# The #1 sport in Canada.....



## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

... may still be perceived as hockey, but consider the following facts:

- The number one sport in Canada participation wise in Canada is soccer. Last year, registration reached over 850,000 soccer players, almost 50% more than hockey. 

- This years under 20 (U-20) World Cup of Soccer hosted by Canada, starting this Saturday, will be the largest sporting event in the history of Canada. There have been 940,000 tickets sold to date, and they are still going fast. They have the capacity to sell 1.3 million tickets, which would be the highest attended U-20 World Cup in history. 

- The Toronto FC (Which I am @#&@ head-over-heals about) has become the #1 franchise in the MLS (Major League Soccer) in season ticket sales, merchandise sales, and television ratings. Toronto FC have 14,000 season tickets sold (1 of them being mine) and have sold out every game in their 20,000+ seat soccer specific stadium on Toronto's waterfront, and the new, 65 Million dollar BMO field. 

There is nothing like being at a live Toronto FC game. It makes other sporting events seem like attending a funeral. The atmosphere is electric the entire game, with fans chanting, cheering, booing and singing the entire game. 

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQvz01OKrsA"]Here's the first TFC goal ever scored at BMO field[/ame], by fan favourite, #9 Danny Dichio.

I went with one of my daughter's to the last home game on Father's Day, where they trounced the #1 team in the league 4-0. [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_o7YA1PwKKk"]Here are some highlights[/ame]. 

Its great, when Danny Dicho scored the very first goal ever, he scored it at the 24th minute. Now, at every game at the 24th minute, the crowd starts chanting the Danny Dichio cheer. At the last game, the crowd just starting the chant, when who scores the 2nd goal of the game... Dichio! [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4AJQdxCmhs"]Here's a video[/ame], which will give you an idea of the level of excitement at the game in the supporters section.

Soccer is sweeping the nation! As for me... hockey schmoky!


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## MasterBlaster (Jan 12, 2003)

.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

MasterBlaster said:


> I thought it was drinking Beer.


If it's any consolation... large beers at BMO field are freakin $12.50.  And... the line-ups are huge and the Calsburg beer garden is always packed.


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

I was going to say the beer thing too. True Canucks understand.


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## zoziw (Jul 7, 2006)

> - The number one sport in Canada participation wise in Canada is soccer. Last year, registration reached over 850,000 soccer players, almost 50% more than hockey.


I would have been very surprised if it was anything but soccer (I've heard europeans mock us by calling it "soccerball" so remember to be offended if you ever hear it called that).

The number of soccer fields located between hockey rinks is staggering and most are used frequently. The number of spectators going to these games, especially for young children's leagues is enormous and clogs up my community with traffic and parked cars at least a few times a week.



> - The Toronto FC (Which I am @#&@ head-over-heals about) has become the #1 franchise in the MLS (Major League Soccer) in season ticket sales, merchandise sales, and television ratings. Toronto FC have 14,000 season tickets sold (1 of them being mine) and have sold out every game in their 20,000+ seat soccer specific stadium on Toronto's waterfront, and the new, 65 Million dollar BMO field.


I really hope this isn't just the euphoria of having a new team in Toronto and that they will keep selling out in the coming seasons. To be able to have a successful professional soccer league in North America is critical to developing Canadian soccer talent and improving our chances of actually getting into the World Cup...and one day winning it.

A big thumbs up to our sports TV stations for covering the Toronto FC and further promoting the sport and league across the country.


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

ehMax said:


> I went with one of my daughter's to the last home game on Father's Day, where they trounced the #1 team in the league 4-0. Here are some highlights.


I took my dad and mom to that game as well and it was a great match to go to, that game was also my 1st taste of Toronto FC football and I was very impressed by the atmosphere of the crowd.

Laterz


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

I vote for beer.... Just don't get Soccer.. I find it boring in the extreme, and then there is the faked injury issue - talk about lying down on the job..


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## zoziw (Jul 7, 2006)

> and then there is the faked injury issue - talk about lying down on the job..


On that note, and oldie but a goodie:

YouTube - Snickers ad - Mr T.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

zoziw said:


> I really hope this isn't just the euphoria of having a new team in Toronto and that they will keep selling out in the coming seasons.


Well... if its any indication... On craiglist and other sites, people are asking, and getting hundreds, sometimes thousands of dollars "for the right" to buy season tickets next year. 

I have one season ticket. (I procrastinated when buying and could only get one). So, I have first right of refusal to renew my season ticket next year. I could use up every ticket this year and probably get more than the value I paid for my ticket, just selling the right to buy a season ticket next year.  

I'm 100% certain this isn't a passing phase as some critics in the papers are saying. I've been itching for a pro-soccer team for ever. In the past, there has been some feeble attempts, mostly from some guy with some spare cash. This time, its different. Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment, who owns the Toronto Maple Leafs and The Raptors, are behind it with very deep pockets. 

Toronto is a massive soccer market. Statistics about TV viewership of soccer in Toronto, especially during World Cup put Toronto at one of the highest ratings in the world. 

My only worry is the traction in the US, where there are some markets with not the best turn-out. Ironically, the success in Toronto is contagious and some elements of Toronto's atmosphere are being copied around the league. 

There's also this player who has just a little hype around him, called David Beckham or something who is joining the league next month. There are rumours of other very high profile signings soon.


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## zoziw (Jul 7, 2006)

> There's also this player who has just a little hype around him, called David Beckham or something who is joining the league next month.


Not sure who this David whatchamacallit is but hopefully your are correct. 

Sounds like some kind of galaxy or something.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

rgray said:


> I vote for beer.... Just don't get Soccer.. I find it boring in the extreme, and then there is the faked injury issue - talk about lying down on the job..


So be it. I won't get into a "my sport is better than your sport" argument. I'll just say, I couldn't imagine possibly anything more boring than baseball or North American football. 

Certainly, in terms of excitement at a game, there is nothing even close to a live, professional soccer game. As I said, it makes other sports seem like a funeral. 

Here's the analogy I have. Different sports are like different ways of making love.  

Basketball... you've got the really quick, score, score, score... Its like the cheap porno of sports.  

North American football is just big and clumsy. Its all hype, but the actual is :yawn: Constantly having to refer to charts, and plays. So much padding. 

Hockey is pretty exciting, but its kind of rough. 

Soccer... Soccer.... is the beautiful game. No gimmicks. No flash. You've got to really work, take your time. Slowly test the defense. If one side is not working, switch to the other side. Find the right (never mind)  You'll find nice music and good singing and chanting. You've got to have skill... gradually you build up to the perfect play and GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAALLLLLLL. The crowd goes wild!!!!!!!!

If you're really good, you might get a couple of goals a game.

All these other amateur sports in North America. With North American culture of instant gratification and non-refined taste... I can see why there are some who don't get it. 

For those of us who do.... Yes... we get it.   

As for the dives... Yeah, there are quite a few who fake it. :lmao:


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

rgray said:


> I vote for beer.... Just don't get Soccer.. I find it boring in the extreme, and then there is the faked injury issue - talk about lying down on the job..


Hey... not everyone can just "fake an injury". It takes a lot of practice!


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

ehMax said:


> So be it. I won't get into a "my sport is better than your sport" argument. I'll just say, I couldn't imagine possibly anything more boring than baseball or North American football.


Certainly not intending to get into any sort of nasty flame war.... but!  

You need to distinguish between the NFL and the CFL. I think that last night's game demonstrates the CFL-rules football can be an exciting spectacle. I have seen a few excellent soccer matches also. Certainly one's predilections regarding "my sport" are an interesting source of variation. I happen to like to watch the, what you might call, plan-and-go aspect of the CFL.


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## Brainstrained (Jan 15, 2002)

Yawn.

I don't mean to be offensive, but I've heard this story every since I was a kid. . . several decades ago.

Registration is increasing. . . it has the highest participation rate. . . the new pro league (I can think of at least three) will bring it to the forefront . . immigrants are fuelling the interest. . . .The World Cup will help. . . .The Under-20 World Cup will help . . .Pele/Beckham/other stars will help. . .

Soccer/football has a boom and bust cycle in North America.

Wake me when it's here for real.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Interest in soccer keeps on increasing over the decades. But why do kids stop participating (even if they keep/start watching) when they get to 12 or so?


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

Brainstrained said:


> Yawn.
> 
> I don't mean to be offensive, but I've heard this story every since I was a kid. . . several decades ago.
> 
> ...


WAKE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

HowEver said:


> Interest in soccer keeps on increasing over the decades. But why do kids stop participating (even if they keep/start watching) when they get to 12 or so?


There have been great soccer players from Canada, the "roadmap" for professional soccer wasn't there in Canada, so our good players were shipped off to Europe or elsewhere. Kitchener's own David Edgar was one such lad. He now plays for Newcastle United in the English Premiership, and *will* be playing for Canada this Sunday. 

He recently was at a Toronto FC game, and he was completely floored. 

Myself, not to toot my own horn, but I was very involved in competitive soccer. I played for our regions select team, and was going to all kinds of tournaments in Canada and the US until I was around 14. Shooting for professional soccer wasn't just something that was really there when I was a kid.


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## miguelsanchez (Feb 1, 2005)

ehMax said:


> Toronto is a massive soccer market. Statistics about TV viewership of soccer in Toronto, especially during World Cup put Toronto at one of the highest ratings in the world.


Isn't that why the Canadian men's team doesn't play any of it's matches here anymore? Most of the spectators would cheer for the visiting team!  

I've been to quite a few matches like that at Varsity Stadium (sad to see it go) and felt pretty bad for the boys in red.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

miguelsanchez said:


> Isn't that why the Canadian men's team doesn't play any of it's matches here anymore? Most of the spectators would cheer for the visiting team!
> 
> I've been to quite a few matches like that at Varsity Stadium (sad to see it go) and felt pretty bad for the boys in red.


Watch Sunday's game on CBC at 8:00pm EST. BMO field will be a sea of red 20,000+ strong cheering for team Canada against Chile. 

Canada's U-20 team hosted a low-key friendly match against Argentina at BMO to a sold out crowd. David Edgar scored on a penalty shot. If you watch, you'll see there was a bit of cheering for Canada. (Nothing like a TFC game) 

Just wait for Sunday.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

Maybe I missed something, but Canada's NEVER been to the World Cup, have they??? So how can it be the #1 sport! 

Don't Blaspheme! Hockey is Canada's #1 sport!

You don't see Canadians glued to their set for soccer.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

miguelsanchez said:


> Isn't that why the Canadian men's team doesn't play any of it's matches here anymore? Most of the spectators would cheer for the visiting team!


LOL... so true...


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

Kosh said:


> Maybe I missed something, but Canada's NEVER been to the World Cup, have they??? So how can it be the #1 sport!
> 
> Don't Blaspheme! Hockey is Canada's #1 sport!
> 
> You don't see Canadians glued to their set for soccer.


Yes, you missed something.. Canada has been to the World cup in '85.... but we didn't do so well. 

We'll see what the TV ratings are for the CBC this weekend. If there aren't as many people glued to the set, its because their not sitting on their lazy @$$, and their actually at the game cheering and enjoying themselves.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

Kosh said:


> LOL... so true...


Er... watch the game Sunday when Canada plays at BMO field in Toronto. Wanna bet a $20 iTunes card the crowd *clearly* goes nutts for Canada the whole game?:heybaby:


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

ehMax said:


> Er... watch the game Sunday when Canada plays at BMO field in Toronto. Wanna bet a $20 iTunes card the crowd *clearly* goes nutts for Canada the whole game?:heybaby:


Would that be Mac "nutts" or a freudian slip?

Either way, I'll be watching paint dry or grass grow.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

SINC said:


> Either way, I'll be watching paint dry or grass grow.


Huffing paint fumes and doing grass is not healthy SINC. I'd much recomend a more healthier and exciting past-time like watching this.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Now this is soccer I can watch:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0h6b3m9NWWM


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## Brainstrained (Jan 15, 2002)

> We'll see what the TV ratings are for the CBC this weekend. If there aren't as many people glued to the set, its because their not sitting on their lazy @$$, and their actually at the game cheering and enjoying themselves.


Yawn.

Actually, if the ratings can be affected by the number of people attending the games, it just underlines that soccer/football hasn't made yet it in Canada.

Wake me when the ratings are in.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

Brainstrained said:


> Yawn.
> 
> Wake me when the ratings are in.


Where are you? At a CFL game? Jays game? Playing golf with the Leafs?  

Sure... I'll wake you up when the television ratings are in. The last event we had, the Women's U-19 World Cup in Canada, got an audience of 914,000 for the 2002 Final on Sportsnet and ranks fourth all-time in the network's history. Source. 

Here are the 2007 Stanley Cup TV Ratings, with a Canadian team in the Stanley Cup.


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## djstp (Mar 10, 2006)

i live, eat, sleep and breath football, mainly european league football


but on a side note

YouTube - David Beckham and Reggie Bush


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## Boomcha (Jan 29, 2004)

I think we should have an Ehmac outing to an FC game. It would be fun.

Jorge


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## Loafer (Jan 7, 2004)

EhMax shares my TFC passion.....Apple & TFC....what a mix

For anyone who has not experienced the delight of being at BMO Field and then talked soccer in Canada down then, sorry....you have no clue what you are on about.

Soccer really is riding a wave at the moment.....history will only tell us if it is short lived or not but judging by the people at the games I get the feeling they are in it for the long haul.

Even the wet cold wenesday night game against Houston Dynamo drew just over 19,000 people

I was in Montreal at the weekend and got talking to a Polish guy......58,000 people at the Poland v Brazil game.......and that's just the U20's

ticket sales for the U20 World Cup is more than double their expectations and by far the highest ticket sales in the history of the U20 World Cup

but no.....soccer is just a fad

Ehmax, I know I asked a long time ago, but what section are you in ?


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## Loafer (Jan 7, 2004)

ehMax said:


> Soccer is sweeping the nation! As for me... hockey schmoky!


<gasp>


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## Deep Blue (Sep 16, 2005)

Soccer (football to everyone else) is the sport of gods.

Hockey is okay.

Baseball is kind of boring.

Basketball is so predictable and uninspiring.

Canadian CFL football is just awful.

The NFL is superb - just love it. Tom Brady has made a real Patriots fan out of me.

North American soccer just doesn't do it for me though. When I have to pay money to enter a stadium I prefer top flight soccer. 

Had a ball in Germany last year during the World Cup. Had an even better time in Rome the night the Italians lifted the trophy. If you see a press picture of the Italian team arriving back in Rome with the World Cup, check out the team on the top floor of their open-top double decker bus. Then - ignoring the millions of people - look down to the rear of the bus and you'll see a stupid guy wearing a bright yellow Brazil shirt helping push the bus at a walking pace with five other strapping lads. 

That's me. It was quite an experience.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

I have defended soccer all my life. I could write a thesis why it's a superior sport but its' no way near being Canada's #1 sport. It has probably reached it's highest popularity in Ontario to date but it's just leaped over the Rock as far as professional sports in Toronto. That's about it. There are several things that need to happen before Soccer can have a shot at being in the top two or three in Canada;

1) Most importantly, development and junior leagues need more funding and exposure. Hopefully embedding and improving the sport at the elementary, secondary and post-secondary levels. Support for amatuer sports in Canada is one of the worst for a country as developed as ours (outside of Hockey and Quebec). 

2) Canadian soccer needs some acheivments. The national team needs to make it to the World Cup and make a good run before enough "Canadians" start jumping on the bandwagon sparking interest and media coverage. 

3) The MLS needs to pick up in popularity, and homegrown role models/superstars need to emerge. In addition, the MLS needs to pick up a couple more succesfull Canadian teams (in the east and the west).

However... most kids start in soccer because their parents push them to join. It is the best sport for youth to develop feet/hand/eye co-oridination with minimal risk to injury. You don't have to be tall to play it. It's relatively cheap to play. It builds a great skill foundation for other sports. Kids grow older and get swayed to the sports that are "popular" or most saught after at their schools and quit soccer. 

I started in soccer. Was frustrated with it's quality and support growing up in the GTA so I got swayed into football. Dipped my feet in CIAU, NCAA and semi-pro play as well before succumbing to my injuries, but I will always promote soccer to my kids or any youth for that matter.


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## Loafer (Jan 7, 2004)

<drool> the thought of a Montreal MLS team.....excites me

It would be the worlds greatest rivallery!
From what I understand this is on the cards in about 3 years. Part of the MLSE contract with MLS was a 3 year exclusivity clause in Canada and I understand the building of a new soccer stadium in Montreal was on the same time frame. Who knows, but they would be fools not to give it a go especially after the run away success of TFC.

Watching the Canada v USA game in the Gold Cup semi's I finally came round to supporting Canada (TFC ignited something in me) and yes, it would be a huge boost to the sport here if Canada can make it to South Africa in 2010.

I can see it now....all the cars with 2 flags on them! Not many places in the world you would see that.

Andre Lombardo....could be quite the player for Canada in the future and it only bodes well for him now that he is getting to play against some decent players now in the MLS.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

*Verdict?*

After many predicitons of making past the 1st round, the Canadian U20 team did not win a game. They did not even score a goal (similar to their 86' World Cup showing). In fact, they were the first host nation to ever not score a goal in FIFA tournament like this. 

Is it getting media coverage? Not really. Does anyone care? Not really. If this was hockey, would it be different - a resounding YES. 

TFC small localized popularity and hype have no relation to the national view of what is the most popular sport in this country.


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## djstp (Mar 10, 2006)

MACinist said:


> .
> 
> Is it getting media coverage? Not really. Does anyone care? Not really. If this was hockey, would it be different - a resounding YES.
> 
> TFC small localized popularity and hype have no relation to the national view of what is the most popular sport in this country.




that can be debated on so many levels, depending on where you reside in this country

as far as media coverage, CBC and GOLtv have exclusive rights to the FIFA U-20, if Fox sports had the rights, there would be a better marketing and ad campain
hence why Sundays National Soccer day was a bomb

TFC has done something to the MLS, that goes beyond what Becks is currently duin for the MLS. The club is making money, packing stands, and outselling merch. Cant say that that is just a localized popularity in a 'Gentlemans Game'


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## zoziw (Jul 7, 2006)

> Is it getting media coverage? Not really. Does anyone care? Not really. If this was hockey, would it be different - a resounding YES.


I agree that if this was hockey there would be a frenzy on, but in fairness, the CBC did run Soccer Day in Canada on Saturday and their entire line-up was soccer until at least the evening.

Hockey is in our culture but it is also big business in Canada, we need a few more MLS soccer teams in order to bring more money, investment and marketing to the sport. When you consider how much more attention soccer is getting now that the Toronto FC is playing, imagine how much more it would get if we could establish teams in Montreal and Vancouver.

Of course, expansion is going to have to be slow and careful but once the MLS brand is established through TFC, it will hopefully make further expansion into Canada a reality.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

djstp said:


> that can be debated on so many levels, depending on where you reside in this country
> 
> as far as media coverage, CBC and GOLtv have exclusive rights to the FIFA U-20, if Fox sports had the rights, there would be a better marketing and ad campain
> hence why Sundays National Soccer day was a bomb
> ...


You don't have to have licensing rights to talk about it. The media coverage I was referring to is simply the lack of commentaries on TSN, SportsNet and any other Canadian newscast discussing why Canada did so poorly. In fact, SportsCenter on TSN (owned by the Amercian giant ESPN) had a very brief commentary from Graham Legget about the fact that no one really gives a hoot in the media on Canada's performance mainly because of deep rooted support for other sports and direct ratings relative to news content. 

Check my previous threads, I am not putting down TFC - but you have no proof that revenue is coming from anywhere outside southern Ontario. I don't have any proof to state that it does but usually that only has to be proven otherwise as it is just assumed that local teams get most support from local fans.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

zoziw said:


> Hockey is in our culture but it is also big business in Canada, we need a few more MLS soccer teams in order to bring more money, investment and marketing to the sport. When you consider how much more attention soccer is getting now that the Toronto FC is playing, imagine how much more it would get if we could establish teams in Montreal and Vancouver.
> 
> Of course, expansion is going to have to be slow and careful but once the MLS brand is established through TFC, it will hopefully make further expansion into Canada a reality.


Yes, agreed but I think much more has to happen as in my earlier post;



MACinist said:


> I have defended soccer all my life. I could write a thesis why it's a superior sport but its' no way near being Canada's #1 sport. It has probably reached it's highest popularity in Ontario to date but it's just leaped over the Rock as far as professional sports in Toronto. That's about it. There are several things that need to happen before Soccer can have a shot at being in the top two or three in Canada;
> 
> 1) Most importantly, development and junior leagues need more funding and exposure. Hopefully embedding and improving the sport at the elementary, secondary and post-secondary levels. Support for amatuer sports in Canada is one of the worst for a country as developed as ours (outside of Hockey and Quebec).
> 
> ...


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## Brainstrained (Jan 15, 2002)

Yawn, is it over yet?

Where's all the soccer/football passion for Canada's new #1 sport?

Must not be over. Everyone still too wrapped up in the games to comment.

Back to snoozeland for me.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Brainstrained said:


> Yawn, is it over yet?
> 
> Where's all the soccer/football passion for Canada's new #1 sport?


#1 National embarrassment..... That was pathetic.


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## Loafer (Jan 7, 2004)

rgray said:


> #1 National embarrassment..... That was pathetic.


It's easy to win a world championship when only a few countries play the sport.
I'd like to see how well Canada would get on in if the rest of the world was obsessed with hockey!.....probably not very well I imagine.

Goes to show just how far behind we (the Canadians) are on the world stage.

Not an embarrassment....just proves there is still much to do.

From what I understand though there has been a lot of good football to see and those who made it to games had a great time.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

Brainstrained said:


> Yawn.
> 
> Actually, if the ratings can be affected by the number of people attending the games, it just underlines that soccer/football hasn't made yet it in Canada.
> 
> Wake me when the ratings are in.


Wakey wakey!  Thought I'd resurrect this old thread to give some ratings number from the last TFC game. Only 8th game of the season...

260,000 for Saturday's match on CBC... 

Of note...

255,000 Orioles vs Smoking Blue Jays - SportsNet


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

ehMax said:


> Wakey wakey!  Thought I'd resurrect this old thread to give some ratings number from the last TFC game. Only 8th game of the season...
> 
> 260,000 for Saturday's match on CBC...
> 
> ...


Nice, I give it to TFC, fan base and popularity is progressing nicely. But not to undermine it's ratings accomplishment in anyway, baseball, just like soccer, is a bandwagon sport in Canada. Jay's peak ratings were during it's first several years of existance and around the championship days. They are no longer winning (nice start this year though) and the novelty of having a Canadian MLB team has worn off. Nevermind Baseballs super long season where watching the first 80 games is pointless. I don't think that there are enough die hard TFC fans in Canada yet to sustain it through years of loosing. That will be the true test to a national sport...


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## Niteshooter (Aug 8, 2008)

Curling


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## bsenka (Jan 27, 2009)

I missed this thread the first time around, but I think it needs to be pointed out that one of the original points made is seriously flawed. If you like soccer, that's fine, but to claim there are more soccer players in Canada than hockey players is silly at best. 850,000? There are least twice that many people playing hockey in Ontario alone. Even if you just stick to children registered in Hockey Canada sanctioned minor hockey, there are between 2.5 and 3 million kids registered every year. That doesn't include the kids who play every day on the thousands of outdoor rinks, those who play in the unsanctioned mini and 3 on 3 leagues, and it doesn't include the millions of adult players that play both in leagues and in unsanctioned shinny. Shinny alone counts for several million players. When ice costs hundreds of dollars an hour, just committing to a weekly pick-up game shows a substantial investment in the sport

Of course, none of that matters in the slightest. If you like a sport, play it/watch it. I love lacrosse, and despite it's being one of our national sports, I'm still not about to claim that it's more popular than it really is. NLL can't even get a TV contract anymore (all games are webcast only). That doesn't make it any less of great sport. You can't tie your self worth to anyone else's interests.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

MACinist said:


> I don't think that there are enough die hard TFC fans in Canada yet to sustain it through years of loosing. That will be the true test to a national sport...


Well, you will be proved wrong, I know this for a fact. Most people outside of the support really have no idea what has been brewing for decades. I will keep referencing this thread through the years and decades and you will see. Vancouver with an MLS team next year at BC place and deposits for season tickets are through the roof. Montreal making it far in CONCACAF league and getting 65,000 at Olympic Stadium. Seattle Sounders selling out 36,000 every week. 

We are in year 3 of a "losing" team in Toronto, and yet there is still a 14,000 season ticket waiting list. On a close to zero degrees, rainy Wednesday night game, there was still 17,000+ in an open outside stadium beside Lake Ontario. 

There is still huge upwards momentum to this and the mistakes of the NASL in the 70's and 80's are not being repeated. 

There has always been massive soccer support in Canada. You can get more soccer channels in Toronto than anywhere else in the world. Never mind years of losing, wait until the winning starts. All the success of MLS in Canada with proper Youth Academies like they have for Hockey in this country will eventually trickle into National Men's program success.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

bsenka said:


> I missed this thread the first time around, but I think it needs to be pointed out that one of the original points made is seriously flawed. If you like soccer, that's fine, but to claim there are more soccer players in Canada than hockey players is silly at best. 850,000? There are least twice that many people playing hockey in Ontario alone. Even if you just stick to children registered in Hockey Canada sanctioned minor hockey, there are between 2.5 and 3 million kids registered every year. That doesn't include the kids who play every day on the thousands of outdoor rinks, those who play in the unsanctioned mini and 3 on 3 leagues, and it doesn't include the millions of adult players that play both in leagues and in unsanctioned shinny. Shinny alone counts for several million players. When ice costs hundreds of dollars an hour, just committing to a weekly pick-up game shows a substantial investment in the sport
> 
> Of course, none of that matters in the slightest. If you like a sport, play it/watch it. I love lacrosse, and despite it's being one of our national sports, I'm still not about to claim that it's more popular than it really is. NLL can't even get a TV contract anymore (all games are webcast only). That doesn't make it any less of great sport. You can't tie your self worth to anyone else's interests.


Its pointless refuting soccer registration numbers vs hockey. Its a fact there are way more youth registered in soccer of hockey by a long shot. 20% vs 12% of Canadian youth according to Statscan in 2005. In the last couple years, soccer registration has accelerated even further with the popularity of TFC. At my daughters soccer camp last summer there were tons more kids, many wearing TFC gear. Wait until Vancouver and Montreal are in the picture. 

Look, the point of soccer being Canada's #1 sport was made tongue and cheek. However, there's no denying soccer has a HUGE momentum right now. I'll revisit this thread in 3 years when Vancouver and Montreal are both in the MLS and even possibly Ottawa.


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## bsenka (Jan 27, 2009)

ehMax said:


> Look, the point of soccer being Canada's #1 sport was made tongue and cheek. However, there's no denying soccer has a HUGE momentum right now. I'll revisit this thread in 3 years when Vancouver and Montreal are both in the MLS and even possibly Ottawa.


If the league even exists in 3 years. We've all seen that "momentum" before. We had 30,000 for a pro soccer game here in Winnipeg a while back. The next year they were lucky to get 1400 a game, the year after that, they were gone. Rinse and repeat.

Soccer will never be a major sport in Canada. Never.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

bsenka said:


> If the league even exists in 3 years. We've all seen that "momentum" before. We had 30,000 for a pro soccer game here in Winnipeg a while back. The next year they were lucky to get 1400 a game, the year after that, they were gone. Rinse and repeat.
> 
> Soccer will never be a major sport in Canada. Never.


:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:

I love getting into soccer haters who have no clue about the realities of soccer in Canada. :lmao:

For one... "Will never be a major sport". Hate to inform you, that ship has sailed already. Its is the number one participated in sport. 
Source: Canadian Social Trends: Kids’ Sports

The largest sporting event *EVER* in Canada was U-20 World Cup
Source: History of the FIFA U-20 Tournament - FIFA U-20 - CBCSports.ca

In 3 years not only will the MLS still be around, but there will be 3, possibly four major soccer franchises in Canada. (2 Behind major hockey franchises) Toronto will still be selling out 20,000 seats next year.. in fact they are expanding the stadium by 8,000 seats, and Vancouver Whitecaps will be filling a remodeled BC place. Montreal will be expanding Saputo Stadium as well. 

If you like, I will wager $1000 that not only will MLS be around, but it will continue to grow as it has for the last 16 years to its now 15 franchises. I'm serious... $1000 that MLS will not only be here, but will be thriving. Any takers? :heybaby:

Care to give more specific details about the "Pro Soccer game" that was played 2 consecutive years in Winnipeg and those stats... or are you getting them from the same place your are getting your youth sports registration stats... which is out of thin air.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

ehMax said:


> Well, you will be proved wrong, I know this for a fact.


Now predictions are facts?  I played organized soccer for many years and a ton of tournaments. I watched several of my friends go to Europe to play. Some tried out for the TFC. Growing up, one of my closest friends father was an ex-star footballer that played many years for Benfica. I admired his trophies, pictures and stories growing up. So I am a supporter, but a realistic/pessimistic supporter. I do hope your predictions come to light but I've seen it before with other sports. Soccer is too new to Canada to sustain growth throughout long loosing years. As long as the TFC don't try to outgrow their fan base, they should survive for a long time. A TFC game is not only selling out because of the sport itself and it's momentum, but they did a lot of things right outside of the game. Playing at the CNE, having readily cheap'er tickets and doing it in a small and intimate venue is part of a sound strategy. If they played at the Rogers centre, "sell outs" and "waiting list" would not be part of your arguement. And the empty seats would cover up any kind of momentum.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

ehMax said:


> You can get more soccer channels in Toronto than anywhere else in the world.


Now you're talking nonsense. Are these channels on Cable? Or Satellite? Satellite is not "officially" getting a Canadian channel and anyone in the world can have satellite and many do. I don't consider Soccer Saturdays with Graham Legget growing up as massive coverage. Only in the past couple years has more content been provided to feed a growing demand but to say that Toronto has the most soccer channels than anywhere else in the world is absurd.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

MACinist said:


> Now predictions are facts?  I played organized soccer for many years and a ton of tournaments. I watched several of my friends go to Europe to play. Some tried out for the TFC. Growing up, one of my closest friends father was an ex-star footballer that played many years for Benfica. I admired his trophies, pictures and stories growing up. So I am a supporter, but a realistic/pessimistic supporter. I do hope your predictions come to light but I've seen it before with other sports. Soccer is too new to Canada to sustain growth throughout long loosing years. As long as the TFC don't try to outgrow their fan base, they should survive for a long time. A TFC game is not only selling out because of the sport itself and it's momentum, but they did a lot of things right outside of the game. Playing at the CNE, having readily cheap'er tickets and doing it in a small and intimate venue is part of a sound strategy. If they played at the Rogers centre, "sell outs" and "waiting list" would not be part of your arguement. And the empty seats would cover up any kind of momentum.


If Toronto FC played a notable game or team at Rogers, they would sell out and I bet you will see that in the next couple of years. If they did play there, you would easily see the same numbers as the Argos between 25,000 and 35,000. 

After the first year when TFC ended up in last, everyone was saying wait until next year... they sold out the second year. After a second year of "loosing" or losing as I like to call it, people said the 3rd year the novelty would wear off. Well, for year 3 they are sold out and they still have a massive waiting list. 

It's a young team and they are building... wait until the winning starts.


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## MACinist (Nov 17, 2003)

ehMax said:


> If Toronto FC played a notable game or team at Rogers, they would sell out and I bet you will see that in the next couple of years. If they did play there, you would easily see the same numbers as the Argos between 25,000 and 35,000.
> 
> After the first year when TFC ended up in last, everyone was saying wait until next year... they sold out the second year. After a second year of "loosing" or losing as I like to call it, people said the 3rd year the novelty would wear off. Well, for year 3 they are sold out and they still have a massive waiting list.
> 
> It's a young team and they are building... wait until the winning starts.


The true test will be much longer then 3 years. We are still in the newlywed stage with the TFC. Kinda like the Grizzlies in Vancouver. A 6 year stint for them it took. However, their pressures of producing money was on a much larger scale. So a true test would probably last 6-8 years of not winning a championship. If they win a championship, then you got the bandwagon bubble like the Jays which does not really indicate a sports true die hard fan base.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

MACinist said:


> Now you're talking nonsense. Are these channels on Cable? Or Satellite? Satellite is not "officially" getting a Canadian channel and anyone in the world can have satellite and many do. I don't consider Soccer Saturdays with Graham Legget growing up as massive coverage. Only in the past couple years has more content been provided to feed a growing demand but to say that Toronto has the most soccer channels than anywhere else in the world is absurd.


MLSE did an exhaustive study of soccer in Toronto before they committed tens of millions of dollars to the franchise. This was one of their findings. 

You can watch the video below with comments by Paul Bernie, directory of soccer for MLSE at the 1:35 mark:





+
YouTube Video









ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.






As for what channels...all on cable GolTV Canada (Which MLSE just purchased), Fox Sports Canada, Setenta Sports, Sportsnet, TSN, TLN. All of these channels are on Rogers and all carry soccer games from all the major soccer leagues and I have all the channels. 

--

Don't worry guys, you will always have your hockey and baseball. But soccer is BY FAR AND AWAY, the largest sport in the world and its has been taking roots in Canada over the past several decades and is starting to explode. 

It was posted here 2 years ago that it wouldn't take off and there wouldn't be TV ratings... well the ratings are continuously growing and they are very respectable with more and more deals coming in place. The Toronto sports radio station the Fan 590 just started picking up games too. 

I will continue to keep coming back in this thread over the years and debunking the other soccer fud... Like the laughable suggestion that MLS might not be here in 3 years.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

MACinist said:


> The true test will be much longer then 3 years. We are still in the newlywed stage with the TFC. Kinda like the Grizzlies in Vancouver. A 6 year stint for them it took. However, their pressures of producing money was on a much larger scale. So a true test would probably last 6-8 years of not winning a championship. If they win a championship, then you got the bandwagon bubble like the Jays which does not really indicate a sports true die hard fan base.


You set whatever year target you want... I will come back to this thread on that date.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

For those interested, Toronto FC is playing the Vancouver Whitecaps at BMO field tomorrow (Sold out) at 8:00 PM and will be covered national on Rogers Sportsnet. 

The game is the first in the second annual *Nutrilite Canadian Championship*. 

Winner of the home and away series gains entrance into the CONCACAF Champions League. 

Toronto FC plays Montreal at home next week Wednesday.


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