# Which wood burning stove?



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

So, our 25 odd year old Regency wood burner is toast, we need to replace it. There is currently a federal rebate on EPA approved stoves so those are the type we're looking at.

As far as specs are concerned, we really only need to heat about 250 square feet but if there is spillover into the rest of the house that can get circulated via the furnace blower fan, so be it. I'd say 2000 square feet max. Budget is $1500 so soapstone is probably out. Function more important than form, bells, whistles. Glass door would be nice.

Suggestions? Brands? Any further info required? I wouldn't even have a problem picking one up stateside if necessary.

TIA


----------



## Dr T (May 16, 2009)

*Buy stove and wood locally*



FeXL said:


> So, our 25 odd year old Regency wood burner is toast, we need to replace it. There is currently a federal rebate on EPA approved stoves so those are the type we're looking at.
> 
> As far as specs are concerned, we really only need to heat about 250 square feet but if there is spillover into the rest of the house that can get circulated via the furnace blower fan, so be it. I'd say 2000 square feet max. Budget is $1500 so soapstone is probably out. Function more important than form, bells, whistles. Glass door would be nice.
> 
> ...


Your specs are incomprehensible. How many cubics units are you looking to heat?
What is your wood source? Your own woodlot (Like us) or do you buy from the guy? hat affects the investment, does it not?

And surely you can buy a stove locally, you do not have to schlepp one in from a foreign country.


----------



## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Lived many in an area where everyone heated either exclusively or mainly by wood. Many of the differences are advertising hype. Look for cast iron doors that seal really well. Look for a good firebrick lining as even good heavy steel needs some protection from the heat generated. If you do go for glass doors learn the simple trick of cleaning the glass with a damp paper towel and wood ash. Free and it works a lot better than commercial products.

Are you cutting your own? Permits run $5.35 for a cord and a half (5 Cubic Meters) in this part of the world. Otherwise have seen prices as high as $200/cord. Though $125-175 is a bit closer to the norm.

Almost anything you buy is going to tend to overheat 200 sq. feet. So definitely figure on some way to divert some of the heat into the rest of the house.

Obviously Russian/Finnish fire places are at least 10 times your budget and weighing in at 2-4 tons are extremely massive but if you are going to be there awhile they may be worth considering. The heat is extremely even and a hot two hour fire will warm the masonry and the room for more than 24 hours. The draw on these suckers is incredible and you won't feel like you are feeding a volcano.

If this is just to heat a recreational space for a few hours a day you might consider a restored pot belly stove. Nice heat and a real conversation piece.


----------



## jamesB (Jan 28, 2007)

I've used a Pacific Energy Vista for the past four years, totally happy with it.


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

FeXL said:


> So, our 25 odd year old Regency wood burner is toast, we need to replace it. There is currently a federal rebate on EPA approved stoves so those are the type we're looking at.
> 
> As far as specs are concerned, we really only need to heat about 250 square feet but if there is spillover into the rest of the house that can get circulated via the furnace blower fan, so be it. I'd say 2000 square feet max. Budget is $1500 so soapstone is probably out. Function more important than form, bells, whistles. Glass door would be nice.
> 
> ...


We have a Joutal 3 and it has been great during ice storms/hurricanes when the power is out for up to five days.

Wood stoves - Jøtul


----------



## Lichen Software (Jul 23, 2004)

for only 250 sq ft, just about anything will give enough heat. Your bigger problem will be finding something small enough that the heat does not blow you out of the room.

take a look at the smaller stoves designed for trailers. It has been a long time since I was in the market. At that time they were generally on a pedistal with their own air supply, with a fire brick lining. we had one with almost zero clearance on the sides, glass door and firebrick lining that took small 12" or so logs. even it put out more heat than we need some times.

Bonus of a smaller stove was we ran it un-damped, resulting in much cleaner combustion and absolutely no chimney cleaning ever.


----------



## dwp (Aug 12, 2003)

We've had a Pacific Energy Vista Classic for several years and it has warmed our 1000 sq ft cottage easily.


----------



## johnnyspade (Aug 24, 2007)

I will second Dr. G and suggest a Jøtul. I have a Jøtul Nordic in my kitchen, which is one of the smallest stoves they make, I think, but it heats the entire back half of my house. It takes a smaller log, about 14 inches. I recall it being about $1200 but that was 7 years ago.


----------



## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

Be sure to consider the chimney in the price. If the stove was in there for 25 years, you may end up replacing all or part of the chimney in order to meet current codes.

The good stuff that runs from ceiling through the attic then through the roof and a foot or two so above the peak, runs about $2.00/inch for 7" internal diameter chimney pipe. The thinner double wall required below the ceiling is probably about half that price.

Current codes may require a fresh air inlet, either directly into the stove or coming through the floor very close to the stove. This too could add to the cost.

Another advantage of a smaller stove is narrower slightly less expensive stovepipe. 

The small Fisher we had easily heated a 1200 square foot house. Windows had to be opened unless the outdoor temps were below about -5°C.


----------



## Lawrence (Mar 11, 2003)

I've always loved pot belly stoves, My father had a "Station Agent" in his house.

Source: Good Time Stoves





+
YouTube Video









ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

Dr T said:


> Your specs are incomprehensible. How many cubics units are you looking to heat?
> What is your wood source? Your own woodlot (Like us) or do you buy from the guy? hat affects the investment, does it not?
> 
> And surely you can buy a stove locally, you do not have to schlepp one in from a foreign country.


That's why I asked. Having never purchased a wood stove before, I really know nothing about them.

Wood source matters not, that's wasn't the question I asked.

As far as not buying locally, if I can save $300-$500 with a two hour round trip stateside, guess who gets the sale?


----------



## FeXL (Jan 2, 2004)

OK, to clarify:

We have a sun room at one end of the house, 16x22x14 high, south wall is mostly windows, heated by a single register. Ain't enough. It is connected to the rest of the house via a 10' wide opening, so whatever heat is generated in the sun room moves into the rest of the main floor as well.

With the fan on the furnace running, at least some of this heat will get circulated throughout the rest of the house. That being said, I'm not trying the heat the whole house with this wood burning stove so I don't need something capable of heating 3300 sq ft.

Looking for recommendations on decent stoves that have had few issues, are EPA approved and fit into a $1500 budget.

Thanks for your input.


----------



## BigDL (Apr 16, 2003)

Perhaps you might consider speaking with a W.E.T.T. certified inspector. They are certified to provide information and recommendations to have your stove installed correctly and up to code. Many companies that sell wood stoves have W.E.T.T. certified staff that could provide you with information.

If the newly installed stove has been certified as WETT installed, you should have no insurance hassles.


----------



## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

FWIW 

With or without EPA approval a smaller stove burning wide open will always burn cleaner than a bigger stove running with restricted air flow. Catalysts, not recommended if there is any way to avoid them, work best with hot fires as well.

If you buy stateside and stove is being inspected by a local building inspector, EPA approval may be adequate or CSA approval may also be required. Seems to vary according to the mood of the local inspectors.

Still like the idea of the pot belly, especially given the room description. However an official stamp of approval may not be possible.


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

eMacMan said:


> FWIW
> 
> With or without EPA approval a smaller stove burning wide open will always burn cleaner than a bigger stove running with restricted air flow. Catalysts, not recommended if there is any way to avoid them, work best with hot fires as well.
> 
> ...


I know that the company that insures our home requires a CSA approved wood stove.


----------



## BigDL (Apr 16, 2003)

Dr.G. said:


> I know that the company that insures our home requires a CSA approved wood stove.


Two years ago I had an "inspector" from my insurance company arrive at our home to look things over.

One item he checked was, our now, nearly 25 year old stove. The only change, I had to install metal panels over the stove in stead of the usual plastic covered fibre glass panels. All because of one inch less than allowable clearance. The bare floor joist had enough clearance and were ok but not the drop ceiling without metal panel inserted.


----------



## shazbat (Feb 7, 2005)

I had to upgrade to an approved woodstove for insurance purposes about ten years ago. We opted for a Pacific Energy. It burns cleanly without a catalyst and the buit in heat shields allow for tight clearances. Overall, very happy with it. They have a range of prices depending on finish, which goes from basic black to enamelled and nickel plated accents. I believe we paid around $1500 for it with all the fancy fixins.


----------



## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

BigDL said:


> Two years ago I had an "inspector" from my insurance company arrive at our home to look things over.
> 
> One item he checked was, our now, nearly 25 year old stove. The only change, I had to install metal panels over the stove in stead of the usual plastic covered fibre glass panels. All because of one inch less than allowable clearance. The bare floor joist had enough clearance and were ok but not the drop ceiling without metal panel inserted.


We had a fire inspector check over our woodstove before I informed my insurance agent that it was installed. When the insurance agent came by, all he requested was for a flat hearth sheet in front of the stove. We had one, but it was stored away since it was summer. Once he saw that and was told that I would not light a fire until it was placed in front of the stove, he was satisfied.


----------



## MacGuiver (Sep 6, 2002)

We've had a Pacific Energy Stove for the past 10 years and its been a wonderful wood stove. Very efficient and a real show piece in the room. That said we just recently made the switch to a Enviro multi-fuel pellet stove. The reason we switch was that we didn't have access to our own wood source and getting it split, dried and delivered has been getting pricey. Putting it up for the winter has always been a lot of work and the wood took up a lot of space in my basement and we've found a need for more basement space for other things. We also found wood messy and because we stored it in the basement, lots of outside bugs made their way into our house with it as well.
The advantages of the pellet stove:
-Higher BTUs than our wood stove
-Clean fuel, not much more $ to buy, takes up less space to store it.
-Fill it once or twice a day and forget it. 
-Consistant controllable heat (should keep the oil furnace off through the night)

Disadvantages:
-requires hydro to run the auger and fans that run it so without a generator or battery backup, its of no use in a power outage. This was my biggest hesitation to making the switch. I have my house wired for a generator so we always have that to fall back on.
-you're at the mercy of the market for your fuel prices. In my case, I was seeing steady rises in cord wood too since I didn't have my own source. Our stove is also capable of burning a variety of fuels from wood pellets, corn, barely, switch grass pellets etc. so we do have other options.
-Our Pacific Energy was amazing for keeping the glass clean. The pellet stove needs to be cleaned weekly but not all woodstoves keep the glass clean like our Pacific Energy did.
-More possible mechanical issues and more maintenance.

When you said you had a small space. The first thing I thought of was a pellet stove for the simple ability to control the heat output on a switch.
If you do go for wood, I'd highly recommend Pacific Energy stoves from my experience.

Cheers
MacGuiver


----------



## Lawrence (Mar 11, 2003)

My sister has a pellet stove in her farmhouse living room, They are plenty warm enough.
Biggest complaint with a pellet stove is the auger getting jammed, So do your research.

Inside a Pellet Stove


----------



## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

My folks had a Wood Chief stove in their basement - some 20 years old, I think - worked wonderfully well and heated the entire house (too much, in fact).

Eventually it succumbed to too much heat too often, the grates broke apart and the shell started to warp, thermostat stopped working... so they went to pick up a new one. Got the certified model required, brought it in, and plugged it into the stovepipe exactly the way the other one was.

Out of the blue arrives the insurance inspector (hmmmm....). Nope, can't do that - can't plug it into that pipe. Not up to code. This despite the fact that the stovepipe (shared with the oil furnace which is used only to heat hot water) was purchased specifically for its ability to be used in this fashion (I forget what it's called). The house had been inspected at various points over the years, and this was never a problem.

Long and short of it - my folks no longer have fire insurance on the house :yikes: Retired, they can't afford to install a second chimney out the basement wall just to accommodate the wood stove. _Nice_.

This little story just to advise you to check with your insurance company *before doing anything.*


----------



## hdh607 (Sep 8, 2008)

We've had two Pacific Energy stoves for 9 years now and they've been great. (one in our house and one our yurt)


----------



## rocket (Apr 21, 2010)

*wood stove*

I have been using a pacific energy for the past 20 years and it works great ,I have only had to replace the baffel a few years ago becaiuse it had warped other than that no problems .


----------



## Dr T (May 16, 2009)

FeXL said:


> That's why I asked. Having never purchased a wood stove before, I really know nothing about them.
> 
> Wood source matters not, that's wasn't the question I asked.
> 
> As far as not buying locally, if I can save $300-$500 with a two hour round trip stateside, guess who gets the sale?


Okay, you provided no info about wood fuel source. You expected your respondents to guess, and I decided not to do so. So there you have it.
Two hours of time would cost me more than $ 500 of my own time, not to mention the actual travel costs, so again do not feel you hafta mention your situation. You pay what you get.


----------



## jamesB (Jan 28, 2007)

Dr T said:


> Okay, you provided no info about wood fuel source. You expected your respondents to guess, and I decided not to do so. So there you have it.


So are you saying you would recommend a different stove depending on whether one has to purchase firewood or cuts his own?


----------



## Lichen Software (Jul 23, 2004)

FeXL said:


> OK, to clarify:
> 
> We have a sun room at one end of the house, 16x22x14 high, south wall is mostly windows, heated by a single register. Ain't enough. It is connected to the rest of the house via a 10' wide opening, so whatever heat is generated in the sun room moves into the rest of the main floor as well.
> 
> ...


Some more thoughts:

1. See if you can get a cold air duct into that room, preferably sucking cold air off the floor by the windows. That will help your heat distribution a lot for cheap. This also works really well in rooms in a finished basement. Sucking the cold air off the floor allows the warm air to settle down.

2. The space is not large. You do not want or need a big stove. It will not take much with a modern wood stove to heat that space. With a big stove, you would have to run it damped or be blasted out of the room. Running a stove continually damped is asking for lots of creosote and chimney fires. 

3. Safety first. Check with you town fire office and with your insurance for the desired certification(s) on both the stove and on the flues if you have a factory made chimney. Note that if you have a factory made chimney, and the stove is due for replacement, the main chimney and flues probably are also. 

When I did it, it was CSA and ULC (Underwriter's labs). Depending on certification desired (ie CSA), that may rule out purchasing in the States.

Once you are to that point, go to your local hardware store and see what they offer in smaller stoves (the trailer option I mentioned before is good for small spaces). Being able to purchase a "No Name" but certified stove locally may actually be cheaper than any EPA grant you would get. Plus a stove that is suited to the space will burn clean.

I would be looking for:

Certified
Looks good
Fire Brick lining
Glass door is nice
Sized for the space being heated

Optional: Cook top, zero clearance sides etc.

A couple of people have suggested pellet stoves. I used to see these when I did appraisals. Generally, the glass seemed to be dirty on these all of the time. I never found them attractive. Times may have changed.

Also, when I was up north, the boiler at the paper mill was converted to burn pellets. It burned coal, gas, oil or pellets. A good friend of mine was one of the stationary engineers running this thing. He hated the pellets. His comments were that they burned exceptionally hot, They did not leave an ash at the bottom like coal so they tended to burn out grates. He particularly hated the dust and the possibility of a dust explosion spooked the heck out of him. Now this was a 6 million horsepower boiler, so it definitely was a little different than a domestic situation. But he did not want anything to do with them in his house or camp after using them at work. We had the pellet factory just 6 miles from town, so they were cheap.

There are also corn stoves, that work much the same.


----------



## eMacMan (Nov 27, 2006)

I have also noted the windows really gumming up on wood pellet stoves. 

Really know nothing about the manufacturing technique other than the pellets are essentially sawdust. I wonder if they use a bit of glue to bind them together? If so that could certainly cause the deposits on the windows.


----------



## Lichen Software (Jul 23, 2004)

eMacMan said:


> I have also noted the windows really gumming up on wood pellet stoves.
> 
> Really know nothing about the manufacturing technique other than the pellets are essentially sawdust. I wonder if they use a bit of glue to bind them together? If so that could certainly cause the deposits on the windows.


There may be several different processes - depending on who has the patent for what.

From what I can see, the advantages of this type of stove may be its easier to obtain fuel in an urban environment, consistent product ( once you know how to deal with it) and the possibility of self stoking. Price is probably going to depend on what else is available in the area and what else the sawdust can be used for. Essentially, it is currently a waste product. Give it an alternative use and the price will rise.

Where I was, it was a drying and pressurization process. The plant went full bore for a couple of years and then there was an alternative use for the sawdust and they could not produce at a salable price, so they shut down. This was before the great availability of these stoves and I think they were depending on an industrial market to some extent. They had to compete with industrial scale coal, gas and oil.

I just remember my friend being really exasperated with the stuff and calling it "The fuel of the [email protected] future!!" and throwing up his hands.


----------



## BigDL (Apr 16, 2003)

I am trying this "engineered bio-bricks fuel" for the first time this winter. These bio bricks burns in a conventional wood stove.

I bought two pallets of 75 packages of12 bricks 2 pounds each (900 bricks for 1800 pounds) of fuel. The pallets occupy 48" X40" X 36" which equals 40 cubic feet of space 80 cubic feet in total . One pallet equals 1 cord of wood in heating value, therefore the equivalent heat of two cords of wood in less storage space than one cord of wood which occupies 128 cubic feet of space.

I loaded these from the end of the drive way, down the width of our home and half the length of the house to the back door and down 8 feet into in the basement in less than 3 hours.

I shall see if I can regulate the heat to make the bricks last as long as two cords of wood.

Anyone try these and any advise as to their use and any pit falls?


----------



## bryanc (Jan 16, 2004)

Anyone else read the title of this thread and find themselves unable to stop thinking about this?





+
YouTube Video









ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


----------

