take apart my MBP to do it..?


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## Another_Paul (Sep 20, 2005)

Judging from some pics of the notebook, it looks like the battery is built-in? I hope it's a user-replaceable part. Who would want a 2K notebook after the battery wears out?


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Base model educational price - $1799.... Do-able!!


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

MacBook Air:
1.6 Core 2 Duo
80 GB HDD
2GB DDR 667 RAM
13" screen
+ External SuperDrive

1999$ CAD


Current Sony TZ series portable:
1.06 Core 2 Duo
100 GB HDD
1 GB DDR 533 RAM
11" screen
Optical drive included

2199$ CAD _on sale_. Was 2499$ just a few weeks ago.


In the ultra portable world you're catering to a specific niche. If you look back over the models that have been produced over the last 5 years they all either sacrifice horsepower, the optical drive, or both to keep costs down and battery life up. Smaller components are more costly, whether because they are harder to make or made in smaler quantities or both.

So while two grand isn't exactly ideal, it's not exactly out of line with the markets pricing.


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## Marc P. (Feb 9, 2003)

*They present it as a "no compromise" ultra portable*



guytoronto said:


> It's an ultra-portable, not a workstation.


Unless I'm mistaken, an HDMI port is not very big. Also, the MacBook Air ad states that Apple "did not compromise with this ultra portable where other manufacturers have compromised, keyboard and display". Well, they DID compromise where others have and that is on the ports. At least, if they had a proprietary option (some sort of dock) to have these ports... but no!

They present this as a no compromise ultra portable... with a few compromises!

We could argue this till morning, but for me anyway, I could live with no hdmi for now, but the non-inclusion of what we've come to expect as a given for any Mac computer - the FW port - is inexcusable!

As the kind of mac user that has only a portable and no other mac and a need for FW for digital video and fast file transfers, this "Powerbook-lite" would have interested me with a FW port, but as is, it simply doesn't, that's all.

Marc P.


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## Mr. Fartleberry (Dec 17, 2005)

This is probably targeted at the people that will option out a blackbook out to 2 grand and more. No MB Air-head for me. 

And just when are these monitors going to become "end of life"? (not there's anything wrong with them other than price) ... (and they don't have any ports) ... (or swivel vertical for portrait editing) ... 

Yeah $3248. Steve you funny man ...


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

Cor roC said:


> I just watched the Guided Tour Video of the MBA.... the new trackpad features are diggable.
> Any chance they'll be able to update my MBP to do those kinds of tricks (zoom, swipe, rotate), or would they have to take apart my MBP to do it..?


The multi-touch trackpad cannot be retrofitted into any existing Mac.


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## Mr. Fartleberry (Dec 17, 2005)

*World's Biggest iPod?*

Any one see a battery on this? 

Bah, enough bad news for one day.


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## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

*MBA - no user-replaceable battery*

This isn't going to go over well with some. But I guess if you're prepared to pay a $700 premium everything's up for grabs...

MacBook Air doesn't have a user-replaceable battery - Engadget


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## MacGenius (Nov 13, 2001)

Comparing the MBA to a G4 Cube I think is a bit harsh. The Cube was a nice product but priced really too high for what it was really worth.

The move to Intel CPUs however has made Apple very competitive in the market. Go have a look at other PC machines of the same calibre as the MBA and you'll soon realize just how well priced it really is.
Consider the fact you have to deal with Vista, no decent iLife-like suite, smaller screens, no multi-touch (and much smaller trackpads. What is it with PC manufacturers and those really small trackpads anyhow?), no backlit keyboard etc...

Nope, good value all around considering some shortcomings from being so thin. 
I took the plunge. Too bad I can't have it right now before I leave on vacation on Friday....


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## Eric0 (Nov 22, 2007)

I have a feeling future versions may include a removable battery of sorts. As a business traveller, a removable battery is invaluable on long flights without plugs. 

5 hr battery life is nothing compared to the 11.5 you can get with Sony's highcap TZ series battery.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Meh, I'm not excited about this one in the least....

I wanted an ultra-portable, but they went the wrong way with it. It's still too big IMO.. I wanted an ULTRA-PORTABLE, not ultra THIN.... we're going to be seeing a LOT of these breaking and people complaining.

1 USB port? _micro_ DVI (great, yet ANOTHER adapter needed - *EDIT: looks like that's included, that's nice of them* ), NO audio input (huge negative for me, means no live recording without an external USB device), slower that useable HDD unless you opt for the ridiculously expensive SSD (and those 4200rpm 1.8" drives have a HUGE failure rate), _on-board_ memory (yeah, 2GB is pretty decent, but still...) and it's not user upgradeable at all (that matters to some people).

Just about the only thing they got right is they FINALLY added a backlit keyboard.. the Macbooks should've had these from the beginning.

Maybe I just don't give a crap anymore, but these keynotes don't get me going.. the new products always seem to be going the wrong direction for me... aside from the iPhone, still love mine...


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

Seriously, what the hell would you do with an HDMI port on an ultra-portable with limited RAM/HDD Space/GPU? Your missing the target market totally. 

Pound for pound (weight vs. performance/features), this is the most portable (thinnest/lightest) notebook on the planet (I think). PC manufactures charge a HUGE premium for portability like this. Apple's pricing, is much cheaper then others. It seems pretty reasonable to have such an engineering feat at less then market pricing. However, historically, Apple did not charge that much of a premium for portability on their notebooks. 

There is a market for these, and its' not most of us. 

PC World - Chart - Top 10 Ultraportable Laptops


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Did I say where's the HDMI port? No, I was just complaining that I'd need to buy another adapter, and it was coupled with the 1USB port complaint.

I am the market, I've been waiting for an *ultra-portable* from Apple for years, but they missed the mark with this for me. I don't consider this an ultra-portable, by definition, it isn't. It's _THIN_, whoopdee frickin doo.. we don't need that thin, it's pointless.

I think it's safe to assume lots of people share this opinion. I've read lots of comments from people who were hoping for a smaller dimensional laptop, not just really, really rediculously thin... and no, I don't think this is the most portable laptop on the planet.

I'm not complaining about the price though, that's what I expected this to sell for.. I'm just disappointed with the incredibly lacking in versatility and function sacrificed over vertical shortcomings.


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## Eric0 (Nov 22, 2007)

MACinist said:


> Seriously, what the hell would you do with an HDMI port on an ultra-portable with limited RAM/HDD Space/GPU? Your missing the target market totally.
> 
> There is a market for these, and its' not most of us.


I agree. 

If your looking for power, performance and ports; go for a Macbook Pro.

If you need to move around often with only a carry-on or shoulder bag; go for a macbook air. 

I mean who does recording/mixing/large scale editing on a Macbook let alone an ultra portable?


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Eric0 said:


> I mean who does recording/mixing/large scale editing on a Macbook let alone an ultra portable?


I do.

Ever heard of live recording? Do I really want to set up a Mac Pro every time I'm going to a gig to record a live event, or a band jam?

Yeah, I could use my Macbook, but I was looking forward to a slick new product, which I'm not denying this is, it just doesn't live up to my expectations and desires.

Satisfied? Or do you want to dissect more of my comments....


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

kloan said:


> Did I say where's the HDMI port? No, I was just complaining that I'd need to buy another adapter


Huh?



kloan said:


> whoopdee frickin doo..


You must live.... IN A VAN DOWN BY THE RIVER! 



kloan said:


> .. and no, I don't think this is the most portable laptop on the planet.


Then read what I wrote again (performance per pound it probably is, but please enlighten me with an example if otherwise).


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

I read every word, but I'm not sure why "performance per pound" has any relevance to what I'm referring to. It's thin, it's relatively fast, it has a nice amount of ram, yadda yadda yadda.... but it's not a true ultra-portable. That's all I'm saying. It could have a G3 processor in it, or a Xeon dual 3.0, that's not the point I'm making.

I'm just saying it's not perfect, and geeze man, can't I expect perfection??? It's my right as an unrelenting wishful thinking consumer and Mac fan.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

kloan said:


> Ever heard of live recording? Do I really want to set up a Mac Pro every time I'm going to a gig to record a live event, or a band jam?
> 
> Yeah, I could use my Macbook, but I was looking forward to a slick new product, which I'm not denying this is, it just doesn't live up to my expectations and desires.


Um. The rumours about htis have always been about it being an ultra portable, so my question is why would you be expecting anything other than an ultra portable?


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

PosterBoy said:


> Um. The rumours about htis have always been about it being an ultra portable, so my question is why would you be expecting anything other than an ultra portable?


What?

Umm, I'm not sure what your point is.. cuz all I've been saying is that I don't think it is an ultra portable, and even if it were (which I don't feel it is), why does that mean it shouldn't have more ports?

Great, it's the "World's thinnest notebook"... yet again they win the award for a feature no one was asking for.

Anyway, I just hope they put some sort of skeletal structure in this thing to make it strong enough to resist impacts, because the Macbook Pros sure as hell don't.. not that they suffer broken screens on a regular basis, but there sure is a lot of flexing in the lid, and with a thin laptop like this, I could see some pretty sad owners posting in the near future.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Eric0 said:


> If your recording a band jam session wouldn't you want to use an external device anyways with more inputs?


Nah, cuz I like to set up spontaneously and quickly... I used to lug around a huge bag with all the gear I needed, but I found it cumbersome, and stopped altogether.. took too much time to set up.

Unless there's something new along the lines of a USB audio i/o on the market with zero latency I don't know about... haven't looked into it in a while....


This could just be me bitching and whining because I'm trying to convince myself I don't like it so I don't go and sell a bunch of my stuff so I can buy one.... :lmao:


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## csonni (Feb 8, 2001)

Way overpriced. I'd never think of swapping my MacBook/Pro for this thing. I suppose it may attract someone, but I wouldn't consider it at all.


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## Eric0 (Nov 22, 2007)

Would be cool to have a skeleton of sorts. That's definitely a long way off though.


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## MacGYVER (Apr 15, 2005)

So who is the market?

1. Not people who are still jogging with their CD players in hand.
2. Not people who pack every single CD and DVD movie in their luggage or hand bag to watch on the airplane.
3. Not people who work in film, carry around an older video camcorder or produce music and need to rip to CD or DVD. 

I wish I had this laptop back in 2006 for the winter olympics, just the weight alone would have been awesome. I found lugging around any mac laptop on my travels was a pain in the rear when it gets up to around 5lbs or more. This would have fit the bill nicely. 

Who needs FW 400 these days? The masses using Windows get by just fine using USB 2 for transferring video and pictures, so why can't we adopt as Mac users? I say that argument is dead. Anyone who wants or needs FW or faster speed isn't looking at buying a MBA, you're looking at a starter MBP series and nothing less. Lets be realistic here and stop the complaints already.

For the person above who says the battery will die on the airplane? No it won't as Apple is providing a Magsafe flight adapter plug, to plug your MBA in while in flight as an accessory. I believe Apple has provided this for most of their MB and MBP line up for quite some time now?

Blue Ray on a 13.3 screen? Really? Why would you let your eyes watch something like Blue Ray on such a tiny screen? What benefits are there of Blue Ray on a MBA versus a nice big screen t.v., screen or monitor? I really can't come up with any at this point. Just out of curiosity, have the automobile manufacturers installed Blue Ray into their dvd mobile units such as Chryslers Mini vans? Perhaps they have...

Over the years I have reduced a lot of waste with regards to not buying music CDs, perhaps one day I can do the same for movies and major software packages. I really don't mind downloading music or movies, and most software can be done this way, except for certain ones that do require it to be on DVD. But I would love to see one day where I am downloading the latest OS X from Apple's servers and not needing to buy a box or envelope that produces waste.


----------



## Chealion (Jan 16, 2001)

Eric0 said:


> 5 hr battery life is nothing compared to the 11.5 you can get with Sony's highcap TZ series battery.


FWIW, the 5 hour number is when wireless is turned on. I wonder how much it improves when it's turned off? I doubt 11.5 hours, but I'd guess 6 or 7 hours running "silent". However Apple doesn't say anything about that.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

MacGYVER said:


> I found lugging around any mac laptop on my travels was a pain in the rear when it gets up to around 5lbs or more. This would have fit the bill nicely.


Man do I hear that! The ONLY reason I got an MBP15 is because Apple terminated the PB 12" and I needed a new one. I was always a big fan of the Duo series - it always seemed such a great idea to leave all the heavy extras behind. I guess I never got over the easy portability of the original PB 100. Seems somehow Apple has come full circle.

The MBP is cool in its way but I just don't need to lug a whole studio around with me. 

At going on 62 the difference in weight is going to make my life easier lugging my stuff to lectures and just generally getting around with it.


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## Eric0 (Nov 22, 2007)

Chealion said:


> FWIW, the 5 hour number is when wireless is turned on. I wonder how much it improves when it's turned off? I doubt 11.5 hours, but I'd guess 6 or 7 hours running "silent". However Apple doesn't say anything about that.


It's not that the battery isn't fit for 95% of days. 5 hours is good enough for a Toronto to Vancouver flight.

But it would be nice if it were removable for those Air Canada flights to Europe that still use old planes where there are no adapter or standard 120v plugs.


----------



## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

LOL.... "wireless migration assistant".... I wonder how long _that'd_ take....

Do we have that 'remote disk' feature? Or is that a macbook air specific thing?


----------



## jlevett (Sep 19, 2007)

I have a 5yo Dell Celeron (I know, I know) laptop at home that I have been wanting to get rid of for months but I was waiting for today to see the new toys. For what I do at home, it's going to the MB for me. The MBA is pretty and all and for a while, I was going to get it, but at $450 more than the mid-range MB with just a few cool new features, no deal I'm afraid.


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## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

*Add "no RAM upgrades" to the list of MBA drawbacks*

According to macrumours.com's first look at the MBA, the RAM is soldered to the motherboard. The caveats to this thing just keep on coming.

Mac Rumors: First Look at the MacBook Air


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

(( p g )) said:


> According to macrumours.com's first look at the MBA, the RAM is soldered to the motherboard. The caveats to this thing just keep on coming.
> 
> Mac Rumors: First Look at the MacBook Air


Yep, on Apple's website it's mentioned as 2GB on-board memory....

I know where they were going with this.. it's like the iPod, make it thin enough, it _seems_ smaller... so yeah this is gonna feel pretty small and light, but it's just a shame they sacrificed so much to do it.


----------



## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

Here's one of the first reviews: Macworld | Hands on with the MacBook Air


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## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

kloan said:


> ...it's just a shame they sacrificed so much to do it.


Precisely. I'm always happy to see that Apple's willing to push the envelope with its ideas, but as an investor I also look at the bottom line and ask if the product is going to sell well. With the MBA, there are just too many things you give up. 

I'd love to be wrong about this. And maybe things will change if/when the price of flash RAM drops, but in the short-term I just can't see a lot of people choosing it over (a) the affordable MB or (b) the performance oriented MBP.

One thing I do think they're right about is the decision to drop the optical drive in favour of a software + wireless solution. It cuts out something that many won't even notice they're missing unless they need to re-install the OS. And even then the Remote Hardware idea seems to be a good one.


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## ericlewis91 (Jul 12, 2007)

*hey*

guess what guys


i just ordered the baselineone on apple education store

with external drive

shipping Feb 3-6

EDIT: cancelled order

when batter dies in 3 years..its going to be a pain in the ass and expensive

so i cancelled


----------



## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Absolutely, I've always been in favour of using an external optical drive, making the laptop smaller.. since the drive isn't always a necessity.

Well, I'm still a big fan of my Eee PC over this... it's a true ultra-portable, albeit not much use for anything such as audio recording or anything like that.. but at least it's tiny.



ericlewis91 said:


> guess what guys
> 
> 
> i just ordered the baselineone on apple education store
> ...


cool man, post lots of pics when you get it....


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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

As a student I can see this laptop being great. 

For the things a student 'needs' it has the speed and the space for it. For just websurfing, emailing, music, video files, ppt/keynotes, MSWord, Excel it seems to me the MBA is a great choice. 

Go home, load programs/whatever via the external cd drive, backup via time machine. D/l music and video's, pack up and head off to school/travel and voila!

Ok not having an optical drive is a major bummer since you can't load in dvd's while on the travel go... w/e not the end of the world I can think of a bunch of ways to get movies onto my laptop  (furthermore Apple is pushing for people to purchase tv/movies from itunes... not so terrible)..

Anyhow all in all this thing resembles more of a really giant ipod touch with a keypad.

p.s. as for wireless cd/dvd/whatever drives from networked computers... in my experience according to the volume of data needed to be transferred wirelessly it has always seemed to me the performance has been poor... i would not look favorably to loading dvd's or installing programs wirelessly. I'm on an older MBP stuck with 'G'. Although I have no experience with N technology so maybe that changes the tide a bit...

p.p.s. as for when someone's OSX gets accidentally corrupted and needs to reinstall OSX via wifi... can't imagine what slick way they have the wireless card working even when the OS isn't working... I assume it can only be done via external DVD drive.

edit: looking forward to reviews in Feb.


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## ericlewis91 (Jul 12, 2007)

sorry

i cancelled my order

non replaceable battery will cost alot in 3 years to replace!


----------



## Mr. Fartleberry (Dec 17, 2005)

ericlewis91 said:


> sorry
> 
> i cancelled my order
> 
> non replaceable battery will cost alot in 3 years to replace!


You are also dead-ended with the RAM as well. 

*Keynote video just posted on the site*. Maybe I just need a good sales job.


----------



## psxp (May 23, 2006)

*Decisions*

Hey,

Have been holding off a Macbook purchase to see what Apple comes up with.

Maybe I have too much off their kool-aid, but I can see where this has use..

If I needed a desktop replacement machine, then I would get a MacPro.

This Macbook air is designed for those who want a very Portable simple solution. I have Portable Media Player (Archos 605) which I take with me and can watch movies when on the road. Ie. plug into the TV or with this new macbook, copy the files to the macbook digitally.. probably even over wifi!! Sweet...

I love the fact it has the larger screen, and full keyboard but 11" would have been nice. The backlit keyboard is good too.

The more I think of the MBA, the more I Understand it.. though, wish it came with a docking station or 2+ USB ports. 

Firewire will be missed (no editing of DV video straight from my camera.. but then, isnt everything going to digital nowadays? ie SD Video cams?)

Just read this on the MacWorld review:
"Finally, it’s worth mentioning that the MacBook Air’s tiny .16-inch thin front side still has room for two pieces of actual hardware: an infrared receiver and the ubiquitous pulsating sleep light"

hooray!! I presume still can use my mac remote ;-)

Can anyone tell me how much space an install of Leopard takes up?

B.


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## ericlewis91 (Jul 12, 2007)

psxp said:


> Hey,
> 
> Have been holding off a Macbook purchase to see what Apple comes up with.
> 
> ...


around 7-8gbs depending on how many printer drivers you have?

then iLife 08? is like 10gbs


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## Greenman (Feb 22, 2003)

Eric0 said:


> It's not that the battery isn't fit for 95% of days. 5 hours is good enough for a Toronto to Vancouver flight.
> 
> But it would be nice if it were removable for those Air Canada flights to Europe that still use old planes where there are no adapter or standard 120v plugs.


Hmmmm.... a trip from Toronto to Vancouver....

maybe I'm way off here but has anyone noticed the 'specs' 

Electrical and operating requirements
Line voltage: 100V to 240V AC
Frequency: 50Hz to 60Hz
Operating temperature: 50° to 95°F (10° to 35°C)
Storage temperature: -13° to 113°F (-24° to 45°C)
Relative humidity: 0% to 90% noncondensing
Maximum operating altitude: 10,000 feet
Maximum storage altitude: 15,000 feet
Maximum shipping altitude: 35,000 feet

Maximum operating altitude - 10,000 feet!!!


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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

Greenman said:


> Hmmmm.... a trip from Toronto to Vancouver....
> 
> maybe I'm way off here but has anyone noticed the 'specs'
> :
> ...


lol! Probably for an unpressurized aircraft... those guys flying around in their cesna's etc to the cottage. ;-)


----------



## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

ericlewis91 said:


> non replaceable battery will cost alot in 3 years to replace!


Based on what, exactly? Don't assume it will cost a fortune to replace the battery just because the end-user isn't capable of doing it.


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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

MacGYVER said:


> So who is the market?
> 
> 1. Not people who are still jogging with their CD players in hand.
> 2. Not people who pack every single CD and DVD movie in their luggage or hand bag to watch on the airplane.
> ...


Great post MacGYVER

What people need to understand this product is for a certain market.


----------



## psxp (May 23, 2006)

HowEver said:


> Multitouch trackpad, backlit keyboard, 1.8" hard drive/flash memory drive, lighter than anything, thinner than anything...
> 
> There may be a few features some people will pay for.
> 
> Not fond of the black keys on silver though.


It may look better in person... ie. The Nano fatty and Iphone.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Lars said:


> Based on what, exactly? Don't assume it will cost a fortune to replace the battery just because the end-user isn't capable of doing it.


What would you charge to replace the battery in a 4th generation iPod (monochrome)?

Thanks.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

They already answered it on Engadget, it's $129 (US) for the replacement battery, free installation.


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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

chas_m said:


> The geeks and nerds will focus on what it doesn't have, but if you look at it from a consumer perspective, particularly a reasonably flush consumer (Apple's target market), this thing presses a LOT of their buttons and is a fully capable machine. I'm predicting it will do well, not as well as the MacBook but pretty darn well.


EXACTLY - The iphone has done well, but it was not *great* ie. Multiple SMS has just been fixed, no video recording and no Picture Msging!! When I tell people my iPhone does not have this they say "what?!!"

To Joe Consumer, this may do well.


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## acc30 (Apr 26, 2006)

looks great and I guess for the target demographics, it's good. I have to admit, it looks very nice. 

I wanted to get a laptop this year, when do you guys think new macbooks will come out?


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## ericlewis91 (Jul 12, 2007)

acc30 said:


> looks great and I guess for the target demographics, it's good. I have to admit, it looks very nice.
> 
> I wanted to get a laptop this year, when do you guys think new macbooks will come out?


MAY/JUNE


RIGHT BEFORE FREE IPOD PROMOTION

WHICH MACBOOKS ARE HUGE SELLERS


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## acc30 (Apr 26, 2006)

ericlewis91 said:


> MAY/JUNE
> 
> 
> RIGHT BEFORE FREE IPOD PROMOTION
> ...


perfect... I'm hoping I'll have something saved up around summertime 
I wonder if they'll change it to aluminum or keep it white...


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## chas_m (Dec 2, 2007)

psxp said:


> EXACTLY - The iphone has done well, but it was not *great*


Spoken exactly like a person who has spent no real time with one.

The iPhone is well BEYOND *great.* It is (literally) a lifestyle-changing, industry-changing device.

That it does not have "x" or "y" feature is laughably unimportant next to the big picture of what the iPhone does not just for the people who have one, but for everyone who DOESN'T have one. As economic voodoo artists like to say, "a rising tide lifts all boats." This isn't true of economics, but it IS true of business, and the iPhone _is_ that rising tide. Your next phone, no matter WHAT it is or WHO makes it/services it, will be better BECAUSE of the iPhone. Period.



> Multiple SMS has just been fixed, no video recording and no Picture Msging!! When I tell people my iPhone does not have this they say "what?!!"


For the record, the iPhone has GREAT picture messaging. It's called e-mail and it works BEAUTIFULLY. I can send a REAL 2mpxl photo to someone instead of a cut-down, washed-out, 192x128 44dpi *representation* of the picture I took to someone. What's more, my method is FREE, yours ISN'T.

MMS = seriously overblown technology that has never lived up to its promise. A lot like voice dialing (PRAISE BOB the iPhone doesn't have voice dialing!).

Video recording will come when the iPhone has 16GB or more of RAM standard, which leaves me with exactly ONE feature I wish it had and can't figure out why it doesn't -- voice memos. I'm the first to admit it, I wish the iPhone did voice memos.


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## Chealion (Jan 16, 2001)

da_jonesy said:


> That 8 GB flash drive is $39.99 if you do the math, 64 GB would cost about $320


The problem is that the price doesn't scale linearly. That's not to say that Apple like with their RAM is laughing their way to the bank everytime someone decides to purchase it but that expecting the 64GB flash drives to cost $320 at this point in time is incorrect. In about 3 months? It might be less - flash memory prices drop that fast. Looking online for buying a 64GB SSD drive seperate is still putting it above $1000 USD. (eg. Newegg.com - SUPER TALENT FSD64GC25M 2.5" 64GB SATA Internal Solid state disk (SSD) - Retail)


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## jackyk (Jun 22, 2005)

I can't believe the pricier model is more expensive than the higher end MBP's even the 17". Is portability really worth THAT much?


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## Arne (Jan 27, 2003)

The black kb makes it look like the 1st gen G4 Powerbook. Looks like computer design (at least in Cupertino) is like fashion design - cyclical.

No Firewire!!?? How unMac!


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## vacuvox (Sep 5, 2003)




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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

chas_m said:


> Spoken exactly like a person who has spent no real time with one.
> 
> The iPhone is well BEYOND *great.* It is (literally) a lifestyle-changing, industry-changing device.
> 
> ...


I actually an iphone mate, and use it daily... so I DO SPEAK AS SOMEONE WHO USES ONE.. 

yeah, so what if I can send a hires picture to someone in email?? My HTC S620 can do that too.. but it can also send a Picture MMS too.. 

BUT the people I want to send a picture to dont have email on their phones and I would like to MMS them on special occasions and have them receive it on their mobile phones.. ie. New Years.. a picture is nicer than a text msg especially when you're out of town. ie. Times Square etc.

Anyway, this thread is about the MBA, not the iPhone.


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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

acc30 said:


> perfect... I'm hoping I'll have something saved up around summertime
> I wonder if they'll change it to aluminum or keep it white...


Probably aluminum, to make all the models similar..

and probably LED screens with backlit keyboard..

B


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## Atroz (Aug 7, 2005)

*I like it.*

I think it's a great little machine for my use. I've got a 24" iMac for big stuff, so my powerbook is used for email, web browsing, chatting, etc. The Powerbook is a 3 year old model that I've had for 2.5 years. It's coming up on time to replace it and the Air might do it. My Powerbook is taxed when displaying Flash animations/video. No camera for video chatting. Keyboard is loosing its colour (which means the keys are becoming clear and the back lighting shows through, power supply cable is patched together. 

I like the size, weight, etc. The new touch pad is great. Not so happy about the missing firewire, but I guess that's pretty minor. The thing that bugs me though is the glossy screen. I want to be able to bring this outside with me and the glare could be horrible. sigh. 

A few hundred dollars more gets a faster CPU, more HD, bigger screen w/Matte option, more ports (2 USB, Firewire, etc.). Ahh, but the size/weight of the Air is so nice. 

I wonder what it will be like for heat? I understand the current MPB are considerably hotter than my PPC powerbook. It's one reason that I haven't switched yet. I really do use a laptop on my lap, and I don't need it burned.


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## Eric0 (Nov 22, 2007)

The heat on the MBP isn't too bad as long as your not doing anything overly intensive. I have the older Core Duo model which from my understanding, is hotter than the C2D's.


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## kgeorge78 (Sep 8, 2003)

I always buy the newest and greatest apple notebooks!

MBP for me, MB for wife. BUT, this time, I might just wait.

It looks great but performace wise, it's a dropoff from the black macbook I think. I guess I'm going to have to try this one before I buy. The lack of DVD drive is kinda a turnoff - Having to rip a movie before I take the machine on a trip.

I dunno. Whos buying one?

p.s. My black macbook is no longer for sale!
lol

I'll remove it from the classifieds today. OH what a shame!


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## avedon (May 25, 2007)

I'm disappointed also. Price wise and no firewire..... I will stick with my MacBook and for the price get a 24inch iMac.


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

It's a very elitist machine. Good for people who need the lightest Mac possible. It's not a workstation. Great for MS Office, light Adobe work, etc.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Heat! That's a very good question. My C2D gets ridiculously hot when I try to use anything CPU intensive. So much for a *lap*top eh?

I didn't see any fan vents in the pictures online... maybe they're well hidden.... or on the back somewhere (didn't see any pics of the back).


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

guytoronto said:


> It's a very *elitist* machine. Good for people who need the lightest Mac possible.


Perfect! I love that.


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## jackyk (Jun 22, 2005)

kgeorge78 said:


> I dunno. Whos buying one?


Why don't you buy it first and tell us about it? Since you always need the latest and greatest Apple products.... right? 

Everyone here just doesn't want to be the first to buy it-- that's all. But really... there's nothing really earth shattering here. It all just boils down to portability. You either need it or don't. Don't just buy it because Apple is "telling you to".


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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

hey, I dont think the MBA has a slot for security devices.. ie. Kensington locks.. 

am I wrong?


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## jackyk (Jun 22, 2005)

just put it in an envelope


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## Atroz (Aug 7, 2005)

psxp said:


> hey, I dont think the MBA has a slot for security devices.. ie. Kensington locks..
> 
> am I wrong?


I think you're right. I can't find any hole in it that looks like it's for a lock. 

Hmm. Gotta keep an eye on it then.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

.


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

Wow there are some really passionate people in this forum. 

I don't need the MacBook Air personally though I'd so get one if they had a 160GB HD option. There are probably thousands of business professionals on the go drooling into their lattes right now. There are people who will really appreciate how thin this baby is especially if they have to lug it around with them everywhere. It'll be way easier to use on an airplane than the MacBook Pro and most PCs notebooks. 3lbs is really light and it does make a difference. Look at all the hockey players looking to shave off a few grams off their hockey stick. I can definitely feel the weight difference between a 680g and 790g hockey stick. This thing will sell. Not as much as the regular MacBook but I predict sales equal to the MacBook Pro.


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## ciaochiao (Apr 21, 2005)

*attendez!*

Hi All:
One of my kids has the apple site as home page so I saw the newest Mac toy. Coincidentally, my youngest is doing an assignment on 'what will life be like in 20 years?' and our discussion was mainly about technology. If you've got a lot of money, no kids, pets, mortgages, or car payments, then get the newest toy. But we want Apple to improve on the current equipment, then maybe a strategy would be to wait just a bit so that they know the lack of fw-which I actually do use, an adequate optical drive so that you WON'T have to rip prior to taking it along, and all the other points that you guys have made - very well incidentally, will be included by the 3rd round of production. Remember when the jelly iMacs with a 10 G HD and limited optical abilities PLUS a G3 platform with a top speed of 400 MHz cost $1999 in the year 1999? Additionally, I really like the fact that not everyone has a Mac. It made the Mac community a more selective one with greater thinkers (that's my opinion only). It also made the Mac one of the safest systems to give your children and thus introduce them to the abilities of current technology and knowledge earlier. Mac should have continued as the system of choice for educators and education - remember the Newtons-LIGHT years ahead of anything else. I also wonder why Apple didn't come out with a swivel screen MB/P 1st rather than Mac users having to purchase WACOM tablets to achieve a similar effect? I also wonder why Mac insists upon making all books with the glossy screen? I like the matte and I'm definitely not an expert user but it is much easier on the eyes. 

So wait, attendez, duhng (Cantonese for wait), attesa,wartezeit, espera, 'chi'kai', or whatever your language and let Apple know they need to continue to excel. I've got to admit however, that if I had no financial obligations, I would likely go for the 2nd rev of the MBA. It does look amazing but then everything apple designs is quite astounding. There, my CANADIAN dollars worth of humble opinions.
Ciaochiao :love2: have some $$$$!


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## soon2bemac (Nov 2, 2004)

Looks alright, I personally would have preferred smaller overal dimensions rather than just making it slimmer. Biggest reason I wouldn't get one and really the only reason I went MBP over just a MB was the lack of dedicated video. (I preferred the KB on the MB as well sadly).

I'd have to type on one to see what it feels like but with that curved shape on the base it looks like it might be awkward to actually use on your lap.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

HowEver said:


> Apple does *not* call its portable computers "laptops." You won't find the word on their website*, you won't hear it when you call AppleCare, and you won't see it in their commercials. These are "portables" and "notebooks."
> 
> 
> (*I found an exception, on their support page:
> Apple - Support - Manuals - Portables . )


yeah.. yeah... i know they don't call it a laptop, they're just covering their hides legally.. but it's still a laptop.


----------



## kgeorge78 (Sep 8, 2003)

jackyk said:


> Why don't you buy it first and tell us about it? Since you always need the latest and greatest Apple products.... right?
> 
> Everyone here just doesn't want to be the first to buy it-- that's all. But really... there's nothing really earth shattering here. It all just boils down to portability. You either need it or don't. Don't just buy it because Apple is "telling you to".


But the big apple machine is so hard to resist....... must resist!

Na, I'll pass, but I would love to see one in person.

I passed on the iphone this long, might as well pass on this... and the apple tv.


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## jackyk (Jun 22, 2005)

kloan said:


> yeah.. yeah... i know they don't call it a laptop, they're just covering their hides legally.. but it's still a laptop.


you are completely right. how can one say the MBA is not a laptop? are you insane?

if you buy into the fact that the MBA is a "notebook" or "portable" then apple has successfully done their job. it's called pseudo individualism-- the standardization of products. 

Deep down, it's all the same stuff but they slap a fin-tail on it and suddenly it's like a whole new product!


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

jackyk said:


> Deep down, it's all the same stuff but they slap a fin-tail on it and suddenly it's like a whole new product!


*Covers ears* Lalalalalalala.


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## chas_m (Dec 2, 2007)

I commented on this in another thread, but after watching the actual keynote I think I understand Apple's view and I think most critics have it all wrong about the MacBook Air.

The critics are not wrong about what's missing, but they themselves miss the point: the Air is not intended as a solo computer. It's not a workstation computer. It's not your everyday computer.

It's your "show" computer. It's the computer you take on biz trips. It's the computer you take out of the case when your aim is to impress. IOW, you WILL get laid with this thing! 

Looked at *in that light,* the MacBook Air is absolutely ingenious. It's your sports convertible, not the Mazda you drive to work. Think of it that way and it really suddenly makes a LOT more sense (for its target demographic, which really doesn't include scruffy nerds by and large quite frankly!).


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

chas_m said:


> Think of it that way and it really suddenly makes a LOT more sense (for its target demographic, which really doesn't include scruffy nerds by and large quite frankly!).


The demographic does, however, include older, somewhat arthritic, 'scruffy nerds'...  

I want one for reasons already posted earlier in this thread. Time to count out the penny jar, go under the cushions on the couch and toss in my Professional Development Allowance....


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## Macified (Sep 18, 2003)

chas_m said:


> The critics are not wrong about what's missing, but they themselves miss the point: the Air is not intended as a solo computer. It's not a workstation computer. It's not your everyday computer.
> 
> It's your "show" computer. It's the computer you take on biz trips. It's the computer you take out of the case when your aim is to impress. IOW, you WILL get laid with this thing!
> 
> Looked at *in that light,* the MacBook Air is absolutely ingenious. It's your sports convertible, not the Mazda you drive to work. Think of it that way and it really suddenly makes a LOT more sense (for its target demographic, which really doesn't include scruffy nerds by and large quite frankly!).


For more people than you can imagine, this will be the everyday computer. Hy wife has a PowerBook G4 which is loaded to the gills but she uses none of the features that have been removed in the Air. She can't remember the last time she used the optical drive for business purposes. She doesn't use ethernet or modem. She occasionally uses 1 USB port but does use the firewire and video out. The only thing she won't have in the Air is firewire and USB is a suitable substitute for her needs. While she enjoys the 15.5 inch screen on the PowerBook, 13.3 is enough and video will cover the rest. She needs a lightweight system for email, Word, Excel, PowerPoint and logging in to business apps. She travels a lot and would appreciate the weight and battery of simplified system.

This is computing for most people.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Macified said:


> For more people than you can imagine, this will be the everyday computer. Hy wife has a PowerBook G4 which is loaded to the gills but she uses none of the features that have been removed in the Air. She can't remember the last time she used the optical drive for business purposes. She doesn't use ethernet or modem. She occasionally uses 1 USB port but does use the firewire and video out. The only thing she won't have in the Air is firewire and USB is a suitable substitute for her needs. While she enjoys the 15.5 inch screen on the PowerBook, 13.3 is enough and video will cover the rest. She needs a lightweight system for email, Word, Excel, PowerPoint and logging in to business apps. She travels a lot and would appreciate the weight and battery of simplified system.
> 
> This is computing for most people.


Exactly!


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## Pelao (Oct 2, 2003)

> For more people than you can imagine, this will be the everyday computer. Hy wife has a PowerBook G4 which is loaded to the gills but she uses none of the features that have been removed in the Air. She can't remember the last time she used the optical drive for business purposes. She doesn't use ethernet or modem. She occasionally uses 1 USB port but does use the firewire and video out. The only thing she won't have in the Air is firewire and USB is a suitable substitute for her needs. While she enjoys the 15.5 inch screen on the PowerBook, 13.3 is enough and video will cover the rest. She needs a lightweight system for email, Word, Excel, PowerPoint and logging in to business apps. She travels a lot and would appreciate the weight and battery of simplified system.
> 
> This is computing for most people.


Nicely put. Apple now offers a very nice range of notebooks. The MBs are very powerful, fully featured and are a great home computer for someone who also needs some mobility. The MBPs additional features are great for a power user who needs it all. The new Air is just right for a mobile pro, and I feel it will do very well for sales, marketing and executive types. Apple could have gone for smaller (like the 12" PB or the Sonys) but rather went for less weight while retaining a nice screen and a full keyboard. This computer could easily and comfortably be used all day - hook up a second monitor at the office and you have a very nice setup.


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## da_jonesy (Jun 26, 2003)

Chealion said:


> The problem is that the price doesn't scale linearly. That's not to say that Apple like with their RAM is laughing their way to the bank everytime someone decides to purchase it but that expecting the 64GB flash drives to cost $320 at this point in time is incorrect. In about 3 months? It might be less - flash memory prices drop that fast. Looking online for buying a 64GB SSD drive seperate is still putting it above $1000 USD. (eg. Newegg.com - SUPER TALENT FSD64GC25M 2.5" 64GB SATA Internal Solid state disk (SSD) - Retail)


But this is what I don't get... You can take multiple physical hard drives and partition them so them look as if there is one logical partition. That is the whole point of RAID. So why can't inexpensive SSD drives be combined using RAID techniques?


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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

I couldn't agree more. 

Me for example, I'm a very experienced and technical guy when it comes to computers, PC and Mac.

I use everyday MS Office applications for day to day things, and keynote/pages for school projects. Safari/Firefox for web surfing/facebook. Adium/Skype for instant messaging and communication. Mail to download/read/check email. I've hooked up iSync so that AddressBook and iCal are synced/paired to my Nokia 6620 phone, everything is synced so that my calendar and addresses are backed up and stored locally on my MBP. I've got "Stickies" a very underrated and under discussed program on 24/7 with my "To-Do-List" which changes day to day prioritizing things I must do, like study, buy groceries, call mom, do laundry, etc.. and not to forget iTunes & iPhoto for my music, and some various videos/photos.

Everything I've listed is pretty much used by the basic to moderate user, and used in the way a basic to moderate user would. None of the programs are computer intensive or require any special horse power. The average Joe&Shirley Shmoe don't need a heavy duty computer, a la MBP/MacPro. The MB and the MBA are perfectly suited for all of the above mentioned.


Now let's talk about the heavier programs that people use. Now remember I am on a 1.83GHz MBP (week 13) Intel Core Duo, with 1.5 gig of ram.

I also happen to use Photoshop, Aperture, iMovie, iWeb, Toast Titanium and the grand daddy of them all Discreet Autodesk 3D Studio Max at home for personal hobbies and projects. I'd also get Final Cut but there wouldn't be enough room on my MBP HardDrive, not with a 15gig partition out of an 80gig HD for WindowsXP to run 3DsMax.

The above programs are not essential when I travel/go to school/out of the house.

I'd much rather have them at home on an iMac. I don't need a dvd drive with me everywhere I go either, I rarely burn cd/dvd. Watching DVD's on a plane, or hooked up to my TV will be missed but RemoteCD/TimeCapsule+MBA/iTV/AirPort Extreme+MBA are all viable solutions now.

With a TimeCapsule as the router I pretty much would never see another cord again, backups wireless!!

So once again I agree, MacBookAir is the perfect solution for those that can afford. I personally can't, not even for an iMac. However I'll set it as a goal for some point in the distant future, which won't be a problem as long as I budget right.


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## elmer (Dec 19, 2002)

da_jonesy said:


> But this is what I don't get... You can take multiple physical hard drives and partition them so them look as if there is one logical partition. That is the whole point of RAID. So why can't inexpensive SSD drives be combined using RAID techniques?


It's hard to tell without knowing more details. There's a lot more to a drive than just a bucket of data. You are paying for the ability to quickly and randomly access any of the data and transport it to the RAM ridiculously fast. To get a better idea on how to answer this question, it might be worth looking into the specs of the low capacity inexpensive drives vs. the 64GB SSD for the interface speed, cache, heat generated, etc. In the meantime, let's not forget that RAID itself does have some processing cost and performance tradeoffs. In other words, can you really tell me that a 8-way RAID array of those $30 drives gives the same read/write sequential and read/write random access bandwidth and latency, using the same amount of power and generating the same amount of heat, and taking up the same amount of space including all the interconnections for addressing, data and power? Even if that were possible, it would take some R&D dollars 

Side note: what really got me interested in this announcement is the tantalizing thought that this is almost an inflection point in PC/internet history. This could be a significant milestone towards everything being online. The combined release of Time Capsule, online video rentals, and Macbook Air is a really great way to make such a statement. Besides appealing to the fashion conscious, I think the whole solution appeals to anyone who wants to pretend they live in the future. And that's the only way the SSD makes sense. They're appealing to Trekkies  In other words, yes, you have to drink the kool-aid, take the red pill, etcetera.beejacon I predict there will be a new cult within the Mac cult. The Airheads.

One thing I find absolutely droolworthy about it: _no fan, no hard disk access sounds, no optical drive sounds ... the first completely silent Mac portable._ Alright - I admit it - the only reason I'm not planning to buy one is that it doesn't use LCARS.

Of course, you don't have to pay $3000 to get a 13" SSD laptop. Just look at the Dell XPS M1330. It even has an optical drive, firewire, ethernet, and 2 USB. But it's thicker and starts at 4 lb.


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

da_jonesy said:


> But this is what I don't get... You can take multiple physical hard drives and partition them so them look as if there is one logical partition. That is the whole point of RAID. So why can't inexpensive SSD drives be combined using RAID techniques?


No space in the computer for multiple drives. 


After a day to think about it, here's my prediction for the MacBook Air:

For the first 6 to 12 months the Air will appeal to a small core of people who value weight above all. Modest sales, but I doubt Apple expects this to be a big hit right away.

The HDD option will disappear with Rev B. 

Within just a few months, the price will start to drop substantially due to cheaper solid-state drives, which will start to appear in other portable Macs (not to mention becoming common industry-wide). I think early adopters understand this, so the price cuts won't cause much outrage.

Within two years, all MacBooks will have SSDs and the Air and MacBook (not Pro) lines will merge. A full complement of ports and an optical drive might be confined to the Pro line.

In other words, I believe this machine represents the future of the low-end Apple portable. It's premium priced for the moment, but that's not likely to last long.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

I like your prediction.. works for me just fine. I'll wait.


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## fyrefly (Apr 16, 2005)

That SSD HD at NewEgg is $1500 and it's a 2.5" SATA, not a 1.8" PATA (which is the HDD inside the Air, and is presumably even more expensive.

I agree with Chas, there is a market for this thing, and agree with iMatt that this machine will serve a limited market, but is very forward thinking way of laptop computing (the same way the iPhone is a very forward-looking way of mobile communications).

Apple has again set the bar high - and that comes with a cost. This machine is not cheap, and doesn't have the features that some need, but it will fit for some people.


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## 5493 (May 22, 2005)

elmer said:


> ...I predict there will be a new cult within the Mac cult. The Airheads.


Airheads. I like it!


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## sadd3j (Aug 24, 2004)

It still sounds like something I'd wear on my feet.


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## vacuvox (Sep 5, 2003)

iMatt said:


> No space in the computer for multiple drives.
> I believe this machine represents the future of the low-end Apple portable. It's premium priced for the moment, but that's not likely to last long.


It might represent the future, period.

Steve loves shedding old technology - even if people are attached to it. When he dropped floppy drives from the Mac line it caused quite a bit of consternation. Everyone had floppy disks and wanted a slot to put them in. In the end, Steve was right and we moved forward.

No pain, no gain.

I think this has the same potential. We'll see if it works out... but it seems Steve has seen the light with his iPhone etc and is moving us away from a single one-box-does it all scenario to a series of interconnected local devices and remote servers that communicate wirelessly and seamlessly.

In this regard, I think the Time Capsule is just as interesting as the MBA - if not more so. I want one. The MBA I have practically no use for - but I think some people will really love it. I'm waiting for wireless DC power. Cables begone!


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## chas_m (Dec 2, 2007)

iMatt said:


> In other words, I believe this machine represents the future of the low-end Apple portable. It's premium priced for the moment, but that's not likely to last long.


(strokes beard in a stroky-beardy sigmund freud type way) hmmm ... yes, yes ... indeed. Hm.


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

vacuvox said:


> It might represent the future, period.
> 
> Steve loves shedding old technology - even if people are attached to it. When he dropped floppy drives from the Mac line it caused quite a bit of consternation. Everyone had floppy disks and wanted a slot to put them in. In the end, Steve was right and we moved forward.
> 
> ...


Most of that makes perfect sense, but I think integrated optical drives will be around for a long time to come; the end is only just barely in sight. Some people can do without them right now, but they're still much more useful to most of us than floppies were when the original iMac came out. 

I also agree that Time Capsule was one of the most interesting announcements yesterday. Even without Time Machine it has lots going for it.


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## TheBat (Feb 11, 2005)

iMatt said:


> I believe this machine represents the future of the low-end Apple portable. It's premium priced for the moment, but that's not likely to last long.


I think this statement sums it up for me as well.

I look forward to Rev 2 or 3.


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## RISCHead (Jul 20, 2004)

There is a strong corporate market for ultra portables. I will be getting one.
My current ultra-portable has no built-in optical drive (I've had it for 2+ years).
Its a Core Duo @ 1.6 GHz with 2 GB RAM.
It has a SATA 100 GB HDD @5400 rpm.
12" screen.
Not a workhorse, but suits my portability needs just fine.
Current battery lasts 5+ hrs but is a bit bulky.
Will need to lug a USB hub around, but will find one that makes sense to carry.

Price point is fine and competitive in the target market.

Rev A will have its issues I'm sure.

Slightly worried about 4200 PATA, would have preferred 5400 at least.
I think the goal is to push me to the SDD - we'll have to see.
I'll wait until there are some in the stores I can play with.

I have other machines for workhorses.


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## Atroz (Aug 7, 2005)

I posted earlier about liking the MBA, but not liking the glossy screen. I've thought of one other issue though. 

The hard drive does not seem to be removable. I guess we'll know when somebody takes the first one apart. This is an issue for me. My data is mine, I don't want to send it to Apple if the machine needs repairs. I like the option of removing the hard disk before shipping a machine away from my control. If I can't do that with the MBA, then that's a real negative.


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## Pelao (Oct 2, 2003)

> Slightly worried about 4200 PATA, would have preferred 5400 at least.
> I think the goal is to push me to the SDD - we'll have to see.


If you use it for office related tasks it will be fine. The old iBooks had 4200 drives, and they were fine.


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## RobTheGob (Feb 10, 2003)

Lars said:


> PATA is a standard ATA drive that's been around since the beginning of time.


Haha - since the beginning of time?!? n00b!


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## Macified (Sep 18, 2003)

Atroz said:


> I posted earlier about liking the MBA, but not liking the glossy screen. I've thought of one other issue though.
> 
> The hard drive does not seem to be removable. I guess we'll know when somebody takes the first one apart. This is an issue for me. My data is mine, I don't want to send it to Apple if the machine needs repairs. I like the option of removing the hard disk before shipping a machine away from my control. If I can't do that with the MBA, then that's a real negative.


You have no choice in the matter. If you have to send your system in to Apple for repair, you have to send it in intact. If you have any Apple portable system, it voids the warranty for you to remove the drive. Probably does on the desktop systems as well. Yeah, it's your data and it's on your hard drive, but if you want Apple to service it under warranty it's all going to them anyway. Make them sign a non-disclosure agreement if need be but you aren't getting the drive out anyway.


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## neufelni (Sep 17, 2007)

Atroz said:


> I posted earlier about liking the MBA, but not liking the glossy screen. I've thought of one other issue though.
> 
> The hard drive does not seem to be removable. I guess we'll know when somebody takes the first one apart. This is an issue for me. My data is mine, I don't want to send it to Apple if the machine needs repairs. I like the option of removing the hard disk before shipping a machine away from my control. If I can't do that with the MBA, then that's a real negative.


You could just backup/clone the drive and then format it, and then just restore when you get it back.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

.


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## Atroz (Aug 7, 2005)

neufelni said:


> You could just backup/clone the drive and then format it, and then just restore when you get it back.


If the machine is broken, you can't do this. And seeing that there's no Firewire on this system, you can't even do a firewire connection from another machine to access the hard drive on the Air.


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

RobTheGob said:


> Haha - since the beginning of time?!? n00b!


Wow, that was a really intelligent response. I'm really impressed.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

*A couple of reviews*

Wired Video: Hands-On With the MacBook Air | Gadget Lab from Wired.com

PC World - Putting the MacBook Air Laptop Through Its Paces


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

Atroz said:


> If the machine is broken, you can't do this. And seeing that there's no Firewire on this system, you can't even do a firewire connection from another machine to access the hard drive on the Air.


Good question. Maybe Apple has made it capable to run target disk mode over USB.


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## Cor roC (Jun 20, 2007)

Lars said:


> The multi-touch trackpad cannot be retrofitted into any existing Mac.


Darn. Thanks for the info!


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## chas_m (Dec 2, 2007)

guytoronto said:


> Good question. Maybe Apple has made it capable to run target disk mode over USB.


If they haven't already, they surely will soon enough.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

The hottest thing at the MAcWorld blogging lounge wasn't a Mac










Hmmmm $200 versus $1900


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## zmttoxics (Oct 16, 2007)

Lars said:


> PATA is a standard ATA drive that's been around since the beginning of time.  (Slower than SATA.) PATA, ATA, IDE are more or less all the same thing.


Woah, dude. The beginning of time? I don't even want to begin to fight you on that one. Just know that you are wrong and never say that again. Please.


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## Principal (Nov 28, 2004)

*This made me smile*

Someone else's post in another forum  

Any idiot who buys this thing is not a smart shopper.It would be like buying a $30000 car with no radio,no AC and No heat. But the the salesman Steve Jobs would tell you that you don't need a radio because you can sing to yourself, and you can roll down the windows to stay cool.
Oh, and you can borrow your friends coat to stay warm.
Yes, you could buy a $10000 car that does more. But the Apple car is the Apple car!
:lmao:


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

MacDoc said:


> The hottest thing at the MAcWorld blogging lounge wasn't a Mac
> 
> 
> 
> ...


A commodore 64?


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## chas_m (Dec 2, 2007)

No offense, but that OLPC project is nothing more than a POS geek toy. Yes I've handled one. Some nice ideas behind it but the actual user experience reminds me of soviet-era cell phones.

The cognitive dissonance caused by people who whine about what the MacBook Air *hasn't* got but then get excited by the OLPC PoS ... I'm well on my way to an aneurism.


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

chas_m said:


> If they haven't already, they surely will soon enough.


I highly doubt it.



zmttoxics said:


> Woah, dude. The beginning of time? I don't even want to begin to fight you on that one. Just know that you are wrong and never say that again. Please.


The ATA interface has been around for over a decade now. It's been long enough.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Lars said:


> I highly doubt it.
> 
> 
> 
> The ATA interface has been around for over a decade now. It's been long enough.


A decade ago is the beginning of time?  But GeeDubbya says the earth is 6,000 years old...


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## soon2bemac (Nov 2, 2004)

MacDoc said:


> The hottest thing at the MAcWorld blogging lounge wasn't a Mac
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Indeed, that or the EEE PC which is similarly intriguing. Going to have to follow some of the hack guides and throw leopard onto one of those for fun.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Jeez, that *is* offensive. Are you at all familiar with the One Laptop Per Child initiative?





chas_m said:


> No offense, but that OLPC project is nothing more than a POS geek toy. Yes I've handled one. Some nice ideas behind it but the actual user experience reminds me of soviet-era cell phones.
> 
> The cognitive dissonance caused by people who whine about what the MacBook Air *hasn't* got but then get excited by the OLPC PoS ... I'm well on my way to an aneurism.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

HowEver said:


> Does anybody like the black on silver keyboard? It isn't growing on me. (Not that I "hate" it.)


Looks' Vaio'ish...


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## Atroz (Aug 7, 2005)

HowEver said:


> Does anybody like the black on silver keyboard? It isn't growing on me. (Not that I "hate" it.)


I noticed the different colour, but didn't immediately like or dislike the new keyboard. meh. 










Is it my imagination, or does the MacBook Air's keys have a concave to them that is missing on the new standalone keyboard? Are these the same keys as on the Macbook?


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

I like the black on silver. Reminds me of the Titanium PowerBook keyboard, which I used to like.


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## jonmon (Feb 15, 2002)

i miss the apple on the command buttons


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## Macified (Sep 18, 2003)

jonmon said:


> i miss the apple on the command buttons


Add that to the list of features missing in the Air that you can still get on the MacBook Pro. My MBP has a cute little apple on the command key.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

Lenovo's New Ultraportable Thinkpad X300 - Gearlog

If only Lenovo had a design team....


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

MACinist said:


> Lenovo's New Ultraportable Thinkpad X300 - Gearlog
> 
> If only Lenovo had a design team....


seems people forgot what ultra portable actually means for a laptop... 13.3" isnt ultra portable...

===
i like the black keys on silver, i always thought silver keys was too much silver..


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## chas_m (Dec 2, 2007)

kloan said:


> seems people forgot what ultra portable actually means for a laptop... 13.3" isnt ultra portable..


It does now, dude.


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## chas_m (Dec 2, 2007)

HowEver said:


> Jeez, that *is* offensive. Are you at all familiar with the One Laptop Per Child initiative?


Yes I am, and I'm not dissing the nobility of the idea behind it, and I think it's VERY well suited to it's target (non-US) audience.

My comments were directed at the targeted US market, ie gadget freaks. For THEM, it's a POS toy etc.

I'm sorry I didn't make that clearer, and you were right to point that out. Thanks.


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

I hope my Mac Book Air 1.8GHZ 80GB HD leaves the factory very soon. I need it right away for work, travel, and play.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

chas_m said:


> It does now, dude.


lol... apparantly...


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## elmer (Dec 19, 2002)

This seems to be the product people love to dis. Rarely do we see so much negative hype.
On futureshop.ca, even though the product's not shipping yet, there are already 115 so-called "customer" ratings averaging to 2.5 out of 5.


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## MacGYVER (Apr 15, 2005)

elmer:

You know that may be true, but this is going to be Apple's product that will seriously make some huge sales through out the year. In fact I won't doubt if we start to see a lot of back orders or huge shipping delays.

As for the ratings, this happens a lot over at dpreview with digital cameras. Nikon or Canon can introduce a new digital camera to the media, and right away, before anyone can touch it, before the stores have it in stock, before Nikon or Canon even ship to the stores, people are rating the cameras on the site. I don't understand how you can rate a product before you physically try it out. I mean dpreview's ratings are more than a one answer rating.


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