# Jean Chretien buys a Mansion!



## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Our former PM has just whipped out the swiss bank account and paid almost two MILLION bucks for a nice house in Quebec.

Nice to know where all of those tax dollars went, eh? 

Anyone else think that the timing for this is just a bit "off". The optics are really bad...but it's not like Chretien cares or anything.

He never did.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

We should also note here that Jean Chretien...like all Big Bosses of every organised crime group...has resorted to the old ploy of having the new palace registered and "financed" by his wife and daughter.

The "little guy from Shawinigan" couldn't possibly be seen to be actually paying for such a house himself, could he?

No more than Tony Soprano could have that fancy New Jersey mansion in HIS name, either (it was Carmella's, according to the title). No doubt they both read the books about Al Capone and how he eventually got caught for tax evasion. Not racketeering.

A lesson well learned.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

You're right. He was, after all, just a pauper before becoming the Prime Minister.

Oh, wait, no he wasn't. He was a board member of several major Canadian corporations.

Not that I like the guy, all I am saying is that 1) it's entirely possible he used legitimate funds, 2) there are plenty of reasons to put things in your families names and 3) I don't think many people really give a **** about what Jean Chretien does these days.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

He never earned any more than a couple of hundred grand per year. Mostly he was paid signifigantly less than that (at least on paper). He comes from a poor family with a lot of children. He was born in a backwater area of Quebec.

But he now owns both a fancy condo worth three quarters of a million AND a very fancy mansion worth about two mill. He keeps most of this stuff in his wifes or his daughter's name, BTW.

Just like the leaders of all of the major crime organisations have done, ever since the lessons of Al Capone. ("_Who ME?? I'm just a simple guy who owns a corner pork store in New Jersey! Or a small waste disposal company in Hoboken! Or...I'm a little nondescript street fighter from Shawinigan who got lucky. I have NOTHING of value! Check for yourself!")_

We should also note that Old King Jean was on the losing end of several big real estate deals while he was in office. The fact that he tried to use his influence as Prime Minister to salvage these bad deals is a matter of public record.

But...oddly...he still seems to have enough cake in the bank to live better than 98% of the Canadian population.

Funny about that, eh?


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> We should also note here that Jean Chretien...like all Big Bosses of every organised crime group...has resorted to the old ploy of having the new palace registered and "financed" by his wife and daughter.
> 
> The "little guy from Shawinigan" couldn't possibly be seen to be actually paying for such a house himself, could he?


More than likely it's for tax reasons. If you believe that the majority of Canadians wouldn't do the same thing...put up a poll here and see what happens.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> He never earned any more than a couple of hundred grand per year. Mostly he was paid signifigantly less than that (at least on paper). He comes from a poor family with a lot of children. He was born in a backwater area of Quebec.


A. Show us his finances please.
B. From what you're saying...if you come from a poor background...you should still be poor. Logical, I guess...




MacNutt said:


> But he now owns both a fancy condo worth three quarters of a million AND a very fancy mansion worth about two mill.
> 
> But...oddly...he still seems to have enough cake in the bank to live better than 98% of the Canadian population.


He also happens to be "counsel to the firm" for about three law firms. Do you have any idea how much someone like a former PM can earn for a law firm in terms of prestige, new clients, and mentoring? I don't and I don't believe that you do either.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Jean Chretien has a very good reason to hide from the taxmen.

Same reason that ALL of the major players in ALL of the organised crime groups do, I'd bet. 

Those guys ALL put their major purchases (like expensive houses) into their wives or daughters names. Only dummies do it any other way.

Oddly enough, most of my wealthy buddies seem to have all of their fancy gear in their OWN names. Same as I do.

Odd about that, eh?


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> Oddly enough, most of my wealthy buddies seem to have all of their fancy gear in their OWN names. Same as I do.
> 
> Odd about that, eh?


Some conclusions:

A. Using your own logic from above, you must come from a wealthy background.
B. You and your buddies probably need tax advice.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

I come from NOTHING, Ironmac. My parents were both union members who slaved for wages all of their lives.

They couldn't even afiord to put me through university. I paid for all of my education by working late night chinese food delivery jobs. Or...I got my employers to pay for it.

I bought my own brand new 750 motorcycle when I was seventeen. My parents never ever bought me anything more than clothes. My dad made about eight bucks an hour at that point in my life.

By the time I was twenty one, I owned two houses. And had four musclecars. I lived and worked in Rio de Janeiro in my early twenties. And made more money than both of my parents combined.

I lost all of that and got it back again. In spades.

And now I'm doing pretty well. Very well, actually, But I was below every poverty line known to man for about ten years in my thirties. Never took welfare, though. Not even once. I spent exactly four months on UIC, in my whole life.

My current situation would make you blush (I love my yacht). And I have VERY good tax advice, thank you. 

So does Jean Chretien, I'd bet.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> I come from NOTHING, Ironmac.


But...but...didn't you knock Chretien earlier for having enough money to buy a mansion despite coming from a poor background? And, now, you boast about how you have a yacht yet coming from the same destitute background? 

*Hypocrisy alert!!!*


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

I got my money by working for it, Ironmac. Honestly. I also always pay my taxes (my company and I were BOTH audited last year. They found nothing amiss.)

Care to ask anyone in this whole country if they think that Jean Chretien got HIS money by working for it??

Or...did he get it by skimming?

Apparently, all of the current Gormery inquiry testimony now points to Jean Chretien's own PMO as the source and the heart of all of this corruption. More will be revealed about this in the very near future.

Watch and see.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> I got my money by working for it, Ironmac.


Your money comes from working for overseas governments that repress their own citizens.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Wrong as usual.

I have NEVER ever recieved one single cent from ANY foreign government.

I was always paid for my work by a company that is based in either Canada or the USA. The Cuban government wanted to employ me at one point but I respectfully declined.

Because I had NO desire to work for a government that _ACTIVELY REPRESSES IT'S OWN CITIZENS!_

Truth.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> I was always paid for my work by a company that is based in either Canada or the USA.


Big deal. You can't hide behind that. Ever hear of Talisman?


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## MannyP Design (Jun 8, 2000)

Interesting how MacNutt assumes J.C has no money to afford a 2 million dollar mansion, yet claims to know he only makes "hundreds of thousands" a year without a shred of proof... so that could include upwards of $999,999.00/ year, no?

Instead, he dilly-dallies around in the hypothetical. Oh what fun! I've been taught early in life that it's not necessarily how much you make, but how you spend it. MacNutt, the businessperson he is, should know this.


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## MannyP Design (Jun 8, 2000)

MacNutt said:


> Because I had NO desire to work for a government that _ACTIVELY REPRESSES IT'S OWN CITIZENS!_
> 
> Truth.





> I was always paid for my work by a company that is based in either Canada or the USA.


No, but it's perfectly alright to work for a country that actively represses it's own, as well as other citizens.


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## TroutMaskReplica (Feb 28, 2003)

> But...but...didn't you knock Chretien earlier for having enough money to buy a mansion despite coming from a poor background? And, now, you boast about how you have a yacht yet coming from the same destitute background?
> 
> Hypocrisy alert!!!


lol! well done, ironmac. kind of like shooting fish in a barrel though.


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

IronMac said:


> But...but...didn't you knock Chretien earlier for having enough money to buy a mansion despite coming from a poor background? And, now, you boast about how you have a yacht yet coming from the same destitute background?
> 
> *Hypocrisy alert!!!*


Good Job IronMac not only did you wound the monster in that other thread but now you have slayed it in it's own lair.

Laterz


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

If Chretien was so poor, and has never made money by working, how did he get all the way through law school?

Just asking.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Perspective is relative.


WASHINGTON (Dow Jones) - Maurice "Hank" Greenberg, who last month relinquished his posts as chairman and chief executive of American International Group Inc. ( AIG) amid intense regulatory scrutiny, reported Tuesday a gift of 41.4 million company shares to his wife, Corinne P. Greenberg. 

According to a filing released by the Securities and Exchange Commission, the transaction took place March 11, three days before insurance titan AIG announced Greenberg had retired as president and CEO. The company said later in the month that Greenberg also would retire as chairman. 

The shares Greenberg gifted to his wife are worth $2.2 billion at AIG's closing share price Tuesday of $53.20 .


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## Vinnie Cappuccino (Aug 20, 2003)

I like MacNutt's statement about comming from nothing, fool, Nothing comes from nothing, don't put yer parents down like that, ya make it seem like it was an immaculate conception!  Good Rags to Riches Story though! Kinda like the Donald in some respects!


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Jean Chretien fought his way to the very top of a deeply corrupt organisation pretty much the same way that Al Capone did. He has always described himself as a "streetfighter".

Remember when he grabbed that protester by the neck and threw him to the ground? Remember when he unleashed the cops with pepper spray on the protesters?

Can you see Tony Soprano doing precisely the same thing...if he ever managed to get control of a major political party and then took power over a WHOLE COUNTRY??!!??

And do you really know where "he got the money to attend law school"?  

Didn't think so.

You might want to take a moment to think about this.

The answers you come up with might be rather enlightening.

Trust me on this.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

So what you're saying is that you really don't have any idea at all, and it's easier to just to keep throwing around allegations.

How typical.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

It's also oddly typical how MANY of those "shocking allegations" actually turn out to be true in the long run. Isn't it?

You might want to check the record on this. Especially when it comes to what I have said in the past about the terribly corrupt Liberals. 

Gosh...you might almost think that I had some sort of insider information on all of this. Wouldn't you? 

What a concept.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> Gosh...you might almost think that I had some sort of insider information on all of this. Wouldn't you?


Even a blind man with a shotgun might manage to hit the side of a barn once every few shots.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Yep. Too bad for you that this particular "blind man" was aiming VERY carefully at a _PARTICULAR_ barn for about three solid years. While everyone around him in this community was telling him he was silly or demented for doing so. Ande heaping great masses of scorn upon him, for doing so.

But, guess what?

He shoots...he _SCORES!_! 

So...want to know what's coming next?

Stay tuned.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> So...want to know what's coming next?
> 
> Stay tuned.


It'd better be a response to that thread you've been dancing around or else your yacht is going on a cross-continental trek.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

My yacht is tied up at the dock right now. Near as I can tell...it's not planning on taking any "cross-country" treks without me at the helm. 

But I HAVE considered selling it lately. You in the market for a classic Chris Craft motor yacht, Ironmac? It's all phillipine mahogany. A real beaut.

Make me an offer.

Just call before you drop by for a test drive...okay?


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## gwillikers (Jun 19, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> My yacht is tied up at the dock right now. Near as I can tell...it's not planning on taking any "cross-country" treks without me at the helm.
> 
> But I HAVE considered selling it lately. You in the market for a classic Chris Craft motor yacht, Ironmac? It's all phillipine mahogany. A real beaut.
> 
> ...


Geezuz Gerry, that's just outright gloating. If reincarnation is for real, you're doomed man. I'm talking soup kitchens and suffering. Karma Gerry, karma!!


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

MacNutt said:


> My yacht is tied up at the dock right now. Near as I can tell...it's not planning on taking any "cross-country" treks without me at the helm.
> 
> But I HAVE considered selling it lately. You in the market for a classic Chris Craft motor yacht, Ironmac? It's all phillipine mahogany. A real beaut.
> 
> ...


So what are you saying that you're going back on your word?

Laterz


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

gwillikers said:


> Karma


Maybe that's what I will rename it when it slips into the green waves of its new slip at the Toronto Yacht Club.


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## Pamela (Feb 20, 2003)

If *I* can afford a $500,000 house, then i would HOPE that freaking John Cretien would be able to afford a $2m house!

Macnutt must have been seriously bored when he started this thread...because it ain't got nuttin to it!

2 million dollars...pfffhh...call me when he spends more like $100m.


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## da_jonesy (Jun 26, 2003)

Pamela said:


> If *I* can afford a $500,000 house, then i would HOPE that freaking John Cretien would be able to afford a $2m house!
> 
> Macnutt must have been seriously bored when he started this thread...because it ain't got nuttin to it!


Yeah I tend to agree... I don't think Macnutt has been paying attention to housing prices as of late.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Pamela said:


> because it ain't got nuttin to it!


The price is not the issue. The fact that he put the house in his wife's and his wife's sister's name smells of wrong doing regarding Adscam and hiding future assests to prevent any recovery action.

That alone is worth the thread.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> Our former PM has just whipped out the swiss bank account and paid almost two MILLION bucks for a nice house in Quebec.
> 
> Nice to know where all of those tax dollars went, eh?
> 
> ...


This is the first post to this thread. The point was that Chretien paid almost two million for a house (in Toronto, that sort of price is what you'd be paying in downtown!)...not that he was hiding the purchase behind his wife's and wife's sister's names. That came almost a day later.


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

IronMac said:


> This is the first post to this thread. The point was that Chretien paid almost two million for a house (in Toronto, that sort of price is what you'd be paying in downtown!)...not that he was hiding the purchase behind his wife's and wife's sister's names. That came almost a day later.


around TO putting the house, business, high end German sedan in your spouse's name for the sake of getting away with a few tax breaks is standard procedure.

Laterz


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

K_OS said:


> around TO putting the house, business, high end German sedan in your spouse's name for the sake of getting away with a few tax breaks is standard procedure.


Just glanced at an old Globe article...did you know that everyone is entitled to some sort of principal residence unit tax break? If your kid is over 18, you can buy them a house or something as a principal residence and get a tax break out of it. (I may be paraphrasing it wrong but go ask your accountant!) Odd tax break but there it is!


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

The reason that I brought it up was that I thought the optics were particularly unfortunate, given the current events and all. A few months earlier, or a year later and no one would have even noticed.

King Jean's arrogance knows no bounds.


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

IronMac said:


> Just glanced at an old Globe article...did you know that everyone is entitled to some sort of principal residence unit tax break? If your kid is over 18, you can buy them a house or something as a principal residence and get a tax break out of it. (I may be paraphrasing it wrong but go ask your accountant!) Odd tax break but there it is!


I've seen it done many times especially family's with a few children they buy house after house and put them in the children's names and later they turn them into rental units and that way they get money coming from both sides.

Laterz


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

K_OS said:


> I've seen it done many times especially family's with a few children they buy house after house and put them in the children's names and later they turn them into rental units and that way they get money coming from both sides.
> 
> Laterz


Really? Using MacNutt's reasoning they must be related to organized crime! Not to mention Italian!  (Anyone catch that thread where, according to MacNutt, the colour of your skin tells people what your religion is? LOL!)

Wait a sec...if you see this sort of thing...you're probably guilty too by association!


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## trevj (Sep 8, 2002)

*Chretien's new home*

Just to set the record straight regarding Chretien's new home. I'm surprised nobody has corrected this yet, but the house is actually in Ottawa, not Quebec. Although it is a very nice house, it is by no means a mansion.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Let's not split hairs here. 

Jean Chretien is now at the very center of a massive scandal involving the theft of taxpayers money. Hundreds of millions of dollars worth. And he has just purchased a multi-million dollar home...right in the middle of it all.

Like I said earlier, the optics aren't very good. To say the least.


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## trevj (Sep 8, 2002)

This thread brings to mind an interesting encounter my wife and I had in February at the Casino de Lac Leamy in Hull, Quebec. We were watching the action at the roulette tables when my wife gave me a good nudge in the side and motioned to her right. Standing immediately beside her was Jean Chretien (his wife and RCMP bodyguards stood behind us). He looked at me just as I turned, so we exchanged "hellos." Then I said, "You're not here spending my hard-earned money, are you?" Without cracking a smile (I think it actually went over his head) he replied, "No, I'm not spending ANY money. I'm just hear to take a look." He went on to explain that this was actually the first time he had ever been in a casino in Canada and he was quite impressed with the atmosphere. There ends my brush with crime, er, I mean fame. Would you believe infamy?


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## MannyP Design (Jun 8, 2000)

Ha ha ha. That's too funny.

Maybe he's researching new ways to screw the people?  He'd be a great pit boss. 

P.S. Trev -- love your work! Beautiful, man, just gorgeous stuff.


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

trevj said:


> This thread brings to mind an interesting encounter my wife and I had in February at the Casino de Lac Leamy in Hull, Quebec. We were watching the action at the roulette tables when my wife gave me a good nudge in the side and motioned to her right. Standing immediately beside her was Jean Chretien (his wife and RCMP bodyguards stood behind us). He looked at me just as I turned, so we exchanged "hellos." Then I said, "You're not here spending my hard-earned money, are you?" Without cracking a smile (I think it actually went over his head) he replied, "No, I'm not spending ANY money. I'm just hear to take a look." He went on to explain that this was actually the first time he had ever been in a casino in Canada and he was quite impressed with the atmosphere. There ends my brush with crime, er, I mean fame. Would you believe infamy?


Ho well according to MacNutt you and I should be going to jail soon we're in to deep into the belly of the underworld. 

Laterz


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Chretien should already be in jail. Hopefully he will be someday soon.

Not sure about the rest of you guys. Did you get caught swiping tax money as well?


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## Clockwork (Feb 24, 2002)

I don't particularly like Jean and believe there is a good possibility that he did scam the Canadian people, but until you can prove it beyond a reasonable doubt then it's hard to prove. I personally think he is a crook but I also think Brian was a crook as well, and maybe the next PM and the next one after that will be crooks as well. I also think most politicians are crooks. Politics used to be a civil servant job in which people didn't make all that much money. Now they get $60 000 pensions or something like that after two terms. While people are making $640 a month who have disabilities politicians are well taken care of. This to me is just another example of social injustice. I found and interesting article about Lawyers salaries. 

http://ctv.workopolis.com/servlet/News/robmag/20020222/RO8SALA

According to this Lawyers in Quebec have the highest salary range-between $64,590 and $153,040. So I would bet that he probably makes more then that. So going by this information a 2 Million dollar home is not out of reach if you make that much money. I am also sure he saved a lot of money. Or maybe he has a mortgage.


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## trevj (Sep 8, 2002)

According to reports in the Ottawa Citizen, his wife and daughter hold an $800,000 mortgage on the property. I understood that he was a millionnaire before he came into office (maybe even moreso after he left  ). I agree though, for a high priced lawyer/ex PM like Chretien, a 2 million dollar house is not "unreasonable." It may be hard to fathom for those of us who can only dream of making three or four hundred thousand a year, but it shouldn't come as a surprise that wealthy people buy expensive things.
I should just note that I am NO fan of Chretien either.


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## Clockwork (Feb 24, 2002)

Another idea I was thinking which is commonly used by business men, Doctors etc, is many people in this situation hire there family members and pay them well. This lowers personal taxes. Of course the money goes back to them in the end, but they can get out of paying as much when the tax man comes.


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## trevj (Sep 8, 2002)

Yes, this is a common practice for anybody who is self-employed. Any accountant worth their salt will recommend hiring your spouse or children (grown children) to work for the business. Of course, if you are audited, you will be expected to prove that the family member who is receiving an income has done work to justify receiving a salary.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Again....

I was just commenting on the optics of it all. And the timing. Could have been better, don't you think?

Jean knows no shame. His arrogance is still firmly in place. Will be till they cart him off to the crowbar hotel, I bet.


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## Clockwork (Feb 24, 2002)

I like that saying that sh*t always floats to the top. Unfortunately the people that get to the top often are the snakes who will back stab, exploit and do what ever it takes to get on top. I highly doubt that Jean was an honest PM. They are just too smart and have too much money to get caught. Except this time the Liberal party got caught in the cookie jar.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Jean had that particular cookie jar parked right in his office. And all of the people who were dipping their fingers in it are either his best buddies and staff, or his relatives.

King Jean had the keys to the drawer that the cookie jar was kept in. His fingerprints are all over the place. He is at the heart of this thing. No two ways about it.

And the optics of him buying a multi-million dollar house right in the middle of the whole sh*tstorm is more than a bit tragic. It's beyond arrogant.


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## Clockwork (Feb 24, 2002)

Yeah, on the other hand, do you really think Harper, Layton, or Gilels would really do any better? The Bloc would be a disaster in my opinion and the parrty I would rather not vote for if there was no other option. What about Brian though, I think he was a crook too. Did he not sue Canada or something like that over something that most people think he did? I dont remember exactly what it was though. Or maybe Im just parranoid about politicans.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Mulroney was actively prosecuted by Jean Chretien's incoming Liberal government for corruption in the Airbus affair. This broke a longstanding silent agreement that a former Prime minister was essentially "untouchable".

Mulroney not only WON his case against all of the power of a sitting majority government that was totally hostile to him...but he also went on to sue them for defamation of character.

He won THAT one too. Fifty million bucks worth. Mulroney must have been pretty confident that he didn't have any skeletons in his particular closet, eh?

Unfortunately, in his zeal to try and fry Mulroney old King Jean has left himself wide open to similar criminal prosecution. And HIS closet is overflowing with bones! (his garage is stuffed to the rafters with it too)   

Watch and see.


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## Clockwork (Feb 24, 2002)

In all fairness though, many guilty people win court cases. Countless examples in history prove this and we all know many. Money has a lot to do with it. If the Liberal party is guilty then shame on them and hopefully they get the books thrown at them. Imagine Jean in Kingston pen lol


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

The Chretien Liberals used the whole power of the Canadian government, including all of the resources of the RCMP etc. to try and hang something on Mulroney. It was a david vs goliath battle if there ever was one.

They came up with squat. Muroney was cleared of all charges.

Chretien, on the other hand, is way waaayyy deeper in self inflicted doo doo than any PM in history. This is the biggest political scandal in Canadian history. And it will lead to even larger Liberal theft scandals in the near future (how do you suppose they managed to turn a two million dollar gun registry into a multi BILLION dollar one?? That doesn't even work!?)

On a corruption scale of one to ten, Jean Chretein and Co. is a twelve. This will become even more apparent as time goes on.

Gee...weren't a lot of people around here saluting him as a "great man" when Martin forced him to retire just a year and a half ago? My my...how times have changed.

Wonder what the next year and a half will bring?


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