# Has anyone in Canada done the crack and using the iphone via wifi



## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

Obviously I don't mean calling, just surfing and email, ipod, contacts, etc. 

Anyone doing it? I'm seriously tempted to get one since I'm downtown T.O and plenty of hotspots. Hell, my fav cafe has wifi and I'm there half the day.


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## emalen (Oct 10, 2004)

imachungry,

know that you're not alone. I'm THIS close to caving and getting one.

i have serious mac fanboy issues.

D


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

It's not a crack, per se, and there is mention of success in other threads here, I believe.


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## Script Kiddie (Jan 30, 2003)

besides, cracking has nothing to do with using it on WiFi. You could pull out the SIM, flush it down the toilet and still use WiFi.


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## Flipstar (Nov 7, 2004)

It's a gamble if you do decide to crack activation. It could be possible that Apple will brick it when their updates start rolling.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

SK....the crack involves unlocking the phone to be used for anything other than a brick without activating it through iTunes...


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## Flipstar (Nov 7, 2004)

RunTheWorldOnMac said:


> SK....the crack involves unlocking the phone to be used for anything other than a brick without activating it through iTunes...


Well you still can't use it as a phone. It'll be just a glorified wi-fi ipod.


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## RunTheWorldOnMac (Apr 23, 2006)

true enough, BUT WHO CARES!!! You pay $300 for an iPod, so the other $300 gives you a WiFi device!


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

Flipstar said:


> It's a gamble if you do decide to crack activation. It could be possible that Apple will brick it when their updates start rolling.


But what if you don't update until service is available in canada? Conceivably it'll work fine as a browser/email/wifi ipod, right? Am I missing something? 

I'm so ready to take the plunge...


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

imachungry said:


> But what if you don't update until service is available in canada? Conceivably it'll work fine as a browser/email/wifi ipod, right? Am I missing something?
> 
> I'm so ready to take the plunge...


It may very well work. But what you are missing is that GSM cell phones typically have several kinds of SIM-related "locks":

country lock (only works in one country or group of countries, typically this *is* in place between the US and Canada)
network lock (one kind of GSM network, for example)
provider lock (AT&T, Rogers, etc.--pick one)
full SIM card lock (only works with ONE SIM card--a specific one)

You can also password some cell phones to require a code be entered to use the SIM card, and to use the phone.

There may now be a new kind of lock, used by the iPhone to require that its own SIM be used. There are reports that this is necessary for some iPhones, and that it isn't for others.

There is no proven unlock of any kind for the iPhone as of now. But it is likely that unless there is, when you go to activate the US-bought iPhone on Rogers, without first unlocking it, you won't be able to, the same way (or perhaps not the same, i.e., requiring some other kind of unlock to work) a locked US AT&T, T-Mobile or Verizon phone can't be used on Rogers.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

HowEver said:


> There is no proven unlock of any kind for the iPhone as of now.


Exactly! I have looked at every 'hack' I can find and *NONE* can be fully verified, imho.

If anyone knows of one that can be verified, please post a link.

I have no interest in buying a $600US (+/-) brick - after all it is not even a full sized brick....  although I also have serious fanboy issues re: the iPhone..


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

I doubt dvd jon is lying when he said his method works to unlock the other non-phone related features of the iPhone.

there is also a new hack brewing, an app that when used unlocks a great deal of access to the file systems in the iPhone.. quite promising for people who'd like to skip iTunes altogether, such as MANUALLY add files to it.... (sheesh.. can't believe they force sync only)


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

kloan said:


> I doubt dvd jon is lying ............


No offence intended here, but what grounds do you have for that statement?


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

because he's been a reliable source for many hacks in the past... and it has been verified by other people already, from what i've read


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

I would suggest that there is too much desire for a crack for it not to happen. It may not be confirmed, but there's too much money and appetite for it not to happen. Just my feeling. :baby:


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

kloan said:


> and it has been verified by other people already, from what i've read


As already stated, I have yet to find a link that I would trust.... Please provide the link to 'what you have read'... I don't understand the reluctance to provide real links...???


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

i didn't post any links because the censors on here always takes stuff like that down.. then again, it might have already been posted before. never know with this stuff what will make it through and what will be deleted.

So sue me » Blog Archive » iPhone Independence Day

obviously, you have to do it yourself before you're gonna believe it. i say go ahead and get one, if you've got the money.. i would, i have no doubt that it works.. and there are enough people working on ways to hack it that there will be plenty more in the near future.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Thanks for the link. I had just found it myself by searching on "*dvd jon*". The first source I have encountered that _seems_ reliable.. The only thing that concerns me is if Rogers might reject a hacked iPhone.

As a complete non-sequitur, the link issue annoys me: people answer questions with macupdate/versiontracker links which usually means they haven't tried the solution themselves. Why inflate versiontracker/macupdate hit counts when credit could be given to the real authors by giving direct links to the real software??? On the one hand, links are important (it is what makes the web work), while on the other hand, if one doesn't *know* through one's own experience, one should mak that clear... !


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## Flipstar (Nov 7, 2004)

The DVD Jon hack for activation is legit, as well as the one that another group released. They also released another software tool that lets you skim through the filesystem and activate processes last night.

I'm also tempted to get an iPhone from the US, but like I said, too much of a gamble. You're working against Apple's iTunes sync and SIM lock which would be a $600 USD mistake if you can't wait til the end of the year.


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## psxp (May 23, 2006)

hmm.. I might just wait for the Sept. refresh of the Ipod. .. its Got to be a wifi Video ipod right??


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## jhollington (Jan 29, 2007)

Just to be clear, we're talking about two different things here.

What DVD Jon has done is bypass the _activation_ aspect which is done through iTunes that otherwise locks out the iPhone from being used _at all_. This is not rocket science, particularly for somebody with his skills, and isn't all that surprising, either. All you really need to do to "activate" the iPhone is determine what passes between it and iTunes during the activation process, and then mimick that procedure.

Considering that once you've gone through the iTunes activation wizard _once_ the iPhone becomes usable regardless of whether or not it has a SIM in it, and regardless of whether or not that SIM is active, this isn't really all that big of a deal either.

As far as I've been able to determine, the only time you ever need to go through the activation wizard in iTunes again is if you do a full factory-restore on the iPhone, which makes sense, since if you're returning it to factory settings, it's giong to revert to it's original out-of-the-box deactive state.

The result of this activation "unlock" is that you can use all of the non-phone-related features of the iPhone. You will still need an active SIM in it to use the phone features, and at this point, that still has to be an AT&T SIM. There is _some_ possibility that you could get away without having to sign up for a two-year contract, opting instead for some other AT&T option, but you'd still have to connect it with AT&T.

What has _not_ been done as of yet is to unlock the iPhone so that it will work with a SIM card from any _other_ carrier. This is a much more challenging issue, as there's nothing to base this process on. Unlike the activation process, there is no documented SIM-unlock process that can be reproduced, there is no existing knowledge that can be expanded on from previous phones by the same manufacturer, and in fact there may very well be no user-accessible unlock mode (unlike traditional cell phones). This doesn't mean it can't hacked to be unlocked, but it's likely more complex than figuring out a code that you have to type in to some secret screen.

Bear in mind as well that it's _very_ likely that an AT&T iPhone will continue to be locked to AT&T even when Rogers _does_ bring the iPhone to Canada (and conversely, a Rogers iPhone probably won't work with an AT&T SIM either). Therefore, buying one now in the hopes of activating it on Rogers in the future is probably a bad idea.


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## sedawk (Jun 26, 2007)

I have been following the hacking/unlocking process very closely. They are much closer to unlocking the phone that you think. This is from a wiki which is tracking the effort nearly on an hourly basis:

"Unlocking:
We know how to unlock the phone, so the question now is whether we can get the commands to the radio or not. We don't believe our method is the only method, but assuming that with the help of some very smart folks we can get access to the radio, the firmware should be trivial to unlock."

The key point is the they know how to unlock the phone. I have been emailing a couple of people on the team -- some very interesting guys. I will be buying a phone as soon as they are in stock at the apple store again - Seattle being the closest. I bet I will be able to make a call using my Roger's sim card by next Friday.

BTW, my regular phone is KAZR -- it is a European unlocked version that I purchased six months before they were available in Canada.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

I agree. Relying on the premise that someone will eventually figure out how to unlock the phone (SIM) feature, is probably a bad idea. There's no telling how long it might take.

But if you have the cash and want the latest greatest Apple gadget, it's still an awesome device, even without the phone, imo.


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

sedawk said:


> II will be buying a phone as soon as they are in stock at the apple store again - Seattle being the closest. I bet I will be able to make a call using my Roger's sim card by next Friday.


Kablam if you do! :baby:


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

sedawk said:


> I have been following the hacking/unlocking process very closely. They are much closer to unlocking the phone that you think. This is from a wiki which is tracking the effort nearly on an hourly basis:
> 
> "Unlocking:
> We know how to unlock the phone, so the question now is whether we can get the commands to the radio or not. We don't believe our method is the only method, but assuming that with the help of some very smart folks we can get access to the radio, the firmware should be trivial to unlock."
> ...


Wow, I think you may have actually topped your first post here on ehMac (below). Normally, I'm all about the welcome mode, but let me ask: 

You don't really believe that particular set of persons will unlock the iPhone just because they say they will, do you?

If you hate Rogers so much, why use it?

And, how is that new cell phone company coming along?

http://www.ehmac.ca/560620-post4.html


sedawk said:


> This is my first post on ehmac -- so go easy on me
> 
> First of all, I really don't believe Rogers will have the iPhone in Canada until sometime in (late) 2008. I know a few people who are working there and there is really nothing happening on that front. This is coming from the top -- there is no desire to get that product here anytime soon. Remember how long it took to get the iTunes music store here? I think the same slow progress will happen with the iPhone -- and Rogers will even slow it further.
> 
> ...


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

Interesting off reddit:

http://rixstep.com/2/1/20070703,00.shtml


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## JuicedJuviJew (Jul 11, 2007)

Ok for the non-believers of the working DVD JON crack...it's real. I've owned my iPhone since the thursday after they came out (too tired to remember the date) and i Ran BOTH IPHONEINTERFACE and DVDJONs tools and they both work. Oh btw, I'm from Ottawa and It cost me about 700$ US to ship it up here. I believe that they will crack the sim lock because they can crack any other sim lock on the market. As soon as they do that, I'm heading to rogers (unfortunately due to the fact i LOATHE rogers) and buying a SIM card so i can use it as a cell phone. I'm probably going to keep my trusty Samsung a920 CDMA cell phone around just incase i hate the reception but If you have any questions about this...lemme know and I'll keep you updated...
G


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

JuicedJuviJew said:


> Ok for the non-believers of the working DVD JON crack...it's real. I've owned my iPhone since the thursday after they came out (too tired to remember the date) and i Ran BOTH IPHONEINTERFACE and DVDJONs tools and they both work. Oh btw, I'm from Ottawa and It cost me about 700$ US to ship it up here. I believe that they will crack the sim lock because they can crack any other sim lock on the market. As soon as they do that, I'm heading to rogers (unfortunately due to the fact i LOATHE rogers) and buying a SIM card so i can use it as a cell phone. I'm probably going to keep my trusty Samsung a920 CDMA cell phone around just incase i hate the reception but If you have any questions about this...lemme know and I'll keep you updated...
> G


Yea, I picked one up in Buffalo yesterday and can't activate using the DVD Jon method as I don't have a PC. If someone knows of the Mac version of the activation, please PM me. :baby:


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## jhollington (Jan 29, 2007)

I think there's a Java version that you might be able to get running on a Mac. Using Bootcamp or Parallels should be an option as well if you have an Intel-based Mac.

The DVD Jon crack certainly works, since as I said above, it's really not rocket science. That part of the activation process doesn't even appear to be in any way tied to the SIM card itself... It's just a one-time out-of-the-box sequence that's sent from iTunes to the iPhone, and therefore not hard to reverse-engineer.

As for SIM unlocking, Bongo Wireless up in Markham is one of the more reputable and experienced unlocking outfits in Canada, and in fact I've known people who have sent their phones up there from the U.S. to have them unlocked. While the folks at Bongo are not necessarily computer or Mac OS X experts, they do excel in cell phone unlocking technology, and they had this to say on their web site:



> Please do not call or email us about selling or unlocking of the new Apple iPhone. We have been flooded with emails and calls regarding this issue and it has been confirmed that this phone cannot be unlocked under any circumstances. This device is completely different than any other phone we have encountered.
> 
> It has to be activated using the online iTunes and must be an at&t account. Even with an active account, the user cannot use another active at&t SIM in the phone as it will not work. The device depends on online updates through it's iTunes. The browser cannot be configured as it is network dependant somewhat like Danger's Hiptop Sidekick.
> 
> As of this date nothing can be done. Purchasing this phone from the US will be a waste of your money. Wait until further development and more news on this device. We will post here any news that would concern using the phone on Rogers or Fido.


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

imachungry said:


> Yea, I picked one up in Buffalo yesterday and can't activate using the DVD Jon method as I don't have a PC. If someone knows of the Mac version of the activation, please PM me. :baby:


There is definitely a mac based version. I have the link to it on my computer at home. It's supposed to be very easy as well.

I will post it later on.


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

JuicedJuviJew said:


> Ok for the non-believers of the working DVD JON crack...it's real. I've owned my iPhone since the thursday after they came out (too tired to remember the date) and i Ran BOTH IPHONEINTERFACE and DVDJONs tools and they both work. Oh btw, I'm from Ottawa and It cost me about 700$ US to ship it up here. I believe that they will crack the sim lock because they can crack any other sim lock on the market. As soon as they do that, I'm heading to rogers (unfortunately due to the fact i LOATHE rogers) and buying a SIM card so i can use it as a cell phone. I'm probably going to keep my trusty Samsung a920 CDMA cell phone around just incase i hate the reception but If you have any questions about this...lemme know and I'll keep you updated...
> G


Just curious. I pick the iphone up now and use the activation crack to enable everything but the phone. Lets say it eventually gets unlocked. I can take the sim card I'm using now with FIDO and place it in the iphone - it should work correct?? How does my contract with FIDO change?? I'm on a basic plan with FIDO now - includes minutes, text messaging, etc... With the IPHONE I will be surfing the internet, using EDGE I assume, all these new things - how will I be charged??


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

Mac version: tested and working by others

Anderson Technologies » Blog Archive » Activate your iphone without AT&T Service:


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

kydee6039 said:


> Just curious. I pick the iphone up now and use the activation crack to enable everything but the phone. Lets say it eventually gets unlocked. I can take the sim card I'm using now with FIDO and place it in the iphone - it should work correct?? How does my contract with FIDO change?? I'm on a basic plan with FIDO now - includes minutes, text messaging, etc... With the IPHONE I will be surfing the internet, using EDGE I assume, all these new things - how will I be charged??


Just a warning. If you try to surf the web with a data-intensive cell phone, and do not have a data plan in place, you will be mortgaging your house, and several others, to pay off what you will owe. There are occasions where cell phone companies forgive such charges, but they are under no obligation to do so. I realize that by asking about this, you are trying to preclude having such a problem, but for any dear reader about to try this, you've seen the caution. So, for those who have fido (or Rogers) but no data plan, you will be paying per downloaded kilobyte. That doesn't mean just for downloading files, that means everything you see on a webpage is going to cost you.

And yes, your fido SIM will work in an UNLOCKED GSM cell phone, so long as it has the 1900 Mhz band, which the phone in question here does have.


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

Thanks for the reply. So basically what your saying is I should sign up for a data plan with fido?? I couldn't find any info on a data plans on fido's site?? What is the basic cost for a plan of this nature?? Also, when a plan says you have 200mb of data monthly - what is included in this?? Is this only over edge or does wifi count aswell?? I assume emails, etc.. are included in this 200mb??

Sorry for all the questions - never owned a blackberry or a similar device.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

kydee6039 said:


> Thanks for the reply. So basically what your saying is I should sign up for a data plan with fido?? I couldn't find any info on a data plans on fido's site?? What is the basic cost for a plan of this nature?? Also, when a plan says you have 200mb of data monthly - what is included in this?? Is this only over edge or does wifi count aswell?? I assume emails, etc.. are included in this 200mb??
> 
> Sorry for all the questions - never owned a blackberry or a similar device.


HowardForums: Your Mobile Phone Community & Resource - Fido.HowardForums.com

HowardForums: Your Mobile Phone Community & Resource - fidoFAQ


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## Script Kiddie (Jan 30, 2003)

Options you can add


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

I found an easy Mac-based activation hack and I'm using the baby right now at a cafe in downtown T.O. 

THIS DEVICE IS THE BOMB, even without the phone. 

So far ten people have stopped me on the patio and are blown away by this thing!

One guy: "Dude, I'm not even into this technology stuff, but that is some StarTrek **** right there." 

I'm totally happy using this thing on my wireless network at home and on the road at cafes. FOR FREE! Zero cost. 

The setup sync with mail was a breeze. I did nothing and it sucked in all my mail accounts and they're working perfectly. 

YEAH BABY! :baby:


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

imachungry said:


> I found an easy Mac-based activation hack and I'm using the baby right now at a cafe in downtown T.O.
> 
> THIS DEVICE IS THE BOMB, even without the phone.
> 
> ...


So everything works except for the phone and internet over EDGE?? Do you find it easy to get on wifi throughtout the city?? I'm thinking about getting this but I just want to make sure I know what I'm getting myself into.

Any other info would be appreciated.


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

kydee6039 said:


> So everything works except for the phone and internet over EDGE?? Do you find it easy to get on wifi throughtout the city?? I'm thinking about getting this but I just want to make sure I know what I'm getting myself into.
> 
> Any other info would be appreciated.


Correct. The only other thing that doesn't yet work for me is uTube, but I just read there's an easy way to get that working as well (I won't use it that much, really, so who cares). 

I basically spend most of my day in my house and at a few different cafes which all have free Wifi. It's not essential for me to have my email in between. It's like 3 or 4 minutes. You might be different. 

I just had a conversation with a guy who's part of the Toronto Free Wifi team (he stopped by the cafe) , and he indicated that Wifi use is very hard on the battery of these kinds of devices, but basically I've been using this all afternoon on Wifi and it's still 3/4 strength, so it's all good so far. 

I can't tell you how cool it is to me to use this baby for free and it does all that I need. I actually don't use the phone that much anyway, so I can happily wait until the Rogers stuff shows up, but even then I may not want to pay data charges (heh heh). 

The people who say it's a $600 brick--to each his own. For me, I spent $500 on my last 80GB ipod, and it doesn't do half the things this thing does. 

I was worried like you, but now I just love this thing. :love2:

By the way, this was the easy activation h a c k that I used (mac based): 

http://anderson-technologies.com/archives/5

(Mods, please edit if this is objectionable. Not sure if it's okay)


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

I posted that hack on page 3.

Thanks for all the info. I think I've decided to get one. I will be in the US in about 2 weeks and hopefully by then the thing will be unlocked.

I'm glad to finally hear from someone in TO that actually thinks this thing is worth buying without the phone for now. 

More info, please - more info!!


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

One other question - I assume if you get one of the iphone's that has a defect or something that doesn't work great you would somehow have to figure out how to get a new one?? Could be a huge pain in the ass. 

Ever thought about that??


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

kydee6039 said:


> I posted that hack on page 3.


Sorry, never even noticed. Went off on a different tangent, totally forgot you posted it. Thanks though.


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

Thanks for all the info.

I now know I will be picking this phone up in 2 weeks when I'm in the US.


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## Jade (Feb 7, 2006)

So jealous!! Battery life sounds great from your experience too. I am not sure if I can hold out a month to see if the rumoured new iPod has wifi.

If I was a rapper I'd wear it around my neck as bling. :heybaby: 




imachungry said:


> Correct. The only other thing that doesn't yet work for me is uTube, but I just read there's an easy way to get that working as well (I won't use it that much, really, so who cares).
> 
> I basically spend most of my day in my house and at a few different cafes which all have free Wifi. It's not essential for me to have my email in between. It's like 3 or 4 minutes. You might be different.
> 
> ...


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

I'm going to chicago in 2 1/2 weeks and I was planning on purchasing the iphone and applying the hack. I'm not sure if I can wait that long - yes I know a little patience would be nice. My question is: Apple has a 14 day return policy on the phone. Lets say I order the iphone (off ebay) within 14 days of visiting chicago. For whatever reason if I get a lemon and I have problems with the device will I have an issue returning the phone to the apple store in chicago??? Do I need a receipt?? I just want to cover my tracks just in case something goes wrong!!


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

I guess a second part to this question is - for all the canadians who purchased this phone from the US - what will you do if something goes wrong with the phone?? Also, lets say ROGERS does end up bringing the phone to canada will you be able to take your US purchased iphone and have rogers/apple canada service it under the US warranty or do you have to go back to the US??


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## jhollington (Jan 29, 2007)

The answer to the first part is that you would definitely need the receipt to be able to return it to the Apple Store. Further, it would have to be purchased by the original _purchaser_ within 14 days to be under the normal return policy. So if an eBay seller had bought one on June 29th, you're already going to be outside of the return envelope.

Of course, if there's a _problem_ with it, then you could potentially get it fixed or replaced under warranty, but at the same time it's difficult to say what Apple would do with an iPhone that was purchased by a resident of another country (warranties are sometimes country-specific -- I haven't read the fine print on the iPhone warranty, but it's possible that you could at least get some hassle from the Apple Store).

Further, although it's not likely to be a problem if you restore the iPod to its factory settings, since there shouldn't be any traces left, the use of the activation hacks that are available would technically not be supported by Apple as well, which is another reason you might get some flak if you take it in and they realize that you're not from the U.S.

In answer to the second question, it is highly unlikely that an AT&T iPhone will _ever_ work on the Rogers network unless you can actually get it unlocked. Chances are good that once Rogers brings the iPhone to Canada, they will be locked to the Rogers network, and the AT&T phones will be locked to the AT&T network, in much the same way as cell phones presently are. So it's not a question of whether or not you can get Rogers to _service it_ but that it probably won't even _work_ on the Rogers network unless you actually _can_ get it unlocked (which is unknown at this point).


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

Thanks for the response. Are you sure you really need the receipt?? What if someone was given the iphone as a gift from a relative who lives somewhere else in the US - most people don't give receipts with gifts. Your telling me that person would need to obtain the receipt to get the phone serviced or returned??

With regards to my second question. The phone in due time will be unlocked - I'm not really worried about that. My bigger concern is whether rogers/apple canada will service the phone if i have a problem with it based on the fact I purchased it in the US - I would of course restore to default settings.


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## jhollington (Jan 29, 2007)

kydee6039 said:


> Thanks for the response. Are you sure you really need the receipt?? What if someone was given the iphone as a gift from a relative who lives somewhere else in the US - most people don't give receipts with gifts. Your telling me that person would need to obtain the receipt to get the phone serviced or returned??


Well, to be fair there are really two different questions here.... If you wanted to return the iPhone for a _refund_ within 14 days, you would definitely need the receipt.

If it's simply a matter of getting it serviced or replaced under warranty, you could probably get away without the receipt.... after all, it's not like any iPhone would be out of warranty.



> With regards to my second question. The phone in due time will be unlocked - I'm not really worried about that.


Well, unfortunately I'm not entirely convinced of that. There's nothing at all that suggests that unlocking it is going to be possible or practical with the current firmware. Remember that unlike most cell phones, the iPhone wasn't necessarily designed with unlockability in mind.

I'm not saying it may not be possible, but we need to be prepared for the possibility that it isn't, or that in the very least it's more difficult than a lot are expecting, and will therefore take longer (not to mention the possibility of being foiled by firmware updates from iTunes).



> My bigger concern is whether rogers/apple canada will service the phone if i have a problem with it based on the fact I purchased it in the US - I would of course restore to default settings.


Apple Canada might not be an issue, but Rogers almost certainly will be.  Even today they won't provide support for any phones they didn't sell you, regardless of whether they carry the same model.


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

Well I just gave the apple store in the eaton centre a call. I wanted to see if they would service the phone if it was purchased in the US - answer was no. That is really the only thing from stopping me from purchasing this thing. What if I bring it back and in a month I have a problem ie. dead pixels, phone stops working for some reason, etc... I would have to somehow have to go back to the US and have it serviced - this could be a huge pain in the ass!!


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## jhollington (Jan 29, 2007)

As of right now that's not surprising. They don't sell it, they don't stock replacement units, so of course they can't service it.

That could possibly change once the iPhone is available in Canada, even if it were purchased in the U.S., although obviously Apple Canada is in absolutely no position to comment on that right now.


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## adagio (Aug 23, 2002)

Someone may correct me if I'm wrong. As far as I know Apple Canada doesn't honour the warranty of any item, other than laptops, which are purchased outside of Canada. This is not unusual. The same rules apply to many electronics and appliances purchased out of country. If you cross border shop you are taking a chance.


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## jhollington (Jan 29, 2007)

Actually, Apple has traditionally honoured the warranties on iPods purchased in the U.S., so it might not be abnormal for them to do the same with the iPhone.

Of course, since the _Canadian_ model of the iPhone may be different from the U.S. model (even if for no other reason than being locked to a different carrier), a U.S. version might not be supported.


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

Man I have to have this phone but it's definitely a risky investment. 

Just curious, how many people on this forum actually have the phone??

As of right now I know of only one - anyone else??


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## Flipstar (Nov 7, 2004)

Honestly, I think you're over-hyping yourself into getting the iPhone. There is no way I could call the iPhone an investment, because I can't seem to think it would make me any profit down the line.

There's plenty of us on here that would like to see the iPhone in our hands, but many of us aren't willing to hold a potential $600 brick in our possession. If you have the $600 to blow, go for it, you should still be ready to lose that money at the drop of a dime. 

Like I've mentioned in my past posts, it is a gamble and the odds are against you. 

Questions you should ask yourself:

Are you willing to go back to the US to replace your iPhone if it's defective?
Will the iPhone ever get sim unlocked?
How long will it take to get the sim unlocked?
If the iPhone ever gets sim unlocked, will Apple just lock it up again on an update? Perhaps blacklist your IMEI?
Is an 8GB iPod w/ Wifi really worth $600?
.... the list goes on ...


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## kydee6039 (Jul 11, 2007)

Uh...............I think I still want one. Yea, I definitely want one. I will take my chances.
I visit the US enough where getting it serviced isn't a problem and I have faith it will be unlocked soon. Worst case I sell it on ebay for less than what I paid and take my loss. 

Only one person in this thread who actually has the phone?? There must be others??


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## emalen (Oct 10, 2004)

Hey kydee6039,

Rest assured you're not alone. I'll be in the US a week from this Tuesday and I'll definitely be picking up one. Yes, a 600 ipod wifi device seems expensive.. but consider the fact that I have on my desk still the original 5gb ipod that I paid around the exact same price for!


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## jhollington (Jan 29, 2007)

I have one, but that's primarily due to my role with iLounge. It's essentially a "research unit" and not my primary phone. It's presently activated properly on an AT&T plan, which makes it particularly expensive to actually _use_ as a phone.

Even if the iPhone _were_ available on Rogers, I'd never use it as much more than a secondary phone, since it lacks many of the capabilities that I need as part of my day job. My primary phone was a Nokia E62 and I just moved to the E90 a couple of days ago. Now _that's_ a Smartphone.

For me, the iPhone would likely replace my RAZR V3i, which is my "recreational" phone.... the one I take with me when I'm not working and don't need the kind of connectivity and features that a mobile consultant requires.


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## AppleAuthority (May 21, 2005)

jhollington said:


> I have one, but that's primarily due to my role with iLounge. It's essentially a "research unit" and not my primary phone. It's presently activated properly on an AT&T plan, which makes it particularly expensive to actually _use_ as a phone.
> 
> Even if the iPhone _were_ available on Rogers, I'd never use it as much more than a secondary phone, since it lacks many of the capabilities that I need as part of my day job. My primary phone was a Nokia E62 and I just moved to the E90 a couple of days ago. Now _that's_ a Smartphone.
> 
> For me, the iPhone would likely replace my RAZR V3i, which is my "recreational" phone.... the one I take with me when I'm not working and don't need the kind of connectivity and features that a mobile consultant requires.


Slightly off-topic, but how do you like your E90? It looks like a powerful phone. How does it handle multimedia, like if it were to be used as an iPod? Where did you get the E90 and for how much? How does it compare with the iPhone (now that you've used both)?

Also, what did you think of the E62 while you had it?


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## jhollington (Jan 29, 2007)

The E90 is a great unit in terms of overall features, and it's actually a fairly logical upgrade from the E62, since they both use the same Symbian S60 OS. 

The HSDPA/3G features don't work in North America due to different frequencies, but I find EDGE is fine for what I do when I'm mobile, and 3G would just empty my wallet. The device has WiFi, so I'd rather just find a hotspot when I need faster access speeds.

One thing I particularly ike about the E90 is the screen size when open, but also the fact that it basically works like a normal phone when closed. The thumb-keypad phones (E62, Palm Treo, Blackberry) have always been more of a pain to just dial a number with, but the E90 puts a normal keypad on the outside and the keyboard on the inside.

The thing I like the most about the Nokia E-series is the fairly tight Mac compatibility. iSync plug-ins for the E62 were built-in as of 10.4.9 (and available separately before that), and Nokia now offers the E90 plug-ins for iSync as a free download. This means that wireless Bluetooth syncing of iCal and Address Book data works very smoothly -- better than with the Palm/BB/WM devices, all of which require extra software and in some cases a cabled connection.

The browser on the E90 is also based on Safari (webkit) so you get the same full browsing experience that you would on a computer. Obviously, no full Flash support for things like YouTube or CityNews (although it does include "Flash lite").

I don't plan to use the E90 primarily as a media device (ie, iPod), but it does have some nice features in that area. Nokia even has a beta "Media Transfer Suite" for Mac now that runs up in the menu bar and will sync an iTunes playlist of content to the E90 over USB or _Bluetooth_. It also integrates with iPhoto for photo import/export in much the same way. Obviously _protected_ AAC tracks are not supported, but it will play anything else, including the unprotected "iTunes Plus" tracks. It even supports embedded album artwork for playback, and of coruse any transferred file can be used as a ringtone or alarm. 

The E90 also has reasonable stereo speakers on it (for a phone) and an A2DP profile (although I have no stereo BT headset to test that with yet). The only real downside is that it still uses a 2.5mm jack for the normal headset, but at least that's better than the old proprietary Nokia connector. Sound quality is quite impressive, and they even pack in an FM radio.

The camera is a 3.2MP still and 640x480 video camera, with an LED flash. It produces very nice pictures for a device of its class, and will show up (over USB or Bluetooth) as a camera in iPhoto or Aperture (with the Nokia Media Transfer suite). 

The other feature I particularly like is the GPS, which not only includes Nokia's own mapping application, but offers the ability to buy city guide and voice navigation map licenses right through the phone for very inexpensive short-term licenses (so if you were driving across Europe for a week, you could buy a 7-day map package for around $10).

Mind you, if you were looking for a more multimedia focused deviced, the N95 is even better in this regard, as it's smaller and has a 5MP camera and some other nice media-related features. It's also approximately $300-$500 cheaper. It lacks a full keyboard and therefore any real e-mail capabilities, but it packs in all the same multimedia capabilities.

In comparison to the E62, the OS features are mostly the same, but the E62 was tighter on memory and tended to be much slower by comparison. The E90 whips through menus without skipping a beat, whereas the E62 always felt just slow enough to seem "sluggish" -- I was never _waiting_ for it, per se, but it wasn't exactly snappy). Obviously, the E62 didn't include GPS, WiFi or camera capabilities either, but the screen was very nice compared to other devices in its form factor and it has almost all the same _software_ features that aren't hardware-dependent, like the webkit-based browser.

The catch of course is that the E90 will run you almost $1500 CAD after taxes, because of course its unlocked and unsubsidized. I picked up mine up at Bongo Wireless in Markham, although there are other places in Toronto you can get them. There are also sites on the web offering them for as low as $900 USD (which isn't bad with the exchange rate), but not all of these sources have particularly positive feedback either, which was why I decided it was better to just pay the extra and pick one up locally.

As for its comparison to the iPhone, there really is no comparison... Both devices are in a completely different league. The iPhone has the single most intuitive and well-designed interface of any phone or PDA I've ever used (and I've used a _lot_ of them), and I _really_ wanted to like it and be able to use it, but it lacks too many features that I have come to depend upon. 

The touchscreen keyboard is more usable than I thought, but for the amountof e-mail I write it still doesn't hold a candle to even a hard-key thumb keyboard, let alone the full mini-keyboard on the E90. 

Leaving aside bells and whistles like GPS and video recording, which are nice to have but I can't possibly consider "essential" features for business purposes, the iPhone still lacks some of the basics such as task support in the calendar, voice dial, IM/chat (which I do use to communicate with team members), and proper Bluetooth data transfer and synchronization (I've become accustomed to having my phone sync whenever I get within range of my Mac, and my schedule changes enough that this is necessary).

The iPhone will naturally improve and address some of these deficiencies I'm sure, and it may eventually get into the league of being usable for business purposes, but no matter how cool and easy to use the device is, I can't afford to cripple myself by losing what is basic functionality for me.


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## ericlewis91 (Jul 12, 2007)

i have an iPhone activated on AT&T and im in Canada


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