# Alternate ISP to Bell or Rogers?



## Waltzy

I the next month or so I will be moving and I'm going to be in the market for some of that internet stuff the kids talk about. In my current home I have Rogers 7mb service. For the most part I am happy with it except when it comes to bittorents. I've heard through the grape vine(Rogers rep) that Rogers throttles bittorent. To me this means they are screwing me on something I pay good money for. 

So in the last week I've been told that Bell does not throttle bittorents. This seemed to be a good alternative until I came across this piece from CBC:Marketplace.

CBC.ca - Marketplace - Are you getting the high-speed internet you're paying for?

And I really do not agree with Bell selling an up to 7MB service and then are only allowing their tech's to open up the pipe to 5MB!! To me this is just B*^*^[email protected]$T

So here's what I'm wondering. Is there any ISP who does not throttle, gives the speeds advertised and is available in my area and doesn't bend me over when bill time comes.

I should also point out that I don't want an ISP who piggybacks Rogers or Bell. I want it to be completely independent of those morons(the ISP's that is).

I live(or will) in Port Credit

Help is truly truly appreciated.....Thanks


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## Carl

So you want advice, but only from non-arrogant EhMac'ers? That's too bad, because I knew the answer to that one. ;-)


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## John Clay

I'll be rather blunt here: Good luck finding an ISP that does not use Rogers or Bell in some fashion.

Cogeco is a good cable alternative if they offer service in your area. I'm not sure if they use Roger's copper cabling.

There are several DSL ISPs in Ontario, and all of them use Bell's DSL equipment (but their own routing after the Central Office). As for the issue of Bell only providing x speed when paying for y, this is because not all phone lines are capable of getting the full speed. In order to maintain a stable connection, Bell scales back the speeds you get. There are *no* DSL providers in Ontario that do not use Bell equipment in some fashion - Bell Canada is the only company that owns the phone lines.


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## Eric0

If your looking for good speeds on bittorent. Then you have 2 real choices, you can uncap your Rogers service. Don't ask me how I'm not a cable guy but I have seen it done. Generally that involves climbing a pole or on some older homes onto the roof. Uncapping will make your surf speeds alot faster but will probably not change bittorent speeds as packet shaping is done on Rogers servers I believe? 

The second option is to rent a server in Texas or wherever on an open connection. You'll get bittorent speeds in excess of 1-2 mb/s. Then you just have to connect to the server and download the finished file to your home computer. This also allows you to access your files anywhere in the world and reduces the risk of getting busted for illegal downloading if it ever becomes and issue in Canada.

Cost wise the server is slightly more expensive but if you share the cost with some friends it probably won't be more than 10-20 dollars per month per person.


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## 8127972

TekSavvy Solutions Inc. is my choice. It is DSL so it does use Bell infrastructure, but they are far more customer service oriented than Bell or Rogers. Also worth noting, they can tell you roughly what your speed will be UP FRONT. Oh yeah, they don't throttle Bittorrent AFAIK.


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## HowEver

8127972 said:


> TekSavvy Solutions Inc. is my choice. It is DSL so it does use Bell infrastructure, but they are far more customer service oriented than Bell or Rogers. Also worth noting, they can tell you roughly what your speed will be UP FRONT. Oh yeah, they don't throttle Bittorrent AFAIK.


Sympatico throttling Bit Torrents now??? - dslreports.com

Reports are that throttling follows people after they leave Bell, but use Bell resellers.


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## pictor

Personally, I think Bell is the devil incarnate. They have screwed me so badly over the last year, that I came closing to yelling over the phone at them, on any of the dozens of calls I have had to make. Bell will *never* earn another cent of mine. 

Which means I have no home phone line (other phone services still use Bell's infrastructure), which means I have to have cable internet.

I don't mind it though. I find my torrent speeds to be variable, but I have gotten decent speeds.


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## dcorban

Sympatico has indeed started throttling Bittorrent. I didn't believe it myself until I checked my torrents and saw the speed maxing at 30K/s, when it used to be over 400K/s. It has been this way for at least a week.

I am calling tomorrow to cancel.

I highly recommend Teksavvy. TekSavvy Solutions Inc.

Teksavvy gives you the option of a $30/month account with 200GB cap and premium routing, or $40/month for unlimited with routing that gives you 10-15ms more latency.

I would have switched to them 2 months ago, however when I called Sympatico to cancel, they matched Teksavvy's price, so I stayed with them. Since then, I have had to call 3 times with billing problems, so I am done with their bullcrap.


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## EvanPitts

I have a similar situation. I have had my ISP for a number of years, and I have not had any problems, and I have been quite happy at how inexpensive it is. But files have grown larger over the years, and dial-up is not always up to the task. (I have two phone lines so it doesn't matter if the computer stays online for days at a time). I usually drop in at Williams for a coffee if I need a big file, as I can usually download 1GB per coffee, so $1.46 per GB!...

But at some point in the next year, I will be moving, and I want to get rid of my Bell (dis)service because of all of the problems with billing I have had over the past year or so. I am not so interested in "high speed" as much as I am in having something that is economic, and not entirely Evil Empire oriented like Sympatico. My girlfriend has Sympatico, and it is only three times the speed of what I have now, but at much greater cost. She is going to discontinue her service as well, since they trashed her e-mail account and replaced it with MS Live; and to no surprise, they have been messing up her billing as well.

I, among the very many, would like to have a real Internet service sans Bell's little evil empire. (We do not have Rogers in this area, and the local high speed service is over $100 per month, though it is very fast according to my friend who uses it).


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## Waltzy

It looks like first thing Monday I'll be giving these Techsavvy guys a call to see what it's all about.....I will not have a land line so it may end up costing me a bit more. I think it'd be worth the extra cash but the better half may put a hook in things.

Thanks for the advice guys, Cheers!


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## Guest

Waltzy said:


> So here's what I'm wondering. Is there any ISP who does not throttle, gives the speeds advertised and is available in my area and doesn't bend me over when bill time comes.


    

Sorry had to comment, almost spit coffee all over my monitor when I read that line.

Best of luck with your search ... techsavvy seems like a decent choice from what I've read here in a few threads, but it's commonplace to advertise and up-sell on speeds that the ISP can hit only in theory. I'm thinking of making the jump to them in the near future as well, but it requires also having a bell supplied phone line, which I was looking forward to dumping as I do 100% VoIP now (not consumer VoIP like vonage or rogers, I run my own asterisk server and pre-purchase time from a wholesaler).

P.S. Rogers gets worse every year. Not only are they throttling bittorrent and other p2p stuff, they are now throttling ALL encrypted traffic. sshfs is now so slow it's almost unusable for me. When I phoned them to complain they said "We don't support using that type of thing." When I asked them what they do support they said "Web browsing and email," sigh. There's a LOT more to the internet than that and I wish ISP's would understand that.


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## lreynolds

I'm with Teksavvy, and would recommend them as well. There were some hiccups in the beginning, but they were really good about getting stuff sorted out.


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## iMuck

There is an easy way around the throttling. Just use a program that does encription and turn it on (hint: not BitTorrent). Basically, ISPs have figured out how to recognize files that are traded popularly (.avi, .wmv, .mpg, etc) as patterns and throttle these. Encription masks and make them less detectable from other internet traffic. 

What really pisses me off about throttling is that it is affecting my ability to transfer files to clients' FTP sites sometimes.


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## gadgetguy

Not sure if they would be in your area but we have had NO troubles with Shaw Cable. I think we have the middle one of the three speeds (Lite, *High*, and Nitro or something) and I often get 4500 kbps during non peak hours (such as 3am, haha) but lately it seems to be capping at around 2000 kbps. Hmm..


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## 8127972

HowEver said:


> Sympatico throttling Bit Torrents now??? - dslreports.com
> 
> Reports are that throttling follows people after they leave Bell, but use Bell resellers.


According to Teksavvy, they throttle nothing and I can confirm that I have excellent BT speeds and I am Ex-Sympatico. This thread on DSL Reports confirms this:

Switching to Teksavvy (Sympatico Throttle) - dslreports.com

Look for the fifth post from "TSI Jason."


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## ThirtyOne

I switched from Sympatico to TekSavvy in October, and have never been happier with an ISP. Not only is it cheaper, but it is faster, and they've provided excellent customer service when I've needed it.

And Sympatico charged me $100 for the hell of it when I disconnected them! At first they did not know why they charged me, and then they claimed it was an "early cancellation charge" for leaving my contract early, but I wasn't on contract with them. Just seemed like a blatant cash grab, hoping I wouldn't notice on the bill. I'm still fighting that one, as they promised to reverse it and credit me with it, but it hasn't happened yet. (/rant)


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## dcorban

I cancelled my Sympatico monday morning. What a nightmare. I was on the phone for about an hour. They claimed I was under contract, when I have never been under contract. Supposedly, sometime in June, I accepted a contract. They claimed it would have been sent via email and I clicked the "I agree" button. I have never received any email from Sympatico and never would have accepted a contract in any form. It was at that time I was considering cancelling.

After going back and forth with the billing dude ("You accepted a contract" "No, I didn't") for a while, I was finally put through to a "supervisor" who claimed I would be receiving $100 billing credit to make up for the early cancellation charge. My cancellation date is Dec 26, and I will be calling Teksavvy that week to sign up for the premium account.


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## Puccasaurus

Another vote for Teksavvy. 

I recently moved and jumped at the chance to leave Rogers. The only snag I had with TS was really my fault -- I was trying to save a few bucks by using a refurbished 2wire modem. When I bought the recommended Speedtouch modem from Teksavvy I shot back up to full speed. They even ship it with your settings pre-configured so you just have to plug it in and get online.

Customer service is insanely great, speed is good and stable, and if you use torrents it's the place to be.


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## imperialis

Switch to Teksavvy.


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## mpuk

I'm moving and coming to the end of my contract with Rogers and am thinking of giving Teksavvy a try...

Are the feelings towards Teksavvy the same now as they were when this post started, or does anyone have new experiences to share on Teksavvy service - i.e. still not throttling anyone?


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## bgw

*TekSavvy*

I recently changed to TekSavvy. I don't use torrents often so I can't really comment. On the few occasions I have (downloading NeoOffice for instance) it has worked well - very fast. I think one of the reasons I never used torrents was fear of Sympatico's caps and torrents always died on their service. So far with TekSavvy all has been great. I have contacted tech support on three occasions (Bell pulled my DSL hardware a week after I started with TekSavvy!) and they have been wonderful. (Even at 1:00 am on a Saturday morning!)

Change - it will save you money and headaches.


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## 8127972

Still with Teksavvy. Still love Teksavvy. Enough Said!


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## yeeeha

On this thread and others I have read recommendations of alternative ISPs to the "big boys" Sympatico and Rogers.

For DSL subscription, we know that Bell owns the copper pair. Of course these alternative ISPs would check and set up all technical details of using the Bell copper pair before we start using the service from them.

But what if there is a service problem that clearly is not the fault of the alternative ISP. Bell could say that the problem rests with the ISP and not its copper pair or equipment. So, there goes the finger-pointing and the problem is not resolved promptly.

Has anyone experienced something like this with an alternative ISP? I am fed up with Sympatico and is ready to switch ISP.


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## CaptainCode

Teksavvy's probably the fastest growing 3rd party ISP in Ontario. Everyone seems to be switching to them from Bell and Rogers.


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## Gene B

yeeeha said:


> On this thread and others I have read recommendations of alternative ISPs to the "big boys" Sympatico and Rogers.
> 
> For DSL subscription, we know that Bell owns the copper pair. Of course these alternative ISPs would check and set up all technical details of using the Bell copper pair before we start using the service from them.
> 
> But what if there is a service problem that clearly is not the fault of the alternative ISP. Bell could say that the problem rests with the ISP and not its copper pair or equipment. So, there goes the finger-pointing and the problem is not resolved promptly.
> 
> Has anyone experienced something like this with an alternative ISP? I am fed up with Sympatico and is ready to switch ISP.



You may find the answer to your question here; TekSavvy forum - dslreports.com broadband community


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## FlaminWiz

I have Rogers Express (I think). I'm satisfied with it because I can run a wired desktop, wired printer, wired XBOX 360 and a wireless laptop. If you need to run more than this, I reccommend Rogers Extreme.


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## Abysmal

I too suggest TekSavvy.. been a customer for almost a year.. Its been the best coice I have made..

Abysmal


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## esct

I tried to start a thread before asking about YAK but nobody took it...

So what about YAK?? Home


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## ApplePie

TekSavvy internet is "pure" and not to mention cheaper. I am happy with them and their business practices. I won't say that for Bell or Rogers. 

TekSavvy will be doing home phone soon - no details of yet - but I hope it's as good as their internet. Then I will be free.

Cheers

Edit: To *yeeeha* go to this forum and ask about your concerns. Don't worry about it.
TekSavvy forum - dslreports.com broadband community


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## John Clay

yeeeha said:


> On this thread and others I have read recommendations of alternative ISPs to the "big boys" Sympatico and Rogers.
> 
> For DSL subscription, we know that Bell owns the copper pair. Of course these alternative ISPs would check and set up all technical details of using the Bell copper pair before we start using the service from them.
> 
> But what if there is a service problem that clearly is not the fault of the alternative ISP. Bell could say that the problem rests with the ISP and not its copper pair or equipment. So, there goes the finger-pointing and the problem is not resolved promptly.
> 
> Has anyone experienced something like this with an alternative ISP? I am fed up with Sympatico and is ready to switch ISP.


I can't speak for other ISPs, but I know that TekSavvy will advocate on your behalf with Bell. If it takes too long, TekSavvy will open up tickets with higher ranking techs at Bell, and that usually helps.


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## crazy

Bell is bar-none, the worst company we've dealt with. My household *had* been a customer for ~35 years (with Sympatico for ~7) and were treated like crap. I can't even remember all the BS we've gone through. The connection flat out sucked, the fastest ever was 2.5 and that was not reliable whatsoever. Then after my millionth call to Bell they "fixed" my internet by dropping me to a 1Mbps profile (!!!) and not telling me. When I discovered it, I was pissed and it was the final straw after 7 years of a terrible and expensive connection. I immediately disconnected and they didn't even make an attempt to retain a customer for this many years...

Been with Rogers even since and have had very few problems. I have a consistent speed of 6-7Mbps (about 3-4 times faster than with Bell!) and its slightly cheaper thanks to bundling. 

I know its a your mileage may vary sort of thing, but I'd avoid Bell like the plague.

TekSavvy was not an option for me seeing as how the connection with Bell was so poor and they had no idea how to make it at least decent...


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## FlaminWiz

Like I said, ROGERS ALL THE WAY!

AND FOR BELL FUC*ERS, GO TELL THEM TO GO FUC* THEMSELVES.

Note: No bad things were said in this post. You have no proof whatsoever.


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## staples57

Just my two cents...

I highly recommend TekSavvy (www.teksavvy.com).

I recently switched from Bell $ympatico to TekSavvy with no regrets.
Bell was almost $50 per month, where as, TekSavvy is $30 for the same service.

The tech support at TekSavvy has to be the best I've seen.
...knowledgeable, courteous, professional, really nice people!

Check out their web site, call them and see what they can do for you.


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## crazy

TekSavvy is a good company, and I love the fact that their VP (IIRC) posts actively on DSLreports.com, but if your existing Bell line is bad/slow, then they aren't going to be an improvement.


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## jdurston

With TekSavvy DSL over a dryline do you pay TS or Bell for the line?

How much in addition to the DSL service does a dryline cost?

I have Rogers express right now with no home phone (I hate Bell), but would like to switch to TS to support them and to stick it to the man (Rogers).

Anyone use portable internet?


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## staples57

crazy said:


> TekSavvy is a good company, and I love the fact that their VP (IIRC) posts actively on DSLreports.com, but if your existing Bell line is bad/slow, then they aren't going to be an improvement.


I don't want to start an argument but...

My new TekSavvy connection is faster than my previous Bell connection.
DSL speed tests support it.
...maybe it's the modem, or the fact that TekSavvy doesn't limit download speeds

Even if the speed is the same, I'm still saving $20 per month over Bell.

I still recommend TekSavvy.


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## John Clay

jdurston said:


> With TekSavvy DSL over a dryline do you pay TS or Bell for the line?
> 
> How much in addition to the DSL service does a dryline cost?


When you order dry DSL from TekSavvy, you only order it through them, you pay TekSavvy the full cost (DSL + band rate) of the service. The band rate is usually around $10 or so.



staples57 said:


> I don't want to start an argument but...
> 
> My new TekSavvy connection is faster than my previous Bell connection.
> DSL speed tests support it.
> ...maybe it's the modem, or the fact that TekSavvy doesn't limit download speeds


You may well be seeing better speeds, and that is probably due to a higher line profile. New modem is unlikely to increase line stats (and thus the probably profile you'd be at), but anything is possible. Sympatico doesn't throttle speed tests either.


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## crazy

staples57 said:


> I don't want to start an argument but...
> 
> My new TekSavvy connection is faster than my previous Bell connection.
> DSL speed tests support it.
> ...maybe it's the modem, or the fact that TekSavvy doesn't limit download speeds
> 
> Even if the speed is the same, I'm still saving $20 per month over Bell.
> 
> I still recommend TekSavvy.


I stopped following ISPs once I left Bell, but I don't doubt it. Like said earlier its probably how TS is handling the profiles. I guess I should say if your existing connection with Bell is bad & unreliable, then TS won't solve that


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## sass

*The best ISP in Canada*

Acanac.ca has the best DSL service in Canada. They are out of Toronto and I have been using them for a while now. They are also the cheapest and give you the most bang for your buck. They also offer dry loop service. No torrent problems. I get anywhere from 400K to 500K on downloads. They also give you 100gigs of online storage and you can store whatever you want. They offer long distance, telephone service etc. It works out to $18 a month (tax included) the only drawback is you have to pay for the year. It's an extra $8 a month if you want dry loop. There is also a $49 modem deposit that you get back once you end your service with them. This paired with Skype is the ultimate package. They also have a referal program. You send them 10 customers and your service is free for as long as your with them. If you have any questions or if you decide you want the service (I would love the referals) email me sassine (at) gmail dot com.


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## chas_m

I don't want to be a wet blanket here, but enjoy those few companies NOT throttling BT and other P2P while you can. Bandwidth caps are coming and in a country with VERY limited options like Canada has, ultimately I don't think there will be many escape routes.

FWIW I have Shaw 10mb service and don't do a while lot of downloading, but do watch more than a little video online. No limits or throttling encountered so far, but I'm generally not using the kind of stuff they're monitoring.


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## Suite Edit

sass said:


> Acanac.ca has the best DSL service in Canada. ... This paired with Skype is the ultimate package. They also have a referal program. You send them 10 customers and your service is free for as long as your with them. If you have any questions or if you decide you want the service (I would love the referals) email me sassine (at) gmail dot com.


It looked kind of promising, but their site seems poorly maintained, their 416 number doesn't ring or give a busy signal and their 866 number has been busy all morning. It seems pretty fishy to me...

If I am having connection problems, how am I supposed to EMAIL their support?


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## gmark2000

acanac is legit. They are just very understaffed.

Another ISP to look at is VIF (VIF Internet) out of Montreal.


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## Gene B

"acanac is legit. They are just very understaffed."

For some reason that doesn't give me a warm, fuzzy feeling. Maybe they should outsource to India like Bell does. Now there's the epitome of quality costumer service. :clap: :clap: :clap:


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## 5andman

Following this person's progress with Teksavvy:

Art Of Geek » Switching ISPs: Good-bye, Bell Sympatico. Hello TekSavvy! [Update 1]


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## coldcanuck

Gene B said:


> "acanac is legit. They are just very understaffed."
> 
> For some reason that doesn't give me a warm, fuzzy feeling. Maybe they should outsource to India like Bell does. Now there's the epitome of quality costumer service. :clap: :clap: :clap:


I've been with acanac for about six months and canaca (their sister company) for web hosting for over three years. For a company that operates entirely through email, the experience has been really good. I've had every problem solved within 24 hours. I highly recommend them.


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## sass

Acanac is not for Mr. and Mrs Jones. It's for people that don't want to be capped, want to download like crazy, and can setup their own modem (comes pre-configured). If you are sick of rogers, bell, cogeco, and all their bs then I say go with Acanac.


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## Darien Red Sox

I live in CT, USA and all of the ISPs stink. Right now I am with AT&T with their up to 1.5MBs package. When I had a slow connection and called them they ran a test and told me that my speen was curentley 400Kbs. They told me then that it was that my computer had a bug that was causing it to seeme like I had a slower connection even though just the other day I had a 1.2MBs connection. After explaning this to me they tryed to sell me the next package up which was a 1.5MBs garenteed package with speeds up to 3MBs, which I have tryed to upgrade to before but it has not been offered on my street. Also you can only get tecksuport Munday through Saterday from 9-5, outherwise you will be trying to talk to a computer which isnot vary smart.
The cable compney is even worst and charge you $50 a month plus modem rental for there servace which is super fast 15MBs basic or 30MBs Boost) but goes down all the time, but to qualify for cable internet you must also have TV with them though which is anither hassle (if you want to get their "FREE HD" you need to rent a box from them for and extra $5 month per TV )
I hope Virizon Fios comes in to my naborhood soon and then I can get fiberoptics connection up to 50MBs, TV, and Phone with no catches and that is reliable.


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## chas_m

Darien:

May I respectfully suggest you spell-check your posts?

As regards your internet service, is a cable modem not an option for you? I have found that cable modem service generally kicks the crap out of DSL in nearly every part of the US I've looked, and that's a pretty wide swath. Verizon FIOS would be ever better but it could be quite a while before it's actually available. My neighbourhood in Orlando was promised it about five years ago and as of October they were still waiting.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac

I am moving to Oakville at the end of the month. Rogers cable internet is not available so I either go with Cogeco or go DSL with Bell. I will be going with Bell for my tv needs but was not a fan of their DSL service in the past. Any Oakvillians here who can offer any advice? I can't stand Cogeco's tv service, the guide setup is the worst, no flow, channels are all over the place and I get completely annoyed with it so I am gonna go with expressvu.

Any thoughts?


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## Mississauga

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> I am moving to Oakville at the end of the month. Rogers cable internet is not available so I either go with Cogeco or go DSL with Bell. I will be going with Bell for my tv needs but was not a fan of their DSL service in the past. Any Oakvillians here who can offer any advice? I can't stand Cogeco's tv service, the guide setup is the worst, no flow, channels are all over the place and I get completely annoyed with it so I am gonna go with expressvu.
> 
> Any thoughts?


I strongly recommend you query one or two of your soon-to-be neighbours regarding their preferred ISP. Whichever ISP is apparently fastest and least troublesome is obviously the way to go. ExpressVu is a good choice for TV; after one year, I could never go back to anything else.


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## bgw

Teksavvy is just as good as it has ever been. Had a reason to talk to tech support recently when my modem didn't sync. Tech solved it in 5 minutes and then wanted to stay on the line to do some line tests. Checked my signal to noise ratio, and did some speed tests. All numbers were good. The tech suggested that I join DSLReports so I could do more testing and maybe squeeze out a bit more from my connection!

It seems that Teksavvy is only interested in hiring techs that enjoy and love their work. So far everybody I dealt with a Teksavvy seems to be on a mission to make your internet service the best. They are a text book case on how service should work! (Man, a lot of other companies could learn from them!)

Oh ya, Torrents etc. still come through fast and furious.


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## screature

chas_m said:


> Darien:
> 
> May I respectfully suggest you spell-check your posts?


chas_m may I respectfully request that you stop being the bad spelling cop around here. People around here aren't in grade school and they don't need to be treated like kids, your aren't our teacher.

Like I said to you before about this, it is rude and peevish to point out the spelling or, grammatical, or pronunciation errors of another adult. Please just give it a rest.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac

2 friends live in Oakville and use Cogeco cable and phone. They like it, but I know they had issues with their connection from time to time. As I really don't want DSL, I think Cogeco is my only option. If I had to go DSL I would stick with Bell but in the past had lost connections frequently, numerous unknown password changes and such.

Doesn't appear anyone has anything good to say about Bell so I will go Cogeco.


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## screature

Waltzy said:


> I the next month or so I will be moving and I'm going to be in the market for some of that internet stuff the kids talk about. In my current home I have Rogers 7mb service. For the most part I am happy with it except when it comes to bittorents. I've heard through the grape vine(Rogers rep) that Rogers throttles bittorent. To me this means they are screwing me on something I pay good money for.
> 
> So in the last week I've been told that Bell does not throttle bittorents. This seemed to be a good alternative until I came across this piece from CBC:Marketplace.
> 
> CBC.ca - Marketplace - Are you getting the high-speed internet you're paying for?
> 
> And I really do not agree with Bell selling an up to 7MB service and then are only allowing their tech's to open up the pipe to 5MB!! To me this is just B*^*^[email protected]$T
> 
> So here's what I'm wondering. Is there any ISP who does not throttle, gives the speeds advertised and is available in my area and doesn't bend me over when bill time comes.
> 
> I should also point out that I don't want an ISP who piggybacks Rogers or Bell. I want it to be completely independent of those morons(the ISP's that is).
> 
> I live(or will) in Port Credit
> 
> Help is truly truly appreciated.....Thanks


What is interesting about the Market Place piece is that they left out the Quebec giant Videotron. 

I live just across the river from Ottawa on the Quebec side in Aylmer and I am with Videotron and have been since broadband first hit the market.

I am constantly surprised by how long downloads take for my friends on the Ontario side. While, because I am on cable, my speeds vary greatly depending on how many people are on at the same time my download speeds are typically between 700kbps and 1000kbps. Now I am paying for the extreme speed which maxs out at 10Mbps. But Extreme speed is the second slowest option with Videotron in their broadband offerings. The have 20, 30 and a 50Mbps speed offerings as well. You pay for this speed obviously and strangley enough the monthly maximum download limits, before you have to start paying extra for your downloads, diminishes as your speed goes up. As an example at 10Mbps I get 100GB combined up and down before extra fees kick in. When you have 50Mbps you only get 50GB before extra fees kick in.

At any rate, I have to say based on what I am hearing from other people here, Quebec must have the fasts internet in the country. Who new?


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## Mississauga

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> Doesn't appear anyone has anything good to say about Bell so I will go Cogeco.


Bell DSL is all about location. I'm fortunate that I am in close proximity to a central station and thus have great performance. A friend only 7 kilometers away suffers with 800kb download speeds, but requires the consistency of DSL.

No matter the ISP, insist you receive a trial period to determine speeds and stability before negotiating a long term contract. When I switched from Rogers to Bell, I was offered this option.


----------



## yeeeha

I called Bell a few minutes ago and was about to terminate my subscription so I could switch to TekSavvy. I have been with Sympatico since 2001, so I have an unlimited bandwidth access before Sympatico implemented a bandwidth cap a few years ago.

Since I am on a monthly plan and not on a contract, I would have to give Bell a 30-day notice.

From what I have read in different forums, most Bell reps would not ask any question and go ahead to process the cancellation order. I happened to reach a rep who cared a bit more. She called up my account and looked at my usage, then offered me a discount from the current $50 unlimited bandwidth to a one-yr. contract of $29.95 per month and a 60GB bandwidth limit. I forgot to ask what the connection speed would be with the discounted one-yr. plan. I am assuming that it would be the same.

The no contract monthly payment with TekSavvy is also $29.95, but with a 200GB bandwidth limit and potentially a slightly better connection speed. My current speed is, I think, not bad. I made a speed test through Speakeasy and got a 2600kbps download and 650kbps upload speed. I know that I am at the 5km distance limit from the serving central office to get a good DSL connection speed.

Even the 60GB bandwidth limit is plenty for me and I will never get close to using a fifth of that per month.

The reason why I have been thinking about ditching Sympatico is that lately the connection is unreliable, and Bell is totally not transparent about what kind of upgrade it is making in Toronto and Montreal that causes the disruption in service almost daily for the past two months. And Sympatico also throttles the download speed.

The latest discount offer from Sympatico is interesting. Assuming that I would have the same connection speed, the $29.95 per month is not an option that you can find on the Sympatico website. There is simply no such plan.

Now I would have to think again.

Any opinion would be appreciated.


----------



## Mississauga

yeeeha,

Nice to read a reply with clear thinking about the DSL/cable conundrum. 

While some might scorn your lack of ultimate download speed, I applaud the fact you realize 2600kbps suits your needs.

The marketing ploys practiced by today's ISPs can often present false or misleading expectations and results. Too many users are led to believe they NEED the latest and fastest of anything. Unless one requires a tremendous amount of downloading capabilities, a 2 MB service will generally suffice.

My switch to Bell was triggered by the then abysmal consistency of my local cable service and not so much the speed. I was quite satisfied when the D/L speed was 1500kbps to 1800kbps, but those speeds were sporadic and would dip to 800kbps on many occasions. My Bell DSL not only insured consistency, but also provided an unexpected increase in speed; something I wasn't too concerned over.

Monitoring my bandwidth usage indicates I average approx. 6 GB to 10 GB per month, well below any limitations; even though I too have an early unlimited plan.

I have no doubt you'll make the right decision for your needs.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac

Mississauga...I assume we know where you live and thus use Cogeco. 80) Did you ever experience lack connection consistency? I had this in the past with DSL. I use a wireless router and want to set it and forget it. I had this with Rogers but as I am moving to Oakville will no longer have Rogers Cable. I can go with Rogers DSL but have to go with their home phone as well...no thanks! My friend has problmes from time to time with his Cogeco home phone and internet; he couldn't receive calls and such. My fear with Bell is frequent dropped connections and such. Anyone experiencing this with Bell or are most just p'od at the service when you need to call...then again with Rogers I NEVER called...


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## bgw

Yeeeha, my concern with your staying with Bell is their billing. They agreed to match Teksavy's price and caps for me but everyone (including myself) has had problems with their billing. So you may be happy with the service but unhappy with their accounting.

As for your line, you can go to Teksavvy's web site and check your line. You could also call them and they may be able to provide you with more information about the line's speed and characteristics.

I recommend you go to DSLReports and see what is on their user forums.


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## HowEver

8127972 said:


> According to Teksavvy, they throttle nothing and I can confirm that I have excellent BT speeds and I am Ex-Sympatico. This thread on DSL Reports confirms this:
> 
> Switching to Teksavvy (Sympatico Throttle) - dslreports.com
> 
> Look for the fifth post from "TSI Jason."


From what I've read, this is true about throttling, but it remains that Bell Sympatico can cut off customers--including customers of Teksavvy--for massive bandwidth/downloading usage.

Solution for Bandwidth/Unlimited... and better Premium too! - dslreports.com

So for those who wish to avoid Bell throttling, but don't download a ton, Teksavvy seems to be the wisest choice at the moment.


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## yeeeha

bgw, I am aware of the terrible accounting of Bell. I have been lucky so far not having any problem with the accounting of my Bell phone service and Sympatico. But thanks for reminding me again.

With the one-yr. discounted plan that Bell offers, if I commit to it I am stuck for the entire year. Should the service quality drops, there would be a penalty for me to bail out of the contract. This is why I have never got into a fixed period contract with any ISP.

I have talked to TekSavvy about switching. They told me exactly what to do with Bell before making the switch. I also asked TekSavvy about the download speed. While it is possible that I might get a slightly better speed withTekSavvy, I think my limitation is the distance of my place to the serving central office and the physical condition of the copper pair. My line isn't exactly in the best of shape. Several years ago a Bell tech had to splice a new section to the line to fix a signal leakage that caused a very noisy line whenever the ground got very wet.

In this and other threads, many of us have expressed our dissatisfaction with the "big player" Bell and cablecos. When is Hydro going to get into this business? They have infrastructure reaching places where Bell doesn't even get to. And I am fairly sure that a few years ago Hydro had done some experimentation on sending data through a power line. But we have heard nothing on where the Hydro is with that area of research and experimentation.


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## ApplePie

HowEver said:


> From what I've read, this is true about throttling, but it remains that Bell Sympatico can cut off customers--including customers of Teksavvy--for massive bandwidth/downloading usage.
> 
> Solution for Bandwidth/Unlimited... and better Premium too! - dslreports.com
> 
> So for those who wish to avoid Bell throttling, but don't download a ton, Teksavvy seems to be the wisest choice at the moment.


Lots of Teksavvy customers download MORE than a ton and have not been cut off by Bell - I'm sure Bell would love to cut them off but it ain't going to happen.


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## John Clay

HowEver said:


> From what I've read, this is true about throttling, but it remains that Bell Sympatico can cut off customers--including customers of Teksavvy--for massive bandwidth/downloading usage.
> 
> Solution for Bandwidth/Unlimited... and better Premium too! - dslreports.com
> 
> So for those who wish to avoid Bell throttling, but don't download a ton, Teksavvy seems to be the wisest choice at the moment.


This is partly correct; Sympatico can remove customers of Sympatico from the "Has DSL available" program, which they must be in in order to obtain third-party DSL service. Once you've switched, Sympatico has NO say in your connection, as it uses no Sympatico equipment, only Bell. And Bell has no jurisdiction to throttle or boot a user; they are providing the pathway equipment only, not paying for bandwidth.

Many TekSavvy users use more than 500GB of bandwidth, and I think a few use around 1TB.


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## Mississauga

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> Mississauga...I assume we know where you live and thus use Cogeco. 80) Did you ever experience lack connection consistency?


No, my area is serviced by Rogers cable. In the 4 or 5 years I've had Bell DSL, I can only recall 3 or 4 occasions I had to call support. Each subsequent call has been handled better and faster. But I should point out I've requested my account information be flagged to avoid all the requisite "beginners" steps in troubleshooting. My last call for support was immediately moved to a 3rd tier support level and the problem was discovered/resolved in a pleasantly timely manner.


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## HowEver

John Clay said:


> This is partly correct; Sympatico can remove customers of Sympatico from the "Has DSL available" program, which they must be in in order to obtain third-party DSL service. Once you've switched, Sympatico has NO say in your connection, as it uses no Sympatico equipment, only Bell. And Bell has no jurisdiction to throttle or boot a user; they are providing the pathway equipment only, not paying for bandwidth.
> 
> Many TekSavvy users use more than 500GB of bandwidth, and I think a few use around 1TB.


Follow the link I provided, and you quoted. Rocky, who works for Teksavvy and posts on dslreports on their behalf, wrote:



Rocky for Teksavvy said:


> Bell currently has the ability to cut DSL service on users that are deemed abusers on their Sympatico network... These users would be prevented from getting DSL through a Bell Wholesaler should Bell choose.
> 
> Bell can however not throttle us... They can only set profile sync speeds.
> 
> Rocky
> --
> TSI Rocky - TekSavvy Solutions Inc.


Permalink:
Re: Solution for Bandwidth/Unlimited... and better Premium too! - dslreports.com

If you're saying this has to happen *first* while on Sympatico, it isn't something Rocky cites.

He does say somewhere that they flag users downloading 300GB+ per month.


----------



## John Clay

HowEver said:


> Follow the link I provided, and you quoted. Rocky, who works for Teksavvy and posts on dslreports on their behalf, wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Permalink:
> Re: Solution for Bandwidth/Unlimited... and better Premium too! - dslreports.com
> 
> If you're saying this has to happen *first* while on Sympatico, it isn't something Rocky cites.
> 
> He does say somewhere that they flag users downloading 300GB+ per month.


I've read the thread, and Rocky is the CEO of TekSavvy. To the best of my knowledge in casual discussion with Bell techs, managers and TekSavvy techs, this can only happen when on the Sympatico network, not a third-party supplier. Rocky mentioned that they're flagging users with 6Mbps *or greater* speeds using more than 300GB/month, as they are not TekSavvy DSL customers, but rather using a DSL login, and Sympatico's ADSL2 connection. TekSavvy only offers ADSL1 5Mbps, but Bell will sometimes set it to 6Mbps.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac

Anyone ever try Rogers DSL?


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## gmark2000

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> I am moving to Oakville at the end of the month. Rogers cable internet is not available so I either go with Cogeco or go DSL with Bell...
> Any thoughts?


Cogeco's internet is very highly rated and is one of the fastest in Canada according to DSLReports and 2Wire. When I do a u/l d/l test, I am ranking very high.

Any problems I have had related to cable cuts in my neighbourhood I know when that happens.

One bonus is that Cogeco offers lots of free Wifi to subscribers from Oakville to Hamilton. Great if you have an iPhone or iPod Touch.

Rogers offers WiMax service with a plug-in modem in Oakville.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac

Thanks! Make a strong point for Cogeco....


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## gennybeans

it's that time...
rogers has decided to enforce their bandwidth caps. i can't take it anymore, as i download and upload crazy amounts each month. though, besides the point, the cap is at 60GB for the Express Hi-Speed ($44+tax)? that's ridiculous. 

time to look into alternatives.


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## bgw

Start your seach by going to DSLReports. And make sure you checkout TekSavvy.


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## gennybeans

i've checked out both and have had my eye on teksavvy for a while now.
come monday, i am switching. this 60GB cap is a load of crap.


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## bgw

I'm happy with TekSavvy. With Sympatico I always broke my cap. With TekSavvy I have never got above 1/8th of my cap of 200 GB. The service has been really reliable and tech support has been great. They went as far as advising me to set up an account with DSLReports so that I could use all their tools to work with me to squeeze the last ounce of speed out of my connection. My speed is at 0.85 of the the theoretical top speed and only 5% below the practical speed. I haven't had the time to do the work to tweak the line; if I do, Teksavvy, I'm sure will be willing to help. They'll probably even enjoy helping!


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## HowEver

John Clay said:


> I've read the thread, and Rocky is the CEO of TekSavvy. To the best of my knowledge in casual discussion with Bell techs, managers and TekSavvy techs, this can only happen when on the Sympatico network, not a third-party supplier. Rocky mentioned that they're flagging users with 6Mbps *or greater* speeds using more than 300GB/month, as they are not TekSavvy DSL customers, but rather using a DSL login, and Sympatico's ADSL2 connection. TekSavvy only offers ADSL1 5Mbps, but Bell will sometimes set it to 6Mbps.


Sadly Sympatico now seems to be throttling everybody.

http://www.ehmac.ca/everything-else-eh/63208-update-dsl-throttling-issue.html

Update on throttling issue... - dslreports.com


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## Cliffy

HowEver said:


> Sadly Sympatico now seems to be throttling everybody.
> 
> http://www.ehmac.ca/everything-else-eh/63208-update-dsl-throttling-issue.html
> 
> Update on throttling issue... - dslreports.com


I wrote my MP and the Minister of Industry about this one.


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## 8127972

I'm really ticked about this! But the CRTC has proven to be useless when it comes to this stuff, so I am not hopeful about this changing anytime soon if ever.


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## John Clay

HowEver said:


> Sadly Sympatico now seems to be throttling everybody.
> 
> http://www.ehmac.ca/everything-else-eh/63208-update-dsl-throttling-issue.html
> 
> Update on throttling issue... - dslreports.com


A small correction. Sympatico isn't throttling anybody but their own users. This is a case of Bell Nexxia abusing its power as a "last mile" carrier and restricting all DSL traffic (though maybe not business... yet to be determined) at the DSLAM and/or BAS level.


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## chas_m

This has probably been mentioned back a few pages, but I use Shaw (10mb speed) and haven't noticed a throttling issue. This is probably because I download a modest amount of stuff (maybe 10GB or less a month? I've not really measured) and most of it _not_ via P2P.

I think the real key here is "flying under the radar" by constraining your downloading a bit (200GB+ a month? That's a new filled HD nearly every month!!). If you can't, you really ought to upgrade to a corporate line, where huge downloading is expected and thus less monitored/capped.


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## John Clay

chas_m said:


> This has probably been mentioned back a few pages, but I use Shaw (10mb speed) and haven't noticed a throttling issue. This is probably because I download a modest amount of stuff (maybe 10GB or less a month? I've not really measured) and most of it _not_ via P2P.
> 
> I think the real key here is "flying under the radar" by constraining your downloading a bit (200GB+ a month? That's a new filled HD nearly every month!!). If you can't, you really ought to upgrade to a corporate line, where huge downloading is expected and thus less monitored/capped.


Except when the ISP (TekSavvy, for example, factors in a 200GB cap in it's residential package) in question has no problem with large bandwidth use. The issue here (recently) is Nexxia overstepping its bounds and ****ing with 3rd party ISPs data, something it has absolutely no right to do.


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## 8127972

John Clay said:


> Except when the ISP (TekSavvy, for example, factors in a 200GB cap in it's residential package) in question has no problem with large bandwidth use. The issue here (recently) is Nexxia overstepping its bounds and ****ing with 3rd party ISPs data, something it has absolutely no right to do.


Nexxia says that it's in their TOS to the ISP's that they can do this. They're likely using some vague legal clause to justify it.


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## John Clay

8127972 said:


> Nexxia says that it's in their TOS to the ISP's that they can do this. They're likely using some vague legal clause to justify it.


As I said in one of the other threads, the contracts say nothing specifying Bell's right to do this... but they don't preclude it either, according to a senior TekSavvy tech.


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## vacuvox

I just noticed that I've been paying $47.95/mo for Sympatico 5MB/s since last July. Prior to that, I had a series of contracts with them for a better rate. But apparently I was not paying attention and when my 12-month contract came to an end, they bumped me up to the "regular" rate - $10 more per month - without warning. Partly because the sympatico charge appears on my Bell bill, I simply failed to notice the change until just now. Argh.

I have been with sympatico for ages - and I resent not automatically getting the optimum price. So I called. While dealing with Bell's call (manipulation)-centre (they actually offered to refund the extra charges since July - but only if I signed a TWO year contract for a more expensive service) I was weighing my options, searched ehMac and found this thread. So I've decided to give Teksavvy or Acanac a try. At least being on a monthly with sympo allows me to cancel at (almost) any time.

So, although I was satisfied with the actual DSL service I was receiving from sympatico, I just can't stand doing business with them. Thought I would share!


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## Waltzy

*Those big brother bitches strike again*

So after loving Techsavvy (more than my GF) for almost 4 months now I come across this little answer to why my torrents have slowed even on Techsavvy.

Bend over all of us Canadian bitches......our ever growing love of monopolies strikes again........

globeandmail.com: Bell irks ISPs with new throttling policy

............bend over indeed.......I feel sorry for Techsavvy they are absolutely great.....but now they are the same as everyone else.


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## SoyMac

*It's time.
*
We are with Sympatico.
I'm pretty happy with my DSL internet connection with Sympatico, and the service is fairly good.

But we've decided to switch to a local ISP (Keynetz). 

Here are our reasons for switching:

1. Sympatico costs about $50 a month. Keynetz, $35.

2. Sympatico seems to have completely sold out to Microsoft. Sympatico's help page is a Yahoo web page, Sympatico's home page is some kind of MSN kiddy website, etc.
It seems Sympatico just said, "Here, Microsoft, you run our web presence. Oh, we have a few Apple users out there. Give them just enough service so that we can say we serve Apple customers too, but not good enough service to keep them happy."

3. Despite several calls to Sympatico Help India, and many resettings of the Mail preferences. Mail is flaky at best.
We rely on email for many aspects of my Honey's business (enquiries, appt. bookings, etc.), and good email service is absolutely necessary.

Friends with Keynetz report getting a local person on the phone when assistance is required.

It's really the email that has pushed us over the edge.

I'll report back with my switching experience.


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## keebler27

SoyMac said:


> *It's time.
> *
> We are with Sympatico.
> I'm pretty happy with my DSL internet connection with Sympatico, and the service is fairly good.
> 
> But we've decided to switch to a local ISP (Keynetz).
> 
> Here are our reasons for switching:
> 
> 1. Sympatico costs about $50 a month. Keynetz, $35.
> 
> 2. Sympatico seems to have completely sold out to Microsoft. Sympatico's help page is a Yahoo web page, Sympatico's home page is some kind of MSN kiddy website, etc.
> It seems Sympatico just said, "Here, Microsoft, you run our web presence. Oh, we have a few Apple users out there. Give them just enough service so that we can say we serve Apple customers too, but not good enough service to keep them happy."
> 
> 3. Despite several calls to Sympatico Help India, and many resettings of the Mail preferences. Mail is flaky at best.
> We rely on email for many aspects of my Honey's business (enquiries, appt. bookings, etc.), and good email service is absolutely necessary.
> 
> Friends with Keynetz report getting a local person on the phone when assistance is required.
> 
> It's really the email that has pushed us over the edge.
> 
> I'll report back with my switching experience.


Hi Soy,

In your chats with Sympatico support wrt mail, are you saying it's a sympatico thing? I've been having huge issues and have been following a thread on apple.ca/support discussion boards. it's driving me nuts. constantly asking for email passwords and server passwords, i've reset everything, asked sympatico to make all passwords the same and no matter what i do...i'm screwed 

cheers,
Keebler


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## HowEver

I just went to keynetz's home page. Hmmm.

I couldn't find any reviews for keynetz.

Canadian ISP - KEYNETZ

Company listing - dslreports.com

I'm curious to know if you considered Teksavvy?




SoyMac said:


> *It's time.
> *
> We are with Sympatico.
> I'm pretty happy with my DSL internet connection with Sympatico, and the service is fairly good.
> 
> But we've decided to switch to a local ISP (Keynetz).
> 
> Here are our reasons for switching:
> 
> 1. Sympatico costs about $50 a month. Keynetz, $35.
> 
> 2. Sympatico seems to have completely sold out to Microsoft. Sympatico's help page is a Yahoo web page, Sympatico's home page is some kind of MSN kiddy website, etc.
> It seems Sympatico just said, "Here, Microsoft, you run our web presence. Oh, we have a few Apple users out there. Give them just enough service so that we can say we serve Apple customers too, but not good enough service to keep them happy."
> 
> 3. Despite several calls to Sympatico Help India, and many resettings of the Mail preferences. Mail is flaky at best.
> We rely on email for many aspects of my Honey's business (enquiries, appt. bookings, etc.), and good email service is absolutely necessary.
> 
> Friends with Keynetz report getting a local person on the phone when assistance is required.
> 
> It's really the email that has pushed us over the edge.
> 
> I'll report back with my switching experience.


----------



## John Clay

HowEver said:


> I just went to keynetz's home page. Hmmm.
> 
> I couldn't find any reviews for keynetz.
> 
> Canadian ISP - KEYNETZ
> 
> Company listing - dslreports.com
> 
> I'm curious to know if you considered Teksavvy?


Keynetz is a TekSavvy reseller, best I can tell.


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## bgw

The fact that it isn't reviewed is kind of worrying. If it isn't on DSLReports it sort of doesn't exist. They maybe wonderful just the same. Before you jump check out TekSavvy, the highest rated ISP in Canada.


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## HowEver

John Clay said:


> Keynetz is a TekSavvy reseller, best I can tell.


Rocky says they aren't part of Teksavvy:

Is Keynetz a part of Teksavvy? - dslreports.com


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## SoyMac

keebler27 said:


> Hi Soy,
> 
> In your chats with Sympatico support wrt mail, are you saying it's a sympatico thing? I've been having huge issues and have been following a thread on apple.ca/support discussion boards. it's driving me nuts. constantly asking for email passwords and server passwords, i've reset everything, asked sympatico to make all passwords the same and no matter what i do...i'm screwed
> 
> cheers,
> Keebler


Yeah, that's exactly the issue we've been having. And resetting the Mail settings through repeated chats with Sympatico's phone support has changed nothing.

The straw on the camel's back is that clients are reporting emails bounced back, emails unanswered.


----------



## John Clay

HowEver said:


> Rocky says they aren't part of Teksavvy:
> 
> Is Keynetz a part of Teksavvy? - dslreports.com


They may not be a part of TekSavvy, but their website is hosted by TekSavvy:
Keynetz.com - Key Netz


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## SoyMac

HowEver said:


> ...I'm curious to know if you considered Teksavvy?


No, I hadn't considered Teksavvy. So I just did a _very_ quick search for Teksavvy in Ottawa and can't find them here.

I'm going to Keynetz on the recommendations of a couple of friends who switched from Sympatico to Keynetz a couple of years ago, and report happiness with Keynetz ever since.

I of course welcome any other reviews, reports, and information.


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## HowEver

John Clay said:


> They may not be a part of TekSavvy, but their website is hosted by TekSavvy:
> Keynetz.com - Key Netz


I think this thread just tripled keynetz' web presence.


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## SoyMac

John Clay said:


> They may not be a part of TekSavvy, but their website is hosted by TekSavvy:
> Keynetz.com - Key Netz


Is this a good thing?
Bad?
Neutral - doesn't matter?


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## John Clay

SoyMac said:


> Is this a good thing?
> Bad?
> Neutral - doesn't matter?


Doesn't really matter. Just interesting.


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## keebler27

SoyMac said:


> Yeah, that's exactly the issue we've been having. And resetting the Mail settings through repeated chats with Sympatico's phone support has changed nothing.
> 
> The straw on the camel's back is that clients are reporting emails bounced back, emails unanswered.


Hi Soymac,

Have you tried entourage or another email app to see if that makes a difference?
Just wondering.

If the new 10.5.3 doesn't fix the mail issues, i'm going to try entourage or something to see if that makes a diff.

btw, the reason why I'm going to wait is b/c i didn't have these issues with 10.5.1 - only the upg to .2 caused issues. This leads me to believe it's not sympatico's fault, unless of course, they changed something at the same time.

also, regarding the near $50 your are paying. I called and bitched and had mine reduced to $30 + taxes. call and them you're about to leave and that you've been a valued client etc...


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## normcorriveau

Why not use a non-ISP email. I use Google Apps for my domain and I couldn't be happier. The service is terrific (Google Mail doesn't go down very often) and I get my mail though IMAP in Mail on my Mac. Can't beat the price (it's free).

Norm (not affiliated in any way with Google)


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## satchmo

The bigger question is what are the ISP alternatives that are not linked to Bell or Rogers? 
I believe there's not very many...Shaw?, Telus?


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## plunko

*What About Out West?*

I'm looking for an alternative to Rogers & Bell in BC and Alberta. Ontario has lots of great options, but what about in Victoria, Vancouver, Edmonton & Red Deer?

Any tips?


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## plunko

plunko said:


> I'm looking for an alternative to Rogers & Bell in BC and Alberta. Ontario has lots of great options, but what about in Victoria, Vancouver, Edmonton & Red Deer?
> 
> Any tips?



I've since answered my own question.

Teksavvy operates anywhere that Bell offers DSL service, since they use Bell's infrastructure. 

Now I'm just waiting to see what happens with CRTC decision in the next few weeks!


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## bgw

plunko said:


> Now I'm just waiting to see what happens with CRTC decision in the next few weeks!


I'm on TekSavvy and waiting for the decision too. I want to know if it will be worth while to jump to TekSavvy cable. The unpredictability and shear stupidness of the CRTC decisions is annoying.


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## kompas

interesting thread - i'm stuck living in a condo, downtown Toronto. Rogers is the exclusive phone/cable provider in the building. So, Rogers cable and internet it is. 

How's that for choice?!


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## bgw

kompas said:


> How's that for choice?!


Choice, Canadian style!


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## John Clay

kompas said:


> interesting thread - i'm stuck living in a condo, downtown Toronto. Rogers is the exclusive phone/cable provider in the building. So, Rogers cable and internet it is.
> 
> How's that for choice?!


You may be able to get TekSavvy cable service, as it uses Rogers' cable infrastructure.


----------

