# WE WILL HAVE THE iPhone AFTER ALL ( JOBS ISN'T THAT STUPID)



## Neptune5.com (Feb 13, 2006)

An investigation into the ongoing trademark dispute between Cisco and Apple over the name "iPhone" appears to show that Cisco does not own the mark as claimed in their recent lawsuit. This is based on publicly available information from the US Patent and Trademark office, as well as public reviews of Cisco products over the past year. The trademark was apparently abandoned in late 2005/early 2006 because Cisco was not using it.

According to Jay Behmke, a partner at CMPR who specializes in trademark law,

The Cisco iPhone trademark was registered 11/16/1999 (Reg. No. 2293011). In order to keep a trademark registration active, you have to file a Declaration of Use on or before the sixth anniversary of the registration date, in which you state, under penalty of perjury, that you have been using the trademark continuously during that period. The sixth anniversary would have been 11/16/2005.

Cisco did not file the Declaration of Use by 11/16/2005, which if they had been using the trademark would seemingly have been easy to do. However, the USPTO gives you an extra six months grace period, if you pay an extra fee. This grace period would have expired 5/16/2006. Cisco filed a Declaration of Use on 5/4/2006 which kept their registration active. Had they not filed, their registration would have been canceled.

With the Declaration, you are required to file a copy of a label or other packaging showing the trademark in use. Cisco filed a picture of the box for the Linksys iPhone.

CIT200 - iPhone or not?

A cropped version of the picture filed by Cisco is shown above. You can find the full image on the USPTO web site. The picture shows a box for the Linksys CIT200 Cordless Internet Telephony Kit, with a sticker showing the word "iPhone™" affixed to the back, outside the shrink wrap. The front of the box is not shown, but it doesn't appear that the word iPhone appears anywhere else on the box.

A search of product reviews of the CIT200 shows no mention of the word iPhone [1]. The first mention appeared in December 2006 when Cisco unveiled a series of new products bearing the iPhone name. It was not until then that the CIT200 was rebranded under the iPhone moniker [2].

Tom Keeting, CTO of TMC Labs writes:

In fact, this seems to be true since the Linksys CIT200 and the Linksys CIT310, (both of which I reviewed) are now called the iPhone and were only recently renamed on December 18th. Specifically, each Linksys/Cisco product is called the Cordless Internet Telephony Kit or iPhone for short. The PDF manuals still reference the old name, such as this manual for the CIT200 and I couldn't find a single reference to the word "iPhone" in the manual even though I see "iPhone®" with the registered trademark throughout their website. I guess they missed that. Time to re-print/convert those PDFs!

This information indicates that Cisco did not actively offer a product named "iPhone" between 1999 and December 2006. But they knew Apple was interested in the name because Apple had approached them and negotiations were ongoing. Jay Behmke writes:

If Cisco didn't launch a product using the iPhone name, their trademark registration would be canceled and they would have no bargaining chips with Apple. So in order to keep the trademark active, they had to file the Declaration of Use, and start selling a product under that trademark.

It is possible that the Declaration of Use is defective, as there was no continuous use, and the sample that Cisco submitted was for a product not released until 7 months later. The fact that the Declaration of Use was submitted only days before the deadline expires gives me the impression that they were scrambling to get a product to market, and had to file the Declaration before the product was ready.

If Apple can prove in federal court that the Declaration of Use contained misstatements of fact, i.e. that there was no continuous use, then Cisco's registration can be canceled. This could clear the way for the next company in line for the iPhone trademark, Ocean Telecom Services LLC (widely regarded as a front company for Apple). It could also explain why Apple decided not to sign the agreement Cisco proposed. Behmke:

Without the registration, Cisco and Apple would still have a trademark dispute to resolve, but Cisco will have a harder time proving that it has valid trademark rights.

Cisco acquired the trademark when it purchased Infogear in 2000. Ironically, Infogear was granted the trademark after it was abandoned by its previous owner, a company called "Cidco".


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## gizmo321 (Oct 27, 2006)

I was hoping you meant we'll have it in Canada......


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## phuviano (Sep 14, 2005)

gizmo321 said:


> I was hoping you meant we'll have it in Canada......


Yeah, me too.


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## idiot (Sep 10, 2006)

lol, most misleading thread title ever :clap:


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## Jason H (Feb 1, 2004)

idiot said:


> lol, most misleading thread title ever :clap:


lmao.


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## Neptune5.com (Feb 13, 2006)

SORRY GUYS BUT I GOT TOO CAUGHT UP IN THERE NOT BEING THE iPhone name that i didnt care much for anything else worse case senario i will just go to newyork just to buy one roaming fees and all


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## Neptune5.com (Feb 13, 2006)

SORRY GUYS BUT I GOT TOO CAUGHT UP IN THERE NOT BEING THE iPhone name that i didnt care much for anything else worse case senario i will just go to newyork just to buy one roaming fees and all


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## Neptune5.com (Feb 13, 2006)

what the hell just happend ?


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## Oakbridge (Mar 8, 2005)

I really don't care what they call it. I am more concerned with Canada 'having it' available to them. As it is now 5 days after the US announcement, and there is still no word of Canadian availability, there are some of us that may be a little bit anxious for an announcement.


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## Thom (May 10, 2005)

Neptune5.com said:


> An investigation into the ongoing trademark dispute....


Sholdn't you give credit to someone when you use their article like this?


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## ice_hackey (Aug 13, 2004)

The I-phone is not listed on the Canadian site.
http://www.apple.com/ca/hardware/

Probably it'll come out in Canada too, but the US market must be a bigger priority at the moment.

I hope they sell an unlocked version abroad.


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## Vexel (Jan 30, 2005)

Hey guys,

The iPhone is coming to Canada. Here's a link to another thread where they're discussing it. http://www.ehmac.ca/showpost.php?p=504527&postcount=23

The only thing I keep seeing that bothers me is, if I have to sign a contract.. that's fine... but if we're forced to take a Data plan.. that's ridiculous.. the data plans in Canada are hideous and it looks like they're going to be required with a purchase of the iPhone.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Maybe you can set up the iPhone to do phoning and WIFI, but default block any data plan type usage?? That's how I would want it..


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## Vexel (Jan 30, 2005)

rgray said:


> Maybe you can set up the iPhone to do phoning and WIFI, but default block any data plan type usage?? That's how I would want it..


That's true, but you'd still have to pay for the data plan.

Basically. I want the iphone for phoning and as a portable mini computer/ipod. I wouldn't use a Data Plan unless the prices were extremely cheap. But, locking you into a data plan being required? That's BS. 

I suppose you could select the cheapest and only use it to check your email once.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

Vexel said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> The iPhone is coming to Canada. Here's a link to another thread where they're discussing it. http://www.ehmac.ca/showpost.php?p=504527&postcount=23
> 
> The only thing I keep seeing that bothers me is, if I have to sign a contract.. that's fine... but if we're forced to take a Data plan.. that's ridiculous.. the data plans in Canada are hideous and it looks like they're going to be required with a purchase of the iPhone.


I agree, forced data plan charges are unacceptable to me. I also like the idea of having a multi use phone. On my own terms.


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## ice_hackey (Aug 13, 2004)

This phone probably won't be sold outside the US, as it's EDGE. You should expect it to stay on Cingular and Rogers/Fido for a good 6-12 months.

If they decide to enter the global market they will need to adopt the same model as everyone else, and sell unlocked phones. And also probably upgrade to 3G!

If you don't buy one immediately - you'll win!
They'll probably also upgrade to a reasonably-sized HD by then too! 16GB would be acceptable.


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## Macified (Sep 18, 2003)

Vexel said:


> I want the iphone for phoning and as a portable mini computer/ipod. I wouldn't use a Data Plan unless the prices were extremely cheap. But, locking you into a data plan being required? That's BS.


The iPhone isn't a portable computer. "OS X" or not. My Palm TX has more functionality available to it than the iPhone will have for a long time. I'm not knocking the iPhone, it is what it is. As an iPod it rocks albeit with small storage. As a phone, it is miles beyond other phones. As a portable computer, it isn't there until it can do Office documents, ebooks, games, etc. In time the iPhone may be there. But for now there will be lineups of people just wanting to slag it for not doing ________ (insert complaint here). Make sure you are getting one for the right reasons (ie. just because it's cool) or you will wind up kicking yourself.

On topic: great article and some good journalistic digging. It will be interesting to see what happens next in the dispute.


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## ice_hackey (Aug 13, 2004)

Unlock it
Upgrade to 3G
Open it to 3rd party apps (filemaker, skype, etc)
Add office support
Add Blackberry push services
Add AirTunes support
Upgrade to 16GB drive or higher
Add Java support
3.2MP camera or better... better lens
Add front camera for iChat video conference & 3G
Upgrade the battery, make it removable
Add dual-sim support
Make a wifi-based "monitor out" dongle for projectors or LCD displays
Add support for BT KB & Mouse

Then you'll have a computer replacement worth buying!


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

And have fairies and cherubs dance out of the phone into your head...



ice_hackey said:


> Unlock it
> Upgrade to 3G
> Open it to 3rd party apps (filemaker, skype, etc)
> Add office support
> ...


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

My Rogers cell phone has EDGE.

No Canadian wireless provider sells unlocked phones (with a couple of exceptions for specific models).

Thanks for pointing out when the 16GB version will be available. Now we'll all wait and buy the iPhone then.

Sheesh.



ice_hackey said:


> This phone probably won't be sold outside the US, as it's EDGE. You should expect it to stay on Cingular and Rogers/Fido for a good 6-12 months.
> 
> If they decide to enter the global market they will need to adopt the same model as everyone else, and sell unlocked phones. And also probably upgrade to 3G!
> 
> ...


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## ice_hackey (Aug 13, 2004)

North America is far behind Asia in terms of infrastructure.
EDGE wouldn't be warmly embraced here, you need 3G or don't bother with data.
The current i-phone is good enough for the US market though.

As cute as the i-phone is, I'll wait for it's second generation before buying into it - for the reasons listed above. The cherubs are an option I hadn't thought of.. but now that you mention it!! 

Now that I've had a few days for the excitement to wear off - I see it for what it is. Not worth my money, yet.



HowEver said:


> My Rogers cell phone has EDGE.
> 
> No Canadian wireless provider sells unlocked phones (with a couple of exceptions for specific models).
> 
> ...


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## ice_hackey (Aug 13, 2004)

When I mentioned "the US" I meant USA and Canada... aka North America.
Yes, Toronto also has edge.

The rest of the world uses 3G.



HowEver said:


> My Rogers cell phone has EDGE.
> 
> No Canadian wireless provider sells unlocked phones (with a couple of exceptions for specific models).
> 
> ...


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## Jason H (Feb 1, 2004)

ice_hackey said:


> Unlock it
> Upgrade to 3G
> Open it to 3rd party apps (filemaker, skype, etc)
> Add office support
> ...


Ummm. Isnt that a lot of information to smash into a wifi connection? Not to mention the extra graphics processing needed.


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## ice_hackey (Aug 13, 2004)

HD 720p may be asking for too much, but 800 by 600 would be usable for my purposes. The phone processes just fine at 320 by 480, so we're already part way there! Fine - no spanning, but could mirroring really be asking so much?

I can share my desktop to other computers using Remote Desktop via WIFI so how different could this be?

They could call it "AirDock".


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Wow. No.



ice_hackey said:


> When I mentioned "the US" I meant USA and Canada... aka North America.
> Yes, Toronto also has edge.
> 
> The rest of the world uses 3G.


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## ice_hackey (Aug 13, 2004)

America invested heavily in EDGE before 3G was in the picture... but you'll see it eventually!

Other parts of the world have moved faster, but that's easier to do in smaller countries.


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## optical (Dec 31, 2006)

Having worked at cingular for a number of years I can tell you that EDGE is still the dominant data type over the GSM standard, but 3G UMTS/HSDPA/HSUPA (3.5G if you will) has been deployed in all of the major US cities. It just seems dumb to me to only have it support EDGE. The only difference is the antenna construction and a slightly different instruction set in the firm ware. Why not spend the extra .003 cents per unit to include the upgrade? As for subsidy locking, that's just a fact of this part of the world. If you want an unlocked model I'm sure someone will either figure out a hack to do it, or if there is a nice interface way then someone that works for Cingular can login to Snooper and get the unlock code out of there (It's under the utilities tab). OR you can buy one from one of the countries where subsidy locking is not a standard practice. 

I heard there was a new law passed in the US stating that the phone companys now have to give you the unlock code if you request it, because the US legislature stated that it's anti-competitive to lock customers into one company. We'll have to see how that pans out in terms of actual practice.


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## Greenman (Feb 22, 2003)

*We already have iPhone in Canada!! ...sort of*

From the Comwave site:

http://www.comwave.net/CDN/iPhone/iPhone_mobile.htm

"iPhone Mobile™ allows you to enjoy wireless communications wherever a wireless internet connection (WIFI) exists.

Simply turn the phone on and it will search for a WIFI connection on its own. Then simply make a call as you would with a cell phone. iPhone Mobile will work anywhere; at home, office, and around the world."



Not exactly the Apple phone but Canadian and holds patent rights in Canada.


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

Greenman said:


> From the Comwave site:
> 
> http://www.comwave.net/CDN/iPhone/iPhone_mobile.htm
> 
> ...


Yes, the CEO was on ROB TV the other day making his case ("Buy me out Apple, buy me out! Please don't sue me Apple!) :baby:


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## ice_hackey (Aug 13, 2004)

3G(HSDPA) is capable of 3.6 Mbit/s connection
EDGE is capable of a mere 236.8 kbit/s

The Asian market is too savvy to pick up on an EDGE phone. Heck - most people in Osaka have faster internet on their mobile than the average Canadian has at home. Ouch!

Like mentioned below, just wait for the overseas release and buy a non-locked version.




optical said:


> Having worked at cingular for a number of years I can tell you that EDGE is still the dominant data type over the GSM standard, but 3G UMTS/HSDPA/HSUPA (3.5G if you will) has been deployed in all of the major US cities. It just seems dumb to me to only have it support EDGE. The only difference is the antenna construction and a slightly different instruction set in the firm ware. Why not spend the extra .003 cents per unit to include the upgrade? As for subsidy locking, that's just a fact of this part of the world. If you want an unlocked model I'm sure someone will either figure out a hack to do it, or if there is a nice interface way then someone that works for Cingular can login to Snooper and get the unlock code out of there (It's under the utilities tab). OR you can buy one from one of the countries where subsidy locking is not a standard practice.
> 
> I heard there was a new law passed in the US stating that the phone companys now have to give you the unlock code if you request it, because the US legislature stated that it's anti-competitive to lock customers into one company. We'll have to see how that pans out in terms of actual practice.


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