# Wet Basement - What to do?



## Loafer (Jan 7, 2004)

oh man....where do I start
So we move into an old house just over a year ago. Basement is finished....drywall and ceramic (cold) tiled floor.

During the thaw/rain we had over the weekend we had a bit of water in the basment, nothing major just enough to soak the rug in the middle of the floor. I looked around to see where it was coming from and noticed some bubbling pint.....turns out the drywall was wet.

I pull off the baseboard and I have mould running about 6-10" up the drywall all the way round the basement.

So I figure there has been a bit of moisture there for quite a while for mould like that to grow.

Our house is detached but only 2-3' from our neighbours with a concrete path on both sides. 

Here's the questions....

If I ran a **** load of exterior caulking between the house and the path to fill up any cracks would that reduce the level of moisture coming in down the side of the foudations to a manageable level (i.e barely anything) or would there still be enough moisture in the earth around the basement to keep the interior moist all the time ?

Also, bare in mind we have a flat roof on our 3rd floor and we get a ton of water being blown off down one side onto the path.....if I got up there and sorted that out too do you think I could solve the problem ?

I just got a quote for digging the exterior and well, I had to pick myself up off the floor....I simply can't fathom spending that kind of money right now and I get the impression any basement guy I get round to look at it will tell me I should do it properly blah blah blah

All answers will be greatly appreciated


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

If you don't have a french drain or footing drain around your house, build one. They're easy to build, the only difficult part you'll encounter is tying the drain to a storm main. There is likely a lot of hydraulic pressure in the soil outside your building and it will get in no matter what you do to try to seal the concrete. A footing drain will relieve that hydraulic pressure. If anything you can do the french drain yourself (it's easy, all you need is perforated pipe, landscaping fabric, drainage rock, a shovel, and a prefabricated sediment sump), call city hall (or whoever) and ask them where's a good place to tie to storm if you don't have an existing storm connection, and simply hire someone to make that final connection to wherever. That should solve the problem.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Loafer: You can apply hydrostatic cement to the wet surface to provide a stop gap solution, but dona83 is right that the water pressure will continue to mount unless you relieve it. Try the caulking first, but if that doesn't work you will have to dig and place drains and Tyvek. I have known people to do this themselves--I've rented a jackhammer to bust concrete before and it isn't such a horrible job, but this requires a lot of digging. 

How is your neighbour's house? Could this be a shared cost project?

Try the exterior caulking first and see if it helps.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

Don't do anything and definitely don't spend money on any caulking, it'll be a total waste. Wait for drier weather...I'm not kidding.

Your problem is probably with your foundation and water saturated soil all around the house. The only way to fix this is to dig down to the footings and seal up the whole foundation, lay weeping tile, backfill with gravel, etc. Big, messy and expensive job. 

My old house had a stone foundation and in the 20 years that I lived there, had a wet basement only once and that was during a spring thaw after a winter with exceptionally heavy snowfall. The ground was so saturated that I think nothing would have stopped the water from entering the basement.

If you plan on living in this house for a long time, find a really good foundation guy and get it done, otherwise live with the odd time this may happen.

I would however recommend you cut away the moldy drywall and replace it. Cut just the bottom xx inches and replace with new. No need to gut the whole basement and don't waste money on waterproofing the interior. Your problem is on the outside.


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

(Sorry I only threw in the sediment sump in case the city requires it... they may not require it for a house.)

I found something on Rona's website.
Rona.ca - Damp-proofing and filling your house foundations

Do you think he'll need underfloor french drains as well?? Ouch! Do the footing drain first and see if that rectifies the problem. The underfloor french drain will be super expensive...


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## Loafer (Jan 7, 2004)

Thanks for all your replies guys

kps...you are the most inline with my thinking
Just out of curiousity do you know of some kind of plastercised paint or something that I can spray onto the floor around the bottom on the studwork so when I replace the drywall it will create a barrier between it and any moisture that may come through in the future ?


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

Don't try to trap the water behind the wall, it's actually better if it comes in. It's obviously better if you know it's still coming in. Sealing a section here or there will just channel the water elsewhere and possibly where it could cause serious damage. You should have a floor drain somewhere in the basement. That is a must. I hope the previous owners didn't tile over it.

If this is a one time occurrence due to the current conditions here in TO, it may not happen again for a long time. If however, this problem becomes chronic and at every little sprinkle or thaw, you'll need to spend the money and get your whole foundation waterproofed. You can't just patch a section, the water will seek another entry point.

In the mean time, cut away the damaged drywall, pull out any insulation (check for wetness and how far up it goes) and leave it open for a while. Not only to dry out, but to see if more water seeps in and where. If you suspect a certain area, remove the drywall/insulation all the way to the ceiling. Look for wet spots, colour changes, physical cracks or inspect mortar joints if applicable. Drywall and insulation are relatively cheap, so don't be afraid to excavate a fair portion if required. Count on not enjoying the basement for a while, but the more information you collect now, the better when you need to call in the waterproofing contractor.


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

I say waterproofing is useless without relieving water pressure...


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## johnnyspade (Aug 24, 2007)

I feel for you and it's a total drag that your basement is finished. Your home inspector should have caught even a slightly damp basement with a moisture meter. I would assume it's been damp longer than you have been there though mold can develop fairly quickly.

The advice from KPS is key. Whatever you do, don't trap the mold bin the wall. You need to prevent it from getting into the building altogether and wait until drier weather before tackling that. If you're in an area where the ground needs to thaw you may expect some more water in the Spring. The French drain is a good option.

You may also want to walk the perimeter of the house to see if there's water pooling and where it may be sitting against the house. If you have dirt up against the foundation, or the sills, it can act as a wick. You didn't mention if you have gutters but if you do check to see that they are extended away from the house a little ways and not just dumping the water on your walk.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

dona83 said:


> I say waterproofing is useless without relieving water pressure...


Absolutely! Part of a proper waterproofing job is not just to repair and seal the foundation walls but to drain around the foundation. You have to dig to the footings in order to expose the facade of the foundation, it would be irresponsible of the contractor not to install weeping tile around the footings to facilitate drainage.


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## Loafer (Jan 7, 2004)

I'm thinking the extra water is coming down off the roof and being dumped onto the concrete path and then seeping down the extensive cracks we have between the path and the foundation. I did have a foundation guy round yesterday and he quoted me $34 G's to dig down both sides of the house and install waterproofing....that for me right now is just not an option....3 month old 2nd kid and a wife on maternity leave doesn't leave me with much room for extra cash right now.

Also, based on conversations my wife and I have been having lately we don't expect to be in the house another 20 years.....probably 5 at the most so I can't see how I would ever get that kind of investment back on the house.

I think I will sort out the water issues on the outside.....pull out a bit more of the drywall where the dampness is the worst and patch it up as best I can. Not an option I want to do but it's all I can afford right now.

Thanks for the input guys..... the ehMac community, nothing beats it


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

Whoever you sell the house to may knock out that much or more off their offer to allow for fixing that. You could also get a second opinion... or get a non-biased home inspector in to see what they think needs to be done.


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## Chris (Feb 8, 2001)

I have had great results with a product called UGL damp proofing paint. I had a sudden thaw one year, and my basement flooded. The following summer, I scrubbed down the walls with tsp and an acid wash, then painted two layers of UGL on the walls and at the floor. The basement was completely dry afterwards, even during the next sudden thaw! But, remember, this is damp proofing, not water proofing; if you have water actively flowing into the house, you'll need to take more serious steps.

Having said that, yes, make sure your eavestroughs are draining well away from the house. If you have an area that is pooling against the foundation wall, make sure to use a very good exterior grade waterproofing caulking, and try to grade the ground away. The real solution is probably a full dig-and-drain, but you might get away with an interior drain or even the french drain mentioned by others. What ever you do *CHECK FOR UNDERGROUND SERVICES BEFORE DIGGING!* Hitting a hydro or gas line will make a bit of water in the basement seem inconsequential.

There's been a lot of good advice given here. I'll only add that if you can show a future purchaser that you have taken care of this issue, it will actually add value to the house, as it is a big inconvenience that he won't have to go through.

Best of luck!


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

Having worked as a labourer many years ago for a contractor that did foundations, as well as having done it myself on my house, most of the cost is in labour. The materials cost is very small, as it is the days of digging that is most of the work. That being said...

I would first suggest to do repairs to the inside of the basement, as this is the part most easily accessed. Clean the walls, repoint any of the mortar joints that are in poor condition (if it is a block basement), and fill holes with hydraulic cement. Then you can overcoat it with two coats of parging (portland cement, either mixed yourself or premix as mentioned above). Drywall is a mix of gypsum and starch, so mould not only loves the paper backing, but loves the starch. You will probably have to pull the wall down and repair it correctly.

One common source of leaks, even on a damproofed wall, is that there is a chance that someone actually screwed the studs to the wall. I suggest making the connections at the top into the joists, and tapcon screws into the floor. I also would not, as it is not a bearing wall, put the bottom plate right on the floor, but I would use spacing blocks so there is a small, perhaps 1/2" gap between the plate and the floor. In my own house, I also enveloped the whole wall with vapour barrier, so that water would not leach into the insulation, though I did leave a gap at the outside top above the grade to allow vapour to escape.

Outside, you would need to dig down (call to locate first) and do the wall repairs. Repair all of the mortar joints (if it is a blcok wall), patch holes with hydraulic cement, and overcoat with Portland Cement, followed by a layer of tar. Make sure there is a weeping bed, and that the tile is not clogged. (We did not have any tile around the house originally). We embedded the tile in a bed of gravel, and we also ran the gravel up the wall as we backfilled - though you could use the newer plastic sheets that do the same job (but were not available when we did the house). It is a lot of manual work, but pretty inexpensive (depending on the price of beer) if you can get a bunch of friends to help dig.

My basement has not leaked since we did that twenty years ago. We did the same thing at my uncle's house, but even though we could only treat one side of the house, his basement has been dry for fifteen years because the side we did was the soruce of the problems. I even had to make a number of concrete blocks to fill in the blocks that had completely crumbled away - and that is how all of the water was getting in.

Doing the inside will help a bit - but repairing the outside is the permanent solution. $34 thousand is a lot of money, and I would really get a number of quotes.


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## Boomcha (Jan 29, 2004)

I've also used this UGL product, it comes in oil and latex based. I used the oil based in my cold room before I insulated with extruded polystyrene foam insulation in my non heated "cold room/wine cellar/storage room". That one room looked ROUGH before hand and water would come in when it rained. 

What I did was the same processed as Chris above, cleaned up the wall as per instructions, 2 coats of the Drylok (fist coat by brush and second by roller and man will this stuff get you high). I left it for about 2 months after without any insulation to make sure that water was indeed not coming in anymore and then I insulated it and did the rest of the stuff. There was one section where I left the insulation removable because I got the water service in my house upgraded and looking at it about 1.5 years later the wall were all bone dry. So this stuff works nicely.

UGL - DRYLOK® Masonry - Masonry Waterproofer

The proper thing is do dig it up and fix it the expensive way but this a somewhat decent solution it you are tight on cash or don't want to invest a lot into it.
For sure make sure that you are not draining into the area from the roof and the grade is away from the house, that should be step one.

Jorge


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## Loafer (Jan 7, 2004)

ok guys, I feel a bit better now.
Just had someone else round who quoted me on doing work on the inside. Basically they take off the drywall and studs install a plastic membrane that runs into a small trench around the interior of the wall with weeping tiles that all gets tied up to the drain and a sump pump. Then they concrete it back over.

All this and a promise of a lifetime warranty (even a clause saying they'll pay for any damage to furniture, carpets etc if their system fails) for 1/7 of the price of the exterior work.

All I would need to do it put back the studs and drywall.....easy peasy.
It's a no-brainer for me.


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## Harvey (Oct 9, 2005)

Sounds like that's a recurring problem. Was the basement newly renovated when you bought? Perhaps the sellers were hiding the problem with a quick cover-up.
Did you ask the previous owner about basement damp/flooding? Was it mentioned in the documents? If they lied to you, you can take them to court. If you didn't ask, you're out of luck. 
You may have reason to sue (or threaten to) and have the previous owners cover some or all of the repair costs. (if so do the best job possible!)

Regards
from Ottawa
Harvey


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## Chris (Feb 8, 2001)

That internal weeping will work well, as long as you have a sump installed. We did that on our current house because the foundation is limestone, and not a drop has come in since.

As for the UGL Drylock, I used the latex product which doesn't smell much, if at all.

Sounds like you're on the way to finally solving your problem.:clap: Good luck!


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## Brainstrained (Jan 15, 2002)

Welcome to the world of 1,001 answers, none of which may be the correct solution. 

All of the advice given has been good.

Start, however, with your first inclination - solve your roof drainage problem. Get that water away from the house and you may not have a wet basement problem. Ditto any other potential source of water - that pathway - and poor landscaping - trees close to the house, ground that slopes toward the house, etc. . .

These may not solve the problem, but they are the among least expensive fixes.

If there are cracks and seepage points in the basement walls and foundations, how well any of the other suggestions work will probably depend on the amount of hydrostatic pressure in the ground. Digging up the foundations, installing new tiles and sealant is the most expensive option but it's the one most likely to work and to work for a long time.

Sealing the walls from the inside and installing an interior drainage system could also work for a long time, but not so long if there is substantial hydrostatic pressure. If there are hairline cracks in the floor, the water could eventually work its way through the floor, if it hasn't already. 

A sump could be an affordable long-term solution if the problem is the result of an occasional heavy rain or fast heavy thaw that cause the hydrostatic pressure to spike. My first house had one and I didn't appreciate it much as it only turned on twice in five years. My second house flooded one rainy day almost every spring until I put in a sump. It hasn't turned on in almost two years, but I appreciate the sump enough that every Feb. I check to make sure it works.

So I guess my advice is keep talking to people to learn about possible solutions, get a better idea of what your problem is, don't rush into anything - the problem's probably been there awhile and doesn't need to be solved in a day, and try to find the best solution for your situation.

You really do need to find a solution though. As Harvey alluded to, you now have a legal responsibility to tell anyone interested in buying your home that it has (had) a wet basement. If you can't also tell them that the problem has been repaired and the basement remained dry for X years, the cost of the repairs will come out of the selling price of the house.


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## gastonbuffet (Sep 23, 2004)

"Start, however, with your first inclination - solve your roof drainage problem. Get that water away from the house and you may not have a wet basement problem. Ditto any other potential source of water - that pathway - and poor landscaping - trees close to the house, ground that slopes toward the house, etc. . .

These may not solve the problem, but they are the among least expensive fixes."


this will solve 97% of the problem. Great advice


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## Loafer (Jan 7, 2004)

Ok guys, my new drainage system is nearly complete.

I have a few questions as I will be re-finishing the room myself.
Originally we had a ceramic tiled floor which as you can imagine is horrendously cold. I'm going to put down a subfloor (the 2' particle board with plastic dimpled backer).

Now, do I install the subfloor before I re-do the studs and drywall ?

Also, should I use rigid styrene boards against the concrete foundation and batting ? or one or the other ?

Some places will need the rigid styrene for sure because the studs are only 1-2".....how do I fix it to the wall, is there a special glue for this ?

In the places where I have styrene do I need to put a vapour barrier over it or is the styrene enough to keep the moisture out ?

I think that's about it for now.
Thanks in advance for any input


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## Chris (Feb 8, 2001)

I'd put the floor down first, and put the wall on top. This will make attaching the finished surface (drywall or panelling) much easier.

As for insulation, I have a bias in favour of rigid insulation in below grade situations. Should any moisture penetrate the wall, the rigid foam won't wick it up. It'll trickle down, under the new subfloor you've just installed, and drain away to the new sump. The adhesive is easy to work with, and you won't need a vapour barrier. You'd also be able to frame a wall in front of the insulation using smaller, cheaper, dimensional lumber, if that is your wish. It also installs quite quickly.

That's been my experience, anyway! Have fun!


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

What Chris said.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

There's that floor panel product that you can put down on potentially leaky floors. They're slightly raised and will allow moisture to run directly under them into the drain. Saw them at Home Depot.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Just noticed this thread. Loafer, how did your repair work out?


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## slipstream (May 9, 2011)

Had a problem like that. Went through similar stress thinking I would have to contract out a major drainage excavation. Finally pulled off the drywall to look and discovered that the original builder had put a pipe through the foundation and not sealed it, so every rainfall a bit of water got in. Couple of hundred dollars to a concrete expert sealed the hole, then I replaced the insulation, drywall and drywall better than before.


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