# Is Airport worth it?



## kps (May 4, 2003)

$180+tax seems exorbitant for a wi-fi base station. I've had two D-links and no matter what some of you may say, they've been rock solid workhorses for me. My last one has been chugging along for 5years without any issues, but I suppose it's getting a bit long in the tooth, so I'm considering an update.

Hence the question: Is Airport Extreme worth the cost?


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

Looks good anywhere, easy to setup, and easy to troubleshoot when something goes wrong. Enough reasons for me. Of course it's not for everyone depending on your needs, but for a simple home network, it's great.


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## John Clay (Jun 25, 2006)

It's worth the cost if you don't want to tweak or alter many settings, and want an easy to setup station.

I'm partial to Tomato, so I'm happy with anything that will run that. These days, the best one out there is the Asus RT-N66U. Costs about the same as an AirPort, but far more flexible and powerful.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

Definitely overpriced.


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## John Clay (Jun 25, 2006)

screature said:


> Definitely overpriced.


That's like saying a bottle of good Scotch is overpriced compared to a bottle of some cheap blended stuff.

For the throughput and range, an Extreme is hard to beat for the price. Premium price for premium product.


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## andreww (Nov 20, 2002)

I'd always used Airport, but recently when I needed a new wireless router I couldn't see the value of spending the extra cash on Airport and went with another brand instead. I will say that the Airport was easy to set up and it worked flawlessly throughout its life. The router I bought, DLink i think, was a little more complicated, but it does have a lot more options than the airport. So it took a little time, but once its done, its done. Some of the features that I find interesting are the ability to block domains permanently or only during certain hours. This is extremely useful when you have teenagers that stay up all night Skyping with their friends, or watching youtube until the early hours of the morning. When school starts I'll definitely be implementing that feature. You can also limit the hours each user can access the web which may also come in useful.


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## fjnmusic (Oct 29, 2006)

kps said:


> $180+tax seems exorbitant for a wi-fi base station. I've had two D-links and no matter what some of you may say, they've been rock solid workhorses for me. My last one has been jugging along for 5years without any issues, but I suppose it's getting a bit long in the tooth, so I'm considering an update.
> 
> Hence the question: Is Airport Extreme worth the cost?


I've had an 802.11n Airport Extreme running constantly for the past seven years and it's still faster than the WiFi at work. Had a Dlink before that that I finally abandoned since I never could get it to work. Absolutely unintuitive IMHO. I'll pay more for the "it just works" factor ten times out of ten.


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## Andrew Pratt (Feb 16, 2007)

Buy last years model from the refurb store.


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## fyrefly (Apr 16, 2005)

Andrew Pratt said:


> Buy last years model from the refurb store.


Yep, but make sure you get the $139 one from July 2011 versus the 2008 one (which I have had since 2008 and it's been running flawlessly!)

Refurbished AirPort Extreme Base Station - Apple Store (Canada)


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

I messed with others for too many years. Switched to an Extreme and bye-bye troubles. Definitely worth the dough.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

Thanks for all the info and opinions. 

Andrew, the refurb idea sounds good. Didn't think they refurbed the routers.

I'm giving it some more thought.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

John Clay said:


> That's like saying a bottle of good Scotch is overpriced compared to a bottle of some cheap blended stuff.
> 
> For the throughput and range, an Extreme is hard to beat for the price. Premium price for premium product.


I stand by my statement and most single malt is overpriced as well.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

kps said:


> Thanks for all the info and opinions.
> 
> Andrew, the refurb idea sounds good. Didn't think they refurbed the modems.
> 
> I'm giving it some more thought.


I got my Airport 2nd hand here but new in the box for basically half price, that is the only reason why I have one. I used to run a Netgear for years without any issues and only upgraded because it was long in the tooth and it's though put was obsolete.


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## Andrew Pratt (Feb 16, 2007)

I've owned routers from all the major players and they've all worked well enough...for awhile. The expensive ones worked better for longer and my Apple ones have worked perfectly. Like most things Apple, they are expensive but high quality and reliable.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

screature said:


> I got my Airport 2nd hand here but new in the box for basically half price, that is the only reason why I have one. I used to run a Netgear for years without any issues and only upgraded because it was long in the tooth and it's though put was obsolete.


All this decision making today has made me drop $300 for hunting gear and I'm not done yet...I think the old D Link will have to do for a bit longer now.


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## lyonsnet (Feb 19, 2008)

When compared to other wifi routers you find in the stores, the price on the extreme might be considered "overpriced". 

However, it was worth it for me for the ease-of-use when setting up:
- an older USB laser printer for sharing over the network
- a USB 2TB drive with 2 partitions (a) TimeMachine, and (b) storage for stuff

(and yes I know TM over the network is not officially supported, but it's working perfect for me for now)

What I like best is the ability to connect to my storage partition through the finder from anywhere (sort of my own cloud storage of 1TB). 

This setup was seamless to setup, and has been working with zero issues ever since. 

Cheers,


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

Andrew Pratt said:


> I've owned routers from all the major players and they've all worked well enough...for awhile. The expensive ones worked better for longer and my Apple ones have worked perfectly. Like most things Apple, they are expensive but* high quality and reliable.*


YMMV obviously but when there is so much competition in this market space with perfectly good, less expensive and more robust options. 

The Airport is expensive any way you cut it IMO. For people who don't want to do the research and look around and have deep pockets go ahead and buy a full price brand new Airport. If that isn't you and if you are willing to take your time and shop around there are less expensive and more robust options available in the market place.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

lyonsnet said:


> When compared to other wifi routers you find in the stores, the price on the extreme might be considered "overpriced".
> 
> However, it was worth it for me for the ease-of-use when setting up:
> - an older USB laser printer for sharing over the network
> ...


Certainly hasn't been my experience especially with firmware upgrades where several hard reboots have been required.


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## Tech Elementz (Mar 15, 2011)

Speaking on the topic of AirPort, does it support the ability to act as a WAP natively without much configuring? I would love to buy the AirPort Express as I mostly use WiFi throughout the apartment...


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## Andrew Pratt (Feb 16, 2007)

Yes it is easy to extend existing Apple WiFi networks using other Airports (Express or Extreme).


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## hayesk (Mar 5, 2000)

screature said:


> YMMV obviously but when there is so much competition in this market space with perfectly good, less expensive and more robust options.
> 
> The Airport is expensive any way you cut it IMO. For people who don't want to do the research and look around and have deep pockets go ahead and buy a full price brand new Airport. If that isn't you and if you are willing to take your time and shop around there are less expensive and more robust options available in the market place.


Such as? Please make sure it has:
- dual radio
- guest network
- NAT-PMP
- 3x3 antenna array
- 450Mbps (most are 300 or less)
- support for printers and external storage
- ability to give clients fixed addresses from the DHCP server
- support for IPv6
- extendable WPS
- gigabit Ethernet switch (cheap ones are usually 100)

Yeah, if you don't need the above, a cheaper router will be fine. Bit that doesn't make the Airport Extreme expensive for what it is. It just makes it a premium product.


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## Pat McCrotch (Jun 19, 2006)

If price is such an issue, why not consider the express? The audio port on my Airport express is a deal breaker (or maker) for me.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

I'll just say that having owned and/or used most routers on the market, the ones that offer the same level of ease and power are all in the same price range.

Linksys has some that are basically as easy to set up now for cheaper, but the ones that offer the same range, tweak ability, extra security, etc, are all over 150$.


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## Silv (Mar 28, 2008)

I just bought an ASUS RT-N66U to replace an Airport that has been giving me issues for a while. I price matched Best Direct with Memory Express to bring it below $160.

Couldn't be happier. Hayesk nailed it on the head with the feature list.

Only complaint is that the Airport Extreme I have in another part of the room can't be used to extend the ASUS's network.


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## Stephanie (Jul 21, 2004)

I have used Airports on and off since the original grey domed ones. IIRC the original ABS cost $499 back in 1999 and it was like magic compared to stringing 10BaseT wire all over the place.

Apart from some capacitors I replaced on my very first airport, they've been solid units with more capabilities than most cheap routers, and even some expensive ones. 

I still have two of the old original Airport base stations and both were still working when I finally retired them - and they were only retired because we wanted the newer faster transmissions. Both stations still worked perfectly.

Currently using an Airport Extreme at home, rock solid without a hiccup in over a year; and a Time Capsule at the office, also installed over a year without any problems whatsoever.

They might be more expensive than some cheap no-name junk or a bargain bin D-Link or Linksys, but in my experience, they Just Work.


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## mac_geek (May 14, 2005)

Yes; it's worth it.

No lost Saturdays or Sundays trying to figure it out, reconfigure it, or troubleshoot.

Performance is fine; I'm sure others will debate this endlessly.

At the end of the day, do you want a generic .mp3 player or an iPod? I choose iPod. I also choose Airport Extreme.


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## franko (Jan 3, 2008)

I can only go with my experience and based on that, I'd say the Airport is worth the price. I went through 4 routers (2 Linksys, one NetGear and one D-link) before I got my first Airport. The reason I bought the Airport was because I got tired of having problems with the connection and having to reset the routers several times a month. Since I had the Airport routers (2 so far, one in bridge mode) I have had no issues whatsoever. If you're the type that has special needs or want to have some settings that the Airport doesn't offer, then the Airport may not be for you. For me, I just want to have a router is easy to set up and that works.


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## digitddog (Jul 5, 2006)

My Airport Extreme is forgotten and neglected. And that's the way I like it. It's as reliable as a water tap. And on those rare occasions when I want to do something fancy, it'll usually support it.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

hayesk said:


> Such as? Please make sure it has:
> - dual radio
> - guest network
> - NAT-PMP
> ...



This:

Netgear N900 Wireless Dual Band Gigabit Router


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## groovetube (Jan 2, 2003)

hmm, at 20 *more* than the AE, I'll take the AE thanks.
Netgear WNDR4500 N900 Wireless Dual Band Gigabit Wireless N Router - Netgear - WNDR4500-100NAS


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## phuviano (Sep 14, 2005)

groovetube said:


> hmm, at 20 *more* than the AE, I'll take the AE thanks.
> Netgear WNDR4500 N900 Wireless Dual Band Gigabit Wireless N Router - Netgear - WNDR4500-100NAS


At bestbuy and futureshop, its 159.99, and 149.99 at dell.


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## groovetube (Jan 2, 2003)

20 bucks cheaper?

Still couldn't pry the AE outta my hands. I've used most of the routers, the AE is the best trouble free router I've ever used. Hands down.

I could see if it were say, 99 bucks, or cheaper.


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## fjnmusic (Oct 29, 2006)

So how much is peace of mind and freedom from hassle worth? I will always pay more for quality if that's what quality costs.


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## groovetube (Jan 2, 2003)

I thought the thread was really about is the cost of the AE worth it. I assume the comparisons are to routers 100 bucks or cheaper. Not within 20 bucks or so. At that point, I guess the the decision is, which one you like better. I don't really cheap out for 20 bucks when it comes to my router.


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## ldphoto (Jul 9, 2009)

Coming in a bit late to this thread, but it is certainly of interest to me. In my day job, I am a radio frequency telecommunications engineer (e.g. I'm paid to make wireless stuff work). I have tried, many, many wifi access points, and have access to some pretty advanced testing gear to do so.

I came to the conclusion that as a wireless access point, the Airport is up there with the best in its class, such as the high end Linksys (E4200), and other dual-band N450+N450 routers. To take advantage of this however, you need a rather new laptop (<18 months or so). On a iPad or older MAcBook, you would never see the difference, since they don't support MIMO at all or 2x2 at best. Most other routers of the same quality radio-wise are about the same price as the Extreme. Also, beware roiuters with only 100BT Ethernet backhaul, since that would be your bottleneck.

As a router, the Airport Extreme has some critical flaws. The biggest one for me is that Guest Networks are subject to the same MAC address access lists as the main network. This makes the guest network useless if you use MAC filtering on your main network. It's also impossible to tell an airport Extreme to not give a DHCP address to a client if it's not on the reservation list. And there is also no indicator on in/out data totals. the lack of such features has driven me to not use my Airport Extreme as a router at all. I use an old Linksys WRT54GS router with DDWRT as a router, have disabled the wireless on it, and use an Airport Extreme in Bridge mode connected to it to provide the wireless access.


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## digitddog (Jul 5, 2006)

Thanks, ldphoto. That's great insight and a great approach to getting more services from an Airport. When I used DD-wrt on a Linksys WRT54GS router, I loved the range of services that were possible but had intermittent RF connectivity problems. Does your approach overcome this problem and really give the best of both worlds?


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

Hmmm... is an Airport base worth the price??

I would would definitely say YES , unless one needs to do some manipulations using Tomato or DD-WRT etc., as they just work and the later models are even better.

And did I mention their ease to setup?? They're almost a no brainer.

But... don't get fooled that the AP Extreme is a better unit than the AP Express if one doesn't need all the extra Extreme features.

And as a comparison, I was at our local Costco store today browsing their computer goodies, and they had a Linksys dual-band router for $180.00 and a Belkin dual-band router for $40.00, nether of which had any of the extra features that the new Airport routers have, including the AP Express or the AP Extreme.

And I could tell you a loooong story about an older PITA D-Link (DIR-625) that just crashes any wireless 'net connection with any Mac running SL to attempt any access to the iTunes Store. Everything else worked, as did using its wired ethernet connection. And the same results on various Mac setups and even after a factory reset and new setup.

The solution was simple - buy a new AP Express, easy setup and problem solved.

PS: The same D-Link DIR-625 works fine via wireless when accessing the iTunes Store on any Mac running Leopard 10.5.8, whether a PPC or an Intel Mac. Go figure Apple!!

And thanks ldphoto for your informative info. Most interesting.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

pm-r said:


> And I could tell you a loooong story about an older PITA D-Link (DIR-625) that just crashes any wireless 'net connection with any Mac running SL to attempt any access to the iTunes Store.


I'm going to go ahead and say your experience was an anomaly given that I have had that router and it worked fine when I was running Snow Leopard. In fact, I gave taht router to someone and it continues to work fine for them, too.

I've since upgraded to the DIR-655 which runs like a top, but I'm a huge nerd who likes to tweak things. If you're not a huge nerd, def. get the AirPort base stations. So much easier.


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## phuviano (Sep 14, 2005)

groovetube said:


> I thought the thread was really about is the cost of the AE worth it. I assume the comparisons are to routers 100 bucks or cheaper. Not within 20 bucks or so. At that point, I guess the the decision is, which one you like better. I don't really cheap out for 20 bucks when it comes to my router.


I'm not sure if you were referring to me or not. If you were, i was just stating that the netgear can be purchased for cheaper, thats all. I actually use apple routers myself, so no i'm not saying i prefer the netgear over it. I've owned two 2nd gens extremes (sold one), and bought a 5th gen extreme about a month ago.


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

Hmmm... with trying three different network setups and resetting the DIR-625 for wireless use with any SL Mac , any iTunes Store access would just finally crash, including all other 'net access and would sometimes/often even require the dlink to be reset.

And I'm pretty Mac savy and not the first turnip to fall off the truck!! 

Maybe this particular DIR-625 is just a goofy unit when using its wi-fi and accessing the iTunes Store???? 

And I must admit that it took me a while to narrow down the problem with this particular D-Link DIR-625 router.



PosterBoy said:


> I'm going to go ahead and say your experience was an anomaly ...


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## groovetube (Jan 2, 2003)

phuviano said:


> I'm not sure if you were referring to me or not. If you were, i was just stating that the netgear can be purchased for cheaper, thats all. I actually use apple routers myself, so no i'm not saying i prefer the netgear over it. I've owned two 2nd gens extremes (sold one), and bought a 5th gen extreme about a month ago.


I sort of was. I realize that if one looks, you can find something 20 bucks cheaper. But that isn't really the original point of the thread I think.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

phuviano said:


> At bestbuy and futureshop, its 159.99, and 149.99 at dell.


Exactly and because it isn't made by Apple you can shop around to get the best price. 

I have had Netgear products going back over a decade and never had a single problem with them, they make some great stuff every bit as good as Apple especially compared to Apples earlier over priced offerings. The latest Extreme may be equal to other top of the line consumer routers but you are still stuck with it being from Apple and so you will never get it cheaper than $180.


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## fjnmusic (Oct 29, 2006)

I've had my Apple Extreme running continuously for about seven years now. That works out to about $30 a year. I can live with that. The D-Link that I owned never did work. At all. It was very unintuitive to try to set up. So what is the cost then?


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## groovetube (Jan 2, 2003)

I agree that the AE is well worth the dollars. My personal opinion, and I don't necessarily buy all apple products across the board.

Again, I didn't think the issue was a matter choice, within 20 bucks or so. But you know how threads go


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## fjnmusic (Oct 29, 2006)

I certainly do, and one could argue that I saved a lot of money on the D-Link, even if it never worked.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

pm-r said:


> Hmmm... with trying three different network setups and resetting the DIR-625 for wireless use with any SL Mac , any iTunes Store access would just finally crash, including all other 'net access and would sometimes/often even require the dlink to be reset.
> 
> And I'm pretty Mac savy and not the first turnip to fall off the truck!!
> 
> ...


Probably corrupt firmware or something.


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

I have no idea how but I've bricked a handful of routers. 

Two Airport Extremes so far and non of them bricked.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

screature said:


> The latest Extreme may be equal to other top of the line consumer routers but you are still stuck with it being from Apple and so you will never get it cheaper than $180.


Not necessarily. I bought my most recent Extreme at London Drugs here in the city during their Christmas sale last year for $159.


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## ldphoto (Jul 9, 2009)

pm-r said:


> But... don't get fooled that the AP Extreme is a better unit than the AP Express if one doesn't need all the extra Extreme features.


There is one MAJOR difference. The express has a 100BT wired port (even the new one). the Extreme is gigabit. For 5 GHz 802.11n with wide channels, the wired port can become your bottleneck.

This isn't an issue for internet browsing, but for file transfers or TM backups, it makes a difference.


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

PosterBoy said:


> Probably corrupt firmware or something.


A good thought, so I downloaded the latest appropriate 109 version again even though the d-link said that was what was installed and loaded it.

When using iTunes to access the iTunes Store via a wireless connection, it seemed to work better, but alas iTunes stopped any access and it even stopped any internet connection for the other Ethernet wired connected Macs and I had to use the Network diagnosis or reset the router to get it working.

Strange that Safari works fine, it's only when using iTunes via wireless and accessing the iTunes Store that it doesn't work, and that includes all Intel iMacs running SL 10.6.8, but strangely no such problem using my wife's G5 PPC iMac via a wifi connection and running Leopard 10.5.8.

Maybe I'll experiment a bit by setting the d-link to use the slower 802.11b/g and not n which it's set to, and I don't really need the n speed or range right now.


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

Well, by golly, I think I got it working properly - at least so far.

After the last firmware reinstall and after my wife was finished playing some iTunes radio stations via her PPC G5 with 10.5.5, I set the D-Link to use 802.11g ONLY, and all iTunes Store access seems to be working properly.

I could not find any option or way to set any of the Intel Macs running SL 10.6.8 to use 802.11g only and they all show that 802.11 a/b/g/n are enabled and available for use when using the 'Network Utility'.

I would have thought there would be some option available to control any wifi access speed option from the Mac, but I sure can't find it. 

Edit:
PS: I'm not going to do any further testing with my old Leopard 10.5.8 installs that if I recall correctly, everything worked via wifi and the iTunes Store with the D-Link DIR-625 for the few times it was used.

But I prefer a hardwired ethernet connection that I normally use as it seems to be more reliable and faster.


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## screature (May 14, 2007)

SINC said:


> Not necessarily. I bought my most recent Extreme at London Drugs here in the city during their Christmas sale last year for $159.


Ok fair enough an occasional sale, but you can't have distributors competing on the "everyday" price the way they can with every other non-Apple product.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

Well I broke down and got an Airport Extreme about a week or so ago. Figured I would wait a bit before posting, just in case. 

So far so good, very easy to set up and I no longer get hangups as I did with the old D-Link. Always thought it was an issue with Rogers...Doh! Set up was ultra-easy, the only problem, and it was a slight one, was getting the printer/scanner to work wirelessly on the MBP, but it only took me a few tries and a quick peek at the printer's manual. The printer has a network card and is connected to Airport via Ethernet.

For some strange and inexplicable reason I do miss the daunting interface and customizability of the more standard routers, but really, that's a frivolous issue. Life is good.


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## groovetube (Jan 2, 2003)

I think you'll find in general the airport will do most of what you'll need, sometimes it's called something else. But after several d-links, and a pile of linksys's, the 2 AEs have been flawless.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

I was always a tinkerer and have a small geek streak in me, but I've been getting away from that the past few years and want stuff to just work without too much fuss.


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## groovetube (Jan 2, 2003)

Same here. Too many more fun things to do than googling how to do some technical thing that likely won't improve something outside my front door.


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## okcomputer (Jul 18, 2005)

SINC said:


> I messed with others for too many years. Switched to an Extreme and bye-bye troubles. Definitely worth the dough.


My experience exactly. 

D-Link, Netgear, Linksys, free ones from Bell/Aliant, Eastlink, etc. - none were as easy-to-use and reliable as my AEBS'.


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## heavyall (Nov 2, 2012)

Add me to the list of people who found out the hard way that trying to save money with other routers only turned out to be more expensive, because I ended up going with the Airport Extreme anyway. For all their features and configurations, all the others lacked the one setting I needed: a functioning wi-fi connection.


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## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

A year (two?) ago, I convinced a colleague of mine to pick up a Time Capsule (Airport router + Wireless hard drive for Time Machine backups). 

He'd lost two hard drives to crashes over the past 10 years, and in neither instance had a backup. Telling him to buy an external HD and do backups manually didn't work - not even when Time Machine came along, and all he had to do was plug the damn thing in once in awhile. He was/is so focused on writing that the rest of the world takes second place. Logic doesn't enter into this.










The TC has been brilliant. Replaced his old Linksys router that was always giving him trouble, and TM backups happen automagically over-the-air. No fuss, no muss. That peace of mind was worth the extra $$ to go beyond an Airport Extreme. Yeah, at $299 you could probably do it cheaper with other gear - but this just works for him, and he never has to think about it... plus it backs up the other Macs in the house too...


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## Paul82 (Sep 19, 2007)

Count me as another happy TimeCapsule user, makes time machine backups easier, and if you have AppleCare on your Mac it also covers your TimeCapsule/Airport base station. Even it it was bought up to 2 years BEFORE you bought your Mac. As I found out thanks to this forum last spring when I had the hard drive in one fail on me.


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## JCCanuck (Apr 17, 2005)

*Will the Airport Extreme run things faster?*

When I have a high res movie running on my ATV3 to my LCD TV the problem is that my daughter using her Macbook and my wife using the ipad2 experience slow downs but the movie runs smooth. Everything in the house, the iMac, iPad 2, ATV3 and Macbook are connected to the Bell 2Wire router/modem device with ultra-high speed connection. Will the Airport Extreme and having the Bell 2Wire wifi turned off as described in previous posts help increase wifi speeds? I am thinking yes because the AirPort Extreme delivers speeds up to five times those of 802.11g wireless networks.


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## Paul82 (Sep 19, 2007)

It's hard to say for sure as I don't know much about the bell router you mention but if it is only g as you imply in your post then yes switching to an n wireless router,(which the airport is), should give you a significant speed boost. In general the wi-fi built into most modems that isp's bundle is not all that great either in terms of reception/range/performance, so you will likely find some improvement in that respect as well.

That said there are many, factors that come into play when it comes to configuring a wireless network, not all of which will be solved by switching to an airport. One of the simplest things to do is move the location of the modem/router if possible, preferably to a central location.


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## phuviano (Sep 14, 2005)

JCCanuck said:


> When I have a high res movie running on my ATV3 to my LCD TV the problem is that my daughter using her Macbook and my wife using the ipad2 experience slow downs but the movie runs smooth. Everything in the house, the iMac, iPad 2, ATV3 and Macbook are connected to the Bell 2Wire router/modem device with ultra-high speed connection. Will the Airport Extreme and having the Bell 2Wire wifi turned off as described in previous posts help increase wifi speeds? I am thinking yes because the AirPort Extreme delivers speeds up to five times those of 802.11g wireless networks.


I have the 2wire modem with the wifi disabled as well, and using an airport extreme as my router. Similar setup, but i'm with teksavvy. I have a 15mb download, and 1mb upload speed (advertised speeds). I've tested my connection many times with speedtest, and i always get 15.xx mb download speeds, and just under 1mb upload speeds. You may want to use speedtest and see what kind of speeds are are actually getting.

I use netflix quite often, never have any issues with running it in its highest hd mode (it automatically selects quality based on connection speed). I do have a bit of a slow down with just general web browsing if i'm watching a movie on netflix. If i go on flickr, its more noticeable, since there's more data to load when compared to a generic generic website.

Imo, i think what your expericing is quite normal. Well at least from my experience.


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## Sugith (Jan 6, 2010)

*What's your time worth?*

It depends on what your time is worth. If it's worth something, get an Apple Extreme, Express or Time Capsule. If not, enjoy wasting time messing with settings and calling tech support.


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## cklondon (Dec 27, 2008)

I have used Time Capsule (with Airport Extreme built-in) as my router and backup of choice for about 5 years now (on my second one, my ex-wife kept the first one, it was easier that way... ;-)

Love it, easy to manage/troubleshoot, and I both wifi networks (it can create 2). One is an inner/sharing/secure one for printing, TV, etc., and a password-protected 'guest' one for visitors to use.


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## Philip Bast (Mar 24, 2007)

I've had an Airport Extreme for six years now. No problems whatsoever.

Just updated my Rogers modem, to the latest "fastest" model with Wi-Fi. Sales rep told me the best part is I can get rid of my old "wireless router." So I thought I might advertise my aging Airport Extreme here and pocket a few bucks.

When setting up the Rogers modem, I hit a snag, so I called for tech support. Rogers tech guy asked what I was getting rid of, and when I said Airport Extreme, he said I'm way better off plugging it into the new Rogers modem and bypassing the internal wi-fi. The new Rogers modem offers faster internet speed, but the Airport Extreme provides faster Wi-Fi service.

So I'm not selling my used Airport after all.

Just my anecdote, for what it's worth.


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## spiffychristian (Mar 17, 2008)

.


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##  Dumpling (May 28, 2010)

Had issues with throughput on wifi with my Bell modem/router combo and all the techs told me to get a new router. I decided to tryout the Airport Express and it has been more than worth it. Solved the issues I was having instantly. Strong signal throughout my apartment, and wireless speeds that match what my ISP promises. Having the iOS app to control the easy setup and configuration of the router is another big bonus. I absolutely love it and will not use another router again. The design and small footprint, the airplay speaker capability, and how it plays nice with all my Apple gear are all pluses.


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## sashmo (Oct 19, 2002)

Right now i have one of those plug-in Airport Express base stations. I also have a Cogeco router. The home situation is such that the wireless connection has to be reset (I unplug the AE) too often as internet connection drops. So I'm thinking that if I purchased a more powerful Apple router, perhaps I wouldn't have this problem. I see that on Apple's refurbished site they have both an Airport Express and an Airport Extreme Base Station. For wireless capability, do I need another "base station" or can I just get the Airport Express?


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

If you have the 1st gen Airport Express base station, the new 2012 2nd gen is *much* better, and like the AP Extreme, now uses and supports the dual-band 2.4GHz and 5GHz wireless bands.

According to Apple the Express is recommended for an apartment, smaller home, or dorm:

Apple - Wi-Fi - Compare Wi-Fi base stations

Whereas the Extreme is recommended for a larger home, office, or classroom.

So depending on your home layout, it seems that the Wi-Fi antenna in the Extreme is no doubt larger and thus able to transmit a stronger signal over a longer distance.

Which Apple seems to expound on here:
Apple - AirPort Extreme - Features - 802.11n Wi-Fi


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## sashmo (Oct 19, 2002)

Thanks for the reply PM-R. I have a house so maybe the Express will be fine.


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## Bjornbro (Feb 19, 2000)

If you want range (especially outside), get both. I have an AExtreme centrally located in my home to my Wi-Fi stuff and I placed and an AExpress near a backyard window and have it set to extend the network. I need this to operate my AppleTV connected to a LCD projector to "watch movies under the stars". Plus it's nice to have that connectivity to operate the kids' iPod/boombox. :clap:


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

Bjornbro said:


> If you want range (especially outside), get both. I have an AExtreme centrally located in my home to my Wi-Fi stuff and I placed and an AExpress near a backyard window and have it set to extend the network. I need this to operate my AppleTV connected to a LCD projector to "watch movies under the stars". Plus it's nice to have that connectivity to operate the kids' iPod/boombox. :clap:


Good suggestion, but I'll bet that you're not going to "watch movies under the stars" lately in Souther Ontario.

I hope all you folks back East keep safe and warm and the power stays on.


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## sashmo (Oct 19, 2002)

How does one verify which version of the plug-in Airport Express base station they have? I checked the AE and only found some very tiny print.


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## Bjornbro (Feb 19, 2000)

pm-r said:


> ...but I'll bet that you're not going to "watch movies under the stars" lately in Souther Ontario.
> 
> I hope all you folks back East keep safe and warm and the power stays on.


Thanks for the well-wishes, it sure is hard to see across the road.



sashmo said:


> How does one verify which version of the plug-in Airport Express base station they have? I checked the AE and only found some very tiny print.


As far as I know there are only two versions. The old style is a plug-in (no cord), the new one looks like a white AppleTV.


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## sashmo (Oct 19, 2002)

Thanks Bjornbro. I must have the first version. So I can assume, as was said, that I'll notice a difference with the 2012 version.


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

sashmo said:


> How does one verify which version of the plug-in Airport Express base station they have? I checked the AE and only found some very tiny print.


If you open 'Airport Utility', it will show and list the Airport Base model(s) that are on and connected.


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

sashmo said:


> Thanks Bjornbro. I must have the first version. So I can assume, as was said, that I'll notice a difference with the 2012 version.


If you don't, I'll sure be surprised.


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## Sugith (Jan 6, 2010)

*Old Time Capsule or new Airport Extreme?*

After years of flawless service, my 1st gen TC got flakey this morning and two hours of rebooting everything didn't fix it.

So I ordered an Airport Extreme refurb from Apple intending to add an old external HD to it to replace my TC.

Then my TC started working again.

But it's too late to cancel my Airport Extreme order.

So I can return it when I get it, or will I be better off keeping it instead of hoping the old TC doesn't flake out again? That is, is there at least a perceptible improvement on the new AE from an old TC?


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

If you purchased the later refurb Airport Extreme model, I'd suggest keeping it, and your pervious model was maybe just providing a strong hint that it was due time to do so and indicating that something may be failing.


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## Sugith (Jan 6, 2010)

Thanks for the advice.

Is there a perceivable performance improvement with the later refurb AE vs. the 1st gen TC? (They're both a/g/n routers.)


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## sashmo (Oct 19, 2002)

pm-r said:


> If you open 'Airport Utility', it will show and list the Airport Base model(s) that are on and connected.


Good thinking. I checked Airport Utility and was met with an error message. The version that I have (v. 6.1 looking just like the utility that I have on my iPad) doesn't support the base station that I have. I need v. 5.6.
BTW I ordered the refurbished 2012 Airport Express.


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

Now how stupid is Apple on this one for backward compatibility??

And there seem to be quite a few p'd off users and even getting the 5.6.1 version installed.
Download AirPort Utility for Mac - Set up and manage your Wi-Fi network and AirPort base stations. MacUpdate.com

And to make it easier to get around the catch-22 install problem, head off to:
Installing the Old AirPort Utility (Version 5.6) on Mountain Lion | frank.is

Gee, every day I read of yet another reason for me to just stay using OS X SL 10.6.8, at least everything I need works.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

It really wasn't hard to also use 5.6.



pm-r said:


> Now how stupid is Apple on this one for backward compatibility??


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## pm-r (May 17, 2009)

Yes, Airport Utility 5.6.x is quite compatible and sometimes required with Mountain Lion, *if* it's already installed, but its installer isn't if it isn't.

Mountain Lion and the ancient AirPort Base Station | Macworld


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## sashmo (Oct 19, 2002)

My refurbished 2012 Airport Express has arrived and is in operation. It was an easy installation. Thanks to everyone for their helpful comments. Haven't lost internet connectivity yet.


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