# Build a Bridge to Vancouver Island



## RicktheChemist (Jul 18, 2001)

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## islander (Jan 31, 2001)

Hell, no!!!!!

No bridge from the mainland! Let the islands be islands, I say. Earthquakes, pollution (from lines of cars/trucks on whatever type bridge they can fashion), pollution from people who will then use this area as a suburb for Van, Native land claims and other factors all militate against building a fixed link. 

The Gulf Islands (and parts of Van Island too) are short on water (this year especially) and space for septic as it is. Throw in the extra population that will surely accompany a fixed link and you have ecological disaster. 

The most recently proposed route for a fixed link from the mainland (not proposed by government I hasten to add but by some independent advocates) is from a small island near Vancouver International Airport across the Strait of Georgia to Valdes Island, up that island and across the Gabriola Passage to Gabriola Island, up about half the length of Gabriola and then across Mudge Island to Van Island, near Cedar just south of Nanaimo.

I couldn't begin to express the level of anger that the whole idea of turning parts of Gabriola into a throughway and the rest of it into a suburb of Van raises in many here. Am I exaggerating about that possibility? Nope, on a clear day (not today) you can see downtown Van, West Van, the British Properties from here. It's not far. A fixed link would make it trivial to go from here to Van. But the environment won't take an influx of people and it won't take the influx of traffic (pollution) either.

Will a fixed link happen? Seems unlikely at the moment. A few months ago our weekly newspaper had a letter from the provincial transportation minister (Judith Reid) in which she seemed to quash for a very long time the idea of a fixed link based on its immense cost alone. Building a bridge across the very deep Strait of Georgia in an active earthquake zone will entail serious problems of design and construction. Whatever link results (floating bridge, bridge-tunnel system, something else) will then entail a really huge toll, that according to all estimates seen so far will dwarf what one now pays to cross via BC Ferries.

So now we're back to BC Ferries. Gabriola Island is served by a 70-vehicle ferry with 16 20-minute sailings a day to Nanaimo. From the Gabriola ferry terminal to Departure Bay (sailings for Horseshoe Bay in West Van) is maybe seven minutes on a bad day. Then it's about 95 minutes to cross. 

In January there will be a new privately owned foot ferry (for > 300 passengers) from Nanaimo Harbour to downtown Van, travel time of 75 minutes with a fare of $17.50 each way. So, getting to and from the mainland will be a lot easier (though not for vehicles).

Do we need a monstrously expensive fixed link ? It might seem so on those busy holiday weekends with people at major terminals facing two or three ferry waits at peak travel times. But on balance I'd say no. The ferry system needs improvements and is getting them however slowly. The fascination with constructing yet more edifices 'because we can do it' shouldn't lead us into yet more financial black holes (à la the Pacificats).


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

My sentiments, exactly Islander! There is no way that any of the people here on Salt Spring will ever go for a bridge to Vancouver Island! We want to keep the moat around our paradise intact!

A bridge from the mainland to Vancouver Island _might_ happen....someday. Certainly doesn't seem to be in the cards right now, though.

I think that Campbell would face a real uphill battle if he were to start building bridges between the islands. As you pointed out, the ecology is rather fragile and too many people would move in. We do NOT want to become "bedroom communities" for a larger area.

Sheesh! I'd have to sart locking my house and stop leaving the keys in the ignition of my car!

That's hardly civilised behavior.....and it belongs in the rest of the world. Not here!


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

They wont build a bridge to Vancouver Island because there are too many small islands in teh way. They would have to build it from somewhere further up the coast, probably so far that the driving time would be greater than to just take the ferry.

Hover Cars will happen first I reckon.

--PB


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## Cynical Critic (Sep 2, 2002)

Perhaps Doctor Frink has developed the hover car by now PB. He did built those hover bikes after all.

Don't tell me the Simpsons is just a TV show because so are all the news programs. Next people will be telling me that the Survivor series is a contrived farce made on a small budget to sucker audiences into watching their advertising. Now that's just silly. . .


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

Nope, it aint, and that would be annoying if it werent for the hundreds of prank calls we got when that who first came out.

And FYI CC, professor Frink does have a HoverCar in the video game Simpson's Road Rage. It is one of the best cars if you ask me, but then I haven't unlocked them all yet.

--PB


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Sheesh...you are _cynical_, aren't you senor Critic?









Say! You don't suppose that Posterboy's actual birth name might be Bart, do you?


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## Cynical Critic (Sep 2, 2002)

As for the bridge, on days where we don't feel like waiting for the boat or paying the rising costs, a bridge sounds almost ideal. Nevertheless, a bridge does not appear to be cost effective at this point and us islanders like to remain somewhat exclusive and removed from the rest of the world.

MacNutt: I am cynical. It seems to be a part of my generation. However, I think it's healthy to be cynical if that cynicism can develop into critical analysis.  Wait a second. Am I over-analysing. . .

PB: I never got the hover car in Road Rage but I only rented the game for a day. I'd played too much Crazy Taxi so I wasn't as impressed as I could have been. I always expect something more than any Simpsons game has ever provided. 

Now all I can hear in the back of my head is that jingle from the Mad T.V. skit: _Lowered Expectations_.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

For my money, CC, you are best served by _continuing_ to be cynical, a critic, and _very_ skeptical about everything you see or hear. It's the only way to be sure that you aren't being led around by the nose and fed a lot of crap by those who would like to influence your opinions.

Use your solid basic instincts, take all statements as unproven until you see some factual proof, or an obvious result that verifies what you have been told. I always say..."SHOW me, don't TELL me".

The truth will present itself, eventually.

Sometimes it takes quite a while....but eventually, you will be able to see what IS reality, and what has no basis in reality.

As for the bridge to any of the Gulf Islands....especially Salt Spring...I'll let my buddy Jack speak for me. He says "even if they try and build one, it won't be completed.... not as long as there are any explosives still on the island"

Enough said.


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## Cynical Critic (Sep 2, 2002)

I'll be there to light the fuse or push down the ignition box if they ever try to build a bridge to Salt Spring.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

Nope, you'll be second in line, behind me.

--PB


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

I think that _all_ of us will have to wait in line to light that particular fuse....my buddy Jack has that spot all marked out for himself and he is a seriously large, and rather nasty, individual.

Trust me on this....there will be no bridge to Salt Spring any time soon.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Waste of money imho since they are all going to slide into the Pacific when the big one hits 

What we really need is to pave over the Detroit River and the Niagara River THEN maybe we would have something that resembles an "open border" instead of a truck parking lot.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

Actually Macnutt, my grandfather has been in line to light the fuse since the fist mentions of a bridge way back in the day.

--PB


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Won't matter who lights the fuse, PosterBoy....MacDoc says we're all gonna slide into the Pacific anyway.  

Anybody want to speculate on some Alberta waterfront property before it goes way up in value? I want to get in on the ground floor here! Plus, I'll need somewhere to live anyway!


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Let's see.....take a chunk off the west coast....global warming....drought in the prairies....polluted air and clogged hightways out east.....how about we start a mass migration of all Mac users ( obviously the enlightened of the world) to the Peace River 
Least then I can
a) breath the air safely without falling into the Pacific
b) avoid dying of West Nile fever
b) still make a living 
Enlightened self- interest I believe it's called.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Ah sigh....disillusioned again. ;-(
Speaking of surfing the big one apparently a couple of surfers in Mexico or Central America actually surfed a tsunami a few years back. May be an urban legend but I think I saw it on one of the TLC spin offs about tidal waves and they interviewed these guys.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

I've worked in the Peace River region on lots of wells fairly recently and I don't think you'd really like it very much. The roads are crappy, there's real bears in the woods, the mosquitos are so large they show up on radar and the air is fouled by the stink of pulp mills and sour gas wells. Plus....the weather is even worse than it is in Mississauga, if that's possible.

Probably best to ride it out where you are already at....and be thankful for what you've got. Hey....it could be a lot worse, after all!

Me? I'm taking your advice about the earthquake sinking the whole west coast into the Pacific to heart. 

I've bought a big nasty surfboard, and I'm keepin it right by the front door.

When the BIG ONE hits I'm gonna grab that bad boy and hang ten all the way past the rockies to Alberta!

If you guys in the Wildrose Province feel a big rumble and then hear the rush of a giant tsunami, then look up at the crest of the wave. You'll see a wild-eyed former west-coaster wearing a kilt and clutching a bottle of tequila in one hand while screaming "INCOMING!!"

Better clear a spot for my landing...no guarantees on accuracy. Just thought I'd warn all of ya.









(I'll miss Salt Spring....and, if I'm lucky, I'll miss Mt.Robson as well!)  

YEEEHAAWWW!!


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

We have ,on occaission, experienced tsunami waves out here on the edge of the Pacific, and something that should be noted about tsunami's is this:
They only "rise up" and crest when they get into shallow water. At sea they are not generally much taller than any of the other big waves out there. They do tend to move really fast, so you'd most likely notice it....but surfing a wave that hasn't yet crested is not as easy as it sounds.

Sorry to disillusion you once again. Anything else I can do to spoil your day?


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Maybe not http://www.network26.com/Path/landseasky/tsunami.html 
http://www.signalsmag.com/signalsmag.nsf/0/BD3C00680F4D2D108825693F006E72E1 

Now I understand how tsunamis are created and propagate but everything I've seen and read indicates that when they come ashore there is nothing like the speed ( 400 mph + ) that they propagate in the ocean. That must be due to friction and conversion of lateral motion to vertical motion..if you think about how the energy vector must change towards the vertical then the slowing down makes sense too.
Rare indeed but not impossible and the description of the activity in water just prior to the wave set hitting is also accurate.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Cool stuff MacDoc! The link that you provided pretty much nailed what we of the Pacific coastal regions already know about Tsunami waves, and their unique behavior. There is even a section about "tidal waves" in our local phonebook. It's right after the big section on "Earthquakes and what to do WHEN one hits your area"

Such is life, out here in LotusLand.  

On a side note: The area of Salt Spring that I live in is known as "Fulford Harbour". It is a long narrow bay somewhat like a Scottish loch and is quite shallow at the lands end with prominent mud flats. A lady artist who has lived in this area since the late twenties once told me that she had seen the whole harbour empty out....just before a huge wave came ashore and cleaned the local pub right off of it's foundations. I have to assume that this was one of the many Tsunami's that we have experienced during the twentieth century.

We live pretty close to nature out here and this is just one more example of how the natural world can reach out and bite you, once in a while.

Hey....it's all part of the package. And I wouldn't trade it for anything else on earth. I flat out _love_ this place.

Besides....I've got my big nasty surfboard waiting right by the front door. Just in case.


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## bcchicken (Feb 20, 2012)

*so sad to make other people lose out*

So I will admit I didn't read all of the info in this thread. After about the 4th saltspringer, or gabriola residents reply I felt I had the general idea of how you feel. In fact its the same story as when you guys pop into your local cellphone provider and rudely yell and complain about there being no reception where you live because you refuse to have a cell tower on your islands. It might disrupt the natural beauty and blah blah. 

I think what's being forgotten when you complain about natural and eco sustainabilty is the amount of pollution created by boats crossing the ocean ten times a day to carry people over. Or the increase flights when the weather gets bad enough to shut the ferries down. We have many options to get off the island. None of them are very ecofriendly but I find the majority of saltspringers and gabriola people are completely off base. You have grown into the "not in my backyard" mentality. So much so that your selfishness is so evident most people that aren't on your island regard you as a joke in society. 

Just so you know if the people of vancouver decide they will be making saltspring or gabriola their new community, they will.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Welcome to ehMac, but wow, reviving a 10 year old thread for a first post as an introduction? Would it not have been better to open a new discussion? 

MacNutt's been dead for over five years now and every time I see his name again, I am reminded of our loss.


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## GratuitousApplesauce (Jan 29, 2004)

bcchicken said:


> So I will admit I didn't read all of the info in this thread. After about the 4th saltspringer, or gabriola residents reply I felt I had the general idea of how you feel. In fact its the same story as when you guys pop into your local cellphone provider and rudely yell and complain about there being no reception where you live because you refuse to have a cell tower on your islands. It might disrupt the natural beauty and blah blah.
> 
> I think what's being forgotten when you complain about natural and eco sustainabilty is the amount of pollution created by boats crossing the ocean ten times a day to carry people over. Or the increase flights when the weather gets bad enough to shut the ferries down. We have many options to get off the island. None of them are very ecofriendly but I find the majority of saltspringers and gabriola people are completely off base. You have grown into the "not in my backyard" mentality. So much so that your selfishness is so evident most people that aren't on your island regard you as a joke in society.
> 
> Just so you know if the people of vancouver decide they will be making saltspring or gabriola their new community, they will.


Like SINC I'm curious about why you would resurrect a 10 year old thread.

2 points I'd like to make here. I'm one of the Gulf Island residents that you see as selfish and I find your attitude of writing off many thousands of people as "a joke in society" to be highly insulting.

Secondly, if you've ever investigated the subject of building a fixed link to Vancouver Island from the Lower Mainland, you would find out that the provincial government has on different occasions studied the issue because of political pressure and on each occasion concluded that it is not feasible for several reasons.

1) The cost would be astronomical for an estimated $8 to $12 Billion project. This projection was made in 1980, so you can imagine what the cost would be now. Potential toll prices couldn't begin to cover the construction cost over the lifespan of the link unless the one-way fee was at minimum $200 or up to $800 given a more expensive project and the building authorities and/or private partners seeking a return on investment.

2) The engineering challenges are enormous and greater than anything in the world that has ever been attempted. Those challenges include:
• length of a crossing that could be up to 26 kilometres
• water depths are up to 365 metres
• deep, soft sediments of up to 450 metres on the ocean bed
• potential marine slope instabilities along the eastern side of the Strait could result in future underwater landslides
• extreme wave conditions (4 to 7 metre waves, with 6 metre tides and 2 knot current)
• design wind speed of 115 km/h with gusts up to 180 kmh
• passage of major ships through the area; and
• the need to protect a crossing structure against ship impact (a floating bridge could not withstand the impact of a tanker vessel).

Nobody has built a structure yet that has had to deal with all of those conditions. Add on top of that, extra engineering to whatever method was chosen to make sure the structure could withstand a magnitude 9.0 or greater earthquake that will occur in the region at some point.

3) There simply isn't a large enough population and enough traffic by a long shot to support a project of this scope and expense, even if the technical challenges could somehow be magically overcome.

Conclusion -- a fixed link to Vancouver Island is a fantasy, regardless of what we here on the Gulf Islands think about the idea. The BC Ferries will be with us for a long, long time.

These facts never seem to stop people commenting on newspaper comment sections -- every, single, time there is the least little story on the ferry system. "When will they build us a bridge?", they bleat. Answer, -- never.

Welcome to ehMac bcchicken.


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## RicktheChemist (Jul 18, 2001)

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