# Canadian Immigration Policies



## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Just tonight, the local news out here on the west coast has reported the forced deportation of an Iranian feminine rights activist to her native Iran. Her familiy is ALL here, legally....and she will almost certainly be imprisoned and possibly even tortured when she arrives back in the homeland that she fled. Where she has NO ONE!

That would be right about now...as you are reading these words. Her plane left this afternoon. For Iran. She was on it, in tears.

But..oddly enough...had she been a foreign born stripper, instead of a foreign born activist for female rights...and ESPECIALLY if she had been a foreign born stripper who had volunteered to work on Liberal Judy Sgo's (the current Immigration Minister in the current Liberal Minority government) campaign for re-election...

Then she would have probably been allowed to stay. By special order from the immigration minister herself!

But she chose NOT to take her clothes off several times per night in a cheesy Toronto airport strip bar while being watched by a bunch of drooling drunken men. And, therefore, never met the chief of office staff for the Liberal Immigration Minister..who apparently conducts much of his office business in this rarefied environment.

And, therefore, she never managed to obtain the same sort of preferential treatment that many of the foreign-born strippers got. (probably after numerous private lap dances with Judy Sgro's top guys).

Is anyone else here even slightly disturbed by this bizarre dichotomy in our Canadian Immigration policies? By none other than the Immigration Minister, herself?

Why is she tossing outspoken foreign feminists (who have come here for sanctuary from their own despotic male-dominated government) to the wolves... while protecting foreign strippers who have worked on her campaign staff?

Am I the only one who sees this as terribly odd? How come no one else here has chosen to make a single comment on this? It has, after all, been one of the main topics in Question Period for about a week or so. It's also been all over the headlines.

Heck...it's even eclipsed the recent revelations about the close connections between Liberal Party insiders and the Gambino crime family of New York. It's also pushed the ongoing major investigation into the massive fraud and theft and money-laundering by the Liberals into the background. Temporarily.

Any thoughts? Comments? Major apologies or excuses?

Your thoughts will be read by many. Your silence will speak volumes. Tread carefully.

And...Fly at it. 

[ December 08, 2004, 02:40 AM: Message edited by: MacNutt ]


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## gwillikers (Jun 19, 2003)

My wife and I were discussing this story tonight after seeing the news story. The decision seems so cruel that we wondered if there was something that the Dept. Of Immigration wasn't disclosing about this case. There needs to be an explanation as to why this woman cannot stay here with her entire family, all of whom have already been accepted into Canada.

I think the Immigration Minister has some explaining to do in this case.


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## iPetie (Nov 25, 2003)

If there is not more to this Iranian womans story, then I am ashamed to be Canadian on this day.
The reality is that there has to be other issues surrounding this deportation, particularly if she has family already established in Canada. People must remember that Canada is one of the hardest countries to be deported from in the world.
Unfortunately again, for the protection of her family already here, immigration or the RCMP are not likely to share that info.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

We need to give the immigration ministry an enema!

I believe today is the final ruling in the American deserter case, let's see how that pans out.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

(something bizarre happened when I tried to reply to this thread. My carefully edited post got scrambeld like alphabet soup)

Okay..here is the gist of it...

We need a new Immigration Minister. NOW!  

There are new allegations of cheques from questionable sources being added to the foreign-born stripper scandal. Jusdy Sgro has lost whatever shred of credibility she might once have had. She will no longer be able to function as an effective Immigration Minister from this point on.

She must resign. Or be fired. Immediately.

My bet is that Martin knows this...and that he will do it during the holiday season when most people are distracted by home and family celebrations. There is some precedent for this. It spares the Liberals any additional embarassment...sort of.

Look for her to leave her portfolio sometime before the first week of January. That's my best guess.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Of course, that won't help the Iranian born woman who is now likely being beaten to a pulp in some fetid prison.


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## Carex (Mar 1, 2004)

Better yet MacNutt, she will likely just end up firing (or they will resign) her staff members. How can she be responsible for what her underlings are doing at all hours of the day. That would take credibility!!


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

And Ministerial responsibilty.

From a Liberal Cabinet Minister. Good luck on that.


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## iPetie (Nov 25, 2003)

Macnutt: again, what a load of crap.

Fact, nobody here cares about the immigration ministers status. Politicians do stupid things and pay for it in the end. We have other things to worry about.

You have a lot of opinions about corrupt politics for a guy who lives in the most politically corrupt province in the country. I'll start with the premiers if you like.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

This particular politician has done more than "stupid things". She is a newly exposed segment of one of the largest organised criminal groups in North America.

The Canadian Liberal Party...led by the horribly corrupt Quebec elite.

And a LOT of people are just now realising this simple fact. And commenting about it. And...apparently...even chanting about it. In public.

Nice to see that some of the sleepwalkers in the Toronto area are finally getting clued in about this. The rest of the country has been onto this subject, in a big way, for a long time. Glad to see you guys are finally getting up to speed here.

A couple of nights back, I watched a late night comedian commenting on the well-publicised connections between some of the higher end Liberals and the New York Gambino Crime family.

He said this:

"Apparently the Gambino Dons and their Capos are quite upset about all of this. They've been trying to clean up their image in the past few years, and are largely legit these days. And they are VERY upset that their good name has been linked to some of the biggest criminals that this continent has ever known! "Those Liberal f*cks up there in Canada have got a whole damn COUNTRY tapped! WE never had more than half a single city! In our BEST year!!"

Massive theft of tax dollars, fraud, money laundering, graft, corruption (all according to the Attorney General of Canada, no less)...and now preferential visas for foreign sex trade workers. Who were conveniently "working for the Immigration Ministers re-election bid.

What the leader of the NDP, Jack Layton, has publicly called "pimping"...

Sounds a lot like organised crime to me. On a massive country-wide scale, no less. No wonder the Gambinos are cheesed at being connected to this batch of big-time criminals!

You know what they say....Walks like a duck...looks like a duck...

It's most probably a duck.


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

In all honesty she was not born in Canada so the Canadian government has the right to determine whether immigrants stay or go. We have a system like no other, Free Health Care, and people are so moronic in wanting more and more people to come into Canada. All those people who want immigrants to come in our country, will you still be saying that once our health care system becomes like the American health care system due to too much use and not enough funds towards it? People bitch and cry about waiting for hours too see a doctor, or many months to see a specialist. Do you honestly think that time will be shortened by allowing more people into Canada?

But thinking about it our health care system is screwed anyways. All these fat obese Canadians who will end up having body aches, heart problems, back problems, diabetes, etc. in their near future will be the ones who destroy our health care system. Thanks fat people, now go back to eating your meal, don't want to burn too many calories moving the mouse too much.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Nope...she wasn't born here. Neither were her whole family. But they are all Canadians now. Just like you and me.

And there are several major foreign-born criminals happily residing in this country. And a whole bunch of foreign born strippers who have been given special Ministerial approval by Judy Sgro to stay here indefinitely...

But this poor lady, who was an activist for women's rights in Iran, has been summarily deported back there. With almost no notice. She is now in custody, and is facing an Islamic Court.

Any idea what she will be going through, right now...this very minute...as we speak? An activist female who is divorced and who has no passport, and who now must face up to a kangaroo court made up of fanatic religious males in the only Islamic State on the planet? A lady who fled her own country in fear for her life from the despotic male-dominated clergy that currently run that horrible place?

She's back there. Right now. And, according to all accounts, was led from the plane in handcuffs by the Islamic Guards.

I shudder to think about her fate.  

But...on the lighter side...at least a whole bunch of strippers from Romania managed to get instant status here in Canada! Without even trying! That's something...right??
All thanks to Immigration Minister Judy Sgro.

Who...quite clearly...has her priorities straight.

Don't you think?


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

Our society is so driven on protecting EVERY human person. For f&*k sakes our world population is over 6 billion and growing quickly. She is only a number, if she dies she dies. That's one less polluter in this world. As a species our emotion and brain capacity is our downfall. We have created so much technology and we emotionally feel everyone should have access to it, but that results in MASS pollution. It's idiotic how we worry about 1 woman's death yet we kill other species for sport.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Not sure if I share your thoughts on this, Spike.

But I certainly DO question why THIS woman had to be thrown to the wolves by our own Immigration Minister, while a whole bunch of foreign-born strippers got special permission to stay here.

Especially today, now that we know that some of these foreign-born strippers were handing secret cheques to the Immigration Minister while using third party names to cover the graft.

Say...here's a thought!

Maybe we should deport Judy Sgro to Iran...and let HER face an Islamic court made up of fanatic males.

A few months in an Iranian jail might make a believer out of even the most hardened Liberal criminal in our current minority government. Especially a female one.

Now that would be just one more tiny bit of insignifigant biomass that no one would really miss in this great sea of six billion human beings.

In fact...we'd probably all so much the better off for it, really.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Just got a late night long-distance phine call from a buddy of mine who resides in the TO area. He had some buddies over to his place for some sort of a birthday celebration, and they all spontaneously erupted in a major chant about the current (and soon to be replaced) Immigration Minister. No doubt after a few brewskis...

He dialed my number and just held the phone up so I could hear what the crowd was chanting. He knew I'd enjoy it.

I picked up the phone, and heard a large crowd singing..

"Judy Sgro has GOT to GO!
Judy Sgro has GOT to GO!
We don't know much...but THIS we know..
Judy Sgro has GOT TO GO!!"

This was followed by loud beery cheers. From a largely Liberal-sympathetic hockey-starved crowd, BTW.

Then they started the chant again. A bit louder and nastier this time. It went on and on...

Warmed my black old heart...lemme TELL you!   

Makes me think that there is a faint hope for this country yet!


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

and why would you agree MacNutt, because the view is different from the common dribble that society has provoked on it's residents. With such overpopulation that means more distribution of money by the government, meaning less money for each person than if there were less people to begin with. Our society is going back in time where the wealthy control our society (ie drug companies, cigarette companies, fast food companies) and we, the middleclass/lowerclass, are the peasants meant to wallow in the depths that we have created for ourselves while the wealthy go elsewhere to live a greater life.

Sad how people are conformed by the higher power, and by higher power I dont mean that fictional character people call "God".


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## Pelao (Oct 2, 2003)

> t's idiotic how we worry about 1 woman's death yet we kill other species for sport.


Until, of course, that 1 woman is someone important to you.


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

Paleo - as I stated; emotions are our downfall. They have clearly experienced life. What more must they do? Live till 1000 doing the same things each and everyday?

There was a study with rats. The scientists created an environment that provided ENDLESS amounts of food and water for these rats, but let them populate uncontrolably. Even though the rats had unlimited food they began killing each other because their population was getting out of control. We will begin doing this in the very near future and it is quite evident.


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## Pelao (Oct 2, 2003)

> emotions are our downfall


Speak for yourself. I like my emotions and those of the people around me. They give expression to life. A balanced mix of reasoning and emotion is wonderful. I enjoy the feelings of loving and being loved.

Nope. Not a downfall.

Quite the opposite.


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

Pelao - I would like to see your response to the world that will be in 2025 when your loved ones have created 1000's of tonnes of pollution and used energy, made by nuclear material, making the world horrid and practically uninhabitable. Where school tuition will be in the $100,000 range. "Love will keep us together" they say, but that is only valid until we "snap" and become crazed through confinement.


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## Pelao (Oct 2, 2003)

So here we are, in time travel land. While at school in to 70s we had lots of this doomsday stuff. We are running out of this or that. Pollution will kill us all. We'll be overrun by people. All by the year 2000.

Of course we need to be concerned about resources and the environment, and certainly take more action than we are now.

However, the projections I have read see the worlds population leveling off at around 8 billion. A challenge? Well certainly. I believe that we'll manage it. It will be easier now that we may possibly be down by 1 woman. Yippee.


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

It's idiotic how someone believes 8 billion is an ok manageable number. 8 Billion! is ok, yet we kill animals when numbers are over 100 for a certain area, thus being overpopulated. Christianity is our societies downfall for we must let every human species live, killing any other species needed to keep as many humans alive.


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## Pelao (Oct 2, 2003)

> Christianity is our societies downfall


Well at least we have evolved as a species. A while ago it was emotions.

So, this means that those who practice other religions, or none at all, are not having a negative impact on our world?

I share your concerns regarding population and resource sharing.

I suspect we may have somewhat different thoughts on what we can do about it.


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

Christianity has perpetuated us to "believe" that everyone is equal, from the retarded to beautiful, disallowing us to remove those of lesser need (the retarded) because we become emotionally attached.


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

This isn't about Christianity or emotions...it's about fairness, equality and consistency in our immigration policy. Keep religion, wildlife culling, pollution, overpopulation, and whatever else you're preaching out of it.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

> remove those of lesser need (the retarded)


How kind of you.


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

> Christianity has perpetuated us to "believe" that everyone is equal, from the retarded to beautiful, disallowing us to remove those of lesser need (the retarded) because we become emotionally attached.


I'll take that as a compliment.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

*Christianity has perpetuated us to "believe" that everyone is equal, from the retarded to beautiful, disallowing us to remove those of lesser need (the retarded) because we become emotionally attached.*

So are you proposing a final solution to the Christian, retarded, or emotional question?

I mean, seriously, what are you trying to say?


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

I'm just saying get rid of those in society that we don't need. 

Getting rid of those at the lower end of the spectrum (ie homeless, retards, etc.) is logical, but emotions make it sound crazy.

Think about it; humans are the leading cause of earthly destruction, therefore to reduce earthly destruction we reduce human population.

[ December 10, 2004, 01:37 AM: Message edited by: spike326 ]


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## ehMax (Feb 17, 2000)

> Getting rid of those at the lower end of the spectrum (ie homeless, retards, etc.) is logical, but emotions make it sound crazy.


Actually, it sounds like Hitler.


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

ehMax - you say that why? because you are emotionally attached to humans. Why does one eat chicken? We say because its different, but in actual fact chicken isnt different. They have muscle and fat, as do we. We eat them because we are not emotionally attached to them. If emotions werent a factor in your decision to say "Hitler" it would be highly logical to reduce the human population. And if we did it would be rediculous to get rid of those who are say environmentalists than to get rid of homeless people.


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## Chealion (Jan 16, 2001)

Spike - Your viewpoint is popularly thought to be completely ignorant and inhumane. The reason is because emotions, rationalization and adaption are what make us different from any other animal or machine on the planet. Would that not count for something? I would just like to see the rationalization for deciding that any emotion, or any defect (sign of weakness) is reason for that person to be killed.

Emotions have good and bad points. I think I need to watch Equilibrium again.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

*I'm just saying get rid of those in society that we don't need. *

Why such a selfish viewpoint? Why "we don't need them, liquidate them? *Dr. Evil pinky*" and not "we need to change our society to take better care of our own?"

Both options are radical changes, which one do you suppose would be the most beneficial to us as a people?

*it would be rediculous[sic] to get rid of those who are say environmentalists than to get rid of homeless people.*

Who's to say that a homeless person wouldn't be an environmentalist if given a proper chance? Or a doctor? or a lawyer? or one of a thousand other occupations?

And if you are going to liquidate the handicapped, why not liquidate the ignorant? I mean, better just to get rid of them than to educate them. What about the poor? They aren't quite homeless, but they are still a burden on our society, right? 

Where, exactly, on this slippery slope do you plan to stop sliding?


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

I'm just saying that in the last 100+ years we have destroyed the earth which took 4billion years to make. 100 years times resulted in a drastic change, and the only way to save the earth is through another drastic change. I think its great that their are so many people enjoying the earth, but why have that knowing the earth wont be as it is today in 100 years with so many people?


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## Pelao (Oct 2, 2003)

> I'm just saying that in the last 100+ years we have destroyed the earth


Now I understand!
The earth I live on has not been destroyed. The one you live on has been destroyed. You should visit this one. Lots of troubles, but lots of good stuff too.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Spike, your solutions are completely out of step with humanity. While many agree that we cannot go on devastating and abusing our planet, the mere idea of terminating human life as a solution is abhorrent. Indeed, it's not even imaginative. We have a joint responsibility to making the world a better place and a likely scenario if we carry on the way we are is that there will be mass death. However, wilful termination of any human life is not a solution. If you think it is, then perhaps you'll be first to volunteer?


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

used to be jwoodget - if there was a signed document stating the human population would be decreased throughout the world to levels below 6 billion I would kindly volunteer for the sake of the world and other species.


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

Pelao - you are just one of many who believe the world is great. Why do you think products like Football were created? They were created so that the dumbfounded would be taken to a different world, a false world that they would believe is great.


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## Pelao (Oct 2, 2003)

> Why do you think products like Football were created? They were created so that the dumbfounded would be taken to a different world, a false world that they would believe is great.


Thanks for clearing that up.


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

Why bother with you people; too conformed to even understand.


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## Chealion (Jan 16, 2001)

> f there was a signed document stating the human population would be decreased throughout the world to levels below 6 billion I would kindly volunteer for the sake of the world and other species.


Am I to take this as you would be one of the ones who would willingly give up their life in order to reduce the population or that you would sponsor the erasure of thousands of people in order to "save the earth"?

The original intent of this thread was about immigration, which is the moving of people from one country to another. Not the process of over populating. I've never seen immigration to be a source of over population (refugee situations not withstanding).

Granted, people are polluting the earth and if something doesn't change we may regret it in the future, but to say that the Earth can not support 6 billion people I can not fathom. The Earth can support well more then that, but it won't be able to sustain 6 billion at a standard of life comparable to the rich and famous today.

As for football, it's a game. The purpose of games is leisure, and with leisure time tends to come a moral boost allowing people to enjoy life. Would you rather just work at your job 24/7 and have no time for yourself? I don't know anyone who can do that.

You may believe we are too conformed, but I prefer to think of it as engrained in a little more realistic reality. Who gives anyone else the right to decide whether they are good enough to live or die because of their current economic situation?


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## spike326 (Aug 22, 2004)

rather than wasting any more of my time I'm not going to reply anymore.


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## thewitt (Jan 27, 2003)

Please do post again. This has been very entertaining.

Especially the part where you would volunteer if there was agreement to keep the population under a specified amount. Maybe there are others that share your thinking and if everyone just started offing themselves the population would round down to where you would be happy... But you wouldn't be here to be happy... Maybe that isn't a good plan?


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Okay...I'm going to go wayyy out on a limb and attempt to derail this wayward thread back onto it's original subject.

Can anyone else here see the horrible irony in our very own Immigration Minister (Judy Sgro) granting special visas to foreign born strippers while actively deporting feminine rights activists back into male dominated countries where they will be imprisoned or killed?

And does anyone here care what might have become of the poor Iranian born lady that was the original subject of this thread?

What do you suppose HER particular reality is, right this very minute?


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Hey Macnutt, while I think Sgro's department does some stupid things, they also do 275,000 good things a year. I don't think Sgro is the issue here, its the plight of the Iranian woman. But wait a minute - I thought you were accusing the Liberals of supporting Muslim extremists......

I sincerely hope she is safe but I don't think that she should be used as a topic for political games.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

If the term, as you put it, "political games" means granting special Canadian visas to a whole raft of foreign born strippers while actively pursuing the deportation...into hostile conditions...of female activists. Who have ALL of their family residing here in Canada....

Then, perhpas, I might suggest that we change the "gameplayers". Because it's not really fun anymore.

Especially for that poor Iranian born champion of feminine equality. You know..the one who thought she was safe here in Canada with all the rest of her family?  

(Hey...want to bet that SHE isn't seeing this as any sort of "game" right about now? If she's even still alive at this point.) 

Perhaps it's high time we changed out the people who are in charge of the "game".

They don't seem to be playing very fair, these days.

To say the very least.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Interesting...

Two days of dead silence from the small handful of totally committed supporters of the fading Federal Liberals here at ehmac. You know...the ones who are so vocal in their enthusiastic support of this horribly corrupt bunch of wastrels on pretty much every OTHER thread.

But here...they choose to fade into the woodwork and stay quiet. For a change.

Especially in the face of YET ANOTHER major scandal!   

Why am I not at all surprised?


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Sorry been busy..... you know how it is...... In the meantime, perhaps you could bring yourself to answering some of the challenges made to you?

The Iranian woman is, as far as we know, an isolated case. I thought you were in favour of deporting anyone who sounds like they are from an Islamic nation.... I do think Immigration Canada may have screwed up on this case but I don't see the point of bashing Sgro. That is political gaming since having her ousted would do precisely nothing for the deported woman. But that's the point, n'est-ce pas?


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

It's funny.

If a thread heats up and Macnutt disappear for a few days or weeks, it's because his water business suddenly got busy. Real life needed his attention, and all that.

If a thread heats up and anyone else disappears for a few days, obviously it because they've been scared into hiding.

It's such a stark contrast.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Interesting. We now have at least three seperate known incidences of forced deportation into hostile Iran. these are people who, by the way, have ALL of their families living here in Canada and who will almost certainly be jailed and possibly even killed once they return to that repressive country. People who have been working and paying taxes here in Canada...and who are NOT implicated in any sort of criminal activities of any sort. But they HAVE to leave. NOW!

On the other hand... we have Judy Sgro, who was removed today as Federal Immigration Minister under a massive cloud of corruption. She is being loudly accused of selling special Ministerial permits that allowed certain "special people" to stay here in Canada. "Special People" like stripper/hookers from Romania who were brought into Canada by known organised crime figures and even a pizza shop owner who helped her her with her re-election campaign. And who supplied her campaign office workers with all the free pizza they could eat. Several of the stripper/hookers apparently worked on Judy Sgro's re-election camaign as well. Gee...big surprise.

My question here is this...

How much longer can we Canadians put up with this dog and pony show from the deeply corrupt and failing Federal Liberals? How many more massive scandals will it take before we all wake up and decide that we have had enough of this nonsense?

Part two of the last Federal Election will take place sometime this year. There will be a vote of non-confidence in the current minority government and we will all be going back to the polls. Probably sooner than anyone ever expected.

Want more of the same, this time around? More corruption? More top-level indecision (like the terribly late tsunami relief effort). More massive waste of Canadian tax dollars (like the multi-billion dollar gun registry, just to name one)? If so..then cast your vote accordingly.

The rest of us...about eight out of every ten Canadians...are ready for a change at the top. A long overdue one.

Watch and see.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

MacNutt said:


> The rest of us...about eight out of every ten Canadians...are ready for a change at the top. A long overdue one.


Yup, that's right. Just under 8 in every 10 Canadians didn't vote for the Liberals. Of course, just over 8 in every 10 Canadians didn't vote for the Conservatives, and somewhere around 9 in every 10 didn't vote for the NDP or the Bloc.

Of course, that is counting everyone that was eligible to vote, not everyone who did. One should also bear in mind that an abstention from voting does not count against anyone, it counts against everyone.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

What it means to me, PB, is that the vast majority of the Canadian people aren't exactly enthusiastic supporters of our current Liberal minority government.

It remains to be seen if all the new scandals have irrevocably damaged this delicate thread of power that they still stubbornly cling to.

I suspect that we'll have a chance to find out, sometime this year. Minority governments in Canada rarely last more than eighteen months. That means that time is running out for these guys.

But...realistically...they may have several more months to go before the inevitable non-confidence vote in the House of Commons.

Plenty of time to reveal several NEW scandals! :scream: :lmao:


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Over 80% of the Canadian population were supportive of the governments handling of the tsunami disaster. The Canadian economy is steaming ahead. Sgro# has effectively removed herself as a whipping boy for the Opposition*. Hmmm..... no evidence of panic on Sussex Drive.....

Meanwhile Ralph is doing his absolute damndest to unscrew the Conservatives chances by his call for a massive cull of beefstock and for healthcare privatization. He *must* be on Martins payroll.

#Sgro has vigorously denied the claims of the pizza parlour owner and removed herself from office while the claim is contested. Will be interesting to see how this develops as I think there is a lot more to this than meets the eye.

*An Opposition that seems to define itself entirely in the negative. Where are these guys?


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Keep on clinging to faint hope there Jim. Apologies and hasty explanations for the latest Liberal Party failures and scandals and resignations and firings of Cabinet Ministers who depart under a cloud of coruption will be treated as good entertainment by most of the rest of us. Especially in the absence of an NHL hockey season.

We need the comic relief. Keep em coming!! :lmao:


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

A quick recap and listing of the current Liberal Party scandals and screwups. For those of you Canadians who are missing hockey as a nightly bloodsport, and who need something to replace it. Just for the entertainment value:

-Liberal MP Carolyn Parrish was summarily fired by Paul Martin after her repeated public outbursts (and tearful recants) in front of the popular press. She was actually removed from the Liberal Party when she began to direct her bizarre outbursts against Paul Martin himself. Pretty much everyone who has been in contact with her thinks she needs some serious medical help and perhaps even psychological counselling. But people in southern Ontario actually elected her to a key position in the Federal Government of this country (what...there was no "none of the above" box on that ballot?)...and this silly root vegetable, who was the carefully considered choice of so many Ontarians, may NOW hold the key vote that might just bring this shaky minority government down in the upcoming non-confidence vote that every political pundit thinks is just around the corner. (see below)

-Paul Martin's minority government is on VERY shaky ground these days. Even with every single Liberal Party member, and every single NDP Party member voting on the government's side...they STILL won't have a majority in the house. They are in serious trouble. And are very vulnerable to any sort of a concerted attack by the other parties on a contentious policy point.Their days are numbered. And Paul knows it.

He's not driving the herd these days...he's on foot, running in front of the herd. While trying not to get run over. Don't expect any sort of real leadership from THIS lame duck!

-The multi-billion dollar Canadian gun registry is still eating up tens of millions of tax dollars every single month. While doing absolutely NOTHING to stem gun violence in this country. (in fact...it's doing practically NOTHING to actually register most of the long guns in this country, as well. But that's beside the point.) The Paul Martin government has recently declined the opportunity to alter this failed policy in order to remake it into something that MIGHT actually work. Probably for fear of offending the still present Chretienistas in the Federal Liberal Party. It would be a giant insult to the former King Jean if yet another of his favorite programs were to be exposed as a total failure. A VERY EXPENSIVE failure, at that.

Which brings us to the next part of this silly soap opera...

-Canadian Sovereignty. Because of the policies of the past ten years of Liberal rule...we Canadians no longer have the military capability to even patrol our own borders or coastlines. We cannot even HOPE to actually defend them from anything at all. Even in a time of national disaster, we no longer have enough soldiers or staff to actually help the population to deal with the problem. And we certainly don't have the ability to transfer the few troops that we still DO have to any sort of distaster/war zone ( our airlift capability for personnel and equipment is virtually nonexistant these days). Not that they could actually help or anything. Their military/rescue equipment is horribly outdated. Much of it is actually nonfunctional. Or only exists on paper. (The money that was supposedly spent on nonexistent gear went "elsewhere". Big surprise.)

The Canadian Coast Guard has been equally starved into almost total uselessness during the past decade of Chretien/Martin mismanagement. We have no ships in our Coast Guard or Navy that can operate in ice laden waters. In a country with the second longest ice prone coastline on the whole planet. Many of the Coast Gurad ships that are still operating are barely seaworthy and a bunch of them are tied up awaiting repairs. Or fuel.

We have Canadian submarines that are a deadly threat to the people who man them and helicopters that can barely stay in the air. A tiny handful of outdated fighter aircraft, and army jeeps that are so out of date that we aren't even bringing any of them back from the last place that they were deployed. We send our brave few soldiers into bright white desert warfare with dark green camoflage. And no armour. People laugh at them. And shoot at them.

Bottom line here? Currently...we Canadians rely totally upon the Americans to defend our soveriegnty. And to help us out in the event of a major national disaster. We are no longer capable of doing these jobs ourselves, as we could in the past.

We rely upon the Americans to do this, while several of our most prominient Liberal Government officials loudly insult them and their leader. They call them idiots and fascists. In public. Repeatedly. And laugh at them.

Let's hope the Americans have a great sense of humor. And a slow fuse.

BTW...The reason that Paul Martin's Liberal government was so slow to respond to the huge Asian tsunami disaster (almost two weeks before the first Canadian reponse arrived) has been reported to be both political infighting in the deeply divided Liberal Party, and the fact that...like all of the rest of our military...the DART teams were not actually fully equipped with the equipment they needed to do the jobs that they had been trained to do. The DART teams have been around for eight years now. Which is practically a heartbeat in the military procurement timeframe of the Chretien/Martin Liberal Party. It's been reported trhat some of the DARRT equipment...like some of the military equipment...exists on paper only. The money to buy the gear may have been diverted "elsewhere". No wonder they didn't have all the right equipment yet. Wonder if they ever would have, had there not been a major disaster? Wonder what would have been their response time if Canada had had a major disaster of this magnitude??

Wait...there's more. LOTS more.

-We now have a Liberal Party Immigration Minister, Judy Sgro, who has been publicly accused of selling special Ministerial permits for residency status in Canada...to foreign-born strippers and hookers and criminals, no less...in return for help with her re-election campaign!! (no doubt there were a few more monetary kickbacks in there as well, for the Big Boss at the TOP. That's how it works in any sort of organised criminal enterprise, after all).

While all of this permit-selling was going on...this very same Liberal Immigration Minister...Judy Sgro... has been very busy deporting several honest taxpaying people who came here as political refugees from repressive countries like Iran. Refugees who, by the way, already have all of their immediate family well established in Canada. As long-term Canadian citizens, no less. Oh yeah...and one of them is a noted spokeswoman for women's rights in Iran! A lady who well may be facing a death sentence in that horribly repressive country right now, due to Judy Sgro's hasty deportation order. (too bad she wasn't a stripper. Maybe she would have been allowed to stay here in Canada.) :yikes: 

-Do I even need bother to remind anyone here of the dozen or so major investigations into the biggest political scandal that Canada has ever seen? You know...the one that the Auditor General has called an "Fraud and money-laundering schmeme on a grand scale'?

-Do I need to remind anyone here that pretty much ALL of the closest confidants of the former King Jean are now either in jail or on trial for stealing more than a hundred million dollars of Canadian tax money? (the reality is probably ten times that much. But, I digress...)

-Do I need to remind everyone here that one of thye former King Jean's closest buddies...the guy who was in charge of the many programs that all that money was stolen from...has now been connected to a famous organised crime family from New York? Not that this should surprrise anyone...his accounting company has been connected to them for many many years.

It goes on and on. And it just gets juicier and juicier the deeper you look. The judge in charge of one of the main investigations into the massive Liberal theft of taxpayers dollars has said that "the very best is just around the corner".

Heck...it's BETTER than hockey! No writer of fiction could have EVER come up with such outrageous stuff! Not in a million years!! Talk about "Reality Television"!! :scream:

And It'll certainly do...at least until we get our national sport back again. Too much fun! :lmao: :scream:


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

And THAT, my friends, is just the short version of the ongoing dog and pony show that we call the Federal Liberal Party of Canada. 

It would be truly laughable and lots of good fun...if it were happening to somebody else. :scream: 

Don't you think?


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> The Canadian Coast Guard has been equally starved into almost total uselessness during the past decade of Chretien/Martin mismanagement. We have no ships in our Coast Guard or Navy that can operate in ice laden waters. In a country with the second longest ice prone coastline on the whole planet. Many of the Coast Gurad ships that are still operating are barely seaworthy and a bunch of them are tied up awaiting repairs. Or fuel.


You may want to have a look-see here and see how many ships Canada has that can actually operate in ice laden waters:

http://www.ccg-gcc.gc.ca/vessels-navires/main_e.htm

If you can back up your latter two allegations relating to repairs and lack of fuel that would be great. Ships tied up to a wharf do not qualify.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> -Do I need to remind everyone here that one of thye former King Jean's closest buddies...the guy who was in charge of the many programs that all that money was stolen from...has now been connected to a famous organised crime family from New York? Not that this should surprrise anyone...his accounting company has been connected to them for many many years.


Has now been connected? What does that really mean? Well, it seems that the story broke in the New York Daily News...a highly-respected piece of journalism that has on today's front cover "Diet Advice for Free!" as one of its headliners. In the article, they quote an FBI informant-Frank Lino, who says that Gagliano is a made member of a crime family. Keep in mind that Mr. Lino is characterized as a killer, a loan shark and an accomplished liar.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

*Yea, BUT*

Quote:
"Keep in mind that Mr. Lino is characterized as a killer, a loan shark and an accomplished liar."

Also keep in mind that Mr. Gagliano is a Liberal involved in Adscam, which enhances his chances of being corrupt.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

MacNutt,

Your credibility in judging the political aspiraitons of the Canadian electorate leaves much to be desired. Your black and white treatment of all things political (right wing good, everything else bad) provides entertaining rhetoric (for some) but the world is not black and white. At this rate, there will be no need for anyone to buy a National Post, listen to Rush Limbaugh or to watch Fox News....... we have Radio MacNutt.


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

MacNutt said:


> What it means to me, PB, is that the vast majority of the Canadian people aren't exactly enthusiastic supporters of our current Liberal minority government.


That's all well and good, but by the same logic there are even fewer people who are enthusiastic about the Conservatives, the NDP, the Bloc, etc.

Also, using now 7 month old election data to justify your opinion that the Liberals are "failing" or somehow unsupported by the populace is a tad foolish in this day and age, don't you think? Why not look up some current public opinion polls and share them with us?


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Just thought I'd revive this thread now that Judy Sgro has been canned as Immigration Minister...and now that there are some new revelations about her office selling special Ministerial permits to certain...ahem...types of people, while deporting pretty much everyone who didn't help out in her re-election campaign. Or hand over a big kickback like the strip clubs did when she gave the peelers a free pass.

Any of you ehmaclanders out there actually vote for this miserable excuse for a human being? Feel good about it now?

This would be a good time to vent if you are feeling frustrated by all of this. Or remorseful.

Or it might be a good time to stay silent and hope it will all go away. Along with all the rest of the criminal investigations against the Federal Liberals. (yeah...like THAT'S gonna happen!)

Your choice.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> Just thought I'd revive this thread now that Judy Sgro has been canned as Immigration Minister...and now that there are some new revelations about her office selling special Ministerial permits to certain...ahem...types of people, while deporting pretty much everyone who didn't help out in her re-election campaign. Or hand over a big kickback like the strip clubs did when she gave the peelers a free pass.
> 
> 
> Your choice.


I just finished cleaning a very dirty indoor grill so I figure...why stop there?  

MacNutt...seriously, where do you get your info?

A. Sgro was not canned...she resigned.
B. What new revelations? The only new revelations is that videotape which shows her accuser (or not) being made into a liar once again.
C. What kickbacks from strip clubs?

I suspect that you're going to keep silent on answering those questions...as per usual.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

-If you think that Judy Sgro's resignation under a cloud of controversy wasn't as a result of some top level prodding then you are definitely wearing rose colored glasses with lenses like coke bottle bottoms.

-The fact that Sgro's office was granting special Ministerial visas for residency in Canada to foreign sex trade workers at the behest of organised crime figures while actively deporting taxpaying relatives of Canadian citizens back to troubled countries like Iran should tell you what was really going on. Why would it not be the other way around if there were no money changing hands? Do I have to connect the dots for you?

Or are you one of those innocents who still somehow cling to the belief that the Federal Liberals are NOT connected to organised crime? Even after all that has transpired? All of the fraud and theft and all of the ongoing criminal investigations? The Auditor Generals many scathing reports? Man..those rose glasses MUST be thick!


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## iPetie (Nov 25, 2003)

MacNutt- said:


> The fact that Sgro's office was granting special Ministerial visas for residency in Canada to foreign sex trade workers at the behest of organised crime figures while actively deporting taxpaying relatives of Canadian citizens back to troubled countries like Iran should tell you what was really going on. Why would it not be the other way around if there were no money changing hands? Do I have to connect the dots for you?


Sgro is an idiot, of that I have no challenge. The rest is pure blather. Do you know the inside facts as to why that woman was deported. Because Macnutt, getting deported from this country is almost impossible for for even convicted felons. That story and the subsequent outrage disappeared very quickly. Why? You know we Canadians can't let go of a good injustice. 
Provide Facts and links with your accusations please. Otherwise it's just slander.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

I've just lost yet another long detailed reply. I've had it with fighting this buggy mess for tonight.

See you tomorrow.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

*Looks Like a Plot to Me!!!*

An interesting article caught my eye in the Globe today:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/TPStory/LAC/20050201/SGRO01/TPNational/TopStories

Can it be? Can this all be some sort of plot by the nefarious Conservatives? Consorting with child traffickers...sheesh...how much lower can they sink?


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Not sure how much lower Judy Sgro and the terribly corrupt Liberals can sink. Or HAVE sunk, in the past.

The evidence is all out there for anyone to see for themselves. Only a completely indoctrinated apologist could POSSIBLY excuse all of their sins at this point.

Good luck on THAT!


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

I don't know...child trafficker is pretty low...how do the Conservatives square that?


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Nice try.  

I'd guess you'd have to compare that fleeting allegation to all of the well established charges of massive fraud and theft and money laundering that the Federal Liberals are now facing. You know...the ones that were leveled against them by none other that the Auditor General of Canada....

Paul Martin will be on the witness stand in the following week. So will Jean Chretien.

They will be attempting to explain their obvious involvement in this, the most massive scandal in Canadian history.

I can't recall any time in the past when a sitting Prime Minister or his recently retired boss was EVER required to sit on the witness stand and explain their questionable previous behavior before the Canadian people. Not EVER!

So...given those facts...

Care to rephrase your question, Ironmac? Or care to go silent and not deal with the obvious reality?

Your choice.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

Ignoring the question? Derailing the original thread? Typical...


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

I'd say that SOMEONE is certainly avoiding the question around here.

Paul Martin and Jean Corruptien are at their very lowest ebb these days. At least outside of the rareified confines of municipal Toronto.

Just this week "The Economist" has loudly proclaimed Paul Martin to be the new "Mr. Dithers". They also say that he is "Not up to the job of running Canada"...and that "there is a serious leadership gap at the highest levels in Ottawa these days".

No sh*t sherlock. What was your first clue.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

MacNutt said:


> Paul Martin will be on the witness stand in the following week. So will Jean Chretien.
> 
> I can't recall any time in the past when a sitting Prime Minister or his recently retired boss was EVER required to sit on the witness stand and explain their questionable previous behavior before the Canadian people. Not EVER!
> 
> So...given those facts...


Actually, our first PM..Sir John A. MacDonald was required to sit on the witness stand and I believe that he was in office. So, given that fact...


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## gastonbuffet (Sep 23, 2004)

conservatives vs. liberals, a never ending story!!!
boohh booh booring


Spike was right!!!!!!!!

let 's start the cleansing with politicians. 


leave me alone, i'm off the meds!


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## MasterBlaster (Jan 12, 2003)

.


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Here we go again....


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## gastonbuffet (Sep 23, 2004)

ok, i'm losing track here.
let's recapitulate, we kill politicians, we kill Hondurans, we kill iranians..........wait, err, sorry , we save all iranians and kill ???? irakis?. What about Koreans?, at least let's bomb the north part. Americans we should leave alone cause ehmac would go down...........mexicans are saved by fajitas and tortillas. Do we need France?


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Nobody needs France. And I'm not touchin the rest of your post. No way.


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

gastonbuffet said:


> ok, i'm losing track here.
> let's recapitulate, we kill politicians, we kill Hondurans, we kill iranians..........wait, err, sorry , we save all iranians and kill ???? irakis?. What about Koreans?, at least let's bomb the north part. Americans we should leave alone cause ehmac would go down...........mexicans are saved by fajitas and tortillas. Do we need France?


Like I asked in another thread . . What ARE you smoking?


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

Must be "BC bud" laced with animal tranquilisers. Nothing else would explain it.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

France has given us haute cuisine, petit pain au chocolate, the statue of Liberty, brie, champagne, Bordeaux, Pasteur, truffles, Nice, la Tour Eiffel, the Champs Elysée. OK so their car designs kinda suck but overall France has given and continues to give the world far more than its ever taken. Vive la France!


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

But what have they done for us lately? All of that stuff was from a bygone age. Looong ago!

France and the French, as we know them today, are on the cusp of a major change. Both politically and socially.

Hopefully, when this big makeover happens, we will be treated to a Gallic poulation that bathes a bit more regularly. And who aren't so collectively bitchy. And has restaraunt waiters who are not so carefully studied in the art of obnoxiousness.

And that's just the short list.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Thanks for yet again stereotyping and insulting an entire population of 60-odd million in one little post. You don't think that a waiter might perceive of your inate condescension and thus treat you appropriately? You must get that a lot....


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## MacNutt (Jan 16, 2002)

French waiters and the French in general are well known and well documented by almost everyone who has ever been there. It's been the subject of jokes for years now...and even their tourist beureaus have been working hard to counter this widespread impression of France that everyone seems to come home with. Without much luck (too much hard evidence to the contrary, I'd suspect)

And...of course...the more politically correct among us instantly erupt in outrage whenever any of these commonly held truisms is brought up in public.  

Luckily, truth seems to be winning out over political correctness these days. The PC types seem to have less and less traction each year.

Funny about that, eh?


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## PosterBoy (Jan 22, 2002)

MacNutt said:


> the French in general are well known and well documented by almost everyone who has ever been there


No, Parisians have been. All of the people that I met in the south of France were nice, open, well mannered and, contrary to popular belief, bathed every day.

But hey, if it gets in the way of your stereotype, feel free to ignore it.


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## IronMac (Sep 22, 2003)

It's pathetic how some people look at the balance sheet of who did what for whom and thereby tot up the worth of a people. Does liberating a people mean that they should be indebted forever? How long should that particular act last?

Which brings into question the Dutch, Belgians, Greeks, Italians...should we have liberated them because they did or did not do something for us? Pathetic!


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Pathetic is an appropriate word. Political correctness can go too far, but rednecked asshole-ism seems always to be capable of extending the bounds even further.... QED.


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