# Dual Drive MacBook - SSD & HDD



## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

I just replaced the hard drive (5400 rpm, 500GB) in a 13" MacBook with a solid state drive, and have ordered a kit to convert the space used for the optical drive into a spare drive, making it a dual drive set-up.

The main drive is a solid state drive for OS X, VMWare (Windows 7, Linux), and all applications. It is smoking fast, and boots up in seconds.

The second drive will be used for as data storage and a time machine backup. The conversion kit comes with an external case so I can still use the optical drive externally.

Here is what I purchased:

Intel X25-M 160GB SSD $500

Intel® Mainstream SATA Solid-State Drives - Overview

MCE OptiBay Hard Drive $100

MCE OptiBay Hard Drive for MacBook Pro, MacBook, PowerBook G4, and Mac mini

Is there anyone else out there with a setup like this? Any experiences with extra battery drain with the two drives, or heat build-up? I expect this will not be an issue.

I am extremely impressed with the increased performance as a result of this upgrade.


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## andreww (Nov 20, 2002)

What a great idea! That optical drive bay is very cool, even comes with an external case for your superdrive.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

I have no personal experience of doing it but have read about others who have and saw no particular mention of heat build-up. The SSDs run cool and draw little power relative to an HDD and as the HDD is for backup and data storage it won't be running all the time (especially if you choose the sleep drive when possible option in the Energy Saver section of System Preferences) so I would think it should be fine.


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## adam.sn (Feb 7, 2007)

That's SWEET!!!! I had no idea I can do this. 1.5TB here I come. I hardly ever use the optical drive anyway... especially while on the go! 

Thanks for the heads up!


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## Benito (Nov 17, 2007)

I keep thinking that this is what I should do in the future to my current MBP.


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## Z06jerry (Mar 16, 2005)

zlinger said:


> Is there anyone else out there with a setup like this? Any experiences with extra battery drain with the two drives, or heat build-up? I expect this will not be an issue.


Check out this 28 page thread! ...

MCE Optibay Alternative CHEAP - Mac Forums


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## hbp (Apr 18, 2007)

I've heard you should keep your HDD in the HDD bay, and put your SSD in the optibay.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

hbp said:


> I've heard you should keep your HDD in the HDD bay, and put your SSD in the optibay.


I haven't heard that but it makes sense to me although it may be a misbegotten notion.

The reason why it "seems" to make sense to me is that the optibay may be configured with less power due to that an optical drive requires less power on a continual basis than an HDD.

SSDs require less power than HDDs but an SSD in the optibay would most likely be the boot drive so would most likely be drawing more power on a continual basis than the HDD so I am not so sure...

So if it is true that putting the SSD drive in the optibay is recommend and if it is because of power concerns, I think that if you put the HDD in the optiaby and then choose, "Put the hard disks to sleep when possible" in the System Preferences and used the HDD in the optibay only for back up and data it may mean that the power draw on the optibay drive would not require the kind of power that it would if you didn't make this selection and therefore may make it reasonable to put the HDD in the optibay. But I am not sure... maybe someone with more expertise could chime in on the matter...


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## Newdeal (Nov 2, 2009)

*...*

its because the regular hdd slot has the sudden motion sensor which hdds should have and the optical bay doesn't have the sudden motion sensor which for an ssd doesn't matter anyway


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

Newdeal said:


> its because the regular hdd slot has the sudden motion sensor which hdds should have and the optical bay doesn't have the sudden motion sensor which for an ssd doesn't matter anyway


Thanks Newdeal! That makes sense, great to have so many knowledgeable people around here. This is one of the reasons why I come to ehMac every day. :clap:


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## hdh607 (Sep 8, 2008)

very cool. great thread!


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

hbp said:


> I've heard you should keep your HDD in the HDD bay, and put your SSD in the optibay.


Based on discussion so far, I will swap the drives around once I get the optibay, as configured above.

I assume I can then change the boot drive to start from SSD. I can't wait to get this running.

.. after first day of use, the upgrade is working great. I have Windows 7 running in VMWare and it is as if it was started in bootcamp. Before, it was more noticeably sluggish.

A few more questions for the group. 

1) I assume data transfer between the SSD and HDD will still be impressive, and faster than USB external (as it is SATA interface?). True?

2) I read somewhere that OSX does not support TRIM function, but Windows does?. "TRIM command allows an operating system to tell a solid-state drive (or "SSD") which data blocks are no longer in use, such as those left by deleted files.


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## Newdeal (Nov 2, 2009)

windows 7 does trim, osx does not. USB hard disks have slow transfers so year it will be faster to an internal hdd than an external hdd. I have an OWC mercury extreme ssd and it loads parallels with windows xp in like 20 seconds which is rediculously fast...not that I really use windows for anything but at least I have the option lol


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## adam.sn (Feb 7, 2007)

I'm also excited about the possibility of a RAID setup inside a laptop!!! Too Cool!


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## normcorriveau (Dec 6, 2005)

I've got two SSDs running RAID 0 in my MacBook Pro. You have to be VERY diligent about backup if you do this but the speed bump is very nice.


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## adam.sn (Feb 7, 2007)

Why do you have to be so diligent about backing up? Isn't that what a RAID is for? Hehe


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## Newdeal (Nov 2, 2009)

*...*

there are differant types of Raid, the one that is a backup is Raid 1. The one people are doing with SSDs is Raid 0 (striped) which basically makes two drives act as one drive with double the speed and size. Unfortunately if one drive fails all our data is gone


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## Guest (Mar 5, 2010)

This sounds very interesting ... having an SSD in place of my optical drive and carrying the optical drive external. Once you've got the optibay unit please let us know how it works out. SSD system drive + existing drive as storage (and spinning down when not in use) sounds awesome


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## adam.sn (Feb 7, 2007)

Newdeal said:


> there are differant types of Raid, the one that is a backup is Raid 1. The one people are doing with SSDs is Raid 0 (striped) which basically makes two drives act as one drive with double the speed and size. Unfortunately if one drive fails all our data is gone


Oh cool  Good to know. 

Is it double the speed because of the SSD or because of some other reason?


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## Newdeal (Nov 2, 2009)

*...*

its double the speed because you have two drives reading through two busses at once so there is just twice the "pipe" for data to flow through. Its twice as fast as one ssd (well almost twice, not quite) and one ssd is more than twice as fast as a single hdd


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## i-rui (Sep 13, 2006)

mguertin said:


> This sounds very interesting ... having an SSD in place of my optical drive and carrying the optical drive external. Once you've got the optibay unit please let us know how it works out. SSD system drive + existing drive as storage (and spinning down when not in use) sounds awesome


that does sound interesting. Does anyone know if an external optical drive can boot from a cd if you'd ever have to troubleshoot? and if it is possible would ALL external optical drives be able to do this or only the apple usb one?


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## normcorriveau (Dec 6, 2005)

I can and have booted from my external CD. The drive is the internal Apple drive in the third party case.

I wouldn't say two SSDs in RAID 0 is twice as fast as one drive because there is a lot of overhead. It is faster though.

Norm


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

I will post the results of my conversion, and maybe post a few pics if any wants to see.


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

Newdeal said:


> Unfortunately if one drive fails all our data is gone


yes, this is very true. but I would think that it is less risk with two SSD RAID0 drives vs. two HDD RAID0 drives.

I understand that solid state is more reliable, except for system or file corruption that could occur regardless.


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## Newdeal (Nov 2, 2009)

*...*

my first OWC mercury extreme SSD bit the dust after 4 days of use...the replacement has made it a week so far but I am glad I have a time capsule backing it up


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

Oh man that's beyond awesome. I know that I never use my optical drive for much... some games require it like Simcity 4 but I'd rather have an external optical and maximum internal storage. I wonder if they could optimize it even further so it can hold a 2.5" HDD + a 1.8" SSD.


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## Mckitrick (Dec 25, 2005)

zlinger - Did you get the *Free external case for your optical drive? Can you post a picture of it if so?

Thanks!


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

I installed the extra drive this evening, and it works great! The external case is on backorder until next week for the DVD drive.

I can say that it involved removal of numerous screws, being careful of cables and not breaking anything. Also, I swapped the 160 GB SSD and 500GB HDD to the configuration, as discussed before (HDD bay with shock sensor, SSD in upgraded optibay).

I had a scare when the SATA ribbon cable jumped off the logic board, it actually snaps onto the logic board, and I'm grateful it was only this. I added a few strips of electrical tape for insulation and to cover up screws. It took a while to first boot up... but is OK and runs perfect.

I now use the 160 GB SSD drive for OS, Applications, VMWare Machines, Files in Use... etc. 500 GB HDD is for storing data files, music, movies, pictures, and documents. 

I will post pictures of the mounting kit, and external DVD once I receive it.


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## Mckitrick (Dec 25, 2005)

Awesome! How's the boot time now that it's gotten past the nail-biting first boot?


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

Mckitrick said:


> Awesome! How's the boot time now that it's gotten past the nail-biting first boot?


About 20 seconds startup... And 5 seconds shutdown.

The SSD drive is 10% free so probably slower than it should be.


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## kkritsilas (Mar 1, 2010)

I have a question or two about this.

1. The optical drive is an ATA (or more properly, a Parallel ATA) interface with I believe to be a 100 MB/s or 133 MB/s interface. This is for my late 2007 MacBook Pro, I don't know if the latest MacBooks/MacBook Pros have gone to a SATA interface for the Optical drive. With a 100/133 MB/s interface, does the interface not become a bottleneck for the performance of the SSD? While most mechanical hard drives won't read at 100MB/s, at least on a sustained basis, an high performance SSD sure can. If one is buying an SSD to maximize performance, shouldn't the SSD be on the faster SATA connection/bus?

2. The kit that is being used, I assume is using some sort of Parallel ATA to SATA convertor (to permit the SATA drive to be used on a Parallel ATA port). Doesn't this further reduce the performance of the SSD drive in the optical bay?

I just want to understand all the ins and outs of maximizing performance with this type of set up, not to criticize or put this down.

Kostas


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

The late MacBook's are pure SATA speed, as far as I understand. 

The "adapter" kit is really only an enclosure and works with unibody MacBook and new MacBook Pro. It is quite simple and just routes a small cable between SATA connectors to a cable that makes its way to the logic board.

System Profiler confirms:

Serial-ATA Device Tree

NVidia MCP79 AHCI
ST9500325AS

NVidia MCP79 AHCI
INTEL SSDA2M160G2GC

The speed reports as 3 Gigabits for both devices.


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## broad (Jun 2, 2009)

optical drives in unibody macbook pros are SATA


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## jagga (Jul 23, 2005)

Newdeal said:


> its because the regular hdd slot has the sudden motion sensor which hdds should have and the optical bay doesn't have the sudden motion sensor which for an ssd doesn't matter anyway


But isn't the sudden motion sensor actually IN the HDD case, not in the laptop as separate? 

I just hope future MBP's featuring Unibody's has SSD's by default.


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## broad (Jun 2, 2009)

yeah and i hope that my big mac is made out of the the same beef thats in a steak from Morton's, but that aint gonna happen either..haha


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## jagga (Jul 23, 2005)

broad said:


> yeah and i hope that my big mac is made out of the the same beef thats in a steak from Morton's, but that aint gonna happen either..haha


listen here bub, hehe jk. Never say never; Apple was the first to have CD drive in a laptop, first to have over 20GB in a laptop, first to have 1" thin laptop, first & a huge run to have laptops under 6lbs fully equiped (I think for over 10yrs straight). So I'm hoping this'll be soon. Maybe late 2010 or mid 2011.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

kkritsilas said:


> I have a question or two about this.
> 
> 1. The optical drive is an ATA (or more properly, a Parallel ATA) interface with I believe to be a 100 MB/s or 133 MB/s interface. This is for my late 2007 MacBook Pro, I don't know if the latest MacBooks/MacBook Pros have gone to a SATA interface for the Optical drive. With a 100/133 MB/s interface, does the interface not become a bottleneck for the performance of the SSD? While most mechanical hard drives won't read at 100MB/s, at least on a sustained basis, an high performance SSD sure can. If one is buying an SSD to maximize performance, shouldn't the SSD be on the faster SATA connection/bus?
> 
> ...


New MBPs are SATA all the way. time to get jiggy with it.


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

I received the external case last week... it was on backorder. Well, here is the setup.

It is a plastic case, and came with a usb cable (although a bit long 6ft.).

It works perfect... and I tested CD's, and it works as expected.

With regards to Macbook dual drive... this is working fine also, although I notice that it sometimes takes longer to wake up from sleep, and the battery drains more in sleep mode. Perhaps coincidence, or battery is getting weak/needs calibration.

I now just shutdown/startup, when I use it.

I will check drive settings and other advanced options using MacPilot.


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## kkritsilas (Mar 1, 2010)

screature said:


> New MBPs are SATA all the way. time to get jiggy with it.


Not everybody owns a new MBP. I own a 2007 17" MBP, and just wanted to know if this method of improving performance was an option for me and the machine that I own. It may be necessary for me to use the SATA port for the SSD, and the optical bay for a mechanical hard drive. Some folks have written here regarding the issues with the heat and impact sensors only being present in the hard drive/SATA bay. so using that bay for an SSD may be an issue, and the lack of those sensros, and the constant power draw of a mechanical hard drive in the optical bay is also a potential issue, as well as having only an ATA 100/133 interface only.

Kostas


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## greensuperman32 (Mar 28, 2005)

this is a VERY intriguing idea to me, but I have 1 concern about this. How would doing this affect my 3 years of Apple Care?


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## spacemonkey (Nov 18, 2009)

Newdeal said:


> *there are differant types of Raid, the one that is a backup is Raid 1.* The one people are doing with SSDs is Raid 0 (striped) which basically makes two drives act as one drive with double the speed and size. Unfortunately if one drive fails all our data is gone


This is dangerous talk right here. No form of RAID is a substitute for backups. RAID 1 will not protect you from accidentally deleted files, OS errors, worms, trojans, user error etc.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

spacemonkey said:


> This is dangerous talk right here. No form of RAID is a substitute for backups. RAID 1 will not protect you from accidentally deleted files, OS errors, worms, trojans, user error etc.


"Worms, trojans"??? You must come from a PC background. :lmao: No one using a Mac has to worry about such things. 

But yes no form of RAID is a backup. The only form of RAID I will ever use (and only ever have ever used), being that I am not in an enterprise environment is RAID 0 (for performance) then peform religious back ups to external drives.


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## spacemonkey (Nov 18, 2009)

Sorry, I still get flashbacks from the old days, it was so horrible...


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

I can report the external Mac drive works nicely on a netbook. Installing Ubuntu Netbook Remix.


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## Benito (Nov 17, 2007)

Sorry to reopen this older thread, but I am about to install my SSD and do the switch. I have a 2007 non unibody MBP. I have the OptiBay as well. I'm going to install my old HDD in the optibay because my 2007 MBP has ATA. The SSD will be installed with SATA in the old HD position.

What I'd like to do is to have only the OS and all apps including my virtual machine on the SSD and use my HDD as the files server, but keep the OS and apps there as a back plan in case the SSD dies suddenly. What is the best way to get my OS and apps from the HDD to the new SSD?


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

Benito said:


> Sorry to reopen this older thread, but I am about to install my SSD and do the switch. I have a 2007 non unibody MBP. I have the OptiBay as well. I'm going to install my old HDD in the optibay because my 2007 MBP has ATA. The SSD will be installed with SATA in the old HD position.
> 
> What I'd like to do is to have only the OS and all apps including my virtual machine on the SSD and use my HDD as the files server, but keep the OS and apps there as a back plan in case the SSD dies suddenly. What is the best way to get my OS and apps from the HDD to the new SSD?



SuperDuper or Carbon Copy Cloner. Both are "free". The paid version Super Duper does incremental Backupsas well and CCC is donation ware.


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## Benito (Nov 17, 2007)

I have Carbon Copy Cloner, so rather than doing a complete copy of the HDD I can selectively get it to copy the OS and the apps that I want?


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

Benito said:


> I have Carbon Copy Cloner, so rather than doing a complete copy of the HDD I can selectively get it to copy the OS and the apps that I want?


No I don't think you can be selective (not sure with CCC as I use SuperDuper). But anyway just clone everything over and delete want you don't want after is what I would recommend, otherwise you have to use the OS install CD and then Migration Assistant which is way slower.


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## Benito (Nov 17, 2007)

Hmmm unfortunately the new drive is only 80 G and I have over 110 G on my current one.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

Do you have an external drive that you can dump the extra data to, at least temporarily or borrow a friends external for a temporary data dump?


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## Benito (Nov 17, 2007)

Yes I do, that is actually a much better idea. Thanks for suggesting that, I could use the ext HD I have for my Time Machine Back ups and put the extra files there, then clone the HDD to the SSD once it is down to the OSX and apps.


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## lang (Jun 9, 2010)

Benito said:


> I have Carbon Copy Cloner, so rather than doing a complete copy of the HDD I can selectively get it to copy the OS and the apps that I want?


Yes - latest version of CCC does allow selective copies (at the folder level).


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