# G4 Imac 17" "sunflowers" issues



## AquaAngel (Feb 16, 2007)

i will post more specs later, but i am having issues booting from Hard drive as it will not see it at all.

It simply won't find the internal hard drive. it does boot from the cd. Target disk mode shuts down the machine. no firmware password and i did reset everything via Open firmware including zapping the ram 3 times and replaced the Pram battery. ATA ribbon was replaced, still can't find the HDD when i boot from the bootable mac os x 10.2.

I can hear the hard drive spinning.

Any Firewire hard drive are also not seen. USB? not seen

Thanks


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

> Any Firewire hard drive are also not seen. USB? not seen


Do you mean they are not mounting on the desktop or they are not showing up in Disk Utility or under Startup Disk preference pane???

Usually any drive that does not mount or show up has died and has used up its lifetime.



> I can hear the hard drive spinning.


That could also be the noise from the fans thought you are hearing, and not necessarily from the drive itself.

It sounds like that drive has died.



- Patrick
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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

This is ancient history, but I believe that not all hard drives could be recognized by the G4s through FireWire--only some models and brands. I agree with pm-r that your original HD is probably toast.


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Macfury said:


> This is ancient history, but I believe that not all hard drives could be recognized by the G4s through FireWire--only some models and brands. I agree with pm-r that your original HD is probably toast.


Experience with my MacPro might also suggest that having a dead HD could impair your computers ability to recognize other devices. Also as always replace the clock battery, probably not the issue here, but it's cheap and it can't hurt.


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## AquaAngel (Feb 16, 2007)

pm-r said:


> Do you mean they are not mounting on the desktop or they are not showing up in Disk Utility or under Startup Disk preference pane???
> 
> Usually any drive that does not mount or show up has died and has used up its lifetime.
> 
> ...


once i boot from the cd "installation disk" 10.1. when it ask to choose the destination disk, none of the drive are showing. i did replace the hard drive and still can't see it as a master jumper installed just like the previous drive was set up. 

i know that drive was working as i did a wipe and did a benchtest and all was in good working order. i tried to boot from the usb drive, but nothing. if i press T for target disk mode, the mac will shut down. there is no firmware password set up on that machine.


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## Rob (Sep 14, 2002)

I don't think any of the PowerPC Macs will boot from USB. I'm pretty sure USB booting only came in with the Intel Macs.

You should be able to boot from an external firewire drive if it has a valid operating system. Target Disk mode will also have to be done through firewire on PPC Macs.

The OSX boot CD should allow you to access Disk Utility from one of the top menu options. Try looking under the Apple icon menu at the upper left. If it's not there, then try all the other menu headers. I know this was available in a 10.4 (Tiger) boot CD or DVD, but not sure if the really old OSX installer that you're using has it. It could be that the drive isn't properly formatted for this version of the OS, and can't be seen. Disk Utility should allow you to at least see the drive if it's there. It will also allow you to format and/or partition the drive so the OS can be installed.

It's been a while since I worked on an old lampshade G4. I seem to recall the hard drive was not that easy to access. Maybe a cable wasn't hooked up right somewhere in the process. Is it really worth all the trouble?


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## AquaAngel (Feb 16, 2007)

Rob said:


> I don't think any of the PowerPC Macs will boot from USB. I'm pretty sure USB booting only came in with the Intel Macs.
> 
> You should be able to boot from an external firewire drive if it has a valid operating system. Target Disk mode will also have to be done through firewire on PPC Macs.
> 
> ...


The valid bootable disc does have the disk utility in it, but it does not see the drive at all, i have replaced the drive with 3 different drive and the results are still the same Like i said, the target disk mode shuts down the computer when T is pressed while booting.


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

> i have replaced the drive with 3 different drive and the results are still the same



Not trying to sound like a smart ass here, but are _the three different drives_ you have tried actually known good working units, and also how are the connectors and connections???

If that FP iMac is booting and running properly from the install CD/DVD, then I would suggest either the internal drive and its format or its cable is goofy or kaput.


- Patrick
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## AquaAngel (Feb 16, 2007)

pm-r said:


> Not trying to sound like a smart ass here, but are _the three different drives_ you have tried actually known good working units, and also how are the connectors and connections???
> 
> If that FP iMac is booting and running properly from the install CD/DVD, then I would suggest either the internal drive and its format or its cable is goofy or kaput.
> 
> ...


OK, let me put it this way. i have 10 SCSI hard drive. all of them have been tested. Of course all of them have different sizes. All of them have passed the test, no bad block(s). the ribbon have been replaced and the symptom are still the same. i have tried the Slave jumper, no go, master, no go, cable select still a no go.

Hard drive has been put into another mac and works flawlessly, but it doesn't work on that specific G4. is it bricked? that is what i am wondering. i have tried a different Firewire cable and the symptom is still the same. EVEN if nothing is connected at the back of that machine! it still shuts off when trying to get into the target disk mode.


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

> OK, let me put it this way.



OK, let's start again and get some basic information like what exact G4 iMac model are you working with???

You can find them all listed here"
https://everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/index-imac.html

There you can read some of the information on the typical model:
https://everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/specs/imac_800_17_fp.html

I didn't see it mentioned what size your SCSI hard drives are, and you will probably notice that not all of those iMac models will support "big drives".

Also, some of the models also have other limiting factors and can be quite fussy as to what goes into their innards. The same with the Mac operating system versions.

If it helps, there is a whole page on replacing hard drives in those models here if you haven't read it already:
_*How do you replace or upgrade the hard drive in the iMac G4 models? Which models support "big drives" and which do not*_?
https://everymac.com/systems/apple/...how-to-upgrade-hard-drive-use-big-drives.html

BTW: is there some specific purpose or reason you are wanting to resurrect such an old iMac model???

If I recall, for the little I worked with any of those models, is that they could be very finicky and specific of what could be replaced. 

I'm not even sure that Apple didn't restrict hard drive replacements to their own custom built drives.

Anyway good luck with your project, and maybe someone out there in Googleland has some of the answers you are looking for.

You may want to even consider getting and using an external firewire Drive as a boot Drive if you just need to get the unit working.



- Patrick
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## AquaAngel (Feb 16, 2007)

pm-r said:


> OK, let's start again and get some basic information like what exact G4 iMac model are you working with???
> 
> You can find them all listed here"
> https://everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/index-imac.html
> ...


The imac that i am working is this model
"iMac G4/800 (Flat Panel) features an 800 MHz PowerPC 7445 (G4)"

The hard drive size is 40 gig western digital. i put in an 80 gig Seagate "working" and also a 20 gig seagate that had a os 9.2.2 installed in it as it was from a mac cube and none of those are booting on that imac.

someone posted earlier on the fan noise when i posted that the hard drive is spinning. yes the hard drive is spinning. i have power on the hard drive and trust me. when you hear a old hard drive spinning? you simply know that it is spinning. you can't mistake that sound. 

Why i want to revive that puppy? well, good ol games and ol software of course. Plus. it looks better when it is working then a dead imac on the shelve collecting dust right? 

mac looks better when it is a collectable and running like those i recently revived like my ol G3 tower? mac cube, G4 MDD, imac sunflower "ya i have 2", imac G3 and currently working on the Color classic.


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## Rob (Sep 14, 2002)

I think you've probably answered all your own questions already.

1) Is the drive dead or malfunctioning? No. Multiple drives tested with same result.
2) Is there power getting to the drive? Yes, it's spinning. Power cable attached and working
3) Is the drive seen by the computer? No. Not seen by Disk Utility on boot CD

Item 3 is the key. The drive is not being seen by the computer. The most likely problem is that the cable attaching the drive to the motherboard is not installed properly, or it the wrong type of cable. If that's not it, then the motherboard could be toast. 

You've also created some confusion by referring to SCSI drives in an earlier post. Apple switched to IDE (Parallel ATA) drives with the G3 models. A G4 iMac definitely does NOT use a SCSI drive. I don't think a normal SCSI drive will even connect with an IDE cable (different number of pins), so you probably do have IDE drives, not SCSI.


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

> I don't think a normal SCSI drive will even connect with an IDE cable (different number of pins), so you probably do have IDE drives, not SCSI.


Correct RobAnd!! And I'm glad you made the correction, and I'd say that's a pretty damn good summary of the situation.

Maybe there is a unique forum somewhere for specialty or unique problems for those _iMac G4/800 (Flat Panel) 800 MHz PowerPC 7445 (G4)_ mdels or any oddities they may have.

Otherwise I would say your corrected summary of the situation pretty well sums up all the problems.

PS: As for _*playing old Mac games*_, I'm sure I came across a post maybe a week ago of a new site that has adapted some sort of emulation for current Mac users to be able to play some of the old games.

I'm sorry I do not have any URL, but maybe that could be found with a quick Google search.


- Patrick
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## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

When I had time to mess around with older gear, I made frequent use of Low End Mac. One good place to start for iMac G4 issues.

And as for "why?" - it's an iMac G4! A bonkers, but brilliant, design from Apple. No other company would ever have put something like this on the market. I also have a 15" model in a box in the basement, with a dead HD... one of these days, I'll resurrect it. And I have a friend who has a the 20" model, which I'm trying to decide is worth the pesos he's asking for...


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## AquaAngel (Feb 16, 2007)

Some great points out there and most likely answered my question like you said. i confused myself with IDE and SCSI. i did replaced the ribbon "40 pins" and result was still the same. Now if it is the motherboard, i'm gonna have to investigate deeper in this. i do have a 20" that have a dead pram battery and i will replace it as i know that g4 is running.









for the time being? that g4 will remain on my shelve as a display, will try to fix it when i will have the time as i am getting a G4 mdd this week end


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