# What are you retentive about?



## Moscool (Jun 8, 2003)

Many of us have a bee under our bonnet about something. 

For my part, I'm not too fussed about approximative spelling (as re-reading my posts shows!). It's not about punctuation: I am still learning thanks to this fine book.

No, the one thing that gets me going is the incorrect use of the apostrophe... For instance, find the error on ehMac's front page... For all things apostrophic, have a look at the reference here.

What's your pet peeve?


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Lateness. I hate it when someone is late for no real reason. I try to be 5 minutes early for nearly everything. That is my pet peeve #1. #2 are politicians who waste our tax dollars on needless "junkets" to various exotic areas. #3 is littering.


----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

lack of honesty
economy of words


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Moscool,

A rule of thumb I was taught many years ago was this:

If you use 's after any word, stop and substitute the word "is" for the apostrophe. If it doesn't make sense, it is likely wrong.

Therefore on the ehMac front page both the words "Canada's" and "Today's" become suspect.

I like Dr. G. cannot abide late people. They drive me crazy.

Cheers


----------



## Hankman (Sep 26, 2003)

People who do not use turn signals.
People on their cell phones and driving.
People who only brush the snow off their front windshield and nothing else.
People driving $$$$ SUVs in downtown Toronto and do the above.


----------



## _Outcast_ (Oct 17, 2003)

> Therefore on the ehMac front page both the words "Canada's" and "Today's" become suspect.


But the apostrophe in these cases is used to show possession and is therefore correct.

Don't get me started on people who use random capitalization and misplaced commas..... English, the forgotten language.


----------



## Pamela (Feb 20, 2003)

yes, outcase is correct. The apostrophe 's' also refers to possession.

ex. The dog wagged it's tail. (you couldn't use the aforementioned trick of substituting "it is" in this sentence, however it is still correct.

That's probably the only grammar/punctuation thing I know...that and that "a lot" is spelled just like that...not "alot". My 9th grade teacher drilled that one into us!


----------



## Moscool (Jun 8, 2003)

Hey Pamela

I'm afraid your doggie example is incorrect. It should be *its* tail (his own tail, as opposed to it is tail), Sinc's rule therefore works. The mistake on the front I was alluding to is:

Photo*'s* and discussions about the Macworld San Francisco!


----------



## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

I'm a fan of the following use of the apostrophe in the possesive sense, as in, "The Queens' corgi was mauled to death by Princess Annes' terrier".

It seems that we are all too ready to dispose or ignore the nuances of our written languages despite their construction over many hundreds of years. This is not the same as the introduction of new words or meanings, or colloquialisms. It 's also not simply pompous.


----------



## sharkman (Nov 26, 2002)

Where shall I begin?

Okay ,how about this: miss-use of the written forms of "then" and "than".

ie — "If it's bigger 'then' a breadbox, 'than' it probably isn't a breadbox."

This really drives me up the wall.







I see it alot and I just–don't–get how people don't get it.









Just one of many.


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

Poor usage of spelling and grammar drives me nuts, especially with those folks whose native tongue is English. _Arrggh._

People with cellphones glued to their heads while attempting to negotiate a lane change on the 401 at rush hour, or a left at a busy intersection.

TV networks like TBS Superstation who casually butcher movies with its brutal _eight minutes of film, five minutes of commercials/i] pattern. Especially when they edit out content simply to jam more ads into a given time slot. Death to these culture-shredding vampires.

There, that's three; I'll stop now.

(;->))_


----------



## Macified (Sep 18, 2003)

People who say "Nucular" when, in fact, they are saying "Nuclear".

Since we all seem to be annoyed by minor gramar issues, can anyone tell me if the use of commas in my first sentence/paragraph is correct. It is my assumption and understanding that the use of "in fact" is an aside and addition to the sentence and, therefore, is blocked by commas. 

The secong paragraph should be read in your best Rex Murphy voice. Which, by the way, adds to my second pet peeve. People who, like Rex Murphy, take 500 word to say what can be said much more clearly in 50. Superfluous is the word I believe.


----------



## JumboJones (Feb 21, 2001)

I think mine has to be those who think that NO SMOKING signs don't apply to them!  

As well as those who think just because they have a 4-wheel drive SUV they're invincable in any weather and can therefore drive however they wish.  

And finally those who drive expensive foreign cars and complain about how much their insurance is.


----------



## _Outcast_ (Oct 17, 2003)

The word 'got' is a legitimate word. The way people sometimes use it leaves a lot to be desired. 

Whenever I hear someone say something like "I got to go" I cringe. It should be "I've got to go." I need to look up why though as it's been a few years since high school. I know that "I got to go" would be acceptable if someone had asked if you were able to attend the opera or some other event that you thought you might not have been able to. "Did you go to the opera?" "Yes, I got to go."

At this point it's late and I'm in need of sleep.


----------



## Moscool (Jun 8, 2003)

Dictionnary defines Have got to as a colloquial form of Have to (originin unknown, perhaps s.o. has a bigger dictionnary...). Not to be confused with the preterit of to get. Example at the opera above is a correct use of to get. In all other cases, try to replace with 'have to' and see if it works/sounds right. Isn't grammar bags of fun?


----------



## Aurora (Sep 25, 2001)

My biggest peeve is people who don't think it important to spell correctly on the internet. In particular, proper use of loose and lose.
Cheers,


----------



## Macified (Sep 18, 2003)

One more thing. No offence intended to previous posters.

Using the word "like". It was funny in Finding Nemo (You are all like, whoa. And then you were like WHOA. And then you were like whooooa.).

Please come up with a creative way to get around using 'like'. When I sometimes catch myself falling into this common pattern, I slow down and rework my sentences to support alternatives.


----------



## _Outcast_ (Oct 17, 2003)

> My biggest peeve is people who don't think it important to spell correctly on the internet. In particular, proper use of loose and lose.


I'm with you on this one as well. I'd actually broaden it to include any form of communication, not just the internet. I once had a manager at work send me an email that I could barely understand. It was full of spelling mistakes, random capitalization, and, apart from commas up the yin-yang, no other punctuation. When I explained to him that his email was unclear and difficult to understand he turned to me and said, "So what? Spelling don't matter. You know what I meant." To which I replied, "If I had known what you meant would we be having this converstaion right now?" He just shook his head as if I were the idiot and walked away. This was a man who was making a six figure salary yet he failed to recognize the importance of proper communication skills. Scary.

The other one that you hear all the time is this, "There's a few things I want to go over." Shouldn't that be "There *are* a few things I want to go over???" I hear this all the time on the radio, on the TV news, everywhere. Since when did singular and plural forms become interchangeable?

[ January 19, 2004, 05:45 PM: Message edited by: _Outcast_ ]


----------



## sharkman (Nov 26, 2002)

"...isn't "alot" supposed to be " a lot" hey sharkman??"








Touché imtk.









Hey, I never claimed to not be the bane of someone else's frustration. In fact, aside from almost always miss-spelling "alot", I also know I have trouble with:

its, it's and its',
someone, somebody, everybody

and others that don't come to mind at the moment.  
Ain't the English language grand?


----------



## gordguide (Jan 13, 2001)

Spelling, punctuation (not quite as much but it's all part of the same thing) and overall butchery of the English language is pretty annoying.

My writing style is, apparently, not exactly proper. Like that last sentence. Or that last sentence. Or this one.

But style is different than spelling and punctuation, and we pretty much have to tolerate a wide variety of styles these days.

I blame advertising. Little, if any, commerical copy would pass my Grade 5 English teacher's scrutiny without corrections.

Our beloved computers have to take some of the flack as well. Words like iTunes really don't exist in a proper world of English.

I'm willing to concede that English is a living language, and evolves as we use it. So, if iTunes ever becomes proper and accepted, fine. Some other grammatical errors will never be accepted (I hope).

As for my other peeves:
Using windchill temperatures on the radio and TV exclusively. I don't mind if we get both. If you go from the house to your car in the attached garage, and then to protected parking, you haven't experienced the windchill temp for even a second. How cold was it then? Nobody knows.

What if I want to know if my car will start? Windchill has no effect on cars left overnight. I will admit that the wind will cool a car off faster if you've had it warmed up by driving recently; but it can never go below the actual air temperature no matter what. Ever. The windchill temp is most certainly not the air temperature.

I actually heard my TV announcer tell me it was -100 F in Maine last week. Give me a break.

Sorry to the guys who complained about people who just babble on and on. Guilty.

[ January 19, 2004, 10:21 AM: Message edited by: gordguide ]


----------



## TroutMaskReplica (Feb 28, 2003)

i hate it when people talk about the 'impact' that something will have on something else. everybody started saying it at the same time, in about the late 1990's.

ie., what impact will september 11 have on our way of life?

why can't you say, 'how will sept 11 affect our way of life?'

does anyone find my lack of caps annoying? it's because i never learned to type properly, and i'm about 10x faster using lower case.


----------



## Ingenu (Jun 4, 2003)

- Poor spelling drives me nut (I'm a proofreader). I guess it's obvious I'm talking about french spelling and grammar, since my knowledge of english is less than satisfactory.

- As Hankman, people who do not use turn signals.

- Scooter drivers in France-they're REALLY dangerous (next time I go there, I'm bringing my carbine).

- My cats chewing plastic wrapping.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

People that worry about minor grammar when posting online.  

Personally I'd rather have the thoughts and the contribution as opposed to the perfect rendition.

•••
People who don't realize that talking on a cell phone when using a headset is exactly the same as talking with a friend standing there. Don't stare it's rude. My community is different than yours - get used to it.  

People who don't use headsets when driving.  

Lurkers who don't contribute  

Houses that are showpieces instead of living/working spaces. ( you know plastic on the sofa )









Community design that does not include working and living areas intermingled


----------



## MaxPower (Jan 30, 2003)

I'M SURPRISED THAT NO ONE MENTIONED THE FACT WHEN SOMEONE SENDS AN EMAIL OR TYPES IN CAPITALS.

One of my biggest pet peeves.

That, and when someone puts two spaces after a sentence to start a new sentence.

It's called kerning. Computers are not typewriters.


----------



## Sonal (Oct 2, 2003)

Well, I'm a marketing writer, so there are some particular writing errors that drive me nuts. I'm forgiving of most typos (I make many of them myself) but I detest the following:

</font>
*utilize* - 99.99% of the time, the word you want here is _use_. (The 0.01% case, is in computer performance analysis where utilization and usage have subtly distinct meanings.)</font>
*irregardless* - the word you want here is _regardless_. Irregardless means "not without regard" = "with regard".</font>
*flammable* - the word _inflammable_ means "able to inflame." Unfortunately, people everywhere (who probably use "irregardless") thought it meant "not flame-able", hence the word "flammable" appearing on packaging everywhere.</font>
*till* - when being used as _until_. There's a guy I edit for who WILL NOT understand this.</font>
*it's / its* - the former is a contraction for _it is_. The latter is possessive. Yes, the possessive form is different from the most other possessives. English is weird.</font>
*between you and I* - it's _between you and me_. You wouldn't say "between you and she", you'd say "between you and her".</font>
*alright* - this is not a word, contrary to what many people think from their experience with "already". You should use _all right_.</font>
There are more, but those are my top few.

I'll concede that the degree to which writing errors drive me nuts varies with the context -- on a forum is one thing, in a printed glossy is another. Though I'll never understand people who post messages without using any capitals. It does not take long to press "shift" and it makes everything so much more readable.

Errors in a dictionary REALLY drives me crazy. Dictionaries can be wrong. Some dictionaries will add words based on how people commonly use them, without regard to whether or not that usage is correct. Yes, words evolve, but some things that are wrong just stay wrong.


----------



## Hankman (Sep 26, 2003)

I am surprised no one has mentioned Windoze users who still say their platform is THE BEST.


----------



## BabeBetty (Nov 5, 2001)

Pet peeves... hmmm...


"Expresso". It's ESPRESSO, people!!

Corrupt CEO's. ie Conrad Black.  


Misuse of the word "literally".
"I literally DIED!"
No, you didn't, honey.

Noisy broken wheels on shopping carts. Doesn't that just make you wild?!

Obnoxious, badly-behaved dogs (more a peeve towards the owners.)

Minor peeve: That Apple has made the iTunes music store available to Windows users, but not OS 9 users.

Bigotry.


----------



## imactheknife (Aug 7, 2003)

I am a grammer idiot, but isn't "alot" supposed to be " a lot" hey sharkman??







every one has a pet peeve when it comes to grammer, but they oftan have issues of thier own!. 

My dad HATES the word "got" and every time I say it he is like thats not a word! Yet 5 minutes later he's like I got to go? or Look what I just got! I am like ya Moron listen to yourself! hehe he's not a moron really!

My biggest pet peeve is people who don't know the "rules of the road" and please if you need to take drivers ed DO IT over again! and stop the stupid driving, better yet learn to do it right!

cheers, Mark

[ January 19, 2004, 01:12 AM: Message edited by: imactheknife ]


----------



## _Outcast_ (Oct 17, 2003)

> I am surprised no one has mentioned Windoze users who still say their platform is THE BEST.


Because that's not just irsksome, it's downright offensive.









[ January 19, 2004, 02:27 PM: Message edited by: _Outcast_ ]


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Just a reminder......".It's the thought counts"  

There are many who are dyslexic or poor typers and holding them to a standard discourages online interaction.
It doesn't have to be chat level short cutting.

Sometimes if I'm moderating I will clean up a slip just as a courtesy but as above it's the thought........

That said I agree that being persnickety about spelling language use can be more persuasive in an an argued point. But the question was ahem ....retentive.


----------



## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Boy...ehmax must be squirming around in his chair while reading this particular thread. 









I'm pretty easy about spelling a lot of the time. I get the idea and, like macdoc, I'm more interested in what the person has to say. I also think that more of the lurkers should speak up and post something. Anything!

My biggest pet peeve?

People who say "ECK CETERA" when the term is actually "ET CETERA".

I have no idea why this bugs me so much, but it does. The aforementioned "nucular" instead of "nuclear" is a close second in bugabilty for me.

As are people who insist on pronouncing NASA as NASSAU (which is the capital of the Bahamas).

This isn't bad spelling, it's lazy pronouncation. 

Me no like. So there.


----------



## MaxPower (Jan 30, 2003)

One more thing:

People who break for no apparent reason.


----------



## Goobernatorial (Sep 24, 2003)

> "...isn't "alot" supposed to be " a lot" hey sharkman??"
> 
> Touché imtk.
> 
> Hey, I never claimed to not be the bane of someone else's frustration. In fact, aside from almost always miss-spelling "alot"


You've misspelled misspelling.


----------



## kps (May 4, 2003)

I know my own spelling and grammar are in need of improvement, but my biggest peeve in that respect is the incorrect use of:

*your
you're
their
they're
*


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

A great many people also misspell the word "misspell". They're found here and there, and their miscues are oftentimes ignored. This is why I urge my students to utilize interactive journals with their primary/elementary grade students. This way, they are able to model the expected spellings of certain words in an indirect manner.


----------



## TroutMaskReplica (Feb 28, 2003)

Another thing that really bothers me is that, despite all of our wondrous technological advances, a coffee carafe that doesn't spill when poured has not been invented yet.

I write this with a big wet coffee stain on my pants.


----------



## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

An abridged list of things that irk me...

*Misuse of:*
It's, its
You're, your, yore
Course, coarse
There, their, they're...

*All use of:*
Phat, lite, nite, awesome, actually, surf, hack, ax (as in "can I ax you a question?"), nucular, Febuary, oh _really?_, bling-bling, bootylicious, so I'm like, get real, heads-up, whatever, jiggy...

*Behaviour*:
- Compulsive/meaningless cellular phone (over)usage,
- Cellular phone usage while driving,
- Acts of personal grooming while on the commuter train such as nail filing/clipping, shaving, application of make-up, flossing of teeth,
- Excessive, meaningless hand-gestures while talking,
- People whose voices I don't recognize calling me at work, saying "hi it's me",
- People who call me at work and put me on hold right away,
- People whose headphones are playing at such a high volume that you can tell what they're listening to from 20 feet away,
- People who e-mail me at work, only to call me 5 minutes later to ask if I received their e-mail message...

_There, that should do for now._


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Hmmm sounds like a pro and con cell phone thread might keep the kitchen cosy


----------



## Goobernatorial (Sep 24, 2003)

I hate people who drive in my blindspot. Especially on the DVP when I'm trying to merge after coming from the off ramp.


----------



## Guinness (Jan 4, 2002)

... that idiot who decides to change his order after getting to the Tim Hortons drive in window!

Mike


----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

> Hmmm sounds like a pro and con cell phone thread might keep the kitchen cosy


and to put a political spin on it, just because...

how about neo-cons using cell phones while driving their cars?


----------



## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

HEY!!







 

I don't have a cellphone. And I rarely drive a car. 

So THERE!


----------



## hmto (Jul 4, 2003)

My pet peeves in no particular order:

--12 items in the 5 item express checkout aisle;
--automated solicitation calls-hang up before they get the chance to talk;
--cell phone usage while driving;
--thread crappers;
--annoying check engine light on dash;
--polyphonic ring tones;
--slow golfers;
--binary printing errors;
--too many to list not enough time


----------



## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

- The mispronunciation of nuclear as "nu-key-lar" (agh!);
- Editors who insist on capping the words "web," "email" and "internet" (to which I always respond sarcastically: "Oh just like we need to cap the words "television," "radio," and "newspaper?");
- Those who, when referring to a date, still insist on adding the prefix "the year" (i.e., we expect the economy to recover by the year 2005). That's so 1974...


----------



## BigDL (Apr 16, 2003)

I was not going to weigh in on this heady debate as I thought other people would be all over this topic however I was wrong. Maybe it’s just me, regardless, here I go.

The subject parking.

The people that park their vehicle so that it takes up the maximum number of parking spots. Seems to occur most often at peak traffic times in a store/coffee shop parking lot.

When it snows people loose the ability to judge. If the painted line are not there they park so that three cars take up the space of 7 or 8 cars. They leave enough room between vehicles so that you can park a vehicle between them but you could never open a doors not even a little bit.

The people that “invent” a parking spot often on painted islands in a relatively empty parking lot or otherwise park to block another vehicle in.

Parking within 6 feet of the curb usually at a corner or park on an angle so the nose of the vehicle is blocking the sidewalk and the rear end blocking the street.

It makes me soooo angry I could squash a grape!


----------



## Lawrence (Mar 11, 2003)

Speeding school buses...

It really irks me that these guys and gals can zip up and down
our residential streets as fast as they like without fear of being
pulled over for speeding.

It also bothers me to see them rolling over the corners of a
sidewalk when the bus is too big for the street they are turning
from and into, Who says these 40 passenger buses can't go
where ever they like.

Yesterday I saw a school bus rolling down the street half on the
road and half on the sidewalk, The street was too narrow for
the school bus to pass another school bus coming in the other
direction.

The hazards of being a D.I.N.K. couple in a school bus neighbourhood.

Dave


----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

> --slow golfers


amen brother
especially annoying when playing "twilight rates"


----------



## Moscool (Jun 8, 2003)

Hey HMTO

What do you mean by 


> thread crappers


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

> --annoying check engine light on dash;


Do you think maybe this might mean your car needs to be repaired?


----------



## sharkman (Nov 26, 2002)

> I hate people who drive in my blindspot. Especially on the DVP when I'm trying to merge after coming from the off ramp.


Geez Goober, it is YOUR blind spot. Shouldn't you be the one keeping an eye on it? (No pun intended.)


----------



## Caillou (Jun 9, 2003)

1. Bad pronounciation:
A case in French: aréoport and aéroport... Well I guess that knowing how to pronounce it properly will be irrelevant when we will get into the habit of calling airports by their branded name. Pearson. Trudeau, etc.

2. Stupid government decisions:
One of many: P.E. Trudeau Airport. The very same guy who wanted to shut down Dorval 20 years ago. Is this a joke? (Should this be another thread on its own ?)

3. Indeed, the Engine Check light on my Volks.

4. Telemarketing calls between 6 pm and 7:30 pm while having to deal with dinner, the kids homeworks, baths and nighty-night routine. ARRRRRHHHHH !

5. And so many more, but as an old chineese man told me once: "Ve'ly, ve'ly small details in you'l life young man."


----------



## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

Minor one I have, but still annoying... 

When people end a sentence with a word or two in quotes, and put the period _outside the quote._ Incorrect Example: ".....period". Correct Example: " .....period." 

Annoying, at least to me, to read.


----------



## Pamela (Feb 20, 2003)

...all things related to driving in Vancouver.

As soon as I got back from Barcelona this summer I realized I felt more uptight than usual. Turns out it's because I didn't use one vehicle while I was there.

As soon as I got back on the road (as a passenger at that!) in Vancouver I was instantly stressed out.

Come on Vancouver...wake up! Let's get some decent transit already!

....that and Spanish/Mexican restaurants. I have no idea how they decide that these two cuisines should be grouped together. A total insult to my heritage.


----------



## Ingenu (Jun 4, 2003)

> quote:
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> --slow golfers
> 
> ...


I should add : golfers driving when you are at 200 yards-I just keep the ball.  

Don't they understand it's dangerous?


----------



## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

On writing/web discussion:

People whom don't at least try to use correct grammar, punctuation and spelling. I don't claim to be perfect, but I at least try.

I really hate when people over use smileys in forum posts and instant messaging services. A well placed 'rotf' is one thing, but 6 of them is distracting at best.

People who respond to big long posts with a single line.

On Driving:

People who cut other people off.
People who speed up to get in front of traffic only to slow down to a crawl.
People who go slower than the speed limit. I don't really mind if you are doing 95 in an 80 zone, but I _hate_ when people go 65 in an 80 zone.
People who go slow in the left most lane on the highway/freeway.


----------



## Chealion (Jan 16, 2001)

Tiny cramped Regional Jets run by Canada Jazz and made by Bombardier. It makes a 2 hour flight, 2 hours of hell.


----------



## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

The Bombardier jets are luxury compared with the twin prop things they use for local flights - you need strong ear plugs and a coat.

"I should add : golfers driving when you are at 200 yards-I just keep the ball. Don't they understand it's dangerous?"

(Shoot, does the question mark go inside or outside of the quotes when quoting another posting?).

Yes, that pisses me off, especially when they are also driving in my blind-spot and over the speed limit in Vancouver with their dashboard engine light on and no indicators.


----------



## TroutMaskReplica (Feb 28, 2003)

i effing hate it when people on the 400 series highways wait until their lane runs out to change lanes. or they race ahead on the tapered part at lane's end to get ahead when traffic is jammed.

airport taxi's drivers are terrible for this. 

i hate it when you're stopped at a red light in the through lane, and some twit driving a '91 honda civic in the right turn lane floors his underpowered car to race around you. his car isn't fast enough to do this so you have to hit your brakes to let him in or he'll hit the curb or some parked cars on the other side.

if anyone here does this you should go right now to the nearest provincial offences office and turn in your licence. there is no excuse for this.


----------



## Ingenu (Jun 4, 2003)

> Yes, that pisses me off, especially when they are also driving in my blind-spot and over the speed limit in Vancouver with their dashboard engine light on and no indicators.


Is it ironic, or my english is THAT bad?


----------



## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Ingenu, one of the beauties of language (and fundamental to much British comedy) is the double entendre.... even better when spoken (such as in asking to buy four candles and being given fork handles).


----------



## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

- Having to wait for what seems like an eternity while the person ahead of me does 3 weeks' worth of banking transactions at an automatic teller, when all I want to do is withdraw $20 and be on my way,

- Missing Jeopardy!


----------



## LGBaker (Apr 15, 2002)

I have thought long and hard about this topic. At the beginning, my list was long and I began to feel like one of those prickly little pufferfish - all bloated behind pursed lips. I also began to worry that I was unusually retentive, but my analyst reassured me on this score.

So, I have distilled all those irksome, infuriating social interactions that we experience every day into the "essence of retentivity", sort of a "rose water" of my life.

I really don't appreciate those people who are so thoroughly conditioned that they abandon whatever they and I are involved with....to answer the telephone as soon as it beckons. This is rude.


----------



## Pamela (Feb 20, 2003)

Two more things to add after having the day I've had...

1. Those who either don't know how to do their job or those who are really bad at their job. (ie. Having to do someone else's job for them.)

2. The Canadian dollar is down when you want it to be up, and up when you want it to be down. *sigh*


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

> People who respond to big long posts with a single line.


I have seen cases where there is far more wisdom in a single line post than in the total post of 500 words it follows.

Cheers


----------



## Ingenu (Jun 4, 2003)

> Ingenu, one of the beauties of language (and fundamental to much British comedy) is the double entendre.... even better when spoken (such as in asking to buy four candles and being given fork handles).


In german, there's also the "Ich heisse" (my name is) and "scheisse" (or something like that) that mean "sh*t". When you're learning german, you must be very careful, because the pronounciation is nearly the same.

That's pretty much what I remember from my german class...  

It's silly, but I can't think of any double entendre in french...  

Regards


----------



## Tait Kahray (Jan 22, 2004)

The retention thread is good enough to push this newbie into contributing (rather than just lurking).

Since I agree so much with most of the posts, particularly on grammar, driving and cell phones, I am obviously much more retentive than I realized. Here are some that really get to me that I haven't seen here:

A- people who focus every fibre of their being into verifying each price being run up on the cash register only to be totally unprepared to pay once the total has been presented. Startled, they immediately root around in a large pocket book and eventually pull out - their cheque-book... 

B- the loss of the singular term "saving" in advertising. Somehow, a single transaction that costs less becomes semi-pluralized because it involves money. "That's a savings of $5.00!" To me, if you saved one cent or a million dollars that one time, you saved it once and it's a saving, not a savings.

C- being told about something that is "x times less!!" If it's two times less, does that mean it's half as much? Am I being left in the information dust because I had the Old Math in school or is advertising four times less literate than it needs to be?

Ca - speaking of "two times", at least when it applies to more, whatever happened to "twice"?

Enough for now - time to see I've done this right.


----------



## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Hi Talt,

Your post reminded me of the insanity of prices that end in 99 cents. I know why its done, but it's a form of insult to our intelligence. I also hate the hidden costs associated with everything we buy. In the UK VAT is 25% but its included in the marked prices. You know exactly what the cost is at the check-out (or "till" as the Brits say). Take a typical Ontario restaurant check with PST, GST and liquor tax and variable tip. Oh, and that's another thing. Why are people so stingy with tips? Many people depend on this money for their income and their hourly wages reflect this.

Airline fares are even worse since there are so many hidden costs that it's almost impossible to predict the final tally (although supposedly this is changing).


----------



## Tait Kahray (Jan 22, 2004)

Knowing the posted price is all-inclusive is just great. I had that experience in Amsterdam and I think Stockholm as well. If we can do it for gasoline here, why not everything else? It even makes tipping easier









I agree with you on airline fares and extend it to telecom services: ordinary (POTS) telephone, wireless and cable. Hidden obligatory charges, packages too complex for even the sales staff to get right, bundles to lure you into multiple service traps...constant shell games.


----------



## JumboJones (Feb 21, 2001)

It actually wouldn't make tipping easier because you are only obligated to tip on the subtotal BEFORE taxes.

As for being stingy on tips, I concider myself a fair tipper, especially in restaurants. But what I hate is tipping at a bar that already charges you $4-6 for a beer. Especially if I had to go up to the bar to get it myself! I mean all you did was turn around, grab a beer and take the cap off, what kind of tip does this warrent? 

But be cautious with tipping though, it is up to the restaurant whether they keep the tips or allow the servers to have them. As well it is stupid that most don't tip out the kitchen staff, which work a hell of a lot harder than wait staff and only get a couple of dollars more an hour.

[ January 23, 2004, 01:10 PM: Message edited by: JumboJones ]


----------



## Moscool (Jun 8, 2003)

Given the focus on grammar and punctuation in this thread, I checked if my reference book on the subject was available in Canada. Not yet, but you can pre-order it at Amazon. This is what it looks like:










A must!


----------



## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

I just remembered on on my way to class this morning. 

People who walk under awnings with their umbrellas when it is raining, and wont make way for the people without umbrellas. Really pisses me off.


----------



## TroutMaskReplica (Feb 28, 2003)

some work related gripes:

1) megolomaniac brand managers that think they're designers.

2) inexperienced/dumb prepress people basically running their own departments, while their bosses lack the technical expertise to oversee them properly. this seems to be the norm in the print industry.

3) prepress people and their supervisors that don't think to compare the supplied printed output to their screen/printed output before calling us to do an approval. if you've effed it up don't bother calling us, stupid.

3) getting a disc from an agency and finding their elaborate workgroup scheme has led them to put 5000 files on a CD that should contain 2 or 3 files and a font folder, and all of the file names are made of cryptic 12 digit numbers. and after spending considerable time trying to sort out the mess, finding they've done it wrong and we'll have to go through the whole mess again.


----------



## JumboJones (Feb 21, 2001)

I'm sorry I have to add people who don't flush toilets/urinals. This is just ignorant, and you should be locked in the washroom to suffer the smell of your own filth.


----------



## mbaldwin (Jan 20, 2003)

> People who walk under awnings with their umbrellas when it is raining, and wont make way for the people without umbrellas. Really pisses me off.


Spoken like a true Vancouverite.  

I began to hate umbrellas and the people that use them after only a few weeks of living here. I'm 6'3''. A large part off Vancouver's umbrella-using population is 5'0' to 5'6'. That puts their umbrellas right at face height for me. I've lost count of how many times I had to put up my hand or jump out of the way because someone "forgot" that they carrying a pointy weapon above their head.  Of course, these are usually the same people that walk under the awnings too - all the better to corner you against a building...  

- Martin.


----------



## mbaldwin (Jan 20, 2003)

Another one:

Daily fax calls (surely by junk faxers) to voice-only phone numbers. I was getting up to 5 a day on my cell phone a few months ago.

- Martin.


----------



## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

*Spoken like a true Vancouverite. 

I began to hate umbrellas and the people that use them after only a few weeks of living here. I'm 6'3''. A large part off Vancouver's umbrella-using population is 5'0' to 5'6'. That puts their umbrellas right at face height for me.*

I feel your pain. I'm 6'4", a lot of umbrellas are right at eye level. Because people don't seem to realise that they don't need an umbrella under an awning nor that they could put my eye out, I just stop walking and stand there, making them go around me.

It sounds a little harsh I guess, but it is the only technique that works. Occasionally someone will shoot me a dirty look for making them move and I'll just smile back at them cheerfully.


----------



## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

Re: umbrellas - I'm 6'4" as well. Oy gevalt do I know what you mean. My preferred defense is a huge golf bumbershoot. _Divert full power to the forward shields!_ 

This thread is surprisingly therapeutic.


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Seems I forgot the single biggest thing that irks me.

Telemarketers!

Every time I answer the phone and hear that noise in the background from the buzz of the "phone room" I see red.
Then of course you have to say "hello" a few times before someone realizes the computer has dialed a "live one".

Grrrrrrrr


----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

best defence against tele-marketers is either an answering machine or voice mail system
oh and call display too
i know it's not right to have to pay to enjoy your privacy, but it works


----------



## BigDL (Apr 16, 2003)

MACSPECTRUM said:


> i know it's not right to have to pay to enjoy your privacy, but it works


You don’t have to pay for technology to stop tele-marketers at all.

When you pick up the phone and say hello twice and you don’t hear any back ground noise it is probably a tele-marketer. The lack of sound is the automatic dialer connecting to the next available agent. If the computer is faster and by the time you realise this is a tele-marketer and a voice states your formal name and I am calling on behalf of... No technology either case just hang up. 

The people calling don’t know you ... have you ever called them up and invited them over for a few brew and watch the game ... their not your friends just hang up and don’t worry about it.


----------



## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

That's just what I do... pick up the phone, say hello, and if there's that certain yawning chasm of silence, I immediately hang up. Haven't hung up on a legitimate phone call yet - at least, none that I know of. And I don't have to waste money on that silly tele-zapper thing. Although whatever floats your boat.

Yep, telemarketers are evil. Unsolicited phone calls, even from charity groups, really wind me up. I'd rather get junk mail than have the privacy of my home breached by some nimrod of a stranger cold-calling me simply because my number came up.


----------



## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Tait Kahray...

One of the things that I am the MOST "Retentive" about..being that I am a very visual person...is the avatar that each of us chooses to identify their personal self. I NEVER look at anyone's "score" of posts. I also NEVER look at the number that indicates when they have joined this forum. It just doesn't matter to me.

But I sure DO look at their avatar. It's the way I identify them, instantaneously. Just the way it is....

I have an avatar. A rather distinctive one. I have had it for some considerable time now, at this forum. Perhaps you would care to choose another, different, avatar. Just to avoid confusion.

If you wish to discuss this, then please PM me.


----------



## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Big DL...

You might consider reading what I have written above. Macspectrum already has dibs on that avatar. It's what I...and many others...use to identify him with at this forum.

Just a thought.


----------



## BigDL (Apr 16, 2003)

Dear Macnutt

I had a little avatar I wanted to bring to the party but I could not get to work as I have the computer dexterity equal to the hand dexterity of someone wearing boxing gloves.

The Steam engine kinda worked for me as I am a railway worker. I did not see MACSPECTRUM posting for a while and started using the avatar.

It would sure help when an avatar is taken then it can’t be used. This is not to criticize Mr. Mayor. Sorry if I offended or caused any problems for others and in particular MACSPECTRUM.

I know what you mean when I see your avatar and I agree with the text of the post I have to go back and check the name.









I have chosen a new avatar this one , believe it or not, kinda work with my workplace as well. I have not “researched” my choice and if it is in use by another please let me know.


----------



## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

Hang on a second, Macnutt. The ehMac avatars are not your property. You have no claim to them, including the one you're using. They're provided as a *courtesy* by the Mayor. If you have strong feelings about ownership, being a visual person, or making sure that your posts stand out, then the onus is on you to develop your own such that it becomes a copyrighted original work.

If this board were to operate otherwise, then there would only be enough avatars to accommodate 200 of the 2300+ members. That hardly seems right, wouldn't you agree?


----------



## Moscool (Jun 8, 2003)

Here is a big peeve: censorship, and its evil twin, hidden censorship!

Worst case by far is on flights: most movies are cut so that they don't offend anyone. Only Virgin Atlantic makes a point of showing full films. Thumbs up to them !

Everybody else nannies viewers, be it on aircraft, network TV or, sometimes, video.

What really gets up my nose is when someone decides what is appropriate and then not even bother to tell me about it! Case in point: I have seen at least three different cuts of Airplane! (yes, yes, I have seen it more than 3 times...)

- one had the scene with the little girl/the drip/the guitar cut off
- another had the automatic pilot BJ scene removed

(I have actually never seen this film uncut since the theatre release)

On North American network TV, there is often censorship to make more space for commercials (!!!). In the UK you get these infuriating 'may be edited' for language, nudity, etc. so you never actually know if you have seen the real thing or not.

The hypocrisy is that TV here operates a 'watershed' system by which all mature content is supposed to be shown after 9p.m. Nothing wrong with that: just don't censor the damned thing!


----------



## Macified (Sep 18, 2003)

On the topic of telemarketers and fax spam......

I hate it when Bell sells access to my answering service. I have come home a couple of times only to find that I have messages from companies who did not call me. Not that I want to here from them anyway.


----------



## Sonal (Oct 2, 2003)

Regarding Telemarketers.....

Canada has recently introduced some fairly strong laws regarding personal privacy. You CAN have privacy, and it doesn't cost you.

The practical upshot is this. If a telemarketer call you, you have the following rights:
1) Find out what information they have about you, and who they got it from.
2) Have your name removed from their lists and any lists they provide information to.
3) Talk to their privacy officer (and/or the privacy officer of the company they got the info from) if you do not think your privacy concerns are being me.

As well, no company you provide personal information to is allowed to share your personal information without your consent -- you can opt out of sharing at any time. Plus, they have to tell you up front what they intend to do with your personal information, and tell if they change what they intend to do with your information.

I've used this, and it does help to reduce telemarketing calls. Plus, it can be satisfying to say: 
"I would like to know where you collected my personal information from, and then I would like to be removed from your calling lists, under the rights guaranteed to me by the Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act of 2000, Schedule A, section 3."

(No, you don't have to quote it, but it's fun to gently push back.)

You can find out more at the Privacy Commissioner's website, here: http://www.privcom.gc.ca. Provincial laws can be found via this site. And no, I'm not a lawyer.


----------



## imac&fries (Jan 16, 2004)

I have far too many hang ups to list here, which I believe speaks volumes about my personality. I do have one I'd love to share in the hope that word spreads and possibly this societal plague will end. I detest people that refuse to say "thank you" when I hold a door open for them. These very same people deserve to be hog tied and wipped to within an inch of their miserable lives. LOL

Got Milk?


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Ah now I like your nick imac& fries but I think your "thankyou" deserves an entire thread perhaps.

I would contend that you hold the door open because it satisfies your own instincts of courtesy and help, and that you can therefore be content in your action without the need for thanks.

A thankyou may be appreciated but surely should not be required for something that YOU choose to do.

It's different if you are asked - then a thankyou would be absolutely called for and you would have a right to expect one.

It's like the theory behind doing an anonymous good deed. The deed in itself gives the perpetrator satisfaction - there's the reward.
Whether it brings happiness, fulfillment joy or whatever to the other party is really beside the point and in some cases you may never know - the satisfaction is in the doing.

Why disallow yourself the happiness of your deed by pinning its success to the acknowledgement of others.

In my mind it's an important concept in disassociating something you undertake because it pleases you from getting the approbation of others for doing so.

It's a solitary pleasure as ALL things ultimately are. Recognizing that it's YOU who are being well served by holding the door open ummm er relaxes the blockage so to speak  

So going into it without expectation takes away the angst of wondering whether you will be thanked and then if you DO get thanked it makes for a pleasant surprise.

You win in either case...... instead of becoming a candidate for chrons


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

I think I understand MacDoc, or well, um, maybe, but wait, er, uh OK.

Cheers


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

"All of us could take a lesson from the weather. It pays no attention to criticism" 

Nor does it thank you when you open the door to smell the fresh air. 
You open the door because..........?? 
Doing so makes YOU feel good...  

You open the door unasked for someone because......??
Ditto

Capish...


----------



## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Touche!

Cheers


----------



## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

*I would contend that you hold the door open because it satisfies your own instincts of courtesy and help, and that you can therefore be content in your action without the need for thanks.*

Indeed, the need for thanks is not there, but where it is basic common courtesy to hold the door open it is also basic common courtesy to say "thanks" when it is held open for you.

What I don't like is when you hold the door for someone, and then 20 other people RUN to get through it while you're still holding it.

[edit: that's "20 other people" not "2 other people."]

[ January 27, 2004, 01:16 AM: Message edited by: PosterBoy ]


----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

> What I don't like is when you hold the door for someone, and then 2 other people RUN to get through it while you're still holding it.


it all adds up to lack of common courtesy and soon no courtesy at all
door openers will no longer do so
- former door opener


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Now Ghandi would call a 20 person run a blessing of good feelings.

Happy self satisfied door opener.

After you Gaston............  
It's not about them.......


----------



## Moscool (Jun 8, 2003)

But some would expect thhe thank you as proof that their value system works: I hold the door, you thank; I walk on your foot, I apologize, etc. So it answers the need for predictable social interaction...


----------



## Ingenu (Jun 4, 2003)

> I walk on your foot, I apologize, etc. So it answers the need for predictable social interaction...


In Canada, you should say : "I walk on your foot, you apologize"... That's a predictable social interaction...


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

The light dawns - I NOW understand Montreal drivers perfectly.


----------



## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

I couldn't resist sharing how I handle telemarketers. We've had a serious long-standing problem here with several who call here (sometimes as often as three times a week). While I respect everyone has a right to make a living, that does not include repeatedly harassing someone long after they have said "no thanks." So here's what I do: always sound interested for a moment and then cut them short, asking if they wouldn't mind holding for a moment. Then I go back to what ever I was doing. Hold button is optional.

Benefits: 
1. I don't get annoyed or angry, nor do I have to listen to their sales pitch for the umpteenth time;
2. My time isn't wasted;
3. Their time *is* wasted...and that hits them where it hurts;
4. It's agonizing for them unable to tell whether they have a legitimate lead so they tend to hang on just a little longer. Cruel, yes, but necessary.


----------



## lotus (Jun 29, 2002)

((pgant)) so now you know my secret to telemarketers. One night when I was very busy the phone rang continuosly, finally I answered with "hello" and put the phone down. Every now and then I would listen in and hear this woman ranting about how I wasn't letting her do her job, etc. Usually I am not that rude but my patience was exhausted.


----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

i still prefer call display
unknown, private numbers are not answered - if you don't want to share your number, i won't answer

also, if i don't recognize the number, i usually don't pick up

the legal response that tele-marketers have to respect is;
"I do not do business over the phone."
this reply is the legal definition of "get lost" and must be respected

for pollsters, i use; "i do not care to participate in surveys."
again, they must respect those words

something about CRTC regulations


----------



## lotus (Jun 29, 2002)

Macdoc, no one really understands the drivers in Montreal. Montreal is on my list of the five worst places to drive on this continent. They include LA, DC, Atlanta and maybe Detroit.


----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

try the NJ turnpike on a summer Friday afternoon
NYC is not exactly a cake walk
you wonder why the cabs have 'battering rams' on their front ends where bumpers should be?


----------



## Ingenu (Jun 4, 2003)

> Macdoc, no one really understands the drivers in Montreal. Montreal is on my list of the five worst places to drive on this continent


Hey, that's where I live!









Maybe you're just a bad driver...









Regards


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Noooooo I don't think so..just a sane one unlike many of your city mates  

Lotus I agree on LA geez Mulholland Dr= road race track and I'm aggressive.


----------



## Ingenu (Jun 4, 2003)

Not our fault, it's our latin heritage : we're passionate.  

Ahem... Am I trying to justify bad driving?


----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

i would trade montreal's bad driving for toronto's evil, not to mention montreal's fantastic food and service

i assume nobody but me drives the 400 on a summer friday afternoon?
über bad drivers


----------



## lotus (Jun 29, 2002)

Ingenu, sorry if I offended you. I moved to Montreal from Chicago and lived there for about a year. Quebec had the toughest driver's exams of any place I have lived, but I was not impressed with their driving.

My 60 yr.driving record is excellent. My worst experiences have been stopping for red lights and cross walks as I have been rear-ended three times. Now instead of slowing for a changing light I will speed to get through before the light gets to red, which is probably against the law, but I haven't been hit since.

I have driven on the Pa.turnpike, but I have never been to NYC so maybe I would change my mind.

How is the snow in Mtl?


----------



## Ingenu (Jun 4, 2003)

No offense Lotus, really  .

As for the snow... there's not any... Well, maybe a month old inch on the ground. Lot of black ice thought, because of the artic weather (it's -20 today without wind chill... AGAIN).  

Regards.


----------

