# Ontario Lottery winner justice?



## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Ray Sobeski, the worlds most selfish guy who won $30 million, waited 11 months before claiming his winnings, didn't tell his wife and then disappeared has had $15 million of his winnings frozen while a court case is under consideration. His wife is claiming half of the winnings. It seems he isn't on a yaght sunning himself in international waters but, instead, put his money into GICs..... Maybe he should have retained Macnutt as an advisor? I hope she takes him to the cleaners (and she's got some pretty good evidence to do so). His remaining $15 million may also be claimed by his two previous wives.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Too bad the guy was not bright enough to see that coming. Had he been proactive and given each of his wives, say $7 million, he might have avoid trouble and had $9 million in his jeans.

I have no sympathy for him now.

Cheers


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

This guy is no simple farmer type. He is a computer tech who spent 11 months speaking with advisors about how to guard his new millions from his ex-wives.

Hard to believe that he could be so stupid as to leave it right there so that it could be siezed by the Canadian courts. Especially after spending almost a year talking with several experts on how NOT to let this happen.  

I doubt if we have heard the last of this. My hard data oriented brain says that there is something fundamental missing in this equation. If it were an oilwell, I'd be looking over the sensor numbers and searching for suspicious anomalies.

Like, for instance, GIC's that seem to be there...but have actually been cashed out or transferred to some offshore account that Canadian officials can't get at? (just a thought)

He should have consulted with Jean Chretien on this. Apparently, our former PM is a past master at hiding vast amounts of Canadian cash in offshore accounts without leaving any sort of paper trail.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

You are hilarious Macnutt. You seem to empathize with a complete jerk who has connived to deny his wife her rightful share, who was so cheap during his relationship that he denied his wife a home for her kids and demanded the change from take-outs, yet you think his advisors were also willing to help him break the law. He got financial advice all right but since its illegal to hide money from its rightful owners, it looks as though they told him what to do financially and legally.

He's a life-time jerk. Can't change his spots even after winning $30 million. He'll die a loser.

As for Jean Chretien, why don't you go find some evidence (because there isn't any!!)? In other words, put up or shut up? You may hate the guy, but that doesn't make him a crook.

[ May 24, 2004, 01:02 PM: Message edited by: used to be jwoodget ]


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## Strongblade (Jul 9, 2001)

The fact that we hate Jean Cretien doesn' make him a thief. The fact that Jean Cretien made off with lots of money makes him a thief.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Where's the evidence Strongblade? JC presided over some particularly loose accounting via Alphonso Gagliano's department but no one has shown that JC personally benefitted from his poor oversights and judgements.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

I have never accused JC of personally benefiting from any one thing.

Proof? I have none.

Gut feeling? A Mile long.

Anyone who defends this corrupt individual needs to give their head a shake.

The little guy from some Quebec town is, and always will be, a question mark as a PM. And a poor one at that.

Cheers


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Well said, Strongblade and SINC! Your feelings are similar to the majority of Canadians when it comes to Chretien, according to recent polls.

And anyone who chooses to defend our late and not lamented former dictator...er, I mean Prime Minister...DOES need to give his head a good shake. The guy is a crook. Perhaps the worst one we have ever known. This is not up for debate. 









As for my apparent "cheering on" of the largest lottery winner in Canadian history....

What I actually SAID was, "Hard to believe that he could be so stupid as to leave it out in the open where it could be siezed, especially after he apparently spent almost a year consulting with financial experts about precisely how NOT to let this happen".

Why would a guy purposely miss out on 900 grand in potential interest from a giant windfall like that by waiting almost a whole year to collect...unless he was laying some serious plans and making some shrewd moves in order to retain the cash once the ex-wives began to deploy the lawyer brigade?

I still say we haven't heard the whole story yet.

Also...I hate to break this to you Jim, but financial experts exist to find ways to help people keep money that might normally end up in others hands. Often the government, sometimes ex-spouses. They often operate in the gray areas.

(and the earth is round, by the way)


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Jim...I worked in a mobile earth sciences laboratory for a great many years. Show me a data set and some good indications as to why that data exists as it does and I can connect the dots. You don't find petroleum in places where it shouldn't be (exploratory drilling, my forte) by making up rumors and spreading innuendo. You find it by taking the end results of many different sensor streams and tracking back from there. 

If it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck....

WHEN the Liberals are defeated, we will see some interesting things emerge from the wreckage of the former "Natural Ruling Party of Canada". When the dust finally settles, some fingers will be pointed and some people will make some serious accusations about their former colleagues. Records to prove this will be produced, and aired, in a public orgy of self destruction. More arrests will follow.

And, at that point, Jean Chretien may just decide to take an extended post Prime Ministerial tour of some very far off places. Specifically, places that don't have an extradition treaty with Canada.

If, by some blind stroke of luck, the Liberals are returned to power, then he will get away with what might someday be described as the greatest theft of taxpayer dollars in Canadian history. Until the next one.

Maybe we Canadians should get together and use our voting power to put an end to this nonsense, once and for all. Get to the bottom of it and put the criminals behind bars. Send a clear and distinct message to any and all future Canadian governments that this will no longer be allowed.


Getting back to the topic of the lottery winner....

I STILL think that he must've had some sort of plan in mind. Why else would he wait that long to collect?

And I STILL think that we haven't heard the last about this. Something's still missing.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

The only thing missing is this guys moral compass.

In my business, I listen once to an argument, assess its validity and supprting evidence and either reproduce and build on it or throw it in the garbage. By exaggerating and re-iterating untruths and conjecture, I think you are undermining what is a very good point - that JC was a slimey politician. Keep at it and the guy may even have a future in the Senate


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## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

Mr. Sobeski is apparently collecting his karmic reward. Sow, and reap. 

I'm with Sinc and probably most others, I don't have *any* sympathy for him.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

I'm a scientist. What can I say? Show me the evidence. I don't take anyone's word for it. Spreading malicious rumours and gossip is presumably fun but I like to stick to the facts. If you ain't got em, then you may as well be spitting into the wind.

I'm sure there are many people in the RCMP who would love to tackle JC. But they will not do so without hard evidence. I don't like the guy at all. But I am not going to call him a crook until he's been convicted.

Oh, and as to why the guy missed out on 900 grand in potential interest - in case you missed it, he's a loser and a jerk. I thought those qualities were rather easy to spot.


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## MrVermin (Jul 26, 2002)

I for one also have no sympathy for this guy.. and hope that his ex gets her share...

The only thing is her share of what? From what is said, the government only got their hands on $15 million... Out of $30 million... If he proves that is all he has left in court, then she gets about $7 million... 

Instead of half, she ends up with 1/4... Not fair by any stretch....

Now since JC is now in a Quebec Law firm... if this guy were really smart, he would hire JC to represent him on this...

Anyone who can make as mich money as JC did disappear while in public office, can do wonders for this guy...

MrVermin

[ May 25, 2004, 01:59 PM: Message edited by: MrVermin ]


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Legally, I think the wife has claim to 50% of the winnings which is why only $15 million was put into esgro. It turns out that, initially, almost all of the $30 million was seized and the guy couldn't even fill up his tank. His lawyer negotiated release of $15 million. If his wife wins her case, she gets the majority of the $15 million that has been seized (along with the interest from it).


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## Strongblade (Jul 9, 2001)

As for Jean Cretin being a thief, I may not have evidence, but certainly, just looking at a picture of him makes me feel like I was just robbed, mugged and molested all at once...


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## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

Better watch it, or Hull Hogan is gonna get ya...


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Strongblade...

You WERE just molested and robbed and mugged all at the same time. We all were.  

Just for the record, I don't have a lot of sympathy for Sobieski, either. If he blew a years worth of interest on 30 mil while working on a plan to keep the cash away from the ex's.... and this is the best he could come up with....then he deserves whatever he gets. Or doesn't get, in this case.

The news says he is a computer techie by trade. Want to bet that he's a DELL dullard? An Apple dude would have been much more creative.


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## Strongblade (Jul 9, 2001)

I was...? Wow... That explains the weird sensations. Just like when Mulroney was in power, but with more KY jelly.

(Now there is a visual I'll try and block out...)


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Yeah...at least they could buy us dinner or something.

And thanks for the visual. I was just about to eat lunch. Now my appetite is gone.


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