# Beijing 2008



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

...








The Official Website of the Beijing 2008 Olympic Games


Opening ceremonies on CBC at 7 am with some coverage starting earlier.

CBC Olympics | Broadcast Schedule - Daily


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## prijikn (Aug 8, 2008)

Thanks for share it . India has already won a golden medals in the Olympics.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Hmmmmmm *8/8/8* thousands of Chinese couples, some in Canada and also Australia getting married on an "auspicious" date.

Just watching the fly over of the venues in HD on CBC.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Oh :yawn: . I disliked jocks in high school and have done so ever since. Time to check out iTunes movies.


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## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

What, is some kind of track meet going on or something?


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Yes, I believe so.

Sort of combination between a Ferris wheel and an execution.

Chinese winners get bits of metal, losers get shot.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Wow liked the floating rings and fairies - gorgeous.

The rolling scroll is very effective.....nice mix of high tech and low tech.

Loved the nine year girl singing. Too sweet.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

If you look closely you can see people being dragged to the executioner for following falun gon and I can see people being beaten because they had independent thought and you can see Chinese politicians getting involved with Darfur for control of oil...I support our athlete's but it angers me to no end that Beijing got the Olympics.

Watch for controversy in ALL sports that require judging...China WILL win or at least get all 10s...even for not showing up!


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Y'know the opening ceremonies are a celebration of a 5,000 year old culture.

Stuff the inane political comments where the sun don't shine or start a separate thread if you want to rant,

It only took half a century for Canada to apologize for cultural genocide and a certain "head tax" so don't go throwing rocks "white man" 

•••

The ocean scene engaging the entire stadium was spectacular. :clap:


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Gosh, what an apologist! "I want me games!"


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## Mississauga (Oct 27, 2001)

China stinks... in a LOT of ways! Sorry, athletes. I'm not watching these Olympics. The IOC should be on a hit list for selecting this despicable country!


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Well perhaps it was a hi-jack perhaps not...the title simply said Beijing 2008. It seems pretty open for comment. We may have just apologized now for something we did in the past but you miss a key fundamental point. CHINA STILL DOES THESE THINGS NOW!!!

We are just supposed to look the other way? What if we held the Olympics in Afghanistan or Iraq?


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

MacDoc said:


> Y'know the opening ceremonies are a celebration of a 5,000 year old culture.


Bull. It is promo for the communist party hiding behind a bunch a cliche iconography.

At least the Canadian ******* Games are honest.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

You won't catch me watching the event either. I'm with rgray on this one. :yawn: :yawn:


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## Brainstrained (Jan 15, 2002)

I was disappointed China got the games, and am not happy with much of what has occurred since, but that said I am hoping for the best -- which is not that Canadians doing their best win lots of medals (though this is probably a close second) rather that the Games help open up Chinese government and society to the world.

The Chinese government, no doubt, is hoping for the reverse -- that the world opens up to China, but they have to come to the conclusion that this is a two-way street or this will be a wasted effort.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Brainstrained said:


> The Chinese government, no doubt, is hoping for the reverse -- that the world opens up to China, but they have to come to the conclusion that this is a two-way street or this will be a wasted effort.


to the Chinese communist government - "You are coming to a sad realisation...."


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

MacDoc said:


> It only took half a century for Canada to apologize for cultural genocide and a certain "head tax" so don't go throwing rocks "white man" :mad


That's a sad argument. How long has China been around? At least 1,000 years you say?


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

The athletes have unfortunately been sold down the river by the IOC. I wish them well in their individual endeavours, but this is one Olympic Games I won't watch, and no amount of fireworks and American Idol theatrics can whitewash what's happening here.


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## Sitting Bull (Feb 4, 2008)

I won't watch either, 
I cant believe the dog and pony show this has become.


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

The phrase "Potemkin village" comes to mind, only now it's a Potemkin metropolis, cleanish air and all. 

I'm also completely unsurprised that the people who thought this event would cause the Party to loosen its grip turned out to be hopelessly naive. 

Count me as another who won't be watching.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

It looks like supporters of this Olympic games are in very short supply here.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)




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## Sitting Bull (Feb 4, 2008)

Look at all the drastic steps they have taken to clean up the streets and the air pollution. Flowers, curtains to block the view of it's poor and there houses. What a joke. They will clean up the air for the olympics, but how about participating in all this carbon, global warming panic that the rest of the world is supposedly responsible for. I guess we can pay for them while they continue to do what they want.
Do we really think that China will change after this is all over? They will go right back to a lockdown state of free speech and human rights etc... Those that were brave enough to have voiced there opinion and speak out against the government will pay dearly once the west has left. 
Just my opinion.


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## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Dave Barry is in Beijing for the Olympics...


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## since84 (Jan 9, 2002)

Do you non-watchers think anyone will notice your absence?

In your cut-your-nose-off-to-spite-your-face attitude, you've missed some incredible displays.
Like at least a thousand drummers drumming in unison, and a flying white dove created by more thousands wearing white and running to create the moving image, or the people holding huge, cards flat above their heads and standing or kneeling to produce 3D effectsof China's great inventions -- paper, moveable type, the compass and gunpowder (the last celebrated by incredible fireworks displays).
The synchronization is awe-inspiring.


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## since84 (Jan 9, 2002)

I forgot to add.

The Games should be about the athletes, not the politics of the country. (even though that inevitably creeps in.)
That being said, every host city has been diligent about presenting itself at its most incredibly beautiful, including relocating homeless, etc, people (though not as unfeelingly as Bejing)
The IOC gave these Games to China instead of Canada in the belief that they would improve human rights and China's attitude toward the rest of the world. 
The IOC was wrong.

So ignore the ceremonies and speeches, but celebrate the athletes and their performance. You only get to see this level every 4 years.


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

since84 said:


> Do you non-watchers think anyone will notice your absence?


Yes. The people who measure television ratings, the people who set advertising rates based on those ratings, the people who decide to spend truckloads of money for the right to broadcast the games, the people who sell Olympic merchandise, etc.

Maybe, if enough people tune out, the idea will click with the IOC and everyone else involved in this sham: it's stupid to try to use the Olympics as an instrument of political progress and it's shameful to hold the Olympics in totalitarian countries. 

Besides, if it turns your stomach to see an already repressive regime ratchet up the repression in the name of celebrating a glorious culture, how can you possibly justify watching?

Chinese culture is glorious, wonderful and ancient, yes. Its current custodians are not worthy of it.



> The synchronization is awe-inspiring.


So is the synchronization of a typical parade in Pyongyang. Does that make it a wonderful spectacle that warms the cockles of your heart?


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

With all due respect, since84, do you think a thousand drummers forced to drum in unison makes up for the tragedy that's unfolding in China? Well then this is the show for you. 

I'm with iMAtt. The demographics will tell the tale. I wish our athletes well, but their struggle is a personal one. They were sold down the river by the IOC.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)




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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)




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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Another:


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

since84 said:


> Do you non-watchers think anyone will notice your absence?
> 
> In your cut-your-nose-off-to-spite-your-face attitude, you've missed some incredible displays.


I would rather cut my nose off than to believe these games should be celebrated in any way, shape or form. Those who believe such nonsense know not what they celebrate and that is sad.


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

Oh... my... goodness. Best cauldron lighting EVER!!!


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

*Speaking of "sad realisations"...*



rgray said:


> <snip> "You are coming to a sad realisation...."





Sitting Bull said:


> Look at all the drastic steps they have taken to clean up the streets and the air pollution. Flowers, curtains to block the view of it's poor and there houses. What a joke.


Which is more or less exactly what Vancouver anticipates/is doing in preparation for *their* Olympic moment......



since84 said:


> Like at least a thousand drummers drumming in unison, and a flying white dove created by more thousands wearing white and running to create the moving image, or the people holding huge, cards flat above their heads and standing or kneeling to produce 3D effectsof China's great inventions -- paper, moveable type, the compass and gunpowder (the last celebrated by incredible fireworks displays).
> The synchronization is awe-inspiring.


Yeah, yeah, we get all that. Not so awe inspiring in a culture where the giving and taking of orders is _de rigeur_.

*MacDoc*, nobody disputes your right to enjoy the admitted artistry and sheer magnitude of the event. I fully appreciate all that. I just wish you sounded a little more like you were "holding your nose", as the expression goes, to the human reality of the situation.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

dona83 said:


> Oh... my... goodness. Best cauldron lighting EVER!!!


That prison is just a dazzling rainbow of colour! And don't forget the dancing!


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## Amiga2000HD (Jan 23, 2007)

I watched the opening ceremonies on CBC HD too (a big screen TV's been set up in the lobby at work) - it was something else to see those pictures coming in live from the other side of the world, and the ceremonies were quite a visual presentation as well.

Yes, the Olympic games have been a political football for everybody involved since time immemorial, but I did enjoy watching the opening this morning.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Why celebrate any Olympics then?

Will people be boycotting Canada during Vancouver's 2010 hosting session? Canada does not have a perfect human rights record, you know.

If other countries had any sense they would completely refuse to trade with China--or go to war--so long as China continues to murder and imprison its own citizens in the tens of thousands, and rules with policies that result in millions of forced sterilizations and fines for just having more children, and supporting a male culture like no other.

That said, why not celebrate the athletics of it all?

Let's revisit this thread in 2010, and see how many leave the country and avoid television for a few weeks to protest Canada's hosting of the Olympics. How about a show of hands if this is what you're planning?


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

iJohnHenry said:


> Yes, I believe so.
> 
> Sort of combination between a Ferris wheel and an execution.
> 
> Chinese winners get bits of metal, losers get shot.


So, metal for both, then.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Facetious argument--there's a huge gap between "not perfect" and deplorable. If "the "athletics of it all" are completely seperable from this travesty for you, HowEver, by all means wave your flag.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Macfury said:


> Facetious argument--there's a huge gap between "not perfect" and deplorable. If "the "athletics of it all" are completely seperable from this travesty for you, HowEver, by all means wave your flag.


Whatever the politics were that selected Beijing, China is evil, the International Olympic Committee is complicit--but the athletes are not. Look away for another four years if you must.


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Many athletes have devoted the past several years just to get to these games a handful of these will actually win medals. 

Trashing Canadians (and everyone else) that have worked that hard because you disagree with the politics of the host is in extremely bad taste.

I know one athlete that had earned a ticket to Moscow. Believe me they don't get over the stupidity that leads to a boycott. If you really believe in sending a message to China you should of course sell your computer, TV and everything else that was made there. Otherwise all this holier than thou bit is just so much BS. (pardon the language)


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

HowEver said:


> Whatever the politics were that selected Beijing, China is evil, the International Olympic Committee is complicit--but the athletes are not. Look away for another four years if you must.


The athletes are complicit as well of course. Though of all the complicit parties, they are the least guilty.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

It won't let me multi-quote right now, and there are so many posts I wish to respond to. :-( 

One I remember is the 'biting off your nose to spite your face', so I will address that one.

It's called being committed to your convictions.

All this bread and circuses means diddly-squat in the hopes that China will evolve into a humane society.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

The whole Olympic thing is an overblown bunch of hype, no matter where it is held.

It is tainted by drugs and smeared by unfair competition and has been for decades. In short, it's a joke.

I won't be watching it in Canada either.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Canada has better scenery.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

*I'm celebrating!*

I'm celebrating the fact that Toronto didn't get these 2008 games when they bid on them years ago. 

Commercialized, politicized, 'roid infested, nationalist, waste of time.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Amen.

Mayor Jean Drappeau's words still echo in my head:

"The Olympic Games can no more lose money than a man can have a baby."


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

kps said:


> *I'm celebrating!*
> 
> I'm celebrating the fact that Toronto didn't get these 2008 games when they bid on them years ago.
> 
> Commercialized, politicized, 'roid infested, nationalist, waste of time.


That too! :clap:


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## johnnyspade (Aug 24, 2007)

I'm not really an olympics fan. They kind of lost me when professionals started competing and I think I liked the spirit of the thing better when it was up to the true amateurs. I did catch some of the opening ceremonies though and what I saw was pretty impressive.


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## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

I'll pay attention when the IOC finally recognises and includes Ballroom Judo, Downhill Weightlifting, High Jump Archery, and Karaoke Fencing.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Now high-jump archery I would definitely tune in for. :clap:


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

Ballroom Judo sounds cool.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

But Frank, weapons.

Imagine the carnage!!!!


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Remember when Toronto thought it had a chance? They were talking about fixing up the Don River and building all manner of public works projects--just co-incidental ya unnerstand?. That fell with a crash when Toronto got dinked, thank goodness.


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Finally managed to see the first half hour of the opening ceremonies about 11 last night. Absolutely blown away. :clap: :clap: :clap: 

Do wonder why the rebroadcasts were 4 PM, 5PM and 11 PM. Surely they could have displaced two of the 4 rebroadcasts of "The National" and plunked it down in prime time.


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## adagio (Aug 23, 2002)

Count me in as another one avoiding these Olympics. These games were entirely about politics, be damned the athletes. The IOC is corrupt as is much of the judging. Many of the athletes themselves are "dirty". 

The Olympics has become all about brown envelopes, favours, drugs and propaganda.

I cannot look the other way with all the horrors happening in China. Please, don't even try to compare Canada's imperfections with the likes of China.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

adagio said:


> Count me in as another one avoiding these Olympics. These games were entirely about politics, be damned the athletes. The IOC is corrupt as is much of the judging. Many of the athletes themselves are "dirty".
> 
> The Olympics has become all about brown envelopes, favours, drugs and propaganda.


It would seem the majority on ehMac choose not to peer through rose coloured glasses to watch this fiasco.

Those who support them are few and far between.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Clearly there are those who are watching the Olympics and therefore are busy not posting here...


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

HowEver said:


> Clearly there are those who are watching the Olympics and therefore are busy not posting here...


Well, that makes both of us "not watching" then.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Make that the Unholy Triumvirate.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

SINC said:


> Well, that makes both of us "not watching" then.


Apple users multitask. (Except when they use their iPhones.)


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

HowEver said:


> Apple users multitask. (Except when they use their iPhones.)


Highly unlikely one can watch the show and type a post at the same time, Apple user or not.

Multitask Schmultitask.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

YouTube - Fred. A Dogumentary Film


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## gastonbuffet (Sep 23, 2004)

400 mts men's freestyle swimming relay , Amazing!


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## Corbeau (Apr 25, 2008)

What's with these "Share the pride" ads, with people all over the world muttering "Oh Canada"?

Immigration Canada propaganda?


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

They need more slaves to work for the Government until Tax Free Day (June 14th this year).

Who knows what it will be next year?? Not sooner, like this year, I bet!!!


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

gastonbuffet said:


> 400 mts men's freestyle swimming relay , Amazing!


Agreed, but how could that French guy have been that stupid????


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

eMacMan said:


> Agreed, but how could that French guy have been that stupid????


Apparently.

And in the race before, there was the female swimmer who missed gold by touching the wall with a flat palm rather than extending her fingers.


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## gastonbuffet (Sep 23, 2004)

eMacMan said:


> Agreed, but how could that French guy have been that stupid????


i used to compete (really small, tiny, puny time) and 2 things happened to the french: A) time was on his side, the lead he had going in made him a winner, no doubt. this means he thought he wasn't pressed for time to touch the edge. he swam at 100%, but finished at 98%.
B) the american was at his right, he couldn't see him.

Contrary, the american knew he was lost and gave 102% all the way. 

the french faces were to die for!


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Mmmm don't thnk it was that simple....the French swimmer was locking up - he took 17 strokes to the American's 14 and the American drafted his wake which is why the French swimmer tired ....he was dragging two bodies.

The American was very clear in post swim talk about it and you can see in the video how close he clung to the lane where where the French swimmer was.

There is no way he could have done a 46 second split without drafting - that was like almost 1/2 second faster than any other split in history. 
It was heart, and a crafty experienced anchor who knew his physics.

You can see it here how it played out in the last few meters.

YouTube - 2008 olympics 4x100 mens relay intense race

I do agree it was 102% from the Yank - but he sucked the power away from the Frenchman by drafting.. the French had no gas when he needed it. I don't think he let up, he didn't have it to give.


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Point is the Frenchman was all the way to the left side of his lane. That's why the Yank was able to ride his wake so efficiently and then was able to come up with that final burst for the win.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Exactly - poor strategy by the Frenchman - crafty gamesmanship by the Yank.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Charming.  

Do lane assignments go to the highest bidder??


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Are you suggesting:

that the Americans not only bought the lane assignment, but also the poor swimming choices by the French, always so willing to sell out to their traditional rivals?

and that the Americans bought the win, based on your zero facts, mindless prejudice and nothing else?

Nice.




iJohnHenry said:


> Charming.
> 
> Do lane assignments go to the highest bidder??


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

No, I am saying that any contest between individuals should be free of "drafting", whether in water or through the air.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Well you'd eliminate a lot of gamesmanship in sporting events then 

Bicycling notably, sailing, speedskating, come to mind - I'm sure there are more.

It is part of the sport.

••
I have a question....just HOW do the beach volleyball bikinis stay on 











••

Phelps ....gold number 3 BUT 1 SECOND off the world record....in 200 meters. Wow.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Great opening ceremony... inventive, innovative and a cool mix of high tech and tradition. Some cool stuff afterwards - Phelps the phenom - and some dreadful stuff - the lone Canadian boxer being summarily done in by the fierce competitor from Kazakhstan comes to mind... I am not normally an Olympics watcher but I enjoyed catching snippets of it via CBC all the past week, even if they repeated far too many events and covered too little of the other events that were unfolding... too little money in the kitty, perhaps? Something amiss there.

In any case, politics are always going to rear their ugly head... but I have to cut this short and stuff some 'za down my gullet. Just had a long day on the road and it's time to chill... and catch some men's gymnastics.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Okay, I understand the drafting in water reference, but I don't get the through the air part.



iJohnHenry said:


> No, I am saying that any contest between individuals should be free of "drafting", whether in water or through the air.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Some of the gymnastics are incredible. 

Between CBC, NBC and NBC time shifted plus TSN there is lots of HD available.

Phelps really is a phenom.
Blows out a gold in WR time then an hour later sets an OR cruising to a heat win 

Some of the back stories - like Kirsty Coventry representing Zimbabwe duking it out with the best in the world.
She took down one world record in the heat then again in the final but ended with silver and almost upset the favourite for the gold.

•••

Drafting in air - bicycling, long distance running ( prohibited I think ), sailing. ( actually the inverse - wind blocking )


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

A couple of nights ago we caught a bit of the women's synchro diving. Wow, insane stuff. The Chinese were utterly dominant... almost surreal watching the pair of them, cool as cucumbers, flawlessly executing dive after dive. They even looked remarkably alike, as if their bodies had been were poured from the same wondrously hydrodynamic mold. Water be damned; they were on fire.

Tonight, the men's gymnastics were great too... the Chinese again showing how brilliantly prepared they were, but the Americans coming in with a bronze and being jubilant about it... and the silver-winning Japanese appearing nonplussed, even depressed... fascinating stuff.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Yeah a bit of drama with a US bronze - total meltdown by one of the US floor routine performances that hurt to watch then pulled out by a last minute hero on the pommel.

The Chinese were seriously unstoppable. Some were breathtaking.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

That last American pommel performance was pure poetry... man, he had his legs arcing up waaaay high. Serious atheticism - a bravura job that kept them in the medal runnings. That's the kind of drama I like in the games. Some great stories.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

A couple of days away from the city and all he thinks about is sports, sports, sports.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

So true. I am not myself. It is very troubling.

And it's been a full _week_ away, thanks very much.

[pulls Mac closer to self, sighing]


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

Just catching up on the Olympics, took me two sessions to view the whole opening Ceremonies. Beautiful history of China's contributions to the world, great synchonized drumming and mixing China's old culture with it's new culture (the digital age).. ex. the lighted drums. Loved all the fireworks - so much that the Chinese had me fooled that they footprint fireworks was real. I mean, after all they did invent fireworks, so why couldn't they organize those footprints, but it was all CGI.

I hate that I missed the race of the men's 8 rowing. It sounds like there was a couple of strange mishaps, but the Canadian team still came out ahead.

Lots of swimming, which the USA and Auzzies are great at. I have to agree with Macdoc that Phelps is amazing, he's going to take quite a few medals home for the USA.


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Max said:


> but the Americans coming in with a bronze and being jubilant about it... and the silver-winning Japanese appearing nonplussed, even depressed... fascinating stuff.


I suspect the Japanese would have been delighted with silver had it not been the Chinese that beat them. Both of those countries tend to hold grudges a lot longer than is either sane or healthy. 

Still can't believe some of those high bar performances. It is truly a miracle no one was killed trying to work their way up to that level.

Sorry to see David Ford miss the medals in Whitewater slalom. I do believe the gate judge blew the call on the penalty. I certainly could not see a touch. Still Canada keeps its hopes alive for "Le Grande Skunk". Maybe countries with no summer should limit themselves to the Winter Olympics.


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## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

I'm completely lost as to the schedule of the games - it's on Mexican TV, but I haven't seen a thing yet. One I'd like to catch is the 50m freestyle women's pool: the amazing story of 42-year-old Dara Torres!


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Amazing indeed! Cougar Alert!!!!


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

eMacMan said:


> I suspect the Japanese would have been delighted with silver had it not been the Chinese that beat them. Both of those countries tend to hold grudges a lot longer than is either sane or healthy.
> 
> Still can't believe some of those high bar performances. It is truly a miracle no one was killed trying to work their way up to that level.
> 
> Sorry to see David Ford miss the medals in Whitewater slalom. I do believe the gate judge blew the call on the penalty. I certainly could not see a touch. Still Canada keeps its hopes alive for "Le Grande Skunk". Maybe countries with no summer should limit themselves to the Winter Olympics.


Yeah, I figured the rather downcast Japanese reaction had to do with the Chinese. I guess they were expecting a much closer competition.

As for the whitewater stuff, I don't know much about the sport but I was fascinated by the engineering that had to have been behind such a completely artificial watercourse. I wonder how it must feel to people who are used to natural conditions (with their inherent capacity to be changed by stuff like rockslides, branches and trees that fall in during storms, etc. - all the things that can happen to a river over a given period of time, things which change up the flow and provide new surprises and challenges.

I've solo kayaked in very calm conditions up in Killarney but something tells me that it's not quite the same thing!


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Max said:


> ...
> As for the whitewater stuff, I don't know much about the sport but I was fascinated by the engineering that had to have been behind such a completely artificial watercourse. I wonder how it must feel to people who are used to natural conditions (with their inherent capacity to be changed by stuff like rockslides, branches and trees that fall in during storms, etc. - all the things that can happen to a river over a given period of time, things which change up the flow and provide new surprises and challenges.


Big difference is caused by the vertical sides. In most smaller rivers the waves stand still and the water moves. You lean in the direction the water is moving. Oceans are the opposite the waves move and the water stands still, you lean into the ocean. The vertical walls create lateral waves which are like small ocean waves criss crossing the artificial river. Nice thing is that the river level remains constant and every competitor is running in exactly the same conditions.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

True enough... great quality control that way. Leaves it entirely up to each athlete how they do; no wild card variables like you might get in a natural setting. I imagine you can also change things up fairly significantly by altering the volume of water per given second, moving the blue pylons and such... in any case, it's a pretty cool build.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> Amazing indeed! Cougar Alert!!!!


That's the Olympics for you - biggest display of spandex, skin and jiggle since the last time....


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

*Way to go, Politburo*

Ugh... just was called to watch CBC... apparently the cute little girl who sang the winsome song during the opening ceremonies was doing a Milli Vanilli... she was pretending to sing and the actual vocals were done by a girl who was deemed by the politburo to be insufficiently cute to merit her entire participation in the event. Moreover, some of the special fireworks were 'digitally enhanced' for the television viewers... the magical walking footprints were at least partially digital.

_Niiiiiiiiice._ LOL


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Next we'll be hearing that all the olympics broadcast on tv are cgi and Canada has won many medalds and China has won nothing...

They said they showed a picture of a "cute" girl because the other one was ugly. WT*? These are kids...if I was the other kids parent I would be furious!


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Yes. Excellent way of smearing egg on their own faces. A sign the Chinese authorities are trying too hard to impress the world? No, it couldn't be.


----------



## gmark2000 (Jun 4, 2003)

I find it a curse when the media pins medal hopes (expectations) on the athletes. It's so much more rewarding when a Kyle Shewfelt, Simon Whitfield or Adam Vancoverden win gold by surprise.

Perdita was certainly cursed in Athens.


----------



## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

Max said:


> Ugh... just was called to watch CBC... apparently the cute little girl who sang the winsome song during the opening ceremonies was doing a Milli Vanilli... she was pretending to sing and the actual vocals were done by a girl who was deemed by the politburo to be insufficiently cute to merit her entire participation in the event. Moreover, some of the special fireworks were 'digitally enhanced' for the television viewers... the magical walking footprints were at least partially digital.
> 
> _Niiiiiiiiice._ LOL


I mentioned the CGI of the footprint fireworks above.. not really a Biggie in my view. It would have been better, though, if China had said it was done digitally. I think that's what most people are looking for, is for China to be honest, and hiding all this, just for the news crews to find out later is just hurting China's rep.



Max said:


> I was fascinated by the engineering that had to have been behind such a completely artificial watercourse.


For some reason the underwater camera caught my fascination - this round cylindrical thing under water in one of the lanes that moved ahead of the swimmers. Of course under water cameras are nothing new. 

Microsoft was apparently kept busy by one of the US networks providing 30-some internet feeds of the Olympics under certain computer, power and other technical restrictions given to the news networks at the Olympics. There was a Geekbrief article on it.


----------



## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

Man, with the music from the Men's Beach Volleyball, I feel like starting a bonfire and opening up a beer and having a beach party... LOL. Beach Volleyball must be the snowboarding event of the Summer Olympics. Party on Dude...


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Kosh said:


> I mentioned the CGI of the footprint fireworks above.. not really a Biggie in my view. It would have been better, though, if China had said it was done digitally. I think that's what most people are looking for, is for China to be honest, and hiding all this, just for the news crews to find out later is just hurting China's rep.


Agreed - I'd have no problem if they'd mentioned it from the outset. Might strike me as a tad cheesy, but I'd be happy to wave it off in the spirit of any country crowing about hosting the Olympics and using the event as a proud coming-out party. Now, however, it just makes the organizers look heavy-handed, belittled by their own obsessive politics.

The story of the little girl is different... that's pure cheese. Perhaps I am dismayed because I found myself captivated by the sight of this amazing, beaming kid and her wonderful voice, alone in the centre of that packed, utterly surreal stadium... I got taken in and I resent that. LOL


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

You mean that wasn't real water


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Tough break for the US women's gymnasts... unnerved by the youthful Chinese and their insanely lengthy training regimen. Some heart-breaking falls and mis-steps cost them crucial points. We were watching an American channel and there were some veiled allegations that the Chinese were falsely representing the ages of their contestants - that one or two of the Chinese female team were too young to qualify for the events. Pretty wild stuff and I have to wonder if we won't be hearing more of this story in the coming days.

Still, the Americans got a silver. They were gunning for more, and clearly they were unhappy to be playing second-fiddle to the host country, but those teensy Chinese girls were just stupendous... they were approaching the sort of clinical perfection and tight tolerances that you'd expect from a fine-tuned, well-oiled machine.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

It's Big Cash versus Slave Labour on the world's most unspoiled stage!


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

That's about it... although I wouldn't characterize it as such... the slave labour bit is a tad dramatic. I imagine most Chinese are rather happy at rising living standards and view their steady rising in the modern world as a direct result of terrific collective willpower; your mileage may vary and it seems you're much happier portraying it in darker, less charitable terms.

But certainly the approach is different - these athletes are chosen at an early age and experience an exceedingly long incubation period. Viewed from many angles there is an undeniably sinister undertone to it - Papa State knows best what's best for his subjects. Bucketloads of cash makes it easier to go up against this "athlete farm" strategy but it doesn't automatically guarantee that you can stop them from attaining their goals. Ask the American gymnasts who did their very best these Olympics.

Superb athletes like Michael Phelps represent another sort of wild card; comparatively speaking, neither private largesse nor sweeping nationalist programs can do much in the face of such raw ability.


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Max said:


> ...
> Superb athletes like Michael Phelps represent another sort of wild card; comparatively speaking, neither private largesse nor sweeping nationalist programs can do much in the face of such raw ability.


Coupled with an incredible work ethic. His team mates say he goes flat out every practice session!


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

I know it's a cliché but: _it couldn't happen to a nicer guy._ Seems to be really loved and respected by his team-mates. What a machine!


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Is his trainer a Canadian?? - Bauman's quite the sports name here...

••

I'm glad the new suits are widely used - it's destroying the record book but at least the playing field is level in that respect.


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Very futurismo, those suits. When they're fully decked out in them, wearing their high tech goggular units and furiously shaking their limbs in prep, they look just a tad strange.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

oooooowwwwwwwwwwwwwww !  

not for the faint of heart.....

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/200


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Thanks for the warning, but I still almost passed out. I can't even imagine the pain from a dislocated elbow.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

The showman stuff did not bother me - it's show business and illusion is the order of the day but gymnasts age is disturbing and those girls do NOT look 16

YOU tell me that girl on the right is legal










cmon 68 lbs at age 16.










This looks like a _preteen cheer_ 

Quite frankly I'm not certain that young performers should be barred but I would have to defer to the "experts".

It seems like such an odd lottery - if puberty delays you've got a huge advantage.

They WERE marvelous however.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

They were certainly all incredible but they _all_ looked much younger than 16... geez, the one in the middle is equally suspect! Something's rotten here. Fascinating to catch the only mildly-veiled skepticism on the part of commentators covering the event.

Politics again... each round of Olympics seems to be quite unable to fully insulate itself from the oft-messy folly of nationalist politics.

I didn't watch buddy dislocate his elbow. Couldn't even stomache the thought of watching it.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

As I cruised some of the photos it almost seem some of the photos made their faces look older.

They did have significant makeup on



















Seriously questionable










versus










tho the US team member on the left also looks very young - no where near the "ageless" Chinese


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

Still not watching...but from the descriptions here it reminds me of Olympic games during the Cold War years when state employed "amateur" athletes from the communist block had to perform and win gold in order to show how superior their system was. I think China hasn't gotten over that. Still going for the propaganda value...bizarre.

Over the years I noticed that the host country always seems to do much, much better in the gold medal department than when the games are hosted elsewhere.

Coincidence? I think not.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

That's very understandable - it's national pride to do well when you are host.

When you look at a small country like Australia and how well they do in many categories it's clear that spending money on facilities and identifying top candidates early and giving them full support pays off.

This IS China's coming out party and they really only started in on the Olympic sports late in the game...really only in the 1980s.

They've steadily progressed as their programs matured



> In 2004, China took part in the Athens Games with a strong delegation, with 407 athletes participating in 26 out of the 28 sports listed on the games program, except for baseball and equestrianism. With a historic high of 32 gold in 13 sports and 63 medals in all, China broke its record Olympic medal haul and exceeded Russia to rank second in the gold medal tally, following the United States, and third in the overall medal tally.


http://english.china.org.cn/english/null/116819.htm

Effort and focus is one thing, drugs ( East Germans and many others including Canada and the US ), biased judging and now perhaps underage altheletes casts a shadow on some truly incredible performances by Chinese athletes who are playing it straight.

If you've got 20% of the planet's population to draw on and a lot of money - it's not surprising how well they are doing - especially with the home town crowd at the venues to pump them up.

It's a marvelous event you are missing.


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## GratuitousApplesauce (Jan 29, 2004)

The Olympics are about profit for a few, but sold to the masses based on pride of country. At least professional sports are honest and upfront in that it's all about big money entertainment. The Olympics hitches itself to supposedly nobler ideals, but is still all about money in reality.

Personally I hope Canada wins no medals, just to show that our increased funding for the programs was truly wasted. Afterwards the world can go back to completely ignoring relay swimming, rhythmic gymnastics, pole vaulting etc. and those who make it their curious hobby to participate in these arcane pursuits can get off their amateur sport welfare.

But in Vancouver, heading for 2010, real estate developers rejoice, while the poor still sleep in alleys.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Yeah, it's a marvelous event we're missing all right.

Some just have a warped sense of "marvelous".


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Yet your marvelous interest in these games you haven't seen is sufficient to warrant your commentary in here, Sinc. You sound like you're talking yourself into your own one-man propaganda program. Warped, indeed!

KPS, I have to agree with MacDoc on this one - I think the Chinese were psyched and have been prepping for these games for a very long time. They want all those medals, to prove to themselves as much to the world that they are a nation deserving of respect. That they might stoop to cheating in one or two instances is not necessarily a huge factor - doping, for example, is something that many nations have experimented with and it's an continual pestilence each and every modern Olympics has had to contend with. I am not excusing the Chinese for falsely representing the ages of some of their athletes (if that indeed is the case), mind you. I'm just noting that cheating is an equal-opportunity sport.

As for cold-war propaganda, it's interesting how these carefully laid-out plans can still backfire. I am reminded of how Jesse Owens cleaned the Nazis' clock in the 1936 Berlin Olympics. The host team still took the most medals but the fact that a black athlete from America could take four golds really irked those who were so intent on crowing about Aryan prowess.


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Max said:


> Yet your marvelous interest in these games you haven't seen is sufficient to warrant your commentary in here, Sinc. You sound like you're talking yourself into your own one-man propaganda program. Warped, indeed!


Max, you are usually astute enough to read the thread before making comments about my opinion being a "one-man propaganda program".

Perhaps this will refresh your memory and void your one-man theory:



rgray said:


> Oh :yawn: . I disliked jocks in high school and have done so ever since. Time to check out iTunes movies.





The Doug said:


> What, is some kind of track meet going on or something?





iJohnHenry said:


> Yes, I believe so.
> 
> Sort of combination between a Ferris wheel and an execution.
> 
> Chinese winners get bits of metal, losers get shot.





RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> If you look closely you can see people being dragged to the executioner for following falun gon and I can see people being beaten because they had independent thought and you can see Chinese politicians getting involved with Darfur for control of oil...I support our athlete's but it angers me to no end that Beijing got the Olympics.
> 
> Watch for controversy in ALL sports that require judging...China WILL win or at least get all 10s...even for not showing up!





Mississauga said:


> China stinks... in a LOT of ways! Sorry, athletes. I'm not watching these Olympics. The IOC should be on a hit list for selecting this despicable country!





Sitting Bull said:


> I won't watch either,
> I cant believe the dog and pony show this has become.





iMatt said:


> The phrase "Potemkin village" comes to mind, only now it's a Potemkin metropolis, cleanish air and all.
> 
> I'm also completely unsurprised that the people who thought this event would cause the Party to loosen its grip turned out to be hopelessly naive.
> 
> Count me as another who won't be watching.





Macfury said:


> With all due respect, since84, do you think a thousand drummers forced to drum in unison makes up for the tragedy that's unfolding in China? Well then this is the show for you.
> 
> I'm with iMAtt. The demographics will tell the tale. I wish our athletes well, but their struggle is a personal one. They were sold down the river by the IOC.





Ottawaman said:


>





kps said:


> *I'm celebrating!*
> 
> I'm celebrating the fact that Toronto didn't get these 2008 games when they bid on them years ago.
> 
> Commercialized, politicized, 'roid infested, nationalist, waste of time.





The Doug said:


> I'll pay attention when the IOC finally recognises and includes Ballroom Judo, Downhill Weightlifting, High Jump Archery, and Karaoke Fencing.





adagio said:


> Count me in as another one avoiding these Olympics. These games were entirely about politics, be damned the athletes. The IOC is corrupt as is much of the judging. Many of the athletes themselves are "dirty".
> 
> The Olympics has become all about brown envelopes, favours, drugs and propaganda.
> 
> I cannot look the other way with all the horrors happening in China. Please, don't even try to compare Canada's imperfections with the likes of China.





GratuitousApplesauce said:


> The Olympics are about profit for a few, but sold to the masses based on pride of country. At least professional sports are honest and upfront in that it's all about big money entertainment. The Olympics hitches itself to supposedly nobler ideals, but is still all about money in reality.
> 
> Personally I hope Canada wins no medals, just to show that our increased funding for the programs was truly wasted. Afterwards the world can go back to completely ignoring relay swimming, rhythmic gymnastics, pole vaulting etc. and those who make it their curious hobby to participate in these arcane pursuits can get off their amateur sport welfare.
> 
> But in Vancouver, heading for 2010, real estate developers rejoice, while the poor still sleep in alleys.


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Sinc, good morning!

Looks like you're been busy - overcompensating here a tad, aren't we? I was responding to you, the individual we know as Sinc, but if you feel you need to be buttressed by the many, what can I say?


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Morning and top of the day to you sir. Just wanted to be sure you didn't think I was alone, is all.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

No, indeed. I read all of those responses when I came back from my week away.

Ahhh, well. Soon enough these current Olympics will be over. Others will take its place, and new scandals and whiffs of corruption will inevitably errupt. Like bad air, the stench of politics, of ultranationalist zealotry, will infect them, too.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

I wonder if anyone has tested for lead in the medals that were not given to the Chinese?


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Better get them to check the Beijing water, too - who knows what what yellow perils may be found there. Those red devils!


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

Max said:


> As for cold-war propaganda, it's interesting how these carefully laid-out plans can still backfire. I am reminded of how Jesse Owens cleaned the Nazis' clock in the 1936 Berlin Olympics. The host team still took the most medals but the fact that a black athlete from America could take four golds really irked those who were so intent on crowing about Aryan prowess.


While you're reminded of Owens, who competed against the clock, I'm reminded of the Olympic figure skating scandal. When judging equally good performances, the host country seems to be given the edge. Mind you, the Chinese always had good divers and gymnasts, but still, my cynicism of judging remains.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

kps said:


> I'm reminded of the Olympic figure skating scandal.


Which one? The one with Stojko?


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> Which one? The one with Stojko?


No, the judging scandal where the French judge was in cahoots with the Ruskies.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Yes...I remember that one...


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

kps said:


> While you're reminded of Owens, who competed against the clock, I'm reminded of the Olympic figure skating scandal. When judging equally good performances, the host country seems to be given the edge. Mind you, the Chinese always had good divers and gymnasts, but still, my cynicism of judging remains.


Fair comment. Running parallel to that observation would be the one that so few of a host country's citizens are willing to admit that they have been granted an unwarranted edge in competitions - that errors in judgement tend to be skewed to the home advantage. No, the pretense is that it's above suspicion, that favouritism is not a factor. Doubtless each host country takes its turn dancing to this tune.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

Max said:


> Fair comment. Running parallel to that observation would be the one that so few of a host country's citizens are willing to admit that they have been granted an unwarranted edge in competitions - that errors in judgement tend to be skewed to the home advantage. No, the pretense is that it's above suspicion, that favouritism is not a factor. *Doubtless each host country takes its turn dancing to this tune*.


Only those that are able to buy-off the IOC in order to get them. <insert a big cynical smily>


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Yep... methinks there's something to that cynicism. When has bribery and fawning flattery ever ceased to be effective in this old world?


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)




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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

I'm waiting for the positive doping tests to start to come in.... Which they likely won't because the Olymics has driven the market and research for undetectable doping.....


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Hey, looks like Tom Waits' old man in that arm chair... after one too many, natch.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

There have already been some sent home for doping - do try and keep up 



> Greek athlete fails doping test, recalled from Beijing
> 
> 5 days ago
> 
> ATHENS (AFP) — A Greek track athlete due to compete in the Beijing Games has been recalled after testing positive for a prohibited performance drug, Greek sports officials said Friday.


Anyone catch the wild men's individual overall gymnastics - some incredible falls.



















Quite unusual at that level.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

MacDoc, when did I ever say they haven't been working on doping? Tsk tsk. Talk about "keeping up" - this edict from a man who is chronic in mixing up his _its_ with his _it's_.

Take _that,_ varlet!


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

The breadth of the competitions that depend entirely on judging is astounding. I prefer a straight-up height, speed, length type of competition.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Max said:


> MacDoc, when did I ever say they haven't been working on doping? Tsk tsk. Talk about "keeping up" - this edict from a man who is chronic in mixing up his _its_ with his _it's_.
> 
> Take _that,_ varlet!


mea culpa on its 

••

The guy pictured was in the middle of dismounting from the rings - so you know the velocity...he lost his grip and was totally disoriented and out of control - hit very very hard. No Youtube I can find yet.

••



> The breadth of the competitions that depend entirely on judging is astounding. I prefer a straight-up height, speed, length type of competition.


Yet those are the most prone to doping.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Hmmm... good point... they are indeed the most prone to doping.

MF, although I see your point, when it comes to artistic merit (often a category in stuff like figure skating and gymnastics), you can't really quantify that or use a handy sliding scale. That's when things can admittedly get loosey-goosey, but I think it's important for certain competitions to have artistic merit comprising at least part of the summation of an athlete's performance.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

We are now the only team withOUT a medal. We have set many personal bests and do well in the world championships but we seem to be missing something...likely undetectable steroids...


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> We are now the only team with a medal....



 make that WITHOUT a medal.. unless things have changed in the last few minutes.. All the talk of Canadian records and personal bests is so much horse faeces ... And the wailing for $$$$ has already started - AMATEUR sport my @$$.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Post corrected..yes withOUT a medal...


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Margaret Wente's thoughtful take on those teensy Chinese female athletes in today's Globe.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

I don't care if Canada gets any medals. Nice when it happens, but not at all necessary.

If someone finishes fourth or tenth or 100th in the world, that is fantastic.

When some journalist writes that an athlete finished "a disappointing seventh," it shows that they are a disappointing writer with no perspective worthy of mention.

Focus on personal bests, maybe even Canadian records.

.


----------



## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Max said:


> Margaret Wente's thoughtful take on those teensy Chinese female athletes in today's Globe.


Just puts me in mind of castrati, except the parents were Italian, and the practice has been criminalised.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Wente - not as intolerable as usually find her but a bit too holier than thou for my taste.

China has gone from primarily third world disastrously crippled by the Gang of Four, Mao and the Cultural revolution to developing nation with a strong overlay of first world in 3 decades for 20% of the planet's population. Are there stresses and horrors - of course.

Parents can have one child, a way out of poverty for that child is for the child to excel in athletics even if it's not at the international level at least it's an attempt to get there.

What would you do - continue in poverty - along with some 700 million others still mired there, or push your child to take a shot at a decent if hard existence.

It IS rock and hard place and for 40% of China there is no third option.

What WOULD YOU do??


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

I pretty much agree with HowEver... it annoys me greatly when I read an "athlete let Canada down in obtaining a medal"...I read a couple today and yesterday and was shocked!!! These athlete's had personal bests, so they have done better than they have ever done and let us down? They never let anyone down... 

Now, not having any medals...I really would like us to be in the running... it adds another element to watching (albeit I ain't watching this round) Vancouver next round, I'll be watchin' hockey, and whatnot...


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

I run hot and cold with Wente. But she certainly nailed it for me in terms of defining the discomfort I feel about these child athlete experiments.

I don't know what I would do. It occurs to me however, not for the first time, that China's cultural mindset places the spin more on collectivism than on the rights and achievements of the individual.

Seems to me these kids did indeed have their childhood taken from them. That's tragic. China appears quite willing at this stage to make countless individual sacrifices for the sake of the so-called greater good. The problem with using children toward these goals is that they lack the understanding of all that is being asked of them at such early ages.... they are being used by the state and I cannot condone that decision, nor the price these kids pay to mimic perfect athletic machines.

You mention poverty... China is already quickly rising away from massive poverty, thanks in part to a ravenous appetite in the West for all manner of cheap goods. We can't look at the modern China without taking a good honest look at the West. As kps was suggesting the other day, the two regions are inextricably linked... triumphant China rises up while the older, more mature economies of the world are experiencing instability and weakening markets. Perhaps too many in the West are tired and have become soft with their many toys and diversions. Funny, then, that China is equally bent on pursuing much the same lifestyle baubles.

I keep hoping for less national zealotry in the world so that we can as a species turn to addressing the many challenges facing all living things in this crucial era we live in. So far I find little to celebrate.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Ramble ramble .....what would you choose for your child - poverty or a a hard row athletic program???

Those are real and only choices for some 40% of Chinese. 

You may indeed get on the Party's choice of priorities with justification but for the parents....

The competition for limited better education is fierce - what are poor parents with a physically gifted child supposed to do.

Also recognize there is a huge inbuilt misogynism regarding girls. "Expendable' for many families might be appropriate.


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Ramble ramble? And your word salad and link diarrhea is better how?

LOL

_____________________________________

You make it seem like a simple, straightforward choice - poverty or star athleticism for the lucky Chinese kid who gets chosen. I don't buy it. Once the state takes them in and starts to mold them, their lives are no longer their own -childhood's end. Perhaps the parents profit with increased material goods and vicarious attention for their star progeny, but what does the kid herself get from it? Maybe we should pose that question to some of those Chinese girls in five or ten years' time.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Food 

••••••

Well the age thing is pretty much a done deal but the IOC appears to be ignoring it.



before










after










there is lots more
David Flumenbaum: Scandal of the Ages: Documents Reveal Underage Chinese Gymnast

Looks like three of the girls are underage.



> EXHIBIT E: A Xinhua (Chinese state media) article from November 3, 2007 stating clearly that "The Wuhan Team's 13-year-old He Kexin faced off against the National Teams' Yang Yilin in women's parallel bars." Once again, 13 in 2007, 14 in 2008.


----------



## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> We are now the only team withOUT a medal. We have set many personal bests and do well in the world championships but we seem to be missing something...likely undetectable steroids...


I wouldn't say that. We've had quite a few athletes come in 4th and 5th. Heck we missed a medal in one of the swimming events by a tenth of a second, that's still impressive. And alot of finals aren't for a few days yet, such as the 8 man rowing.


----------



## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

MacDoc said:


> Also recognize there is a huge inbuilt misogynism regarding girls. "Expendable' for many families might be appropriate.


Actually, I heard an interesting story about girls in China from a friend. It's not really Olympics related though, but.... Apparently in China, like India, boys are in demand. Apparently one of the reasons in China for this is because sons take care of the parents when they're old, and Chinese can only have one child or else they are fined (and that child doesn't receive schooling, etc.). But because of this, there are less girls and less women for their sons to marry. So often, the parents will buy a bride for their son. This has also caused there to be alot of unannounced kidnappings. So in a very weird malfunctioning way, girls are in demand.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

There is something around 1.7 million missing girls against normal birth patterns between India and China.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

If you get a chance catch a replay of the women's individual gymnastics....high drama and some phenomenal performances.

The US finally dented the Chinese wall of medals despite some marginal judging.


----------



## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

Philip Pan believes the Chinese government is using the Olympics to prove to the people of China that a one-party system can be just as effective as a Democratic government.

THE BOOK at Out of Mao’s Shadow by Phil Pan

globeandmail.com: Chinese turn a blind eye to facts under their noses


----------



## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

MacDoc said:


> There is something around 1.7 million missing girls against normal birth patterns between India and China.


 What else can be said? 




Ottawaman said:


> Philip Pan believes the Chinese government is using the Olympics to prove to the people of China that a one-party system can be just as effective as a Democratic government.


Interesting.

And all the time the Western media is fixated on China's attempt to ingratiate themselves more into the main-stream.

Cleaver buggers.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Umm I don't quite understand your comment.

China's leadership is not responsible for a long tradition in China's rural area of treating daughter's as disposable.

If anything India is more culpable in that regard as they tolerate wealthy families choosing the sex of their offspring.

As hard as it may be - China HAS wrestled the over population dragon at least to a draw.....properity and education should complete the task.

••

Looks pretty slim for Canada this year....the rowers are just about last hope.

Much drama in the women's swimming - lots of close races and upsets. 

Despite the unfair advantage of below age athletes US came gold/silver in individual women's overall - well deserved too.

Maturity showed - they didn't fall apart..

Can anyone tell me why race walking is an Olympic sport 

••

Just watched Usain Bolt  the guy is surrounded by world class sprinters going full out for a place in the next round and this guy bascially "strolls" - there is no other word for it ...to win the heat in 9.92 when the world record is 9.72










He slowed and looked around at the crowd as he cruised across the finish.....commentators are talking 9.6 even possible 9.5 from this guy..and he makes it look effortless.



> Look both ways! Bolt, Powell, Gay cruise to 100 SF
> 
> By HOWARD FENDRICH
> AP Sports Writer
> ...


and it's not even his best event 

••

ooof - close call for Phelps - thought he had lost it - out touched the other swimmer by 1/100th of a second. 

seven golds - one more to go.


----------



## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Power Walking could certainly be dumped.

Canada is just one broken rudder away from "achieving" the total goose-egg.


----------



## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

MacDoc said:


> Can anyone tell me why race walking is an Olympic sport


Because it's bbbbboooooorrrrrrrriiiiiiiinnnnngggggg..... XX) 

Honestly have no idea. But apparently it's more important than women's softball, which is being taken out of the Olympics after this year.



MacDoc said:


> Just watched Usain Bolt  the guy is surrounded by world class sprinters going full out for a place in the next round and this guy bascially "strolls" - there is no other word for it ...to win the heat in 9.92 when the world record is 9.72
> 
> He slowed and looked around at the crowd as he cruised across the finish.....commentators are talking 9.6 even possible 9.5 from this guy..and he makes it look effortless.


I saw that too... he basically looked like he was taking it easy the last 20 metres.



MacDoc said:


> ooof - close call for Phelps - thought he had lost it - out touched the other swimmer by 1/100th of a second.
> 
> seven golds - one more to go.


Now that was close. A few of the broadcasters were discussing it, saying that's the difference of a fingernail, and the other one saying even less. Serbia is appealing the 1/100 second loss.

It's good news for Phelps... he's one million dollars richer thanks to the 7th medal and Speedo his sponsor who put up the jackpot if he got 7 gold medals.


----------



## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

MacDoc said:


> Umm I don't quite understand your comment.
> 
> China's leadership is not responsible for a long tradition in China's rural area of treating daughter's as disposable.


Of course they are. The one child policy? Come on.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Dara Torres qualifies for Sunday's final!*



> Swimming in the second semifinal, Torres popped a time of 24.27 to nail down the No. 1 slot for the championship final. Competing in her fifth Olympics and with 10 Olympic medals already to her credit, Torres just missed her American record of 24.25, set at the United States Olympic Trials last month in Omaha.


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

MacDoc said:


> Can anyone tell me why race walking is an Olympic sport


Can of worms...

Curling gets me. It's a game, not a sport. 

One could argue that any judged event doesn't belong in the Olympics.

Race walking is silly because you can move faster by taking your feet off the ground. I will say those guys are crazy fast though.


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## gmark2000 (Jun 4, 2003)

We're on the verge of getting our first medal. Either silver or gold from a female wrestler. (Knowing Canada's luck, we'll get the silver.)


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Canada is leading in the men's pair rowing - half way through the 2000 meter :clap: we shall see.

Aussies now ahead.


Canada wins a silver :clap:










Apparently the first medal.

Wrestling is for sure a silver and maybe a gold . On now.

Cool she won the first of three rounds. One more and we have have a gold.

2 nothing lead in second round.








Gold for Canada :clap:
Carol Huynh.

And that was over the reigning world champion two years running 

And a shared bronze for another wrestler..the drought is over.


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## gmark2000 (Jun 4, 2003)

Three medals. I guess our work is done.


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

gmark2000 said:


> Three medals. I guess our work is done.


Too bad. That goose egg would have been a real achievement one that could never be surpassed. Maybe 2012.beejacon


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

That thought crossed my mind....:clap:

•••

Usain Bolt 










9.69 seconds monster new world record....and he ran away from the field - once more cruised - he raised his arms 15 m from the end, looking around, stops using his arms and just coasts.

How does a guy that big 6' 5" move that fast. What a wonder...

One day he's actually going to try.

Good read
BBC SPORT | Olympics | Athletics | Bolt from the blue

and he's only 21.


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## hhk (May 31, 2006)

Can you believe NBC was showing the USA vs. Spain *preliminary* basketball match during this race? What a joke.

Do you think having zero American contenders had anything to do with it?


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Vandave said:


> One could argue that any judged event doesn't belong in the Olympics.


It would be a good argument.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

So we eliminate referees too??? 

••

NBC time shifts for their patrons convenience 

I DID have rise rather early ( by accident) to catch Canada's medals.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

MacDoc said:


> So we eliminate referees too???


No, but we use video cameras to back up their decisions. Not possible with someone prancing around with a ribbon on a stick.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Indeed. A prance-free Olympics would be an Olympics made safe for all!


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

Macfury said:


> It would be a good argument.


It would only make sense to boot all the judged events out of the Olympics, at least we would get rid of all the scandals that come from which judge is in bed with who in whatever event is being judged next.

Laterz


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

Macfury said:


> No, but we use video cameras to back up their decisions.


not a bad idea I just saw Italy getting scored on when according to the replay the ball didn't even cross the line.

Laterz


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

K_OS said:


> It would only make sense to boot all the judged events out of the Olympics, at least we would get rid of all the scandals that come from which judge is in bed with who in whatever event is being judged next.


Judged events have no place in the Olympics and it would be great to see them dumped. A lot of my objections to the Olympics would fade away if they narrowed their focus to measurable performance.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

^^^
Perhaps more of the Olympic Games could actually be based on some real sports that are played by actual leagues. They do not have Olympic Rugby, or Rugger, or Hurling, and Baseball was dropped as a demonstration sport, replaced with Softball (I think). Olympic "wrestling" is basically some greasy dudes getting Greco-Roman on the floor - they should have real wrestling, since the fixing of matches would fit right into the methods of the IOC.

And what about Olympic Auto Racing? Viewer wise, Auto Racing is one of the most popular sports in the world, with almost a half million people that turn out for the Indy 500 as evidence, the crowds that turn out for the Tourist Trophy (for motorcycles) and for the various rally races that go on. 

I doubt that someone could actually demonstrate that some dude juiced on steroids that can throw a metal ball 200 feet is somehow "in better shape" than the dudes that drive the off road trucks for two straight weeks in the Dakar Rally.

Instead, we have underage girls prancing around with hoops and ribbons, people frolicking in swimming pools, and all of the other "sports" that no one bothers with except in the Olympics.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

> Judged events have no place in the Olympics and it would be great to see them dumped. A lot of my objections to the Olympics would fade away if they narrowed their focus to measurable performance.


I can see it now...

was that a strike...well...lets look at the video .......14 hours later.....


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

EvanPitts said:


> I doubt that someone could actually demonstrate that some dude juiced on steroids that can throw a metal ball 200 feet is somehow "in better shape" than the dudes that drive the off road trucks for two straight weeks in the Dakar Rally.


In terms of "better shape" Formula 1 drivers train to sustain heart rates in excess of 170 bpm and to resist G-forces of +/- 5G while still maintaining attention and lightning fast reflexes for 2 hours. NASCAR drivers have to perform over 500-600 miles or around 4 hours. The punishment Paris-Dakar drivers endure is even greater. Nothing in the Olympics even comes close.

Perhaps we should note that the Olympics are called *GAMES*, not "sports".


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

rgray said:


> Nothing in the Olympics even comes close.


Triathlon and marathon.


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

EvanPitts said:


> ^^^
> Perhaps more of the Olympic Games could actually be based on some real sports that are played by actual leagues. They do not have Olympic Rugby, or Rugger, or Hurling, and Baseball was dropped as a demonstration sport, replaced with Softball (I think). Olympic "wrestling" is basically some greasy dudes getting Greco-Roman on the floor - they should have real wrestling, since the fixing of matches would fit right into the methods of the IOC.


I don't think baseball and softball should be in the Olympics. I don't consider them to be sports.

I would like to see MMA added. The only problem is the toll a single match places on the body. I guess the fights could be limited to 5 minutes.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Vandave said:


> Triathlon and marathon.


I'd like to see some data on sustained heart rates in those sports.


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

rgray said:


> I'd like to see some data on sustained heart rates in those sports.


I'd like to see a Nascar driver try to keep up with a professional runner or triathlete for more than 1 km.

And yes, marathoners and triathletes get their heart rates up to that level for many hours. 

How do you think those drivers train to get their fitness up? Running and cycling. It's just that marathoners and triathletes do more of it.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Beijing sure is gorgeous today - clear air and blue sky. What a treat for the athletes.


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

Another Bronze. Good job Cochrane. :clap:


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## hhk (May 31, 2006)

Man, I could feel Paula Racliffe's pain at the end of that marathon. I give her a lot of respect for finishing that race. I ran one marathon seven years ago and it nearly killed me. 

And Tyson Gay. His interview the NBC was pure class. He made no excuses, he just said he couldn't get it done. I hope he comes back to give Bolt some competition.


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

hhk said:


> Man, I could feel Paula Racliffe's pain at the end of that marathon. I give her a lot of respect for finishing that race. I ran one marathon seven years ago and it nearly killed me.


I ran one two years ago. I could feel her pain as well.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Bolt's an alien - so is Phelps... 

•••

8 golds in '08


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

hhk said:


> Man, I could feel Paula Racliffe's pain at the end of that marathon. .


I caught that race flipping channels last night and couldn't stop watching. What was more amasing, was Constantina Tomescu-Dita still running in the background with the Romanian flag as Racliffe crossed the finish line 6 minutes later.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Respectable haul today and the men's 8 rowing Gold was a treat.

Cool....a swimming Bronze - 88 years since the last one for Canada in the 1500.


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## hhk (May 31, 2006)

kps said:


> I caught that race flipping channels last night and couldn't stop watching. What was more amasing, was Constantina Tomescu-Dita still running in the background with the Romanian flag as Racliffe crossed the finish line 6 minutes later.


Ya, I kept yelling at her "Please stop running!"


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Bolt was incredible. :clap: :clap: Not only did he set a World record but was able to coast the last 15-20 meters. Imagine what he could do if he wasn't saving some for the 200 Meter event.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

For all the 40+ athletes....Torres missed an individual gold by 1/100 th of a second ( she should have won - mental error - lifted her head  )

I think one of her rivals was 17 












> *Torres Edged Out by Hundredth of a Second*
> 
> By CHRISTOPHER CLAREY
> Published: August 16, 2008
> ...


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Ohh Shawn Johnson - such a bright spark...nudged out of Gold AGAIN just at the last.

Once by her team mate and once by the last routine in the competition a Romanian pulled off.










She's such a treat to watch - big smile - I think the judges favour slim and tall -she reminds me of Mary Lou Retton.


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

Vandave said:


> I'd like to see a Nascar driver try to keep up with a professional runner or triathlete for more than 1 km.
> 
> And yes, marathoners and triathletes get their heart rates up to that level for many hours.
> 
> How do you think those drivers train to get their fitness up? Running and cycling. It's just that marathoners and triathletes do more of it.


I don't know about Nascar drivers but F1 drivers(ie: Giancarlo Fisichela, Michael Shumacher, Heiki Kovalainen) have in the past competed in Marathons and have done an excellent job at running the marathons with respectable times.

Laterz


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

Our current haul of medals is 9 - 2 gold, 3 silver, 4 bronze - putting us in 15 spot overall. Ian Millar, probably one of the oldest competitors, won one of the silver medals in an equestrian event. Apparently it was late in day 10, so that explains why I missed it.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

It would have been interesting to see how Bolt would have done had he not been so arrogant to celebrate before finishing. I would of liked to see him run through the line to see how fast he really was or have him fall flat on his face just before the line during his early celebration.

I remember Patrick Roy show boated a save once and the puck rolled out of his glove and into the net...idiot...


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

I'm sorry that you feel cheated, but he does have more running to do.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Wow Ian Miller 9 Olympics  - 61 years old and FINALLY an Olympic medal :clap:


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

True...but the 100M is the one that really does set the benchmark for being the world's fastest man, and of course woman...I am guessing he will be runing 200, 400 and 4x100 relay? Do they have a 4x200?


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> True...but the 100M is the one that really does set the benchmark for being the world's fastest man, and of course woman...I am guessing he will be runing 200, 400 and 4x100 relay? Do they have a 4x200?


The Jamaicans are going leave everybody in the dust in the 4x100 relay, based on what I've seen so far of the sprints. The Jamaicans are born sprinters.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Kosh said:


> The Jamaicans are going leave everybody in the dust in the 4x100 relay, based on what I've seen so far of the sprints. The Jamaicans are born sprinters.


Well, they are now.... Some of them.

That's kind of like watching Michael Phelps and saying that Americans are born fast swimmers.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

HowEver said:


> Well, they are now.... Some of them.


Actually some early research shows it could be in the Jamaicans' genes... but that's very early research.


Just saw the 200m sprint and Bolt did it again, he relaxed the last several meters. He's gonna regret it one of these days... the old turtle and hare story comes to mind...


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Yes the population has a much higher percentage of fast twitch muscle fibre that benefits sprinters so there will be more candidates..BUT all populations have some that are heavy on the fast twitch.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

*Michael Phelps - just another corporate-owned Frankenstein?*



> The Michael Phelps Gold Medal Conspiracy
> Thirteen-time gold medalist swimmer Michael Phelps is such a big American hero and super-mega-champion, right? That's just what they want you to believe. In fact, his .01 second victory—the lowest margin of difference allowed in official swimming competitions—over Serbia's Milorad Cavic in the 100 meter butterfly yesterday was a giant scam! In fact, it was all part of an elaborate plot between Phelps, the U.S. government, NBC, and time-keeping overlord OMEGA! Don't believe the chlorinated hype!
> 0.01 OF A SECOND?
> 
> ...


Through The Looking Glass: The Michael Phelps Gold Medal Conspiracy

Michael Phelps - The Greatest Amphibian of All Time* - or just another corporate-owned Frankenstein?


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

Yeah it's all a big conspiracy. Yeah right.

One of the Americans also lost by 1/100 of a second.

The only people that think there is a conspiracy are the ones that print it.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

MacDoc said:


> Yes the population has a much higher percentage of fast twitch muscle fibre that benefits sprinters so there will be more candidates..BUT all populations have some that are heavy on the fast twitch.


I'm of the fast twitch pool...perhaps I should move to Jamaica and take up running...


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

Amazing race by Whitfield. :clap: :clap: :clap:


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

> I'm of the fast twitch pool...perhaps I should move to Jamaica and take up running...


Too much competition--- Canada is sorely lacking.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

MacDoc said:


> Too much competition--- Canada is sorely lacking.


You can't forget Donovan Bailey.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

"Early research" ?

What is early research? That sounds like the opposite of a scientific conclusion.

A hypothesis is "early research."




Kosh said:


> Actually some early research shows it could be in the Jamaicans' genes... but that's very early research.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

There is no question about the fast twitch aspect...



> Genetic link to speed, aggression?
> published: Sunday | July 20, 2008
> 
> Eureka? Have we found it? Why does this little bit of rock sitting in the small Caribbean Sea have the two fastest men in the world? And an unrivalled athletic profile over the years, size for size?
> ...


So a bigger pool by population size.....but it still has to be taken advantage of....

But of course the outcome is speculative
Jamaica Gleaner News - Genetic link to speed, aggression? - Sunday | July 20, 2008


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## gastonbuffet (Sep 23, 2004)

Brasil _ Argentina playing an amazing match rigth now!!!!!!


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Wow 4 hurdlers all crossed the finish line with 1 / 100th of a second of each other for the bronze 

Fortunately the Canadian runner was first of those 4 :clap:.....by 1/1000TH or a second......maybe a drop of sweat difference.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

I see I have some catching up to do tonight. We seem to have a few more more medals:








*Canada* 
2 Gold 
6 Silver
5 Bronze
13 Total 


Does anyone remember what the estimate was before the games. I remember hearing 17 and then there was another number, 14, given. We're getting close to our estimate.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> I'm of the fast twitch pool...perhaps I should move to Jamaica and take up running...


Why go to Jamaica, stay here in Canada and run for us  . 

And yeah I know you were joking around.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Excellent Italy/US women's indoor volleyball on right now - even teams lots of excitement.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

One of the greatest sporting events that I ever actually attended was the men's and women's volleyball finals at the 1976 Montreal Olympics. The Russians were the heavy favorites in both finals, yet the Polish men's team won, as did the women's team from Japan. I still remember calling out "Polska ........ Polska ............. Polska ............" with most of the crowd in the Montreal Forum.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Ah well deserved gold for Shawn Johnson in the individual events - balance beam - highest score recorded in China for the beam:clap:










oh yeah forgot......that gold was in addition to her THREE silvers....!!!!!!!!!

Hard to believe the Russians were shut out entirely 

Shawn and Nastia Liukin sure put on a show.....of course along with the Chinese.

••••

Australia and Can tied in the 6th softball semi-final.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Kosh said:


> Why go to Jamaica, stay here in Canada and run for us  .
> 
> And yeah I know you were joking around.


Actually what I would really like to do is box for Canada; I think we qualified 1 fighter. I kickbox but have been off for almost a year with a broken kneecap and am just getting back now; found a little weight I need to shed. It's good to dream sometimes but that would be pretty cool...


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## Corbeau (Apr 25, 2008)

We had one boxer in the Olympic(tm) tourney, but I can't recall in which class.

He got whipped in his first bout, something like 20 points to 3 after four rounds, against a fighter from Kazakhstan.

BTW, for motivation, that country gives $250,000 to each of their boxer. Some conditions apply.

The condition is that they bring back a gold medal.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> Actually what I would really like to do is box for Canada; I think we qualified 1 fighter. I kickbox but have been off for almost a year with a broken kneecap and am just getting back now; found a little weight I need to shed. It's good to dream sometimes but that would be pretty cool...


Talking about boxing, there was news at the Olympics that Canada is getting a boxing academy City of Becancour, Que., to host first world boxing academy


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

a force of nature.....











> Usain Bolt of Jamaica reacts after running a world record 19.30 to win the gold medal in the men's 200m final 2008 Olympic Games in Beijing on Wednesday. (Michael Steele/Getty Images)


well everyone wondered what would happen when he actually turned the jets on full afterburner.



> Usain Bolt kept driving for the finish line, knowing the race was won but there was something even bigger out there.
> 
> Not just another world record, but history itself. Not just an unheard-of blowout, but the chance to be called the greatest sprinter ever.
> 
> ...


sorry I missed the live feed  What a phenom and damn he's sooooo BIG!! - big guys not supposed to be able to fast like that....


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Not a bad piece, too bad they used the word "hurtled" for a non-hurtles race...



> The Jamaican wunderkind *hurtled* to his second world record and his second Olympic gold medal, finishing the 200-meter race in 19.30 seconds to break Michael Johnson's 12-year-old mark. In doing so he became the first man ever to break the world record in both the 100 and 200 at the same Olympics and the first since Carl Lewis in 1984 to win the sprint double.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

You mean a non-HURDLES - race  - you are allowed to blush now.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

My hats off to him for breaking both records, and running through the line...as said before....he had other races...


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

MacDoc said:


> You mean a non-HURDLES - race  - you are allowed to blush now.


Talking about hurdles, what a devastating loss for Lolo Jones who hit the top right edge of the 9th hurdle (the second last hurdle) in the 100-meter hurdles.










She had it in the bag, until she hit that 9th hurdle. I'm not sure what happened.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Yeah that was what led to the 4 way tie for bronze within 1/100th of a second. Good for Canada but a shame for the favorite.

I think her timing was just off - she was moving so fast and got to the hurdle just a fraction early .

••
Anyone timing shifting - catch the USA/Serbia men's volleyball semi


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

It is gonna get wet... 





















> Typhoon Nuri is headed to China and NASA is keeping tabs on it. Three NASA satellites recently captured images of Nuri, and enabled forecasters to look at cloud temperatures, cloud heights and wind speeds.
> 
> During the early morning hours (Eastern Time) on Wed. Aug. 20, Nuri was a Category Two typhoon on the Saffir-Simpson scale, with maximum sustained winds near 90 knots (103 mph). At 2:00 a.m. EDT on Aug. 20, Nuri was located near 18.9 degrees north latitude, and 121.1 degrees east longitude. That's approximately 440 nautical miles east-southeast of Hong Kong. Nuri has been tracking west-northwest at 8 knots (9 mph), on a track toward China.


Can you imagine the mess if this hits Hong Kong while the Olympics are on.

Even Bejing is seriously wet today.

•••

Got to see Bold in the 200 - the other runners look like kids he's so big - and these others are the very best in the world. Into a head wind he blows off the world record - he's hilarious too.

and the whole stadium sang him Happy Birthday........22 and King of the World indeed.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

No, I knew. But here you go, if necessary:  Wait, that's a wink.



MacDoc said:


> You mean a non-HURDLES - race  - you are allowed to blush now.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

One nit deserves another 

Wow is it ever coming down......Decathlon kick off and people out on road courses getting drowned.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Great silver by Emilie Heymans in the 10 meter diving :clap:

took an amazing dive with multiple 10s by the Chinese to knock her out of gold.










So that's 14 medals and perhaps another coming in equestrian.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Gold for Canada in individual equestrian :clap:

Eric Lamaze










rock n roll......good watching too it was an exciting contest.......


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

TSN predicted 15 medals...since we are already their I hope they are wrong...


----------



## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

MacDoc said:


> Gold for Canada in individual equestrian :clap:
> 
> Eric Lamaze


Does he use the LaMaze method?? :baby:


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Ouch - such a sweet kid and so talented but 



> *International Olympic Committee launches probe into He Kexin's age*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


International Olympic Committee launches probe into He Kexin's age - Times Online

That means the overall as well so her team mates would lose their......ach what a mess.

Damned if they do, damned if they don't, no easy position for the IOC.


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

MacDoc said:


> Damned if they do, damned if they don't, no easy position for the IOC.


Yes, it is easy. You do the right thing. Consequences shouldn't change the action.

It looks pretty obvious that this girl isn't old enough to compete. The information was available and now the Chinese covered it up. The best thing they can do is come clean now. Odds of that happening..... zero.....


----------



## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

iJohnHenry said:


> Does he use the LaMaze method?? :baby:


It's all about the breathing...


----------



## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Guys have died horrible deaths, with the words "breath, Honey, just breath." in their throats.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

iJohnHenry said:


> Guys have died horrible deaths, with the words "breath, Honey, just breath." in their throats.


I can just imagine. Makes a good case for getting the simple snip-snip. Then if the girl gets pregnant, it's all about getting on Montel Williams to find the real dad...


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## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Vandave said:


> Yes, it is easy. You do the right thing. Consequences shouldn't change the action.
> 
> It looks pretty obvious that this girl isn't old enough to compete. The information was available and now the Chinese covered it up. The best thing they can do is come clean now. Odds of that happening..... zero.....


Word.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

EvanPitts said:


> I can just imagine. Makes a good case for getting the simple snip-snip. Then if the girl gets pregnant, it's all about getting on Montel Williams to find the real dad...


Wrong...snip snip isn't 100% over time as it can grow back together. You need to get tested once a year to make sure.

A friend had her tubes ties...foolproof right? Well, it's a %0.005 chance of getting pregnant...3 months later, twins!

Now back to the Olympics...I hope they do get caught. China is renowned for always wanting to save face, honour....is China that arrogant or do they think the world is that stupid? First they tampered with the fireworks, then the had a "cute" kid sing because the singer was ugly, now passing off young athletes. I'm sure there will be more controversy...

I look at their use of lead in the same manner....arrogance or ignorance?

A friend of mine used to live in Hong Kong...the second China took control she said they couldn't get out of there fast enough...


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Tom Hall wins a Bronze for Canada in 1000 C1 ( single canoe ). :clap:


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

Saving face and honour are two different things. China cares more about the former than the latter. In the case of these Olympics, we can point to several instances of appearances coming ahead of integrity and honour. Westerners can see right through it.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Aren't they both the same? They want to look good, they want to be held in honour and do so by trying to pull off the most hair brained schemes and wind up being caught with their pants down.

16 medals so far...our falg bearer finished 8th...the curse still holds true. It's like touching the conference cups in the NHL...


----------



## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> Aren't they both the same?


For the most part, I would say that is the case of Anglo-Saxon culture. The concept of justice and fairness is ingrained deeply in our society and it has a long history. 

In China (and other cultures, including some European), saving face and looking good is completely different than honour. Cheating and corruption is OK as long as you don't get caught or as long as you can get away with it. 

And yes, these hair-brained schemes are very transparent to us. Our respect (i.e. what they want), would be greater if they took a moral path. Instead, we are just left to shake our heads at the consistent lack of morals that China demonstrates.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

MacDoc said:


> no easy position for the IOC.


Sure there is! 

The IOC could actually insist on honour and honesty instead of pandering to the Chinese. 

There is now evidence that two Chinese gymnasts are under age....

I expect more nonsense to be revealed in the aftermath of these 'games'.

EDIT: Rogaine (  ) and his posse of greed whores, in it for the perks and power, that comprise the IOC are not exactly paragons of honour themselves and the way they are handling this isn't going to help their reputation much. At this point you could say the IOC hasn't got much to lose by not stepping up and everything to gain if they do. The way things are unfolding at the Beijing games is going to just make the Olympics (even) less relevant.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

...from a Newsweek sports photojournalist's blog on his Olympic experiences. A few other nice shots, too...


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

iJohnHenry said:


> Does he use the LaMaze method?? :baby:


Actually he's famed for using the Cocaine method. He's missed two Olympics because he tested positive for Cocaine usage. I guess this time he decided to party *after* getting the Gold.

I see we're up to 17 medals now.









*Canada* 

Gold 3 
Silver 8 
Bronze 6 
Total 17 


All those pundits that said Canada weren't getting any medals can eat their words. And all that money we poured into the Olympic athletes actually did something.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

The last few posts raises some questions...who cares if did a little chach...the horse is doing all the work? And second...how in the world is ping pong a sport? I'm pretty good at marbles, maybe I should plead that to be a sport...


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Ping-pong is a pastime, a game for families to get together.

At the aggressive end of the spectrum, it is hardly worth worrying about.

All value, as an "inclusive" activity, is totally lost.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

THIS is why table tennis is a sport

http://www.stumbleupon.com/demo/?review=1#url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luVfBZ7I2Mk

You might as well say why is fencing a sport. 

Table tennis had a strong impact on Chinese/US history - 

Ping Pong Diplomacy

One of the American players accidentally got on the Chinese team's bus - made friends and one thing led to another.....the guy died recently but they interviewed his Chinese friend and showed clips of what happened subsequently.
Keep an eye open for it during the Olympics....remarkable story.











> A gift from Zhuang to Cowan helped lead to a U.S.-China exhibition in Beijing and the end of 22 years of Chinese isolation from the West.


It's good read here.....

Wolff and Davis: Ping-Pong Diplomacy made the Beijing Games possible - More Sports - SI.com

300 million people play table tennis worldwide.

I remember playing the Junior Champion of India and also the Junior Hong Champion ( and getting the crap beat out me  ) in the 70s as they were touring universities. Then they put on a show that was unreal.
Those sport connections stick and can sometimes trump the politics of grumpy old men,


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

I remember when Nixon and Kissenger met with Chairman Mao and Premier Zhou Enlai. The conservatives in the US were outraged in that Nixon built his career on "bashing" communists in the US and in Russian/China.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Yes, ping pong is fast...very fast but that doesn't warrant enough to be a sport. 300 million people do yoga and play chess everyday but they aren't gonna make t to the Olympics anytime soon.

Perhaps they are trying to get sports from every country? Fencing originated in France I believe. It's more sporting that ping pong.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

What next? Watch making?


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> The last few posts raises some questions...who cares if did a little chach...the horse is doing all the work?


Yeah I had that thought too! If anything it would put him at a disadvantage I would think.


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

MacDoc said:


> Gold for Canada in individual equestrian :clap:
> 
> Eric Lamaze
> 
> ...


Eric Lamaze didn't win a medal for Canada. His HORSE did.

When they make bronc riding an Olympic sport, lemme know. That at least is a human winning a contest over a beast and not vice versa like horsey jumping.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

I guess you enjoy tormenting dumb animals....spurs n'all -so exciting. 

Show jumping is a partnership.

••••

Catch some of the rhythmic gymnastics.....interesting sport.









Canada's Alexandra Orlando 



> In addition to her face time on a major American TV network, Orlando has also been a bit of an Internet sensation in recent weeks.
> 
> Web TV Hub, an online TV and video entertainment magazine, put her No. 1 on its list of 50 most beautiful women at the Olympics. She beat out the likes of tennis starlet Maria Sharapova and star Russian pole vaulter Yelena Isinbayeva.


TheStar.com - Beijing Olympics 2008


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

MacDoc said:


> I guess you enjoy tormenting dumb animals....spurs n'all -so exciting.
> 
> Show jumping is a partnership.
> 
> ...


Show jumping depends entirely on the ability and current temperament of the HORSE. That's why they call the human a rider. He/she is simply along for the ride.

If you knew anything about rodeo, you would know the stock is treated better than jumping horses in that they are used for 8 seconds about three times a week.

Those jumping horses are tormented for hours at a time knocking their front legs on near impossible jumps as "training".

As for the spur rowels, of which I suspect you know even less, they are dulled and have been for years to protect rodeo stock. 

Those itty bitty English style spurs the dopes in hard hats use on their english tack, do far more damage to those thoroughbred steeds.

And finally, some gymnast running along a board or bar is more closely linked with "art" than any "sport". It's kinda like walking the railroad tracks as a kid, just for the hell of it, although it is a tad more exciting when a train is coming which is more than I can say for the Olympics.


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## hhk (May 31, 2006)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> Yes, ping pong is fast...very fast but that doesn't warrant enough to be a sport. 300 million people do yoga and play chess everyday but they aren't gonna make t to the Olympics anytime soon.
> 
> Perhaps they are trying to get sports from every country? Fencing originated in France I believe. It's more sporting that ping pong.


Have you even seen table tennis at a high level? The level of skill and athleticism is incredible. A friend of mine who coaches tennis at a high level uses table tennis as a cross training tool to teach spin. 

Just because you and most North Americans are ignorant of the game does not mean it doesn't belong. 

Tell me this isn't sport:

YouTube - Amazing Kim Taek Soo Table Tennis


----------



## hhk (May 31, 2006)

SINC said:


> Eric Lamaze didn't win a medal for Canada. His HORSE did.
> 
> When they make bronc riding an Olympic sport, lemme know. That at least is a human winning a contest over a beast and not vice versa like horsey jumping.


Why is skiing a sport? I mean, it's not the skier doing the work, it's gravity. Why don't they give the medal to Mother Earth instead of Franz Klammer? After all, she did all the work. Franz was just along for the ride.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

I used to play badminton at a high school tournament level so enjoyed watching some of the play in this Olympics but one statement blew me away.....200 mph...in badminton???!!!!..

Lots of drama on the track with baton fumbles costing the favourites medals.
Both Jamaica and US tanked..


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

I used to play competitive table tennis. There is no doubt that it's a sport with a high level of skill. It also requires a lot of training at international levels. The players have developed legs with muscles more like soccer players.

I've also played competitive chess. It's not a sport, although speed chess gets pretty fast.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

There was a post on one of the sites from a former 16 year old National US Champion and she confirmed that despite having participated in other high fitness sports table tennis was perhaps the hardest mix of aerobic and anerobic activity.

•••

This article is a good assessment of the "age thing".



> *Maybe it's time to open Olympics to all ages*
> August 22, 2008
> 
> TIM DAHLBERG
> ...


TheStar.com - Beijing Olympics 2008

•••

Damn - Canadian came fourth in the cross country biking....  Her best placement ever .

Some nasty falls.

••

Soccer fans - gold medal game just starting 12 midnight EST.
Nigeria versus Argentina.

Gorgeous weather in Beijing after torrential rains yesterday.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Bit of a comeback for the top ranked paddler....












> *Adam van Koeverden wins silver medal*
> August 23, 2008
> 
> DOUG SMITH
> ...


TheStar.com - Beijing Olympics 2008

He looked soooo down yesterday after the 1k flameout I thought it might really hurt his performance in the 500....good for him.;clap:


----------



## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

*Lip-sync not the only musical outrage.*



> Peter Breiner, who arranged more than 200 national anthems for the 2004 Olympics, has accused the Beijing Olympic Committee of stealing those works for this year's Games. He says he is "100 percent sure" that his arrangements are being played at medal ceremonies -- and the Washington Post's culture critic couldn't agree more.


Composer Says Beijing Olympic Committee Ripped Him Off


----------



## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

But, everything in China is Public Domain.

That is, after all, what Communism is all about.


----------



## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

iJohnHenry said:


> But, everything in China is Public Domain.
> 
> That is, after all, what Communism is all about.


That's not the claim made - they claim they did it themselves...

Mmmmm.. good old fashioned one-way cultural sensitivity...


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Lisa Leslie

Quite the career - 4 gold medals .....32 straight games without a loss in 4 Olympics. 

Poor Australia - bridesmaid 3 x running in women's basketball.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Yikes ..10 across the board for the Russian syncho swimmers....and that's in BOTH categories technical and artistic. ....worth catching - I'm sure it will be on every recap. 










Talk about taking it a step up.

•••


18 total medals for Canada :clap:


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## MannyP Design (Jun 8, 2000)

Cuba is kicking ass in Taekwondo these days...

YouTube - olympic referee gets kicked in the head


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

I don't doubt the aerobic aspect of table tennis, and the hand-eye coordination but I don't consider it an Olympic sport. Yoga is quite physical and some of those techniques aren't something you just do all of a sudden....I don't see someone getting points for holding the farting dog or the drunken lotus...

We'll agree to disagree on it being an Olympic sport only.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

•••


Interesting story as the last event unfolds the men's marathon - they are on a fast pace but slowing now as they approach the finish. Weather is not bad ( high 20s but clear ) and they should break the Olympic record.

The tale they related was bringing a Kenyan and an Ethopian to Denmark ( apparently not trained runners ) and putting them through a state of art long distance training program with a young Dane similar age as well to see how they all fared.

Despite having identical training and nutrition the two Africans accelerated their times far and away past the Dane - even to the point that they were rivalling the top Danish distance runners with years of training and experience.

Some serious genes showing up 

They noted that Canada and Britain might have 2-3 sub 2.10 marathoners........Kenya has 500+.

Looks like Kenya may get a gold tonight. He's moving out in front significantly.

Yep - gold for Kenya and a whopping great busted Olympic record....by 3 minutes or so.

Thhhhhhaaaaattt's all folks......closing ceremonies in a few hours.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Looks like the closing ceremonies are starting now - 8 am

with a bang










I want a light wheel to ride.....too cool :clap:


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

MacDoc said:


> Looks like the closing ceremonies are starting now


:clap:


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

*Doping athletes still an Olympic-sized problem: expert*

Olympic organizers have imposed strict anti-doping measures on athletes competing in Beijing but one expert warns the problem is nowhere close to being fixed.
In total, officials with the International Olympic Committee (IOC) say between 4,500 to 5,000 doping tests will have been conducted by the end of the Games -- up from the 3,600 at the 2004 Games in Athens.
But Victor Conte, the man behind the Bay Area Laboratory Co-Operative (BALCO) scandal that provided professional athletes with undetectable performance-enhancing drugs, says the IOC's statement is all propaganda.
"All these athletes have to do is taper off for a short period of time before they set foot into the Olympic Village and they will test negative and they know that," Conte told CTV.ca in a telephone interview from California.
Conte believes government agencies' efforts in monitoring athletes has helped -- but not enough.
"I still believe that the use of performance enhancing drugs at the elite level of sport -- professional as well as Olympic -- is rampant," he said.

CTV.ca | Doping athletes still an Olympic-sized problem: expert


----------



## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

Doping is perhaps the greatest sport at the Olympics - and perhaps they should give out medals to the nations that have the best undetectable doping. They could also dish out medals the the most corrupt officials of the IOC, worst possible judging, worst blown calls by referees, most rigged opening and closing cemeonial event, etc.

And to think they are going to dump Baseball, a real sport played by real leagues in many countries, but retain a number of other "sports" that are never played professionally and have no future outside of the Olympics.

Not only that, much of the Olymics are no longer "sport", but people practicing for ten straight years for sixteen hours a day. So much for the amateur aspect, and no wonder why records drop like flies. Anyone who has a chance of doing anything for sixteen hours a day for ten years or more to the exclusion of things like work, study, building a shed, etc. is liable to be able to do it quite well. I would imagine that amount of time would even yield someone who actually knows how to use Windoze?


----------



## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

And in the name of personal glory??

I don't think so.

Political glory is what the proponents are after.

Hey, look, our system produced the best wheat in the World.  

Big deal.

Bring on the Commonwealth Games.

(And the Winter Olympics, natch. )


----------



## hhk (May 31, 2006)

EvanPitts said:


> Doping is perhaps the greatest sport at the Olympics - and perhaps they should give out medals to the nations that have the best undetectable doping. They could also dish out medals the the most corrupt officials of the IOC, worst possible judging, worst blown calls by referees, most rigged opening and closing cemeonial event, etc.
> 
> And to think they are going to dump Baseball, a real sport played by real leagues in many countries, but retain a number of other "sports" that are never played professionally and have no future outside of the Olympics.
> 
> Not only that, much of the Olymics are no longer "sport", but people practicing for ten straight years for sixteen hours a day. So much for the amateur aspect, and no wonder why records drop like flies. Anyone who has a chance of doing anything for sixteen hours a day for ten years or more to the exclusion of things like work, study, building a shed, etc. is liable to be able to do it quite well. I would imagine that amount of time would even yield someone who actually knows how to use Windoze?


In one breath, you are complaining that only sports played professionally should be in the Olympics.

In the next breath, you decry the loss of the "amateur aspect".

Pick a position.


----------



## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

MacDoc said:


> Looks like the closing ceremonies are starting now - 8 am
> 
> with a bang
> 
> ...


One wonders how long it took them to edit that video.... Apparently the opening scam took a year....


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

I think their editing involved. Stop, Rewind, Play. 80)


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

I want one of these



















They were riding them around as maneuverable as bicycles in the closing ceremonies....too cool.

YOu can see them here and they rolled around at good speed too.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Just on more faked digital implant for TV? Likely not, as I have seen these things before in the good old USA many years ago. Check YouTube. Nothing new here. :yawn:


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Sinc's pessimistic dismissal notwithstanding, it was a great closing ceremony. And those luminous unicycles were way cool... but my eye was really caught by those waves of smartly-dressed Chinese women with multiple drums strapped to their hips. They were just having so much fun, it was contagious.

And the floating mega-drums above the crowd? Man, were they dreamy. The aerial pyrotechnics in general were masterful - and I'm not talking merely the glorious bombast of near-relentless fireworks - no, it was all the fly-by-wire acrobatics and slow-mo dancing of surreal objects over the stadium... kudos to the organizers/choreographers of all this intricate stuff. Kudos to the thousands of dancers and drummers for their precision work and heartfelt enthusiasm. Wonderful combination of slick, forward-looking tech, awe-inspiring Chinese pride and Cirque de Soleil calibre verve and imagination.

Although I have to admit, seeing Jimmy Page emerging from the guts of a London Bus threw me for a loop. I'm still trying to decide if it was a slice of cheese or just a neat touch and a hint of how London will seek to make its mark in four years' time. Nice to see Mr. Page can still wield a Les Paul with some authority, though. The man looks like he is morphing into a distinguished monk.

China has set some new standards for pomp and circumstance. Every Olympics goes for gold in this regard, but it will be a tough act for London to follow.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Yeah I hear sour gas is a real problem in Alberta. 

••••

Beijing also set the bar for having fun. That's what impressed me the most.
While the opener was mindboggling it was mostly "oh so serious"

The closing while still spectacular was one big party. You only had to watch Jackie Chan belting it out  and Page doing Whole Lotta Love to catch the drift. I thought London held it's own style against the China tidal wave.

They had FUN.....a planetary party if there ever was one. :clap:

Photo links

2008 OLYMPICS CLOSING CEREMONY: Photo gallery of the 2008 Olympics Closing Ceremony in Beijing -- chicagotribune.com

2008 Beijing Summer Olympics closing ceremony photos | read my mind

lots of candids here from on the floor...and hundreds of fireworks shots from various points around the city

Beijing Olympic Closing Ceremony Pictures - Pixcetera.com

Bit of Cirque du Soleil writ large.


----------



## hhk (May 31, 2006)

Max said:


> Sinc's pessimistic dismissal notwithstanding, it was a great closing ceremony. And those luminous unicycles were way cool... but my eye was really caught by those waves of smartly-dressed Chinese women with multiple drums strapped to their hips. They were just having so much fun, it was contagious.
> 
> And the floating mega-drums above the crowd? Man, were they dreamy. The aerial pyrotechnics in general were masterful - and I'm not talking merely the glorious bombast of near-relentless fireworks - no, it was all the fly-by-wire acrobatics and slow-mo dancing of surreal objects over the stadium... kudos to the organizers/choreographers of all this intricate stuff. Kudos to the thousands of dancers and drummers for their precision work and heartfelt enthusiasm. Wonderful combination of slick, forward-looking tech, awe-inspiring Chinese pride and Cirque de Soleil calibre verve and imagination.
> 
> ...


I'm with you. So easy to be a cynic with the Olympic Games. But anyone of us would give their left receptacle to be part of it. 

I thought Page looked and sounded great. Same with Leona Lewis. I wonder what Robert Plant was thinking at the time.


----------



## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

I too have good deal of cynicism. However these games and ceremonies were spectacular. The Chinese deserve full credit for what they accomplished. 

The cynicism I'll concentrate on our own governments. We can hardly expect the rest of the world to get it right when our own systems are corrupt to the core.beejacon


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

hhk said:


> IBut anyone of us would give their left receptacle to be part of it.


Most of my recepticals are centred, well except for my eyes and ears. :lmao:


----------



## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

The Olympics are over - Woo Hoo! Now they can start putting some interesting stuff on TV!

And think about it, no belly aching about medal counts for the next three years, until all the malarkey starts again. (Except they are going on and on about Vancouver, even though most of the "games" are going to be held elsewhere.) And maybe they can stifle all of the controversies about Tibet and beating up flame runners and such, and get back to the work of reporting about the Taliban and Osama.

Other nations won more medals because their athletes are so juiced up on dope and steroids, while Canadian athletes won theirs almost fair and square, or at least with lesser amounts of dope.


----------



## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

MacDoc said:


> I want one of these


 
Yeah, I want one too. Looks cool.

As for Sinc mentioning he saw one in the US, I think that was a gas-powered one. I seem to remember seeing gas powered ones a couple years back. These pedal ones look better.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

No more - _"Officer I didn't see it"_  from the SUV crowd

Should be really stable with the gyro effect from that monster wheel - maybe TOO directional. 

I would NOT want that inner bearing to seize.....oh MY


----------



## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

MacDoc said:


> No more - _"Officer I didn't see it"_  from the SUV crowd
> 
> Should be really stable with the gyro effect from that monster wheel - maybe TOO directional.
> 
> I would NOT want that inner bearing to seize.....oh MY


How about we let you do a test run and we'll try it after reading your review.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

I don't think they make them in China, because none of them broke or fell apart during the ceremonies...


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Whereas everything made in Canada is of the highest quality, natch. Including our steel products!


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

eMacMan said:


> The Chinese deserve full credit for what they accomplished.


Masters of video fakery! :clap:


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Max said:


> Whereas everything made in Canada is of the highest quality, natch. Including our steel products!


At the very least, our number 1 ingredient isn't lead...Lead is to China as Duct Tape is to Red Green... I-OOOOOOOO


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Oh, and our meat processing is second to none, too!


----------



## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> At the very least, our number 1 ingredient isn't lead...Lead is to China as Duct Tape is to Red Green... I-OOOOOOOO


Also we don't up the "protein" count in our grain products by adding *Melamine* or add lead to children's' toys How can anyone take that country seriously?   They'll try to poison people for a few cents...

Just because they scammed the greed whores at the IOC doesn't change any of that. What it does do is makes anyone, athletes included, who buys into this crap complicit!!! 

Think about it. The money you paid for the poisoned pet food, grain and children's toys went to support those preposterously pretensions ceremonies!!! Wake up people! That country doesn't care if it kills you as long as it makes a few extra bucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And that is all very cool with the IOC and all the other fawning acolytes.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

That much is true. I salute your sensibilities on the matter, but I also want to wish you the best of luck in getting rid of all the stuff that was made in China; it's going to be a long list.


----------



## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Max said:


> That much is true. I salute your sensibilities on the matter, but I also want to wish you the best of luck in getting rid of all the stuff that was made in China; it's going to be a long list.


Indeed it is but I assure you NOTHING from China will ever go in my mouth or into the mouths of my kids and grandkids (if/when) as long as I have something to say about it.


----------



## JumboJones (Feb 21, 2001)

Now here's a side to the Olympics I don't mind seeing.

Beach babes and cheerleaders at Olympic Beach Volleyball and Basketball | The News is NowPublic.com


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

rgray said:


> Indeed it is but I assure you NOTHING from China will ever go in my mouth or into the mouths of my kids and grandkids (if/when) as long as I have something to say about it.


Rgray, the food thing is perhaps easiest to abide by... heck, even if you take your (future) grandkids out for Chinese food, chances are it's going to be Canadian Chinese food and beyond there being a world of difference between the two cuisines, it's likely all going to be food coming in from North America.

But you're going to have a much tougher time with clothing, toys, tools, electronic instruments and appliances.... I bet that, were you to go through your own household right this instant, you'd find an unsettling amount of stuff that was made in China. Sure, it might have come from an American or Canadian-owned firm, but that can be a mere shell game. Tons and tons of Chinese steel is coming in, too... money talks.

China is rising because the West has been fueling it with money for decades now...our demand for cheap goods has brought us to this place where we are now. Why anyone should be surprised at this point is a mystery to me. But that said, I'm seeing a lot of fear and apprehension about China and its ambitions. The only thing to temper this is my own expectation that not even mighty China knows what's in store for tomorrow's world... some of its most ambitious plans may well be eclipsed by tumultuous changes in terms of world climate, pollution, overcrowding, more aggression/competition over fresh water, arable land, natural resources, etc.

I'm thinking they're playing for keeps though... probably on that, many of us can agree. And of all things, it looks like the world is going to witness a second wave of competition for space exploration. China is just one of the players in those sweepstakes, but it's determined to be a main contender.


----------



## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

I'm with Rgray... I wonder how much money traded hands to give them the games. I am glad our athletes did better then expected but that country is arrogant and thinks the world is filed with idiots...I have friends who got outta there and said they would never go back!


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

For every anecdote you can trot out that friends found China horrific, there will be others who will be happy to report something else.

China, or rather its government, might not give a damn about what we think... they have bigger fish to fry. India and China are old rivals. Both are, what, a billion plus now? You could stuff two thirds of Canada's population into greater Mexico City, for that matter.

Anyway, the history of human conquest is chock full of empires who considered the rest of the world a sad clutch of morons to be exploited or kept down. There's a certain icy logic at work, too; in order for there to be someone at the top of the heap, a whole mess of people - and countries - have to by definition make up the congested heap itself, writhing and squirming under the weight of the colossus up top. Periodically things switch up and former victors become the vanquished. I wouldn't say we are witnessing the changing of the guard but we're certainly cruising into a strange new time.


----------



## hhk (May 31, 2006)

So...better to buy Made in USA? Because they have such a spotless record in the area of human rights and respect for sovereignty. Or maybe Mexico? Maybe India or Malaysia? 

Easy to talk tough in this regard but when you start digging into the record of almost any industrialized nation, a lot of dirt comes to the surface. There really is no such thing as clean consumerism. We are all guilty of contributing to the profits of abusive, exploitive governments and corporations.

The only way to avoid this is to live off the land. And me, I don't plan to be eating squirrel and trying to tune my coconut radio.


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

hhk said:


> Easy to talk tough in this regard but when you start digging into the record of almost any industrialized nation, a lot of dirt comes to the surface. There really is no such thing as clean consumerism.


Well said. But we can make an impressive industry of pretending otherwise.

Or perhaps it's merely a case of the masses preferring the devil we (think) we know. And loathing the red/yellow/different devil we don't know.


----------



## Sharon4 (Aug 22, 2008)

I agree with alot of what you said. On a note purely about the Olympics...I will remember them forever. For the first time in my life I watched every moment of the Equestrian events. It meant getting up at 5am every morning but every second was wonderful. When Eric Lemaze(sp?) won the gold medal I was so thrilled and overcome with emotion. It was an exceptional Olympics...for the athletes and fans.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

> The only way to avoid this is to live off the land.


Whose land??!!!!......this is INDIAN COUNTRY ...


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

Max said:


> For every anecdote you can trot out that friends found China horrific, there will be others who will be happy to report something else.
> QUOTE]
> 
> 
> Yeah, those who have been told how to think and would dare not say anything about the cummunist regime... Offer to take a plane load of Chinese out of China and let them understand the freedom we have...they won't want to go back.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

I suppose that if you wish to believe that one billion plus Chinese are living in utter fear of their own government and can only react as robots or terrified puppets, I guess that answer makes sense. If you think that the Chinese people aren't extremely proud of their many accomplishments and impressive modern trajectory, that makes sense too. If you think the masses aren't in thrall of their own power as citizens of a country bent on shoving America aside and becoming the next dominant nation, then I guess that's fine too. I don't subscribe to your views myself.

Alas, what you or I think makes little difference to the Chinese anyway. They want our respect but they'll get along just fine without it; we've already given them plenty enough as it is. Heck, we've been helping them along for a long time now. We just didn't frame it that way in our own minds. We've just been saving money at Walmart and Costco, that's all.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

That sums it up nicely Max. Lotta truth there.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

Max said:


> Whereas everything made in Canada is of the highest quality, natch. Including our steel products!


Even the Olympic clothing... It used to be made by Roots, so it was pretty solid, Made in Honduras kinds of items. And really, they know how to make clothes in Honduras, since I have some six year old workshirts that are still in pretty good shape, well, minus all of the stains on them.

The new Olympic clothing is not only is it butt ugly, and I mean ugly, but it will probably fall apart in two weeks, or recalled because it is filled with ground up lead or something.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

A Chinese citizen doesn't have much in the way of power... those who excel and drive the country forward are celebrated as they make China look better. I will agree on the WalMart comment fully! We all talk about how horrible China is and yet we fuel them to continue as they do in saving a dollar.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Plane load of Chinese???.....Sure -  = there are hundreds of thousands of students abroad at universities around the world and the majority return quite willingly. Many engineers in particular find the pay, opportunity and demand higher in China these days,



> Red-hot demand for tech jobs
> By Sol E. Solomon, ZDNet Asia
> Wednesday, July 23, 2008 11:45 AM
> 
> ...





> The Big Brains Are Back
> 
> *A booming China is luring home its best and its brightest—along with some westerners as well.*
> 
> ...


China's Reverse Brain Drain | Newsweek International Edition | Newsweek.com

you sound like a cold war sound byte


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

Max said:


> Oh, and our meat processing is second to none, too!


Actually... Maple Leaf did react quickly. Listeria has been uncommon in this country, unlike the US where there are regular recalls of hamburger and other meats because of outbreaks.

Canadians are just jumping the gun, in some kind of panic or something. I hear all of this stuff like "oh, you have to throw out all sliced meats!" That is nuts because it is an over reaction to the situation. All of the meat in question is now out of date, so you shouldn't eat it anyways. And the meat is from one single plant, so no need to throw out all meats.

Maple Leaf has been quite responsible in this situation. When Star-Kist was canning rotten tuna - they "got rid" of the problem by putting it on sale everywhere, and paying off the inspectors. In Walkerton, they found the problem but didn't even issue a boil water order because of "panic". This time, they found the problem, and have addressed it as best as they can.

And we do not know the whole story, because it may be a mutant strain of Listeria, because they were having trouble cleaning the plant with the top five most hard core disinfectants available. And unlike E Coli, Listeria is not so well understood or studied.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

Max said:


> Rgray, the food thing is perhaps easiest to abide by... heck, even if you take your (future) grandkids out for Chinese food, chances are it's going to be Canadian Chinese food and beyond there being a world of difference between the two cuisines, it's likely all going to be food coming in from North America.


I doubt many North Americans would really want to try the Scorpion on a Stick, let alone the deep fried sea horses, monkey brain soup, candied grubs, fragrant meat, fresh snake, etc. But if you live in or around Hogtown, one can get something that is more like "authentic", like Dim Sum or Hot Pot, without having to deal with the hissing roach salad, salamander stew, or pot luck made from various spiders and millipedes found in a basement. Of course, the intrepid can find "authentic", if one is ready to explore some of the seedier alleys in Hogtown.

But at least some of the produce in stores these days are from China, and I noted that garlic from China is in abundance. They will ship such items around the world, despite the fact that they grow garlic just down the road from here in rather large quantities. But then, we are pretty big suppliers of ginseng to the Chinese these days anyways...


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## adagio (Aug 23, 2002)

I guess I'm one of the few. I absolutely avoid buying anything from China, if given a choice. Sometimes choice doesn't easily exist but I do read every single label or package I buy. Shopping takes twice as long, and many times I pay quite a premium, but it's something personal I prefer to do.

For those who avoid WalMart I think you'd be quite surprised how many "Proudly Canadian" items they carry. They've done a far better job of supporting Canadian interests than Crappy Tire has.

When it comes to food, I purchase as local as possible. Yes, even local garlic which costs twice as much as that from China. It isn't just a matter of quality but rather a chance for me to do something to keep our economy going. I wish everyone would take the time to shop wisely and perhaps not be so freakin cheap. We're hurting ourselves by being lazy and saving a few pennies.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

adagio said:


> Yes, even local garlic which costs twice as much as that from China. It isn't just a matter of quality but rather a chance for me to do something to keep our economy going. I wish everyone would take the time to shop wisely and perhaps not be so freakin cheap. We're hurting ourselves by being lazy and saving a few pennies.


Yep. I agree, Marg.

We differ on our shopping habits, though, where it comes to other goods. I own some musical instruments that were made in China. I also have some great Korean gear too, for that matter. For what I paid, they offer very good value. I get tired of buying some goods that are perhaps North American in nature but which suffer from surprisingly inconsistent quality control or are dearly expensive because certain companies are cynically capitalizing on brand recognition/hype - or their products were produced by union labour that has little competitive edge left to them. That condition can change at any time, however, so I try to shop around and keep abreast of the latest movements. The rise of fuel costs will definitely impact the price of goods being imported from Asia and other places abroad; at some point it becomes a zero-gain situation and the argument to produce locally again rises to the fore.

It's a multifaceted issue, that's for sure.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

EvanPitts said:


> Actually... Maple Leaf did react quickly. Listeria has been uncommon in this country, unlike the US where there are regular recalls of hamburger and other meats because of outbreaks.
> 
> Canadians are just jumping the gun, in some kind of panic or something. I hear all of this stuff like "oh, you have to throw out all sliced meats!" That is nuts because it is an over reaction to the situation. All of the meat in question is now out of date, so you shouldn't eat it anyways. And the meat is from one single plant, so no need to throw out all meats.
> 
> Maple Leaf has been quite responsible in this situation. When Star-Kist was canning rotten tuna - they "got rid" of the problem by putting it on sale everywhere, and paying off the inspectors. In Walkerton, they found the problem but didn't even issue a boil water order because of "panic". This time, they found the problem, and have addressed it as best as they can.


Yes, I am hearing on the radio that Maple Leaf is getting points for being so swift and thorough in its reaction to the outbreak. I was merely pointing out that we live in glass houses and that dissing China may be the flavour of the day but it ain't nearly the whole story.

On the other hand, I can't agree that "Canadians are jumping the gun;" At last count, 12 people are dead for no other reason that they ate some sandwich meat. Had one or more of those victims been among your friends and family, I doubt you would speak so lightly.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

adagio said:


> I guess I'm one of the few. I absolutely avoid buying anything from China, if given a choice.


Actually, if you want to hurt China, you should do the opposite. The more demand for manufacturing, the more Chinese salaries will increase, the more Chinese will buy consumerables (eventually luxury items), inflation will hit them, and salaries will increase. They will eventually become like Canada or Taiwan where it costs too much to manufacture things there and companies will move their manufacturing to other countries. Thus in the long-term, they become another USA.


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## adagio (Aug 23, 2002)

Not to downplay this tragedy, I must add my 2 cents.

While this bacteria was a contributing factor to several deaths it must be pointed out that, from what I'm hearing, they were all folks with compromised immune systems. I'm not saying they wouldn't have lived longer without their deli sandwich but this is not too far off from dying of the flu. Millions contract these potentially life threatening illnesses all the time and don't die. Healthy people shouldn't be too upset or worried.

Maple Leaf has just had rotten luck. I've worked as a lab tech in food QC and I can tell you the large companies are VERY stringent. You should be concerned by the small places who are more likely to not follow the rules as stringently. I know it's cool to hate big, rich companies but I reiterate, buying fresh and local is no guarantee you'll never get a food borne illness. Neither is being a vegetarian vs a meat lover.

Ultimately there is no such thing as safe food. Bacteria is a normal function of life. The best that any of us can do is try to eat healthy foods and a proper diet which help keep our immune systems at peak performance.


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## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

adagio said:


> I guess I'm one of the few. I absolutely avoid buying anything from China, if given a choice. Sometimes choice doesn't easily exist but I do read every single label or package I buy. Shopping takes twice as long, and many times I pay quite a premium, but it's something personal I prefer to do.
> 
> For those who avoid WalMart I think you'd be quite surprised how many "Proudly Canadian" items they carry. They've done a far better job of supporting Canadian interests than Crappy Tire has.
> 
> When it comes to food, I purchase as local as possible. Yes, even local garlic which costs twice as much as that from China. It isn't just a matter of quality but rather a chance for me to do something to keep our economy going. I wish everyone would take the time to shop wisely and perhaps not be so freakin cheap. We're hurting ourselves by being lazy and saving a few pennies.


Out of curiosity where did you find a computer that has no Made In China parts?


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## adagio (Aug 23, 2002)

You'll note I said when there are options. When it comes to things like computers there isn't. If it were possible I'd love Apple to make their stuff somewhere else. They don't, unfortunately.

There are many choices to be had when it comes down to household items and furniture though most times for a premium. As an example, I recently bought a new mop for my wood floors. There were several to choose from, all from China except one. It's made in Ontario. I had to take the time to read all those labels and yes I did spend $5 more for the item.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Kosh said:


> Actually, if you want to hurt China, you should do the opposite. The more demand for manufacturing, the more Chinese salaries will increase, the more Chinese will buy consumerables (eventually luxury items), inflation will hit them, and salaries will increase. They will eventually become like Canada or Taiwan where it costs too much to manufacture things there and companies will move their manufacturing to other countries. Thus in the long-term, they become another USA.


Yep. And so the cycle will very likely repeat anew. China will be no more invulnerable to this stuff than America, or the British...


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

Max said:


> On the other hand, I can't agree that "Canadians are jumping the gun;"


It is just that there is a panic, and people are tossing out anything that happens to be Maple Leaf, without even looking to see if it is from that plant or not. Two products were affected, both batches are now out of code and shouldn't be consumed (probably why people are getting poisoned in hospitals because no where in the union agreement does it say they have to read the due dates or rotate the stock).



> At last count, 12 people are dead for no other reason that they ate some sandwich meat. Had one or more of those victims been among your friends and family, I doubt you would speak so lightly.


Perhaps - but when the hospitals are so filthy, with equipment and furniture covered in feces, and that kills way more people - no one seems to really care for any length of time.

So on one hand we have a company who found a problem and is doing something about it and not covering it up, they are put down because of "corporate greed".

While filthy old Joe Brant Hospital has been dispensing even more virulent killer diseases out of malfeasance, filth and feces, but they are commended because they are now doing something about it long after the fact, and the CEO and other executives are congratulated because we all know Mike Harris did it because he did not build them a new hospital every five years for them to ruin with filth.

In fact, Mike Harris was obviously the murderer in Walkerton because of "funding cutbacks", and not because some jackass faked a resume in order to score big pay and was hired by his brother on the nepotism plan, and neither because they sunk the town well in the middle of a cow field.

So everyone is talking about throwing out Maple Leaf products and never using them again - when really, they have taken every step imaginable to correct a problem - while good old Joe Brant is back to covering everything in feces, and the CEO is scoring the next big pay raise.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

If I had a package of Maple Leaf meat I'd be tossing it - erring on the side of caution. You might call that a panic move, but I wouldn't. After all, we're talking about a company whose list of possibly affected brands has swelled to over 200. If they can make a mistake on the line, it's hardly unreasonable to assume they can also make a mistake tracing the source of the contamination. You might be happy with the Maple Leaf product in your fridge, but I'm guessing many of our fellow Canadians would feel otherwise.

As for Mike Harris, filthy hospitals and who murdered whom, I'll leave that up to others to sort out.


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