# iPod Touch - Futureshop



## darkscot (Nov 13, 2003)

What's the difference (besides price) on these two:

Future Shop: iPod & MP3 Players: Apple iPod: Apple 8GB iPod Touch V2

& the 8 Gb model here: Apple Store (Canada) - iPod touch

And I'm also camera shopping. Anyone have any thoughts on the Canon Powershot SX100IS? Future Shop: Cameras & Camcorders: Digital Cameras: Canon PowerShot 8MP Digital Camera (SX100IS)

Thanks!


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## ..........? (Dec 25, 2005)

Hey I can't help you much on the ipod touch but I can help you on the digital camera. Canon consumer camera line is not that great compare to other brands. Canon is great at D-SLR and professional stuff. 

I would suggest you look at Panasonic Lumix line. They have LEICA lens so they take great picture and the camera is relatively easy to use. And stay away from anything from Sony. typically their(sony) camera is not that user friendly.


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## spitfire1945 (May 17, 2008)

Canon SD series is usually very good and their DSLRs are ok but at the moment they don't hold much against the Nikon DSLRs. However Lumix has surpassed most brands out there and their leica lenses are brilliant. Sony cameras are brilliant... if they ever take SD cards. I hate Sony and their proprietary bull$hit.

Don't get carried away with with the Mega Pixels. Megapixels don't account for the quality of the CCD and CMOS chip that the camera has. Also don't get attracted towards the cameras with a VERY large LCD screen, especially avoid the ones that don't have a eyepiece view in them. This way you will conserve batteries as you will have a choice to turn off the screen and use the eyepiece viewfinder instead. 

Cheers


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## kb244 (Apr 23, 2002)

To echo what spitfire said, when looking at similar point and shoot cameras of varying megapixels, beleive it or not, but the ones with higher megapixels are more likely to be noisier and lower quality, especially since for the most part they all have the same sensor size if not very close. 

Kinda why a few years back my Canon Powershot G3 (4Mp) did better prints than the comparible 'prosumer' model of fuji 12MP cameras. Aside from the image processing chip that canon has been known for. 

DSLR of course are quite a different league.


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## hayesk (Mar 5, 2000)

Those iPod Touches are the same ones. FutureShop is cheaper.


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## kb244 (Apr 23, 2002)

hayesk said:


> Those iPod Touches are the same ones. FutureShop is cheaper.


I have a question though, I don't know how it is in canada, but I know here in the US, retailers cannot sell apple branded products new-in-box for cheaper than Apple themselves would sell them for. Is it supposed to be the same for the Canada market to, and if so how can Futureshop be cheaper?


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## wytwolf (Oct 5, 2006)

The ipod touches both have MA623C/B as their part number so they are the same. If you want more information on cameras i would suggest looking at camera review sites or forums such as Digital Camera Reviews and News: Digital Photography Review: Forums, Glossary, FAQ


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

kb244 said:


> I have a question though, I don't know how it is in canada, but I know here in the US, retailers cannot sell apple branded products new-in-box for cheaper than Apple themselves would sell them for. Is it supposed to be the same for the Canada market to, and if so how can Futureshop be cheaper?


This is a common fallacy. No manufacturer can set or restrict pricing. It's called price fixing, and it's illegal.

You only assume Apple sets prices because most retailers follow Apple pricing.



> In the United States, price fixing can be prosecuted as a criminal felony offense under section 1 of the Sherman Antitrust Act. In Canada, it is an indictable criminal offence under section 45 of the Competition Act.


Price fixing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## kb244 (Apr 23, 2002)

guytoronto said:


> This is a common fallacy. No manufacturer can set or restrict pricing. It's called price fixing, and it's illegal.
> 
> You only assume Apple sets prices because most retailers follow Apple pricing.
> 
> ...



Actually here in the US and I've worked for several camera shops (including one where I was involved in the pricing of products before we put them on the shelf, small business basically). For example you cannot price the cameras below the MAP (Minimum Advertised Price) or you risk your dealership license with that manufacture. Some companies can get away with it by offering rebates instead, cuz the advertised price remains at MAP, but the final price is after rebate.


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## CanadaRAM (Jul 24, 2005)

The manufacturer can restrict what prices are advertised, but they can't restrict what prices the dealer actually sells for. 

Apple's prices are de facto regulated through the simple fact that Apple gives the dealers an extremely small margin - 3% - 7% - which means that nobody has any room to discount.

You will see Costco selling iPods for $5 off Apple's price on a regular basis.
Futureshop occasionally puts on $10 off as a promotion.


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## kb244 (Apr 23, 2002)

CanadaRAM said:


> The manufacturer can restrict what prices are advertised, but they can't restrict what prices the dealer actually sells for.
> 
> *Apple's prices are de facto regulated through the simple fact that Apple gives the dealers an extremely small margin - 3% - 7% - which means that nobody has any room to discount.*
> 
> ...


2% to 3%, thats bout the same profit margin as most digital cameras, especially digital SLRs. Course some companies like B&H for example, if they buy up to 3 million dollars worth of inventory and pay in cash for example, they can get an additional 5% off each unit, meaning they could sell them right at MAP and still make a decent margin (respectively speaking), but its also what hurts all the smaller shops to the point that there are no more real camera stores, just chain shops that have little to no expertise.


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## Gamalen (Sep 7, 2007)

sorry..double posted by accident..not sure how to remove this.


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## Gamalen (Sep 7, 2007)

I worked as a sales manager at a photo retail store for several years and worked very with the local reps from Nikon, pentax, canon, minolta. 
The way it worked was.. we purchased the cameras at cost from the manufacturer. We could put any kind of price on that digital camera. The manufacturer doesn't care how much we sell them for or put conditions on our selling price..The unit price at cost is the same no matter who they sell them too, unless you're a big chain store (futureshop, bestbuy) where you may be able to negotiate a lower at cost purchasing price. 
Our pricing was based on:
- Suggested Retail price from the manufacturer
- Competitor pricing
- Consumer demand.

We were an independant franchise store, so actually listed our prices a little bit below big box stores. We took less profit, but moved more volume and got them into the store to buy camera accessories where the real profit was made.
This wasn't always the best tactic as people would take your chepaer price and go to futureshop and have them match or beat the price.

I'm sure that apple doesn't have a "Must sell at these fixed prices" clause in their contracts. I see sale prices all the time that are cheaper than what they have listed on apple.ca . Eg. Staples sold 8 GB nano's that were 20 cheaper the other week.


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## hayesk (Mar 5, 2000)

CanadaRAM said:


> You will see Costco selling iPods for $5 off Apple's price on a regular basis.
> Futureshop occasionally puts on $10 off as a promotion.


Actually, Costco often sells iPods at $20 or more off. Also, 4GB iPod Nanos at FutureShop cost $140 and they're $159 from Apple.


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

kb244 said:


> For example you cannot price the cameras below the MAP (Minimum Advertised Price) or you risk your dealership license with that manufacturer.


Again, this is an illegal practice. While the manufacturer can control the advertised price (through a MAP clause in your sales contract), they cannot control the price you sell the product at in-store.

It doesn't matter how many which ways they try to spin it - final sales price cannot be dictated by the manufacturer or distributor.


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## kb244 (Apr 23, 2002)

guytoronto said:


> Again, this is an illegal practice. While the manufacturer can control the advertised price (through a MAP clause in your sales contract), they cannot control the price you sell the product at in-store.
> 
> It doesn't matter how many which ways they try to spin it - final sales price cannot be dictated by the manufacturer or distributor.


Resale price maintenance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And... United States vs. Colgate. 


> "To remain legal, manufacturers must apply the policy to all their customers, and enforce it immediately and without exception."


So its legal if you make the MAP apply to everyone. Meaning apple can dictate the minimum price, but they can't restrict one reseller and not another, assuming both resellers will abide by Apple's policy. Amazon could sell ipods at 30$ cheaper, but they couldn't flat out advertise the price at 30$ cheaper, but rather you'd have to add to cart to see the lower price or show it as a rebate, least here in the US.

Also I thought Price Fixing was when more than one manufacture gets together and agrees with each other that they won't sell a certain product below or above a certain price point (say Apple got together with Archos and said neither would sell a media player for under 300$, that would be price fixing).


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## hayesk (Mar 5, 2000)

kb244 said:


> Also I thought Price Fixing was when more than one manufacture gets together and agrees with each other that they won't sell a certain product below or above a certain price point (say Apple got together with Archos and said neither would sell a media player for under 300$, that would be price fixing).


That is correct.


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## darkscot (Nov 13, 2003)

Thanks for the advice and interesting yet diverting read on price fixing. I got the Canon Powershot SX100IS and am happy with it. 

iPod Touch is pretty cool, too. The amount of apps available is cool but I hate sifting through the garbage. Any recommendations on cool Touch apps.


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