# Going (back?) to the moon



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Missions that Weren’t: One-Way Mission to the Moon*





> At the Institute of Aerospace Sciences in Los Angeles in 1962, the pair unveiled their “One-Way Manned Space Mission” proposal.
> 
> The plan called for a one-man spacecraft to follow a direct ascent path to the Moon. Ten feet wide and seven feet tall, the empty spacecraft weighed less than half the much smaller Mercury capsule. Inside, the astronaut would have enough water for 12 days, oxygen for 18 with a 12-day emergency reserve, a battery-powered suit and backpack, and all the tools and medical supplies he might need.
> 
> ...


_from _*squidgeny* _in the comments:_


> _This is how I feel a one-way mission to Mars ought to be conducted. Send an astronaut first, with at least enough supplies to last until the next launch window for a second mission to Mars, which would deliver more supplies and perhaps additional astronauts. The program would consist of a long and expensive series of missions, some manned, most unmanned, with an eventual goal of providing enough equipment and supplies for the first astronaut(s) to return home, while the most recently arrived take their place to continue the study of Mars (and of living on Mars) - a sort of interplanetary shift-rotation._


(Universe Today)


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Flying to the Moon — From the Space Station?*





> “We need the courage of starting a new era,” Europe’s director of human spaceflight, Simonetta Di Pippo, told the BBC News. For sending a mission to the Moon from the ISS, De Pippo said, “The idea is to ascend to the space station the various elements of the mission, and then try to assemble the spacecraft at the ISS, and go from the orbit of the space station to the Moon.”





> With this type of mission, the future of spaceflight actually be as Canadian astronaut Chris Hadfield describes in the video below. “This is the great stepping off point of to the rest of the universe,” says Hadfield, who will be commanding an upcoming expedition on the ISS. “This is an important moment in the history of human exploration and human capability,… and the space station is a visible sign of the future to come.”


(Universe Today)


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

China will get there before a weakened America will.


----------



## John Clay (Jun 25, 2006)

Macfury said:


> China will get there before a weakened America will.


Indeed - and it's truly disgraceful.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

John Clay said:


> Indeed - and it's truly disgraceful.


I agree. I have never seen a country squander its pre-eminence in any field with this sort of abandon. History will hold responsible those who sold out out all of the programs that made the U.S. space program great.


----------



## tilt (Mar 3, 2005)

I have yet to read the original article linked here, but a first glance reminds me of the movie "Moon". A really good movie in my opinion.

Cheers


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

"Moon" was really, really great - especially for the tiny budget and the return to using miniatures in the shoot.

Having grown up on "Space:1999", I may have been indoctrinated with the idea of a permanent space base. It's a shame that the US space programme failed in that regard, but I have no great problem with China being the new leader in space. I do hope that the Canadian Space Agency won't let it's ties to the US programme blind it to the possibilities of joining Chinese efforts. We can't go into space ourselves, and should be cultivating relationships that allow us some future ability to contribute.


----------



## Kazak (Jan 19, 2004)

tilt said:


> I have yet to read the original article linked here, but a first glance reminds me of the movie "Moon". A really good movie in my opinion.
> 
> Cheers


Crossed my mind, too.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

CubaMark said:


> Having grown up on "Space:1999", I may have been indoctrinated with the idea of a permanent space base.


What good is a moonbase if it's hurtling through the universe?


----------



## Kazak (Jan 19, 2004)

Macfury said:


> What good is a moonbase if it's hurtling through the universe?


Plenty, if it's taking Barry Morse further and further away from us.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Kazak said:


> Plenty, if it's taking Barry Morse further and further away from us.


They lost him permanently between season 1 and 2!


----------



## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Macfury said:


> I agree. I have never seen a country squander its pre-eminence in any field with this sort of abandon. History will hold responsible those who sold out out all of the programs that made the U.S. space program great.


It is not only pre-eminence in space programs and technology that has been squandered. Economic pre-eminence has been squandered in dirty wars and republican fiancial policies. The country is realistically of the virge of financial collapse. How many more people would be impoverished if the country started taxing up for a new moon shoot?


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

rgray said:


> It is not only pre-eminence in space programs and technology that has been squandered. Economic pre-eminence has been squandered in dirty wars and republican fiancial policies.


Republican? They were bad, but the last three years under the Democrats have eclipsed them.


----------



## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Macfury said:


> Republican? They were bad, but the last three years under the Democrats have eclipsed them.


OK..... Then... Stupid financial policies.....


----------



## Mythtaken (Mar 22, 2011)

Speaking of financial stupidity, what exactly would be the benefit of returning to the moon via the SST or otherwise? Would not those billions be better spent trying to fix the economic and environmental problems right here?


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Mythtaken said:


> Speaking of financial stupidity, what exactly would be the benefit of returning to the moon via the SST or otherwise? Would not those billions be better spent trying to fix the economic and environmental problems right here?


The money involved stays here, and spurs research and development--it isn't sent to the moon.


----------



## John Clay (Jun 25, 2006)

Mythtaken said:


> Speaking of financial stupidity, what exactly would be the benefit of returning to the moon via the SST or otherwise? Would not those billions be better spent trying to fix the economic and environmental problems right here?


Is that a serious question?

The billions spent during the Gemini and Apollo (and later programs) advanced our understanding of space, our technology, and fueled the domestic economy. Not only did they help with modern aircraft design, but sensors, fuels, and other crucial (and life-saving) technologies that paved the way for future generations.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

John Clay said:


> Is that a serious question?
> 
> The billions spent during the Gemini and Apollo (and later programs) advanced our understanding of space, our technology, and fueled the domestic economy. Not only did they help with modern aircraft design, but sensors, fuels, and other crucial (and life-saving) technologies that paved the way for future generations.


Yep. Although I'm not a big fan of government expenditures, serious space exploration is still only possible when government funded. I believe that private enterprise can now effectively handle a lot of low-orbit and satellite functions.


----------



## Mythtaken (Mar 22, 2011)

Macfury said:


> The money involved stays here, and spurs research and development--it isn't sent to the moon.


Very true. That money does provide for some research and development in a few specific fields. It does little to help the economic situation across the nation.

To be clear, I'm not against space exploration. I think one way moon mission for senators, marketing people, and oil execs is a great idea. However, in the face of a faltering global economy and looming environmental disaster, the idea of spending billions for a weekend walkabout on a dusty bit of rock seems somehow misguided.


----------



## Chimpur (May 1, 2009)

I can see both sides. But the technology and the means to fix our problems are here. The need is here, the money is as well. However the impetus for those n charge to get what needs to be done isn't there. There is far too much greed and petty infighting for things to effectively get done. Like all great "empires" they all fall. The American rise to prominence was far to quick to be sustainable. Thus its fall will be all the more painful for the world to watch and be effected by as well.


----------



## Mythtaken (Mar 22, 2011)

John Clay said:


> The billions spent during the Gemini and Apollo (and later programs) advanced our understanding of space, our technology, and fueled the domestic economy. Not only did they help with modern aircraft design, but sensors, fuels, and other crucial (and life-saving) technologies that paved the way for future generations.


That was then. Yes a great many things were developed because nothing like it had every been considered. It was a huge leap forward in science and technology. 

Times have changed. We already have velcro, pens that write in zero gee and juice in a box. Sure there are still incremental developments in engineering and computer technology because of space research, but most of that comes from satellite building and robotic missions. I don't see how sticking a couple people in a can and firing them at the moon will provide another giant leap for mankind.

I'm fascinated by space and at some point I'd love to see us land on every planet and moon in the solar system we can. But when I see lineups at food banks, ecosystems failing, and countries circling the financial drain, I do question spending billions on returning to the moon.


----------



## Chimpur (May 1, 2009)

"Let us redefine progress to mean that just because we can do a thing, it does not necessarily mean we must do that thing." Hmmmm 50 points to the first one who correctly pegs where this quote is from!


----------



## DR Hannon (Jan 21, 2007)

Chimpur said:


> "Let us redefine progress to mean that just because we can do a thing, it does not necessarily mean we must do that thing." Hmmmm 50 points to the first one who correctly pegs where this quote is from!


Klingon Chancellor, Gorkon


----------



## Chimpur (May 1, 2009)

DR Hannon said:


> Klingon Chancellor, Gorkon


Um; I guess my avatar pic there killed that one.... But um no. Gorkon went on about the Undiscovered country.. keep guessing...


----------



## Kazak (Jan 19, 2004)

Dolly the sheep.


----------



## DR Hannon (Jan 21, 2007)

Sorry, it was the Federation President at Khitomer. Sorry got excited


----------



## kps (May 4, 2003)

Moon base Alpha...that's where all the elites will escape to when the sh*t hits the fan down here on earth...


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

kps said:


> Moon base Alpha...that's where all the elites will escape to when the sh*t hits the fan down here on earth...


Got my Eagle in the garage.


----------



## kps (May 4, 2003)

Macfury said:


> Got my Eagle in the garage.


Better be filled with green fuel, eh!


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

kps said:


> Better be filled with green fuel, eh!


Nope--this thing blows dust all over the place, and runs on coal tar.


----------



## Kazak (Jan 19, 2004)

They also blow up and/or crash frequently. Fortunately, there is an endless supply of them.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Kazak said:


> They also blow up and/or crash frequently. Fortunately, there is an endless supply of them.


It pays to crash them once in awhile, so you can salvage the parts. I believe you can build five or six Eagles out of two crashed spacecraft.


----------



## G-Mo (Sep 26, 2007)

People, we CANNOT go back to the moon... Has no one seen the lost footage from Apollo 18?


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

G-Mo said:


> People, we CANNOT go back to the moon... Has no one seen the lost footage from Apollo 18?


Part of the reason is to capture those creatures and use them as weapons against the Russkies.


----------



## John Clay (Jun 25, 2006)

Macfury said:


> Part of the reason is to capture those creatures and use them as weapons against the Russkies.


+1. Damn Commies.


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

John Clay said:


> +1. Damn Commies.


I agree. "Better dean than red."


----------



## Kazak (Jan 19, 2004)

Dr.G. said:


> I agree. "Better dean than red."


Better dean than clean.


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Kazak said:


> Better dean than clean.


Oops.  That should read "Better dead than red". A classic line from the Cold War.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*China's Next Moon Mission Targets Lunar 'Bay of Rainbows'*












> China is making major headway in its mission to land a rover on the moon — a big step forward in the nation's ambitious lunar exploration plans.
> 
> At China's Xichang Satellite Launch Center, the moon-bound Chang'e 3 spacecraft is undergoing its final tests ahead of *a planned launch in early December*. Meanwhile, a Long March 3B carrier rocket, reportedly modified with new technologies and improved reliability, is set to reach the launch center via train from Beijing on Friday (Nov. 1).
> 
> The touchdown target for the Chang'e 3 mission — a lander and a lunar rover — is thought to be Sinus Iridum, known as the Bay of Rainbows, a plain of basaltic lava on the moon, according to reports by China media outlets.


(Space)


----------



## BigDL (Apr 16, 2003)

Gee I wonder what China plans to exploit.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Rumour has it that this part of the moon is made of chòu dòufu.


----------



## macintosh doctor (Mar 23, 2009)

Lets pray and hope we still have an apollo space craft still as it seems today's technology isn't cutting it.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*China Shoots for the Moon*












> China is aiming to become only the third nation ever, after Russia and the U.S., to land a spacecraft on the moon.
> 
> The Asian nation successfully launched its Chang’e-3 probe, its third lunar mission, early on Monday morning, Beijing time. The spacecraft is set to make the first soft landing on the moon in nearly four decades, on or around December 14.
> 
> ...


(Details: National Geographic)

*See also:*

China Moon Rover to Make 1st Lunar Landing In 37 Years

`Exotic minerals` behind China`s obsession with Moon mission

China launches its first moon rover mission

Spectacular Liftoff Thrusts China’s First Rover ‘Yutu’ to the Moon


----------



## macintosh doctor (Mar 23, 2009)

Scary, they will claim the moon and its air space as theirs and we will have file flight plans as it will Chinese air space soon.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

As scary to us as U.S. space dominance was to them in the past. These emerging issues - China and India both advancing rapidly with their space programmes (India just launched a probe to Mars!) – are another reason why it is important to engage and form agreements through bodies such as the United Nations, so that any developments are for the good of all humankind. China in particular has the economic and resource capabilities to put the U.S. to shame in space over the long term. Canada in particular should be exploring partnerships for our astronauts, since the U.S. continues to be incapable of even launching its own people into space.... and if U.S. / Russia relations continue on their current path, U.S. astronauts looking to hitch a ride into orbit may find the answer is _nyet_.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Exactly. The U.S. is fast becoming an "also-ran."


----------



## macintosh doctor (Mar 23, 2009)

Macfury said:


> Exactly. The U.S. is fast becoming an "also-ran."


Okay like the Brampton Mayor, I will take Mandarin classes but at my own expense LOL
since China is taking over.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

China has also in the past decade been investing very heavily in Africa and Latin America... while the U.S. continues to be distracted with its adventures in the Middle East. Mandarin would be a good idea....


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Tomorrow (Saturday 14 Dec) the Chinese are hoping to become the third nation to "soft land" on the moon with the Chang'e-3 spacecraft and the Yutu (Jade Rabbit) rover...*

*China's first lunar probe to land on the moon*

_China's first lunar rover is expected to land on the moon on Saturday, less than two weeks after it blasted off from Earth, 
....
Chang'e-3, the unmanned spacecraft carrying the rover, is due to touch down on a lava plain named Sinus Iridum, or Bay of Rainbows, shortly after 3 p.m. GMT (10 a.m. ET) on December 14,
.....
On landing, Chang'e-3 will release Jade Rabbit (called Yutu in Chinese) -- a six-wheeled lunar rover equipped with at least four cameras and two mechanical legs that can dig up soil samples to a depth of 30 meters. 

The solar-powered rover will patrol the moon's surface, studying the structure of the lunar crust as well as soil and rocks, for at least three months._​
(CNN)


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Success!*

*BBC News - China lands Jade Rabbit robot rover on Moon*



> *China says it has successfully landed a craft carrying a robotic rover on the surface of the Moon, a major step in its programme of space exploration.*
> 
> On Saturday afternoon (GMT), a landing module underwent a powered descent, using thrusters to perform the first soft landing on the Moon in 37 years.
> 
> ...


(BBC)


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

> On landing, Chang'e-3 will release Jade Rabbit (called Yutu in Chinese) -- a six-wheeled lunar rover equipped with at least four cameras and two mechanical legs that can dig up soil samples to a depth of 30 meters.


Search for scientific knowledge, hell! Where's that Helium-3???!!!


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Jade Rabbit has a pretty cool tool onboard... ground-penetrating radar. As it moves around, it's "seeing" deep underground as well, part of the search for minerals and whatever other resources they can exploit on their future visits.... and make no mistake, the Chinese are definitely intending to set up a base and do what the USA is no longer capable of doing.

Chinese TV released video of the Chang'e lander arriving at the moon, and the deployment of the rover. Pretty cool:

RAW VIDEO: China's Moon Landing And Rover Deployment | Space.com


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

The U.S. is perfectly capable of doing it--it has just lost its guts and the will to live under successive statist governments. China is traveling in the other direction.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

...while we wait for more photos / videos / data from Chang'e.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WoM2bHfr48


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*A video of U.S. Astronauts in the lunar buggy - but with image stabilization technology applied. Cool!*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cKpzp358F4

_*...and the original...*_

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EliLP5uEYAU


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*The Chang'e-3 Lander and Yutu Rover have woken up after a 2-week, minus-180-degree Lunar night, and are back at work!*

*China's Moon Rover Delivers More Stunning Photos From The Lunar Surface*





> Part of the reason for the lunar silence is because Yutu (Chinese for “jade rabbit”) and the Chang’e-3 lander have been hibernating for the past two weeks, which is the equivalent of one lunar night. The vehicles powered down during this time to conserve energy during the frigid (we’re talking -180 Celsius or so — eat your heart out, polar vortex) and sunless lunar night. Both Yutu and Chang’e-3 were automatically awakened via solar power, now that there’s sunlight, and they’re resuming their pre-programmed operations.





> The Yutu rover will spend three months exploring the Bay of Rainbows, lava plains on the moon’s surface. It will also leave a telescope there for some serious star-gazing. The Chinese National Space Administration will share all the information it gleans from this mission. In fact, the new chief of China’s space agency has announced a willingness to cooperate and share information and technology with “all the countries in the world,” and wants to figure out a way to work with NASA despite a 2011 law prohibiting the use of NASA funds to work with China.


(GiantFreakinRobot)


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)




----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Mars will have to learn to speak Google first.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Jade Rabbit is dead.*


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*...or is it?*


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

What a great pic - thanks to China's latest moon probe, Chang'e 5T1:










_The Chinese lunar test mission Chang’e 5T1 has sent back some amazing and unique views of the Moon’s far side, with the Earth joining in for a cameo in the image above. According to the crew at UnmannedSpaceflight.com the images were taken with the spacecraft’s solar array monitoring camera.

The mission launched on October 23 and is taking an eight-day roundtrip flight around the Moon and is now journeying back to Earth. The mission is a test run for Chang’e-5, China’s fourth lunar probe that aims to gather samples from the Moon’s surface, currently set for 2017. Chang’e 5T1 will return to Earth on October 31.
_

(UniverseToday)


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Man, that's a great pic. Blue planet indeed.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

That photo must be a fake--the Earth is bigger than the moon!


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Macfury said:


> That photo must be a fake--the Earth is bigger than the moon!


 Every time I see cool shots of the moon, I'm reminded of James P. Hogan's excellent sci-fi series, particularly the first book:  Inherit the Stars


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

I think I read that one!



CubaMark said:


> Every time I see cool shots of the moon, I'm reminded of James P. Hogan's excellent sci-fi series, particularly the first book:  Inherit the Stars


----------



## macintosh doctor (Mar 23, 2009)

Macfury said:


> China will get there before a weakened America will.


I thought India is headed to Mars? they can just drop off a few on the moon, kill two birds with one stone


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

macintosh doctor said:


> I thought India is headed to Mars? they can just drop off a few on the moon, kill two birds with one stone


India's mars probe arrived a month ago - and has returned some really lovely images!


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)




----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Unless you jiggle that flag every 50 years, you don't get to keep the moon.


----------



## machspeed5 (Mar 4, 2008)

CubaMark said:


>


that's a fascinating proposal! what if someone erected a new flag to send a message to the US?!


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*China keeps on pushing forward... while the USA still can't get it's own arse into orbit. Embarrassing!*
*
China says it plans to attempt first-ever landing of lunar probe on the moon's far side*










China’s increasingly ambitious space program plans to attempt the first-ever landing of a lunar probe on the moon’s far side, a leading engineer said.

The Chang’e 4 mission is planned for sometime before 2020, Zou Yongliao from the Chinese Academy of Sciences’ moon exploration department told state broadcaster CCTV in an interview broadcast on Wednesday.

Zou said the mission’s objective would be to study geological conditions on the moon’s far side, also known as the dark side.

That could eventually lead to the placement of a radio telescope for use by astronomers, something that would help “fill a void” in man’s knowledge of the universe, Zou said.

Radio transmissions from Earth are unable to reach the moon’s far side, making it an excellent location for sensitive instruments.

China’s next lunar mission is scheduled for 2017, when it will attempt to land an unmanned spaceship on the moon before returning to Earth with samples. If successful, that would make China only the third country after the United States and Russia to have carried out such a manoeuvr.​
(Globe & Mail)


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Now the Russians are getting in on the lunar action.....*

*Russia Reportedly Plans To Build A Lunar Base By The 2030s*








Decades and decades after they pretended never to be in a “moon race” with the U.S., Russia reportedly plans to land cosmonauts on the moon by the 2030s, according to the news agency TASS. The most recent plans call for up to six launches of the Angara A5V heavy-lift rocket to put enough hardware into orbit for their first mission, which appears to involve establishing a lunar base.

A lunar base, for real. Long the stuff of science fiction, it seems Russia is trying to do this for real, or at least wants to. The BBC reported in October that the Russian and European space agencies are preparing to go to the moon with an eventual settlement in mind.

* * *​
Even if it’s modest at first, a permanent lunar base is exactly what would be needed to make this mission relevant, so many decades after people first walked on the moon. New manufacturing methods, including 3D printing, have been developed that can make the use of lunar regolith as a building material possible, and the promise of eventual mining of Helium-3 as a fuel for hoped-for fusion reactors are finally giving lunar bases enough justification to exist.​
(Jalopnik)


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

You're shut out, USA!


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Macfury said:


> You're shut out, USA!


A great deal depends on who the next President is, of course, but I suspect this will be the scenario: 

China, the Russians / EU, will make some progress, maybe land a few unmanned probes or even get material into orbit, but at a certain point the US will get its back up and take umbrage at the fact that they are imminently going to be quite obviously laggards in the view of their own citizens (nobody else really matters). 

Then they'll go all patriotic and throw gazoogles of dollars to leapfrog everyone else, build a massive launch platform (like, tie three Saturn V's together) and just drop a prefab base on the moon, put up a flag and call it a day.

Or they might surprise us and join an international effort.... but given the demonstrated psyche of the US state through history, the former scenario is just as plausible.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

No Democrat would put him/herself out to get to the moon alone. Certain Republicans might.



> Then they'll go all patriotic and throw gazoogles of dollars to leapfrog everyone else, build a massive launch platform (like, tie three Saturn V's together) and just drop a prefab base on the moon, put up a flag and call it a day.


I hope so!



CubaMark said:


> A great deal depends on who the next President is, of course, but I suspect this will be the scenario:
> 
> China, the Russians / EU, will make some progress, maybe land a few unmanned probes or even get material into orbit, but at a certain point the US will get its back up and take umbrage at the fact that they are imminently going to be quite obviously laggards in the view of their own citizens (nobody else really matters).
> 
> ...


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

_This was taken two years ago - but I only just found it in a Reddit thread. Photo from China's Yutu rover... Click to see the larger image, it's quite breathtaking._ 

0thatguy
Context: This image was taken by China's Yutu Rover in 2014. The rock is Loong rock, overlooking a crater which unfortunately doesn't have a name. The rover was part of the Chang'e 3 mission which landed at Mare Ibrium, making it the first mission to soft-land on the Moon since the Soviet's Luna 24 in 1976.

The rover became immobile sooner than expected after part of it broke. However, it unexpectedly survived the harsh cold lunar night and continued to transmit data from its operational instruments to Earth until recently.

The successor to this mission, Chang'e 4, will launch in 2018 and will land on the far side of the Moon, which has never been visited before by a lander. In 2017, multiple companies from around the world will launch rovers to the Moon; competing for the $20 million Lunar-X prize and sending back HD images and videos from the Moon.
.
We are living in a good time for lunar exploration!​​


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

That rock looks nothing like a Loong.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

And here are the a whole bunch more photos:

China Just Released True Color HD Photos Of The Moon | TechCrunch


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

For the record, the US sent men to the moon and brought them safely back home four times with less computer power than a modern day iMac.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Direct links to the two pages of China moon photos (Planetary Society mirror):

Chang'e 3 data: Lander Terrain Camera (TCAM)
Chang'e 3 data: Rover Panoramic Camera (PCAM)

There are hundreds of photos in there....


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

CubaMark said:


> Direct links to the two pages of China moon photos (Planetary Society mirror):
> 
> Chang'e 3 data: Lander Terrain Camera (TCAM)
> Chang'e 3 data: Rover Panoramic Camera (PCAM)
> ...


Hmmm, I opened the second link and went to the pic in the right top corner and instead of clicking on the pic, accidentally clicked on 'B IMG'.

It downloaded a file to my desktop that would not open, nor could I trash it. I tried a restart and kept getting a warning about not saving the file and restarting and clicked yes. No luck as it would not allow a restart no matter what I tried, nor would it go into the trash.

I finally had to do a force quit and on restart it allowed me to trash the file. Too weird.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

SINC, I replicated your action - click on "B IMG" and downloading the file. It seems odd that it would cause such systemwide chaos!

It appears on my system as a mac disk image, which of course it isn't. It's a valid image file, but of a kind not native to Macintosh.

There are a couple of viewers you can download from NASA and other sources to use to view the file (and of course, Graphic Converter) if you really need something beyond the JPG that comes with clicking the thumbnail.

I tried Graphic Converter - it will only open the file in RAW Import mode, and by manually entering the parameters provided at the Planetary Society link (2352 by 1728 pixels in size, with Bayer filter) - even then it comes out looking like a photo negative.

At that point, my interesting in wasting any more time on this dissipated...


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

I sure didn't expect you to try and solve it Mark, but thanks for the info. I just wanted to let folks know NOT to do anything but click on the image. As I noted, I clicked on that link by mistake.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

SINC said:


> I sure didn't expect you to try and solve it Mark, but thanks for the info. I just wanted to let folks know NOT to do anything but click on the image. As I noted, I clicked on that link by mistake.


 I like technical challenges like this...


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Report: China developing advanced lunar mission spaceship*









In this June 16, 2012, file photo, the Shenzhou 9 spacecraft rocket launches from the Jiuquan Satellite Launch Center in Jiuquan, 
China. State media say China is developing an advanced new spaceship capable of both flying in low-Earth orbit and landing
on the moon. The newspaper Science and Technology Daily cited spaceship engineer Zhang Bainian as saying the 
new craft would be recoverable and have room for multiple astronauts. (AP Photo/Ng Han Guan, File)​
China is developing an advanced new spaceship capable of both flying in low-Earth orbit and landing on the moon, according to state media, in another bold step for a space program that equaled the U.S. in number of rocket launches last year.

The newspaper Science and Technology Daily cited spaceship engineer Zhang Bainian as saying the new craft would be recoverable and have room for multiple astronauts. While no other details were given in the Tuesday report, Zhang raised as a comparison the Orion spacecraft being developed by NASA and the European Space Agency. The agency hopes Orion will carry astronauts into space by 2023.

China's Shenzhou space capsule used on all six of its crewed missions is based on Russia's Soyuz and is capable of carrying three astronauts in its re-entry module.

China came late to crewed space flight, launching its first man into space in 2003, but has advanced rapidly since then. In its most recent crewed mission, two astronauts spent a month aboard a Chinese space station late last year.

A fully functioning, permanently crewed space station is on course to begin operations in around five years and a manned lunar mission has been suggested for the future.

Now firmly established among the big three in space travel, China last year moved ahead of Russia for the first time in number of rocket launches and equaled the United States at 22, according to Harvard University astrophysicist Jonathan McDowell. Russia had 17 launches, while the U.S. might have had several more if Space X's Falcon 9 rocket fleet hadn't been grounded following a Sept. 1 launchpad explosion.
(Times-Colonist)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*So the moon race is back on, and this time it's the USA vs China...*

*Sorry Mars, The US Is Going Back To The Moon*










Vice President Mike Pence gave a speech yesterday in which he outlined NASA’s new goal. The agency will no longer focus on going to Mars – it is now planning a return to the Moon first.

The announcement is the latest about-turn for the agency, which must be pretty sick of being given a new goal every 4 years. Under Bush, it was the Moon. Under Obama, Mars. Now we’re back to the Moon again. Come on people.

Absent from Pence’s speech – given at the National Space Council’s launch controversially re-started by Trump – were any actual specifics. There was no timeline, no showing of new hardware, no studies. Instead, we got a bunch of wishy-washy statements that might placate the public, but in reality, mean absolutely nothing.

* * *​
For the last decade, NASA has been working on a huge new rocket called the Space Launch System (SLS), and a new spacecraft called Orion. The latter has completed one unmanned launch, while the former will not fly for the first time until 2019.

These were developed as part of Obama’s broader goal to get astronauts to Mars, a worthy idea if one that was not fully supported. This so-called Journey to Mars, championed by former NASA Administrator Charlie Bolden, would have seen astronauts orbit the Red Planet in the 2030s and, at some point, land.

Giving up on Mars would be "disastrous," Bolden told IFLScience in an interview 2 years ago. Sorry Charlie.

* * *​
There were quite a lot of things missing from that Journey to Mars plan, though. NASA hadn’t yet started development on the whole spacecraft that will actually go to Mars, nor any sort of habitat for the future. It has been gathering ideas for building a Mars outpost, though.

Maybe that was for the best because the goalposts have changed yet again. Truth be told, it probably doesn’t change too much for now. The SLS and Orion will still be used for missions to the Moon, so their development will still continue. NASA is also looking into building a lunar space station, possibly with help from Russia.

But this commitment to put “boots on the Moon” is new. It means the Trump administration is telling NASA to actively focus on developing systems to land on the Moon. That’s not cheap, and it will surely delay any attempts to go to Mars.

* * *​
Anyway, the crux of it all is that NASA’s new goal is to go back to the Moon. Until Trump is no longer President, then it'll probably go somewhere else. Then somewhere else. Until Elon Musk colonizes Mars or something.

Oh to be a NASA employee.
(IFLScience)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*China Launching Relay Satellite Toward Moon's Far Side Sunday*










China will launch the next piece of its ambitious robotic lunar-exploration program on Sunday (May 20), if all goes according to plan.

The nation's Queqiao relay satellite is scheduled to lift off atop a Long March 4C rocket on Sunday from the Xichang Satellite Launch Center in Sichuan Province at about 5 p.m. EDT (2100 GMT; 5 a.m. on May 21 local Xichang time).

Queqiao will then make its way to the Earth-moon Lagrange point 2, a gravitationally stable spot located 40,000 miles (64,000 kilometers) beyond the lunar far side. From that perch, Queqiao will relay signals and data between Earth and China's pioneering Chang'e 4 lander-rover duo. That pair will launch late this year and attempt to become the first spacecraft ever to land on the far side of the moon. 

* * *​
The Chang'e program has already achieved a string of successes. The Chang'e 1 and Chang'e 2 probes reached lunar orbit in 2007 and 2010, respectively, and the Chang'e 3 mission put a lander and rover on the moon's near side in late 2013. The next year, China launched Chang'e 5 T1, a mission that sent a sample-return capsule around the moon and back to Earth to demonstrate the technology needed to survive a fiery atmospheric entry. China plans to launch a bona-fide lunar sample-return mission, called Chang'e 5, in 2019.

(Space.com)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*UPDATE:* _On her way!_

China launches satellite to explore dark side of moon: Xinhua


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Holy heck*. 

*Meet SpaceX's first passenger — a billionaire rock musician who got his start selling CDs via snail mail*










SpaceX CEO Elon Musk says the first passenger on a private space flight around the moon will be a Japanese billionaire who also happens to be a rock musician and art collector.

Yusaku Maezawa is the founder of Zozotown, Japan's biggest fashion retail website. He's Japan's 18th-richest person, according to Forbes, which estimates his net worth at $2.9 billion.

Maezawa, 42, is paying an undisclosed amount of money to be the first commercial passenger to fly around the moon on SpaceX's Big Falcon Rocket (BFR), the company announced via webcast on Monday evening. The mission is scheduled to launch in 2023, and *Maezawa is also paying for the fares of up to eight other passengers — all artists*, who the billionaire says will create works of art reflecting their time in space.

(CNBC)​
*SpaceX Announcement* (Webcast)


















*Maezawa's website:* #dearMoon


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Just finished the Hulu series "The First" (Sean Penn in the lead, as the first crew to launch to Mars). Mixed reviews... there's a secondary (?) plot that is a little bit excruciating, and several times through the show I've though to myself that the writers are trying just a little too hard to be "deep". But hey, I'm a sucker for any new TV relating to space exploration (on that note: Anybody know when NASA's second season of "Mars" is to be released?).

Now here's the interesting part, relating to the SpaceX announcement:

*Weird Coincidence: “The First” and Yusaku Maezawa*











*Jean Michel Basquiat painting sold to Yusaku Maezawa for $110.5 million*










(SoundsLikeFresh)


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

_China launches for the moon in a few hours...._

*Chinese spacecraft launches for historic landing on far side of the moon*

China was preparing to launch a ground-breaking mission early Saturday to soft-land a spacecraft on the largely unexplored far side of the moon, demonstrating its growing ambitions as a space power to rival Russia, the European Union and U.S.

With its Chang'e 4 mission, China hopes to become the first country to ever successfully undertake such a landing. The moon's far side is also known as the dark side because it faces away from Earth and remains comparatively unknown, with a different composition from sites on the near side, where previous missions have landed.

If successful, the mission scheduled to blast off aboard a Long March 3B rocket will propel the Chinese space program to a leading position in one of the most important areas of lunar exploration.

(CBC)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

_Landing possible on Thursday...._

*Chinese spacecraft nears landing on far side of moon*

China is trying to reach a milestone in space exploration: landing a vehicle on the far side of the moon for the first time in history.

The mission is one in a series that underscore the country’s ambitions to join — and even lead — the space race. The spacecraft, whose landing could come Thursday, is called Chang’e-4 after the moon goddess in Chinese mythology.

Chang’e-4 would be the first to touch down on the side of the moon that perpetually faces away from the Earth.

“This space mission shows that China has reached the advanced world-class level in deep space exploration,”

* * *​
China plans to begin fully operating its third space station by 2022, to put astronauts in a lunar base by later in that decade, and to send probes to Mars, including ones that could return samples of the Martian surface back to Earth.

The crater where the Chinese were to land is the oldest and deepest on the moon, so the probe’s discoveries could offer insights into the moon’s origins and evolution. And some scientists suspect that the surrounding basin may be rich in minerals. If exploiting the moon’s resources is the next step in space development, a successful mission could leave the Chinese better positioned.

(Toronto Star)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

_Successful landing!_

*China lunar mission: probe makes historic landing on far side of moon*









An image taken by China's Chang'e-4 probe after its landing CREDIT: AP​
A Chinese spacecraft has made the first successful landing ever on the far side of the moon, a mission seen as an important step as the country looks to push forward its space programme. 

The lunar explorer Chang'e 4 touched down at 10:26 am and relayed a photo of the "dark side" of the moon to the Queqiao satellite, the official China Central Television reported on Thursday.

The moon is tidally locked to Earth, rotating at the same rate that it orbits our planet, so the far side - or the "dark side" - is never visible from Earth. Previous spacecraft have seen the far side of the moon, but none has landed on it.

The landing "lifted the mysterious veil" from the far side of the moon, and "opened a new chapter in human lunar exploration", the broadcaster said. 

(Telegraph UK)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*The far side of the moon, at ground level:*










*Full article *at Engadget


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

A close-up of the rover's wheels:


----------



## macintosh doctor (Mar 23, 2009)

Impressive as this feet is,
China will declare the moon part of their republic of communist China.. Would be interesting to see if China goes to the moon landing site and clears it of any historical landing evidence.

Time for the US to send some Democrats to free the plant


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

macintosh doctor said:


> Impressive as this feet is,
> China will declare the moon part of their republic of communist China.. Would be interesting to see if China goes to the moon landing site and clears it of any historical landing evidence.
> 
> Time for the US to send some Democrats to free the plant


China is a signatory to the Outer Space Treaty, which states in part:

_The treaty explicitly forbids any government to claim a celestial resource such as the Moon or a planet.[7] Article II of the treaty states that "outer space, including the Moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means." However, the State that launches a space object retains jurisdiction and control over that object.[8] The State is also liable for damages caused by its space object.[9]_​
Of course, all law is mutable... the coming decades and centuries will be interesting in this regard. For those who haven't been watching National Geographic's _Mars_ docu-drama, this season (2) addresses the commercialization of Mars territory and the conflicts with pure science initiatives.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Jade Rabbit 2 is making tracks! Rover is functional 










(CBC)


----------



## macintosh doctor (Mar 23, 2009)

CubaMark said:


> China is a signatory to the Outer Space Treaty, which states in part:
> 
> _The treaty explicitly forbids any government to claim a celestial resource such as the Moon or a planet.[7] Article II of the treaty states that "outer space, including the Moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means." However, the State that launches a space object retains jurisdiction and control over that object.[8] The State is also liable for damages caused by its space object.[9]_​
> Of course, all law is mutable... the coming decades and centuries will be interesting in this regard. For those who haven't been watching National Geographic's _Mars_ docu-drama, this season (2) addresses the commercialization of Mars territory and the conflicts with pure science initiatives.


has not stopped China making man made islands in the ocean to claim it theirs.. China has not and will not follow any treaty or law. Trust me on this.. patents, international oceans are all a joke to the mammoth communist world leaders; now Space leaders..


----------



## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

macintosh doctor said:


> has not stopped China making man made islands in the ocean to claim it theirs.. China has not and will not follow any treaty or law. Trust me on this.. patents, international oceans are all a joke to the mammoth communist world leaders; now Space leaders..


Of course the USA sets a such sterling example in this area. That of course is straight up pie in the sky thinking, but what the hey. 

As to patents and copyrights I am unaware of China signing on to any agreements in these areas. The US is attempting to bully them into it, but doing so is hardly in China's self interest.


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

What I find most interesting about this Charlie Foxtrot is the almost complete absence of discussion as to why the ChiCom's are _actually_ doing this. (The mining prospects are peripheral.)

Military base, anyone?

If not, then why is there suddenly such a hustle to get a space war program up & running in the US? Why is the US suddenly lighting a fire under NASA's butt to get the moon program up & running again?

Jes' sayin'...


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

FeXL said:


> What I find most interesting about this Charlie Foxtrot is the almost complete absence of discussion as to why the ChiCom's are _actually_ doing this. (The mining prospects are peripheral.)
> 
> Military base, anyone?
> 
> ...


Helium 3 comes to mind...


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Macfury said:


> Helium 3 comes to mind...


Sorry, not getting the reference.


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

In addition, the dark side of the moon provides a certain safety factor re: military targeting.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

FeXL said:


> Sorry, not getting the reference.


Interesting read here:

https://io9.gizmodo.com/5908499/could-helium-3-really-solve-earths-energy-problems


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Macfury said:


> Interesting read here:


Ah. Gotcha.


----------



## macintosh doctor (Mar 23, 2009)

eMacMan said:


> Of course the USA sets a such sterling example in this area. That of course is straight up pie in the sky thinking, but what the hey.
> 
> As to patents and copyrights I am unaware of China signing on to any agreements in these areas. The US is attempting to bully them into it, but doing so is hardly in China's self interest.


you are blaming the USA for China stealing patents ? that is rich. 
Also how is it USA's fault that China is expanding in the south China Sea, they are doing so to claim false ownership claims .. https://www.news.com.au/world/asia/...e/news-story/84aa8664ef1f147d704b8f1e78e62516

I will only think that are doing the same on the moon. Chinese have poor reputations with keeping any treaties or honoring agreements pertaining to ownership.



Macfury said:


> Interesting read here:
> 
> https://io9.gizmodo.com/5908499/could-helium-3-really-solve-earths-energy-problems



I have always speculated that hunt for new resources will be the start of WW3.. 
think about it. North Korea is the last area that has not been pillaged for natural resources.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Dwingeloo Radio Telescope - C.A. Muller Radio Astronomy Station - PI9CAM*

_This photo of Earth and the Lunar farside, maybe our best ever, was taken yesterday by the Chinese Lunar satellite DSLWP-B (Longjiang-2). The Dwingeloo telescope downloaded the photo from the satellite this morning. _​








*Update February 4, 2019*
After a radio-quiet period to avoid interfering with the Chang’e 4 Lunar landing, DSLWP-B became active again on 13 January 2019. The first opportunity to take photos of Earth and Moon were on 3 February, on which a command was sent to take another timelapse. The first image from this timelapse was downloaded with the Dwingeloo telescope on February 4, 2019. For the first time, it the entire Moon and Earth are in view.

(Twitter: Dwingeloo Telescope)​

*NASA's Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter image from 2017:*

This WAC mosaic provides the most complete look at the morphology of the farside to date, and will provide a valuable resource for the scientific community. And it's simply a spectacular sight! The Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter Camera (LROC) Wide Angle Camera (WAC) is a push-frame camera that captures seven color bands (321, 360, 415, 566, 604, 643, and 689 nm) with a 57-km swath (105-km swath in monochrome mode) from a 50 km orbit.









*Soviet Luna 3 — First ever image of the lunar farside in 1959:*









The Luna 3 spacecraft returned the first views ever of the far side of the Moon. The first image was taken at 03:30 UT on 7 October at a distance of 63,500 km after Luna 3 had passed the Moon and looked back at the sunlit far side. The last image was taken 40 minutes later from 66,700 km. 

A total of 29 photographs were taken, covering 70% of the far side. The photographs were very noisy and of low resolution, but many features could be recognized. This is the first image returned by Luna 3, taken by the wide-angle lens, it showed the far side of the Moon was very different from the near side, most noticeably in its lack of lunar maria (the dark areas). 

The right three-quarters of the disk are the far side. The dark spot at upper right is Mare Moscoviense, the dark area at lower left is Mare Smythii. The small dark circle at lower right with the white dot in the center is the crater Tsiolkovskiy and its central peak. The Moon is 3475 km in diameter and north is up in this image. (Luna 3-1, Russian Space Agency, not necessarily in the public domain)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

The moon is suddenly becoming a pretty crowded space (relatively speaking!):

*Israel's Beresheet robot sets its sights on the Moon*

The Beresheet robot is a privately funded venture that aims to land and hop across the lunar surface.

It's a challenging prospect. Only government space agencies from the US, Russia and China have previously managed soft touchdowns.

The 1.5m-high, 585kg Beresheet will begin its mission with a ride to Earth orbit on a SpaceX Falcon 9 rocket from Cape Canaveral in Florida.

Once ejected from this vehicle, the robot will then use its British-built engine to propel itself to the Moon. The journey will take over two months to complete.

(BBC)​
Livestream via SpaceX (845pm EST)


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

_Successful launch and deployment of IsraelIL's moon lander! The 1st stage Falcon 9 (on its fourth launch - the first time this has been attempted) despite a challenging set of circumstances, made a picture-perfect landing on the drone ship off the coast of Florida._ 

*SpaceX launches the first private moon lander on Israel's behalf*

A SpaceX Falcon 9 rocket has ferried Israel's first lunar lander outside our atmosphere, setting it free to make its way to its ultimate destination: the moon. If it reaches its target successfully, Israel would be joining the US, China and the former Soviet Union in the list of nations to have sent a lander to our planet's trusty companion. Unlike the three other countries in that list, Israel's robotic spacecraft named "Beresheet" was created by a non-profit group called SpaceIL. It's the first private moon lander and was previously a finalist for Google's Lunar XPrize.

* * *​
Beresheet will spend the next couple of months orbiting the Earth and then letting the moon's gravity pull it into the lunar orbit. It will then enter a lower and lower orbit until it finally lands on the northern lunar hemisphere sometime in April. 

* * *​
According to The New York Times, the lander can only last a few days at most. It will use that time to measure the moon's magnetic field as it approaches for landing, which could shed light on the moon's core that's believed to be made of iron. The lander also has retroreflectors installed by NASA that can bounce back lasers beamed from Earth to get an accurate measurement of the distance between our planet and its natural satellite.

(Engadget)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

_Whoops....._

*Israeli Moon Lander Hits Serious Glitch in Orbit*

After finding problems with its sensitive “star tracker” navigation system, the Israeli lunar lander Beresheet ran into another serious glitch after its first maneuver: engineers at Israeli space organization SpaceIL found that the on-board computer rebooted unexpectedly, Haaretz reports.

The 1,290 pound lander deployed from a SpaceX Falcon 9 rocket last week. Shortly afterward, it sent its first signals back to Earth as part of a first round of in-orbit tests.

The on-board computer was supposed to control a three minute engine fire that would take the lander farther away from Earth on its months-long trip to the Moon. But then something unexpected happened.

“At this stage, the spacecraft’s computer conducted an independent reset, so the maneuver was cancelled,” SpaceIL CEO Ido Anteby said in a press conference call, as quoted by Haaretz.

* * *

Beresheet will fly in a massive elliptical spiral around the Earth, slowly easing into the Moon’s gravitational pull. Landing on the moon is scheduled for early April.

The computer reboot means that Beresheet didn’t move itself further away from Earth — it’s not yet clear how much of a setback this will be for the team or how far the missing maneuver will postpone the eventual Moon landing.

(Futurism)​


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/mont...3e_gq1y94NXrM0Tm1085btbCbMtwjnAgwWGNeKy372Cco


----------



## wonderings (Jun 10, 2003)

Dr.G. said:


> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/mont...3e_gq1y94NXrM0Tm1085btbCbMtwjnAgwWGNeKy372Cco


I always thought moving out to the moon was a good first step. I know little to nothing about space and living out there but it just seemed closer and thus easier then something like Mars. 

I do enjoy sci fi and something that you see all the time in those stories are space stations with artificial gravity done by a giant ring spinning. In my uneducated brain it makes sense and would love to see more exploring in this realm before pushing out further. 

50123 by B P, on Flickr


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Thanks for the link, Dr. G. I missed the announcement.

The advantages of a lunar orbital outpost are many: It separates the process of getting to the moon's surface into (at least) two separate procedures, potentially reducing some of the risk and allowing for specialization with the crews. 

One of the biggest benefits is having an operations hub that is unaffected by the biggest challenge facing moon surface activities: the razor-sharp, glasslike and apparently quite toxic moon dust. There are concerns that the dust could lead to rapid erosion of seals on doors, space suit joints, etc., and could afflict astronauts with new illnesses. It will be interesting to see the new technologies they'll have to develop to address the dust bunny problem.

One of the oft-repeated reasons for going back to the moon has to do with mining - particularly Helium-3, as a source of fuel for fusion reactors. It seems a little much, however, that the costs could be mitigated to the point where that kind of fuel mining makes any sense. One would think that the ever-increasingly efficient battery technology combined with wind / solar / tidal generation would end up costing us a lot less. 

Now, IF there is a rapid scale-up of technologies for building, mining, processing and manufacturing components for space-capable shelters, ships, etc., on the moon, then it makes sense to establish a base and start digging. There are many examples of automated shelter construction technologies already in development. Once you have a roof over your head, a pressurized environment, and enough supplies on hand / supply stream in place, well... the sky's the limit!


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

CubaMark said:


> Thanks for the link, Dr. G. I missed the announcement.
> 
> The advantages of a lunar orbital outpost are many: It separates the process of getting to the moon's surface into (at least) two separate procedures, potentially reducing some of the risk and allowing for specialization with the crews.
> 
> ...


:clap::clap::clap:


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

wonderings said:


> I always thought moving out to the moon was a good first step. I know little to nothing about space and living out there but it just seemed closer and thus easier then something like Mars.


If they find a nice cache of Helium 3, they can power a whole moon city.


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Hello, Bigot.

FTFY.



CubaMark said:


> One of the oft-repeated reasons for going back to the moon has to do with military bases.


Since when have costs ever been an issue for you? Another tax will take care of that!

'Sides, nuclear?!

Anathema to Greenies!



CubaMark said:


> ...It seems a little much, however, that the costs could be mitigated to the point where that kind of fuel mining makes any sense. One would think that the ever-increasingly efficient battery technology combined with wind / solar / tidal generation would end up costing us a lot less.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

FeXL said:


> Hello, Bigot.


Laughing at you, the universe is. Did you read about the newly manufactured, best light-absorbing, absolute black material? That's the colour of the pot that you are, and my kettle is, by comparison, shiny stainless steel. 



FeXL said:


> FTFY.


GTFO.



FeXL said:


> 'Sides, nuclear?!
> 
> Anathema to Greenies!


Nuclear fusion is just fine, if it's every attained. No radioactive material to store like a time bomb for hundreds of thousands of years. It's a very easy to understand distinction.... for most people... ;lmao:


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Hello, Bigot.

Your pot is the old, cracked, corroded, white & blue porcelain bed pan behind the woodshed long since discarded because it's full of holes (like your head & your arguments) & doesn't hold $h!t anymore.



CubaMark said:


> That's the colour of the pot that you are, and my kettle is, by comparison, shiny stainless steel.


Stunning comeback! :clap::clap::lmao::lmao::lmao:



CubaMark said:


> GTFO.


Oooooo! Scary!!!

Then you'd better explain the difference to yer Prog friends out there who are as uninformed as a wooden horse on the subject. Matter of fact, most subjects...

Speaking of which, I notice you dodged the cost question. Nor have you addressed the costs associated with A Occasional Cortex's Green New Deal. Independent analysts have pegged it as anywhere between 50 & nearly a hundred trillion $$$. For somebody who was screaming blue murder about Trump's spending (while ignoring Barry's), the fact that her bull$h!t solution is going to double or quadruple the national debt doesn't hold some concern for you?

Thought not.

Hypocrite...



CubaMark said:


> ...time bomb for hundreds of thousands of years. It's a very easy to understand distinction.... for most people... ;lmao:


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Sigh.

Incredibly consistent, we can always count on FeXL to **** all over any thread unrelated to his peeve of the moment.

What a waste of time this forum has become.

:-(


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Hello, Bigot.

Further to your bull$h!t, this forum has done nothing but improve over the years.

Every single time a snivelling, whiny, snot-nosed Prog got tired of having his backside handed to him in an even argument & left for greener pastures, the quality of this place has gone up, as well as the overall IQ.

Three more left... 



CubaMark said:


> What a waste of time this forum has become.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Japan's moon rover will be made by Toyota*










_Toyota is going to the moon. _

The Japanese Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) has teamed up with the carmaker to build a pressurized self-driving rover that will land on the lunar surface in 2029. The six-wheeled transporter will be able to carry two humans for a distance of 10,000 kilometers using solar power and Toyota's fuel cell technology. 

The rover will be about the size of two minibuses, with 13 square meters of habitable space, and the astronauts on board will be able to take their suits off inside the vehicle as they explore. It will land on the moon before the human expedition arrives, and travel independently to meet them.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kd2nFHAAtU[/ame]

(Engadget)


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

_Close, but no cigar...._

*Israel's Beresheet Spacecraft Crashes Into Moon During Landing Attempt*










Israel's first moon lander came up just short in its historic touchdown bid this afternoon (April 11).

The robotic Beresheet spacecraft, built by SpaceIL and Israel Aerospace Industries (IAI), aimed to become the first Israeli craft, and the first privately funded mission, ever to land softly on the moon. But the little robot couldn't quite make it, crashing into the gray dirt around 3:25 p.m. EDT (1925 GMT). Mission control lost communications with the spacecraft when it was about 489 feet (149 meters) above the moon's surface.

"We had a failure in the spacecraft; we unfortunately have not managed to land successfully," Opher Doron, the general manager of IAI, said during a live broadcast from mission control. "It's a tremendous achievement up 'til now."
(Space)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

_China's rover is delivering the goods!_

*Chang'e-4: Chinese rover 'confirms' Moon crater theory*

The Chinese Chang'e-4 rover may have confirmed a longstanding idea about the origin of a vast crater on the Moon's far side.

The rover's landing site lies within a vast impact depression created by an asteroid strike billions of years ago.

Now, mission scientists have found evidence that impact was so powerful it punched through the Moon's crust and into the layer below called the mantle.

Chang'e-4 has identified what appear to be mantle rocks on the surface.

It's something the rover was sent to the far side to find out.

Chunlai Li, from the Chinese Academy of Sciences in Beijing, and colleagues have presented their findings in the journal Nature.

The lunar far side, which is turned away from Earth, is more rugged than the familiar near side and has fewer "maria" - dark plains formed by ancient volcanic eruptions.

The Chinese spacecraft touched down on 3 January, becoming the first spacecraft to perform a soft landing on the lunar far side. The rover then rolled off the lander to explore its surroundings.

The rover landed inside a 180km-wide impact bowl called Von Kármán crater. But that smaller crater lies within the 2,300km-wide South Pole Aitken (SPA) Basin, which covers nearly a quarter of the Moon's circumference.

(BBC)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*The Chang'e-4 spacecraft have been operating on the lunar far side for 175 days. *


















The Chang'e-4 lander and Yutu-2 rover resumed science and exploration activities June 27 for the start of the mission's seventh lunar day on the far side of the moon.

The 140-kilogram Yutu-2 (Jade Rabbit-2) rover awoke at 1:26 a.m. Eastern, followed by the lander at 9:45 p.m., with both spacecraft and their science payloads working normally, according to an update from the Lunar Exploration and Space Program Center of the China National Space Administration issued Thursday.

The spacecraft had powered down on the morning of June 9, folding solar arrays in preparation for the 14.5-Earth-day-long lunar night, during which the pair use radioisotope heater units to protect against temperatures as low as minus 190 Celsius (minus 310 Fahrenheit).

(Space.com)​


----------



## wonderings (Jun 10, 2003)

CubaMark said:


> *The Chang'e-4 spacecraft have been operating on the lunar far side for 175 days. *
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looks like they are doing studies on how donuts work in a low gravity environment.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*...and now India is going to the moon!*

*India to send rover to the moon amid global space race*










India is looking to take a giant leap in its space program and solidify its place among the world's spacefaring nations with its second unmanned mission to the moon, this one aimed at landing a rover near the unexplored south pole.

The Indian Space Research Organization (ISRO) plans to launch a spacecraft on Monday using homegrown technology, and it is scheduled to touch down on the moon Sept. 6 or 7. The $141-million US Chandrayaan-2 mission will analyze minerals, map the moon's surface and search for water.

It will "boldly go where no country has ever gone before," the ISRO aid in a statement.

With India poised to become the world's fifth-largest economy, the ardently nationalist government of Prime Minister Narendra Modi is eager to show off the country's prowess in security and technology.

India successfully test-fired an anti-satellite weapon in March, which Modi said demonstrated the country's capacity as a space power alongside the United States, Russia and China. India also plans to send humans into space by 2022, becoming only the fourth nation to do so.

(CBC)​
*NOTE that India's ISRO has a very successful Mars orbiting imager mission still underway. India's Defense Department also successfully deployed an anti-satellite weapon to the consternation of the aerospace industry due to the increase of orbital debris that could threaten other satellites and spacecraft.*


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

India's Mission aborted


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*India sends Chandrayaan 2 probe toward the moon’s south pole for historic landing*










India began a slow but steady space odyssey to the moon’s south polar region today with the launch of its Chandrayaan 2 mission.

The lunar landing, set for Sept. 6-7, would make India the fourth nation to set a probe safely down on the moon’s surface, after Russia, the United States and China.

If all goes according to plan, the mission’s Vikram lander and Pragyan rover would gather the first on-the-ground scientific data from a region that NASA is targeting for a crewed landing in 2024.

Today’s liftoff from the Satish Dhawan Space Center in Sriharikota Space Center, on India’s southeast coast, was hailed by mission leaders at the Indian Space Research Organization.

“It is the beginning of a historical journey of India toward the moon, and to land at a place near the south pole to carry out scientific experiments, to explore the unexplored,” said ISRO Chairman Kailasavadivoo Sivan.

* * *​
Assuming that Chandrayaan 2 sticks to its planned trajectory, the spacecraft will send its lander-rover piggyback payload to a highland plain between two craters, Manzinus C and Simpelius N, at a latitude of 70.9 degrees south.

Scientists say the moon’s south polar region holds the promise of water ice reserves and other potential resources for human settlement — which is why it’s the target of NASA’s Artemis moon program.

** * **​
Looking further ahead, India is planning to start launching its own astronauts in 2022 and send a robotic probe to bring lunar samples back to Earth in the 2023-2024 time frame.

(Geekwire)​


----------



## wonderings (Jun 10, 2003)

I like the new focus that seems to be on the moon these days. Would like to see some R&D for ships with gravity. Seems pretty simple in all the Sci-Fi movies, just need one of these billionaires to start building one.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

wonderings said:


> I like the new focus that seems to be on the moon these days. Would like to see some R&D for ships with gravity. Seems pretty simple in all the Sci-Fi movies, just need one of these billionaires to start building one.


The Duchy of Grand Fenwick achieved this in 1963, with its anti-gravity moonship.


----------



## wonderings (Jun 10, 2003)

Macfury said:


> The Duchy of Grand Fenwick achieved this in 1963, with its anti-gravity moonship.


I want gravity in space not anti-gravity!


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

wonderings said:


> I want gravity in space not anti-gravity!


They blew it!


----------



## wonderings (Jun 10, 2003)

Macfury said:


> They blew it!


Not sure the invention of anti-gravity in space is all that big of a deal, pretty sure I could have invented that myself


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

wonderings said:


> Not sure the invention of anti-gravity in space is all that big of a deal, pretty sure I could have invented that myself


The deal with their rocket is that it left the Earth on anti-grav at a piddling 20 miles per hour. No reason to achieve escape velocity.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*China proposes joint Moon exploration with India*

China welcomes India’s successful launch of its second lunar exploration mission, Chandrayaan-2, and is ready to jointly explore the Moon with India, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Hua Chunying said on Tuesday.

"We positively view India’s launch of the Chandrayaan-2 mission with a lunar rover," she said at a regular briefing. "The exploration and exploitation of space, including the Moon and other planets, is a common task of the humanity, which needs to be addressed by joint effort. <…> We are willing to join forces with India and other countries to advance the lunar exploration."

*(TASS)*​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*Live coverage of India's moon landing attempt Friday night:*

*With Chandrayaan-2 going to land, entire world is on the edge of its seat*

"Not only India, the entire world is watching and excited about it. The world is going to be on the edge of its seat. It's humankind accomplishing great stuff. I am an American astronaut, but I came here to watch the event as I feel we are all one on this mission." He said, "As the orbiter has already reached Moon's circle orbit, it is a success. The icing on the cake will be lander touching the lunar surface."

"...his live show on Chandrayaan-2 that will be shown on National Geographic at 11.30pm on Friday night..."


(Times of India)​


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

The entire world is on the edge of its seat? Is it the finale of _Dancing with the Stars_ we're talking about?


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Macfury said:


> The entire world is on the edge of its seat? Is it the finale of _Dancing with the Stars_ we're talking about?


Hey, it's the _Times of India_. They're understandably excited 

And it is quite a big deal... India's space programme has been racking up successes. Their Mars orbiter was / is a huge success. This month it celebrates five years in orbit, and is still going strong, delivering observational data. :clap:


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

ISRO (India's Space Agency) lost contact with the Chandrayaan-2 lander. No confirmation that it has crashed... just no contact.

*EDIT:* On the upside, India's lunar orbiter remains functional and performing science. The lander was planned for a 15-day mission, so this is disappointing, but still a major success for ISRO.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Well, this is a surprise.... ISRO's Vikram Lander did in fact make it to the surface of the moon... but it was a harder-than-planned landing, and so far, no communication.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*NASA orders minimum 6, up to 12, Orion capsules from Lockheed for future moon missions... $4.6-billion deal...
*










(Techcrunch)


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

I want them to go to the moon using solar and wind power.


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Macfury said:


> I want them to go to the moon using solar and wind power.


Using processes and materials created solely with solar and wind power...


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

FeXL said:


> Using processes and materials created solely with solar and wind power...


My grandpappy burnt coal, oil & gasoline.... I burn coal, oil & gasoline.... and dang-nabbit! My grandkiddies and their grandkiddies are going to burn coal, oil & gasoline 'cause that's the way we do it here! None of this lily-livered, panty-waist, commie-pinko renewable energy fluffery! That ain't manly!


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Hello, Bigot.

Once again, <whoooooosh!>

Yer an idiot.

You're so immersed in your ideological tirade that you fail to note that many of the processes & materials simply cannot be manufactured using wind & solar power.

Name one, _a single solitary working commercial example_, of any of the following currently _operating entirely_ (not merely theoretically) on wind or solar:
1) Titanium smelter;
2) Aluminum smelter;
3) Steel mill.

Go ahead. I'll wait...



CubaMark said:


> None of this lily-livered, panty-waist, commie-pinko renewable energy fluffery! That ain't manly!


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

FeXL said:


> Go ahead. I'll wait...


Going to travel to the moon sitting on a solar panel that works like a flying carpet. Just you wait and see!


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Macfury said:


> Going to travel to the moon sitting on a solar panel that works like a flying carpet. Just you wait and see!


May as well use a trebuchet...


----------



## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

FeXL said:


> May as well use a trebuchet...


Had to look that one up. The wonderful part of being senile is that you re-larn something new every day.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

So they finally found the Vikram lander.... or what's left of it.

Vikram Lander Found










(NASA)


----------



## polywog (Aug 9, 2007)

Macfury said:


> I want them to go to the moon using solar and wind power.


Entirely possible. But that raises the question, how quickly do you want them to get there?


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

polywog said:


> Entirely possible. But that raises the question, how quickly do you want them to get there?


Depends on who is going...


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*China's Chang'e-4 probe survives 500 Earth days on Moon's far side*










China's Chang'e-4 probe has survived 500 Earth days on the far side of the moon while conducting a scientific exploration of the virgin territory.

The lander and rover of the Chang'e-4 probe have resumed work for the 18th lunar day on the far side of the moon after "sleeping" during the extremely cold night.

The lander woke up at 3:25 a.m. last Sunday (Beijing time) and the rover awoke at 11:53 a.m. last Saturday. Both are in normal working order, according to the Lunar Exploration and Space Program Center of the China National Space Administration (CNSA).

The Chang'e-4 probe, launched on December 8, 2018, made the first-ever soft landing on the Von Karman Crater in the South Pole-Aitken Basin on the far side of the moon on January 3, 2019.

A lunar day equals 14 days on the Earth and a lunar night is of the same length. The Chang'e-4 probe switches to dormant mode during the lunar night due to the lack of solar power.

The rover Yutu-2, or Jade Rabbit-2, has travlled a total of 447.68 meters, and is now 292 meters away from the lander. It has conducted scientific detection on lunar rocks, the lunar soil on its track and some impact craters.

Chinese scientists used the lunar penetrating radar on Yutu-2 to study the geological structure up to 40 meters under, unveiling the secrets under the far-side surface of the moon, for more knowledge of the history of celestial collisions and volcanic activities, as well as the geological evolution on the moon.

(CGTN)​


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

https://www.theweathernetwork.com/c...gnI-xMcHZ-YbRWWYRxA3qahSpNqeMUzKhKq_5GBF58hTw

Let us hope for a successful flight.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Looking forward to watching this today - best stream is usually SpaceX's own Webcast.

SpaceX has also updated their website - finally - with lots of pretty pictures, detail on Moon / Mars / Manned Spaceflight missions.


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

CubaMark said:


> Looking forward to watching this today - best stream is usually SpaceX's own Webcast.
> 
> SpaceX has also updated their website - finally - with lots of pretty pictures, detail on Moon / Mars / Manned Spaceflight missions.


Mission scrubbed due to weather. Better safe than sorry.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

I keep imagining Elon Musk with a sledge hammer testing the spacecraft windows before the launch...


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

I read a comment on another blog today whereby the commenter noted that if it came down to a choice between an asteroid hitting the planet or the last SpaceX rocket ship leaving earth, he'd take his chances with the asteroid.

I have difficulty disagreeing with him...


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

China's Yutu-2 rover is still going strong, on the far side of the moon...










[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1C0-_MVjBDM&feature=emb_logo[/ame]


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*China's sample-return Moon mission touches down*

_China has successfully put another probe on the Moon._

Its robotic Chang'e-5 mission touched down a short while ago with the aim of collecting samples of rock and dust to bring back to Earth.

The venture has targeted Mons Rümker, a high volcanic complex in a nearside region known as Oceanus Procellarum.

The lander is expected to spend the next couple of days examining its surroundings and gathering up surface materials.

It has a number of instruments to facilitate this, including a camera, spectrometer, radar, a scoop and a drill.

The intention is to package about 2kg of "soil", or regolith, to send up to an orbiting vehicle that can then transport the samples to Earth.

It's 44 years since this was last achieved. That was the Soviet Luna 24 mission, which picked up just under 200g.

(...)

Reports from China suggest the effort to retrieve surface samples may last no longer than a couple of days. Any retrieved materials will be blasted back into orbit on the ascent portion of the landing mechanism, and then transferred across to the service vehicle and placed in the return module.

The orbiter will shepherd the return module to the Earth's vicinity, jettisoning it to make an atmospheric entry and landing in the Siziwang Banner grasslands of the autonomous region of Inner Mongolia. This is where China's astronauts also return to Earth.

"Chang'e-5 is a very complex mission," commented Dr James Carpenter, exploration science coordinator for human and robotic exploration at the European Space Agency.

"I think it's extremely impressive what they're trying to do. And what I think is fascinating is you see this very systematic, step by step approach to increasing their exploration capabilities - from the early Chang'e missions to this latest one."

(BBC / Twitter)​


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Video - Chang'e-5 lander, drilling, sample collecting on the moon:

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Py5cndfk3Jw[/ame]


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*China's Chang'e-5 probe completes drilling, sealing of lunar samples
*
The Chang'e-5 spacecraft has sealed up soil samples obtained from beneath the Moon's surface, and is ready to continue collecting more samples from the surface, the China National Space Administration (CNSA) said Wednesday. 

After making a successful soft landing at 11:00 p.m. BJT on Tuesday, the lander started rolling out its solar panel wings and unlocking some of the payloads onboard to prepare for sample collection. 

The lander first drilled a 2-meter-deep hole, digging out soil, and sealed it up at 4:53 a.m. on Wednesday. Next, it will use its robotic arms to scoop up more samples from the lunar surface for backup.

These samples, expected to weigh about 2 kilograms, will be sealed in what scientists have described as a long "sausage-like package". 

"Samples have to be sealed up in case any contamination occurs during the course back to earth," Luan Enjie, the chief commander of China's first lunar mission told CCTV. "The Moon environment is very different from the Earth, so samples need to be stored in a very clean container," he added.

These precious soils obtained from the Moon are expected to provide information about its geological evolution and offer insights into solar activities in the universe, according to the mission team.

The Chang'e-5 probe includes a lander, ascender, orbiter, and return vehicle. The sealed packages will be stored in the ascender, which will lift off from the Moon's surface to transfer the samples to the returner and orbiter waiting in lunar orbit. The unmanned rendezvous and docking in lunar orbit will be the first such task conducted by China. 

At the proper time, the returner will then separate from the orbiter and carry the samples back to Earth, finally landing in north China's Inner Mongolia. 

(CCGN)​


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

> "The Moon environment is very different from the Earth..."


Yowza!


----------



## polywog (Aug 9, 2007)

Macfury said:


> Yowza!


I guess they aren't using the same sets as the US did?


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

For those who can't get enough of the moon - here's a nicely designed page dedicated to our closest celestial neighbour:

*Our Moon*


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

*
At the request of the incoming Biden Administration, NASA loaned the Moon rock that was put on display in the Oval Office Jan. 20. It is from the Lunar Sample Laboratory Facility at NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston*










(NASA)

Perhaps a harbinger of where US spaceflight is going to go under Biden?


----------



## wonderings (Jun 10, 2003)

I have to say I am more interested in the moon and putting people back on it before Mars. I feel like the moon is way more achievable and something people could actually come back from and maybe even have a slight chance of helping if something goes wrong. Mars is just a one way trip with help being at least 9 months out, or whatever the travel time is.


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

wonderings said:


> I feel like the moon is way more achievable and something people could actually come back from and maybe even have a slight chance of helping if something goes wrong.


The lunar events of 1999 have all but been forgotten by many, but still fresh in my mind:





+
YouTube Video









ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

I'm still miffed that this went nowhere,


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

I had no idea...!

I recently saw a short epilogue featuring "Sandra" purporting to be the final transmission from Moonbase Alpha. It's been kicking around for quite some time, but always escaped me.


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Macfury said:


> I had no idea...!
> 
> I recently saw a short epilogue featuring "Sandra" purporting to be the final transmission from Moonbase Alpha. It's been kicking around for quite some time, but always escaped me.


Yes - "The FInal Message from Moonbase Alpha". I came across that a couple of years ago - a nice treat.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKrjyjfbprM[/ame]


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Meanwhile, on the far side of the moon....

Andrew Jones

@AJ_FI

_The sun rose over the two Chang'e-4 spacecraft on the lunar far side in the last couple of hours. Yutu-2 should kick off lunar day 27 activities tomorrow evening UTC, with the lander following ~24 hrs later. Yutu-2 will scope out this curious m̶o̶n̶o̶l̶i̶t̶h̶ rock soon (BACC)_


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

There's a new China spaceflight newsletter to keep us abreast of their activities: 

*China News Update*


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Interesting development today....

*China, Russia Announce Plan To Build Moon Research Station*

China and Russia have announced plans to work together to construct a lunar research station, an ambitious first-ever such space project between the two countries. 

Russia's Roscosmos and China's National Space Administration – the two countries' respective equivalents of NASA – announced a preliminary agreement on Tuesday to jointly develop the research facility, known as the International Lunar Research Station, or ILRS. The heads of the two space agencies signed a memorandum of understanding in a ceremony conducted via teleconference.

The proposed station, which once complete would be open to use by other countries, "is a comprehensive scientific experiment base with the capability of long-term autonomous operation," according to a statement released by China's space agency.

The station will be "built on the lunar surface and/or on the lunar orbit," the statement said, and will carry out activities such as "lunar exploration and utilization, lunar-based observation, basic scientific experiment and technical verification." 

In a similar but separate statement, Roscosmos said Russia and China "will jointly develop a Roadmap for the creation" of the station, and "conduct close interaction in planning, justification, design, development, implementation, [and] operation [of] the project ... including its presentation to the world space community."

*(**NPR**)*​*

See also: *
*Russia turns away from NASA, says it will work with China on a Moon base*
*China wants a long-term presence on the Moon in the 2030s.*
(ArsTechnica)


----------



## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

The part where they say



> The station will be "built on the lunar surface and/or on the lunar orbit...


makes me thnk this plan is mostly lunar dust.


----------

