# 2005 GTO... JUDGE



## Griller (Jan 17, 2002)

The 2005 Pontiac GTO Judge 

Pontiac's bringin back a classic name and it looks amazing. The normal new GTO wasn't enough I guess, good thing too. This Judge looks sooooo good.


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## buck (Jan 10, 2003)

I kind of like it. I also kind of like this


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

Definitely nice looking!


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## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

The Judge looks nice, as does the Mustang refresh. 

I saw a Chevrolet SSR parked in front of a local Chevy dealership last week:










Quite striking. But it's pretty certain that this thing is more about styling & looks than true pickup-truck utility and toughness.


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## Rob (Sep 14, 2002)

Yuk, it looks like a Cavalier with a makeup job.


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

I don't know, man, personally I think the Chevrolet SSR is *the* ugliest thing I've ever seen.


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

> I don't know, man, personally I think the Chevrolet SSR is *the* ugliest thing I've ever seen.


In my book the SSR is a close 2nd to another GM product the Pontiac Aztek for the ugliest vehicle ever built.

As for my choice of a beautifull car that's being sold today but not in NA presenting the V6 Renault Clio Sport.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

It's in the general style of the original Judge, not badly executed for 2005 IMO


















Tho I think the convertible version much nicer.


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## Griller (Jan 17, 2002)

> I kind of like it. I also kind of like this


Me too, I like that as well. If you like that, you'll should like this Mustang GTR concept! Only conept though, looks like a good LeMans or SCCA racecar.

As for street-legal stuff the GTO Judge is sweet, I can't wait to see what Ford comes up with for a new Mustang SVT Cobra or a new Boss Mustang.


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## rhino (Jul 10, 2002)

Although I'm a Pontiac fan from way back (my fav is the 1961 model) this new GTO is not it. Seems very bland, almost a souped up grocery getter or Japanese rice rocket look to it. It may have all the right technology for go fast performance, but the style leaves me wanting.

The 2005 Mustang has all the right retro styling cues IMHO and development is seriously looking forward to more. Pics and info at this site show what is here now and coming down the line from the Mustang barn and with the exception of that outrageous tacked on wing, I'd think about taking a test drive just to see.

Pontiac is making other news with their Solstice Concept here which has more of my attention.

Of course it's all a matter of personal taste, but right now I like the more aggressive look of the Mustang to the GTO, SSR, even the latest T-Bird etc. I guess memories of Steve McQueen in his '68 run deep.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Muscle cars.... OK in a straight line....







Here's my lil fave: Lotus Elise.


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## Digital_Gary (Sep 18, 2003)

> Here's my lil fave: Lotus Elise.


Then you'll get a kick out of this. An Integra Type R powered Elise. 0 - 60 in 4.6 seconds. Very fun little go cart!
http://www.japmobiles.com/features/features_detail.asp?ID=15 

I have always loved the Judge. This new one does it for me too!
I would defintely route the exhuast out the back though. 

New Stang looks very hot too. Oh to have lots of money


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## RobTheGob (Feb 10, 2003)

Keep in mind that the *new* GTO is not really a Pontiac. It's a Holden Monaro, from Down Under. Some of the reviews I've seen (not US infomercial reviews) claim that it handles quite well.
Holden


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## misspentyouth (Sep 7, 2004)

> I don't know, man, personally I think the Chevrolet SSR is *the* ugliest thing I've ever seen.

Lars, then you have never seen a 1974 American Motors Matador.


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## JumboJones (Feb 21, 2001)

Sorry I have to say the ugliest car has to be the honda element, two big thumbs down, and one of these!


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## sharkman (Nov 26, 2002)

2005 Pontiac GTO Judge?

Looks like a big piece of cheese to me.

















How 'bout losing the "O"?..... http://www.fordvehicles.com/fordgt/media_gallery.asp?gallery=PRODUCTION_PHOTO



[ September 07, 2004, 08:56 PM: Message edited by: sharkman ]


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## Griller (Jan 17, 2002)

> Keep in mind that the *new* GTO is not really a Pontiac. It's a Holden Monaro...


Actually, Holden is just GM's name in Australia. GM in Denmark is known as Opel and GM in the UK is known as Vauxhall. To say that it's 'really' a Holden and not a Pontiac doesn't work. That would be like saying the Toyota Altezza (Japan) is not a Lexus IS300 (North America), when it really is. In both these cases it's the same manufacturer --- they just name the car differently in different parts of the world.



> Muscle cars.... OK in a straight line....


Traditionally yes, BUT the Monaro has be racing in Australia for some time now in GT and touring car competitions for sometime now on road courses, NOT ovals like the traditional American car. So it should have some of that technology transferred to the production model which would be really smart on GM's part.



> Looks like a big piece of cheese to me.
> How 'bout losing the "O"










That's awesome! I like that cheddar orange colour! But it's tough to compare the Pontiac GTO to the Ford GT. They're two differernt categories of car in terms of power and price. The Ford GT is much more expensive and has like 500-hp and competes with Ferraris and Porsches, where the Pontiac GTO is 'more' comparable to a Mercedes CLK500 (V8) or AMG CLK55 (performance-wise).

[ September 08, 2004, 10:47 AM: Message edited by: Griller ]


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## RobTheGob (Feb 10, 2003)

> Actually, Holden is just GM's name in Australia. GM in Denmark is known as Opel and GM in the UK is known as Vauxhall. To say that it's 'really' a Holden and not a Pontiac doesn't work. That would be like saying the Toyota Altezza (Japan) is not a Lexus IS300 (North America), when it really is. In both these cases it's the same manufacturer --- they just name the car differently in different parts of the world.


I'm well aware of that, but this car was designed as a Holden and is being rebadged for the US market. This is an important point (to me) since this doesn't normally happen in that direction. Holden has had some very interesting cars in recent years and it's about time that they actually brought them here.

Most people have no idea that this is happening, and I suspect that most "Pontiac" buyers might actually have an issue with buying a Australian muscle car...

With Toyota/Lexus, this is a fairly common practice and has been for years...


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## talonracer (Dec 30, 2003)

Nono... the el Camino....

booooolleeeaaaargh!


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## misspentyouth (Sep 7, 2004)

I still get a... um... I mean, I still have a warm place in my heart for the 1972 Formula Firebird. I'd love to see GM recreate it in a modern form, including those RAM air scoops.

Actually I'd like to see both the 1972 Firebird, and the early Camaro redone, just like Ford is doing with the Mustang, only better. If you've seen the original concept of the new Mustang, you'll know what I mean by "better". Too bad Ford changed it from better to worse for the production model.
The 1972 Formula Firebird...










[ September 09, 2004, 07:16 AM: Message edited by: misspentyouth ]


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## MaxPower (Jan 30, 2003)

> Especially when one considers what a runaway success the Chrysler 300 has been...and THAT car is a total breakaway from the current "aero" style trends.


I've heard that this new styling is due to a new safety standard adopted from European standards to minimize the damage caused by vehicle pedestrian collisions.

This does sound off the wall to me so if anyone would like to comment on this one and correct my statement I would like to see some solid facts either confirming or correcting that statement.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

Although I'm more of a fan of the Mustang (and it's various upgrade varieties), that GTO Judge does look nice.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

I think it's a pretty cool car! Certainly a major leap forward from GM, no matter what division in what country originally designed it. I should note here that some of the nicer Cadillacs of recent years have been sourced from General Motor's German division...also known as "Opel".(Opels may be sold in Denmark..but it's a German company, owned by GM)

I have a few issues with the styling, but I think they will work this out after the first model cycle has run it's course. Especially when one considers what a runaway success the Chrysler 300 has been...and THAT car is a total breakaway from the current "aero" style trends. Thank goodness.  

I'm just hoping that this semi-retro, high performance rear wheel drive movement keeps it's momentum in Detroit long enough to give us a brand new Camaro.  

(if it does..rumor has it that the new beast will look a LOT like the 1967-69 model. This would be a dream come true.)


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Maxpower...

From what I've read, the new European pedestrian crash standards will have all of the cars sold over there equipped with spongy soft airbag noses on them. Some of the car magazines have leaked early design excersizes from BMW and Mercedes, and they look totally HIDEOUS!   

I suspect that the new Chrysler 300 would also fail these design parameters. It's far too hard and angular to be very forgiving to any brain-dead pedestrians who happen to stagger into it's path unwittingly.

Tough luck for the snobby Euro trash, if they go ahead with these new silly regs. They'll miss out, apparently, on a really COOL car. Several really cool new cars, apparently. This includes pretty much EVERYTHING from Ferrari and Porsche and Lamborghini, BTW.









Too bad for them. My heart bleeds.


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