# The Coronavirus Thread



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> More: Tom Hanks and Rita Wilson test positive in Australia.
> 
> Player tests positive, NBA suspends season indefinitely.
> 
> I think we can dispense with the Probably Nothing meme at this point.
> 
> If you didn’t watch the Rogan interview with Michael Osterholm I posted yesterday, you need to do so now. The first 20 minutes and last five are Coronavirus specific.
> 
> Hand washing and sanitizer is not effective as the virus is inhaled. Distancing from others is more important.
> Lay away a couple of months of food staples if at all possible.
> *Expect drug shortages for your prescriptions. Check your supplies now.*
> A vaccine is two years away. Unless Trump orders it tested on prison inmates, per Rogan’s suggestion.
> Most of us are going to get this, a significant number will be very sick, and some won’t make it.
> 
> * You can now not travel from Paris to New York, but you can still get to Toronto from Beijing.
> 
> — Keean Bexte (@TheRealKeean) March 12, 2020*​


Trump's Coronavirus Address



> Just started.
> 
> He'll be banning all travel from Europe for 30 days, and I think he said he'd be blocking imports of goods from Europe, except from the UK.
> 
> The left pretends it's Totally Serious about stopping the outbreak, but then shriek about practical steps to reduce the spread of the Chinese flu, like travel restrictions.
> 
> Retweeted by the Washington Post's alleged "Fact Checker:" Whining that saving lives may entail reduced profits for merchants.


Wuhan Virus Exposes The Danger of Reliance Upon China



> China is not just a strategic competitor, it is a hostile foreign power. And by controlling the manufacture of critical healthcare supplies—not just iPhones and toasters—they hold significant power over this country and the rest of the world. And they know how to use it—especially in a time of crisis.


7 March 2020 Covid-19 California Quarantine & Exponential Math



> Well, California quarantined a neighborhood where a Covid-19 case died. (h/t Gail). The video below also mentions it. This isn’t quite the same as other quarantines in that we don’t know if it was just temporary while they collected the guy and disinfected the area, or is it longer due to that whole neighborhood now being suspect and maybe tested?
> 
> *This is exactly WHY you ALL ought to be prepared to be locked in your house. Perhaps for a day, or perhaps for 2 weeks, or perhaps for 2 months if things are spreading and sequential cases found.*


It’s Probably Nothing



> And then there is this little-known fact: Some Chinese researchers are in the habit of selling their laboratory animals to street vendors after they have finished experimenting on them.
> 
> You heard me right.​


It’s Probably Nothing



> Just like they do for the flu: Chinese medical staff request international medical assistance
> 
> The conditions and environment here in Wuhan are more difficult and extreme than we could ever have imagined. There is a severe shortage of protective equipment, such as N95 respirators, face shields, goggles, gowns, and gloves. The goggles are made of plastic that must be repeatedly cleaned and sterilised in the ward, making them difficult to see through. Due to the need for frequent hand washing, several of our colleagues’ hands are covered in painful rashes. As a result of wearing an N95 respirator for extended periods of time and layers of protective equipment, some nurses now have pressure ulcers on their ears and forehead. When wearing a mask to speak with patients, our voices are muted, so we have to speak very loudly. Wearing four layers of gloves is abnormally clumsy and does not work—we can’t even open the packaging bags for medical devices, so giving patients injections is a huge challenge. In order to save energy and the time it takes to put on and take off protective clothing, we avoid eating and drinking for 2 hours before entering the isolation ward. Often, nurses’ mouths are covered in blisters. Some nurses have fainted due to hypoglycaemia and hypoxia.​
> *It’s not alarmist to keep a solid supply of non-perishables on hand.*


It’s Probably Nothing



> The word is “admitted”. Chinese controlled WHO says…_coronavirus death rate is 3.4% globally, higher than previously thought._


It’s Probably Nothing



> America just held a nationwide IQ test. Did you notice it?
> 
> Everyone who has said about coronavirus that, “It’s just the flu,” failed the IQ test. As did those who claim discussing coronavirus is “spreading panic.”
> 
> They are engaging in what Scott Adams calls Loserthink.[…]
> 
> You will almost certainly not die from the coronavirus.
> 
> If the coronavirus contagion and death rates are accurate, between one and three million Americans could die.
> 
> When you have a low risk of a pandemic with a death count exceeding the total number of Americans who died in World War II, you take precautions.
> 
> Reasonable minds can differ as to what those precautions are.
> 
> But if you’re not thinking about coronavirus in terms of fat tail risk, you’re not even allowed to be part of the conversation.​
> Related: Italy moves to Wuhan inspired quarantine status.


It’s Probably Nothing



> This is the most frightening disease I’ve ever encountered’ – virus expert Dr Richard Hatchett.
> 
> "This is the most frightening disease I've ever encountered in my career."
> 
> Richard Hatchett, the doctor leading efforts to find a vaccine for coronavirus, says it is much more lethal than normal flu. pic.twitter.com/1tjJ2ed0Hq
> 
> — Channel 4 News (@Channel4News) March 6, 2020​
> For those who were following Harry Chen, PhD before the account was yanked and the Wayback machine cleansed of his leaked Wuhan videos, it appears he’s back as a “parody” account.
> 
> Update: Italy vs Hong Kong.


Dow Finishes Day at +1067 (Where's Kurt?);
_Trump Pitches 0% Withholding Tax for Rest of Year, to Ease Economy Through Virus Shock_



> Wow, a thousand point surge.
> 
> I'm going to guess the media will name this The Joe Biden Rally 2.0.
> 
> Why did it jump so much?
> 
> Well, probably partly due to people figuring out that the media is deliberately trying to cause a panic based on a virus that, while dangerous for some, is probably going to turn out to be the Y2K of pandemics.
> 
> But also partly due to Trump's proposal of a payroll cut...


All bold mine.

Be safe, people.


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## SINC

Infection slowing down and hospitals closing as Corona virus improving.

*China shuts all 16 temporary coronavirus hospitals in Wuhan*



> In a dramatic sign that the coronavirus crisis is improving in China, the last two of 16 temporary hospitals in the epicenter city of Wuhan have been shut down, according to a report.
> 
> The final group of 49 patients walked out of the Wuchang temporary hospital in the capital of Hubei province on Tuesday afternoon to cheers, according to the Xinhua news agency.
> 
> The 784-bed facility — which was converted from Wuchang Hongshan Stadium — opened Feb. 5 and received a total of 1,124 patients, according to the news outlet, which said 833 were discharged and 291 were transferred to other hospitals.
> 
> Meanwhile, a makeshift hospital in Wuhan’s Jiangxia District also was shuttered Thursday after 26 days of operation, Xinhua reported. It had received a total of 564 patients, 392 of whom were discharged after recovering.


China shuts all 16 temporary coronavirus hospitals in Wuhan


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## Macfury

.... "according to the Xinhua news agency."


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## SINC

Macfury said:


> .... "according to the Xinhua news agency."


Yeah, it's about as reliable as the CBC.


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## Macfury

Note by comparison:



> The 2009 flu pandemic in the United States was a novel strain of the Influenza A/H1N1 virus, commonly referred to as "swine flu", that began in the spring of 2009. The virus had spread to the US from an outbreak in Mexico. As of mid-March 2010, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) estimated that about 59 million Americans contracted the H1N1 virus, 265,000 were hospitalized as a result, and 12,000 died.


The media remained silent, because Obama was president.


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## FeXL

Go figger...

Trudeau Self Isolating As Sophie Awaits COVID Results



> I sincerely wish them well. *Trudeau self-isolating* as wife Sophie awaits result of COVID-19 test
> 
> Related morning updates will follow.
> 
> Juno Awards cancelled in Saskatoon.
> 
> MSM gonna MSM: They Are Rewriting the History of Coronavirus in Real Time
> 
> Viking and Princess cruises dock for two months.
> 
> @profamymcgovern — Coronavirus burial pits in Iran so vast that they’re visible from space (WaPo paywalled). Photo here.
> 
> Two days after Iran declared its first cases of the novel coronavirus — in what would become one of the largest outbreaks of the illness outside of China — evidence of unusual activity appeared at a cemetery near where the infections emerged.
> 
> At the Behesht-e Masoumeh complex in Qom, about 80 miles south of Tehran, the excavation of a new section of the graveyard began as early as Feb. 21, satellite images show, and then rapidly expanded as the virus spread. By the end of the month, two large trenches — their lengths totaling 100 yards — were visible at the site from space.
> 
> According to expert analysis, video testimony and official statements, the graves were dug to accommodate the rising number of virus victims in Qom​
> Glenn Reynolds has been posting daily updates, I’ll just include it in my updates instead of duplicating efforts.


Bold mine.

Go figger.

As the first comment notes, the prick is probably down visiting the Aga Khan while the balance of us are left to deal with planeloads of untested passengers direct from major outbreak countries...


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## Beej

Recent coronavirus reports from Alberta and Ontario show the most common source is from people travelling in the U.S.

https://www.ontario.ca/page/2019-novel-coronavirus

https://www.alberta.ca/release.cfm?xID=6980324A5B1B0-BC2C-40A8-A6AD9E30E3189425

This is a very small dataset, and based on finding a cause using people's recollection of the last two weeks, but I don't think it's a coincidence. The U.S. had very little testing until recently, and their outbreak is probably far larger than the current count (ie. x5 or x10). Add that to the volume of Canada-U.S. traffic, and you would get this result.

I'm not sure we can do much given the scale of our traffic with them, but if you're trying to delay getting the virus for as long as possible, take U.S. connections into consideration.


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## SINC

TV live reports on tonight's news shows people ready to board flights to Las Vegas turning back and leaving the airport once they were informed of the Alberta medical health officer asking Albertans not to travel outside of Canada.


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## FeXL

Alberta Volleyball just postponed 3 premieres, per the new Alberta provincial guidelines.



> Alberta is asking organizers to cancel any events that have more than 250 attendees. This includes large sporting events, conferences and community events. It does not extend to places of worship, grocery stores, airports or shopping centres.
> 
> Any event that has more than 50 attendees and expects to have international participants, or involves critical infrastructure staff, seniors, or other high-risk populations should also be cancelled.


More:



> The other three newly confirmed cases involve a woman in her thirties, a male in his fifties, and a woman in her seventies. They are all from the Calgary zone.
> 
> The travellers returned from travelling in Jordan, Egypt, France, Germany, and the United States, specifically Florida.


4A Basketball Zones are currently on at U of L, the spectators were just asked to leave the building. Don't know if the teams will play it out or not.


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## Beej

SINC said:


> TV live reports on tonight's news shows people ready to board flights to Las Vegas turning back and leaving the airport once they were informed of the Alberta medical health officer asking Albertans not to travel outside of Canada.


Good. Slow it down and hopefully we don't run out of ventilators. Maybe even get a vaccine in the off-season.


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## gwillikers




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## WCraig

Macfury said:


> Note by comparison:
> 
> 
> 
> The media remained silent, because Obama was president.


Must have been that the conservative media was too busy melting down over the tan suit.

Craig


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## eMacMan

Beej said:


> Good. Slow it down and hopefully we don't run out of ventilators. Maybe even get a vaccine in the off-season.


Love that vaccine idea. Maybe they can even put one together along the lines of the H1N1 effort. As I recall that vaccine proved deadlier than the virus.


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## FeXL

Classes cancelled @ U of L.


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## Macfury

The conservative media wasn't reporting heavily in H1N1.

What do you mean by "tan suit"?





WCraig said:


> Must have been that the conservative media was too busy melting down over the tan suit.
> 
> Craig


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## FeXL

I gueth "The Thigns!" didn't help...

Breaking… “Hazard remains low”



> Sophie Trudeau, the wife of Canada’s Prime Minister tests positive for coronavirus. Prime Minister Justin Trudeau now in 14-day self-isolation.
> 
> — Piya Chattopadhyay (@piya) March 13, 2020​


Comments salient (some hilarious!).


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## FeXL

Air travel from Europe to US to shut down over coronavirus. But what about our southern border?



> Trump is rightly shutting off travel to U.S. airports from Europe. Shouldn’t it be a no-brainer that all illegal immigration, even dressed up as asylum and “unaccompanied minors,” will be suspended at our land border as well?


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## FeXL

Greening Our Way to Infection



> The COVID-19 outbreak is giving new meaning to those “sustainable” shopping bags that politicians and environmentalists have been so eager to impose on the public. These reusable tote bags can sustain the COVID-19 and flu viruses—and spread the viruses throughout the store.


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## FeXL

Coronavirus could infect 35 to 70 per cent of Canadians, experts say



> The coronavirus could hit 35 to 70 per cent of the Canadian population, making “a huge number of people ill,” many critically, and makeshift hospitals and quarantine centres could be needed to shore up a health system that has virtually no give, experts predict.
> 
> According to a disease-transmission model developed by University of Toronto researchers, the virus’ overall attack rate in Canada, without public health interventions, *could exceed 70 per cent. That number drops sharply, by about half, “if we add modest control,”* said epidemiologist Dr. David Fisman, one of the model’s creators, but it will take “aggressive social distancing and large scale quarantines” to reduce it further, he said.


Bold mine.


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## FeXL

Where's the hue & cry from the left?

Airlines Flying Empty “Ghost” Flights During Coronavirus Outbreak to Avoid Losing Flight Spots



> This is bureaucracy at its finest (or worst).
> 
> With the coronavirus prompting many to stay in their own germy homes, airlines are wasting thousands of gallons of jet fuel flying empty flights in order to hold their flight slots.
> 
> Europe’s use it or lose it policy seems to be the culprit here. DOES ANY ONE CARE ABOUT THE CLIMATE?!?!


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## FeXL

4 March 2020 Covid-19 Italy Closing Schools & India Keeping Drugs



> India bans export of 28 generic drugs including antibiotics. India is one of THE big generic drug makers in the world. So active ingredients from China blocked, and finished drugs from India blocked. Hey, EU, how’s that Globalism interdependance and putting manufacturing is cheap countries looking to you now?
> 
> Dear CDC: Best get your ass in gear remaking the USA drug industry / capacity.
> You have about a month…
> 
> Anyone with regular drugs used best buy a stock now. Aspirin, other NSAIDs, tetracycline, etc. are generics…


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## FeXL

The State Department Summoned Chinese Ambassador: Stop Spreading Lies that Coronavirus Began in America; _Chinese State Media Threatens to Unleash "A Mighty Sea" of Coronavirus in America_

Couple things of note in the article. IMO, this is the most important:



> Meanwhile, the US is finally taking a look at the perils of having so much of our pharmaceutical production in an enemy country that is prone to plagues, and is considering a push to bring the US' medicine and drug production back home.
> 
> The global spread of the coronavirus is reigniting efforts by the Trump administration to encourage more American manufacturing of pharmaceuticals and reduce dependence on China for the drugs and medical products that fuel the federal health care system.
> 
> The effort includes a push by the White House trade adviser Peter Navarro to tighten "Buy American" laws so federal agencies are required to purchase American-made pharmaceuticals and medical equipment, according to people with knowledge of the plans.
> 
> The administration has been preparing an executive order, which could be released in the coming days, that would close loopholes allowing the government to purchase pharmaceuticals, face masks, ventilators and other medical products from foreign countries. The hope is that increasing government demand for American-made drugs and medical products will provide an incentive for companies to make their products in the United States, rather than China.
> 
> To help facilitate such production, the White House is also pushing for streamlined regulatory approvals for American-made products and more detailed labeling of the origin of products made offshore, these people said.​
> *I'd like to see the Free Trade At Any Price globalists respond to this: China is actually threatening to kill Americans by refusing to sell medicine to us.
> 
> So, sure: Let's leave critical US manufacture capability solely in the hands of evil communist hostage-takers!*


Bold mine.


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## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> I haven’t posted anything new, because I don’t think I need to.
> 
> Now listening to Trudeau announcement/presser, just as it interrupted the rising sound of cognitive dissonance in John Gormley’s voice as he prattles “but the flu”.
> 
> You had the information you needed weeks ago. Some of you took it. Now we watch as Canadians who relied on sources outside the “blogs and twitter” catch up.
> 
> We stocked up on three months of essentials three weeks ago.


Comments interesting/hilarious.


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## FeXL

Convenient, no?

Hunter Biden: I Cannot Come to the Deposition About How Much Child Support I Owe Because of... Coronavirus



> *"It is unsafe for the Defendant to travel, as travel restrictions have been implemented both domestically and internationally, particularly on airlines, due to the Coronavirus," the filing states. "Setting aside personal endangerment, Defendant reasonably believes that such travel unnecessarily exposes his wife and unborn child to this virus. California, in particular, has been the site of numerous reported cases of exposure."*​


Links' bold.


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## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Wuhan Flu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We stocked up on three months of essentials three weeks ago.
Click to expand...

We generally have a couple of months worth of food that is constantly rotated. Why wait for a virus?


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## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Why wait for a virus?


Every time Canuckistan elects a Lieberal PM, the entire country, save Kaybeck, ends up with a virus...


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## Beej

Italians stuck in their homes must be getting very bored.

Porn site allows Italians to watch all of its content for free during the country's coronavirus lockdown
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...h-content-free-amid-coronavirus-lockdown.html


> Pornhub is offering free access to its premium service to people who live in Italy until April 3


That's quite considerate.



> Earlier in the month, it was reported that porn sites have been cashing in on the coronavirus outbreak, with the platforms posting films of people having sex in hazmat suits in an twisted new trend.


XX)


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## FeXL

Beej said:


> Italians stuck in their homes must be getting very bored.


Expect a run of newborns planet-wide in about 10 months...


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## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

More like "Enhanced Bull****"



> Just another story you're not gonna hear on Canada's National Broadcaster...
> 
> Exactly right. Flew home today from USA. Nexus machine asks travellers to self-disclose if they have been to China, Iran or Italy in last 2 weeks. Punch in “no” and walk straight to exit. *That’s what the Minister means by “enhanced screening” for #Covid_19?!*​


Bold mine...


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## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> Rachel Maddow gets schooled.
> 
> this guy rules
> 
> pic.twitter.com/67pId4kC4i
> 
> — rat king (@MikeIsaac) March 13, 2020​
> Related links.
> 
> So much for the European “Union” Germany _blocks exports of medical supplies to Rome. When Italy asked for urgent medical supplies under a special European crisis mechanism no EU country responded._
> 
> Philippines: _Duterte’s lockdown of Manila is ‘a mockery’, as millions of commuters to be allowed in_
> 
> In the UK: _The govt strategy on #Coronavirus is more refined than those used in other countries and potentially very effective. But it is also riskier and based on a number of assumptions._
> 
> Why aren’t there more cases in Africa?
> 
> MSM gonna MSM: _So weird how after being obsessed by the stock market for two days @CNN is suddenly bored by the 2,000 point gain during Trump’s press conference. Maybe @brianstelter can explain it._
> 
> Agents of Influence.
> 
> And Canada.
> 
> We don’t need travel bans, but we should avoid all non-essential travel.
> 
> We can’t stop the coronavirus at the border, but the Trudeau government is now talking about limiting flights and increasing screening at airports.
> 
> To say the government is sending out mixed messages is an understatement.
> 
> Now, after a major spike in cases, the federal government is moving to deal with issues at the border.​
> Well, that’s not entirely fair. They have been dealing with some certain “issues”.
> 
> They let me go after holding me for half an hour. They held me until the last bus of the night (that is transporting illegals) was too far to follow.
> They asked more questions about why an "Albertan is 'ere?" than they did of the Congolese people that just crossed illegally. https://t.co/wgwAGyWSLA
> 
> — Keean Bexte (@TheRealKeean) March 13, 2020​
> From the comments;
> 
> Somewhat anecdotal but I was at the local Rona buying paint earlier this evening… I got to talking with the guy behind the counter and he told me that employees of Coastal Health were in the store earlier in the day buying up paper products, wipes, towels and TP… *apparently the local Hospital is being over run by the foreign born ( mainly middle eastern ) coming to Canada for the “free health care”… they get off a plane from the middle east and head straight to a Hospital… I drove by the local Hospital and the Emergency area does look overly busy… like I said this story is somewhat anecdotal but I’ve never seen the Hospital that busy ever. Are people who are already sick in another country jumping on a plane and heading to Turdholeland where there are no travel restrictions and no screening in an attempt to take advantage of the Liberals open borders policy and the “free health care” ? Most likely.*​


Bold mine.


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## macintosh doctor

to all those who have been making fun of Preppers - who's laughing now lol

Day 1 of 20.. forced social distancing.. 
I have everything i need.. 
yes we have toilet paper, lysol wipes and food for over a month..


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## eMacMan

https://lethbridgeherald.com/sports/lethbridge-sports/2020/03/14/moonlight-run-cancelled/
Good grief this event is held in the great outdoors. Any runner that is not feeling well will likely forget the race altogether. Others are not at any real risk as it is outdoors. Space runners a bit at the start and all will be well. 

Want to cancel because you are expecting a foot of snow? Great, but over fear of a virus?? Seriously this is cold and flu season if you are going to be terrified of virii then schedule this at some other time of the year regardless of whether the Lamestream is saying; "The sky is falling!"



> In an effort to help stop the spread of COVID-19, The Runners Soul Moonlight Run has been cancelled.
> 
> The 2020 race was scheduled to take place March 21.
> 
> “In light of (Thursday’s) announcement by the Alberta government we have made the difficult decision to cancel the 2020 Moonlight Run scheduled for March 21,” said race organizer Shawn Pinder in a release Thursday.


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## Beej

For people interested in data, the following site frequently updates. The updates are ahead of national updates in the U.S. and Canada because they appear to be using state and province data, but it's worth double-checking with a one day lag.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

Note that the U.S. has reported 7.5 cases per million people compared to 6 in Canada despite us having a much higher test rate. For example, according to the CDC the U.S. has run about 13,000 tests, or closer to 20,000 with the data lag, while Ontario has run 7,000 tests. CDC data may not include private labs, which will become an increasing share going forward.

U.S. tests per million, using my 20,000 guesstimate: 61
Ontario tests per million: 479

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/testing-in-us.html
https://www.ontario.ca/page/2019-novel-coronavirus


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## FeXL

They Should Build A Big, Beautiful Wall



> Mexico frets about U.S. coronavirus spread, could restrict border


BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

:lmao::lmao::lmao:


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## FeXL

To the dismay of Progs & NeverTrumpers (BIRM) everywhere...

CNN BREAKING



> TRUMP FAILS TO TEST POSITIVE… developing…


And, from the comments:



> James Woods
> @RealJamesWoods
> 
> But to be safe, let’s close the border to any nation, even our dear friends in Canada, if they are not willing to restrict flights from China until the #Wuhan virus is conquered.
> 
> https://mobile.twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1238970365373628416


100% agreed.


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## SINC

A video worth watching from an expert at the World Health Organization, very short but very important.

https://video.twimg.com/amplify_video/1238504046673231872/vid/640x360/Uyb_D5juOkNcO4Hf.mp4?tag=13


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## SINC

Knowledge is power.

https://www.tenpercent.com/coronavi...OMv7N5AwpvjgapAD9AtylAnUU7UNAyhVE3euD3smdWaM8


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## SINC

Pardon the strong language, but in this case, it is appropriate for hoarders.


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## FeXL

Never Let A Crisis Go To Waste



> Naughty, naughty Nancy Pelosi tried to slip a pro-abortion amendment into the Corona virus bill:
> 
> Pelosi attempted to secure a funding stream of up to $1 billion for reimbursing laboratory claims. According to White House officials who spoke with the Daily Caller, that provision would establish a precedent under which health claims for all procedures, including abortion, could be reimbursed with federal funds. That precedent would render the Hyde Amendment, which blocks taxpayer funding for abortion clinics, obsolete.
> 
> Pelosi resisted efforts by Democrats to end the Hyde Amendment in recent months, with progressives being forced to abandon an attempt to “ensure” abortion coverage for people using federal health programs as part of a $190 billion budget bill passed in July.​
> *Of course, the lyin’ Left has been trying to spin this 180 degrees!*


Bold mine.

Good ol' Ma Jones. The Bigot will be here shortly to defend them...


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## FeXL

About those extra measures...

Your Government Is Here For You



> I came back yesterday from Dubai airport to Pearson there were zero measures. This tweet is a lie.
> 
> — shahjahaan (@shahjahaan1) March 15, 2020​
> Adam Radwinski is “baffled”.
> 
> @PhdParody: _Rumours from the water cooler … things are bad when I hear about sick politicians in Canada from Chinese officials before it’s released in Canada…talk about a leaky ship._


<cough>But...the Thigns!!!<cough>


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## FeXL

So, Zippy the Wonder Slug has awakened from his long winter's nap, took a hit from the bong, saw his shadow and suddenly wants to spend a billion bucks on coronavirus. Of course, the borders remain open, including a certain rear entry Kaybeck port well-known to illegal aliens where the Queen's Horsemen carry your luggage for you. Unfortunately, because he lied about the budget being balanced this year, it's gonna be a bit tougher than he predicted. Maybe the budget won't merely "balance itself" after all...

Trudeau’s ‘fiscal firepower’ against COVID-19 limited



> Announcing billions of dollars in new government spending on Friday to combat the looming economic recession in the wake of COVID-19 and crashing oil prices, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau twice referred to Canada having the “fiscal firepower” to do so.
> 
> Except the reality is Trudeau would have a lot more fiscal firepower at his disposal if he had fulfilled his 2015 election promise — a promise, not a prediction — that his budget would be balanced this year, with a $1 billion surplus.


And when the terrorists are even smarter than Dear Leader (I know, I know. That ain't exactly sayin' much...).

JIHAD ENOUGH ISIS warns terrorists to avoid Europe over coronavirus fears as killer ‘plague’ sweeps continent



> ISIS warlords have ordered their twisted followers to avoid heading to Europe over fears they will catch the coronavirus.


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## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Travellers at Pearson airport complaining about lack of COVID-19 screening



> Travellers arriving at Toronto Pearson International Airport are reporting a lack of COVID-19 screening a day after the federal government announced new national measures to screen for the virus.
> 
> “Six agents on duty, zero screening, no masks, no sanitizer in site, “ traveller Glen Canning wrote on Twitter late Saturday. “This is as unsafe as it can get.”


And the result?

Ontario reports 24 new COVID-19 cases, total rises to 103



> Ontario officials reported 24 new COVID-19 cases in the province in the last 24 hours, taking the provincial total including recoveries to 103.
> 
> The province now has 98 active cases of novel coronavirus infection, up from 74 on Friday morning, while recovered cases remain at five.


Related:

Ontario Medical Association says all elective surgery to be put on hold



> The Ontario Medical Association (OMA) says all non-essential care and elective surgery will temporarily be put on hold as the province directs its efforts towards battling COVID-19.
> 
> In an email sent to Ontario medical staff, the OMA said the “difficult decision” was made “to protect all health-care providers, patients and the public, and most importantly, to manage what we expect may be tremendous demand on the system from spread of the virus. ”


More (updated numbers):



> Ontario has confirmed 39 new cases of COVID-19, the biggest single-day jump since it started tracking the numbers.
> 
> The new cases push the total number in the province to 142, which includes five recoveries.


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## FeXL

Germany seals its borders as 100m Europeans on lockdown



> Walls are being raised and mass quarantines enforced across Europe to combat the spread of the coronavirus, with Germany the latest to partly seal its borders, banning entrants from France, Switzerland and Austria from Monday.
> 
> More than 100 million people across the continent are on lockdown after Spain announced it would follow Italy in confining citizens to their homes for 15 days unless they had to buy food or medicine, go to work or seek medical treatment.


But it's OK!

Canada hath thigns up at the airporths...


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## FeXL

RACIS'!!!

AOC and Ted Cruz AGREE on health tips during coronavirus outbreak: Stay home if you can - and wash your hands

Curious, this about face from a few days back:



> She blasted New Yorkers for refusing to support Asian shops and restaurants fearing infection, leading to a plummet in their business.
> 
> 'Honestly, it sounds almost so silly to say, but there's a lot of restaurants that are feeling the pain of racism,' she said in an Instagram Live.
> 
> 'People are literally not patronizing Chinese restaurants. They're not patronizing Asian restaurants because of just straight-up racism around the coronavirus.'


Wonder if she fell in the bathtub & banged her head or sumthin'...


----------



## FeXL

Progs. Never willing to let a disaster go to waste.

Illinois Mayor May Ban Guns, Firearms Sales Over Coronavirus Panic



> An Illinois mayor has signed an executive order taking up wide-ranging emergency powers that she claims gives her the authority to halt the sale of all firearms and ammunition. The declaration is being framed as a response to the Chinese coronavirus.


More:



> Mayor Feinen now claims the power to ban gun and ammo sales, the sale of alcohol, the opening of bars and taverns, *and the sale of gasoline*. The executive order also gives her the power to shut down electrical services and to take possession of private property within the city.


And people wonder why I have a filled 125 gallon slip tank. Nope, ain't for drivin', save for emergencies. But that'll run our genset for a week or two... 

Speaking of which, regular gas at Costco, Lethbridge, this afternoon was 0.769/litre. That's down 12 cents from when I filled up there Thu.


----------



## FeXL

You simply cannot fix stupid...

AOC Squad Member Calls for Freeing Prisoners and ICE Detainees for Our Health, Of Course!



> No, we do not stutter.
> 
> After she called anyone racist who dared speak the country of origin of the coronavirus, COVID-19, otherwise known as CHINA, Massachusetts Democrat Ayanna Pressley then proceeded to question experts about freeing prisoners to stop the spread of the disease.
> 
> As a card-carrying member of The Squad — made up of radical Democrats Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Ilhan Omar, and Rashida Tlaib — Pressley has as one of her pet issues the emptying of prisons.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Speaking of which, regular gas at Costco, Lethbridge, this afternoon was 0.769/litre. That's down 12 cents from when I filled up there Thu.


Because the price of gas never goes down with a drop in the price of crude, dontchaknow.


----------



## SINC

Macfury said:


> Because the price of gas never goes down with a drop in the price of crude, dontchaknow.


Costco gas here and in Edmonton today is 69.9/litre.


----------



## Macfury

SINC said:


> Costco gas here and in Edmonton today is 69.9/litre.


79 in Ontario. It will all be forgotten when prices rebound.


----------



## Beej

CDC updated the test numbers and the U.S. is still way behind. 
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/testing-in-us.html

They are approaching 3,000 tests per day compared to about 1,000 in Alberta, to take an extreme example from Canada. As private lab testing ramps up the CDC's data may not be useful, but given that the U.S. has 74 times the population of Alberta, they are far behind on knowing the scale of their problem.


----------



## FeXL

On the ligher side...

Amidst Toilet Paper Runs, Florida Man Busted



> As the coronavirus scare prompts panicked runs on toilet paper worldwide, a Florida Man was arrested yesterday for the 1 AM theft of some two-ply bath tissue from a neighbor’s vehicle, according to court records.
> 
> Police allege that Safraz Shakoor, 25, burglarized a Dodge truck parked in the driveway of a residence a few blocks from his Clearwater home.


And:

Northeast Ohio police department asks for all criminal activity to stop due to COVID-19



> "Due to the coronavirus, the police department is asking that all criminal activities stop until further notice. Thank you for your anticipated cooperation in the matter. We will update you when we deem it’s appropriate to proceed with yo bad selves," the department said.


And <snort>:


----------



## FeXL

On the dark side...

Italians over 80 'will be left to die' as country overwhelmed by coronavirus



> Coronavirus victims in Italy will be denied access to intensive care if they are aged 80 or more or in poor health should pressure on beds increase, a document prepared by a crisis management unit in Turin proposes.


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> On the ligher side...


Apparently "screening" of arriving passengers at airports will be done with a touch screen. That's sort of funny, as long as you don't think about the implications.

Maybe health officials will later monitor at-risk arrivals by giving them a new 23" monitor.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> On the dark side...
> 
> Italians over 80 'will be left to die' as country overwhelmed by coronavirus


This is like the summer heat waves in France when younger families go on vacation.


----------



## Beej

Canada shutting the border to most non-citizens due to COVID-19: PM Trudeau
https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coron...citizens-due-to-covid-19-pm-trudeau-1.4854503

Mostly good measures announced today. One major problem is that Americans are exempt. All U.S. tourists should also be banned, and then figure out how much the business traffic can be reduced over the next few days.


----------



## FeXL

Your Government Is Here For You



> @CP24 JUST IN: *CBSA employee at Toronto Pearson tests positive for COVID-19*
> 
> And nobody can figure out why.
> 
> Alberta, Quebec and Nova Scotia are now all sending provincial officials to airports out of concern that CBSA agents are not telling people about the 14-day isolation period. Pretty massive abdication of federal responsibility. Other provinces should quickly follow suit https://t.co/29Nsgn3kqf
> 
> — Robyn Urback (@RobynUrback) March 16, 2020​


Bold mine.

I was going to note that this may just send the point home, but probably not...

Your Government Is Here For You II



> The Bobbleheads.
> 
> #BREAKING Federal Ministers just spoke with reporters about a major announcement coming on Monday regarding Canada's response to the #coronavirus #covid19 – here it is.#cdnpoli pic.twitter.com/jrM7R35IRy
> 
> — Natasha Fatah (@NatashaFatah) March 15, 2020​
> In the US, the CDC has issued an advisory that gatherings of 50 or more be cancelled, nationwide.


This comment sums it nicely:



> “Our numbers are excellent”
> 
> Utter malevolent crapulence.
> 
> *Your numbers aren’t excellent, your numbers are NON_EXISTENT BECAUSE YOUR SCREENING PROTOCOLS DON”T EXIST ON THE GROUND.*
> 
> In short, they are flying COMPLETELY BLIND AND BY THE SEAT OF THEIR PANTS, hoping and praying for a miracle.
> 
> Cheers


Bold mine.


----------



## FeXL

And Now For The Good News



> It’s a leaked document *and worst case scenerio.*
> 
> The coronavirus epidemic in the UK will last until next spring and could lead to 7.9 million people being hospitalised, a secret Public Health England (PHE) briefing for senior NHS officials reveals.
> 
> The document, seen by the Guardian, is the first time health chiefs tackling the virus have admitted that they expect it to circulate for another 12 months and lead to huge extra strain on an already overstretched NHS.
> 
> It also suggests that health chiefs are braced for as many as 80% of Britons becoming infected with the coronavirus over that time.​
> *Watch China. If it returns with a vengeance in China upon the resumption of work… see above.*


Bold mine.


----------



## FeXL

The Left’s Wildest Dreams May Be Coming True



> While sane, responsible people are rightfully worried about what is still to come from Covid-19, it must be noted that the ardent disciples of the cult known as Radical Leftism appear to be having all of their most heartfelt wishes granted.
> 
> First, the economic growth we’ve all enjoyed is about to end, which is something that Bernie Sanders and AOC and Bill Maher and their ilk have been hoping would happen for some time now. But if that wasn’t enough, the reduced growth is certain to reduce carbon emissions. And for the cherry on top, all of the Leftists who have been screaming that we need to reduce the population are now about to have their wishes granted, with an estimated 0.25% – 3.0% of the world’s population about to die. With that population currently at about 7.7 Billion people, this equates to between 19.25 Million to 231 Million souls gone.
> 
> The Leftist Death Cult must be rejoicing!


:clap::clap::clap:

Related:

How The Wuhan Virus Is Accomplishing The Green New Deal’s Goals



> Coronavirus is accomplishing in a matter of weeks what Democrats’ Green New Deal could only hope to do. Crushing capitalism, putting the oil and gas industry into panic, ending travel, and controlling population would all be deliberate consequences of the radical Green New Deal. So its supporters—Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Sen. Bernie Sanders, billionaire and former presidential candidate Tom Steyer, and myriad eco-leftists—should be mildly, if not outwardly, pleased.
> 
> Don’t come to their defense, with claims like, “The Green New Deal is meant to help the environment and battle climate change!” Listen, I don’t make value judgements on intentionality, Kant. So, don’t @ me with what the Green New Deal was “meant” to do. Let’s talk like grownups about what it would actually do.


----------



## FeXL

Shocker: Media (and Very Online Neurotics Who Claim to be TruCons) Shrieked for a Week That Trump Must Get a Wuhan Flu Test;
The Moment He Tests Negative, They Begin Disputing the Test



> So what was the point of pressuring him to take the test?
> 
> Aren't these the same pant-****ting neurotics and mental patients who tell us "I believe in Science" all day long?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reminder: This was the same WH doctor who last night said President Trump didn’t need a test for the coronavirus. Now, a day later, the doctor says he tested Trump for the virus and he’s negative.
> — Yamiche Alcindor (@Yamiche) March 14, 2020
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Q: why did @realDonaldTrump take the Coronavirus test when his dr put out a statement last night saying it was not necessary?
> Q: why did they announce Google tool and drive in tests when it isn’t happening other than a trial in Bay Area?
> — Andrea Mitchell (@mitchellreports) March 14, 2020
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Why would he take the test, despite having no symptoms? Oh, let me take a shot at that: Maybe because the Very Online Neurotics of the media were, as usual, attempting to incite a panic, using Trump's non-tested status as a panic-spreading vector, so he took the stupid test to stop the newest push for a viral panic.
> 
> No?
Click to expand...


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> Shocker: Media (and Very Online Neurotics Who Claim to be TruCons) Shrieked for a Week That Trump Must Get a Wuhan Flu Test;
> The Moment He Tests Negative, They Begin Disputing the Test


Well, you have to keep in mind that the man lies like a priest at a molestation inquiry. He makes up "facts", wings it, fudges, improvises, goes off half-cocked, blither blathers, etc. Even his addresses to the nation have to be walked-back within minutes of airing because he goes off-script into la-la land (right next door to Mar-a-Lago, I hear).

But I think we should give the negative coronavirus results all seriousness. All the same seriousness that Trump gave to Obama's birth certificate *snort* :lmao:


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Sounds like someone else on these very boards...



CubaMark said:


> ...He makes up "facts", wings it, fudges, improvises, goes off half-cocked, blither blathers, etc.


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Huh. Wonder what part of the "science" changed... :lmao:

Wuhan Flu: Canada To Bar Entry To Non-Citizens



> Per the announcement this hour from the late Prime Minister: _Canada to bar entry to all travellers who are not citizens or permanent residents. Exceptions will be in place for U.S. citizens, diplomats, crew and immediate family members of citizens…_
> 
> And crossings via Roxham Road, one presumes.
> 
> If the Trump admin issues the same in coming hours, I think it’s safe to assume Trudeau’s hand was forced by a courtesy call from Washington.
> 
> Related: Mexico is getting that wall.


First comment nails it:



> When is a travel ban, not a travel ban?
> 
> How sciency was the first decision, compared to the sciencyness of the about face decision?
> 
> Apparently he’s listened to all the best experts before, which said travel bans don’t work. So, now bans DO work?
> 
> Incompetent azzhoe!


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

:lmao::lmao::lmao:

Correlation Is Not Causation



> It’s hard to believe they won’t let him into the pressers.
> 
> In all fairness to PM Blackface, Sophie might have just been confused. https://t.co/PK51vbj9rw
> 
> — Keean Bexte (@TheRealKeean) March 16, 2020​


No wonder Socks went into self-imposed 14 day isolation...

:lmao::lmao::lmao:

Comments hilarious.


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu: Heads Up



> Whatever you need that can't be found in a grocery store or pharmacy, get it now. Based on the last few days, I don't expect much to be open beyond grocery stores & pharmacies in much of Canada by tomorrow afternoon. #CoronavirusOutbreak #COVIDCanada #coronavirus #coronapocolypse
> 
> — Brian Lilley (@brianlilley) March 16, 2020​
> Update: This just came across the feeds, and it’s gut wrenching if accurate. (It may also explain why the Canadian government did an about face on foreign entry.)
> 
> Incredible detail in this FT story: up until last week, the UK was basing its coronavirus control policy on a model based on hospitalisation rates for 😲a different disease😲 with lower rates of intensive care need than coronavirus pic.twitter.com/7rJYh9sqg2
> 
> — Tom Hancock (@hancocktom) March 16, 2020​


----------



## FeXL

Your Moral And Intellectual Superiors



> Coronavirus: anger in Germany at report Trump seeking exclusive vaccine deal


Ah, the Grunion...


----------



## FeXL

Why the 2A was created...

New Orleans Mayor Issues Emergency Order Granting Her Power to Ban the Sale of Firearms


----------



## SINC

Ever wonder why viral diseases always seem to start in China?

Here's your answer and it is very interesting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPpoJGYlW54


----------



## SINC

*Bio-warfare experts question why Canada was sending lethal viruses to China*

https://nationalpost.com/health/bio...hy-canada-was-sending-lethal-viruses-to-china


----------



## CubaMark

_And the usual suspects in here wonder why we see Trump for the lying, mealy-mouthed, double-talking, misinformed and unprepared asshat that he is...._

*Trump's fans were shrugging off COVID-19. Now it's a war, and he's their leader*









(Source: TheWeek.com)​
The MAGAverse has gotten the memo: Coronavirus is a bona-fide emergency that requires myriad actions from citizens and government in order to avert catastrophe.

(...)

The whiplash-inducing change in tone from American conservatives comes after prominent voices on the American right derided coronavirus as an exaggerated crisis at best — and at worst, a plot hatched by the media-Democrat industrial complex to take down Trump.

That what-me-worry attitude had potentially lethal real-world effects — with Trump's own fans facing the biggest risk. Republican voters overwhelmingly believe what the president says, according to one new survey, in contrast to the overall public.

After weeks of White House messaging downplaying the severity of the threat, it's no surprise several surveys showed Republicans being far likelier to shrug off health warnings.

One indicated Republicans were twice as likely to think that coronavirus news was exaggerated, and likelier to proceed with planned gatherings. Another showed similar findings. 

(...)

What's changed? 

For starters, Trump's message. 

After COVID-19 case numbers undeniably grew in the U.S., and global markets unquestionably collapsed, and allies like Steve Bannon and Fox News host Tucker Carlson urgently pleaded with him, Trump ramped up his response.

Just a few days ago, he was spinning sunny messages of continued economic prosperity that had been central to his re-election strategy. 

Trump was saying things about the virus like, "We have it totally under control … it's going to be fine" (Jan. 22), and "We've pretty much shut it down" (Feb. 2). He added that cases would drop to zero "within a couple of days" (Feb. 26) or disappear "like a miracle" (Feb. 27)...

(...)

And now President Trump is treating the virus for what it is: a historic health, economic and political crisis that is the biggest test of his presidency.

He insists he always took it seriously. For example, he points to his Jan. 31 restriction on travel from China. "I've always known this is a real … pandemic. I felt it was a pandemic long before it was called a pandemic," Trump said.

(...)

Perhaps the best encapsulation of the before-and-after messaging came from Trump friend and prime-time Fox host Sean Hannity.

On March 9, Hannity bemoaned "mass hysteria," the "newest hoax" from Democrats, and "manufactured, irresponsible, over-the-top rhetoric."

He lumped it in with a variety of other ailments to fret about: "You should be concerned about the flu. You should be concerned about a cold," he said, but added that the media coverage of COVID-19 was "beyond despicable."

Fast-forward a week. In his show this Tuesday, Hannity had a picture of Second World War leader Franklin D. Roosevelt on the screen — and he cast this virus as a war, with Donald J. Trump as America's wartime leader.

He called the coming 15-day period critical in containing the spread. Rest assured, Hannity said, America and its leader are up to the challenge.

(CBC)​


----------



## CubaMark




----------



## Macfury

You're absolutely obsessed with Trump! How many hours a day do you spend thinking about him, CM?


----------



## CubaMark

Macfury said:


> You're absolutely obsessed with Trump! How many hours a day do you spend thinking about him, CM?


Sadly, it's difficult to escape the dominance of US media on Canadian society. Everywhere you turn - there he is... like that evil clown from the Stephen King film.

Odd that you would be calling me out for a supposed obsession in a thread that is specifically relevant to the US government's (in)actions on a global crisis, and one that has repercussions for its closest neighbour - us.

But hey, feel free to deflect and distract. It's par for the course in here....


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

MotherCorpse? Seriously? And an _NPR_ poll?

You funny guy, CM.

So you have issues with a group of voters believing their president? Fine.

Funny you never mentioned this undying loyalty when Jug Ears was in office. Progs ate his **** up like it was their last supper, licked the bowl clean and came looking for more!

And, considering that about half the country are Republican voters, it's something more than just the lunatic fringe like the quote implies. "_n contrast to the overall public." <snort> What a crock of ****!! Bias, much?

But hey, it's that ol' taxpayer funded "fair & balanced" reporting we've come to love & respect. A billion and a half bucks a year buys a lot of brand loyalty!



CubaMark said:



Republican voters overwhelmingly believe what the president says, according to one new survey, in contrast to the overall public.

Click to expand...

_


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

_*Whose*_ inaction? :yikes:

You wanna talk inaction, let's start with the Chinese, who covered up the presence of the virus for weeks. Then let's talk PM Hemorrhoid Blackface, who is still allowing planes from China (among other "hot" areas) to land on Canadian soil, with no screening of passengers to speak of. Oh, I know: The "thigns". Who is _still_ allowing the run of possibly infected illegal aliens down Roxham Road. Who, until a couple days ago, said that the "science" didn't support closures. Well, the "science" hasn't changed, yet here he is, suddenly & allegedly on board, only a few weeks late.

Who d'ya s'pose called him and told him to pull his ever-loving Prog head out of his ass?

Trudles' response to this entire mess has been one of the slowest & worst on the planet & you're levelling criticism at Trump?

HA!!!

I'd take Trump's response in a heartbeat. At least he's not hiding under a goddamn bed for two weeks...



CubaMark said:


> Odd that you would be calling me out for a supposed obsession in a thread that is specifically relevant to the US government's (in)actions on a global crisis, and one that has repercussions for its closest neighbour - us.


----------



## Macfury

Well, you see FeXL, CM doesn't like Trudeau either--but he only wants to talk about Trump.


----------



## Macfury

Merkel:



> "Since German unification, indeed since the Second World War, there has been no challenge to our nation that has demanded such a degree of common and united action."


What was the challenge presented by WWII? The countries that fired back?


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Well, you see FeXL, CM doesn't like Trudeau either--but he only wants to talk about Trump.


It's just so much bull****.

So The Bigot doesn't like Trump. Fine. I get it. I didn't like Jug Ears, myself.

But put aside the TDS and apportion blame (or credit) where it's due, partisan or not. The Chi-Coms, Blackface McGroper, Iran, Italy: all of these have done a far worse job dealing with the virus than Trump has.

For someone who claims to be a scholar, he's certainly not scholarly in his analysis, whether offering praise or criticism.


----------



## FeXL

Caution: Link to MotherCorpse inside.

Wuhan Flu



> Canada, U.S. preparing to close border to non-essential travel


Comments hilarious.

Food Distribution Network Under Stress



> As anticipated…. stores start next phase of tighter hours of operation because fulfillment cannot meet demand. https://t.co/v1FfqhuX26
> 
> — TheLastRefuge (@TheLastRefuge2) March 18, 2020​
> Detail here;
> 
> The Inversion – Big chain markets; those who spent millions developing their own proprietary ‘just-in-time’ distribution networks and automated ordering systems; are currently the least equipped to deal with the level of demand. Meanwhile smaller chains, or mom-and-pops, who rely on third-party brokered distribution are faster to respond.
> 
> Several factors have increased retail market demand for food products and non-perishables. People stocking up, kids out of school, some panic shopping (example toilet paper) and now curfews/quarantines have people purchasing more for ‘meals prepared at home’. Add in a level of closed restaurants and the demand on retail food markets is severely stressed.
> 
> In major urban areas the larger retailers are unable to keep up with demand. This is creating an outward spread as people drive further and further distances to find their needs. Those who travel a distance ultimately stock-up more; thus the outward spider web-cycle is created. Based on ground reports Atlanta Georgia is a prime example.​


Wuhan Flu II



> A bit of good news.
> 
> Medical authorities in China have said a drug used in Japan to treat new strains of influenza appeared to be effective in coronavirus patients, Japanese media said on Wednesday.
> 
> Zhang Xinmin, an official at China’s science and technology ministry, said favipiravir, developed by a subsidiary of Fujifilm, had produced encouraging outcomes in clinical trials in Wuhan and Shenzhen involving 340 patients.
> 
> “It has a high degree of safety and is clearly effective in treatment,” Zhang told reporters on Tuesday.
> 
> Patients who were given the medicine in Shenzhen turned negative for the virus after a median of four days after becoming positive, compared with a median of 11 days for those who were not treated with the drug, public broadcaster NHK said.
> 
> In addition, X-rays confirmed improvements in lung condition in about 91% of the patients who were treated with favipiravir, compared to 62% or those without the drug.
> 
> Fujifilm Toyama Chemical, which developed the drug – also known as Avigan – in 2014, has declined to comment on the claims.​
> It’s not effective in advanced cases, but antivirals that help moderately sick people from getting worse is progress.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> Merkel:
> 
> 
> 
> What was the challenge presented by WWII? The countries that fired back?


Good catch. Maybe it was just lost in translation, but she should probably avoid comparing things to world war two. Nobody else wants Germans to be inspired by their common and united action during the war.


----------



## SINC

This is scary **** folks, read this:

https://www.boredpanda.com/coronavi...oogle&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=organic


----------



## Beej

Special Report: How Korea trounced U.S. in race to test people for coronavirus
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...-to-test-people-for-coronavirus-idUSKBN2153BW

The story goes through what worked in Korea, and what did not work in the U.S.


----------



## FeXL

Hey, Bigot: When you've lost CNN...

CNN’s *David Axelrod Warns Dems That Trump’s Strong Virus Response* May Help Him Win Re-Election



> President Trump has taken command of the virus emergency and America is responding to the threat as we always do – together.
> 
> *Even CNN, never known to compliment Trump, is praising his strong response to the situation.*


Bold mine.

See any Prog media praising Blackface Elbowgate McGroper for _his_ strong response? Me, either.

Related:

Justin Trudeau: Canada’s National Disaster



> Very few countries have been spared the COVID-19 catastrophe. Thanks to Prime Minister Justin Trudeau’s late and inadequate response to the threat, Canada’s number of infected grows daily. Much like Obama’s delayed response to the H1N1 pandemic of 2009, no decisive action was taken to combat the coronavirus until this week, two and a half months after it was blatantly obvious we had a highly contagious new virus loose in the world. *As of this writing, our borders have finally been closed to non-Canadian citizens—but with exceptions: permanent residents, diplomats, air crews, and U.S. citizens. “Family members of Canadian citizens and permanent residents will also be allowed to come home,” said Trudeau.
> 
> One can readily see where the loophole is that vitiates Trudeau’s pronouncements. The Vancouver Sun reports that over 40 percent of Metro Vancouver residents are of Asian heritage, of whom approximately half are of Chinese origin. They are free until further restrictions to travel from China to Canada.* There are cheap, direct flights from Beijing and Hong Kong to Vancouver, Canada’s western portal to the orient. Clearly, Vancouver, where my wife and I have recently moved, is waiting to explode with the disease, as did Milan, which hosts the largest Chinese community in Italy—the administrative region of northern Lombardy was the source of the Italian infection.


Bold mine.

Nice.

Related, too:

Canada will not bar irregular asylum seekers over COVID-19 concerns



> Canada’s partial travel ban over COVID-19 will not stop asylum seekers from crossing into the country at unofficial entries, but *Public Safety Minister Bill Blair said intercepted migrants will face additional health checks and be asked to self-isolate.*
> 
> Mr. Blair said border officials will continue to take asylum seekers into custody after they enter Canada [fukcing illegally], as they have been, but will also start screening for symptoms of COVID-19 and ask migrants where they have been. The asylum seekers, who would normally be moved to temporary shelter facilities after being processed at the border, will self-isolate for two weeks, like every other person entering Canada.


Bold mine.

"Thigns!!!"

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

:lmao::lmao::lmao:

Face it, people. Trudles was a disaster waiting to happen prior to being elected. His post-national corona virus non-response is merely the chickens coming home to roost...


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> Sorry, America, the Full Lockdown Is Coming.
> 
> Whether you are reading this in your living room in Vancouver, office in London, or on a subway in New York City, you need to think hard, and fast, about two crucial questions: Where, and with whom, do you want to spend the next six to 12 weeks of your life, hunkered down for the epidemic duration? And what can you do to make that place as safe as possible for yourself and those around you?
> 
> Your time to answer those questions is very short—a few days, at most. Airports will close, trains will shut down, gasoline supplies may dwindle, and roadblocks may be set up. Nations are closing their borders, and as the numbers of sick rise, towns, suburbs, even entire counties will try to shut the virus out by blocking travel. Wherever you decide to settle down this week is likely to be the place in which you will be stuck for the duration of your epidemic.
> 
> To appreciate what lies ahead for the United States, Canada, Mexico, and the United Kingdom, pay heed to Italy, France, and Germany. The United States, for example, is currently tracking exactly where Italy was about 10 days ago. France and Germany, which track two to five days ahead of the United States, are now revving up measures akin to those taken by Italy, including lockdowns on movement and social activity. In a matter of days, the United States will follow suit.
> 
> If you live alone, have no family members or close friends who require your special attention, and have no alternative living space, you have no decision to make. You are where you will be for coming weeks.​


Interesting discussion in the comments.

Related:

Mayor of NYC Bill DiBlasio: Get Ready for a "Shelter in Place" Order For NYC Within the Next 48 Hours



> This is a serious escalation.
> 
> New Yorkers should prepare for a "shelter-in-place" order in the coming days as local officials try to contain the fast-moving coronavirus that’s spreading throughout the U.S., New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio said Tuesday, adding that a decision will be made in the next 48 hours.
> 
> "We are all deeply concerned ... this is quite clear this is a fast growing crisis," he said at a press conference. "All New Yorkers, even though a decision has not been made by the city or the state, I think that all New Yorkers should be prepared right now for the possibility of a shelter-in-place order."​


----------



## FeXL

Not the Babylon Bee: "Baltimore Mayor Begs Residents To Stop Shooting Each Other So Hospital Beds Can Be Used For Coronavirus Patients"



> Real headline, from CBS.
> 
> Baltimore Mayor Jack Young urged residents to put down their guns and heed orders to stay home after multiple people were shot Tuesday night amidst the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> Young said hospital beds are needed to treat positive COVID-19 patients and not for senseless violence.​
> Maybe they can put up signs declaring that Baltimore is a Murder Free Zone, and that any and all murders must take place at least 1000 yards outside the city limits.


Yep:


----------



## FeXL

On the lighter side.

Bar Offers ‘Buy A Corona, Get A Free Roll Of Toilet Paper’ Promo



> Yeah, the bar decided to offer the free toilet paper and well, the post immediately went viral. Because it’s hilarious and dumb, and yes I know it’s a joke. But I will say this, whoever came up with this idea needs a pretty heavy raise because they sure had their name out there for quite some time. I wonder if people actually showed up or not. If you’re in Wisconsin, can you let me know if this is an actual thing? You gotta love some good sense of humor, we sure need it right now.


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> On the lighter side.
> 
> Bar Offers ‘Buy A Corona, Get A Free Roll Of Toilet Paper’ Promo


:clap:

I'd go for that.


----------



## FeXL

Beej said:


> :clap:
> 
> I'd go for that.


Some great free publicity.


----------



## FeXL

Hey, Bigot: When you've lost the NY governor...

Cuomo: You know who’s doing a good job on NY’s COVID-19 outbreak? _Trump_



> In his press conference updating events on the COVID-19 outbreak, Cuomo emphasized that he and Trump have always had a good working relationship, and that Trump has been “fully engaged” in the coronavirus containment efforts in New York.


So, ya going to run back to Mother Jones fruitlessly searching for a rebuttal on that bastard Trump and the crappy job he's doing or are you just going to hide under your bed & hope nobody notices your silence?

Either way, reality will be right here, waiting...


----------



## CubaMark




----------



## SINC

Good point and I for one appreciate it! :clap:


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Yet again you throw into sharp relief your ignorance of the topic and the futility of your argument.

As an entry level position, the Rotten Ronnie's fry guy was never supposed to be providing a living-level wage. Generally speaking, these type of jobs were occupied by students or for someone who already had another part-time job & was looking to supplement their income. As has been clearly illustrated any number of times on these very boards, a $15/hr minimum wage today does more to hurt workers than to help; fewer entry level jobs available for students, cut hours, closed doors, among others.

The point is not that we believe workers aren't worth $X/hr. We just believe that the market should decide, not a gov't mandate. If the market decides the fry guy should get paid $20/hr, so be it. Same if it's $7/hr.

Go. Read. Learn. This dead horse has been beaten into Rotten Ronnie's burgers...



CubaMark said:


>


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> Hello, Bigot.
> 
> Yet again you throw into sharp relief your ignorance of the topic and the futility of your argument.
> 
> As an entry level position, the Rotten Ronnie's fry guy was never supposed to be providing a living-level wage. Generally speaking, these type of jobs were occupied by students or for someone who already had another part-time job & was looking to supplement their income. As has been clearly illustrated any number of times on these very boards, a $15/hr minimum wage today does more to hurt workers than to help; fewer entry level jobs available for students, cut hours, closed doors, among others.


Funny how your ideological blinders work.

It's also been demonstrated on these boards that disproportionately affected will be seniors who work McJobs as their pension incomes are insufficient to keep them alive.

But you've never been overly preoccupied with the down-and-out. Like a lot of folks on the political right-wing / libertarian flavour, you show a very darwinian attitude: _if they can't make it on their own, they don't deserve to survive! _ That's a position which (intentionally?) ignores the structural existence of poverty and economic disadvantage. We're not meant to get ahead. 

We're meant to plod away in tedious and meaningless jobs, acquiring what few enhancements to our livelihood that we can eke out (roof over our heads, porridge for breakfast and dinner - and there are many who can't do even that). So long as trickle-down economic mentalities dominate, the wealth will continue to torrent-up to the elite in society as the grand majority struggle in vain because they've been brainwashed into believing that they, too, can have a yacht-within-a-yacht sailing the Mediterranean some day....


----------



## Beej

How to Use One Ventilator to Save Multiple Lives

[ame]https://youtu.be/uClq978oohY[/ame]


----------



## Beej

Coronavirus: Trudeau says irregular migrants will be turned away at Canada-U.S. border
https://globalnews.ca/news/6707593/...ants-will-be-turned-away-at-canada-us-border/

That's good news. New York state has about 7,000 cases verified from a population of 20 million people. Canada has about 900 verified cases.


----------



## SINC

What's not good news is they are still allowing people in at Roxem Road or whatever that illegal crossing is called. And to top it off, are providing them quarantine facilities and living expenses. that is just wrong and it should be stopped. Trouble is with the Liberals, it's always OK if it's illegal, just like SNC Lavalin.


----------



## CubaMark

We can stop worrying about the virus, folks. Jesus will save us!


----------



## SINC

CubaMark said:


> We can stop worrying about the virus, folks. Jesus will save us!


Yeah, well I am gonna stay home and watch for now to see how many of 'em are gone in a month.


----------



## Macfury

Why did you put that meme on a background of potted cactuses?



CubaMark said:


>


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

First off, there are a number of ideologs on these boards. By & large they are Progs. You may consider yourself among the counted. I, on the other hand, am not.

Second, making political decisions based on "feels" is not walking, but running us headfirst towards disaster.

QED? Blackface McGroper... _"Grow the economy from the heart outwards."_ Where's that technicolour vomiting emoticon when you need it? If he had balanced the budget this year like he had promised back in 2015, we wouldn't be rushing into economic disaster with his unsustainable Chinese coronavirus "solution".

Third, quote the exact passage where I noted where anybody doesn't "deserve to survive". Be specific.

Fourth, the "structural existence of poverty" is not cured by welfare, no matter how good the "feels". It merely perpetuates it. Period.

QED? First Immigrants.

Fifth, if you don't like your job, create another, preferably legal, opportunity. Is it going to be easy? Unlikely. But it's certainly better than driving yourself to an early grave. Work smarter, not harder.

As far as your precious "enhancements" are concerned you deserve none, zero, of them. Those are the type of things that modern, reliable energy provides. As you are ideologically opposed to a contemporary, carbon or nuclear energy-based lifestyle, go back to your cold, dark cave, animal skins on your back, your knapping flint in hand & be thankful for it...



CubaMark said:


> Blah, blah, blah...


----------



## Beej

Ottawa company hopes to develop mobile COVID-19 test in 4 weeks
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/otta...test-covid-19-1.5505241?__vfz=medium=sharebar

I've seen similar stories from companies in Korea and the U.S. It looks like portable fast testing will begin to be deployed in April.


----------



## Beej

Strange news on potential symptoms.

Loss of smell may be a sign of COVID-19 infection: doctors' groups
https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coron...f-covid-19-infection-doctors-groups-1.4863341


> According to the British doctors, two-thirds of all confirmed COVID-19 cases in Germany have reported losing their ability to smell. In South Korea, where tests were carried out even on those showing no signs of illness, loss of smell was reportedly found in 30 per cent of cases where patients tested positive but only showed mild symptoms.


----------



## SINC

*Evidence over hysteria — COVID-19*

https://archive.is/yuaUq#selection-175.0-175.33


----------



## eMacMan

Beej said:


> Strange news on potential symptoms.
> 
> Loss of smell may be a sign of COVID-19 infection: doctors' groups
> https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coron...f-covid-19-infection-doctors-groups-1.4863341



Also any other cold or flu virus you care to name.


----------



## Beej

Another odd story, this time from Spain.

How dogs have become hot property during Spain's coronavirus lockdown
https://www.thelocal.es/20200319/wh...hey-had-a-dog-during-the-coronavirus-lockdown


> Unlike in Italy, where people can go out to stretch their legs despite a national lockdown, Spain has banned all such sorties under its state of emergency.
> 
> But they can go out if they have a four-legged friend -- for a brief walk and only to carry out the bare necessities.





> "One dog owner told me someone had sent him a message asking if they could rent his dog," Fe says.


----------



## Beej

gwillikers said:


>


Not quite the same thing, but close enough. You were ahead of your time!

Apple donating millions of N95 industrial masks to health professionals in United States and Europe
https://9to5mac.com/2020/03/21/apple-n95-mask-donation/

Fashion retailers are also getting into supplying emergency masks. If masks become "normal" in Europe and North America, then they will have to be more fashionable.


----------



## SINC

*Scientists Identify 69 Drugs to Test Against the Coronavirus*

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/22/...medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark


----------



## SINC

*Israeli doctor in Italy: We no longer help those over 60*

https://www.jpost.com/International...medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark


----------



## eMacMan

Beej said:


> Another odd story, this time from Spain.
> 
> How dogs have become hot property during Spain's coronavirus lockdown
> https://www.thelocal.es/20200319/wh...hey-had-a-dog-during-the-coronavirus-lockdown


Incredibly stupid. Since there was a very low transmission rate on airplanes and even quarantined cruise ships, even someone who buys the propaganda at a wholesale level, should be able to figure out that the chances of catching it outdoors are as close to zero as you can get.

It is all about the tyrants proving they are in control and has zero to do with containing the virus.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> Fashion retailers are also getting into supplying emergency masks. If masks become "normal" in Europe and North America, then they will have to be more fashionable.


Japan is ahead of the curve here. In Tokyo they have long been worn as fashion statements.


----------



## SINC

And now this:

Out-Of-Work Strippers Are Delivering Food Through Boober Eats

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQZdL_uV-GQ


----------



## eMacMan

SINC said:


> *Israeli doctor in Italy: We no longer help those over 60*
> 
> https://www.jpost.com/International...medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark


Given that every source is spinning the stats, I took this with a grain of salt. However one source claims the average CV death age in Italy is 81, 80% of those who died had 2 or more pre-existing conditions and 50% had 3 or more conditions. Further claim is that within the otherwise healthy individuals who contract the virus the death rate is under 0.8% or pretty much on a par with any other cold or flu virus.

Still it's a great way to reduce the load on the national pension funds. Also should be noted that over the past several years Italy has been doing a Ralph Kline/Jason Kenney on their health system, which may be another big reason behind selective treatment. 

Funny with all the hysteria and stockpiling my pharmacy had Vitamin D3 in stock at the regular price. Thankfully so as being in the elderly category, I consider D3 supplements essential preventive action during the winter cold and flu season.


----------



## SINC

eMacMan said:


> Funny with all the hysteria and stockpiling my pharmacy had Vitamin D3 in stock at the regular price. Thankfully so as being in the elderly category, I consider D3 supplements essential preventive action during the winter cold and flu season.


My GP told me 20 years back to stop taking multi-vitamins after my heart attack. He said, "All you need is vitamin D, so take a 1000 i/u tablet daily all year round." It has worked well for me for two decades now.


----------



## Beej

eMacMan said:


> Further claim is that within the otherwise healthy individuals who contract the virus the death rate is under 0.8% or pretty much on a par with any other cold or flu virus.


The flu does not typically kill anywhere close to 1% of otherwise healthy people. Flu kills about 0.1% overall, so a much lower rate for the otherwise healthy.


----------



## eMacMan

Beej said:


> The flu does not typically kill anywhere close to 1% of otherwise healthy people. Flu kills about 0.1% overall, so a much lower rate for the otherwise healthy.


Actually virii themselves kill almost nobody it is secondary complications such as pnuemonia. Regardless the total infection rate is so low that it in no way can justify a mass population suppression, certainly not the accompanying attempt to force feed a cashless society on us. 

That change you get from the till may have been handled by 2 other people in the past 24 hours. Just think about how many use that keypad between cleanings? Especially with stores sold out of alcohol and alcohol wipes.


----------



## Beej

eMacMan said:


> Regardless the total infection rate is so low


Unchecked total infection figures more than triple each week (Canada increased times 6 earlier in March, and times 4-5 in the last seven days), plus the symptoms are more severe than a typical flu, which leads to a higher hospitalization rate. These two things combined are a significant problem (in addition to 5-15% of seniors dying if all were infected) because the hospitals go from fine to overloaded in a few weeks, after which triage ensues for ventilators and other care (ie. mortality rate increases).

This is why the daily corona virus deaths in Italy are now higher than total flu season deaths up to mid January. It can spread to millions like the flu, but kills far more.


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Link dump. Headlines mostly self-explanatory.

Caution: Occasional links to MotherCorpse inside.

The Media Has "Reported" A Hundred Times that Trump "Dissolved" the NSC Epidemic Unit.
This Is a Lie.

Conceit And Contagion


Wuhan Flu

Hollywood Scrambles As It Loses Millions (Billions?) to Coronavirus, and I Just Can't Stop Laughing

World's Biggest Sufferer of Small Man's Disease, the "Pirate" Rick Wilson, Demonstrates His NeverTrump Principles by Wishing the Chinese Flu on the First Lady

Wuhan Flu

Woo Flu

Apocalypse Fatigue: Why Won't At-Risk Boomers Panic About the Wuhan Virus?

Trump: We're Preparing to Approve Off-Label Use of the Anti-Malarial Drug Chlorequine (or Hydroxychloroquine), Which Has Been Found to Greatly Reduce the Infectiousness of Coronavirus Carriers

Your Government Is Here For Them



> The Canadian government will soon roll out millions in foreign aid spending to help combat the spread of COVID-19 abroad, particularly in refugee camps and developing countries, says International Development Minister Karina Gould.


INTERACTIVE: This Map Shows How Many Have Died From Coronavirus In Each US State

Former FEMA Chief Rips Out Earpiece, Walks Off MSNBC: Not Listening to ‘Bullsh*t’

Not All Heroes Wear Capes

NO CORONAVIRUS SCREENING: Pakistani arrivals to Canada surprised no one took their temperature


Canada just gave 16 tonnes of medical supplies to China -- let’s hope they return the favour


COVID-19 outbreak another reminder Justin Trudeau must take a tougher stance on China

Ilhan Omar praises Trump's 'incredible' response to coronavirus pandemic

Prog heads exploding...

Ilhan Omar The Latest Trump Opponent To Praise President’s Leadership In Coronavirus Crisis

Coronavirus turmoil poses test as Canada’s Bombardier sheds assets

Coronavirus: Hillary Clinton Calls to ‘Make Voting by Mail the Norm’ in 2020

What could possibly go wrong?

COVID-19 restrictions to last 'weeks to months': Trudeau

RACIS'!!!

Coronavirus: Trudeau says irregular migrants will be turned away at Canada-U.S. border

RACIS'!!!

Justin Trudeau: Canada’s National Disaster



> Trudeau, a virtue-signaler from the egg, will not move a finger if it offends the Canadian left and exposes him to the false charge of racism.


Grocers Change Reusable Bag Policies Amid COVID-19

Ottawa to roll out foreign aid as part of the fight against COVID-19 spread

Thanks To Capitalism, Grocery Shelves Keep Getting Restocked During Emergencies

Vice: Most of You Are Concerrned About People Dying from the Chinese Flu, But Please Give a Thought to the Real Victims: Transgenders Who Are Having Their Elective Dick-Amputation Surgeries Delayed

Brutal...

“This Is Not A Suggestion”



> Saskatchewan goes into mandatory lock down… details to follow.


Woo Flu, Continued.

Mum's 'home economics' coronavirus home-schooling plan has parents in stitches

Cognitive Dissonance Test for TDS-Infected Canadians

Miss BumBum to the rescue!



> The reigning champion of Brazil’s famed Miss BumBum contest is doing her bit in battling the coronavirus and her fans’ boredom.
> 
> The 29-year-old Brazilian beauty is posting a variety of saucy snaps wearing white lingerie, masks and rubber gloves while wielding hand sanitizer. It’s part of her safety-first message.


Wuhan Flu

I Want A New Country



> So Trudeau has directed the RCMP at Roxham Rd. to cease acting as glorified bell hops and now arrest illegal border crossers and immediately send them back to the USA. I am old enough to remember when then “experts” said the PM could NOT direct the RCMP. How about you?
> 
> — Bill Brasky (@Polkameister) March 22, 2020​


Amazing How Much Change Can Occur in 24 Hours

Your Government Is Here For You

You feelin' lucky punk?



> _"Liberal Health Minister Patty Hajdu says she's *looking at 'criminal penalties' for Canadian travellers* who don't follow the government's advice to self-isolate."_​


As the meme notes, from the folks who brought you zero screening at Canadian airports...


Former Hillary Clinton Subordinate Cites Some Effects of Coronavirus That ‘Are Good for the Planet’

WHO tweeted in January “no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission” for coronavirus

Senate Democrats Are Crashing the US Economy For... Favors for Unions and Environmentalist Boondoggles

Obama Admin Depleted Stockpile of N95 Masks, Never Restored

LA Times and Bloomberg News Both Report: Federal Stockpile of N95 Masks Was Depleted Under Obama and Never Restocked


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Just a little FYI...

More Anecdotal Evidence That Chloroquinine Is Effective; The FDA is to Blame For the Six Weeks of Delay in Coronavirus Testing



> Meanwhile, it turns out that Orange Man Bad was not responsible for the delay in coronavirus testing.
> 
> *The FDA refused to expedite approvals for the test, despite a national health emergency having been declared.*


Bold mine.

And even with the delay, he was still weeks ahead of The Spawn...


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

And He Should Stay There



> Coronavirus goes exponential, TSX down 10.3%, the bottom drops out of oil, and where is the Prime Minister?
> 
> At a feminist conference.
> 
> Related: _The Liberals get the Bloc Québécois to help them shut down investigation into report on PM Trudeau breaking ethics laws._


----------



## FeXL

Your own best judgment determines what you do, if anything, to prepare for an epidemic of the Wuhan coronavirus. For myself, each round of information, as unreliable as it may be in its specifics, suggests an notable epidemic is more likely than not.



> The elites are aware of our existence largely through hearsay, having disengaged from the life of the nation within a century of its founding, driven away by militant factions and other lunatics, the upper class among them. The elite are as disconnected from the class structure as are homeless drunks, and share a similar indifference. But to their credit, while they're neither virtuous nor commendable, it isn't the elites who are peddling woke causes or looting whole industries or buying boltholes in New Zealand. It's their cunning and voracious aspirants, the upper class, which to our everlasting shame is our ruling class.


----------



## SINC

*How the U of A's Li Ka Shing Institute of Virology is responding to the COVID-19 crisis*

Institute was designed for rapid response to viral pandemic.

https://www.folio.ca/how-the-li-ka-shing-institute-of-virology-is-responding-to-the-covid-19-crisis/


----------



## SINC

A long, but very good read that sheds some light on our future.

*Will the Coronavirus Ever Go Away? Here's What One of the WHO's Top Experts Thinks*



> Dr. Bruce Aylward has almost 30 years experience in fighting polio, Ebola and other diseases, and now, he’s turned his attention to stopping the spread of COVID-19.
> 
> Aylward, the senior adviser to the Director-General of the World Health Organization (WHO), is one of the world’s top officials in charge of fighting the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> The doctor, who led a joint WHO mission to China in February to study the effectiveness of the coronavirus response in the country, has seen firsthand the measures Beijing took to fight the virus. Now he’s sharing what he learned with governments and communicating with the WHO response teams working to fight COVID-19 in virus epicenters around the globe.
> 
> In an extensive teleconference interview with TIME from his office in Geneva, Aylward shared what he thinks needs to be done to stop the pandemic, and what the future might hold.
> 
> The following excerpts from the conversation have been condensed and edited for clarity.
> 
> Do you expect COVID-19 to continue to spread?
> 
> We can get little glimpses into the future from places that are recently getting infected, places that aren’t infected, but also the places where it all started. And if you go back and look at China right now, they [identified the virus] in early January, they had a full on response, sort of threw everything at it, and it’s middle of March now and they estimate maybe end of March they’ll be coming out of it, so a full three months.
> 
> When you look around the world in Europe, North America, the Middle East, you can see that we’re really at the period of exponential growth, we’re still seeing the virus going up very, very rapidly, even in hard hit places like Italy, for example. These countries still have months of this challenge in front of them.
> 
> When you look to other parts of the world, like Africa, for example, and parts of the Indian subcontinent you can see that it’s just beginning. Even though they have very, very few cases, if you look carefully at that curve, it’s also in a phase of exponential growth.


Much more at the link.

https://time.com/5805368/will-coron...AbphtZYD-89gzKY_M8JYS8nx_MF-KqZNnuSQXDbNQoSsM


----------



## CubaMark

Overheard at the local grocery store checkout this morning:

[Checkout staff to the guy behind me]

"I'm sorry sir, you need to stay six feet back until this gentleman has finished"​
[Old ****er who looked like he was around during the 1918 Spanish Flu epidemic]

"Don't you think there's such a thing as too much caution? I just got back from Delaware, and we didn't have to do nothing like this down there".​Of course not. You were visiting a country where the Doofus-in-Chief believes folks with the coronavirus should just go to work and they'll get better (yes, he really said that). And also - shouldn't you be in self-isolation?
Jeez.


----------



## FeXL

SINC said:


> Here's What One of the WHO's Top Experts Thinks


Sorry, SINC, but is this the very same WHO that didn't believe in human to human coronavirus transmission as late as January?

I trust any arm of the UN just about as much as I trust the numbers coming out of Com-Chi. XX)


----------



## CubaMark

*Meanwhile, in the apocalyptics states of America.....*

*158 Million Americans Told to Stay Home, but Trump Pledges to Keep It Short*

We are going to save American workers, and we’re going to save them quickly. And we’re going to save our great American companies — both small and large. This was a medical problem. We are not going to let it turn into a long lasting financial problem. We also have a large team working on what the next steps will be once the medical community gives a region the OK, meaning the OK to get going, to get back. 

Let’s go to work. Our country wasn’t built to be shut down. This is not a country that was built for this. It was not built to be shut down. America will, again and soon, be open for business very soon. A lot sooner than three or four months that somebody was suggesting — a lot sooner. We cannot let the cure be worse than the problem itself. We’re not going to let the cure be worse than the problem.

(NYTimes)​


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Once again, your TDS rears its ugly head.

Yesterday, Blackface McGroper got on the microphone & started giving Canuckistanians hell for not isolating, noting that none of us is invincible, or some such garbage. This, all the while not closing down air travel from majorly afflicted countries or shutting down Roxham Road.

The iron...



CubaMark said:


> (yes, he really said that)


Shouldn't you?



CubaMark said:


> And also - shouldn't you be in self-isolation?


----------



## CubaMark

Meanwhile, thanks to folks-who-can't-admit-their-prejudices (I have black / asian / indian friends!) who insist on referring to the pandemic as the _Chinese_ Coronavirus, **** like this is happening:

*Coronavirus: Attacks against Asian Americans reported in Bay Area and beyond*

Cynthia Choi, co-executive director of Chinese for Affirmative Action, is part of a coalition that has started tracking attacks against Asian Americans related to the coronavirus epidemic. They launched their tracker on Thursday and within 24 hours had more than 40 reports.

“I talked to a woman several days ago who was accused of bringing the coronavirus to this country and was spat on by a stranger on the street,” in San Francisco, Choi said.

Incidents like that, she said, are part of a troubling trend of racism, xenophobia and discrimination directed at Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders in the Bay Area and nationwide over COVID-19. The virus, which does not have any connection to race or ethnicity, was first identified in China before quickly becoming a global pandemic that has infected tens of thousands of people in Europe, the Middle East and North America.

(Mercury News)​


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Yet you voluntarily post any number of times on a thread clearly called "The Chinese Coronavirus Thread".

Let me guess: Chinese Ring-Necked Pheasant, English Sparrow and Chinese food are also RACIS'!!!

Go, start up your own thread. You can call it the "Butthurt Progs Politically Correct But Factually Wrong Covid-19 Thread" or some such.

I wondered how long it was going to take for some sad Prog SJW to start whining about this...



CubaMark said:


> <sniff, cry, whine...VICTIM!!!>


----------



## FeXL

The Bigot blaming this on Trump because, "He said!!!" in 3, 2...

Area Retards Decide That Fish Tank Cleaner Is a Useful and Safe Drug for Pre-Emptively Treating Coronavirus;
_Media Blames Trump_



> Now Trump, of course, wasn't so stupid as to confuse a chemical cleaner with an FDA approved-for-human-use drug.
> 
> But you know who was?
> 
> *The media. It was The Media who told people that hydroxychloroquine was the same as chloroquine phosphate.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The media conflated prescribed anti-malaria medication with a fish tank treatment and then tried to blame Trump for the idiots who started purchasing and/or ingesting it pic.twitter.com/OXbsukz5Zn
> — Amber Athey (@amber_athey) March 24, 2020
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Last week dozens of media outlets showcased that FISH TANK CLEANER has Chloroquine Phosphate in it, which is a less safe version of Hydroxychloroquine.
> 
> Now people are ingesting fish tank cleaner and dying.
> 
> The media is disgustingly irresponsible & to blame for this tragic death pic.twitter.com/T0K6eTjOO6
> — Michael Coudrey (@MichaelCoudrey) March 24, 2020
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Weird how _The Media_ overlooks that.
Click to expand...

Bold mine.

For those of you keeping track, that would be the <spit> _Prog_ media...


----------



## FeXL

You simply cannot fix stupid.

Hold My Tide Pod



> A kid who licked toilets as part of the #CoronaVirusChallenge says he's now in the hospital with coronavirus. @gayshawnmendes was also just suspended from twitter pic.twitter.com/lfG2NBlTrs
> 
> — Pardes Seleh (@PardesSeleh) March 23, 2020​


That's almost as dumb as licking doorknobs & walls. Oh, wait...


----------



## FeXL

The Morning Rant: Minimalist Edition



> Khamenei’s Lies About the Wuhan Virus Put Lives at Risk
> 
> Supreme Leader Khamenei’s fabrications regarding the Wuhan Virus are dangerous and they put Iranians and people around the world at greater risk. Facts matter. Here are a few the Iranian regime would like to keep from the world:​


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> The Bigot blaming this on Trump because, "He said!!!" in 3, 2...
> 
> Area Retards Decide That Fish Tank Cleaner Is a Useful and Safe Drug for Pre-Emptively Treating Coronavirus;
> _Media Blames Trump_
> 
> Bold mine.
> 
> For those of you keeping track, that would be the <spit> _Prog_ media...


Seriously? That's the best rebuttal you have?

Let's take what Trump said, exactly:










Combine that with decades of rollbacks of education standards, "empowering" local school boards to dumb down the science and dumb up the bible-thumping, on top of general education underfunding and programme cuts, not to mention the cost of getting a decent education in the USA in that context, and you have a recipe for disaster - as in, someone seeing "chloroquine" and thinking "it's gotta be close to what Donnie told me to take!".

Yes, that NBC report should have gotten it right from the get-go, but a technicality does not absolve the Cheetoh-in-Chief of spreading misinformation and dangerous opinions on the virus.

There are other reports of folks around the world doing the same damn thing - taking anything resembling "chloroquine" and thinking it will save them.

Maybe if we prioritized a science-based curriculum, access to education and had a global political leader (ick) with half a ****ing clue, then things might turn out differently.

Until then, we have you lot grasping at straws to exonerate the unpardonable....


----------



## Beej

Some laughs about our current situation.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8LPPIG8k6o[/ame]


----------



## FeXL

FeXL said:


> The Bigot blaming this on Trump because, "He said!!!" in 3, 2...


...1 BINGO!!!

Pavlov's dog would be envious...

:lmao::lmao::lmao:


----------



## Macfury

CM, you're really grasping at straws here. If he calls the drug by either the right name or the wrong name you find him at fault. At the same time you blame the federal government for the quality of education offered by individual states. Maybe it's time to put a damper on your old man mumbling...


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Still waiting.

Are Chinese Ring-Necked Pheasant, English Sparrow and Chinese food RACIS'! terms?

How about Canada Goose? Atlantic Puffin? Mexican Chickadee? Pacific Loon? Siberian Blue Robin? Tahiti Petrel? Tennessee Warbler? West Indian Whistling Duck? Yucatan Vireo?

Try these on for size: North American Porcupine? Alaskan Hare? Guadalupe Fur Seal? American Bison? Arizona Woodrat? Texas Kangaroo Rat? Wyoming Pocket Gopher? Idaho Ground Squirrel? West Indian Manatee?

And these: Chicago Deep Dish Pizza? Coney Island Hot Dog? Kansas City BBQ? Manhattan & New England Clam Chowder? Philadelphia Cheese Steak?


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> Hello, Bigot.
> 
> Still waiting.
> 
> Are Chinese Ring-Necked Pheasant, English Sparrow and Chinese food RACIS'! terms?


You should be more mindful of your man Donnie of the small hands. Even he has recognized (or his staff somehow managed to clue him in) that referring to it as the Chinese Coronavirus is directly attributable to cases of violence against Asian-Americans.

I cannot fathom how you folks look at Trump and cannot see the utter incompetent disaster that he is. He's not a blue / bold dress. He's a bumbling, possibly mentally ill, habitual liar who is incapable of responding to a simple question.

Remember a few days ago when he lost his **** over a reporter asking him what he'd say to American citizens who are afraid of the situation? Rather than send a message of reassurance, he went off on the reporter, calling him a bad journalist, etc. The persecution complex on full display. I'll give VP Pence credit for at least answering that same question later in the day with some class.

And then we have this example of his permanent state of incoherence:

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFXHZaOuyfc[/ame]

What the hell is a "beautiful timeline"? Why could he not answer the simple question as to what his medical advisors have recommended? 

Undoubtedly, everyone from public health experts to medical doctors to anyone who knows how to apply a friggin' band-aid has told this utter moron that his desire to "get America back to work" is a recipe for disaster.

But someone's investments are at risk, so... good luck out there, folks! tptptptp


----------



## Macfury

Not a single discouraging word for Trudeau, of course... because TRUMMMMMMMMP!



CubaMark said:


> Blah, blah...Trump


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Two lengthy replies & you're still dodging the question. Let me paint you a picture.

All those nouns have one thing in common: They are _descriptors_, not _accusations_. If you don't know the difference, then _you're_ part of the problem.

The fact that there are people out there who are so stupid as to stop drinking Corona beer or are attacking people of oriental persuasion because they are misguided enough to think either are somehow to blame is _not_ Trump's fault, any more than it is yours or mine.

In addition, if you think that sugar-coating a name will somehow stop stupidity from happening then, again, _you're_ part of the problem. People who hate will, quite simply, hate. No matter what name a fukcing virus is called. It originated in China. That's all some need.

Get a grip, man.



CubaMark said:


> Blah, blah, blah...


----------



## macintosh doctor

CubaMark said:


> Seriously? That's the best rebuttal you have?
> 
> .


People are losing their s h i t because President Trump suggests a possibility that a drug if dosed correctly by a doctor can help in the fight against covid19. Some idiots self prescribed it to themselves and died, now how is it his fault and dangerous ? If I am in a hospital on a ventilator gasping for breath feeling like my lungs are full of glass, gimme the goddamned stuff, I will take my chances. I'd even shove one of Gweneth Paltrow's goop eggs up my ass if I thought it might actually give me some relief.


----------



## Macfury

Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhh!



macintosh doctor said:


> People are losing their s h i t because President Trump suggests a possibility that a drug if dosed correctly by a doctor can help in the fight against covid19.


----------



## macintosh doctor

Macfury said:


> Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhh!


again.. we have 300 million people down south heavily armed.. Trump is just trying to give hope and save the economy.. if you think he is nuts think again when those 300 million lose their collective s h i t.. no army on this planet can save us.. 


also : 
Watched CBC yesterday.. India is claiming there are 15K Canadian citizens wanting to come "home".. I am calling BULL ****.. they are not citizens.. they are opportunists.. They are only Canadian for the social programs!! all of a sudden they need our help but during the year they not even in the country, nor paying into our taxes.. 
Just think about the logistics .. we go to repatriate them, it will take 1 month of using Airbus A380 filled right up.. then the repercussions of social payments and influx of the Wuhan virus. Enough is Enough!!! they had since December to come home when the news broke.. Sorry but not Sorry - enjoy your true country of citizenship.. Peace..


----------



## Macfury

Trump is right. People need hope and they need an economy to support them. The effect of a depression or severe recession on people's lives has the potential to be greater than the deaths from COVID-19. People in younger age brackets need to get out there to develop herd immunity.




macintosh doctor said:


> again.. we have 300 million people down south heavily armed.. Trump is just trying to give hope and save the economy.. if you think he is nuts think again when those 300 million lose their collective s h i t.. no army on this planet can save us..
> 
> 
> also :
> Watched CBC yesterday.. India is claiming there are 15K Canadian citizens wanting to come "home".. I am calling BULL ****.. they are not citizens.. they are opportunists.. They are only Canadian for the social programs!! all of a sudden they need our help but during the year they not even in the country, nor paying into our taxes..
> Just think about the logistics .. we go to repatriate them, it will take 1 month of using Airbus A380 filled right up.. then the repercussions of social payments and influx of the Wuhan virus. Enough is Enough!!! they had since December to come home when the news broke.. Sorry but not Sorry - enjoy your true country of citizenship.. Peace..


----------



## macintosh doctor

Macfury said:


> Trump is right. People need hope and they need an economy to support them. The effect of a depression or severe recession on people's lives has the potential to be greater than the deaths from COVID-19. People in younger age brackets need to get out there to develop herd immunity.


not appreciating your sarcasm ..imagine if Trump collectively at once told 300 million people to stay in doors and quarantine the nation 
... our fluid borders would not stand a chance, not to mention the USA does not have the police force to control 300 million people.. 
look at California on a good day with the illegals and gangs.. now multiply that by 1000000 and you will see it go bad very quickly.. it will make iraq look like they have everything under control and civil disobedience is will be the new norm..


----------



## Macfury

What sarcasm?



macintosh doctor said:


> not appreciating your sarcasm ..imagine if Trump collectively at once told 300 million people to stay in doors and quarantine the nation
> ... our fluid borders would not stand a chance, not to mention the USA does not have the police force to control 300 million people..
> look at California on a good day with the illegals and gangs.. now multiply that by 1000000 and you will see it go bad very quickly.. it will make iraq look like they have everything under control and civil disobedience is will be the new norm..


----------



## macintosh doctor

Macfury said:


> People in younger age brackets need to get out there to develop herd immunity.


am I to assume you meant that as serious? you are sounding like an muslim cleric in iran
where they have said hug and kiss and shake hands to build immunity.


----------



## SINC

macintosh doctor said:


> am I to assume you meant that as serious? you are sounding like an muslim cleric in iran
> where they have said hug and kiss and shake hands to build immunity.


This guy agrees with MF!

Radical approach, but could he be right?

*Lawrence Solomon: The lockdown should be for the old and vulnerable, no one else*

https://business.financialpost.com/...Jfr9o3INZfweAz9ddKNIf47Wvg#Echobox=1585229797


----------



## macintosh doctor

and so it begins.. finally.. 
$20 Trillion lawsuit filed against China.. 
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-lawyer-larry-klayman-sues-chinese-government-over-outbreak/



SINC said:


> This guy agrees with MF!
> 
> Radical approach, but could he be right?
> 
> *Lawrence Solomon: The lockdown should be for the old and vulnerable, no one else*
> 
> https://business.financialpost.com/...Jfr9o3INZfweAz9ddKNIf47Wvg#Echobox=1585229797


BULL S H I T- it has been proven that those who have had can get reinfected.. 
i really hope this insanity is not allowed to be considered.


----------



## Macfury

macintosh doctor said:


> am I to assume you meant that as serious? you are sounding like an muslim cleric in iran
> where they have said hug and kiss and shake hands to build immunity.


Nope. Read up here:

https://www.heart.org/en/news/2020/03/25/covid-19-science-understanding-the-basics-of-herd-immunity

I'm suggesting that younger people shouldn't be forced into quarantine against their will. They may get the virus, but are also unlikely to die or clog emergency rooms. That's all.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> Nope. Read up here:
> 
> https://www.heart.org/en/news/2020/03/25/covid-19-science-understanding-the-basics-of-herd-immunity
> 
> I'm suggesting that younger people shouldn't be forced into quarantine against their will. They may get the virus, but are also unlikely to die or clog emergency rooms. That's all.


Based on U.S. hospitalization rates, they would still clog the system.
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6912e2.htm?s_cid=mm6912e2_w#T1_down

Unless you just let the under 20s out, and then locked them out of their homes. That still wouldn't do much of anything for the economy, but maybe it would toughen them kids up. 

More seriously, that's the reason Boris Johnson reversed on this idea. The figures don't work for the corona virus, and that's even when assuming the seniors are highly secure, which they wouldn't be if healthcare workers aren't highly secure, which they wouldn't be if their friends, family, and kids are not. At least until cheap rapid testing is available. In other words, when Johnson chose the strategy it was going to fail.

Cheap and rapid testing, or highly effective treatment, could change things in the near future.


----------



## FeXL

I read something over the last few days that noted younger peoplekind were taking up about 20% of hospital beds. Can't recall where it was but it ties in somewhat closely with Beej's CDC link.


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> I read something over the last few days that noted younger peoplekind were taking up about 20% of hospital beds. Can't recall where it was but it ties in somewhat closely with Beej's CDC link.


It's a mess because, early on, there can be a strong age bias in the data. Germany, for example, had a young initial outbreak. Or, for another example, Italy's cited data on deaths already includes triage, which would favour unplugging the 80 year old to save the 30 year old, biasing the results. But, yes, in the early U.S. data I have seen the result you mention, everyone except under 20s is taking up a material share of intensive care units. 

The very young are fine the vast majority of the time, so let em loose, but don't let them back in the house. beejacon


----------



## macintosh doctor

Macfury said:


> Nope. Read up here:
> 
> https://www.heart.org/en/news/2020/03/25/covid-19-science-understanding-the-basics-of-herd-immunity
> 
> I'm suggesting that younger people shouldn't be forced into quarantine against their will. They may get the virus, but are also unlikely to die or clog emergency rooms. That's all.


i refuse to let the tide pod eating crowd and surface licking corona challenged 20 somethings ruin the world.. you fail to realize they all live in their parents basement, as they tick tok on their smart phones.. so when they come home they will kill us 40+ crowds.. 
i will not sacrifice myself for those genderless liberal brainwashed idiots.. 
sorry on to the challenge of finding a cure .. to the Chinese virus


----------



## chasMac

As stupid as young people are they don't hate their parents. I think they'd come to an accommodation in which they would avoid their elders if they chose to reintegrate into the economy.

Britain had it right in the first place - oldsters and the vulnerable should be shut in for 12-18 months or so. If they have dependents living in the basement or whatever, those too would be forced to self-isolate.


----------



## Macfury

chasMac said:


> As stupid as young people are they don't hate their parents. I think they'd come to an accommodation in which they would avoid their elders if they chose to reintegrate into the economy.
> 
> Britain had it right in the first place - oldsters and the vulnerable should be shut in for 12-18 months or so. If they have dependents living in the basement or whatever, those too would be forced to self-isolate.


You've got it, chasMac. Nice to see you posting!


----------



## chasMac

Macfury said:


> You've got it, chasMac. Nice to see you posting!


Nothing much else to do these days.


----------



## Beej

Beej said:


> For people interested in data, the following site frequently updates. The updates are ahead of national updates in the U.S. and Canada because they appear to be using state and province data, but it's worth double-checking with a one day lag.
> 
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
> 
> Note that the U.S. has reported 7.5 cases per million people compared to 6 in Canada despite us having a much higher test rate. For example, according to the CDC the U.S. has run about 13,000 tests, or closer to 20,000 with the data lag, while Ontario has run 7,000 tests. CDC data may not include private labs, which will become an increasing share going forward.
> 
> U.S. tests per million, using my 20,000 guesstimate: 61
> Ontario tests per million: 479
> 
> https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/testing-in-us.html
> https://www.ontario.ca/page/2019-novel-coronavirus


Summary: The U.S. still does not understand the breadth of their problem, but they are getting closer to at least Canada's degree of understanding (which could still be inadequate).

To update, the U.S. now has 250 cases per million, or 83,000 in total. Canada has 105 per million, or 4,000 in total. Note that the ratio of our per million total used to be 1.25 (7.5 divided 6), and it is now 2.4. The early testing problem in the U.S. later lead to a faster spread problem.

On testing, this site is tracking total U.S.testing, public and private, which has ramped up, but is still inadequate in many states. 
https://covidtracking.com/data/

For example, Texas has fewer test results than Ontario (21,000 vs 27,000), despite having about double the population, and Arizona has completed just under 1,000 tests. Ontario's testing backlog (tested, but results pending) is worrying.

The above uses some free data gathering initiatives (aside from Ontario specifics), so maybe give them overnight to find errors. I've seen one error occur, fixed after a few hours, while Health Canada and CDC data lags 1-3 days, or is incomplete in the case of U.S. testing.


----------



## Beej

The story includes the B.C. government's presentation on scenarios.

B.C. ‘cautiously optimistic’ about COVID-19 forecast, but warns hospitals could still be overwhelmed
https://globalnews.ca/news/6741258/bc-covid-19-forecast-modelling/

There is useful data in there, including confirmation that 4-5% of people who get the virus (only including tested people), require an intensive care unit.


----------



## FeXL

The Lighter side:

Family

The Darker:

Kaiser, NY Prisons & More Just Blowing It.



> The Stupid, It Burns.
> 
> Kaiser Medical has threatened to fire nurses, treating Covid-19 patients, if they wear an N95 mask. Even their own.
> 
> In New York, prison guards are forbidden to wear an N95 mask.


Trump: Cuomo Opted for Death Panels, Lotteries Instead of Buying Ventilators



> New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo had a chance to order 16,000 ventilators five years ago for a discount, but he opted for death panels and lotteries instead, President Donald Trump said Tuesday.


Related:

Trump Finds Skeleton In Cuomo’s Closet, Exposes It On Live TV: “He Rejected Buying 16k Ventilators in 2015, Shouldn’t Blame Us”



> President Trump reached into his pocket on Fox News today and pulled out something New York Mayor Andrew Cuomo did not want to see.
> 
> Trump, pulled out an op-ed by a former Lt Governor of New York, that accused Cuomo of refusing to buy 16,000 ventilators in 2015 after a committee recommended it.


The Media Lied About A Tragic Poisoning To Vilify Trump



> Over the past week President Donald Trump and others have touted the promise of certain anti-malarial drugs to potentially help treat victims of the Chinese virus. Among those drugs is chloroquine.
> 
> This week an elderly couple consumed chloroquine phosphate (not the same thing) contained in a fish tank cleaning product. The husband died, the wife went to the ICU. So what did the media do? What do they always do? They blamed Trump.


Trump said!!!

Climate Activists Urging Democrats to Use Coronavirus Crisis to Leverage Their Agenda



> The problem with being a radical, fanatical activist for climate change is that nothing else matters. There are no other issues to discuss or address. The world could be ending and climate activists would claim it's not happening fast enough.
> 
> So it shouldn't surprise us that global warming fanatics want to piggyback their agenda onto the $2 trillion stimulus deal currently being negotiated.


Progs. They never let a crisis go to waste...

Related:

Bongino Exposes The Dimocrat Dirt In Rescue Bill



> Bongino goes through the Pork and Progressive Agenda that Pelosi, A.O.C want to stuff into the economic rescue bill.
> 
> Forgive post office debt. Mandate Air Lines must do carbon offsets. Federal audits of selected elections. $35 Million for the Kennedy Center. Race, ethnicity, gender audits of corporate boards… and more.


Your Moral And Intellectual Superiors



> A short history of media memory-holing.
> 
> If you haven’t seen, Tucker bodied the media over their early coverage of coronavirus pic.twitter.com/E7uwrmtoun
> 
> — Comfortably Smug (@ComfortablySmug) March 24, 2020​
> Thread.


Iran's "Clerics" Steal $1 Billion in Medical Aid from the Public



> What does Allah command you do with thieves?


Yeppers.

Young Internet Influencers Have a New Way to Get Attention: Licking Stuff in Public to Spread Coronavirus



> You know what gallows humor means?
> 
> It means I'm going to laugh my ass off when angry mobs start lynching these ****ers in the street.


Chinese Virus



> China just sold €4,320,000,000. worth of medical supplies came from nationalized US supply chains to Spain, the country with the 2nd highest deaths caused by the Chinese virus:
> 
> ⬇
> 
> • 550M masks.
> • 5.5M test kits.
> • 950 ventilators.
> • 11M pairs of gloves. pic.twitter.com/J1yKaU35Fz
> 
> — BenTallmadge (@BenKTallmadge) March 26, 2020​
> Australia:
> 
> As the coronavirus took hold in Wuhan earlier this year, staff from the Chinese government-backed global property giant Greenland Group were instructed to put their normal work on hold and source bulk supplies of essential medical items to ship back to China.
> 
> A whistleblower from the company has told the Herald it was a worldwide Greenland effort – and the Sydney office was no different, sourcing bulk supplies of surgical masks, thermometers, antibacterial wipes, hand sanitisers, gloves and Panadol for shipping.​
> Meanwhile, in Chinada…


Wonder how much of that came from Blackface McGroper's 16 tonne donation:

China’s Arse Licker Trudeau faces criticism for sending 16 tonnes of personal protective equipment to China in February



> Canada’s department of Global Affairs shipped 16 tonnes of personal protective equipment to China last month to help Beijing fight the novel coronavirus, an effort that it undertook even after the World Health Organization had warned countries to prepare for possible cases.


Your Moral And Intellectual Superiors



> “Risk Remains Low” – Media Outlets Are Revisiting And Revising Their Old Reporting On The Coronavirus
> 
> Don’t worry about the coronavirus. Worry about the flu. https://t.co/x2ugwJGjF2
> 
> — BuzzFeed News (@BuzzFeedNews) January 29, 2020​
> Related: ‘Economist’ Runs Chinese Coronavirus Propaganda Disguised as News


Trump's Approval Rating for Handling the Wuhan Flu: 60%
The Media's? 44% -- Eleven Points Underwater



> In a poll of the public's approval for all actors in this ginned-up epidemic of panic, the public puts the least trust in the media.
> 
> Trump is trusted much, much more than the media.
> 
> That's gotta hurt.


Yep. That bastard, Trump.

Truckers are saying “**** the log rules, I’m hauling”



> Truckers are saying “**** the log rules, I’m hauling” and they’re getting supplies to the stores. People are stocking the shelves all night and letting old people shop first. Folks are buying meals for truckers, who (obviously) can’t go through the drive-ups. Asking ’em what they want, then buying it for them.​


:clap::clap::clap:

Andrea Mitchell: The Most Frightening Thing About This Pandemic Is Trump's "Skyrocketing" Approval Ratings



> Yes, we understood that this was the only thing that mattered to you.


Business as usual in Chinatown despite state of emergency



> Forget it John, it’s Chinatown!
> 
> In fact if one didn’t know the city and province had declared a state of emergency, and are encouraging people to not leave their homes unless necessary, you might think it was a regular day in Chinatown where it seems sidewalk sales are considered essential.
> 
> It seems when it comes to Prime Minister Justin Trudeau’s “stay home” mantra or Mayor John Tory’s threat’s to crack down, some stores didn’t get the memo.


Man who spooked the world with coronavirus model walks back his prediction

Wouldn't want to be accused of being RACIS!!! by closing down Chinatown. According to The Bigot, I'm probably being RACIS!!! myself by just saying "Chinatown"...



> Before we cause irreparable harm to our lives, liberty, and economy, shouldn’t we first study the nature of the virus, how many people really have it, when it started, and what really works in containing it? These are the questions some of us have already been asking, but our voices were silenced because of the Imperial College of London’s study that said this would kill 2.2 million people in the U.S. and 500,000 in the U.K. Now, the author of that study himself has essentially recanted his projection, whether he admits it or not.
> 
> Yesterday, Neil Ferguson of Imperial College London told the U.K.’s parliamentary select committee on science and technology that he is now “reasonably confident” there will not be an ICU shortage in London and that the fatalities will not exceed 20,000 in the U.K. He predicts that two-thirds of those would have died by the end of the year due to other conditions anyway. And rather than this lasting 18 months, as he projected in his first paper, which widely drove policies in the U.K. and U.S., Ferguson now predicts the virus will peak in “two or three weeks.”


The sonuvabitch should be charge with inciting mass panic.

Related:

UK has enough intensive care units for coronavirus, expert predicts



> The UK should now be able to cope with the spread of the covid-19 virus, according to one of the epidemiologists advising the government.
> 
> Neil Ferguson at Imperial College London gave evidence today to the UK’s parliamentary select committee on science and technology as part of an inquiry into the nation’s response to the coronavirus outbreak.


What an idiot.

Related, too:

"Global Warming" Alarmist Who Panicked the World By "Predicting" a Half Million Wuhan Flu Deaths In the UK Alone Now Says... Never Mind



> *We need heads for this.*
> 
> And I think I might mean that literally.
> 
> His new bull**** -- and his "model" is, like all alleged global warming models, completely based on whatever bull**** assumptions you start the model with -- garbage inputs, garbage outputs -- is that a great many more people contracted the Wuhan Flu than he thought, which means that many, many people had the flu and didn't even know it, which means... the Wuhan Flu is not much more dangerous than the standard yearly flu.
> 
> Gee sorry I crashed the world economy. _Muh bad._
> 
> Of course, he didn't do it alone. It was the incompetent psychotics of the media and the obsessive shut-ins of Twitter that really Spread the Disease of FakeNews Panic.


Bold mine.

Yeppers.


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

The Purple Perogy is unhappy...

Canada ‘strongly opposed’ to U.S. stationing troops near border



> “Canada is strongly opposed to this U.S. proposal and we’ve made that opposition very, very clear to our American counterparts,” said Deputy Prime Minister Chrystia Freeland today.


Ontario health workers desperate for protective gear, ventilators



> A critical shortage of protective medical equipment and respirators during COVID-19 must be addressed now or people will die — and some of the dead will be health-care workers.
> 
> That’s the urgent message from Doris Grinspun, head of the Registered Nurses Association of Ontario (RNAO).


Germany bans entry of 300,000 temporary foreign farm workers over coronavirus… Trudeau keeps Wuhan Flu Gate Wide Open



> “Seasonal and harvest workers will no longer be allowed to enter Germany within the framework of our border controls,” a spokesman for the interior ministry told a Berlin press conference.


More:



> *Temporary foreign workers exempt from some COVID-19 travel restrictions*
> 
> …Travel by temporary foreign workers will also be considered essential travel for land border restrictions.


Of course it will...

WHO policy fuelled Canada’s failure to slow Wuhan Coronavirus at borders #TrudeauLiedPeopleDied



> Two months ago Theresa Tam, Canada’s chief public health officer, reassured us about the COVID-19 outbreak.
> 
> “Canada’s risk is much, much lower than that of many countries,” Tam said. “It’s going to be rare, but we are expecting cases. It doesn’t matter how few those cases are. We are preparing the whole country in the event that you might pick up a rare case.”


Couldn't pour pee out of a boot if the instructions were written on the heel...

Trudeau plans on hiking carbon tax by 50% as coronavirus shuts down Canada



> One in three Canadian businesses will not survive for more than a month of the coronavirus pandemic, and that’s on top of the 929,000 Canadians who lost their jobs last week.


"But we're going to grow the economy from the heart outwards!" XX)

Fossil fuel energy helps us fight COVID-19



> For anyone who has ever advocated ending “the age of oil” — and for that matter ending the age of fossil fuels — you should be happy now.
> 
> You’re getting exactly what you wanted.


You get away with wearing blackface...



> ...groping women at will and paying 10 million dollars to a convicted terrorist & murderer... you start to feel invincible, I guess...
> 
> _ "Part 4 of the draft bill the Trudeau government presented to the Opposition ahead of today's sitting would allow Finance Minister Bill Morneau access to
> *'all money required to do anything.'*"_​
> Fortunately, every once in a while... somebody calls the Prime Minstrel on his ****.
> 
> It's time for a vote of non-confidence.


Related:

Fools And Our Money



> Sources told @globalnews the new draft was expected to drop controversial portions that allowed for sweeping and unprecedented powers of borrowing and spending for cabinet Ministers #cdnpoli #COVID19 #coronavirus
> 
> — Mercedes Stephenson (@MercedesGlobal) March 25, 2020​
> Pray that Quebec has the fortitude for what is about to befall her.
> 
> Money.
> Raining from the sky.
> From us.
> 
> Update.
> 
> REMINDER: Conservatives were ready to pass the aid package early this AM. The gov turned the aid bill into a power grab and threw the day into turmoil. We asked them to remove the power grab. They have not gotten back to us. As of 11:39pm, we haven't seen a new bill
> 
> — Pierre Poilievre (@PierrePoilievre) March 25, 2020​
> And another. Can I call em or can I call em?
> 
> *My heart goes out to the employees of @Bombardier & Canadians whose jobs are affected by #COVID19. We will be there for you. Our government is taking the necessary steps to get you financial help as quickly as possible.* That’s why we’re meeting in the @HoCChamber today. pic.twitter.com/ZHdqv2WdqR
> 
> — Pablo Rodriguez (@pablorodriguez) March 24, 2020​


Bold mine.

So, Asshole, a question: Where's your hue & cry about Bombardier getting yet another handout? And, _and,_ precisely how much cash have they contributed to Federal coffers that wasn't campaign money?

Yeah, thought so...

Related, too:

Trudeau blows his rising PR rating by sinking to new low



> Our Prime Minister, bless his deluded self, apparently thinks he still leads a majority government where he can ram through any legislation that his progressive little heart desires.
> 
> *He also must think opposition members, as well as the national press gallery, are all as dumb as posts.*


Bold mine.

Frankly, they are. But then again, so is The Dope.

Related, 3:

We can't afford the PMO's partisan games



> On its surface, what turned out to be less than a 24-hour delay before Prime Minister Justin Trudeau’s $82 billion economic stimulus package because of COVID-19 was passed by Parliament, wasn’t a big deal.
> 
> ...
> 
> *But the alarming thing was the logic of Trudeau’s PMO in putting that clause into the bill in the first place.*


Bold mine.

Your Country Is Here For Them



> Feed the dogs and they will not bark;
> 
> The federal government is planning to provide financial support to media organizations to keep journalists working and reporting on the COVID-19 crisis.​


'Cause $2 billion bucks a year doesn't buy nearly enough brand loyalty...

Canada to enforce mandatory quarantines for all returning travellers



> With the COVID-19 pandemic accelerating in the United States, the federal government lowered the boom Wednesday on renegade globetrotters, ordering any non-essential travellers who recently returned to Canada to self-quarantine for 14 days, regardless of whether they have symptoms.


Which is why there are parking lot loads of RV's with Kaybeck plates in Wally World parking lots, having just returned from stateside:

Rules For Thee, But Not For Me



> Looks like some Canadian snowbirds, predominately from Quebec, don’t know how to follow some simple rules:
> 
> https://t.co/Wn582ZEv4S Here is @WalmartCanada allowing cross-border travellers in a RVs to shop at the Brockville Walmart.
> 
> What is the matter w these people? Don't care about anybody but themselves! They continue down the 401 contaminating.
> 
> — Ｙｖｅｓ (@YvesHPrevost) March 24, 2020​


Again, can't appear RACIS!!!

Some labs facing backlog due to shortage of essential chemicals needed for COVID-19 test… other countries made smart purchases when the Wuhan Coronavirus first emerged but not Canada of course



> Regions across Canada are ramping up efforts to identify people with COVID-19 but some labs are facing a backlog due to diminishing supplies of essential chemicals needed for tests.


Meme nails it.

Not Creepy At All

Although the data is interesting, I post this for the following comment, rather than anything else:



> Just keep remembering and repeating to others that;
> –
> 1.) *Every single case of the Wuhan Virus entered Canada by crossing our border, either by plane, by vehicle, or by foot,,, every single case.*
> 2.) The few cases that have been spread person to person,,, have been spread from or by someone who was allowed to cross our borders.
> I don’t ask much from the federal government, but protecting our borders, is one of the few things I expect them to do.


Bold mine.

But we had Thigns!!!


----------



## Beej

A bit more data about how corona virus is not just the flu.

The U.S. had 312 deaths today, from 102,000 cases, subject to verification from official sources in a day or two. More likely 500,000 or even a million total cases, including the untested.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

Looking at CDC data on influenza, 50,000 deaths would be a worse than average flu, coming from about 30 million cases.
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html

Most flu deaths occur in about half a year. If all the deaths occurred in half a year, the rate would be 274 deaths per day.

The flu isn't close to as dangerous as the corona virus.


----------



## macintosh doctor

if you still think China has it under control or believe them, you are part of the problem .. 
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/wor...qXYBvGiWWVwVUcVxCrzkUdvyuipSLfYb4BBFBSrxEAP2I


----------



## CubaMark

Has anyone out there seen *any* positive coverage of Trump's handling of the coronavirus mess? 

All I'm coming across are things like this:
*GM ventilator effort goes haywire with Trump slamming automaker CEO*
_U.S. President goes on bizarre Twitter tirade against General Motors' Mary Barra over coronavirus relief efforts_

General Motors and ventilator maker Ventec Life Systems Inc. had much of what they needed in place to ramp up production of breathing machines that would help coronavirus patients survive and recover.

They were just waiting on the Trump administration to place orders and cut checks.

And then, just as frustration was mounting within the largest U.S. carmaker and its partner over the federal government finalizing the details, President Donald Trump went on the attack Friday.

(....)



He called on GM to open an assembly plant in Ohio that it no longer owns and make the devices there immediately.

A little more than an hour after Trump’s first tweet, GM and Ventec announced they’ll build ventilators at the automaker’s parts plant in Kokomo, Indiana, which they’ve been working around-the-clock for a week to convert into a medical-device facility.

GM said in an emailed statement that it will be “donating its resources at cost.” It’s also beginning to make surgical masks at a manufacturing facility in Warren, Michigan, north of its Detroit headquarters. Output will start next week, ramp up to 50,000 a day within two weeks and may eventually get to 100,000.

GM was growing exasperated with the Trump administration because it had done the work to secure suppliers for the 700 components needed to make ventilators. The automaker had even started hiring because the 300 workers on staff in Kokomo won’t be enough to handle the proposed volume, a person familiar with the situation said.

But the companies were waiting on the federal government to decide how many machines it will need, how many producers it will hire and, by extension, how much it will pay Ventec.

Originally, the two manufacturers were talking about US$250 million that would go to the Seattle-based company and its components suppliers to get production moving, said people familiar with the matter, who asked not to be identified because the deliberations were private.

GM and Ventec have opted to go ahead with building ventilators without a federal contract and sell to any buyer.



GM and Ventec said they’re poised to deliver the first ventilators in April and ramp up manufacturing capacity to more than 10,000 a month.

(Driving.ca)​


----------



## Macfury

Yes, plenty. But you're so imbued with the same hatred the establishment media harbours for him, that this is all you're going to notice. 

Of course, Trudeau's fumbles get nary a mention from you...



CubaMark said:


> Has anyone out there seen *any* positive coverage of Trump's handling of the coronavirus mess?


----------



## macintosh doctor

Macfury said:


> Yes, plenty. But you're so imbued with the same hatred the establishment media harbours for him, that this is all you're going to notice.
> 
> Of course, Trudeau's fumbles get nary a mention from you...


agreed.. also worth mentioning, that Doug Ford has become a super star during this pandemic; more of a leader than Trudeau.


----------



## Beej

Some ideas from the 2008/09 financial crises could be helpful during the current crisis.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ADncN9HIa4[/ame]


----------



## Beej

Interview with a New York doctor.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1243633044503834625

The worrying part for me was that ventilators tend not to work in his experience. They may extend someone's life by a number of days, but few recover once they're already that sick, based on the hospital system he is aware of. His top ask was for more staff.


----------



## macintosh doctor

Beej said:


> Some ideas from the 2008/09 financial crises could be helpful during the current crisis.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ADncN9HIa4


even the onion is being one sided and only use whites as an example. lol 
i would assume it would farther greater savings if we included all races in that example lol


----------



## FeXL

macintosh doctor said:


> ...Doug Ford has become a super star during this pandemic; more of a leader than Trudeau.


With all respect to Doug Ford, it wouldn't take much of a leader to best BananaPants McGroper and his cadre of Prog idiots...


----------



## FeXL

Calgary Turned Into Boulder, Colorado So Fast We Didn’t Even Notice



> Road closures planned for Calgary to give more room for pedestrians and cyclists.


Good ol' Nenshi... XX)


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Yes, plenty. But you're so imbued with the same hatred the establishment media harbours for him, that this is all you're going to notice.
> 
> Of course, Trudeau's fumbles get nary a mention from you...


Where's that damn "Like" button?

'Course, it wouldn't have anything to do with The Bigot's "news" sources, either...


----------



## eMacMan

macintosh doctor said:


> agreed.. also worth mentioning, that Doug Ford has become a super star during this pandemic; more of a leader than Trudeau.



Yep keeping those liquor store and head shops going full bore while putting every other small businessman out of business is sheer globalist genius.


----------



## macintosh doctor

eMacMan said:


> Yep keeping those liquor store and head shops going full bore while putting every other small businessman out of business is sheer globalist genius.


LCBO and beer is open for it is a money maker in taxes which we need right now!!
not to mention if we close them, the loss of taxes plus the hit on the medical system of alcoholics will kill our system.


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

But...but...but...TRUMP!!!

The road to Canada's COVID-19 outbreak: timeline of federal government failure at border to slow the virus



> When the COVID-19 crises first hit in late January, Ottawa MPs of all political stripes weren’t satisfied with the federal government’s assurances that Canada had the problem under control.
> 
> For the next two months — until major changes were made at last to our border policy in late March — the Liberal, Bloc, NDP and Conservative MPs dug into that border policy, asking numerous probing questions, examining the motives and reasons behind the initial and unyielding federal response in those two months.


More:



> Also included in the timeline — as a contrast to the approach taken by the Canadian federal government — are the actions taken by the government in Taiwan (compiled byDr. Jason Wang et al), a nation that has so far successfully slowed the spread of the virus, despite close travel and economic ties to China, and despite being expected to have the second biggest outbreak of the virus.
> 
> *So far, Taiwan has had just a small fraction of the cases that Canada has had. Its schools and businesses are still open.* There’s been no community spread of the disease in Taiwan, meaning all cases can be traced back to travellers, as opposed to coming from unknown community sources as seen with so many cases in Canada.


Bold mine.

Huh. The RACIS'!!! bastards.

Reading this timeline makes me ill.  If I have to listen to one more radio report from BananaPants McGroper or TV commercial from Tam in some limp-wristed effort to deflect attention from their complete & utter TGF, I'm going to hurl in techicolour...

As for those of you who voted for these idiots not once but twice, I hope you get what you voted for, good & hard.

Related:



> WHO Jan 14
> “Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel #coronavirus (2019-nCoV) identified in #Wuhan, #China,”
> 
> WHO Director-General Ghebreyesus Feb 4
> “We reiterate our call to all countries not to impose restrictions that unnecessarily interfere with international travel and trade.”
> 
> WHO Director-General Ghebreyesus Mar 25
> “The time to act was actually a month ago, two months ago.”
> 
> And our Dear Leader Justin Trudeau says we follow the WHO, same with Democratic leaders in US and main stream media.


----------



## SINC

*Coronavirus: Italy becoming impatient with lockdown - and social unrest is brewing*



> The strain is showing in the south of the country where one man in Apulia reportedly called police after the bank closed and they couldn't withdraw his mother's pension - their only income.
> 
> Footage shows him shouting at officers, telling them the family has no money, his mother begging them to go to their home so she could show them they have no food. It's hard to watch. It's what desperation looks like.
> 
> Another video has been shared around the country showing a father with his young daughter addressing the Italian prime minister, saying: "It's already 15-20 days that we've been inside and we're at our limit."
> 
> He gestures to his little girl who is eating a piece of bread and says: "Like my daughter, other children in a few days won't be able to eat this bit of bread. Rest assured, you will regret this because we're going to have a revolution."


https://news.sky.com/story/coronavi...medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> But...but...but...TRUMP!!!


Are there still people who don't see that the WHO is in China's back pocket? Who would listen to anything they say at this point?

An a**hole like Trudeau was always willing to gamble the Canadian economy and people's livelihoods on a globalist strategy that will net him a position a the UN, but frightening to see that he sunk so low as to gamble people's lives for the same thing. 

Where is a guy like Harper when you need him?


----------



## macintosh doctor

i am sick of Trudeau and his daily BS speeches of emptiness. 
The biggest complaint i have is big corporations are getting grants people are getting free money and small businesses are getting loans. 

our industry being one that is still operating has my view biased - that small businesses are going to get screwed


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Are there still people who don't see that the WHO is in China's back pocket? Who would listen to anything they say at this point?


Either they don't see or they don't care. Either way, they're part of the problem.


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> *Remember, the chinese military school in Wuhan issued a “Lockdown Notice” on Jan 2nd, 2020. This lockdown was issued a FULL 18 days before the chinese communist party admitted to an epidemic. It’s now clear that the CCP was busy buying up all N95 masks and gear globally.* https://t.co/QIfqbAChsq
> 
> — 😷Kyle Bass😷 (@Jkylebass) March 29, 2020​
> Related: Hop on Walmart or Amazon and order some masks…go on, you can trust them


Bold mine.

Yet The Dope sent 'em 16 tonnes of supplies. What a laugh they must have had at his expense. Keep the good stuff & sell their crap outright or online...


----------



## eMacMan

macintosh doctor said:


> i am sick of Trudeau and his daily BS speeches of emptiness.
> The biggest complaint i have is big corporations are getting grants people are getting free money and small businesses are getting loans.
> 
> our industry being one that is still operating has my view biased - that small businesses are going to get screwed


This has more to do with social engineering than social distancing. According to the Corona Virus Simulation which the Bill Gates Cabal ran back in October. The major goals are to destroy small businesses, kill small towns, crash the global and local economies, force cashless society down our throats. They're also looking to further enrich their insider billionaire buddies, first by massive shortselling just before they crash the stock market, then by obscenely generous bailouts and subsidies at taxpayer expense. Establishing a precedent for a tyrannical totalitarian lockdown of entire nations is really just a bonus. 

If you are a globalist looking to place the US and other free nations completely under your thumb, this is the ultimate wet dream. For the rest of us it's a glimpse of what the German population must have felt as Hitler took control of their nation.


----------



## macintosh doctor

eMacMan said:


> This has more to do with social engineering than social distancing. According to the Corona Virus Simulation which the Bill Gates Cabal ran back in October. The major goals are to destroy small businesses, kill small towns, crash the global and local economies, force cashless society down our throats. They're also looking to further enrich their insider billionaire buddies, first by massive shortselling just before they crash the stock market, then by obscenely generous bailouts and subsidies at taxpayer expense. Establishing a precedent for a tyrannical totalitarian lockdown of entire nations is really just a bonus.
> 
> If you are a globalist looking to place the US and other free nations completely under your thumb, this is the ultimate wet dream. For the rest of us it's a glimpse of what the German population must have felt as Hitler took control of their nation.


one thing we know for sure is that Trudeau is a globalist .. we knew that for over 4 years..
also a couple of years ago he professed that he hated small business..


----------



## SINC

This is a bit unnerving.


----------



## FeXL

Good news.

Wuhan Flu: Hydroxychloroquine Gets Emergency FDA Approval



> FDA Issues Emergency Authorization for the Use of Hydroxychloroquine to Combat Coronavirus Effective Immediately…
> 
> And in France;
> 
> “The French government has officially sanctioned prescriptions of chloroquine to treat certain coronavirus patients,” France 24 English reported Saturday.
> 
> “This ensures continued treatment of patients who have been treated for several years for a chronic condition with this drug, but also allows a temporary authorization to allow certain patients with coronavirus to benefit from this therapeutic route,” said France’s director general of health Jérôme Salomon.
> 
> The move comes after infectious diseases specialist Didier Raoult announced new clinical results, which can be accessed here, that show 78 out of 80 patients treated with chloroquine recovered within five days, reported Trustnodes.​
> More here: Novartis Chief Executive Vas Narasimhan has announced that there is preliminary evidence showing that “hydroxychloroquine kills the coronavirus.”
> 
> Of course… _The Democrats, the media, and people who despise the president don’t want these trials to succeed. Three Democrat governors have gone so far as to ban the use of the drug cocktail. And one has even threatened action against doctors who prescribe it._


I'd read a couple articles about this treatment over the last day or two.


----------



## FeXL

The lighter side.

Sciency

:lmao::lmao::lmao:

Related:


----------



## FeXL

Even more lighter side!


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

I post this for no other reason than the quoted comment

Risk Remains Low

Just a NOTE:



> Mar 29, 2020
> Flights from China still landing in Canada.
> YVR Internaitonal
> 
> MU 581 China East 9:10 AM PDT
> EY1000. Etihad Aiways 9:10 AM PDT
> ..Both outa Shanghei
> 
> CA991. Air China 10:50 AM PDT
> AC6600. Air Canada. 10:50 AM PDT
> ..Both outa Bejing
> 
> No word on whether any persons on these flights were being tested. Or answering the extra question truthfully…pah.
> 
> Closed Broder MY ASS.
> *All GOVERNMENTs in this Bull**** country have BLOOD ON their USELESS Fkn Hands.*


Links' bold.


----------



## FeXL

'Rona Roundup: President Considering Mask-Wearing Guidelines; NYC Hospitalizations Fall; President Considers Quarantining NY and NJ



> Judge frees illegal alien alleged murderer over fears he might catch the Chinese Flu.
> 
> This is NYC.
> 
> You can't quarantine this place fast enough.


----------



## FeXL

Sen. Amy Klobuchar’s Husband Has Been Hospitalized With COVID-19



> Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.) announced today that her husband, John Bessler, tested positive for coronavirus and has been hospitalized.
> 
> He is not on a ventilator yet but is on oxygen. She wrote,


----------



## FeXL

Yet another Prog narrative exploded.

Former HHS Official: CDC Lied to Trump, HHS Secretary About Ability to Make Wuhan Coronavirus Test



> Former assistant secretary of Human and Health Services (HHS) Chris Meekins told James Rosen, a Sinclair investigative reporter, that the CDC lied to President Trump and HHS Secretary Alex Azar about its ability to produce a Wuhan coronavirus test.
> 
> Trump and his administration have received a lot of criticism over tests. Now it looks like the anger should go to the CDC.


----------



## FeXL

On tests.

Wuhan Flu



> Genuine good news.
> 
> This is GAME CHANGER. Abbott to market, starting next week, a fast point-of-care #coronavirus test, delivering positive results in 5min and negative results in 13min. Will deliver 50K tests/day to start. Kudos to Abbott and FDA’s Jeff Shuren and team at CDRH who are in the fight.
> 
> — Scott Gottlieb, MD (@ScottGottliebMD) March 28, 2020​
> Updated with more info.
> 
> I look forward to the day when we return to normal, and the public can go back to bashing big pharma.
> 
> More here: _5 very sick patients w/ #COVID19 whose breathing was being supported by a machine stabilized and/or improved after being given a treatment – antibodies to #COVID19 (which were obtained from the plasma of other patients who successfully recovered from #COVID19)_


----------



## FeXL

It took Chinese coronavirus to finally make illegal immigration ILLEGAL



> Over 21,000 were flooding small-town American hospitals and stretching their resources to the limit. Agents were getting sick. They were also coming for surgeries, and we were paying for it. No, I’m not talking about Chinese coronavirus. I’m describing the public health crisis at our border thanks to what was essentially a court-driven invasion exactly this time last year. Yet our government refused to simply enforce our sovereignty, no matter how bad it got. It’s only now due to coronavirus that the DHS is finally enforcing our sovereignty.


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> I post this for no other reason than the quoted comment
> 
> Risk Remains Low
> 
> Just a NOTE:
> 
> 
> 
> Links' bold.


You can track flights at the site linked below. I only found a search by departure-airport pair (Shanghai to LA in the example), not by country.
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/CCA1051/history/20200331/1430Z/ZSPD/KLAX

Flight "bans" don't mean no flights.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Good news.
> 
> Wuhan Flu: Hydroxychloroquine Gets Emergency FDA Approval
> 
> I'd read a couple articles about this treatment over the last day or two.


I've been following this. Some evidence that the drug allows cells to accept more zinc, which apparently kills the virus.


----------



## FeXL

Beej said:


> Flight "bans" don't mean no flights.


The implication is that it does stop flights from hotbeds of infection. If Blackie BananaPants McGroper isn't banning flights from China, then precisely where is he bannng them from?

In fact, they are importing the virus directly from the f'ing source country!

Same with the alleged Roxham Road _closures_, which appears to be bunk, as well.


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> The implication is that it does stop flights from hotbeds of infection. If Blackie BananaPants McGroper isn't banning flights from China, then precisely where is he bannng them from?


Check the official statement. There will be exceptions, such as for citizens, permanent residents, diplomats, etc.

But I'm pretty sure he can't ban flights to Los Angeles, such as the one in the example I provided.


----------



## FeXL

Beej said:


> Check the official statement. There will be exceptions, such as for citizens, permanent residents, diplomats, etc.


Also, the suitably vague _family members_ catch-all. Therein lies the rub...


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> I've been following this. Some evidence that the drug allows cells to accept more zinc, which apparently kills the virus.


Might be even more effective if they also gave zinc supplements as part of the treatment.

To this point the Puppet Meißters are not even recommending D3 supplementation, which should be an essential first line of defense against any virus.


----------



## Beej

Don't drink methanol. Did that need to be said? 

Hundreds die in Iran over false belief a poison can kill coronavirus
https://globalnews.ca/news/6740165/coronavirus-iran-poison-deaths/


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> Don't drink methanol. Did that need to be said?
> 
> Hundreds die in Iran over false belief a poison can kill coronavirus
> https://globalnews.ca/news/6740165/coronavirus-iran-poison-deaths/


Hold on... I should stop drinking the methanol I already consume because of coronavirus?


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> Hold on... I should stop drinking the methanol I already consume because of coronavirus?


My statement was too broad. A correction:
Don't drink methanol unless you have built up a hillybilly-like tolerance for the chemical.


----------



## FeXL

Canadians in quarantine, but sick illegal migrants are welcome



> You and I have to shelter in place — really, a form of house arrest. We’re all being treated like high school kids with a curfew.
> 
> But illegal immigrants with a fever and a cough are literally and specifically and legally exempted from the ban.


Like I noted, Beej. I don't trust a single thing this gov't says regarding illegal aliens, immigration or coronavirus. And damn little of anything else.


----------



## FeXL

Put their asses in a rubber boat, sans life jackets, & send 'em home.

Belgium: Migrants resist, spit on police as they reject coronavirus measures 



> Also, on Thursday afternoon, police pulled over a car that was travelling in Wommelgem because it was carrying four passengers, which is also against the coronavirus measures. One of the passengers became angry and began insulting the officers and spitting on them. When the police tried to place a mask on his face for their protection, he resisted violently and told them he was infected with the coronavirus. The man was arrested, but he continued spitting at officers even after he was put in a holding cell, according to another report by SCEPTR.


Three words: Gorilla Duct Tape...


----------



## FeXL

Where's Tory's anger for the Lieberals who let the virus in in the forst place?

‘C’mon, people’: angry John Tory warns COVID-19 rule-breakers using dog parks and playground equipment



> Some Torontonians are refusing to comply with a city order to stay out of dog parks and sports fields, infuriating Mayor John Tory and risking a $750 penalty.
> 
> Tory told the Star on Sunday he is baffled by people removing signs and tape blocking park amenities. He ordered their closure Wednesday after public health officials said continued park clustering could help spread COVID-19.
> 
> “To see people not just using (park equipment) but tearing the signs off and tearing the signs down — I mean, c’mon people,” Tory said.


Oooooooo, tearing down "Caution" tape vs letting untold thousands enter the country with no, zero, screening. Which is the greater sin?


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

<cough>Bull$h!t!<cough

Canada hits pause button on immigration during pandemic



> Immigration is on hold in Canada, for the time being, due to the COVID-19 outbreak.
> 
> A federal government official confirms the immigration program is suspended while travel restrictions remain in place, but some wonder whether we might need to keep the program on pause a little longer.


More:



> “Currently, only Canadian citizens, permanent residents *and their immediate family* are allowed to board flights to Canada or to enter through the Canada-US border,” said Kevin Lemkay, press secretary for Immigration Minister Marco Mendicino.


Bold mine.

"Hi! This is my brother, Darrel, and my other brother, Darrell..."


----------



## FeXL

Damn all those Communist Chinese Christians for withholding the coronavirus information!!!

Blaming Christians for the Coronavirus Crisis



> The ancient pagans of Rome, as their society cratered, blamed Christians. Some modern pagans do the same. Witness the recent piece in the _New York Times_ by Katherine Stewart, “The Religious Right’s Hostility to Science Is Crippling Our Coronavirus Response.”
> 
> Even in a paper as biased as the _Times_, this piece stands out, exposing the depth of secularist hatred toward Christianity.


----------



## FeXL

I jes' luvs me that self-assessment questionnaire... :lmao:

Ontario’s online COVID-19 tool has told 100,000 to seek medical help ASAP


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Don't forget, Canadian officials first under-reacted to COVID-19



> The past few days have seen ever-increasing and severe measures brought in to restrict Canadians’ fundamental liberties. For the most part, those measures have been received with widespread support because we understand what is at stake. That support will only last for so long though, especially if the measures get stricter and more difficult to justify.


More:



> Imagine going from calling those who first sounded the alarm racist to not letting families play alone on a sports field.
> 
> Maybe it won’t be an accounting Canadians will seek. It’ll be a reckoning.


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> Canadians in quarantine, but sick illegal migrants are welcome
> 
> 
> 
> Like I noted, Beej. I don't trust a single thing this gov't says regarding illegal aliens, immigration or coronavirus. And damn little of anything else.


You shouldn't trust either Trudeau, or Levant, or Trump. Always go one step further than they're showing if the topic is of interest. I wonder why Levant didn't go through the whole Order in Council? It's worth checking out. And, regardless of the words, enforcement is a problem. Simply decreeing something doesn't make it happen.

I'm curious about video footage out of U.S. airports on their screening, particularly for passengers arriving from Europe and China. Seen any? I know ours is sh*t.


----------



## FeXL

Beej said:


> Simply decreeing something doesn't make it happen.


Precisely. One can't help but wonder if that is by design.



Beej said:


> I'm curious about video footage out of U.S. airports on their screening, particularly for passengers arriving from Europe and China. Seen any? I know ours is sh*t.


Have not. And, I agree about ours.


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> Precisely. One can't help but wonder if that is by design.
> 
> 
> 
> Have not. And, I agree about ours.


Why design when incompetence does most of the work? I picture a memo being emailed the next morning alerting staff of the new rules. Along with the other five or so pointless emails they get from HQ, it gets instantly deleted. Maybe a memo is posted on the bulletin board in the kitchen as well. No one reads those.

Have you wondered why footage of U.S. enforcement is more common? There's more of them, they're way more outgoing about this sort of thing, and they have a wider variety of well-funded media outfits, mainstream and independent.

But, in general, this isn't of much interest to me. I want volumes down, but have no expectation of close to zero, or competent implementation. The draconian step of not allowing citizens onto planes destined for Canada, if they're showing symptoms and enforced by someone else if they can bother, was surprising. Not sure how I feel about that one. All citizens should be allowed to return on their own dime, any time. But putting them in a cramped metal tube for 10 hours with other citizens also does not sit well with me.


----------



## FeXL

On the lighter side.

Mum's 'home economics' coronavirus home-schooling plan has parents in stitches



> While many parents are stressing about how they're going to keep their children learning during the coronavirus COVID-19 schools shutdown, one mum seems to already have it all worked out.
> 
> She's come up with a home-schooling daily schedule for her children for the next few weeks.
> 
> It contains six one-hour lessons followed by an after school club, with a particular focus on the home-schooling section of the curriculum.


----------



## CubaMark

*The United States is now the epicentre of the pandemic. Canada has every reason to be alarmed*

When the U.S. sneezes, the old adage goes, Canada catches a cold.

But what happens when the U.S. coughs? When it coughs that dry hacking coronavirus cough?

We’re about to find out.

The United States is now the epicentre of the global pandemic with more than 135,000 cases and 2,500 deaths, and counting.

Even Anthony Fauci, the level-headed director of the U.S. National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, warns that 100,000 to 200,000 Americans could die of COVID-19, the disease caused by the novel coronavirus.

In Canada, we have every reason to be alarmed. We could very well be on a similar trajectory.

(....)

In Canada, the common shorthand we use is taking U.S. statistics and dividing them by 10.

Yet we don’t have one-tenth of the U.S. cases, 13,500, or deaths, 250. We have a little fewer than half those numbers, about 6,500 and 60.

(....)

Canada’s response, at least on the health side, has been neither politicized nor partisan.

In Canada, politicians have taken advice from public health officials and acted on it without much pushback. (On the economic side of the equation, it’s quite different. That is the bailiwick of politicians.)

In the U.S., President Donald Trump has, as always, insisted on taking centre stage. He routinely pushes aside and contradicts public health officials by saying, for example, that lockdowns should end soon and by touting unproven treatments. The President’s policy flip-flops are dizzying.

(....)

For Canada, the most frightening aspect of the U.S. outbreak is seeing how it has overwhelmed New York hospitals. U.S. hospitals have excess capacity; Canada’s tend to routinely operate overcapacity.

In Canada, we have a lot less wiggle room, and the ability of hospitals to withstand an influx of cases will be tested in the coming days.

First, we need to see if we can handle our own outbreak. Then we may have to deal with impact of the coughing monster next door.​


----------



## macintosh doctor

CubaMark i am all for military at our borders.. 

BTW - i have a client in Mexico and he said he is blown away by the lack of care as well.


----------



## Macfury

Of course Canada's response_ has been_ politicized. Trudeau was afraid to offend the government of China when it was the epicentre of the disease, but refused to cut off travel from that part of the world -- or provide effective screening/quarantine for people entering Canada. Too late now.

We should naturally have lower numbers across lightly populated parts of the country--far lower than the more densely populated US. I hope our cities will fare better than New York because we're smarter, but the idiots who tore down barriers to go to the playgrounds in Toronto on Sunday will most certainly drive numbers higher.


----------



## FeXL

Beej said:


> Maybe a memo is posted on the bulletin board in the kitchen as well.


You mean a Thign?! 



Beej said:


> Have you wondered why footage of U.S. enforcement is more common?


Ummm... Because they're actually enforcing the law?


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Of course Canada's response_ has been_ politicized. Trudeau was afraid to offend the government of China when it was the epicentre of the disease, but refused to cut off travel from that part of the world -- or provide effective screening/quarantine for people entering Canada. Too late now.
> 
> We should naturally have lower numbers across lightly populated parts of the country--far lower than the more densely populated US. I hope our cities will fare better than New York because we're smarter, but the idiots who tore down barriers to go to the playgrounds in Toronto on Sunday will most certainly drive numbers higher.


This is outside so the only possible way to spread is via touch. Wind and sunlight will combine to either greatly dilute any airborne virii or kill them outright. This time of year kids are probably wearing gloves and bubble wrap which should reduce even the touch risk. Not something that would concern me all that much.

In fact the mental health aspect, for families imprisoned in their own homes and perhaps also robbed of their livelihood, probably greatly outweighs the physical risk. Even in Tranna


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

And the lion's share of those are in SoCal & New Yawk. Care to guess why?



CubaMark said:


> The United States is now the epicentre of the global pandemic with more than 135,000 cases and 2,500 deaths, and counting.


Per capita I think it's going to be worse. Why? 'Cause the Prime Imbecile didn't shut $h!t off nearly as quickly as Trump did. The only thing that may change that outcome is our lower population density.



CubaMark said:


> In Canada, we have every reason to be alarmed. We could very well be on a similar trajectory.


<cough>horse$h!t<cough>



CubaMark said:


> Canada’s response, at least on the health side, has been neither politicized nor partisan.


They took advice from the WHO, the most backwards-assed bunch of idiots they could have listened to.  And the reason there was no pushback is because by the time our dear leaders did something, anything (save send 16 tonnes of our precious supplies to China), Prinz Dummkopf's hands were tied! He was saving face, not saving Canadians!



CubaMark said:


> In Canada, politicians have taken advice from public health officials and acted on it without much pushback.


No $h!t. When times get tough, that's what real leaders do. They don't cower under their cottage beds, sneaking out only to deliver a garbled, content-free message filled with umm's and ahh's in a limp-wristed effort to cover the fact that he should have dealt with international travellers, immigrants & illegal aliens two months before he did.



CubaMark said:


> In the U.S., President Donald Trump has, as always, insisted on taking centre stage.


You mean like the WHO? Asked & answered. And, _and_, for such an unproven treatment, there sure are a number of countries & doctors who endorse it. Were all the patients who were treated with it going to die? Nope. Not even close. If the current #'s are correct, only about 2% of them. However, if we can decelerate the death rate, get carriers off the street & patients out of the hospital faster, win/win/win. How is that a bad thing?



CubaMark said:


> He routinely pushes aside and contradicts public health officials by saying, for example, that lockdowns should end soon and by touting unproven treatments.


With Juthdin (bahaha!!!) at the helm, what could possibly go wrong?



CubaMark said:


> First, we need to see if we can handle our own outbreak.


----------



## FeXL

Figgers. Prog playing the Victim Card...

Woman Who Gave Deadly Dose of Fish Tank Cleaner to Husband -- and Then Blamed it on Trump -- Is Prolific Donor to Democrats and Liberal "Pro-Science" Causes



> It all just worked out so that you'd have an attack line on the Bad Orange Man, huh?
> 
> The Arizona woman who said that she and her 68-year-old husband ingested a substance used to clean fish tanks after hearing President Donald Trump tout chloroquine as a cure for the coronavirus has given thousands of dollars to Democratic groups and candidates over the last two years.
> 
> The woman's most recent donations, in late February, were to a Democratic PAC, the 314 Action Fund, that bills itself as the "pro-science resistance" and has vocally criticized the Trump administration's response to the coronavirus pandemic and held up her case to slam the White House.​


Mebbe she should have kept a bit of that money & bought herself a book or two. I hear _The Care & Feeding of Progs_ is a good one...


----------



## FeXL

“In the midst of this festival of frivolity, harsh reality landed in Europe”



> With an intro by Sarah Hoyt;
> 
> Let me put this into small bite-size ideas: Globalism, of the sort that assumes there are no real differences between cultures and that totalitarian regimes are as trustworthy as non-dictatorial regimes, is a luxury. It is the luxury of those so wealthy and pampered they can afford to ignore reality and live in make-believe. In centuries past it was the luxury of the very few and very wealthy. Briefly, for a shining moment in history, all of the West could afford to be that stupid.​
> Related.


Hit the "Related" link inside. It goes to a Tweet by Climate Bimbetta. The responses are numerous & scathing.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> This is outside so the only possible way to spread is via *touch*.


Understood. That's why they're so stupid.


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> Ummm... Because they're actually enforcing the law?


I'm more skeptical of their pronouncements. It's a trust issue. 

Some light research turns up that the earlier U.S. "ban" on travelers from China (with the usual exceptions, and with flights still arriving daily from China) involved trusting airlines and passengers to enforce the rules, plus border agent questioning. Note this is all largely anecdotal ("one passenger said..."; "officials say..."), but it's a start. Anyone else researching any of this?

That last practice -- border agent questions -- is better than a touchscreen and a pamphlet (Canada), but it created problems later when the "ban" was expanded to Europe. I'm not sure if a longer lineup of people infecting each other while they get questioned is better than our looser system. Doesn't matter much if quarantine is still voluntary, and I have not dug into that. 

Note that we have gone from referencing "blood on their hands" for having flights arriving from China in Canada, to better questioning of arrivals at U.S. airports...for flights arriving from China. The blood on their hands may be slightly diluted.


----------



## CubaMark

macintosh doctor said:


> CubaMark i am all for military at our borders..


I'm also dumbfounded at the Canadian government's reaction to the US adding military forces to the border. From what I understand, we're not talking about machine-gun-toting troops lining the 49th. It's apparently increased border-monitoring (jeez, I'm confused, all the usual suspects in here are ranting about the torrent! flood! invasion! of "illegals" coming into Canada from the USA. But the USA is freaking about the torrent! flood! invasion! of "illegals" coming into the USA from Canada. Which is it? Or is it just more fear-mongering?).

Whatever. I don't care what the yanquis do on their side of the border, unless it's massing for a move into Canada to take advantage of universal health care... :lmao:



macintosh doctor said:


> BTW - i have a client in Mexico and he said he is blown away by the lack of care as well.


It's... sadly disturbing and sadly expected. With some 49% of the population _officially_ classified as living in poverty, the luxury of social distancing to prevent the spread is nigh-on impossible for those who have to scratch a living on a daily basis as best they can. Holing up with a full pantry and Netflix is very much not their reality.

The government has also been woefully slow to react and attempt to put into place social distancing measures. A disproportionately-high death rate is likely.... and much of that will probably not be attributed to COVID-19 given a lack of post-mortem testing / designation (likely for political purposes).


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> No $h!t. When times get tough, that's what real leaders do. They don't cower under their cottage beds, sneaking out only to deliver a garbled, content-free message filled with umm's and ahh's...


*Meanwhile, south of the border....*


----------



## Macfury

Are you saying that New York needs 40,000 ventilators, CM?


----------



## FeXL

Beej said:


> I'm more skeptical of their pronouncements. It's a trust issue.


No argument.



Beej said:


> The blood on their hands may be slightly diluted.


Either way.


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Yeah. And?

1. Despite your constant accusation of me supporting Trump as the be-all & end-all, I have often (and clearly) stated my position on him. At least Trump wasn't hiding under a bed in his red plaid onesie, stroking his 7 facial hairs and crying, "Mommeeeeee...".

2. One could write a 10,000 page tome on the outright lies, gaffes, half-truths and bull$h!t from BlackPants McGroperFace over the course of the last 5 years yet, because he represents the political _left_, you cannot find it in yourself to criticize, mock or otherwise denounce him. Your hypocrisy is stunning.



CubaMark said:


> Meanwhile, south of the border....


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Hello, Bigot.
> 
> Yeah. And?
> 
> 1. Despite your constant accusation of me supporting Trump as the be-all & end-all, I have often (and clearly) stated my position on him. At least Trump wasn't hiding under a bed in his red plaid onesie, stroking his 7 facial hairs and crying, "Mommeeeeee...".


There are currently 30,000 critical cases of coronavirus--in the world! CM wants to see 40,000 ventilators delivered to New York. There's a brilliant allocation of resources!


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> There are currently 30,000 critical cases of coronavirus--in the world! CM wants to see 40,000 ventilators delivered to New York. There's a brilliant allocation of resources!


No clew...


----------



## FeXL

Swap 'em a carload of canola for those 16 tonnes of medical supplies The Dope gave away...

China to resume imports of Canadian canola, sources say



> China has agreed to allow imports of Canadian canola to resume, two sources briefed on the matter told Reuters on Tuesday, lifting a ban in place since March 2019 that had halted $2-billion worth of trade.
> 
> The agreement was reached during a call held by China’s customs administration and Canada’s farm ministry on Tuesday, said the sources who declined to be named because of the sensitivity of the matter.


----------



## FeXL

What could possibly go wrong?

New York responds to coronavirus by releasing sex offenders. Texas has a better idea



> *If Americans are being told to “shelter in place,” shouldn’t criminals have to shelter in their places too, in prison?*
> 
> It’s a simple commonsense point lost on most governors and mayors in the country right now, but one governor gets it. On Sunday night, Texas Governor Greg Abbott signed an executive order “to preclude the release on personal bond of any person previously convicted of a crime that involves physical violence or the threat of physical violence, or of any person currently arrested for such a crime that is supported by probable cause.”


Bold mine.

:clap::clap::clap:


----------



## FeXL

Huh. What about _mosques?_

Bill de Blasio Threatens to 'Permanently' Close Churches, Synagogues if They Meet During Coronavirus



> "A small number of religious communities, specific churches, and specific synagogues are unfortunately not paying attention to this guidance even though it’s so widespread," de Blasio said at a press conference. "I want to say to all those who are preparing for the potential of religious services this weekend: If you go to your synagogue, if you go to your church and attempt to hold services after having been told so often not to, our enforcement agents will have no choice but to shut down those services."


An error of omission or intent?


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> 1. Despite your constant accusation of me supporting Trump as the be-all & end-all, I have often (and clearly) stated my position on him. At least Trump wasn't hiding under a bed in his red plaid onesie, stroking his 7 facial hairs and crying, "Mommeeeeee...".


Video or it didn't happen. You spend a lot of time imagining Trudeau in those situations, and then posting about it. Someone might think you have a little Trudeau Derangement Syndrome going on.... :lmao:



FeXL said:


> 2. One could write a 10,000 page tome on the outright lies, gaffes, half-truths and bull$h!t from BlackPants McGroperFace over the course of the last 5 years yet, because he represents the political _left_, you cannot find it in yourself to criticize, mock or otherwise denounce him. Your hypocrisy is stunning.


Your understanding of the political spectrum is astounding... in its complete detachment from reality. Trudeau represents the "Left"? He may be "left" of the Conservatives, but he's still sitting very easily to the right-of-centre, particularly in terms of economic and foreign policy.


----------



## eMacMan

FeXL said:


> Huh. What about _mosques?_
> 
> Bill de Blasio Threatens to 'Permanently' Close Churches, Synagogues if They Meet During Coronavirus
> 
> An error of omission or intent?


Will they follow the Italian model and provide free cable porn to those imprisoned in their own home?


----------



## CubaMark

Macfury said:


> There are currently 30,000 critical cases of coronavirus--in the world! CM wants to see 40,000 ventilators delivered to New York. There's a brilliant allocation of resources!


There you have it, kind readers - a classic example of the deflection used by anyone who dares criticize the Great Trump!

That fact that the Cheetoh-in-Chief lies on a daily basis, recorded for posterity in his news conferences, is not the issue. It's not the issue that he stated publicly that states whose governors are not "nice" to him shouldn't receive any federal aid (he was only elected by the red MAGA hat crowd, apparently, so the rest of the country can go to hell). It's not the issue that what Trump says publicly about the covid-19 crisis contradicts pretty much *everything* public health experts (and even the top infectious disease expert in the US, who is standing less-than the prescribed social distance behind him in said outings) have said on the matter.

*No, *the issue is that I - CubaMark of ehMacland - shouted from the rooftops that *New York State Must Have 40,000 Ventilators!!!!* (even though I said no such thing, ever, to anyone).

Just another day in the la-la land of this sad shadow of the original ehMac....


----------



## Macfury

We're responding to your weird fixation on criticizing only Trump. It's unreasonable and bizarre, and you're being called out for it.



CubaMark said:


> There you have it, kind readers - a classic example of the deflection used by anyone who dares criticize the Great Trump!


----------



## Beej

Update on corona virus being not "just the flu".

Combining Italy, Spain, France, Germany, and the UK, which are the largest countries in western Europe, gives a total population of 324 million. This is similar to the U.S.

Total deaths from January to March are at 27,000, from 346,000 cases in those European countries. Total cases are much higher due to limited testing, but this is after a week or more of extreme measures put in place to stop the spread.

Compare the results to an entire U.S. flu season.

In the last five U.S. flu seasons, total estimated deaths were 23,000 to 61,000 each season, from tens of millions of cases each season.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> Update on corona virus being not "just the flu".


Stop saying that so that it can just go back to being the WuFlu.


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

All I have is a screenshot. See below.



CubaMark said:


> Video or it didn't happen.


<snort>This coming from someone who believes than anyone right of Marx is neocon... :lmao::lmao::lmao:



CubaMark said:


> Your understanding of the political spectrum is astounding... in its complete detachment from reality.


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Why should it be any different for a conservative leader? My entire life Alberta has been ignored by Prog PM's (on both sides of the political spectrum) until the bastards needed something from us (always money). NEP, anyone?



CubaMark said:


> ...(he was only elected by the red MAGA hat crowd, apparently, so the rest of the country can go to hell)...


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Hello, Bigot.
> 
> Why should it be any different for a conservative leader? My entire life Alberta has been ignored by Prog PM's (on both sides of the political spectrum) until the bastards needed something from us (always money). NEP, anyone?


He hates Trudeau too, he says, but he's too much of a gentlemen to say a discouraging word about him-- EVER!


----------



## Macfury

Now here's a great leader who has finally discovered that coronavirus is caused by.... climate change?

There's a leader CM can get behind!


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> Stop saying that so that it can just go back to being the WuFlu.


I thought it was the ChYna virus.


----------



## Beej

The Cuomo & Cuomo show

[ame]https://youtu.be/Z0duA152aTg?t=558[/ame]

Some pretty funny brotherly jabs.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> He hates Trudeau too, he says, but he's too much of a gentlemen to say a discouraging word about him-- EVER!


Curious, that.


----------



## FeXL

Interesting. First one I've seen with controls.

Wuhan Flu: Hydroxychloroquine

And, as noted, that's just HCQ. No cocktail.


----------



## FeXL

States, Counties, Cities, Personal – You Are On Self Rescue Now



> We know this virus spread asymptomatically. About 30% of cases tested in South Korea were asymptomatic. The video below cites a study that found *86% of cases were spread asymptomatically.* Let that sink in a moment. Most of the new cases are coming from that smaller portion of folks who have no symptoms. Checking temperatures and asking folks how they feel will NOT stop this. It is ESSENTIAL to stop asymptomatic spreading. The W.H.O. and CDC advice to not test folks with minor symptoms is not only wrong, it completely ignores the asymptomatic transmission path that is THE largest part of the problem. The W.H.O. and CDC advice to NOT have people wear masks ignores THE MAJOR PATH OF INFECTION, the asymptomatic spreader.


----------



## FeXL

Fish Tank Cleaner Lady: I Thought About Divorcing My Husband, Because Sometimes I'm "Furious"

Lets' go right to the punchline:



> There were no atoms being split in this household.


But...TRUMP!!!


----------



## FeXL

Your Government Is Here For You



> Now is the time at SDA when we juxtapose again!
> 
> Washington, DC – March 30, 2020: _Trump unveils new five-minute coronavirus test device_
> 
> Update: FDA authorizes two-minute antibody testing kit to detect coronavirus
> 
> Ottawa, ON – March 31st, 2020: _*“our next-generation manufacturing supercluster will be leading companies in developing and scaling up new technologies to test and to treat Canadians.”*_
> 
> Flashback to SDA, March 27th: _This is GAME CHANGER. Abbott to market, starting next week, a fast point-of-care #coronavirus test, delivering positive results in 5min and negative results in 13min. Will deliver 50K tests/day to start. Kudos to Abbott and FDA’s Jeff Shuren and team at CDRH who are in the fight._


Bold mine.

Typical gov't content-free word salad. The only supercluster they've got is a super clusterfukc...

But...TRUMP!!! XX)


----------



## Beej

B.C. vs Quebec and figuring out what policies matter

These are early results and could wildly change in a few days, but a few observations at this point.

B.C. is an example of high risk. They likely have more connections with China per capita than any other province (maybe Ontario has more, worth checking), they have the second most land crossings with the U.S. (Quebec is 3rd, but far lower per capita), and Washington state was the first hotspot in the U.S. (currently over 700 cases per million compared to 200 in B.C.). B.C. has also been second to Alberta in testing from early on, if I recall correctly, while Quebec was low on testing initially, but later increased above average (Ontario has fallen way back).

And now Quebec has about 500 cases per million people. The largest factor appears to be early testing and follow up, not travel restrictions, which are still helpful.*

*Australia has a lower infection rate than Canada (187 per million versus 228) and they did an earlier China "ban", but they also don't border a country with nine times their population and with a much higher infection rate (569 per million in the U.S.). It's unclear what the earlier China "ban" accomplished.


----------



## FeXL

Beej said:


> *Australia has a lower infection rate than Canada (187 per million versus 228) and they did an earlier China "ban", but they also don't border a country with nine times their population and with a much higher infection rate (569 per million in the U.S.). It's unclear what the earlier China "ban" accomplished.


Taiwan locked things down early. Last I read, they were still fully commercially operational and had relatively very few cases.

Just ran across this:


Fear of China Made Taiwan a Coronavirus Success Story



> As the new coronavirus sweeps across much of the world and cases exceed 160,000, there is one country that seems to have things under control, despite being only 110 miles from China and having experienced its first case on Jan. 21. Taiwan has only 67 cases (as of March 16), which is admirable in itself, especially when compared to its larger East Asian neighbors.


A lesson to our incompetent idiot leaders...


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> Taiwan locked things down early. Last I read, they were still fully commercially operational and had relatively very few cases.
> 
> Just ran across this:
> 
> 
> Fear of China Made Taiwan a Coronavirus Success Story
> 
> 
> 
> A lesson to our incompetent idiot leaders...


Not to mention their population density, which matters, but is not a deciding factor.


----------



## Beej

You may have heard this story already but, at least for me, I missed the name of the larger company (emphasis added). 

Ventilator Maker’s 2012 Merger Spurs Query From FTC Official
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...lator-merger-needs-new-look-ftc-official-says


> The New York Times on Sunday reported that U.S. health officials, worried about a shortage of ventilators over a decade ago, contracted with a small California device maker, Newport Medical Instruments Inc., to produce inexpensive, easy-to-use machines to add to the national stockpile. Newport planned to sell the devices for about a third of the price that other companies were charging. *Covidien*, which also made ventilators, agreed to buy Newport for $108 million, and then sought to get out of the contract, according to the Times. The government agreed to cancel the agreement.


----------



## Beej

More anecdotal details on Taiwan. Also, it sounds like Australia's airport screening is about as good as ours.

Life in Taiwan is 'pretty much the same' as it was before COVID-19
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkOKe7tkyF4[/ame]

Taiwan may also have invasive apps to help, so I'm not recommending their approach for Canada. But using masks, taking temperatures at the entrance to large buildings, and some other practices look like they're worth copying.


----------



## SINC

Very interesting Beej, thanks for posting.


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Yeah, about that Canadian airport "screening"...

Your Government Is Here For You



> Happy social distancing, mushrooms.


From the comments:



> *Canadians’ forced into isolation via government edicts but foreigners can roam at will, I’ve had all I can take of the incompetence of liberals at every level of government.* Three weeks in and the only people to lose their civil liberties are Canadian citizens, why- because we all know that our government at all levels have little to very little medical supplies. We being forced into our homes because this country lacks the medical supplies to test or treat the people with the virus. At what point is this tyranny enough, they keep us locked down to protect their political empires not to protect us because we know they don’t have the resources to protect us?


Bold mine.


----------



## FeXL

Couple That Drank Aquarium Cleaner Looks Like A Left Wing Stunt Gone Wrong



> Remember the Arizona couple that ingested fish tank cleaner after hearing President Trump say chloroquine is helping stop the Wuhan virus? The woman ended up in the hospital and her husband died as a result, it appears that this may have been a left-wing stunt gone wrong.
> 
> The Washington Free Beacon was able to identify the Arizona couple that ingested fish tank cleaner and then blamed President Trump, they have deep ties to left-wing activist groups.


Related:

Fish tank cleaner couple's story gets weirder and weirder



> As asked here yesterday, what normal person eats a fish-tank cleaner to avoid coronavirus?
> 
> Hmmm, perhaps a loving husband whose oh, so solicitous wife suggests it because President Donald J. Trump (R) highly recommends it. At least that's what the grieving widow says, whose husband died from dining on the stuff while she daintily ingested a mere taste. While the lefty media — i.e., 90% or so of the media — gleefully agreed with her that Trump was at fault, the remaining 10% of the media, plus the hundreds of thousands of silent deplorables, thought this explanation was fishy. The fishiness began to stink to high Hillary hell upon the discovery that the couple was —surprise! — Democratic donors.
> 
> Now the true rot sets in to this fishy story with a long, edifying series of tweets from Techno Fog informing us that grieving widow — another not surprise! — had previously sought a divorce from said husband.
> 
> Wait...there's more! Grieving widow also has mental problems! (Cue defense lawyers. For the wife, not Trump.) And...doctors and medications and blah, blah, blah to deal with this had left the loving couple with...financial problems.
> 
> Oh. Hmmm.


----------



## FeXL

Related?

FBI Tactical Report Describes Chinese Biologist Carrying Viable SARS, MERS Viruses at Detroit Airport in 2018



> An FBI tactical intelligence report obtained by _Yahoo News_ describes an incident in November 2018, which shows that the agency had significant concerns about the bio-security threat posed by China.
> 
> U.S. Customs and Border Protection agents at Detroit Metro Airport stopped a Chinese scientist carrying vials believed to contain the MERS (Middle East Respiratory Syndrome) and SARS (Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome) viruses.


Questions, questions, questions...


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> Couple That Drank Aquarium Cleaner Looks Like A Left Wing Stunt Gone Wrong


That's real dedication to pwning the Drumpf. No pink hat is enough for her.


----------



## FeXL

Ontario is not reporting more than 1,000 likely COVID-19 cases



> Ontario began “enhancing” the pandemic data it provides to the public earlier this week, but provincial health officials are not reporting more than 1,000 that are very likely to be COVID-19 but lack lab confirmation because of test rationing, backlogs or flawed results.


Cat-astrophe in the making? ANOTHER feline tests positive for coronavirus, this time in Hong Kong



> A pet cat has tested positive for the dreaded Covid-19 coronavirus in Hong Kong, after apparently contracting the disease from its owner. Last week, another feline turned out to have the virus in Belgium.
> 
> The Hong Kong cat patient was sent to a special animal quarantine facility on Monday, after its owner, a 25-year-old woman, was confirmed to have contracted the disease. Samples collected from the feline’s oral, nasal and rectal cavities tested positive for the virus, but it did not show any symptoms.


Perhaps this'll get the Progs onside for tighter border controls...

Wuhan doctor who was among the first to alert other medics to the spread of coronavirus 'goes missing' amid fears she has been detained for speaking out



> A Wuhan doctor who was among the first to alert other medics to the spread of coronavirus has disappeared sparking concerns that she has been detained, reports suggest.
> 
> Dr Ai Fen said she faced 'unprecedented, extremely harsh reprimanded' by officials at Wuhan Central Hospital after she shared a picture of a patient report labelled 'SARS coronavirus'.
> 
> The image was widely circulated and made its way to whistle-blower Li Wenliang who raised the alarm about the bug, which has killed more than 41,000 people worldwide.
> 
> Dr Li was reprimanded by authorities for 'illegally spreading untruthful information online'.


Ontario, B.C., Quebec begin building makeshift hospitals in preparation for rise in COVID-19 patients



> Canada’s three largest provinces have begun setting up temporary makeshift hospitals to expand their number of available beds in anticipation of an influx of patients with COVID-19.


Whistleblower says workers at nursing homes aren’t being given protective gear



> A personal support worker caring for those most at risk of dying of COVID-19 says she and her colleagues aren’t being given the proper protective equipment to prevent an outbreak.


'Cauth Juthdin gaves all the mathks away to the Commies...

Canada coronavirus deaths jump by 35%, Quebec says equipment running low



> Canada’s death toll from the coronavirus outbreak jumped by 35% to 89 in less than a day, officials said on Tuesday, and *the major province of Quebec* said it was running low on key medical equipment.


Bold mine.

Major province? Well, salut...

Quick! Gotta write 'em a major cheque!! Can't have Blackie's favourite _major_ province disgruntled!!!

DISHONEST: Trudeau Falsely Claims He Set Aside Money For “Rainy Day”



> While the Trudeau Liberals have gotten a few aspects of the financial response to the CCP Coronavirus right _(while failing totally on protecting the country by leaving the borders open),_ he is now making patently false claims about what led up to that fiscal response.


Why do they always call it a false claim? The bastard outright _lied..._

Coronavirus and Islam: Pakistani clerics refuse to shut down mosques



> Last week, Pakistani President Arif Alvi and provincial governors held a meeting with Sunni and Shiite clerics to convince them to close mosques for congregational prayers across the country amid rapidly increasing COVID-19 cases in the country. The clerics, however, rejected the request.
> 
> "We can in no way close mosques ... It is not possible in any circumstances in an Islamic country," said Muneeb-bur-Rehman, a cleric who attended the meeting.


Related:

Numerous Muslims Worldwide Agree: Coronavirus Can’t Touch Muslims



> While much of the Western world is in quarantine and many fear that the worst is still yet to come from the coronavirus, many Muslims around the world aren’t worried at all: they are sure that Allah will protect them from the plague. As a result, they’re gathering in large numbers, thereby endangering their coreligionists and infidels alike.


The good news about basic stupidity is that is has the habit of weaning itself from society. The bad news is, it invariably takes a few innocents along...

Consider releasing some inmates to stem COVID-19 in prisons, minister requests



> Public Safety Minister Bill Blair has asked the federal prison service and the parole board to look at early release for some offenders to prevent the spread of COVID-19 behind bars.
> 
> *The government is committed to protecting* inmates, correctional staff and *the public* given the unique risks the virus poses for prisons, said Mary-Liz Power, a spokeswoman for the minister.


Bold mine.

The iron...

If they were all given free rides directly to Rideau Cottage, I'd be all over this.

'Best case scenario': COVID-19 measures expected to last until July, government document says



> Canadians are far from done with dealing with COVID-19, as measures to fight the spread of the virus are expected to continue until at least July, according to a government document obtained by the National Post.
> 
> *“Current GoC [Government Operations Centre] modelling suggests as a best case scenario that current measures continue until at least July.”*


I wonder if that's the same models they predict Globull Warming with? And, as an aside, models are only as good as the data going into them (why Globull Warming predictions are all wrong). With data from certain countries <cough>China<cough> nothing more than propaganda, how accurate do they really expect these predictions to be? 

Close enough for gov't work...

Don’t wear a face mask in Canada! Dr. Theresa Tam knows Trudeau already gave them away to China

Yeppers.

It's only fair to ask public sector workers to share in these hardships



> With the exception of the Alberta provincial government, politicians are willing to have the private sector take a huge financial hit, but not so with “their own” — the public sector.


Damn straight.

Official nonsense on masks, travel bans is killing Ottawa's COVID-19 credibility



> On Saturday, the federal government announced passengers with COVID-19 symptoms would be barred from domestic air and train travel, effective noon on Monday. “It will be important for operators of airlines and trains to ensure that people who are exhibiting symptoms do not board,” Prime Minister Justin Trudeau told reporters.
> 
> Does that make sense? It’s a question Canadians seem to be asking more and more about this country’s coronavirus response. And for governments and public health officials, it’s a dangerous one. All too often, the answer is “no.”


What f'ing credibility?

75% of returning travellers bypassing mandatory quarantine: Study



> In households where someone has recently travelled abroad, 75% of them have visited a grocery store and 41% have hosted guests, despite a mandatory quarantine imposed by the Canadian government, according to a new study.


So where's those million $$$ fines Der Gropenfuhr was threatening?

Under Trudeau Liberals, seniors have become pandemic’s irrelevant



> When Prime Minister Justin Trudeau ventures out of Rideau Cottage every morning, GQ-woke and beard nicely trimmed, he never mentions the old folk whose retirement savings have been devastated.
> 
> ...
> 
> Seniors are largely a nuisance. They cost too much, put strains on health care with all their maladies, and they often linger around way too long before rattling off their final breath.


Sweden Health Board Says Elderly Can Be Given Lower Priority, But Not Illegal Migrants



> Sweden’s National Board of Health and Welfare has created guidelines for the priority of care for Chinese coronavirus patients that could see elderly Swedish citizens left to die in favour of illegal migrants.


----------



## Beej

Beej said:


> A bit more data about how corona virus is not just the flu.
> 
> The U.S. had 312 deaths today, from 102,000 cases, subject to verification from official sources in a day or two. More likely 500,000 or even a million total cases, including the untested.
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
> 
> Looking at CDC data on influenza, 50,000 deaths would be a worse than average flu, coming from about 30 million cases.
> https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html
> 
> Most flu deaths occur in about half a year. If all the deaths occurred in half a year, the rate would be 274 deaths per day.
> 
> The flu isn't close to as dangerous as the corona virus.


An update on this post from five days ago. At the time I pointed out how an above average U.S. flu season has about 274 deaths per day if you allocate all deaths to the peak six months, and that the U.S. had over 300 deaths in one day from the corona virus (aka WuFlu, ChYna virus).

The U.S. reported just over 1,000 deaths from corona virus in the last day, subject to the same caveats about unofficial sources aggregating state and local data.


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Y2Kyoto: Contagion



> Public Health Agency did not stock masks but spent $5.6M on #ClimateChange, incl studies of mosquitoes, rats, and programs on “storytelling regarding climate change”. https://t.co/VSOWKoKlyg @CPHO_Canada #covid19Canada #cdnpoli pic.twitter.com/7WwPQKwq4m
> 
> — Holly Doan (@hollyanndoan) April 1, 2020​
> From the comments;
> 
> The federal government announced Tuesday that it “was in the process of finalizing an agreement” with the Montreal-based protective equipment manufacturer Medicom to start N95 and surgical mask production in Canada.
> 
> But the proposed Medicom manufacturing site won’t be up and running for months. According to the company, neither the location nor the number of facilities that will be producing masks has been decided. It is aiming to start production in early summer.
> 
> Trudeau is desperately trying to source N95 masks from other countries, who are struggling with their own needs.
> 
> 
> Guess “studies of mosquitoes, rats, and programs on “storytelling regarding climate change” were more important.​


Also from the comments:



> My prediction.
> 
> Trudeau is desperately trying to buy masks. He knew Canada was going to be short of masks. The only real source is China. That’s why he sent 16 tonnes to China back in February. He was hoping that would curry favour with China.
> 
> Now China will likely play hardball with Trudeau. They’ll demand he send Meng Wanzhou back to China. They’ll also demand Trudeau approve Huawei as the 5G provider. Both deals done in secret.​


And these:



> Chris says:
> April 1, 2020 at 9:38 pm
> 
> Yes.
> Check out the table at the bottom of this web page. *The total cost of all of the Liberals’ COVID wage subsidies, tax deferrals, benefits, credits, and loans is… $570+ billion.*
> https://www.canada.ca/en/department-finance/news/2020/04/the-canada-emergency-wage-subsidy.html
> Reply
> 
> 1.
> LindaL says:
> April 1, 2020 at 9:53 pm
> 
> And yet, he was carrying on a few days ago that they are able to do this because of their good fiscal management over the past few years. Oh my. These guys really live in La la Land.​


Bold mine.


----------



## FeXL

Fish Tank Cleaner Woman Called Trump "Psycho Prez" One Month Before Taking This "Psycho's" (Hallucinated) Advice to Feed Her Husband Poison



> The media is of course offering no corrections nor any new updates.


I'm sorry...Just who is the Psycho here?


Dr. Steven Smith: Hydroxychloroquine Works; "This is the beginning of the end of coronavirus"



> This is not a study with a control group. It's a doctor giving the regimen to his patients and observing the results.
> 
> But the results are very encouraging.


More:



> He said zero patients getting hydroxycloroquine had to be intubated.


Further:



> And on the vaccine front: the University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine says that might have the vaccine ready.
> 
> University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine scientists today announced a potential vaccine against SARS-CoV-2, the new coronavirus causing the COVID-19 pandemic. When tested in mice, the vaccine, delivered through a fingertip-sized patch, produces antibodies specific to SARS-CoV-2 at quantities thought to be sufficient for neutralizing the virus.​
> An Israeli firm announced that it was ten days away from a vaccine.
> 
> One or more of these groups will nail it.



Your Government Is Here For You



> Trust the experts.
> 
> Politicians warned Wednesday Canadians can expect weeks or months of social distancing, but declined to reveal their own models or estimates of just how many people could become infected or die of COVID-19.
> 
> 
> While federal and provincial leaders stressed the need for Canadians to maintain the fight against COVID-19, they refused to disclose models that project how the virus might play out.
> 
> Ontario Premier Doug Ford said releasing projection models might prompt panic.
> 
> “There are a few different models and if we give one or the other it sends two different messages,” said Ford. “These models could drastically, drastically change. If we underestimate on one side and overestimate on the other (it could) create a panic if we overestimate.”
> 
> When asked about releasing information from such models, *Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said, “There are a wide range of projections depending on how Canadians are behaving.”*​


Bold mine.

So, if yer acting like our clueless, douchebag, Prog PM, we're all fukced...

More:



> In Saskatchewan they refuse to even disclose where COVID-19 cases are.
> 
> *The same government that has been giving us computer models about the climate 80 years from now, given current policies, can't give us computer models about COVID-19 eight weeks from now, given current policies?* #cdnpoli
> 
> — Lorrie Goldstein (@sunlorrie) April 2, 2020​
> Related: Trudeau’s attempt to help may kill many small businesses


Bold mine.

DINGDINGDINGDNGDING!!! WE HAVE A WINNAH!!!


Florida sheriff who arrested pastor now releasing 163 actual criminals (while you’re locked in at home)



> In case you still think every unilateral action taken by local officials is driven by science and intrepid concern for public safety and health, I present to you the case of Hillsborough County Sheriff Chad Chronister.
> 
> On Monday, after holding a virtue-signaling press conference lecturing the public on the Bible, Chronister arrested Pastor Rodney Howard-Browne for holding services on Sunday, even though his lawyer says he was following CDC guidelines for sanitation and social distancing.



COVID Confirms It: Dems Don’t Understand Economics



> From Sen. Bernie Sanders demanding that a coronavirus vaccine be free for all and that “profiteering” from it cannot be tolerated, to New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo, who said “if everything we do saves just one life, I’ll be happy,” when he ordered the state to shut down, Democrats are demonstrating they don’t know how an economy works. This is as dangerous as it is maddening.


Shocka...


Prime Minstrel loses the all-important...



> ...Lady Gaga endorsement...
> 
> _"We’re saved! Thanks to *Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, Director General for the World Health Organization (WHO),* who bragged about a recent phone call he had with pop star Lady Gaga."​_
> Shmoozing with a pop star? Well.. it's not like he has anything else on his plate.



Nobody tell Justin...



> ...he's spent enough of our money already...
> 
> _ "King of Thailand Maha Vajiralongkorn is currently self-isolating from the Chinese coronavirus in a luxury hotel in Germany with *an entourage of 20 concubines and female servants,* local reports claimed this week."
> 
> While the majority of hotels in Germany are *closed as a result of the nationwide quarantine,* the 67-year-old is believed to have booked out the entire Grand Hotel Sonnenbichl_​
> From the comments:
> 
> *"Finally, someone taking Coronavirus seriously."*



Coronavirus will only get worse in Canada thanks to Trudeau’s anti-mask, open borders policies



> Justin Trudeau has turned government policy around on a dime again in this morning’s episode of the Trudeau Morning Show.



Trudeau trailed behind Trump by days and even weeks in coronavirus response



> Prime Minister Justin Trudeau has been slow to act in responding to the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> On several issues, including public health screening, travel advisories and creating a coronavirus task force, Canada trailed behind the US by several days or even weeks.
> 
> On Monday, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau suggested that Canada was not on the same trajectory as the US because it had acted sooner.


Yeth! At the airporths he had thigns! Thigns, I tell you!!!

XX)XX)XX)


Iran and the Consequences of Coronavirus



> Will the devastating health disaster bring an end to the Islamic Republic?



Preparing for the Wrong Emergency



> Focused on climate change, Mayor Bill de Blasio failed to equip New York for the coronavirus crisis.



The Comprehensive Timeline of China’s COVID-19 Lies



> On today’s menu: a day-by-day, month-by-month breakdown of China’s coronavirus coverup and the irreparable damage it has caused around the globe.



Since March 13, 158 flights have come into Canada with a confirmed case of COVID-19 on board



> The number of flights into Canada bearing people with confirmed infections of COVID-19 continues to rise, including two repatriation flights for Canadians stranded abroad amid pandemic travel restrictions.
> 
> There were 158 international flights to Canada between March 13 and March 27 on which at least one person was found to be infected with the novel coronavirus that causes COVID-19.



‘It is a very dire situation’: At least 600 nursing, retirement homes in Canada have coronavirus cases



> The new coronavirus has invaded at least 600 nursing and retirement homes across Canada, including hundreds in Quebec, a situation that has overwhelmed front-line caregivers and left frightened families scrambling for information about loved ones they can’t visit.


More:



> _*Blast from the recent past…* Risk of coronavirus outbreak in Canada low, says federal health chief_



Release COVID models driving politicians' decisions



> The projections for COVID-19 deaths out of the United States are shocking: More than 100,000 Americans could die from the virus based on modelling released by the White House.
> 
> By mid-April, the country could be seeing 2,000 deaths a day.


There were a thousand yesterday.


Los Angeles man tries to RAM train into ‘suspicious’ US Navy hospital ship ‘to wake people up’



> An engineer in Los Angeles was charged after attempting to ram a train at full speed into a Navy hospital ship sent to assist with the Covid-19 pandemic, in a bizarre effort to “wake up” Americans to a vague government conspiracy.
> 
> San Pedro resident Eduardo Moreno was charged with one count of train wrecking on Wednesday after admitting to authorities that he deliberately derailed a locomotive in an attempt to crash it into the USNS Mercy, a Navy medical vessel docked near LA to take pressure off the city’s crowded hospitals amid the coronavirus outbreak.


Further on crazy white train engineers...


----------



## FeXL

Ahhhhh!!!

Massive toilet paper shipment wiped out in fiery wreck



> This load of toilet paper got wiped out.
> 
> A tractor-trailer hauling a shipment of the hot coronavirus commodity crashed near Dallas early on Wednesday and caught fire, singeing thousands of rolls and spilling the rest all over an interstate, officials said.


Related:


----------



## FeXL

Republican Senator Rick Scott of Florida: We Need Congressional Investigations Into Why the WHO -- Which the US is Funding -- Is Acting as a Pass-Through For Propaganda Written by the Communist Chinese Intelligence Services



> Yes and after that: Investigate what the "American" media is so eager to propagate Chinese intelligence service propaganda as well.
> 
> Sen. Rick Scott on Tuesday called for a congressional investigation into the World Health Organization, suggesting the U.S. should cut off its funding for "helping Communist China cover up" the full extent of the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> The Florida Republican, a noted China hawk, has long raised concerns about the WHO’s relationship with Beijing, which has undercounted the number of coronavirus cases in the country.
> 
> ...
> 
> "We know Communist China is lying about how many cases and deaths they have, what they knew and when they knew it -- and the WHO never bothered to investigate further,” Scott added. "Their inaction cost lives."
> 
> He said the WHO "willfully parroted propaganda" from China’s Communist Party, and he called for hearings and a full investigation when Congress returns to Washington next month.​



UNREAL: FDA Sat on Critical Mask-Sanitizing Technology, Leaving the Job Up to Grandmas with Sewing Machines



> Ohio Attorney General Dave Yost has had enough of the FDA's dithering over approval of an innovative process that could get millions of N95 masks to hospitals and other healthcare facilities, where they are in critically short supply as the Chinese coronavirus continues to stretch their resources. "If this isn't cleared up by morning, I'm ready to sue the FDA," Yost wrote on his Facebook page on Sunday afternoon.
> 
> What's the problem? Yost says the FDA is limiting the number of masks that an Ohio organization, Battelle Memorial Institute, can sterilize for reuse. Battelle has pioneered a technology that uses hydrogen peroxide vapor to make N95 masks safe for reuse and wants to ramp up production at their facility so they can send the masks where needed, but the FDA essentially shrugged and seemed to say, 'what's the big hurry?'
> 
> "The Food and Drug Administration -- after dithering all week -- finally gave Battelle approval to sterilize a measly 10,000 masks a day," Yost said. "They could be doing 160,000 per day."



Your Government Is Here For You



> And YOU! And You! And You over there!
> 
> The Canadian emergency response benefit is part of the Canadian government’s massive relief package to taxpayers in the midst of the global pandemic.
> 
> Unfortunately for those same taxpayers, Trudeau has snuck non-Canadians onto the list of who qualifies for that lucrative $8,000 per person bail out.
> 
> International students, most of whom come from China, are among those eligible. So are temporary foreign workers.​



In this time of crisis, it's the private sector coming through



> Trump's approach to the coronavirus is exposing one of the great fault lines in American politics, which is the battle between those who believe in the free market and the private sector versus those who believe that the answer is always the government. This fault line has obviously existed for a long time, but it's never been exposed in starker terms than now, when there is a crushing weight bearing down on America. *So far, the private sector is proving more adaptable, more effective, and more decent.*


Bold mine.

Shocka...


Ruth Bader Ginsburg on Avoiding Gyms During the Pandemic: I "Ain't Havin' It"



> The left is really fascinated with the workout routines of an elderly woman.
> 
> Might be Testosterone Envy.
> 
> Law360 (March 31, 2020, 6:42 PM EDT) -- Gyms are closed around the country due to the coronavirus pandemic, but the personal trainer for Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg told Law360 that the justice "ain't having it," and is still working out with him twice a week at the U.S. Supreme Court's private facility.​


I guess if you have your own personal, taxpayer-funded, private facility...


Obama Depleted the Nation's Strategic Reserve of Ventilators, Respirators, and Surgical Masks -- Stockpiled in Case of Bioweapon Attack or Pandemic -- and Then Refused to Restock the Reserve for 8 Years, Preferring to Spend on His Socialist Priorities



> He also repeatedly sought to cut the CDC's budget -- again, I assume so that he could spend that money on socialist boondoggles.
> 
> The 2005 plan created the Strategic National Stockpile of medical supplies and equipment under the auspices of the Department of Health and Human Services and called for the distribution of supplies from six highly secured sites to state and local sites after a pandemic "surge." This Strategic National Stockpile is totally separate from the site in Dubai that the U.S. government uses for international distribution under the Foreign Assistance Act.
> 
> According to a Center for Disease Control report published after the 2009 H1N1 pandemic, 39 million N95 masks were initially distributed from the stockpile, followed by 59.5 million more in second wave. According to Johnson, the stockpile originally was about 100 million masks.
> 
> From April 12, 2009 to April 10, 2010, there were over 60 million cases of H1N1 requiring 274,304 hospitalizations and resulting in 12,469 deaths in the United States.
> 
> After the H1N1 virus slowed down in 2010, according to Johnson, "it was important to restock." That did not happen as the national stockpile budget focused on other priorities deemed higher.​


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Until 15 Minutes Ago, I Was Being Told Canada Was Outperforming Orange Man Bad In Every Conceivable Way



> Last night: President Trump Invokes Defense Production Act Taking Control of 3M Production…
> 
> *Trudeau does not specifically answer Q about whether he has talked to trump today* about the 3M issue, even on follow-up. He says gov understands there are pressures across Canada because of "dwindling supplies" and says that's why gov is working to order/make more PPE.
> 
> — Annie Bergeron-Oliver (@AnnieClaireBO) April 3, 2020​
> CBC: _Because there are currently no domestic manufacturers of N95 masks, pressure put on the global supply by the coronavirus pandemic has left Canada in a precarious position._


Bold mine.

When has Der Gropenfuhrer _ever_ specifically answered _any_ question?

As to MotherCorpse's statement, No $h!t, Sherlock...


----------



## FeXL

FROM THE SAME INTEL CLOWNS WHO CLAIMED RUSSIA STOLE THE 2016 ELECTION:



> Today’s Washington Post front page features a sensational story claiming the intelligence community was warning President Trump and Congress way back in January that coronavirus was going to be a worldwide pandemic.
> 
> But closely reading the key graph shows it to be based on one anonymous source, plus the opinions of anonymous “others:”


----------



## FeXL

Further:

Plastic bag bans dangerous during COVID-19 pandemic



> As we combat the coronavirus pandemic it’s important for Americans to note that many environmental initiatives that purport to “save the planet” not only restrict consumer choice and hurt the business sector— it also puts the public safety at risk.


----------



## Beej

Beej said:


> An update on this post from five days ago. At the time I pointed out how an above average U.S. flu season has about 274 deaths per day if you allocate all deaths to the peak six months, and that the U.S. had over 300 deaths in one day from the corona virus (aka WuFlu, ChYna virus).
> 
> The U.S. reported just over 1,000 deaths from corona virus in the last day, subject to the same caveats about unofficial sources aggregating state and local data.


France, population 67 million, has now had a couple days in a row of over 1,000 deaths per day. This is "just the flu" to people who do not understand compound interest. The barely numerate. The interest rate is 15-25% per day without a response.


----------



## Beej

3M says Trump halting mask exports to Canada has 'significant humanitarian implications'
https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/3m-...gnificant-humanitarian-implications-1.4881032


> "The Administration also requested that 3M cease exporting respirators that we currently manufacture in the United States to the Canadian and Latin American markets. There are, however, significant humanitarian implications of ceasing respirator supplies to healthcare workers in Canada and Latin America, where we are a critical supplier of respirators," 3M said in a statement released Friday.


Bad idea, but I get why the U.S. would do this for future contracts. The same panic that European nations are in, and we may be in the future. 

If (big IF), however, they're talking about not meeting existing contracts, that would be a POS move by Trump. The minimum response in that case should be suspending all recognition of U.S. intellectual property, along with measures for health care related products. Why should we pay for their entertainment industry if they're going full isolationist? Not a future I want, but if they're going to be idiots, so be it.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> The interest rate is 15-25% per day without a response.


So you're telling me I should shift my credit card debt to France?


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> So you're telling me I should shift my credit card debt to France?


Oui, mon amis.


----------



## SINC

As I turned on the TV this morning to the CTV all news channel, I began to count the COVID-19 related stories. I needn't have bothered as every single item was virus related for the full half-hour, at which point they begin anew and repeat it all for another 30 minutes. It's the same on CBC and Global.

I think the MSM are giving this way too much play. Good God when is enough, enough?

They may think they are doing their jobs, but it seems to me they are being tough on the mental health of we who are stuck at home. 

I could understand an update once per hour for 10 or 15 minutes, but the constant barrage of doom and gloom is very hard on their viewers in my opinion. There has to be good news out there they could use to lighten things up for people. I deliberately avoid overplay on my website to not only give readers a break, but give them something to smile about.

Just my rant for the day.


----------



## Beej

SINC said:


> As I turned on the TV this morning to the CTV all news channel, I began to count the COVID-19 related stories. I needn't have bothered as every single item was virus related for the full half-hour, at which point they begin anew and repeat it all for another 30 minutes. It's the same on CBC and Global.
> 
> I think the MSM are giving this way too much play. Good God when is enough, enough?
> 
> They may think they are doing their jobs, but it seems to me they are being tough on the mental health of we who are stuck at home.
> 
> I could understand an update once per hour for 10 or 15 minutes, but the constant barrage of doom and gloom is very hard on their viewers in my opinion. There has to be good news out there they could use to lighten things up for people. I deliberately avoid overplay on my website to not only give readers a break, but give them something to smile about.
> 
> Just my rant for the day.


I agree. We're now experiencing the CNN approach to big stories. 24/7 on the one topic (remember that missing plane years ago? terrible coverage from CNN). Even with free live CTV news, I don't watch more than a couple minutes a day. 

I'll watch a Global youtube video of a full briefing from another province or state to see what's going on somewhere else, but I don't care what chatter the news anchors care to add before and after the brief for TV viewers. They don't know anything.


----------



## eMacMan

Beej said:


> I agree. We're now experiencing the CNN approach to big stories. 24/7 on the one topic (remember that missing plane years ago? terrible coverage from CNN). Even with free live CTV news, I don't watch more than a couple minutes a day.
> 
> I'll watch a Global youtube video of a full briefing from another province or state to see what's going on somewhere else, but I don't care what chatter the news anchors care to add before and after the brief for TV viewers. They don't know anything.


The corona virus coverage has been abysmal. Relevant information would be total pneumonia deaths from all cause same time period each of the past several years. Total pneumonia related deaths this year and how many of them are supposedly attributable to Covid. That simple bit of information would tell us if Corona has in fact added any deaths beyond normal. If not it's time to free the slaves.

FWIW I have found that information almost impossible to find which strongly suggests that there is something fishy about the official narrative.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> The corona virus coverage has been abysmal. Relevant information would be total pneumonia deaths from all cause same time period each of the past several years. Total pneumonia related deaths this year and how many of them are supposedly attributable to Covid. That simple bit of information would tell us if Corona has in fact added any deaths beyond normal. If not it's time to free the slaves.
> 
> FWIW I have found that information almost impossible to find which strongly suggests that there is something fishy about the official narrative.


Try this:

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1310078201

*Pneumonia and influenza deaths, Canada:*

*2014 2015 2016 2017 2018
*
6,597 7,630 6,235 7,396 8,511


----------



## FeXL

_Very_ interesting.

Wuhan Flu: “This is a completely new disease”



> This article is currently percolating across social media and may begin to gain traction in the coming days: *Covid-19 had us all fooled, but now we might have finally found its secret.* (Now deleted, copy here)
> 
> It makes for a compelling read, no question. And it may even be a valid hypothesis, and at least one of the responses lends it legitimacy, as perhaps does this. ⇽ Read it.
> 
> But it’s also written under a pseudonym, “libertymavenstock”.
> 
> With a few minutes of sleuthing, I found the identity of the author — Andrew Gaiziunas along with his Youtube channel on cryptocurrencies, and an interview. It had 7 views as of this morning. So buyer beware should it pop up in your travels. (Update: He is likely the son of a retired Illinois doctor of the same name.)
> 
> It would be useful if our readers in the medical field would chime in.
> 
> Fair warning: to anyone veering off topic or jamming up the threads with conspiracy jack**** – prepare to be disappeared.
> 
> But I also stumbled upon this during my trip down the rabbit hole, and this is probably as good a place to share it as anywhere. By Dr.Cameron Kyle-Sidell who is treating COVID-19 patients in New York City. _Patients need OXYGEN NOT PRESSURE!!! The ventilators may be causing lung damage because of PRESSURE. Needs to be immediately investigated._


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Canada’s National Emergency Strategic Stockpile not kept up



> It survived more then 10 months and 40,000 plus cases of H1N1 but was done within two weeks and just a few thousand cases of coronavirus. That makes no sense.


Comments nail it, especially this one:



> Our stock was piled from the heart out. The stockpile will manage itself. Take a mask leave a mask.


This one:



> Yet less than 3 weeks ago,everyone of these “leaders” was assuring Canadians that they,the government,were totally prepared for the Pandemic..Trust Us!
> Now no stockpile of PPE??


That would be the very same steaming pile of lying, incompetent, Prog idiots who were assuring us back in January that the chance of an outbreak in Canada was very small. tptptptp

And this one:



> There was undoubtedly no stockpile of PPE as the government couldn’t figure out how to turn it into another boondoggle favoring a Quebec company.
> 
> If Bombardier made PPE,there would have been a hundred years supply in storage, enough to supply the entire planet.


----------



## Beej

New York City has, I hope, reached a plateau with the virus, 2-3 weeks after significant state and national action, which is the pattern seen in Europe. The plateau is horrible (see below), but hopefully there is a decline soon.

https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page

NYC had 9 corona virus deaths on March 16th, 77 on the 23rd, and 218 on the 30th. Delaying significant action by one week would have put daily deaths at close to 600, not counting extra deaths from an overwhelmed hospital system. With one exception, their plateau is in the low 200s per day, or about 1,500 deaths in a week. 

https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/fluview/mortality.html

Looking at historical flu/pneumonia tracking from 2012-13 to 2019-20, the worst week for NYC was 184. The worst week wasn't as bad as a single bad day of the corona virus, and that's after a couple weeks of significant actions taken to reduce the spread. 

Also, deaths in late March to early April were never close to that level for the flu, except the latest observation (161 deaths in the latest week), amid reports that New York does not have the capacity to test everyone who dies at home. So there's a chance of overlap with some of the 200+ corona virus deaths per day showing up in the generic flu/pneumonia category.

As usual, my work could use a double-check because I'm not familiar with the data.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> As usual, my work could use a double-check because I'm not familiar with the data.


My greatest interest is in knowing how many asymptomatic carriers have already gone through the mill. I have heard estimates of twice as many to 100 times as many. That number is necessary to calculate a death rate -- though total deaths are bad enough -- and any number required for herd immunity.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> My greatest interest is in knowing how many asymptomatic carriers have already gone through the mill. I have heard estimates of twice as many to 100 times as many. That number is necessary to calculate a death rate -- though total deaths are bad enough -- and any number required for herd immunity.


I agree that would be helpful to know. Randomized testing may be in our future.

Note that, using Alberta as an example, only 2% of tests come back positive, and that's a heavily biased sample of tests. 2% of the population would be about 90,000, or 70 times the current number of cases. I just shaved 30 off your high case!


----------



## FeXL

RACIS'!!!

Indigenous leaders asking that access to Labrador be sealed off



> The elected leaders of the Innu of Labrador are requesting the closure of commercial airports, the ferry services, and travel from Quebec along the Trans-Labrador Highway into Labrador.
> 
> The Combined Councils of Labrador is also asking to stop non-essential travel between Labrador and Newfoundland.
> 
> The Indigenous nations believe limiting travel to essential services is one last step to slow the spread of COVID-19.
> 
> *In a letter to Newfoundland and Labrador Premier Dwight Ball and Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, the Innu Nation says closing off Labrador is vital.*


Bold mine.

Where's the hue & cry from the left?

I can hardly wait for Prinz Dummkopf's hypocritical approval on this little fiasco...


----------



## smashedbanana

This is an informative video on how Covid 19 kills.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4J0d59dd-qM&t=1101s"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4J0d59dd-qM&t=1101s[/ame]


----------



## Macfury

Dr. Vuong concurs that only about 5% of people who are infected will require ventilators.


----------



## chasMac

Anyone plan on wearing a mask out in public? They're becoming more and more prevalent even out here in the Calgary 'burbs.


----------



## Macfury

chasMac said:


> Anyone plan on wearing a mask out in public? They're becoming more and more prevalent even out here in the Calgary 'burbs.


Already doing it when I go into a grocery store, though not on the street. I have been accosted, bumped into, and trapped in grocery aisles by morons with no understanding of pandemics. I can accept the 1/1000 chance of encountering someone with the illness, but I don't want some kook streaming microbes directly into my face.


----------



## chasMac

Macfury said:


> ...I can accept the 1/1000 chance of encountering someone with the illness, but I don't want some kook streaming microbes directly into my face.


Aren't the officials saying masks are only useful to prevent the wearer potentially spreading the virus? But ineffective for personal protection?


----------



## Macfury

chasMac said:


> Aren't the officials saying masks are only useful to prevent the wearer potentially spreading the virus? But ineffective for personal protection?


Yes they are, and it's nonsense. If someone yells in your face or coughs or sneezes in your direction, a face mask can definitely provide some primary protection, depending on mask fit and proper use. 

I cynically believe that the original warnings about their lack of effectiveness was related to concerns that people would hoard them, making them unavailable to health care workers.

The coronavius is a physical object with a defined size. If the fibres of your mask screen some or most of them out, how can this be a bad thing?


----------



## chasMac

I find them so alien to our culture. I will likely not wear one until stipulated by the law. I hope it never comes to that. I worry masks may become a permanent fixture in the west, at least among some segments.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Yes they are, and it's nonsense.
> 
> ...
> 
> 
> I cynically believe that the original warnings about their lack of effectiveness was related to concerns that people would hoard them, making them unavailable to health care workers.


Where's that damn 'like' button?


----------



## FeXL

:clap::clap::clap:

WHO’s Your Daddy?



> _Trump says he will ‘put a hold’ on US funding to World Health Organization, says ‘they missed the call’ on pandemic._
> 
> And more.


----------



## Macfury

Tedros is personally responsible for thousands of deaths. How can he live with himself?


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Tedros is personally responsible for thousands of deaths. How can he live with himself?


I could speculate, considering his political leanings...

Related:

Republicans Introduce Bill to Withhold Money From China-Dominated WHO Until Its Current Head Resigns;
Trump Announces a Hold on US Funds For WHO



> "China-centric."
> 
> From Fox:
> 
> Reschenthaler, along with more than 20 other House Republican co-sponsors, backed the resolution that says "the United States should withhold the contribution of Federal funds to the World Health Organization until Director-General Tedros Ghebreyesus resigns and an international commission to investigate the World Health Commission is established."​


Again, :clap::clap::clap:


----------



## SINC

An interesting read and perhaps a breakthrough if the facts are right.

Covid-19 had us all fooled, but now we might have finally found its secret.


----------



## Beej

SINC said:


> An interesting read and perhaps a breakthrough if the facts are right.
> 
> Covid-19 had us all fooled, but now we might have finally found its secret.


That's hopeful. Thanks.


----------



## FeXL

Big: CDC and White House Mull a Joint Declaration That People Can Start Going Back to Work, Provided They Take Their Own Temperature Twice Per Day and Wear a Facial Mask



> Seems like we've tamed this beast.
> 
> The plan would focus on only _some_ workers returning to work, those workers deemed the most vital.
> 
> But this seems like an opening bid in reopening the country fully.
> 
> It also seems like this beast was not nearly as contagious as "The Experts," as well as the liberal "science-lovers" Experts On Twitter as well as Hot Air's Resident Expert on All Matters Which Could Negatively Affect Trump's Reelection Chances, have been screaming.
> 
> Last night Tucker Carlson said that the vaunted "models" have been consistently wrong and have consistently predicted hospitalization and death rates four or more times the actual observed rates.
> 
> And yet the experts still cite "the models" as proof (as they also cite their own constructed models as proof of global warming).


----------



## FeXL

Beej said:


> That's hopeful. Thanks.


You're welcome...


----------



## SINC

*Inventor of virus-killing mask needs funding*



> CALGARY (660 NEWS) – The University of Alberta engineer who designed a salt-coated mask to kill viruses is hoping for more funding to get the product to market sooner.
> 
> As it stands, completion is still a year and a half away.
> 
> Hyo-Jick Choi, a biomedical engineer and assistant professor at the university, developed special salt-coated filters that can deactivate a pathogen like the coronavirus in minutes.
> 
> “So when the virus-carrying droplets sit on the surface of salt-coated filters, the salt dissolves and when the liquid evaporates… it basically destroys the virus,” said Choi.


https://www.660citynews.com/2020/04/07/inventor-of-virus-killing-mask-needs-funding/


----------



## Macfury

What the hell is up with these insane numbers? 

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/coronavirus-live-updates-covid-19-covid19



> In a best-case scenario, Canada’s total COVID-19 deaths can range from 11,000 to 22,000, public health officials revealed Thursday in their projection modelling.
> 
> That figure requires keeping the spread of infections to just 2.5 to five per cent of Canadians. Based on the modelling, to get there Canada will have to keep a high level of physical distancing measures in place for a while. In the bad scenarios, where infections reach up to 70 to 80 percent of the population, deaths go well over 300,000.


The models need to be scrapped. These numbers make no sense at all given any real world numbers gleaned from real experience.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> What the hell is up with these insane numbers?
> 
> https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/coronavirus-live-updates-covid-19-covid19
> 
> 
> 
> The models need to be scrapped. These numbers make no sense at all given any real world numbers gleaned from real experience.


The highest numbers don't make sense because nowhere was crazy enough to do nothing. Even cruise ships locked down, so their deaths were mitigated. What doesn't make sense about the lower numbers?


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> The highest numbers don't make sense because nowhere was crazy enough to do nothing. Even cruise ships locked down, so their deaths were mitigated. What doesn't make sense about the lower numbers?


Our best case scenario is 20% to 33% of the U.S. best case scenario? Deaths in the range of Italy, which seemed almost to encourage the spread of Coronavius initially, but now appears to be passing the high point of new infections?


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> Our best case scenario is 20% to 33% of the U.S. best case scenario? Deaths in the range of Italy, which seemed almost to encourage the spread of Coronavius initially, but now appears to be passing the high point of new infections?


I think those will get revised down, as the U.S. numbers have been. The problem, as you've pointed out, is that no one knows total infections, so using the observed mortality rate gives a high number of deaths when applied to the general population.

To give you an example of the low end potential for harm, 0.1% of Lombardy has been killed to date, and 0.2-0.3% of Bergamo, a particularly hard hit province in Lombardy. Most of that happened in a couple months and the country is in a harsher lockdown than we are.

In a runaway case left to freely work through a country for a year easily 1% of people could die, or 350,000 for Canada. Getting from there to under 3,000 (as I think we'll manage, for the first wave) still involves a lot of guesswork. The feds are just multiplying a 1% mortality rate (half the current observed rate) by different infection rates.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> The feds are just multiplying a 1% mortality rate (half the current observed rate) by different infection rates.


That's a test question on an elementary school quiz, but not much of a model.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> That's a test question on an elementary school quiz, but not much of a model.


Ontario did even less, but at least they added in useful hospital capacity assumptions. The feds appear to have put some thought into how to account for lockdown policy, but the scenarios provided (the infection rates) still look fairly arbitrary. I'm not sure there's much behind the commonly referenced U.S. model either (IMHE), even though it gives the appearance of more.

There wasn't a firm estimate on how infectious the virus is (2-3 additional infections per carrier was the common range), much less how current policies, slightly different in every province and state, will impact that number.

This is what the news media asked for.


----------



## FeXL

The Morning Rant: Minimalist Edition



> Marko Kolanovic is a well-known strategist whose predictions are often correct, and he is taken seriously by the financial markets. His models of the Sino-Lung-Rot pandemic are in stark contrast to the others, in part because he uses some different data, one set which is collected by Kinsa, a healthcare company that is collecting temperature data.


Wuhan Flu: Signs of Improvement

CDC-IMHE 'Off' by 50%?....................from Rico

CDC Director: Coronavirus Death Toll Will Be ‘Much, Much, Much Lower’ than Projected


----------



## chasMac

Lot of countries appear to be drafting back to work/normal plans: US, Austria, Denmark, even Italy. Measured hope is palpable in their prognoses. With the recent flurry of projections being released by Canadian jurisdictions of late, however, and the advisories attendant on them, seems we are taking a different tack. Extraordinarily dire. Not just the death projections (which I personally find tolerable, even worst case), but the restrictions that are to be imposed upon our population. I don't think the majority will be willing to hold to it.


----------



## SINC

*51 recovered coronavirus patients test positive again in South Korea*



> At least 51 patients diagnosed as having fully recovered from the coronavirus in South Korea have tested positive a second time after leaving quarantine, according to officials.
> 
> The patients from Daegu all tested positive in a “relatively short time” after they were given the all-clear from their initial infections, the Korea Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (KCDC) said, according to the government-funded Yonhap News Agency.
> 
> A specialist team has been sent to conduct an epidemiological investigation in the city, which is the epicenter of the epidemic in South Korea, the agency says.
> 
> For now, the KCDC’s director-general, Jeong Eun-kyeong, believes it is likely the infection was re-activated after remaining dormant in the patients, as opposed to them being reinfected, the report said.


https://nypost.com/2020/04/07/51-re...3Oty73S65Ii_9bNynPzpv2SNTwD6lvEEdTRkQAFk5rN6k


----------



## Macfury

New York State just hit its statistical infection peak and is using 5,008 ventilators. Can you imagine the fallout of simply listening to Cuomo and deploying 25,000 ventilators to New York because he has some "feels" about it — or worrying that refusing his demands might be seen as ungenerous during a public health emergency?


https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america/new-york


----------



## Aurora

Blog-Dare...Stop-It-Just-Stop-It

Whoa! Enough already!

The news editors on Canadian media have lost all perspective in their ridiculous amount of reporting on the Coronavirus pandemic. For goodness sake give us all a break, take a deep breath and shut the hell up with so much overblown and overstated coverage on the pandemic.

STOP IT ALREADY!

When a one hour national TV newscast focuses over 50 minutes on this mess, you are distressing more people than you are helping.

Have your editors lost their minds or what? Where are your news gathering skills? They are obviously AWOL and you don't not even realize the harm you are doing to us. Wake up and rethink your obsession with the topic of the pandemic. 

Yeah, I know it is tough to get off your collective asses and search for the good that is left in the country and the world. But if you are all really journalists, please realize that not all is the doom and gloom that you persist in tossing at us, all day long, every damn day. You continue to depress us all when it should be your mission to provide hope to the masses that make it possible for your decision makers to even have a media to supposedly inform us, know you are failing miserably.

Instead of being obsessed with broadcasting and printing fear at every turn, why are you not helping boost your viewers and readers into survival mode? But no, it is way more important to show us modelling that predicts just how many of us will die tomorrow. What the hell good does that do? Not a damn thing is my response.

Dig, search, research, listen, observe and all the things you were taught in journalism school. Give a balanced and truthful account of what is really happening without dwelling on the dire side of a public health emergency every single day.

Have you even thought about following what people are doing on social media? Are you even aware of the special things people are doing to help their fellow beings? Do you even care, or are you so hell bent on the negative that you cannot admit that there is good out there every single day? Why do you refuse to even acknowledge what is really happening in the country and in the world around us?

For goodness sakes, shake your head, pull it out of the hole your editors have you swimming in, and say to hell with so much concentration on the negative and dig deeper for the positive.

It is hope that your message to the public should be, with a healthy daily dose of the dire, not the other way around.

And in closing are the media completely bamboozled by the antics of politicians at every level? Do you seriously believe that every single news release or interview they grant is not purposely slanted to make them look like they are our great saviour in the hopes of being re-elected when this mostly political and media-hyped situation that has ever been thrusted on the Canadian public has ended?

Take for example Jason Kenney's staged drama on the TV news live last night.

Earlier Dr. Deena Hinshaw, Alberta's chief medical officer of health referred to the 'modelling' results in a few brief sentences yesterday, explaining how it was helpful information to have, but what did the politicians do?

Premier Jason Kenney used the modelling results in a dramatic televised address to Albertans on the live supper hour TV news, painting a dire picture of up to 800,000 cases of COVID-19 and perhaps 3,100 deaths in our province. And remember folks, just how accurate government 'modelling' has been regarding climate change over the past 20 years.

And why do politicians paint these grim pictures by grabbing fictional numbers out of the blue? Because they know full well that those kinds of numbers will never occur and they can then claim victory over the virus when the smoke clears and gain your trust and yes, your vote, to stay in power.

The media suck it up like a bee to honey and therein lies the disservice by making us swallow the very worst news possible and they will continue to refer to it day after day for weeks to come. It is little more than fear mongering.

Think about it people and begin to protest the stuff they bombard you with at every opportunity. And think more about the millions of dollars the Liberal government has spent propping up the very media that seeks to drive you down every single day of this pandemic.

Politicians in particular are the dirtiest bunch of people alive. They see this as an opportunity to control you even further than they did before this entire situation began. And trust me when I say, it is not your situation they want to better, rather it is their own greed and purpose to gain control over you in the new world order they seek.

Be good to each other and stay safe out there folks. But be very aware of who your worst enemies are in this entire fiasco, media and government at every level. Your future and that of your children and grandchildren depend on it.
____


----------



## FeXL

:clap::clap::clap:

Via Local Commie Underlings, Beijing Officially Disapproves



> The Daily Telegraph this week received a letter from the Australian Consulate General of the People's Republic of China, who took gentle issue with our excellent coverage of the coronavirus crisis.
> 
> Following is a point-by-point response to the Consulate General and China’s communist dictatorship:
> 
> ...
> 
> _Tracing the origin of the virus is a scientific issue that requires professional, science-based assessment.​_
> Sure it does. How professional and science-based was the claim published on March 12 by China’s foreign ministry spokesman Zhao Lijian that “it might be US Army who brought the epidemic to Wuhan”?
> 
> _The origin of the virus is still undetermined, and the World Health Organization has named the novel coronavirus “COVID-19”.​_
> The World Health Organisation also appointed Zimbabwean murderer Robert Mugabe as its Goodwill Ambassador and declared on March 2 that the “stigma” of the coronavirus “is more dangerous than the virus itself”.
> 
> The World Health Organisation does a lot of stupid stuff.


More at the link.

:lmao::lmao::lmao:


----------



## FeXL

I jes' luvs me the free market...

American Innovation In The Age Of Quarantine



> What’s a business, like a strip club, to do when it’s declared a non-essential service?
> 
> Become an essential service… while still staying true to it’s core business model.
> 
> _Strippers staff 'Boober Eats' delivery service during coronavirus lockdown https://t.co/2umJn0rgzD pic.twitter.com/PqKlBu6m0c
> 
> — New York Post (@nypost) March 23, 2020​_


:clap::clap::clap:


----------



## Macfury

> Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus: '"Please do not politicize this virus."


Agreed. How else can he get back to his prestigious job as chief medical lackey and press agent for Beijing on the world stage?


----------



## eMacMan

While I consider the Chinese to be as reliable a source of information as our MSM, I do have to wonder if this is a weaponized virus. I mean it first appears after a lengthy Bill Gates simulation where House Arrest and Social Demonizing were perfected, then templates handed out for copy and paste. Then there is it's very small size right at the tiniest edge of the viral spectrum. Finally is the probably false claim that it mutates so slowly they can come up with a vaccine for it. 

A vaccine would no doubt be the ultimate wet dream for Gates and the rest of that Vaccinate Everyone But Your Own Kids Cabal. Especially if they could make it mandatory. However Corona viruses simply mutate too rapidly for that to be a realistic possibility, unless of course this particular virus has been genetically engineered. OTOH Why not claim it's that stable, come up with a useless or possibly deadly vaccine, and hope the next mutation behaves more like a plain old common cold.

Despite that, yesterday the TrueDope said he intends to keep mashing his heel into our throat until that vaccine becomes a reality. One would hope that would have anyone of average or higher intelligence protesting in the streets. So to stop that dead in its tracks we have Social Demonizing euphemised to read Social Distancing. If you dare protest we'll lock you up. Want to call on a higher power? Don't even think of going to church, not even on a double dog dare.


----------



## Macfury

If it were a weaponized virus, then it should already have a vaccine cure available as part of the plan. If Bill Gates were responsible, he should be less open about presenting his simulations to the world.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> If it were a weaponized virus, then it should already have a vaccine cure available as part of the plan. If Bill Gates were responsible, he should be less open about presenting his simulations to the world.


Bill gates has been planning this for a while.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Af6b_wyiwI[/ame]

He's just very bad at keeping secrets. Classic movie villain behaviour, but with a twist.

The twist is that the multi-billionaire's goal is to force vaccinations on everyone, thus making him a few more billion. Something he could have done with a flashy update of Microsoft Office, but he chose this path instead.


----------



## eMacMan

Beej said:


> Bill gates has been planning this for a while.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Af6b_wyiwI
> 
> He's just very bad at keeping secrets. Classic movie villain behaviour, but with a twist.
> 
> The twist is that the multi-billionaire's goal is to force vaccinations on everyone, thus making him a few more billion. Something he could have done with a flashy update of Microsoft Office, but he chose this path instead.


I'm sure he did just fine selling short just before our various governments yanked the rug out from under our economies, thereby crashing the market. 

Our local small businesses however are in really bad shape. Even if they can put it back together after all this, why bother? Next years killer virus will surely see an automatic replay with a few more human rights violations tossed in for good measure.


----------



## Beej

eMacMan said:


> I'm sure he did just fine selling short just before our various governments yanked the rug out from under our economies, thereby crashing the market.


I'm sure a lot of people made money that way when they saw how many U.S. politicians were stupidly downplaying the problem by focusing on how high annual flu deaths were compared to corona virus deaths after five weeks.


----------



## eMacMan

Beej said:


> I'm sure a lot of people made money that way when they saw how many U.S. politicians were stupidly downplaying the problem by focusing on how high annual flu deaths were compared to corona virus deaths after five weeks.



Course Knowing the dummies were committed to the Gates plan made that short bet a whole lot safer.


----------



## Beej

eMacMan said:


> Course Knowing the dummies were committed to the Gates plan made that short bet a whole lot safer.


:lmao:


----------



## Beej

Less than 1% of Austria's population infected with coronavirus, study finds
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ed-with-coronavirus-study-finds-idUSKCN21S0ZW

Some random testing to figure out the true infection rate.


> “Based on this study, we believe that 0.33% of the population in Austria was acutely infected in early April,” SORA co-founder Christoph Hofinger told a news conference. Given the margin of error, the figure was 95% likely to be between 0.12% and 0.76%.


That's about triple the reported infection rate in early April. Austria has done more testing than us, so maybe times four or five in Canada. 

This would miss people who had the virus a while back and have fully cleared up, but it's clear that in Austria the infection rate is quite low.


----------



## FeXL

Further on skewed numbers.

So apparently the death rate from influenza and pneumonia has fallen to zero.



> Simply put, that’s impossible.


Yeppers.

I cut myself sharpening a hand plane blade in the shop this morning. I think it was because of Coronavirus...:lmao:


----------



## Beej

FeXL said:


> Further on skewed numbers.
> 
> So apparently the death rate from influenza and pneumonia has fallen to zero.


I would expect flu cases to plummet because all the things that reduce corona virus also reduce influenza, but pneumonia deaths are spiking (especially in New York City, as I mentioned in a previous post), implying that some corona virus cases are being labelled as generic pneumonia cases. This is consistent with anecdotal reports from New York that people who died at home were not always being tested.


----------



## CubaMark

*Officials investigate after 31 die in Montreal nursing home during coronavirus pandemic*

Thirty-one people have died at a Quebec nursing home where Premier François Legault says the owners concealed information about residents and workers abandoned their posts.

Five of the patients were confirmed COVID-19 cases while the cause of 26 other deaths are unconfirmed at the Herron nursing home in Montreal’s West Island, the premier said Saturday. Police are investigating along with public health officials, Mr. Legault said.

(....) the home’s owner failed to hand over resident medical files to health authorities who are now in charge of caring for them. It was only Friday evening at 8 p.m., after the province obtained a court order, that authorities discovered the number of deaths.

Health Minister Danielle McCann said teams of inspectors are visiting about 40 other private nursing homes in the province.

The province has also had numerous deaths and staff shortages at public nursing homes. About half of the province’s 289 COVID-19 deaths have taken place in nursing homes.

(...) She arrived at around 5:30 p.m. with three other professionals to discover lunch trays were still in the rooms and dinner trays stacked in the hall.

“We thought we’d find the odd one needing a diaper change. Patients were all sitting in urine and feces. Some dressings were a week old. Every single room. I never saw anything like it in my career,” she said.

(Globe & Mail)​


----------



## SINC

*The Healthcrats cure is proving worse than the disease*



> Our country is now run by the Healthcrats.
> 
> The previously ignored public health agencies, buried deep within various levels of government, are the experts politicians now defer to. This would be good news if, on rare occasions, the Healthcrats were right about something. Actually, anything.
> 
> Dr. Theresa Tam is the Healthcrat who runs the federal government. Her record on being wrong is spotless.
> 
> Sixty days before ordering the country to shut down, Tam advised that COVID-19 was not a serious threat. She told the government that “the chances of an outbreak are low.”
> 
> Days before the borders were sealed, Tam advised that closing the borders was unwise. This week, Tam nearly backed over herself reversing on the efficacy of wearing masks.
> 
> She is, if nothing else, consistent.
> 
> The CEO of Public Health Ontario, Dr. Peter Donnelly, (now on leave) is no slouch in the being wrong business.
> 
> As the globe teetered on the brink of this pandemic, Donnelly assured the government that Ontario was ready. He said, “we are not complacent, we are working extremely hard on this, but we are quietly confident that we can handle this.”
> 
> That, my friends, is the Healthcrat equivalent of Neville Chamberlain’s infamous declaration of “peace in our time.”
> 
> The recently released (under duress) federal government memos on COVID-19 from January and February starkly reveal the level of hubris in the executive offices of Canada’s Healthcrats.
> 
> The Healthcrats assured the politicians that Canada was ready for a pandemic, blissfully ignoring warnings that would have alerted the crack management team at my local Home Hardware.
> 
> Warnings, such as the 2017 caution from Ontario’s Auditor General that some 26,000 pallets of health-care emergency supplies were about to stale date. Somehow, Canada managed to ship tons of personal protection equipment (PPE) to China in February, putting our health-care workers at risk.
> 
> My local hospital administrators know better. They stopped the planned destruction of some stale dated equipment with the rather pointed observation that masks aren’t milk — they don’t go bad.
> 
> Canada entered this pandemic with no actionable plan, insufficient PPE, woeful capacity to test and monitor and no supply of simple things like hand sanitizer.
> 
> Ontario revealed its COVID-19 modelling last week. It might have been the weakest government slide deck ever.
> 
> The lack of testing makes much of the data, including projections of infection and deaths, irrelevant at best and irresponsible at worst.
> 
> Glaringly missing from the deck is the slide on how many deaths could have been prevented if Ontario and Canada were properly prepared for the pandemic.
> 
> I’m angry. I don’t normally call out the senior public servants who toil for the public. They are good people, often working in bad systems.
> 
> But the public health authorities are, through inaction or incompetence, putting the people in the front lines at risk. PSWs and nurses who care for the elderly without basic face masks. Doctors and hospital administrators who are figuring out how to balance needs on the front line with non-existent or insufficient testing. It is an outrage.
> 
> This week, Ontario Premier Doug Ford said enough is enough. He ordered the Healthcrats to cut the BS and start testing for COVID-19.
> 
> Ford might have signalled the end of the reign of the Healthcrats. It’s time for better judgment and straight talk.
> 
> Because, if anything on this file is predictable, the public health authorities will continue to be certain, even when they are wrong. And the cure they prescribe will be much worse than the disease.


https://torontosun.com/opinion/colu...hcrats-cure-is-proving-worse-than-the-disease


----------



## eMacMan

Beyond the obliteration of civil rights, the bums in charge are ignoring some very important parts of the equation.

Unemployment increases death. Whether you believe a 1% increase in unemploment will cause 500 or 5000 deaths in Canada, it is clear that just the deaths from ratcheting unemployment up by 20% will cause more deaths than the very worst covid can do. More importantly stress alone has harmful effects on our health up to and including premature death. The response is specifically designed to increase stress levels. IOW the bums who created these 'solutions' are deliberately trying to kill us.

Flattening the curve does not save lives it simply prolongs the period of civil rights obliteration, until the tyrants can generate the next falling sky threat.

It's not social distancing, it's social demonization and/or social oppression. My wife and I were told to stand 6 feet apart when outside waiting in line to get into the grocery store. This in a town with 0 cases to date. Wife read the Staßi thug the riot act. It's truly amazing how 120 pounds of female fury can make a 200 pound man cringe.

Masking up will probably do little to nothing to stop the virus spreading. Been described as trying to keep out mosquitoes by closing a gate. It's only intent is to dehumanize us. The reason so many Asians wear masks is related to smog. Masks can and do keep most of the harmful pollutants out of their lungs.


----------



## Beej

eMacMan said:


> IOW the bums who created these 'solutions' are deliberately trying to kill us.


As likely as the bums who downplayed this well into late March were deliberately trying to kill us, and a few holdouts are still trying, by that line of reasoning. I don't agree with that line of reasoning, but you're welcome to it.


----------



## Macfury

From the Chinese embassy in the UK:



> Last week, The Mail on Sunday carried an article propagating *a groundless theory that links the origin of Covid-19 to a lab in Wuhan.
> 
> The article also discredits China’s effective efforts in combating Covid-19 and promoting international co-operation.*
> 
> There has been no scientific or medical conclusion yet on the origin of Covid-19, as relevant tracing work is still under way.
> 
> *The World Health Organisation has made repeated statements that what the world is experiencing now is a global phenomenon, the source is undetermined, the focus should be on containment and any stigmatising language referring to certain places must be avoided.*
> 
> The name Covid-19 was chosen by the WHO for the purpose of making no connections between the virus and certain places or countries.


If China's chief lackey at the WHO continues to carry water for them, he must be doing it because they're right. Who are we to doubt him? 

This misguided PR effort is embarrassing.


----------



## FeXL

An unprepared Lieberal? Shocka...

Trudeau government unprepared for pandemic despite repeated warnings



> The Public Health Agency of Canada, which was created to prepare for a pandemic, has been accused of being entirely unprepared for coronavirus, according to Blacklock's Reporter.
> 
> Not only did they fail to stockpile useful medical equipment—which they were repeatedly warned to do—but they also receive $675 million from the taxpayer every year to do so.


Related:

Doctors “feel betrayed” by federal government’s lack of pandemic preparedness



> Doctors and nurses across Canada are facing a shortage of medical supplies, including masks, goggles and face shields, according to Blacklock’s Reporter.
> 
> The Public Health Agency was “caught flat-footed,” according to President of the Canadian Medical Association Dr. Sandy Buchman, despite the agency being created to respond in a pandemic.


But, but, but...TRUMP!!!

Related, too:

Three words that clearly & succinctly describe every Lieberal politician in this country.

The Canadian Way of Dealing with a Pandemic: Ineffective, Clueless, and Dishonest



> Canada, not so much. The country’s dilettante leader, who has no viable answer to the crisis, is not so embattled. The lying press, luxuriating in the prime minister’s $600-million bribe, is almost universally on his side, and his inept and intellectually challenged ministers are ritually lionized. 600 mil clearly helps you get your priorities straight. The sheer amateurism of this government is evident in its policy initiatives.


—

'Course not! The decision's long been made to let the bastards in!

Trudeau claims Huawei mask donations won’t influence 5G decision



> During Tuesday’s daily coronavirus briefing, Trudeau was asked about a Globe and Mail report that revealed the Chinese company was sending millions of masks Canada as Canada’s essential medical supplies dwindle.
> 
> “We are not expecting these donations to have any impact on our decisions. In fact, they will not affect our decisions on any issues,” said Trudeau in French.


—

Meme nails it.

‘Planking the curve’: Experts caution Canada is still far from halting COVID-19



> After weeks of staying home, avoiding public spaces and closing non-essential businesses, Canadians are left wondering: is Canada flattening the curve?


—

No argument. We've got out own batch of Commie apologists up here in the Great White North.

‘You’re A Disgrace’: Sen. Josh Hawley Calls For Purging WHO Of Communist ‘Collaborators’



> Republican Missouri Sen. Josh Hawley sharply criticized the World Health Organization (WHO) Wednesday on Twitter, accusing its leader of collaborating with the Chinese Communist Party.


—

What we actually need is an _informed_ opinion.

No offence Dr. Tam, but Canadians need a second opinion



> It’s pretty common to seek a second opinion whenever a doctor delivers some really bad news. Maybe that’s what Canadians need to do after Dr. Theresa Tam has prescribed the nation strict social distancing measures that will continue through the summer and perhaps even go into the beginning of the fall.
> 
> You know what that means: No sports. No patio season. No family camping trips. Kiss the summer of 2020 goodbye, Canada.


—

Umm, uh, oh, uh, ah, I, me-me-me, ummm, ah...HARPER!!!

Head of Canadian Medical Association pushes Ottawa to explain lack of preparation ahead of pandemic’s arrival



> The head of the organization representing Canada’s doctors says the health care system was “not prepared” for the current pandemic, and doesn’t see why the federal government doesn’t fully acknowledge the weaknesses exposed by the COVID-19 crisis.
> 
> “I am trying to understand the government’s response today because I think everyone was caught flat-footed," said Sandy Buchman, president of the Canadian Medical Association. “The front line is telling us over and over that they are not prepared and they are scared. We are hearing it from everywhere.”


—

Told ya...

Trudeau Politicizes Virus Response, Falsely Blames Conservatives For Liberal-Caused Delays



> Liberal wage subsidy legislation was so poorly written that it had to be corrected. Now, Trudeau is trying to blame the Conservatives for the failure of the Liberal government to get it right the first time.


Again, the meme nails it.

—

Shocka...

COVID-19 Reveals the True Nature of Muslim 'Charity': Help Their Own, Hate Everyone Else



> Enter _zakat_, which is often—but erroneously—translated as “charity.” As with virtually everything else Islamic, it too discriminates, sees only in dichotomies, namely “us” (Muslims) and “them” (infidels).
> 
> As usual, Pakistan—so named to mean the “land of the pure [i.e., Muslims]”—offers ample precedents.


—

I'm sorry...is that _Progressive_ Chicago?

Chicago mayor says blacks are dying at alarming rate because of a myth about coronavirus



> "There's a myth in black Chicago that black folks can't get coronavirus," she explained, "and we are doing everything we can to disabuse people of that notion."


Perhaps if they had stayed in school, rather than gone out, bought a gun, became gang members & started shooting each other...

—

Prog heads exploding.

In the Face of a Real Crisis, Transgender Activism Is 'Elective' and 'Non-Essential'



> Over the past five years, Democrats and liberals have leaped over one another to champion the transgender movement, pronoun silliness included. President Obama tried to redefine "sex" in federal law to refer to gender identity, not biological sex. Democrats in the 2020 election cycle rushed to champion transgender activism, with Julian Castro pandering himself into insanity, Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) posting her preferred pronouns, and Joe Biden calling trans activism "the civil rights issue of our time." Left-leaning news outlets like The New York Times demonized President Donald Trump's military policy as "erasing" people.
> 
> *Yet amid the coronavirus crisis, Democrats and the legacy media have proven surprisingly hesitant to push the transgender talking points. Those who would constantly warn about how this or that "crisis" hits transgender people hardest are strangely silent on the issue now.*


Bold mine.

Curious, that...

—

As in, "Kiss my hairy, unwashed, ass..."

Premiers say no to Trudeau on Emergencies Act



> We appreciate your help but don’t need you running the whole show.
> 
> That’s the message from Canada’s premiers to the PM as the fight against COVID-19 continues.


—

But the left has no issues with being tracked.

Canada looking to prepare 'surge' force, use cellphone data to contain COVID-19



> Apple and Google working on system that could allow users to see if they've crossed paths with a person infected with COVID-19


Related:

Authoritarians are getting everything they want because of the coronavirus crisis



> On Friday, America’s top virus doctor seemingly endorsed the idea of “Americans carrying certificates of immunity to prove they have tested positive for coronavirus antibodies.” Dr. Anthony Fauci also recently floated the idea of doing away with the custom of handshakes after the coronavirus outbreak is over. In a world where all things were even, he wouldn’t have a say on which social customs we decide to practice. And he shouldn’t.


Time to flog Fauci...

—

Once again, if it wasn't for double standards...

Hypocrite Gun Owner Alyssa Milano Demands Americans Stop Buying Guns During Pandemic



> Alyssa Milano apparently has a contractual obligation to look like a moron every couple of days.
> 
> The _Charmed_ actress, who days ago dismissed sexaul assualt allegations against Dem fave Joe Biden a year-and-a-half after slandering Justicice Kavanaugh over laughable sexual assault allegations, posted a video to Twitter of her decrying the high amount of gun sales during the pandemic. It was, she said, a “dangerous” trend.


—

Which is precisely why Der Gropenfurher wants to bring in the Emergency Act. Complete & utter control. He who has the gold makes the rules...

More than a million Canadians believe they are on verge of bankruptcy, new poll suggests



> More than a million Canadians believe they are on the verge of having to declare bankruptcy, according to the findings of a new poll released Thursday.
> 
> The survey conducted by DART & maru/Blue found an even larger group — 4.2 million Canadian adults — said they consider themselves to be heading towards bankruptcy over the next three months unless their personal financial conditions improve.


—

No surprise to anyone paying attention.

‘Worst Cover-Up In Human History’: Rep. McCaul Says China And WHO Are ‘Co-Conspirators’ On Coronavirus



> Republican Texas Rep. Mike McCaul on Friday said that the World Health Organization (WHO) and China are working together in a cover-up for allegedly not releasing information about the disease when before the massive outbreak.


—

Your Government Is Here For You



> As Health Canada drags its heels on 15-minute tests manufactured in North America and in use world-wide;
> 
> A shipment of more than 100,000 testing swabs arrived in Ontario contaminated and unusable, the Star has learned, illustrating how even as the province strives to expand its COVID-19 lab-testing capacity it is still contending with global supply-chain havoc wrought by the pandemic.
> 
> The shipment of much-needed swabs, a critical component of the testing, was the first instalment of a big order procured by the federal government, with hundreds of thousands of more from the contaminated batch on the way. The contamination is believed to be mould.


Any bets where they came from?

—

There's a surprise...

Dem Gov Who Has Banned Hydroxychloroquine, Has Been Caught Hoarding It



> This is so typical for those on the left.
> 
> Nevada Governor Steve Sisolak has a lot of explaining to do after it has been discovered that after banning hydroxychloroquine, making it illegal for Doctors to use it to treat COVID-19 patients, his administration has been hoarding it.
> 
> The Governor banned the drug because of his hatred for President Trump however, he claimed it was so hoarders would not stockpile the medicine cause a shortage for patients who have been prescribed the drug for Lupus and other medical conditions. What the governor did was restrict the drug for the public use but, allow the Nevada Department of Corrections to stockpile it for prisoners.


----------



## eMacMan

He's got some good points, especially about unrelated deaths being deliberately mislabeled as Corona.


FWIW our local hospital is almost empty thanks to the Kenney crippling rural hospitals and Docs.



[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xjnFzpmzaA[/ame]


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> FWIW our local hospital is almost empty thanks to the Kenney crippling rural hospitals and Docs.


It would strike me that it's good for the hospital to be empty.


----------



## FeXL

Oh Look! Another International Organization That Is Just As Dysfunctional As The UN!



> Taiwan Releases Email Showing They Warned the WHO in December About Virus, Were Ignored
> 
> *Apparently, Taiwan sent an email in December to the WHO warning them about the occurrence of a new disease in China and asking for more information. That information being investigated that early in the game could have saved tens of thousands of lives. Instead, Taiwan was ignored.*
> 
> Remember, by mid-January, despite these warnings, the WHO was still insisting that there was no evidence of human-to-human transmission. They hadn’t pushed China or sounded the alarm at all, instead letting the communist nation essentially write the press releases being put out. Even when it became clear China had lied and covered up the outbreak, the WHO still accepted their information as fact, something they are continuing to do to this day.​


Bold mine.

Nice.

And our Lieberal politicians are sourcing the WHO as some sort of experts?

HA!!! tptptptp


----------



## Beej

Singh calls for universal access to CERB
https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/singh-calls-for-universal-access-to-cerb-1.4892157


> But the NDP leader says Trudeau could go even farther and drop all criteria to ensure all those who need help can apply.


If there's no criteria, then everybody "needs" it.

This could work with a clawback over the next few tax years, just to make sure everyone has enough cash in April/May, but a "need" based program without criteria is stupid.

The current program appears to be working.
Coronavirus: Nearly 5.4M Canadians now receiving federal emergency aid
https://globalnews.ca/news/6811658/coronavirus-restaurant-tourism-support/


----------



## Macfury

How about that disgraceful Fauci pretending that he warned the US about the dangers of coronavirus early in the year, when on January 26, he was actually saying:



> The American people should not be worried or frightened by coronavirus. This is a very, very low risk to the United States.


Or this on February 17:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...inuscule-skip-mask-and-wash-hands/4787209002/


----------



## Beej

Alberta to share surplus ventilators, masks and gloves with Ontario, Quebec and B.C.
https://nationalpost.com/pmn/news-p...-masks-and-gloves-with-ontario-quebec-and-b-c


> Premier Jason Kenney says Alberta has more than enough protective masks, gloves and ventilators for its own COVID-19 needs, so it’s sharing some of its surplus with provinces in more dire need.


A good news story, although I would have waited a couple days for data to come in after Alberta testing ramps back up.

It also highlights an important point that many journalists miss -- provinces are primarily responsible for preparing their healthcare systems, not the federal government.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> How about that disgraceful Fauci pretending that he warned the US about the dangers of coronavirus early in the year, when on January 26, he was actually saying:
> 
> 
> 
> Or this on February 17:
> 
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...inuscule-skip-mask-and-wash-hands/4787209002/


The national post recently ran a lengthy article on the U.S. response which you may want to read, but I can't find it now. Maybe I have the wrong paper.

Edit: My mistake, it was on the UK. Still worth reading.
https://nationalpost.com/pmn/health...virus-but-they-were-slow-to-sound-the-alarm-2


----------



## Beej

U.S. data on corona virus hospitalizations and underlying conditions
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6915e3.htm?s_cid=mm6915e3_w

The sample is small, but the top two underlying conditions are hypertension and obesity. So, almost everyone in fat nations with bad diets has an underlying condition. 

Also, cats can get it
https://science.sciencemag.org/content/sci/early/2020/04/07/science.abb7015.full.pdf

Our economy can be run by children, fit people, and dogs. We'll be fine.


----------



## FeXL

Beej said:


> If there's no criteria, then everybody "needs" it


He just wants it on the record that the Commies figger every swinging dick sauntering up Roxham Rd is entitled to free cash.

As opposed to, say, small business crooks, I mean, peoplekind...


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> U.S. data on corona virus hospitalizations and underlying conditions
> https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6915e3.htm?s_cid=mm6915e3_w
> 
> The sample is small, but the top two underlying conditions are hypertension and obesity. So, almost everyone in fat nations with bad diets has an underlying condition.
> 
> Also, cats can get it
> https://science.sciencemag.org/content/sci/early/2020/04/07/science.abb7015.full.pdf
> 
> Our economy can be run by children, fit people, and dogs. We'll be fine.


The media carelessly refers to diabetes as a risk factor, but rarely points out that insulin-dependent diabetes is not a problem -- only Type 2 is.


----------



## SINC

*Italy And Spain Ease Lockdown Restrictions As The U.S. Watches For Repercussions*



> Topline: As President Donald Trump weighs “the biggest decision of [his] life” in determining when to reopen the U.S. economy and ease social distancing measures amid the coronavirus outbreak, the governments of Italy and Spain have taken tentative steps this week to send certain workers back to their jobs and allow some shops to reopen, an important indication that the world might be beginning to move past life under shutdown.
> 
> In Spain, thousands of construction and factory workers returned to work this morning.
> 
> The majority of the country is still under stringent lockdown measures, however, and schools and nonessential businesses like retail stores and restaurants are still closed; more than 17,000 people have died in Spain as a result of the virus.
> 
> Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez said Sunday that the decision to restart certain parts of the economy was undertaken after consulting scientific experts, and that any further easing would depend on the country’s progress in slowing the virus, according to the The Guardian; Sanchez’s political opponents have criticized the move as an “imprudence.”
> 
> Italy, once the epicenter of the virus in Europe, will also gently ease some lockdown measures tomorrow and allow some shops to reopen; the majority of lockdown restrictions will remain in place until May 3, 2020, however, and factories will remain closed.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/sarahh...e&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark#6aa76eb43124


----------



## chasMac

Beej said:


> ...
> Our economy can be run by children, fit people, and dogs. We'll be fine.


I remember when "fit" meant more than just not fat.


----------



## Macfury

chasMac said:


> I remember when "fit" meant more than just not fat.


Essentially, the guy in the comic book ads, chiding people for being 98-lb. weaklings.


----------



## chasMac

Macfury said:


> Essentially, the guy in the comic book ads, chiding people for being 98-lb. weaklings.


Those ads are from a time when 40% of North Americans were not clinically obese.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> The media carelessly refers to diabetes as a risk factor, but rarely points out that insulin-dependent diabetes is not a problem -- only Type 2 is.


If blood sugars are well controlled and there are no other (un)related risk factors such as compromised lungs or heart, then T2s are no more at risk than the general population.


----------



## Macfury

chasMac said:


> Those ads are from a time when 40% of North Americans were not clinically obese.


Yup. In most cases, the people reading a comic book would be much better off as Mac, the guy who is kicking himself for being "skinny."


----------



## chasMac

Just came back from Wal-Mart and was called out for going the wrong way down an aisle. This is a law now? If I ignore it what happens? Dirty looks? Time for civil disobedience is nearly upon us.


----------



## Macfury

chasMac said:


> Just came back from Wal-Mart and was called out for going the wrong way down an aisle. This is a law now? If I ignore it what happens? Dirty looks? Time for civil disobedience is nearly upon us.


Don't you know that walking the wrong way down an aisle can get you infected? COVID-19 travels east to west or north to south, so you could walk into a herd of it face first.


----------



## chasMac

If the virus remains immobile in the air for 72 hours or whatever, were screwed regardless of social distancing or aisle-travel.


----------



## CubaMark

A video that may be of interest - Dr. Paul Offit, who has all the right credentials to be discussing infectious diseases. The interviewer here is rather... unprepared... but Offit is a good communicator. The entire video is worth watching, but I suggest particularly checking in around 14:36, where he discusses the roadmap for a vaccine...

[ame]https://youtu.be/_dIsvjwDxjE?t=878[/ame]


----------



## Macfury

Good video. Thanks for sharing it. Herd immunity will likely prevail before that vaccine is developed. Hopefully some anti-viral drug will beat it to market.



CubaMark said:


> A video that may be of interest - Dr. Paul Offit, who has all the right credentials to be discussing infectious diseases. The interviewer here is rather... unprepared... but Offit is a good communicator. The entire video is worth watching, but I suggest particularly checking in around 14:36, where he discusses the roadmap for a vaccine...
> 
> https://youtu.be/_dIsvjwDxjE?t=878


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> Random links for the morning.
> 
> New Rutgers Saliva Test for Coronavirus Gets FDA Approval: _“It means we no longer have to put health care professionals at risk for infection by performing nasopharyngeal or oropharyngeal collections. We can preserve precious personal protective equipment for use in patient care instead of testing. We can significantly increase the number of people tested each and every day as self-collection of saliva is more quick and scalable than swab collections. All of this combined will have a tremendous impact on testing in New Jersey and across the United States.”_
> 
> Treatment protocols are changing and better outcomes are the result: _“Intubated patients with Covid lung disease are doing very poorly, and while this may be the disease and not the mechanical ventilation, most of us believe that intubation is to be avoided until unequivocally required,”
> _
> Not just America: Public Health Authorities Have Failed America at Every Level
> 
> Speaking of which: _Anthony Fauci Wrong About A Whole Lot_


----------



## CubaMark

Macfury said:


> Hopefully some anti-viral drug will beat it to market.


Various countries are already running trials that include Cuba's Interferon Alfa-2B. If it is proven effective, I wonder if the USA will crack open the trade embargo a smidgen to help its citizens? 

They've already received medical equipment from those other commies that they were once at war with... But will the history of their animosity toward Cuba stand in this case? Small inroads were made with trials for Cuba's lung cancer treatment, but its still not on the market for US patients. The most recent info on that collaboration was recently featured on PBS' Nova.


----------



## CubaMark

Macfury said:


> How about that disgraceful Fauci pretending that he warned the US about the dangers of coronavirus early in the year, when on January 26, he was actually saying:
> 
> 
> 
> Or this on February 17:
> 
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...inuscule-skip-mask-and-wash-hands/4787209002/


Respectfully, I think you're being overly harsh. I just listened to the interview with Fauci, and he absolutely stated the danger of COVID-19 to the USA, and was at that point in time recommending vigilant measures to prevent the spread of the influenza virus, which this winter proved unusually dangerous to children.

Certainly, his message is a helluvalot clearer than Trump's nonsensical ramblings...


----------



## Macfury

Your reputation doesn't come back from "very low danger to the US" and encouraging young people to book tickets on cruise ships.



CubaMark said:


> Respectfully, I think you're being overly harsh. I just listened to the interview with Fauci, and he absolutely stated the danger of COVID-19 to the USA, and was at that point in time recommending vigilant measures to prevent the spread of the


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Your reputation doesn't come back from "very low danger to the US"...


It does if you're a Prog in Canada. Tam's words were almost identical and yet, here we are, Trudles & his motley crew are seen as saviours. Most of the populace is just as brain dead as they are...


----------



## FeXL

Purely Coincidental



> Business Insider;
> 
> As questions persist over the exact origin of the novel coronavirus outbreak, newly reported diplomatic cables show that US officials sounded the alarm about possible safety breaches at a Wuhan lab studying coronaviruses in animals.
> 
> In the cables, obtained by Washington Post national security columnist Josh Rogin, US officials raised concerns about safety issues at the Wuhan Institute of Virology in 2018, two years before the novel coronavirus outbreak.
> 
> The lab, which holds a level four biosafety research certification, the highest possible rating, was conducting research on coronaviruses in bats.
> 
> After multiple visits to the lab from a US diplomat in Wuhan and a science diplomat at the US Embassy in Beijing in early 2018, the officials were concerned about safety issues with the lab’s research, they sent two “sensitive but unclassified” cables back to Washington, DC sounding the alarm and asking for assistance to help the lab tighten its safety protocols.​
> More: Josh Rogin with Steve Bannon


Interesting...

Related:

U.S. government gave $3.7million grant to Wuhan lab at center of coronavirus leak scrutiny that was performing experiments on bats from the caves where the disease is believed to have originated



> The Chinese laboratory at the center of scrutiny over a potential coronavirus leak has been using U.S. government money to carry out research on bats from the caves which scientists believe are the original source of the deadly outbreak.
> 
> The Wuhan Institute of Virology undertook coronavirus experiments on mammals captured more than 1,000 miles away in Yunnan which were funded by a $3.7 million grant from the US government.
> 
> Sequencing of the COVID-19 genome has traced it back to bats found in Yunnan caves but it was first thought to have transferred to humans at an animal market in Wuhan.
> 
> The revelation that the Wuhan Institute was experimenting on bats from the area already known to be the source of COVID-19 - and doing so with American money - has sparked further fears that the lab, and not the market, is the original outbreak source.


----------



## FeXL

Watershed Moment: NBC Reports ZERO New Cases of Coronavirus in New York on Tuesday



> New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo appeared on _MSNBC_’s “Morning Joe” to discuss the latest news out of his state. The Daily Caller’s Virginia Kruta reports that, as the Governor was speaking, “the numbers flashed on the screen then, attributed to NBC News: 196,583 CASES, 10,056 DEATHS, NO NEW CASES REPORTED TODAY.”


----------



## FeXL

When you've lost Bill Maher...

China’s desperate attempt to erase its connection to the Wuhan coronavirus is not going well



> “Real Time” host Bill Maher slammed the “PC police” Friday night for overreacting to the “Chinese virus” labeling controversy.
> 
> …*Maher mocked the complainers, listing several other illnesses that are named after their locations of origin — such as the West Nile virus, Spanish flu and MERS (Middle East Respiratory Syndrome)*.
> 
> “You can’t yell at someone for breaking a rule you just made up,” he said, adding, “So why should China get a pass?”​


Bold mine.

As I asked The Bigot a few weeks back, "Is _Chinese Food_ racist?"


----------



## FeXL

WHO’S Your Daddy?



> ACCOUNTABILITY: Trump Halts Funding to WHO Pending Review of Agency’s Handling of Coronavirus Pandemic
> 
> More.
> 
> The facts regarding Taiwan’s email to alert WHO to possible danger of #COVID19#email內容 #TaiwanCanHelp #TaiwanIsHelping @WHO
> 
> 英文新聞稿：https://t.co/AvyHulhrlU pic.twitter.com/nYvmY4R2ao
> 
> — MOHW of Taiwan (@MOHW_Taiwan) April 11, 2020​
> Related.


:clap::clap::clap:

Related:

WHO official says she suspected human-to-human transmission ‘right from the start’ — but the WHO repeated China’s lies for weeks saying the opposite



> A World Heath Organization official said that she suspected human-to-human transmission of the coronavirus "right from the start," a claim that runs counter to the guidance that the organization was giving to the rest of the world during the early moments of the pandemic.
> 
> The WHO has been heavily criticized by the Trump administration and others for repeating China's lies since the start of the pandemic as the Chinese Communist Party attempted to cover up the extent of the outbreak.
> 
> "Right from the start, from the first notification we received on the 31st of December, given that this was a cluster of pneumonia — I'm a MERS specialist, so my background is in coronaviruses and influenza — so immediately thought, given that this is a respiratory pathogen, that of course there may be human-to-human transmission," Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove said Monday during a WHO press briefing.


At best, this is CYA mode. At worst, the WHO is responsible for thousands of deaths... XX)

Related, too:

Your Government Is Here Coming For You



> *From the people who advised that risk remains low, flights are being screened, and masks don’t work;*
> 
> The federal government is considering introducing legislation to make it an offence to knowingly spread misinformation that could harm people, says Privy Council President Dominic LeBlanc.
> 
> LeBlanc told CBC News he is interested in British MP Damian Collins’s call for laws to punish those responsible for spreading dangerous misinformation online about the COVID-19 pandemic.
> 
> LeBlanc said he has discussed the matter already with other cabinet ministers, including Justice Minister David Lametti. If the government decides to follow through, he said, it could take a while to draft legislation.​


Bold mine.

Are these idiots really that stupid?


----------



## FeXL

Purely Coincidental



> Business Insider;
> 
> As questions persist over the exact origin of the novel coronavirus outbreak, newly reported diplomatic cables show that US officials sounded the alarm about possible safety breaches at a Wuhan lab studying coronaviruses in animals.
> 
> In the cables, obtained by Washington Post national security columnist Josh Rogin, US officials raised concerns about safety issues at the Wuhan Institute of Virology in 2018, two years before the novel coronavirus outbreak.
> 
> The lab, which holds a level four biosafety research certification, the highest possible rating, was conducting research on coronaviruses in bats.
> 
> After multiple visits to the lab from a US diplomat in Wuhan and a science diplomat at the US Embassy in Beijing in early 2018, the officials were concerned about safety issues with the lab’s research, they sent two “sensitive but unclassified” cables back to Washington, DC sounding the alarm and asking for assistance to help the lab tighten its safety protocols.​
> More: Josh Rogin with Steve Bannon


----------



## FeXL

Coronavirus a ‘failure of early warning’ for Canada, intelligence expert says



> It was last on a list of eight threat scenarios, but the danger of a global pandemic made the cut when the Liberal government issued a national security policy in 2004.
> 
> With the then-recent SARS outbreak in mind, the government said it would integrate its approach to public health emergencies with its national security agenda, including when drafting threat assessments.
> 
> The promise wasn’t fulfilled, leaving Canada woefully exposed during the COVID-19 crisis, says security-and-intelligence expert Wesley Wark.


Yet Trudles crawled out from under his bed at the cottage every morning for 30 days of his 14 day isolation, saw his shadow & proclaimed he had a handle on things.

—

What happened to Canada’s $300M pandemic stockpile? Agency admits “failure”

I'd read somewhere that the reason Das Gropenfuhrer sent 16 tonnes of medical gear to the Commies was that it was at or near the expiration date. I have a question: Which is worse? Dated gear or no gear?

—

Trudeau government needs to stop taking COVID orders from WHO



> Some days it really does feel like Canada has farmed out its entire health policy during this COVID-19 crisis to the World Health Organization.
> 
> From the early days, answers to questions on testing, on the spread of the virus, on approving treatments or even rapid testing, have been to cite what the WHO recommends.
> 
> That is nothing short of a dereliction of duty by Canada’s top health officials.


But not unexpected behaviour from those who cannot think for themselves...

—

VICTIM!!!

How Racist is COVID-19?



> For the “structural racism” evangelists of the left, nobody bears responsibility for anything, and all problems of black people are due to moral lapses by those repressive people of no color. To say the least, this overlooks some key realities.
> 
> The cities where this disproportion attack is going on are ruled by Democrat Party mayors such as Tom Barrett of Milwaukee and Mike Duggan of Detroit. Also missing from the analysis are Democrats’ massive anti-poverty programs such as Lyndon Johnson’s Great Society and vaunted War on Poverty. Since the 1960s these programs spent countless billions, a strange action for a system of structural racism, which apparently endured for eight years during the administrations of a African American president.


—

Asshole.

Trudeau's cottage visit mocks us and the rules he sets



> Justin Trudeau showed once again on Easter weekend that he doesn’t play by the same rules as everyone else, not even the rules he tell us to follow.
> 
> It was just last Friday that the PM was telling the whole country during his daily address that you couldn’t go see family for Easter.
> 
> “This weekend is going to be very different. You’ll have to stay home. You’ll have to Skype that big family dinner and the Easter egg hunt,” Trudeau said, standing outside of Rideau Cottage on the grounds of Rideau Hall in Ottawa.
> 
> That statement was followed up by this one.
> 
> “During the long weekend, we will all have to stay home. We cannot have gatherings for dinner and we’ll have to be creative to organize an Easter egg hunt inside the house,” Trudeau said.
> 
> So what did he do this weekend?
> 
> He got in his motorcade, with his full entourage, on Saturday afternoon and drove to the PM’s summer residence at Harrington Lake.


—

Poilievre slams Trudeau for allowing Chinese tourists into Canada during pandemic



> The Conservative Finance Critic Pierre Poilievre criticized the Trudeau government's handling of the coronavirus outbreak today, effectively accusing them of negligence.
> 
> Poilievre seemed astonished at the Trudeau Liberal's initial response to the outbreak, particularly by how they continued to allow people from affected regions enter Canada.
> 
> "When somebody comes to this country and they have a legitimate reason to enter, they have to be tested immediately. We can't let people come into this country from abroad, without being tested, and then go out and spread the disease far and wide," said Poillievre.
> 
> "That was the mistake the government of Canada made in the first place when they allowed 2,000 people from the Hubei province to come to Canada after January 22; after they had been briefed by military intelligence that the outbreak was dangerous and massive."


Can't restrict all those Lieberal voters from coming in!

—

Growing fear you can catch Covid-19 more than once as patients who’ve recovered start to test positive again



> For those who have already been infected with Covid-19, the idea of having an immunity certificate to allow a return to normal life sounds like an attractive prospect.
> 
> The proposal, put forward by Health Secretary Matt Hancock earlier this month, is based on the theory that having the virus and beating it means we have developed antibodies to fight it, and these remain in our bodies for life should we be exposed to the virus again.
> 
> However, new evidence about the behaviour of the virus has cast doubt on the plan, as it suggests people infected by it may not be protected from catching it again.


----------



## FeXL

'Greatest fear': Chicago hides names of released prisoners from police



> Cook County, home of Chicago, released hundreds of inmates from its jails during the coronavirus crisis. But good luck trying to find out who is back on the streets or what crimes they are accused of committing.
> 
> The prosecutors and public defenders, who handle the cases in special COVID-19 court hearings, keep a close hold on the information and refuse to share it with the public or other law enforcement agencies.
> 
> The Cook County Sheriff’s Office that runs the jail says it doesn’t know who was released because of the coronavirus.


So, what's the long term plan here? After the coronavirus runs out, are these erstwhile inmates going to be rounded up & thrown back in jail? Or are they going to be free to rob, rape & kill again?


----------



## FeXL

‘Perilously Close To The Edge’: World’s Largest Pork Processor Closes A US Plant, Warns Of ‘Severe’ Meat Shortages



> A China-owned pork processor announced Sunday that it’s shutting down a South Dakota plant indefinitely after employees were infected with coronavirus, noting that the nation’s grocers are under severe stress.
> 
> Smithfield Foods announced the shutdown as government officials keep lockdowns in place across the country amid an ebbing coronavirus pandemic, which has killed more than 20,000 people in the United States. China’s WH Group purchased the company in 2013 for $4.7 billion.


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu: Good News



> CNBC;
> 
> Gilead Sciences shares surged by more than 15% in after-hours trading Thursday after details leaked of a closely watched clinical trial of the company’s antiviral drug Remdesivir, showing what appears to be promising results in treating Covid-19.
> 
> The University of Chicago’s phase 3 drug trial found that most of its patients had “rapid recoveries in fever and respiratory symptoms” and were discharged in less than a week, health-care publication STAT News reported.
> 
> “The best news is that most of our patients have already been discharged, which is great. We’ve only had two patients perish,” University of Chicago infectious disease specialist Kathleen Mullane said, according to STAT News, which obtained a video of her remarks.​
> Related: Dow futures rip 800 points
> 
> Update: Trump Announces 3-Phase Guidelines for Governors to Reopen States


----------



## FeXL

I'd like to see a list of those doctors and where they were from...

World Health Organization Stopped Medical Experts from Recommending Coronavirus Travel Bans



> A report by Australia’s Sky News revealed that on January 30, WHO bureaucrats met with a group of doctors and medical experts to discuss a response to the coronavirus, which at the time was spreading from Wuhan, China, to nations like the United States, Italy, Iran, and South Korea. The report is based on the meeting’s official records.
> 
> The WHO bureaucrats met with the experts in Geneva, Switzerland, and successfully stopped them from suggesting travel bans as a life-saving solution to stop the spread of the coronavirus.


—

The reality about food and drug shortages in Canada due to COVID-19



> The government has focused on ensuring that Canadians have the means to buy groceries, it has been slower at ensuring there is food on the shelves
> John Ivison


—


Trump Is Right to Dump the WHO



> President Donald Trump's announcement that the United States would temporarily cut off funding to the World Health Organization prompted the usual outrage from the commentariat. Bill Gates called defunding "as dangerous as it sounds." CNN chief grandstander Jim Acosta, in a line echoed by many other mainstream reporters, accused the president of making the WHO yet another "scapegoat" for his failure to respond adequately to the virus.
> 
> The president's move is not about shifting blame or making it harder to fight the coronavirus. Rather, it is about tackling the current public health crisis head on by putting the screws to an organization that has actively made the situation worse.


—

~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!

Frankly, I'm surprised MotherCorpse had the stones to ask the question...

Experts criticize Ottawa for destroying millions of N95 masks



> A CBC investigation has revealed the government of Canada threw out two million N95 masks and 440,000 medical gloves when it shut down an emergency stockpile warehouse in Regina last year.
> 
> In an email to CBC, a spokesperson for the Public Health Agency of Canada, which oversees the stockpile, said the masks and gloves had been purchased in 2009 and “had passed the limit of five years for their use, as recommended by the manufacturer.” The masks expired in 2014.


Once again, I ask: What's worse? No masks or dated masks?

—

Anybody with more than two brain cells to rub together isn't...

Canada ‘disappointed’ in U.S. move to freeze funding for World Health Organization says Minister of Giving Your Money To ****hole States



> A Canadian government minister says Ottawa is disappointed that U.S. President Donald Trump has frozen U.S. funding to the World Health Organization after accusing it of mismanaging the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> Karina Gould, Canada’s International Development Minister, said the move was disheartening.
> 
> “Of course we’re disappointed because now more than ever a co-ordinated global response based on science and accurate data is essential,” the minister said in an interview.
> 
> _Accurate data essential? You weren’t getting that from WHO you stupid twit._


Personally, I'd have used a different vowel in that noun...

—

Curious, that...

Flashback: WHO's Tedros was accused of covering up cholera outbreaks in Ethiopia



> The director-general of the World Health Organization had been accused of covering up three cholera epidemics that occurred in Ethiopia while he was the health minister.


—

Three coronavirus whistle-blowers remain missing two months after exposing the true scale of the outbreak from Wuhan




> Three whistle-blowers who tried to inform the world about the true scale of the coronavirus outbreak in Wuhan are still missing two months after vanishing from the public sight.
> 
> The whereabouts of Chen Qiushi, Fang Bing and Li Zehua have been a mystery since February, and Chinese officials have not publicly commented on them.
> 
> The three citizen journalists had sought to expose the true scale of the outbreak from the then epicentre by uploading videos to YouTube and Twitter, both banned in mainland China.
> 
> All of their dispatches revealed a grim side of Wuhan unseen on state-run Chinese media outlets.


—

Prog heads exploding. :lmao::lmao::lmao:

'In Trump We Trust': Treasury Adds President's Name to Stimulus Checks



> In a move that is already making liberals heads explode, the Treasury Department has added Donald Trump's name to the 70 million stimulus checks that will be sent to Americans starting this week.
> 
> That's 70 million grateful voters if you're interested in that sort of thing.


—

~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!

Trudeau Liberals will continue to issue permits to foreign workers while Canada's unemployment skyrockets



> The Department of Employment said yesterday that it will continue to issue permits to foreign workers during this global pandemic, while Canada's unemployment rate at the highest it has been in decades, _Blacklock's_ reports.


You simply cannot fix stupid.

—


Federal health committee again calls on WHO advisor to testify amid concerns over false Chinese data



> A Parliamentary health committee on Wednesday repeated calls for the World Health Organization to explain its handling of the pandemic, amid mounting criticism that the United Nations’ agency relayed faulty Chinese data about the coronavirus that causes the COVID-19 disease.


—

Kenney's criticism of Dr. Tam is well deserved



> Alberta Premier Jason Kenney’s recent criticism of Canada’s top physician, Dr. Theresa Tam, was a much-needed dose of reality during this COVID-19 pandemic.


—

Viva Transgendered Colombians!



> Bogota, Colombia has implemented an interesting policy of restrictions about going outside:
> 1 – Men can go outside on odd numbered days
> 2 – Women can go outside on even number days
> 3 – Transgender people can go outside on those days that they identify with the gender for that day
> 
> More here


—

Israeli Professor: It Doesn't Matter If You Have Strict Social Distancing or None, Coronavirus Follows the Exact Same Pattern in All Countries



> He says that imposing strict shutdowns like the US and no shutdown at all, as Sweden does, produces the exact same "curve."
> 
> None of this bull**** matters, his models say.


—

Wuhan Flu: China Lied, People Died



> China didn’t warn public of likely pandemic for 6 key days
> 
> In the six days after top Chinese officials secretly determined they likely were facing a pandemic from a new coronavirus, the city of Wuhan at the epicenter of the disease hosted a mass banquet for tens of thousands of people; millions began traveling through for Lunar New Year celebrations.
> 
> President Xi Jinping warned the public on the seventh day, Jan. 20. But by that time, more than 3,000 people had been infected during almost a week of public silence, according to internal documents obtained by The Associated Press and expert estimates based on retrospective infection data.
> 
> Six days.​
> ...
> 
> *The US-China trade deal was signed January 15th.*
> 
> More discussion today on War Room.


Bold mine.

—

Wuhan Flu: The Supply Chain Is Not Ok



> Reuters;
> 
> Cargill Ltd has reduced production at one of Canada’s biggest beef-packing plants, the company and the union representing workers there said on Tuesday, after several dozen workers became infected with the new coronavirus.
> 
> The Canadian arm of U.S. agribusiness Cargill temporarily idled its second production shift at High River, Alberta, on Monday, spokesman Daniel Sullivan said.
> 
> It adds to the list of roughly one dozen North American meat plants that have closed temporarily or cut production due to the pandemic.​
> 2 million chickens euthanized in Delaware.


—

~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!

HE REALLY IS THAT STUPID: Justin Trudeau just gave a $828,000 grant to to the Wuhan Institution of Virology.



> As in, the Chinese virus factory that started all this.
> 
> Trudeau just gave them money.
> 
> I wish I were kidding.


—

Canadian snowbird living in car after being turned away at bridge to P.E.I.



> A Canadian snowbird who drove from Florida to Prince Edward Island says he now finds himself living in his car after being turned away by officials at the Confederation Bridge because of COVID-19 restrictions.


—

Laws are for the little people...

To clear up any confusion, not only did Trudeau's Harrington Lake visit clearly break the spirit of the rules around cottage visits, it actually broke the law - Quebec's newly passed ministerial order 2020-13 banning access to the Outaouais region, to be precise.

—

US Now Has High Confidence That Chinese Virus Escaped from a Wuhan Laboratory



> Imagine Trump blaming China!
> 
> EXCLUSIVE: There is increasing confidence that the COVID-19 outbreak likely originated in a Wuhan laboratory, though not as a bioweapon but as part of China's attempt to demonstrate that its efforts to identify and combat viruses are equal to or greater than the capabilities of the United States, multiple sources who have been briefed on the details of early actions by China's government and seen relevant materials tell Fox News.
> 
> This may be the "costliest government cover-up of all time," one of the sources said.​


Related:

REPORT: Coronavirus Came From Wuhan Laboratory, Part Of China Trying To ‘Compete’ With America



> A breaking Fox News report Wednesday claims that according to sources, the coronavirus pandemic currently ravaging the world came from a lab in Wuhan, China, as part of the Chinese effort to medically compete with the U.S.


—

First comment knocks it out of the park.

Chinada



> “Ottawa can’t seem to shake this tendency to flatter”
> 
> Two former diplomats are warning that the Liberal government’s recent silence on China could reinforce the country’s increasingly belligerent actions on the world stage, amid concerns Chinese officials actively misled the World Health Organization during the early stages of the COVID-19 pandemic.
> 
> David Mulroney, who served as Canadian ambassador to China in Beijing between 2009 and 2012, said Ottawa’s “almost humiliating” posture toward China in recent weeks was a missed opportunity to acknowledge the country’s shortcomings during the viral outbreak.
> 
> China has drawn criticism for providing potentially faulty information to the WHO, particularly in the first weeks of the spread of COVID-19, which in turn left world leaders largely ill-prepared for the virus.
> 
> Guy Saint-Jacques, who served as Canada’s envoy to China from 2012 to 2016, said leaders in Canada and elsewhere need to call for a full investigation of the WHO after it uncritically relayed information from Beijing observers claim could be inaccurate.
> 
> He also denounced recent “reprehensible” comments by Health Minister Patty Hajdu, who dismissed claims about faulty Chinese reporting as “conspiracy theories” that originated “on the Internet.”
> 
> Mulroney said the recent silence by Ottawa is part of a long-standing instinct to gloss over Chinese aggressions, largely due to its tendency to retaliate and its growing economic heft. But an unwillingness to acknowledge even the possibility of Chinese misdeeds could sow public distrust.​
> Related: Bob Fife & Co. rip off Sheila Gunn Reid’s story without attribution.
> 
> Ottawa funds COVID-19 research project that is collaborating with Wuhan virus lab – The Globe and Mail https://t.co/aJXyMsjwff
> 
> — Robert Fife (@RobertFife) April 16, 2020​


----------



## FeXL

Why the models will never work...

Wuhan Flu: Rounding Error



> China denies coverup as it simultaneously ups the death count in Wuhan by 50%! The CCP is the laughing stock of the world. #CCPVirus #ChinaLiedPeopleDied #WuhanVirus https://t.co/F7xqIe75n9
> 
> — 😷Kyle Bass😷 (@Jkylebass) April 17, 2020​


Related:

NYC Adds Nearly 4,000 People Who Never Tested Positive To Coronavirus Death Tolls



> New York City added nearly 4,000 people who never tested positive for the coronavirus to its death toll Tuesday, bringing coronavirus-related deaths in the city to around 10,000 people.
> 
> The city decided to add 3,700 people to its death tolls, who they “presumed” to have died from the virus, according to a report from The New York Times. The additions increased the death toll in the U.S. by 17%, according to the Times report, and included people who were suffering from symptoms of the virus, such as intense coughing and a fever.


—

Rex Murphy on COVID-19: The power to censor speech and other great ideas from our Liberal overlords



> If there is one positive thing that can be said about this terrible plague we’re enduring, it is that now and then, it gives the Trudeau government some really, really great ideas.


Is the /sarc really needed here?


----------



## Macfury

The megalomaniacs at WHO now want to aid houses and remove "infectious" family members.

Executive Director at the WHO Health Emergencies Program, Dr. Michael Ryan:



> “In most parts of the world, due to lockdown, most of the transmission that’s actually happening in many countries now is happening in the household, at family level. In some senses, transmission has been taken off the streets and pushed back into family units. Now we need to go and look in families and find those people who may be sick and remove them, and isolate them, in a safe and dignified manner.”


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> _Now we need to go and look in families and find those people who may be sick and remove them, and isolate them, in a safe and dignified manner._


They'd be shown the door at my house, in a very unsafe and undignified manner. Matter of fact, I may not even point them at a door... :lmao::lmao::lmao:


----------



## FeXL

Dr. Theresa Tam: Poster Child of the Peter Principle



> Dr. Theresa Tam is in way over her head. Everyone with even a modicum of objectivity knows it but few have been willing to say it for fear of reflexively getting a called a racist and misogynist. But Alberta Premier Jason Kenney has clearly had enough, as has the Calgary Herald’s Licia Corbella:
> 
> _ We all know what these delays have cost us — more than 1,055 Canadians have died, many more will do so in the weeks to come, our economy has almost completely shut down, children are out of school, people have lost their jobs, others will lose their businesses and homes, public debt that will saddle future generations for decades has ballooned and our inability to visit with loved ones, even when they are on their death beds, is what we all face because Dr. Tam and the WHO failed to act quickly and appropriately on the known evidence.
> 
> As Premier Kenney properly suggested, Dr. Tam’s job is not to swallow the propaganda of totalitarian states obsessed with saving face, but to investigate all of the pertinent information and then recommend policy to protect Canadians._​
> Linked in the article is this excellent March 31, 2020 timeline of Trudeau and Tam’s disastrous politically correct behavior. *Speaking of which, Tam is lucky to be working for a guy who clearly demonstrates the Peter Principle daily*.


Bold mine.

Yeppers. And not just her boss. Most of the damn party...

Many salient comments.


----------



## FeXL

Come Out, Come Out, Wherever You Are



> I have struggled to maintain my composure and my facade of good cheer when I am working out in The Yard of the Federal/State exercise program in our self-imposed and, so far, consensual prison. *But if California is letting felons out of prison so that they can spread their prison viruses and criminal behavior among us while at the same time checking the homeless into free in fancy hotels, then I need to bust out of this jail if only to stock up on some torches and pitchforks.*
> 
> I’m not alone.


Bold mine.

I can find nothing to disagree with...


----------



## FeXL

Study: 50 to 85 Times as Many People May Have Been Exposed to Coronavirus Than Who Have Tested Positive for It, Indicating That the Chinese Flu is Far Less Deadly Than Models Suggest
Plus: Covid Briefing



> Interesting.
> 
> This researchers sought volunteers in Santa Clara County, California, to test their blood for antibodies to coronavirus.
> 
> Under the three scenarios for test performance characteristics, the population prevalence of COVID-19 in Santa Clara ranged from 2.49% (95CI 1.80-3.17%) to 4.16% (2.58-5.70%).
> 
> These prevalence estimates represent a range between 48,000 and 81,000 people infected in Santa Clara County by early April, 50-85-fold more than the number of confirmed cases.
> 
> *Conclusions*
> 
> The population prevalence of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies in Santa Clara County implies that the infection is much more widespread than indicated by the number of confirmed cases. Population prevalence estimates can now be used to calibrate epidemic and mortality projections.​


—

Suddenly the "American intelligence gathering agencies" have credibility?

That said...

Chinese Virus



> Quote: “There is almost unanimous agreement in the American intelligence gathering agencies that the virus … emerged from a lab in Wuhan”.
> 
> Watch this whole thing: pic.twitter.com/xp17mSUQG4
> 
> — Peter J. Hasson (@peterjhasson) April 18, 2020​


----------



## FeXL

Interesting.

Wuhan Flu: Lung Disease Or Blood Disease?



> A new paper out in the Lancet is getting attention.
> 
> Very important study, showing "presence of viral elements within endothelial cells … with evidence of endothelial and inflammatory cell death." This suggests #SARSCoV2 is directly attacking the vasculature, and is much more than a respiratory virus. #COVID19 https://t.co/zhugnVnKVg
> 
> — Dr Zoë Hyde (@DrZoeHyde) April 18, 2020​
> Early medical reaction:
> 
> _This is a huge breakthrough in my opinion. Could explain the myriad of symptoms patients are presenting with, and *why hypertension is the most prevalent comorbidity
> *
> This suggests #SARSCoV2 is directly attacking the vasculature, and is much more than a respiratory virus. #COVID19
> 
> SARS-CoV-2 is not like an ordinary respiratory virus, unfortunately it acts as a ‘deep tissue virus’. It’s bad news for active immunization expectations._


Bold mine.

I was wondering why hypertension was a high risk factor.


----------



## eMacMan

FeXL said:


> Interesting.
> 
> Wuhan Flu: Lung Disease Or Blood Disease?
> 
> Bold mine.
> 
> I was wondering why hypertension was a high risk factor.



Bio engineered perhaps? A likely culprit would be the US, as it seems to target some Asian males as well as blacks.


----------



## CubaMark

Sometimes you can't do anything but shake your head at the sheer stupidity of it all....

Let's start south of the border, in the USA, where Trump has really gone off the rails:

*Trump blasts governors for ‘unreasonable’ coronavirus lockdowns*

And he's taken to his favourite platform to exhort the wingnuts to ever-greater wingnuttery:


(CommonDreams)​
*Further south, in Mexico* the leading news announcer (one cannot in any sense use the word "journalist") on the TV-Azteca national channel, which is owned by right-wing billionaire Ricardo Salinas who is critical of the Lopez Obrador government, is under fire:

_On Friday evening, TV Azteca’s prime time news anchor Javier Alatorre said that the nightly briefings by Deputy Health Minister Hugo Lopez Gatell had become “irrelevant” after a governor said the national death tolls were not up to date.

“We tell you as strongly as possible: Don’t pay attention to Hugo Lopez Gatell,” Alatorre said._
(Bloomberg)​
From my own reading of Mexican national and local news, social media monitoring, and accounts of friends and family in the country, the message to maintain social distancing is moving excruciatingly slowly, and has become ridiculously politicized, with the right-wing political spectrum going hard against public health orders and criticizing the national government. (Of course, when the death toll rises, those same people will criticize Lopez Obrador for not acting swiftly enough and imposing harsh measures for public safety. That's the playbook.)

*And *if we go further, checking in on *Brazil*, the absolutely insane and further-right-than-Trump, President Balsonaro, fired his public health minister after he urged Brazilians practice social distancing to slow the spread of the virus:

*Bolsonaro fires Brazil health minister amid coronavirus pandemic*

Brazil’s President Jair Bolsonaro, whose dismissive stance toward the COVID-19 pandemic has angered many health experts, fired his popular health minister following a series of disagreements over the proper response to contain the virus’ spread in South America’s most populous country.

Luiz Henrique Mandetta, an orthopedist, had garnered support for his handling of the pandemic that included the promotion of broad isolation measures enacted by state governors, even drawing comparisons to Dr. Anthony Fauci, U.S. President Donald Trump’s top virus expert.

His dismissal comes as experts say the peak of the new coronavirus outbreak in Brazil is expected in the coming weeks.

(...)

Bolsonaro, for his part, has repeatedly characterized the virus as a “little flu,” said shutting down the economy would cause more damage than confining only high-risk Brazilians, and touted the yet-unproven efficacy of an anti-malarial drug. *[GEE, Where have we heard this before?]*

(New York Post)​
*As George Takei recently posted:*


----------



## eMacMan

Uh you did know that Corona Virus Czar has officially reduced the predicted carnage by a factor of ten. 

Yep those of us who looked at the stats from Wuhan and Italy were right. The powers that be crashed the economy and put entire nations under house arrest for a bug that is proving no more deadly than a typical flu virus.


----------



## CubaMark

eMacMan said:


> ....a bug that is proving no more deadly than a typical flu virus.


It's much too early to be holding that perspective. 

The fatality rate has varied widely, and scientists are still uncertain as to why that is. This isn't just another influenza virus - it's a novel virus with unpredictable results.

Depending on politicians to make the right call when the scientists are still undecided on the severity of the disease is nonsensical. And among politicians, some are dimmer than others.

A couple of recent articles on the infection / fatality rate and assessments of states' reactions to the virus:

As U.S. coronavirus fatality rate rises to 5 percent, experts are still trying to understand how deadly this virus is

America has suffered great loss before. Here's how we may learn to cope with coronavirus death toll.


----------



## Macfury

I don't believe you're right. 

Who is dying from the coronavirus? Bearing in mind that fatality stats are too high, based on reporting protocols--those who die of almost anything but also have COVID-19 are considered COVID-19 deaths — we have these reports from New York:

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-age-sex-demographics/

If you accept the WHO fatality rate at 3.4% (I'm using a figure from an organization that you might still have faith in) 72% of all New York deaths are among people over age 65. So essentially, fatality rates for those under 65 are at highest 2.4%. Of those people, 80% had known underlying conditions, so for the healthy population under 65, death rates are 0.48%

As random testing takes hold, researchers are finding asymptomatic infected, and asymptomatic recovered as high as 70 times the known cases. In Iceland, a test of 10% of the population showed that half already have the COVID-19 antibody. Even if, very conservatively, that total numbers five times the known cases, the death rate would be less than 0.1% among healthy people under 65. If, like Iceland, the virus has already infected half the population, then death rates fall below 0.01%.

The lesson is obvious. If you are over 65 years of age, or have an underlying condition, sequester yourself. If you are healthy and under 65, want to go back to normal life, and limit your contact with the susceptible group, go back to work. 

If you're simply too frightened to emerge, stay hidden as well. Your participation in economic recovery is not required.



CubaMark said:


> It's much too early to be holding that perspective.


----------



## Beej

Some information on the Netherlands and the corona virus. I have not double-checked the sources.

https://flutrackers.com/forum/forum...31-589-cases-3-601-deaths?p=850476#post850476

Similar to New York City, the deaths are high enough to show up in total death counts (all causes) as an anomaly. The Netherlands has about four times the deaths per capita, due to the virus, of Germany, which tests far more. They're doing better than France, though.

Sweden vs Norway yields similar results (five times the death rate), with Sweden and Netherlands implementing a much lighter set of restrictions than their peers. Decent GDP data will take a while to come in to get a better picture on the trade-off they chose, and if it looks worthwhile in retrospect.


----------



## Beej

eMacMan said:


> for a bug that is proving no more deadly than a typical flu virus.


You're still wrong about this, just as you were when claiming that otherwise healthy people die at a rate of 0.8% from the flu, and that this may all be about +/- a hundred or so deaths. 

The virus has proven to be significantly more deadly than a typical flu. About 3-7 times more when hospital systems are not overrun, based on work done in Austria and Germany.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> The virus has proven to be significantly more deadly than a typical flu. About 3-7 times more when hospital systems are not overrun, based on work done in Austria and Germany.


There's little doubt it causes more deaths among older people and those with underlying conditions. It may also spread more quickly than the flu, goosing the numbers. However, younger and healthier people may be perfectly willing to accept the much lower risk inherent in ending their quarantines.


----------



## FeXL

eMacMan said:


> Bio engineered perhaps?


Ya know, I'm not sure yet.

I've read stories pro & con & haven't seen enough evidence to convince me one way or another. Would it surprise me? Not much.

Wuhan's the source? Yep.
The "lab"? Probably.
That said, not convinced how it got out yet. Read an article some time back that animals from Chinese labs frequently make their way to wet markets. Sounds plausible. Mishandling of the virus at the lab, human(s) infected? Sure. Especially when you read this:

'I've seen better seals on my fridge!' Shocking photos from inside Wuhan lab show broken seal on unit which stores 1,500 virus strains - including the bat coronavirus behind the deadly pandemic



> It is a rare glimpse inside the Chinese laboratory at the centre of mounting inter-national suspicion about the Covid-19 pandemic – and will do nothing to dispel fears that it was caused by a catastrophic leak which has been covered up by Beijing.
> 
> Pictures from inside Wuhan’s secretive Institute of Virology show a broken seal on the door of one of the refrigerators used to hold 1,500 different strains of virus – including the bat coronavirus which has jumped to humans with such devastating effect.
> 
> The pictures, first released by the state-owned China Daily newspaper in 2018, were published on Twitter last month, before being deleted. One comment attached read: ‘I have seen better seals on my refrigerator in my kitchen.’
> 
> The Mail on Sunday revealed a fortnight ago that Ministers now fear that the pandemic could have started as the result of a leak.
Click to expand...


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> There's little doubt it causes more deaths among older people and those with underlying conditions. It may also spread more quickly than the flu, goosing the numbers. However, younger and healthier people may be perfectly willing to accept the much lower risk inherent in ending their quarantines.


Containment to just the young doesn't work. There is room for some opening up, depending on the province, but at a basic level how do you contain the virus to the young?

They can't visit at risk family. Simple enough. Just under 50s and their kids out and about.

Anyone they interact with (other young) can't visit at risk people. I guess we could quarantine most of the healthcare sector away from their families, or quarantine them with their families. Apparently nobody tried this yet, or it keeps failing.

This is where extensive testing can help, but we don't have that yet.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> They can't visit at risk family. Simple enough. Just under 50s and their kids out and about.


Under 65. Yes. Those already visiting at-risk family members under quarantine will likely continue to do so out of quarantine.


----------



## chasMac

Governments seem to almost imperceptibly be moving from a strategy of "flattening the curve" to one of ensuring nobody catches the virus, and most emphatically, nobody dies from it.


----------



## Macfury

chasMac said:


> Governments seem to almost imperceptibly be moving from a strategy of "flattening the curve" to one of ensuring nobody catches the virus, and most emphatically, nobody dies from it.


Agreed. The curve is pretty flat already. Unless there's a cure readily at hand, people need to slowly venture back into the real world.


----------



## CubaMark




----------



## Macfury

Actually, preppers ARE prepped, not protesting. You may feel like an ass because you failed to prepare at all.


----------



## CubaMark




----------



## Macfury

To cowards, CM, it probably looks like that.


----------



## Beej

28,000 Missing Deaths: Tracking the True Toll of the Coronavirus Crisis
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/21/world/coronavirus-missing-deaths.html

The article covers data on total deaths in a number of countries, and how high the numbers were in March to early April.


----------



## Beej

Conspiracy theorists burn 5G towers claiming link to coronavirus
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/wor...-burn-5g-towers-claiming-link-to-coronavirus/

Idiots. 5G towers are for spreading COVID-25, as is clearly laid out in the publicly presented plans for the next pandemic. COVID-19 uses 4G.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> To cowards, CM, it probably looks like that.


CM should be reveling in the current scenario. My neighbour who grew up in communist Hungary stated point blank: "This is Communism!"


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> CM should be reveling in the current scenario. My neighbour who grew up in communist Hungary stated point blank: "This is Communism!"


Why worry? The economy can be sustained using printing presses. 

I'm really tired of seeing people externalize their personal fears as authoritarianism. CM should peer at the world from behind a curtain on his own turf and stop complaining that more vigorous people are willing to face infinitesimal risk to take their lives back.


----------



## chasMac

Looking good for Trump come November. Lefties will view emerging from their confines to vote as a death sentence.


----------



## Macfury

chasMac said:


> Looking good for Trump come November. Lefties will view emerging from their confines to vote as a death sentence.


Why emerge from your lefty baement even after the pandemic? There are still microbes in the air. 

Boo! A germ!


----------



## SINC

Whoa, this is a surprise!

*Coronavirus: Earliest COVID-19 deaths in Bay Area occurred in February, not March*

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/04...medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark



> Two individuals who died in Santa Clara County in February had tissue samples that tested positive for COVID-19, health officials learned Tuesday, revealing the novel coronavirus was responsible for deaths in the Bay Area earlier than medical officials initially believed.
> 
> County Executive Jeff Smith confirmed the test results were received Tuesday from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, after being sent to the federal agency by the Medical Examiner-Coroner.
> 
> The individuals who were tested posthumously for COVID-19 died at home on February 6 and February 17.
> 
> Those two deaths, as well as another death in San Jose on March 6, of a man who later tested positive for COVID-19, occurred before the first coronavirus death was publicly reported in Santa Clara County, on March 9. Health officials had previously believed that death — of 68-year-old Santa Clara resident Azar Ahrabi — to be the first known COVID-19 fatality in the Bay Area.
> 
> 
> “We know there was a person diagnosed in late January with the virus — but to have at least three people right around the beginning of February and late January already have the infection and two of them pass away means the virus has been around for a while,” Smith said.
> 
> The origin of these cases is believed to be within the community, Smith added. That suggests community transmission of the coronavirus was occurring in Santa Clara County well before the first U.S. case of community-acquired COVID-19 was reported in Solano County on February 26.
> 
> “It’s a much more dangerous virus than we initially recognized because we had limited testing,” Smith said.
> 
> In a prepared statement released Tuesday evening, the County of Santa Clara said the individuals died at home during a time “when very limited testing was available only through the CDC.”
> 
> “Testing criteria set by the CDC at the time restricted testing to only individuals with a known travel history and who sought medical care for specific symptoms,” the statement said. “As the Medical Examiner-Coroner continues to carefully investigate deaths throughout the county, we anticipate additional deaths from COVID-19 will be identified.”
> 
> Santa Clara County has so far reported 88 coronavirus-related deaths, including five new deaths reported Tuesday. The county now has 1,948 confirmed cases.


----------



## eMacMan

SINC said:


> Whoa, this is a surprise!
> 
> *Coronavirus: Earliest COVID-19 deaths in Bay Area occurred in February, not March*
> 
> https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/04...medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark


Please run quotes, as their ad blocker blocker is blocking my ad blocker. EDIT: Thanks!

Quick thought though, stateside any death with a positive covid test is treated as a covid death. Including heart attacks, advanced stages of COPD, end stage cancer.... Furthermore the tests they are using actually detect an RNA fragment that may or may not be related to covid. The fragment could even be caused by influenza, heart attack or cancer treatment. Also the tests are not designed to detect if there was a sufficient viral load for the virus to have any adverse effect on the tested. Indeed they are designed to detect it at very, very, very low levels.

Considering this unprecedented protocol and knowing that over 80% of the deaths occur in patients with severely compromised immune systems; It seems logical to conclude that if heart attacks, COPD, cancer, and other natural deaths were correctly labeled, then the covid death toll would at least be cut in half.


----------



## SINC

eMacMan said:


> Please run run quotes, as their ad blocker blocker is blocking my ad blocker.


Done.


----------



## SINC

There is way more to this than a pandemic, it may even be an attempt at a world takeover by China.

*Watch Out For China Buying Spree, NATO Warns*

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrap...-42QRBZvSmO4luKJBPpp12aMBb_W6hWg#6566a1eb1758



> Watch out for Chinese companies swooping in with buckets of cash to buy strategic stakes, or majority control in U.S. and European companies as asset prices fall due to the pandemic.
> 
> NATO sounded the alarm this week, though without naming names.
> 
> “The geopolitical effects of the pandemic could be significant,” said NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg in web conference of defense ministers on Wednesday. “Some allies (are) more vulnerable for situations where critical infrastructure can be sold out,” he said. Of course he meant China. China has been busy buying Greek ports.
> 
> It already pretty much runs Italian textiles. It’s a wonder Italy even makes an espresso machine anymore.
> 
> China Overseas Shipping Company, aka COSCO, owns 90% of the only terminal operator in Belgium. COSCO has a 51% stake in and managerial control of port terminals in Valencia and Bilbao, Spain. They also have minority stakes in other terminals in Antwerp, Las Palmas and Rotterdam, according to a December 2019 study by a Netherlands think tank, seen here.
> 
> John Sawers, former MI6 chief told Sky News this week that, "We need to do more to protect Western technology from being bought up by Chinese companies. I don't think it's an existential threat in the way the Soviet Union was in the Cold War, but nevertheless there is going to be deep rivalry over control of technology,” he reportedly said.
> 
> The pandemic has top officials on the security side of government warning that China might use this time to buy greater influence.
> 
> More importantly, it suggests a growing distrust in China among its biggest business partners.


----------



## eMacMan

SINC said:


> There is way more to this than a pandemic, it may even be an attempt at a world takeover by China.
> 
> *Watch Out For China Buying Spree, NATO Warns*
> 
> https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrap...-42QRBZvSmO4luKJBPpp12aMBb_W6hWg#6566a1eb1758


If so, then both Killer Kenney and the Truedope are willing and enthusiastic participants. They've been doing everything in their power to advance that cause. 

I wonder; What is the going price for a politicians soul?


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> If so, then both Killer Kenney and the Truedope are willing and enthusiastic participants. They've been doing everything in their power to advance that cause.
> 
> I wonder; What is the going price for a politicians soul?


Being named to a UN post such as heading up the WHO.


----------



## SINC

Can you smell the stupid from where you are sitting? This is incredible!

https://www.facebook.com/DonSinclai...66297951269&notif_t=feedback_reaction_generic


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Being named to a UN post such as heading up the WHO.


Der Gropenfuhrer would sell his soul for far less. The UN post is just gravy...


----------



## eMacMan

SINC said:


> Can you smell the stupid from where you are sitting? This is incredible!
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/DonSinclai...66297951269&notif_t=feedback_reaction_generic


Actually I thought it was rather hilarious, though not knowing the woman I have no idea if it was truly intended to be parody.


----------



## Beej

I found some data on daily deaths in Sweden, so below is 2019 and 2020 daily totals for people 65 and older. 2020 ends on April 8th, while I included data out to April 12th for 2019.









The gap between the lines is far greater than reported corona virus deaths up to April 8th, which is consistent with the significant under-reporting covered in the New York Times article I posted a day or two ago. As bad as Europe's numbers look, the real death toll for the virus is far higher.


----------



## Macfury

The real question regarding COVID-19 isn't exactly the mortality rate--it looks to be as low or lower than most flus. It's the ability to spread quickly through the population that will determine total number of deaths.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> The real question regarding COVID-19 isn't exactly the mortality rate--it looks to be as low or lower than most flus.


I wouldn't put much stock in those studies/press releases coming out of California yet, claiming low mortality by having a high estimate of the virus' prevalence. If you look at the methodology, the results are shaky at best (e.g. the first study almost doubled the prevalence just based on demographic re-weighting, not test results, and the test kit accuracy claim is based on a small sample mostly from the U.S. distributor for the China-sourced kits). 

New York will hopefully have results coming out as well, where the virus' prevalence is high enough to overwhelm the problem with false positives, as with a German study I checked.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> I wouldn't put much stock in those studies/press releases coming out of California yet, claiming low mortality by having a high estimate of the virus' prevalence. If you look at the methodology, the results are shaky at best (e.g. the first study almost doubled the prevalence just based on demographic re-weighting, not test results, and the test kit accuracy claim is based on a small sample mostly from the U.S. distributor for the China-sourced kits).
> 
> New York will hopefully have results coming out as well, where the virus' prevalence is high enough to overwhelm the problem with false positives, as with a German study I checked.


It's the number of such studies that are coming out that I find interesting--not one in particular. That mortality decimal place can be moved awfully quickly.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> It's the number of such studies that are coming out that I find interesting--not one in particular. That mortality decimal place can be moved awfully quickly.


The two from California use the same test kits, and have selection bias problems. The worst results I saw were a test from the Netherlands showing a 3% infection rate using blood banks (ie. not people looking to be tested, but biased toward the healthy and not with a cold). The implied mortality rate is very high, but the only results I've seen implying less than 0.3% are the California studies.

To give you an example of the false positives problems, using the dubious claim for the California tests of 0.5% and, say, 15% false negatives:
100,000 people, 1,500 test positive (1.5% unadjusted result from the first study)
500 false positives
175 false negatives
equals 1,175 actual positives (1.2%), which would land the mortality rate around 0.4%, consistent with the range seen in prior European studies.

And China test kits are notoriously crappy.


----------



## CubaMark




----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Your Government Is Here For You



> This is unbelievable. As of last night Trudeau has reopened our borders to people making claiming refugee claims from Upstate New York.
> 
> *New York State is currently battling a massive COVID-19 outbreak. Admitting anyone from New York is grossly irresponsible.*#Cdnpoli #COVID19 https://t.co/gLLM0M0YGX
> 
> — David Jacobs (@DrJacobsRad) April 22, 2020​
> Related! Toronto’s Willowdale refugee hub now a major outbreak centre


Bold mine.

The only way this is going to sink in is if half the population of Ontario & Kaybeck contract coronavirus from refugees.


----------



## Macfury

Why are you so afraid of_ other people_ choosing to end their own quarantines? You can still hang out in your own basement.



CubaMark said:


> CubaMark, the frightened bug


----------



## chasMac

https://www.foxnews.com/health/near...-suffered-underlying-health-issue-study-finds

94% according to JAMA.

Lockdown is pointless.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Why are you so afraid of_ other people_ choosing to end their own quarantines? You can still hang out in your own basement.


He loves the commie lifestyle. Standing in long lines only to find the items you want are out of stock. Armed and gas masked Staßi making sure you don't get together with others to protest. A nice little dole instead of earning your keep....

It's a wet dream for any commie.


----------



## Macfury

Tucker Carlson is spot on bout the "lockdown":



> "This is what happens when mediocre people suddenly find themselves with God-like powers."


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Tucker Carlson is spot on bout the "lockdown":
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "This is what happens when mediocre people suddenly find themselves with God-like powers."
Click to expand...

Actually they have had to work very hard to even achieve low end mediocrity.


----------



## SINC

eMacMan said:


> He loves the commie lifestyle. Standing in long lines only to find the items you want are out of stock. Armed and gas masked Staßi making sure you don't get together with others to protest. A nice little dole instead of earning your keep....
> 
> It's a wet dream for any commie.


I keep noticing this "Staßi " showing up in your recent posts. What the heck is that?


----------



## eMacMan

I pointed this out earlier but battered women are clearly of no importance to the lockdown gods.

https://gazette.com/news/isolation-...cle_2bd7e16c-83fd-11ea-883f-9f1d4208a28a.html



> As cases of the coronavirus across Colorado begin to level off — a sign that hunkering down is making a difference — a sharp rise in domestic violence cases in El Paso County suggests that not everyone is safer at home.
> 
> In the last two weeks, there have been 50 more felony domestic violence cases compared with the same time last year, 4th Judicial District Attorney Dan May said Tuesday at the county commissioners meeting.
> 
> “Unfortunately, it’s a perfect storm here,” May said of the stay-at-home order, which went into effect March 26.
> 
> “These stay-at-home orders are isolating the victims of domestic violence and they are isolating for long periods of time, preventing escape,” he said.
> 
> “We are seeing an increase in very violent and long-term and protracted domestic violence.”


Even worse:


> “The problem that we are concerned with is because of the isolation and people being left at home is that people aren’t having the ability to reach out because they are there with their abuser,” Markley said.
> *
> Markley said in the past few weeks, she has seen several abusers receive low bonds or personal recognizance bonds, allowing them to return to their victim in less than 24 hours.*


----------



## eMacMan

SINC said:


> I keep noticing this "Staßi " showing up in your recent posts. What the heck is that?


Think East Germany before the Berlin Wall came down. They were the state secret police whose only purpose in life was to root out dissenters. To say their tactics or even their existence was revolting is being far too kind. They alos depended on neighbours informing on neighbours, something we are seeing encouraged with the anti-social distancing rules.


----------



## CubaMark

*Kentucky Sees Sharpest Rise In Covid-19 Cases Following Anti-Lockdown Protests*

In a press conference on Sunday, April 19, Governor Beshear reported that, following the protests, 273 new cases of COVID-19 had been confirmed, constituting the highest daily increase in cases the region has announced since the pandemic began. The Kentucky Department of Health reports that the current number of cases is now 2,960 with 148 fatalities from the disease.

According to a report from the Courier-Journal, the protest took place last Wednesday (April 15) and saw around 100 participants denouncing Beshear's adherence to the vital lockdown measures with slogans including “You’re not the King. We won’t kiss your ring,” while failing to observe the recommended physical distance from each other or wear protective items. Led by former Governor of Kentucky, Matt Bevin, the chants were aimed at Beshear, who was giving a Covid-19 update in a room nearby, for enforcing social-distancing orders that prevented residents from working. Over 10 million Americans have applied for unemployment benefits since the outbreak. 

The emotion is catching across the country, as in Denver, Colorado, nurses formed a counter-protest against lockdown protestors, blocking their cars in the road by standing defiantly in their scrubs. Colorado currently has over 10,000 confirmed cases and has seen 468 deaths from Covid-19. 

(IFLScience)​


----------



## Beej

Beej said:


> I wouldn't put much stock in those studies/press releases coming out of California yet, claiming low mortality by having a high estimate of the virus' prevalence. If you look at the methodology, the results are shaky at best (e.g. the first study almost doubled the prevalence just based on demographic re-weighting, not test results, and the test kit accuracy claim is based on a small sample mostly from the U.S. distributor for the China-sourced kits).
> 
> New York will hopefully have results coming out as well, where the virus' prevalence is high enough to overwhelm the problem with false positives, as with a German study I checked.


The first results from New York are in, and the estimate is that 14% of New York state residents have been infected.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/23/new...ents-have-had-the-coronavirus-cuomo-says.html

That would put the mortality rate around 0.5-0.7%, or at the higher end of previous studies, but still close.


----------



## Macfury

What's the point of this article? Demonstrating that some people aren't as scared of the virus as they are of economic devastation?



CubaMark said:


> *Kentucky Sees Sharpest Rise In Covid-19 Cases Following Anti-Lockdown Protests*
> 
> In a press conference on Sunday, April 19, Governor Beshear reported that, following the protests, 273 new cases of COVID-19 had been confirmed, constituting the highest daily increase in cases the region has announced since the pandemic began. The Kentucky Department of Health reports that the current number of cases is now 2,960 with 148 fatalities from the disease.
> 
> According to a report from the Courier-Journal, the protest took place last Wednesday (April 15) and saw around 100 participants denouncing Beshear's adherence to the vital lockdown measures with slogans including “You’re not the King. We won’t kiss your ring,” while failing to observe the recommended physical distance from each other or wear protective items. Led by former Governor of Kentucky, Matt Bevin, the chants were aimed at Beshear, who was giving a Covid-19 update in a room nearby, for enforcing social-distancing orders that prevented residents from working. Over 10 million Americans have applied for unemployment benefits since the outbreak.
> 
> The emotion is catching across the country, as in Denver, Colorado, nurses formed a counter-protest against lockdown protestors, blocking their cars in the road by standing defiantly in their scrubs. Colorado currently has over 10,000 confirmed cases and has seen 468 deaths from Covid-19.
> 
> (IFLScience)​


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> What's the point of this article?


Open protests against lockdowns=bad.
Open borders for refugees, illegal aliens=good.


----------



## FeXL

Well, look who just woke up...

Canada must ‘re-think’ relationship with China over pandemic: Scheer… Not With PM Arselicker in charge we won’t



> Outgoing Conservative Leader Andrew Scheer says it’s time Canada reassess its relationship with China, amid mounting concerns the country concealed information about the spread of COVID-19 within its borders.
> 
> In an interview on CTV’s Question Period airing Sunday, Scheer said China’s handling of the pandemic has demonstrated that the “communist regime” can’t be trusted.


—

This is known to computer programmers as GIGO... (garbage in, garbage out)

Widely Followed Model for Predicting Virus Deaths Is 'Flawed and Misleading,' Experts Now Say



> How can you speak from authority if the data you rely on is flawed? It's a problem for policymakers around the world who have been relying on a scientific model that projects the number of dead from the coronavirus. The White House has been relying on the model to formulate policy and develop plans to reopen the economy.
> 
> But epidemiologists are saying that the model is hopelessly flawed and gives misleading results.


—

Canada, U.S. strike deal to extend border restrictions by 30 days



> Prime Minister Justin Trudeau says Canada and the United States have struck a deal to extend current border restrictions between the two countries by an additional 30 days, as the U.S. moves to exempt Canada and Mexico from export restrictions on personal protective equipment (PPE).


—

New York mosque still open for daily prayers while churches across the country face mandatory shutdowns



> A mosque in New York is reportedly still open for daily prayers amid the coronavirus pandemic that has forced Christian churches across the country to close their doors and cancel their in-person gatherings.
> 
> While churchgoers in many states have been criticized and even punished for continuing to gather, that same level of scrutiny has apparently not been leveled at the Mosque of Jesus, Son of Mary in Syracuse, New York.


'Course not!

—

Half of Canadians want COVID-19 restrictions lifted by June: poll



> Close to half of Canadians want their respective provincial governments to begin lifting COVID-19 restrictions within two months, according to the latest survey by the Angus Reid Institute.
> 
> The organization polled a representative randomized sample of more than 1,900 Canadians online from April 15-17.


—

Where the rubber hits the road. This is where we find out who ranks higher on the SJW victim scale: Blacks or Chinese?

Racism Against Black People in China Amid Pandemic Sparks Diplomatic Crisis



> Abuse and racism against Africans in southern China amid pandemic fears have spurred backlash in their home countries, leading to diplomatic tensions.


—

_What_ trust?

Dr. Tam’s about-face on masks damages trust at a crucial time



> Last week, Canada’s top doctor said that if we’re not sick, or haven’t been around someone with a confirmed case of COVID-19, we shouldn’t wear a mask. “Putting a mask on an asymptomatic person is not beneficial, obviously if you’re not infected,” she said.
> 
> This week, Dr. Theresa Tam did a complete about-face: actually, the use of non-medical masks can help to control the spread of COVID-19, she said. “Wearing a non-medical mask, even if you have no symptoms, is an additional measure that you can take to protect others around you in situations where physical distancing is difficult to maintain, such as in public transit or maybe in the grocery store.”


—

Curious, that...

Canada secures order for five million pills of anti-malaria medication eyed by U.S. as treatment



> The Canadian government quietly secured a deal with India last week for five million capsules of hydroxychloroquine, the National Post has learned, a drug that U.S. President Donald Trump has unfoundedly touted as a remedy for COVID-19.


—


China furious as leading German newspaper writes out £130BN bill for 'coronavirus damages'



> GERMANY has rattled China by joining the UK, France and the US in a rare attack, after Berlin called out Beijing's responsibility for the global pandemic and a leading newspaper issued a £130bn invoice.


—

Once a Prog...

Illinois Dems' $41 Billion Demand Includes $10 Billion Pension Bailout That Has Nothing to Do With Coronavirus



> Illinois Democrats are demanding $41 billion from the federal government for coronavirus relief, including $10 billion for Illinois's cash-strapped and underfunded public pension plan. *The most fiscally mismanaged state in the union, which has criminally neglected funding its public pension fund for two decades, wants Washington to pull its chestnuts out of the fire?*
> 
> Certainly, states should get something. But what Illinois is asking for is shocking.


Bold mine.

—

Physics Geek: This Isn't About Controlling a Virus.
This Is About Controlling the Deplorables.



> Hail PhysicsGeek.
> 
> Remember how the social distancing and shutdowns were designed to flatten the curve? And do you remember the purpose of the flattening? That's right: it was to prevent the number of cases from exceeding our medical services capacity to handle the number of cases.
> 
> And yet now there appears to be a growing trend to require everyone in the country to be tested before we start to open things up again.​


—

Kurt Schlichter: They Can't Stop Us From Reopening the Country



> John Ekdahl has been on a helluva tear on Twitter.
> 
> The center-of-the-universe New Yorker attitude I can handle on an everyday basis. When you start shutting down my life and putting my friends and family out of work and you won't even close your own virus-spreading hotzone subway? Seriously **** off. All of you.
> — American Journalists Publish Chinese Propaganda (@JohnEkdahl) April 18, 2020​
> He wonders why it is that the _New York-based media_ is scolding Floridians for visiting the beaches in small numbers, but yet all of _New York City's parks remain open._
> 
> He wonders why people are being told they can't drive but _New York City's subway system remains open,_ each car a contained petri dish. (And note -- they only gave out the order to wear a mask on the subway a few days ago!)


—

Wuhan Flu



> In a province with 7% unemployment; (h/t Paul)
> 
> Health officials said that as of Friday, 358 cases in High River and elsewhere in the region were linked to the Cargill facility. Many of the workers at the Cargill Ltd. plant are new immigrants or temporary foreign workers, whose jobs and *shared living spaces make them especially vulnerable to infection.*​
> Seven weeks in a Wuhan hospital: _The ophthalmologists were the last line of defense._
> 
> Defiant Residents Grab Shovels, Dirt Bikes After Cali Authorities Dump Tons Of Sand In Skateparks
> 
> Think globally, manufacture locally: _How COVID-19 Is Wreaking Havoc On Our Ability To Make Things_
> 
> My friend Tom just received his ten pack of toilet paper from Amazon.


Bold mine.

—

Thugs Killed More People in Chicago Than Coronavirus Did



> While the authorities are cracking down on miscreants attending drive-in church services or surfing in the ocean, urban gangs are practicing social distancing by shooting their victims from passing cars.
> 
> With 4 dead and 19 wounded over the weekend, Chicago’s gangs made it clear that they weren’t staying home. Either that or they thought that shooting rival drug dealers was an essential activity.


—

Drink Camel Urine To Cure Coronavirus, Prophetic Medicine Man Says



> An Iranian man calling himself an Islamic prophetic medicine healer has prescribed drinking camel urine to prevent and cure COVID-19.
> 
> In a video now widely shared on social media Mehdi Sabili who is also the chairman of prophetic medicine society treats himself to camel urine and says it must be taken "fresh and warm".


Damn. And my supply of camel pi$$ is in the fridge & a week old...

—

Another Media Asshole Infected with Coronavirus, George Stephanopolous, Spotted Out in Public Without His _Mandated_ Mask



> Some of you may disagree with the mandate to wear masks proactively, when you don't have the disease.
> 
> What about when you are diagnosed with it and know you are now a vector for a highly contagious, often deadly disease?
> 
> What about if you're part of the industry mass-shaming Americans for failing to abide by social distancing rules you ignore yourselves?


—

Considering the epidemic of obesity in the US, this is marginally over a standard sample...

Hospital Analysis Reports Show Nearly Half Of Coronavirus Patients Are Obese



> A recent analysis of hospital network data found that nearly half of patients being treated for the coronavirus were obese.
> 
> The COVID-NET report, published by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, found that of the patients who’d contracted coronavirus, 9 out of 10 of them had an underlying health condition. Of those patients, 48.3% were obese.


—

Backup Presidential Candidate Andrew Cuomo: If You're Out of Money Because You're Locked Out of Your Nonessential Job, Just Take an "Essential" Job



> LearnToCodeRed, Axeman says.
> 
> Yeah, I guess I might as well just go ahead and take that EMT qualification test. Should only take me an hour or so of cramming, I figure. And then, snap, I'll be on a "bus" saying "start a drip of lactated Ringers, stat!" by the end of the week.


—

All Fifty States Are Either At Their COVID Peak, or Past It



> Good news. One would like to see the 15 states currently at their peak of infection to be past their peak of infection, but that should happen soon.
> 
> The other 35 states are now on the declining part of the much-blathered-about curve.


—

One Republican Gov Is Handling the Coronavirus Like Sweden & Its Flattening The Curve



> Many states have enacted very strict lockdown policies and yet are still struggling with the coronavirus. For example, the southeastern region of Pennsylvania has been under a stay-at-home order since for almost six weeks and cases continue to mount.
> 
> However, South Dakota Governor Kristi Noem is trying a different strategy and it’s working.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Certainly, states should get something. But what Illinois is asking for is shocking.


States should get money from other states? Maybe if they pass it back and forth real fast it will amount to something.



FeXL said:


> Hospital Analysis Reports Show Nearly Half Of Coronavirus Patients Are Obese


As you say, given the incidence of obesity in the land of plenty, this sounds like a partial cure.


----------



## SINC

*China puts a city of 10 million 'on lockdown' to curb a new coronavirus outbreak after a student returning from New York 'infected more than 70'*

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...egTuWoLAQ8tBUk6Z4fBXeXKzJdxvYajlV7tbRTh0idsW0


----------



## CubaMark

What is this maniac doing? 

A *normal* government leader would stand up and say that the medical scientists are researching potential treatments, in the meantime practice social distancing, take extra care with the elderly and immune-suppressed, and please observe public health orders from your local officials.

Instead this turd-for-brains is up there spouting off every little thing that occurs to him (maybe if we sacrifice a virgin (I made a move on her, but she was a virgin, so...) on an altar on Wall Street, this thing'll magically go away), and the weak-minded / victims of decades of right-wing underfunding of education systems just lap it up. First the hydroxychloroquine fiasco, now we'll soon have reports of mindless trumpites injecting bleach into their veins or spending 12-hours a day in a tanning salon bed soaking up UV.

Future historians will have a field day with this period of American politics. A truly embarrassing chapter....

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHkzqejFKbM[/ame]


----------



## Macfury

Your low opinion of the underclass is part of the prog mentality.

Trump was talking about use of ultraviolet light inside the body--something we're already seeing. 




CubaMark said:


> What is this maniac doing?


Good prog! Nice prog! Here's your biscuit for being so obedient!



CubaMark said:


> A *normal* government leader would stand up and say that the medical scientists are researching potential treatments, in the meantime practice social distancing, take extra care with the elderly and immune-suppressed, and please observe public health orders from your local officials.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Good prog! Nice prog! Here's your biscuit for being so obedient!


Now, get into the train car...


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Yet, _yet_, Prinz Dummkopf has quietly ordered up 5 million doses for Canada.

Curious your silence on that...

In addition, we have a gen-u-wine De-troit Prog meeting with Trump and thanking him for hydroxychloroquine saving her life. 

Even more curious...



CubaMark said:


> First the hydroxychloroquine fiasco...


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> Today’s news.
> 
> Late Breaking: The Calgary Stampede has been cancelled First time in a century.
> 
> Follow @ScottGottliebMD – _New: Researchers clone two human blocking monoclonal antibodies using #SARSCoV2 specific memory B cells isolated from patients with #COVID19 that bind and neutralize activity of virus; demonstrating the basis for antibody drugs as potential therapeutics._
> 
> Sen Elizabeth Warren’s older brother has died of COVID-19
> 
> A Global Food Crisis Looms. The supply chain is not ok.
> 
> It arrived here last, and we locked down first: With only 65 active cases, Saskatchewan’s 5 stage re-opening begins May 4th.
> 
> Enemy of the People: _I know I’m acting as an unpaid propaganda agent for China, but I’m doing it anyway._
> 
> See above: _American citizens who care about their health as well as U.S. national security need to know about China’s domestic and international security and intelligence organizations, and the global web of companies and organizations they control and manipulate.
> _
> Two cats have tested positive for COVID-19.
> 
> New York State: @NYGovCuomo The first phase of results from a statewide antibody study are in.


—


Renowned Microbiologist Claims Wuhan Lab 'Did Absolutely Crazy Things' With Coronavirus



> A world renowned Russian microbiologist says that the novel coronavirus responsible for the COVID-19 pandemic was the result of Wuhan scientists doing "absolutely crazy things" in their laboratory.
> 
> Dr. Peter Chumakov of the Engelhardt Institute of Molecular Biology and Russian Academy of Sciences claims that while the Wuhan scientists' goal in creating the coronavirus was not malicious - instead, they were trying to study the pathogenicity of the virus, according to the Daily Mail.


—

How Canada’s crucial data gaps are hindering the coronavirus pandemic response



> Gaps in key health and economic data are hindering Canada’s response to the COVID-19 pandemic, leaving Canadians in the dark about who is being infected or struggling with the devastated economy, say researchers, politicians and scientists.


Comment:



> _Our government has pushed CCP virus propaganda on the public why would I trust them even if they had complete data?_


Yeppers.


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

I'd definitely support a nationally coordinated movement to toss Trudles & the rest of his clowns out on their arses...

As talk grows that some provinces could reopen earlier than others, Trudeau urges national coordination



> With some provinces well ahead of others in flattening the curve of the COVID-19 pandemic, federal officials are urging national coordination when it comes to easing physical-distancing restrictions and reopening the economy.


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> Hello, Bigot.
> 
> Yet, _yet_, Prinz Dummkopf has quietly ordered up 5 million doses for Canada.
> 
> Curious your silence on that...


_Source?_



FeXL said:


> In addition, we have a gen-u-wine De-troit Prog meeting with Trump and thanking him for hydroxychloroquine saving her life.
> 
> Even more curious...


Not at all curious that *you* would take an anecdotal case, in which _correlation does not = causation_, and push it as some kind of proof that your Lord Cheetoh is some kind of "genius" :lmao:

Meanwhile, Trump's own Food & Drug Administration says today:


FDA warns against using hydroxychloroquine for coronavirus outside of hospitals (NBC News)

*And:*

Hydroxychloroquine had no effect on seriously ill coronavirus patients in New York: study
(New York Post)

Hydroxychloroquine and coronavirus: a guide to the scientific studies so far (The Guardian)


----------



## CubaMark

Macfury said:


> Trump was talking about use of ultraviolet light inside the body--something we're already seeing.


Well! That's very interesting! Would you be so kind as to link to some of those examples of inside-the-body application of UV light to kill the coronavirus? 

I'll just make some popcorn and wait for it....


----------



## Macfury

If you get sick with COVID-19, I hope you have a medical document directing your doctor not to use that drug under authority of the _UK Guardian_ newspaper.

Using the FDA as an authority gets a laugh out of me! And yes, the drug (in combination with the rest of the cocktail) is considered most effective for patients who are NOT already seriously ill.


----------



## Macfury

Here it is. 

https://www.baystreet.ca/viewarticle.aspx?id=585857





CubaMark said:


> Well! That's very interesting! Would you be so kind as to link to some of those examples of inside-the-body application of UV light to kill the coronavirus?
> 
> I'll just make some popcorn and wait for it....


----------



## FeXL

My post #421 above.

Read. Learn.



CubaMark said:


> Source?


1. You don't think a Prog congresswoman would lie, do you?

2. If it was a single anecdotal case, I'd agree with you. However, I've read of dozens of cases over the last couple weeks & they all point to the same thing: hydroxychloroquine, along with the balance of the cocktail, appears to be effective against Chinese coronavirus in at least some cases. That tells me it's worth taking a look at, anecdotal or not.

3. There goes your TDS again. Who said anything about Trump? I thought we were talking medications?

4. As far as the FDA, no surprise. All they're doing is trying to stop stupid Progs from eating toxic fish tank cleaner. In addition, I trust the FDA about as much as I trust any other gov't organization: damn little. These are the same idiots who have been pushing BS dietary recommendations for years.

5. Don't bother quoting _The Grunion_ to me. They have just as big a political axe to grind as MotherCorpse.



CubaMark said:


> Not at all curious that *you* would take an anecdotal case, in which _correlation does not = causation_, and push it as some kind of proof that your Lord Cheetoh is some kind of "genius"
> 
> Meanwhile, Trump's own Food & Drug Administration says today:


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Here it is.


D'oh!


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> My post #421 above.
> 
> Read. Learn.


Take your own advice and read the article to which you linked. The order was placed in November 2019, for treatment of patients suffering autoimmune diseases. Also:

_...the five million pills are earmarked for patients who need it to treat lupus, malaria or rheumatoid arthritis. So they will not be used for clinical trials or to treat COVID-19._​



FeXL said:


> 1. You don't think a Prog congresswoman would lie, do you?


Don't know. Never heard of her before this. And you may recall, if you were paying attention, that I view the Democrats as just the less-desirable side of the corrupt, imperialist coin that is the USA. That I despise Trump and the mindless lemmings that are following him of a cliff does not mean that I favour his political opponents. This is an error you make frequently.



FeXL said:


> 2. If it was a single anecdotal case, I'd agree with you. However, I've read of dozens of cases over the last couple weeks & they all point to the same thing: hydroxychloroquine, along with the balance of the cocktail, appears to be effective against Chinese coronavirus in at least some cases. That tells me it's worth taking a look at, anecdotal or not.


Sure - it may be that hydroxychloroquine can play a role in treating COVID-19. *BUT*. Unless these are observed within the context of controlled clinical trials, all of these bits of "anecdotal evidence" may simply point to persons who recovered through the workings of their own immune response. You have to be able to _prove_ the link, not just _believe_ that it exists. And Trump's uninformed thinking-out-loud-at-press-briefings isn't helping.



FeXL said:


> 3. There goes your TDS again. Who said anything about Trump? I thought we were talking medications?


I'm talking about Trump and his inane babbling about possible (as in, invented in his mind spur of the moment) remedies for coronavirus. I'm sure it serves his purposes to distract from the mounting death toll to have us all caught up in reacting to his press briefings. It's all circus... to the point where he walked back his suggestion that people "inject....disinfectants" to cure themselves (prompting the bleach industry to issue a public warning not to do something so bloody ridiculous).



FeXL said:


> 4. As far as the FDA, no surprise. All they're doing is trying to stop stupid Progs from eating toxic fish tank cleaner. In addition, I trust the FDA about as much as I trust any other gov't organization: damn little. These are the same idiots who have been pushing BS dietary recommendations for years.


Not much one can say to someone who is so deeply paranoid. Seen any black UN helicopters lately? :snort:



FeXL said:


> 5. Don't bother quoting _The Grunion_ to me. They have just as big a political axe to grind as MotherCorpse.


It's not just The Guardian. It's everyone. Everyone is talking about the danger to public health posed by the big little boy who didn't do his homework and is now up in front of the class winging the book report without a clue. And it shows. To everyone except those with those orange-tinted glasses, apparently.


----------



## CubaMark

Macfury said:


> Here it is.
> 
> https://www.baystreet.ca/viewarticle.aspx?id=585857


Thank-you. I'm surprised this exists at all. One biotech company's announcement of a research agreement to develop (someday) a treatment for seriously ill patients that involves inserting a catheter into the lungs to blast UV-A light (which all other reports I've read discount as any kind of an effective virus-killer; UV-C works, but it also kills healthy cells). 

That's a worst-case scenario future treatment for the sickest of patients. Trump's press briefing certainly didn't make it appear as though he was talking about that level of illness... he appeared to be talking about general remedies for coronavirus.

This isn't me splitting hairs - it's recognizing that Trump is spouting off on topics of which he has little to no knowledge. It's as though he tasked an intern to go onto the intertubes and Google search for ways to kill a virus - far-out stuff, outside-the-box! And then decided to base an entire press briefing on the first page of results.

I cannot fathom that you, with whom I have profound disagreements but who I believe to be reasonably intelligent can sit back and defend this circus that is underway in Washington. Even your libertarian leanings cannot withstand the absolute sh&tshow that is the Trump presidency.


----------



## Macfury

Quite frankly, I think that only Sweden is pursuing a reasonable policy. 



CubaMark said:


> Thank-you. I'm surprised this exists at all. One biotech company's announcement of a research agreement to develop (someday) a treatment for seriously ill patients that involves inserting a catheter into the lungs to blast UV-A light (which all other reports I've read discount as any kind of an effective virus-killer; UV-C works, but it also kills healthy cells).
> 
> That's a worst-case scenario future treatment for the sickest of patients. Trump's press briefing certainly didn't make it appear as though he was talking about that level of illness... he appeared to be talking about general remedies for coronavirus.
> 
> This isn't me splitting hairs - it's recognizing that Trump is spouting off on topics of which he has little to no knowledge. It's as though he tasked an intern to go onto the intertubes and Google search for ways to kill a virus - far-out stuff, outside-the-box! And then decided to base an entire press briefing on the first page of results.
> 
> I cannot fathom that you, with whom I have profound disagreements but who I believe to be reasonably intelligent can sit back and defend this circus that is underway in Washington. Even your libertarian leanings cannot withstand the absolute sh&tshow that is the Trump presidency.


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

You expect me to trust the same idiot who sent 16 tonnes of PPE to China with not using the lupus treatment for anything else? The same asshole who emptied out warehouses, thousands of pallets, of emergency gear prior to the outbreak? The same racist, two-faced, lying sonuvabitch who ignored the (surprisingly) accurate pandemic report his Chief Public Health official prepared back in the noughts?

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Have I got a chunk of swamp land for you...

As to your claim about sole autoimmune disease use, I just checked. There are a number of medications used to treat lupus, of which hydroxychloroquine is merely one. Canada averages less than 500 cases of malaria/year. I could find no hard numbers on how much is used for rheumatoid arthritis but it is also one of various treatments.



CubaMark said:


> Take your own advice and read the article to which you linked. The order was placed in November 2019, for treatment of patients suffering autoimmune diseases. Also:
> 
> _...the five million pills are earmarked for patients who need it to treat lupus, malaria or rheumatoid arthritis. So they will not be used for clinical trials or to treat COVID-19._​


But she's a _Prog._ _Prima facie_ that makes her more credible!



CubaMark said:


> Don't know. Never heard of her before this.


The only error I make regarding you is just how much of a Marxist you really are.



CubaMark said:


> This is an error you make frequently.


Yep. And it may also mean that it's actually an effective treatment. Frankly, I'll take the words of medical doctors over brain-dead TDS sufferers.



CubaMark said:


> Sure - it may be that hydroxychloroquine can play a role in treating COVID-19. *BUT*. Unless these are observed within the context of controlled clinical trials, all of these bits of "anecdotal evidence" may simply point to persons who recovered through the workings of their own immune response.


The mounting death toll would be far less _worldwide_ if:
1. The Chi-Coms had been honest about the outbreak in the first place;
2. The Chi-Coms had been honest _ever_ about the numbers of infected & dead;
3. The WHO didn't have its nose so far up the Chi-Coms arses the Chinese appear to have two tongues;
4. Prog politicians <cough>Tam<cough> hadn't parroted the WHO claptrap verbatim and without question;
5. Prog media hadn't portrayed Sino Lung Rot as the black plague;
6. Prog politicians had closed down national borders weeks earlier than they did;
7. I could go on at length...




CubaMark said:


> I'm sure it serves his purposes to distract from the mounting death toll to have us all caught up in reacting to his press briefings.


I've listed any number of instances on these boards where the FDA has done 180's (and sometimes 360's!) on earlier guidelines: butter, eggs, fat, cholesterol. In addition, vaping, HFCS, 23andMe genetic tests, and any number of drugs to name a few. Whenever I hear there's been a fresh FDA approval, the first question I ask is, what iteration is this?



CubaMark said:


> Not much one can say to someone who is so deeply paranoid.


No, it's not. It's all the Prog "news" sources with axes to grind: CNNBCBS, MotherCorpse, BBC, etc. That they entail the lion's share of the market makes it seem like it's everyone to those who don't source elsewhere.



CubaMark said:


> It's not just The Guardian. It's everyone.


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> Your government is here to hide from you: _The Treasury Board yesterday invoked employee safety in withholding pandemic records including details of sole-sourced contracts._
> 
> Signs that China has another Wuhan? _“Leaked documents show the number of virus patients there may be 200 times the official data…”_
> 
> Germany: _Zoo May Feed Animals to Animals as Funds Dry Up in Pandemic_
> 
> Something lighter…
> 
> I’m sure there’s a pride parade you can march in somewhere
> 
> — Mat lub (@Matlub9) April 24, 2020


----------



## Beej

Coronavirus Antibody Tests: Can You Trust the Results?
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/24/health/coronavirus-antibody-tests.html

There is a small sample problem with this work, but the advantage is that it's not a result provided by the test kit sellers. The tests for those California studies that made big headlines have false positives of around 2-3%, so their result of ~3% of people testing positive is meaningless. Unless a larger independent trial shows they are as accurate as the distributor claims (99.5%).

Source data for the news article where you can look up results for specific tests.
https://covidtestingproject.org/


----------



## Beej

COVID-19 robs victims of at least one decade of life on average, analysis shows
https://nationalpost.com/news/covid-19-victims-losing-one-decade-of-life-on-average-analysis-shows

This is one look at some European data, so expect the result to change with more data, particularly from less stressed healthcare systems. The number should be lower for Canada and the U.S. -- I thought 7 years, but maybe that's too optimistic. 

That said, the idea that most of the people dying were about to kick the bucket any moment now was always absurd. This is just a more formal way of saying that.


----------



## Beej

COVID-19 recovery plan for N.B. begins with 2-household 'bubbles' but mass gatherings may wait a year
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-...ery-plan-new-brunswick-blaine-higgs-1.5543682


> People can choose one other household to partner with to form a "two-family bubble."
> 
> Their choice must be mutual and once they decide, they cannot choose a different household


That's going to make for some awkward conversations for people who thought they were best friends.

Maybe they'll create a public database so everyone can see who has no friends.

Key parties will get boring, fast.

The jokes almost write themselves.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> That said, the idea that most of the people dying were about to kick the bucket any moment now was always absurd.


I've heard little of that. Only that seniors over a certain age with at least one underlying condition are not likely to live much longer anyway, statistically.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> I've heard little of that. Only that seniors over a certain age with at least one underlying condition are not likely to live much longer anyway, statistically.


I don't know if it was stated so much as implied. That was the impression I always got: "Wul, they had one foot in the grave already, so...".


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> I've heard little of that. Only that seniors over a certain age with at least one underlying condition are not likely to live much longer anyway, statistically.


I've seen people arbitrarily cut the death toll in half because they are unhappy with how broadly corona virus deaths are defined. The root of that is because frail people are dying from heart attacks and other problems. The reality is that those same frail people can hang around for many years under normal circumstances.

Part of the problem could be misunderstanding life expectancy. Life expectancy at birth is about 80 years, but at the age of 80 it isn't zero. It's about nine years in this older data set.
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1310013401


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> Part of the problem could be misunderstanding life expectancy. Life expectancy at birth is about 80 years, but at the age of 80 it isn't zero. It's about nine years in this older data set.


Of course. But that number does not include underlying conditions.


----------



## eMacMan

Beej said:


> I've seen people arbitrarily cut the death toll in half because they are unhappy with how broadly corona virus deaths are defined. The root of that is because frail people are dying from heart attacks and other problems. The reality is that those same frail people can hang around for many years under normal circumstances.
> 
> Part of the problem could be misunderstanding life expectancy. Life expectancy at birth is about 80 years, but at the age of 80 it isn't zero. It's about nine years in this older data set.
> https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1310013401



OTOH If someone dies of a heart attack, tests positive for Covid, with a test which will detect it in any quantity but will not determine whether there was a sufficient viral load to impact health, then in all fairness that individual died of a heart attack, not covid. Ditto someone with end stage cancer, or advanced lung disease. 

Yet current reporting practices chalk all of those deaths up to covid. 

More importantly flattening the curve is not intended to save lives. By altering the normal sharp rise to a peak followed by an equally sharp decline, to a longer more gradual rise, all that is accomplished is delaying deaths. Perhaps more importantly it prolongs enforced social isolation and the accompanying financial devastation.


----------



## Macfury

Macfury said:


> Here it is.
> 
> https://www.baystreet.ca/viewarticle.aspx?id=585857


Note that YouTube removed the video associated with this product, just as people were becoming interested in it, for violating their terms of service.


----------



## Beej

Macfury said:


> Note that YouTube removed the video associated with this product, just as people were becoming interested in it, for violating their terms of service.


The globalists are trying to hide information that could help kill a virus that is just the flu, and the excess deaths are only a spontaneous outbreak of heart attacks in multiple countries. This is all a hidden trial run to put everyone on heart medication. :lmao:

Social media and google crackdowns on whatever people are angry about in the moment continue to be ridiculous. Early on, youtubers were told not to say the term corona virus or they would get demonetized. This is while youtube ran videos from news media that frequently used the term.

As long as CNN speculates about things, it's okay. Like a plane disappearing into a blackhole. But naughty youtubers may say something ridiculous and misleading. That biotech company got caught on the wrong side of youtube's Official vs Casual divide.


----------



## Macfury

Beej said:


> The globalists are trying to hide information that could help kill a virus that is just the flu, and the excess deaths are only a spontaneous outbreak of heart attacks in multiple countries. This is all a hidden trial run to put everyone on heart medication. :lmao:
> 
> Social media and google crackdowns on whatever people are angry about in the moment continue to be ridiculous. Early on, youtubers were told not to say the term corona virus or they would get demonetized. This is while youtube ran videos from news media that frequently used the term.
> 
> As long as CNN speculates about things, it's okay. Like a plane disappearing into a blackhole. But naughty youtubers may say something ridiculous and misleading. That biotech company got caught on the wrong side of youtube's Official vs Casual divide.


As long as the videos are WHO approved, I'm on board!


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> As long as the videos are WHO approved, I'm on board!


Blackie, Hajdu & Tam approve, too! :clap::clap::clap:


----------



## Beej

In vaccine news, separate teams in the UK and Israel are saying their option could be ready by September. That's a best case at this point, and for a product rushed through testing, so we'll see.

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-52394485
https://www.jpost.com/health-scienc...weeks-we-will-have-coronavirus-vaccine-619101

I found this paragraph to be out of place for public communications.


> “The scientific framework for the vaccine is based on a new protein expression vector, which forms and secretes a chimeric soluble protein that delivers the viral antigen into mucosal tissues by self-activated endocytosis, causing the body to form antibodies against the virus.”


Why bother printing that for the public to read?


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Blackie, Hajdu & Tam approve, too! :clap::clap::clap:


Here's a beauty:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...g-carefully-agencys-warnings-coronavirus.html



> WHO chief berates the world for 'not listening carefully' to the agency's warnings about coronavirus on January 30 when there were only 82 Covid-19 cases outside China


And further:



> 'Don't use this virus as an opportunity to fight against each other or score political points,' he said.


Unless you're scoring political points with China, that is.


----------



## FeXL

The COVID-19 nursing home crisis wasn't 'unimaginable.' It was predicted, then ignored



> When it comes time for the official post-COVID-19 inquiries, and I think several are called for, it’s fair to predict the situation in nursing and long-term care homes will leave the starkest impression. The Pinecrest Nursing Home in Bobcaygeon, Ont. was the first to come to widespread public attention thanks to a harrowing report in The Globe and Mail. “Equipment everywhere. An eerie silence broken only by the sound of TVs, the coughing of residents and the shuffling of workers in protective masks, gowns and gloves. Patients with dementia had slipped into a kind of ‘fugue state,’” a nurse there reported. COVID-19-positive residents shared rooms with healthy ones, she said, because there was nowhere else to put them.


—

When Canadians Wanted The Borders Closed To Stop The CCP Virus, The Liberals (Led By A Guy Who Repeatedly Wore Blackface) Called Us Racist. Why Should We Care When The Liberals Cry About ‘Racism’ Now?



> As you read this, I’m sure you can remember when the Liberals – including Justin Trudeau, Patty Hajdu, Theresa Tam, and many more, insinuated that ‘stigma’ was the biggest threat as the Coronavirus emerged from China, and insinuated that travel bans were ‘racist’ and ‘wouldn’t work.’


<snort> We don't...

—

With what? A million more faulty ones?

Love the cartoon... :love2:

Trudeau government claims China will replace one million faulty masks



> Chinese suppliers have said they will replace the shoddy medical equipment they sent Canada in one of their “mask diplomacy” missions, according to Global News.


—

Again, love the cartoon.

Nine key questions for Canada’s COVID-19 inquiry

Let's cut to the chase:



> _The first question should be: “What the F&ck were you thinking giving jobs to Tam & Hajdu?”_


Yeppers.

—

Hey, Sockboy: Bite me...

Trudeau forces businesses, charities to ‘confirm’ they don’t ‘discriminate’ to receive emergency aid



> Justin Trudeau’s Liberal government is forcing businesses, not-for-profits and registered charities applying for an emergency interest-free loan to help them through the coronavirus lockdown to “confirm” that they do not “discriminate” on the basis of “gender,” “sexual orientation,” and “religion,” among other things, in order to receive the financial help.
> 
> Borrowers who do not wish to confirm the “non-discrimination” clause are excluded from the government-run program based on this stipulation, which appears to be unique to the Canada Emergency Business Account (CEBA).


—

RACIS!!!

Minorities Overwhelmingly Support An Immigration Ban To Fight Coronavirus, Poll Finds



> A survey found that an overwhelming majority of minority groups in the United States supports a moratorium on immigration to help stop the spread of coronavirus.
> 
> A USA Today/Ipsos poll conducted earlier in April found that 71% of non-white respondents support a ban on immigration as a means to fight the COVID-19 pandemic, a notable result given many critics of the Trump administration claiming an immigration ban to be xenophobic.


—

Papers, please.

Civil liberties group concerned as Ontario cops get IDs of those who test positive



> A civil liberties group is raising concerns as Ontario police officers now have access to the IDs of those who have tested positive for the novel coronavirus.
> 
> The data was made available to first responders as part of emergency measures during the pandemic.
> 
> “We appreciate that first responders are on the front lines of a public health crisis. Protecting the health of communities and first responders is rightly a priority,” a letter to Solicitor General Sylvia Jones read.
> 
> *“Providing personal health information directly to law enforcement, however, is an extraordinary invasion of privacy.”*


Bold mine.

—

Worldwide death toll climbs to 200,000



> More than 200,000 people worldwide have now died with the coronavirus, figures from Johns Hopkins University show.
> 
> There are more than 2.8 million confirmed cases of Covid-19, according to the tally.


—

'Cause Trudles jes' luvs him a good, ol' fashioned, basic dictatorship!

Communists took over THREE Canadian medical mask factories in China: Trudeau's government thinks it's a good news story



> Navdeep Bains, the Minister of Innovation, Science and Economic Development was pressed by CBC’s Vassey Kapelos about the recent revelation that one million medical masks that Canada had received from China were deemed defective.
> 
> However, instead of answering if even more medical supplies from China were compromised, Trudeau’s corporate welfare czar bragged how his government has inspired a medical mask company to return to Canada through investments — which is just government code for subsidies and handouts.


—

Not a surprise to anyone paying attention.

Revising the First Draft of Coronavirus History



> Incredibly, many in the mainstream media are taking a serious run at revisionist history in regards to the coronavirus and how it was reported in the early days. Some “reporters” somehow seem to think that in the course of just a few weeks, people magically will have forgotten what they said on social media or on-air or in publications.


—

Trudeau is exploiting the coronavirus crisis to silence free speech



> According to recent statements made to CBC reporters by Dominic LeBlanc, the federal government is drafting new legislation to “punish” those responsible for spreading online “disinformation” about COVID-19 online. Though the specific terms of this legislation are not yet clear, Justin Trudeau’s Liberals have deliberately made their intent publicly known and it is more important now than ever to speak up to pre-emptively end this catastrophic assault on free speech in Canada.


More:



> *The first thing that occurred to me when I heard about this plan is the obvious fact that this government feels it is a better use of their time and energy to police online rabble rousers than to come up with practical solutions for the pressing problems facing Canadians during this national crisis.*


Bold mine.

Ya know, if all this was about is "online rabble rousers" I'd probably have less issues with this. However, it's not. This is more about people levelling legitimate criticism against the Prog narrative than anything else. And Progs hate criticism.

—

Things you won't find coming from the WHO...

China tried to patent potential coronavirus drug Remsvidir the DAY AFTER Beijing confirmed virus was transmissable between humans



> On January 21 a patent for commercial use of Remdesivir was filed in China
> The application was made by the top-secret Wuhan Institute of Virology bio-lab
> It is at the centre of concerns about a possible leak of the coronavirus disease
> Leaked documents shown that China officials who knew they faced an epidemic delayed warning the public for six days


—

'Cause the fish eaters & producers are his supporters...

Trudeau promises aid for fish and seafood sector



> Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau announced an aid package of 62.5 million Canadian dollars (about US $44 million) for the country’s fish and seafood sector to fight the COVID-19 pandemic.
> 
> Fish and seafood are among the country’s top food exports and the sector reportedly employs some 72,000 people.


—

China Continues to Flood the World with Defective Medical Supplies



> More than a dozen countries on four continents have recently disclosed problems with Chinese-made coronavirus tests and personal protective equipment. The problems range from test kits tainted with the coronavirus to medical garments contaminated with insects.
> 
> Chinese authorities have refused to take responsibility for the defective equipment and in many instances have cast blame on the countries that purchased the material. They have also called on nations of the world to stop "politicizing" the problem.


—



> Wuhan Flu – Small Dead Animals





> On the state of antibody tests: from the Infectious Diseases Society of America (pdf);


—

Wuhan Flu: Unintelligent Design?



> If you have an hour, I recommend you watch this. (The keynote topic begins around 15:20 into the podcast but the discussion preceeding is also worthwhile.)
> 
> If you don’t have an hour, I recommend you make it. It’s your introduction to this: Lab-Made? SARS-CoV-2 Genealogy Through the Lens of Gain-of-Function Research
> 
> If you hear anyone claim “we know the virus didn’t come from a lab”, don’t buy it — it may well have. Labs around the globe have been creating synthetic viruses like CoV2 for years. And no, its genome would not necessarily contain hallmarks of human manipulation: modern genetic engineering tools permit cutting and pasting genomic fragments without leaving a trace. It can be done quickly, too: it took a Texas BSL4 lab less than 2 months to create a synthetic clone of CoV2.​


—

I don't understand the surprise. Progs gonna Prog...

'Hyper stupidity!' Oxford professor shamed over coronavirus vaccine rejection comments



> AN Oxford University professor who said she feared her famous institution being the first to find a coronavirus vaccine has sparked a furious reaction from Britons online, who have viciously accused her of "hyper stupidity" and lacking common sense.


—

Wuhan Flu



> There’s no human to human transmission, masks don’t work, and don’t worry about food shortages: Russia Cuts Off Wheat, Other Grain Exports
> 
> Another beef packier closes, this one in Wisconsin: _The Green Bay beef plant employees 1,200 people and “feeds nearly 3.2 million Americans every day,” according to JBS USA._
> 
> Long thread, lots of charts: _a lot of data on reported Covid deaths is highly suspect, so we’ve been looking into excess mortality — how many more people than usual have been dying around the world in recent weeks?_
> 
> The WHO deletes a tweet: _Unfortunately, several media outlets had already cited it_
> 
> 27 Tankers Anchored Off California, Hundreds Off Singapore As Oil Industry Shuts Down
> 
> …a flood of faulty COVID19 antibody test kits purchased from Chinese companies by the Indian Council of Medical Research has triggered a controversy


—

Where's the calls for RACIS!!!?

‘Calling For Americans To Die’: Chinese Official’s Tweet About Gargling Disinfectant Sparks Backlash



> A Communist Party of China spokesman sparked backlash after he said in a tweet Saturday that “some people” should be “injected” with disinfectant “or at least gargle with it” so “they won’t spread the virus, lies and hatred when talking.”
> 
> “Mr. President is right. Some people do need to be injected with #disinfectant, or at least gargle with it. That way they won’t spread the virus, lies and hatred when talking,” Hu Zhaoming wrote on Twitter.


—

Huh...

Giuliani: ‘Fauci Gave $3.7 Million to Wuhan Laboratory’ in 2014



> Sunday on New York AM 970 radio’s “The Cats Roundtable,” Rudy Giuliani, personal legal counsel for President Donald Trump, accused the President Barack Obama administration in 2014 of funding the Wuhan laboratory in which the coronavirus is believed to have originated.
> 
> Giuliani said if he were U.S. Attorney, he would open an investigation to find out what the Obama administration and Dr. Anthony Fauci as a director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases knew about the practices going on in Wuhan when they sent $3.7 million.


—

Chinada



> All the way to the bottom.
> 
> Today I was going to ask Trudeau about how China managed to convince 8 members of the WHO committee to vote in favour of the Xi Jinping's virus coverup. *Tam was on the committee. How did she vote?*
> I wasn't chosen, so you have to settle for 5 Qs begging for more gov. spending.
> 
> — Keean Bexte (@TheRealKeean) April 27, 2020​


Bold mine.

Questions, questions, questions...


----------



## FeXL

Duplicate.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Here's a beauty:


Un-frigging-believable.

As I noted in my link dump above: already rewriting history...


----------



## FeXL

Interesting read. I've always wondered about those "flu death" numbers...

Comparing COVID-19 Deaths to Flu Deaths Is like Comparing Apples to Oranges



> When reports about the novel coronavirus SARS-CoV-2 began circulating earlier this year and questions were being raised about how the illness it causes, COVID-19, compared to the flu, it occurred to me that, in four years of emergency medicine residency and over three and a half years as an attending physician, I had almost never seen anyone die of the flu. I could only remember one tragic pediatric case.


More:



> In the last six flu seasons, the CDC’s reported number of actual confirmed flu deaths—that is, counting flu deaths the way we are currently counting deaths from the coronavirus—has ranged from 3,448 to 15,620, which far lower than the numbers commonly repeated by public officials and even public health experts.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Interesting read. I've always wondered about those "flu death" numbers...
> 
> Comparing COVID-19 Deaths to Flu Deaths Is like Comparing Apples to Oranges
> 
> 
> 
> More:


So essentially, he's also saying that urging people to get flu vaccines is based on bogus data.


----------



## Beej

Suncor research being used to develop COVID-19 antibody test
https://calgaryherald.com/business/...est/wcm/2389deaa-1f7c-407b-8d0c-07e68e0a2fcc/


> Martin Flatley — a biochemical engineer based at the company’s Sarnia, Ont., refinery — said it’s not a huge leap to go from a wastewater treatment application to COVID-19 antibody testing, as the DNA sequencing technology is the same. The research team is using a type of algae that shows a lot of promise for not only producing the protein needed for antibody testing, but producing it with the correct modifications to mimic how it’s made in humans.


An unexpected twist.


----------



## SINC

*Coronavirus hype biggest political hoax in history*



> The new coronavirus is real.
> 
> The response to the coronavirus is hyped. And in time, this hype will be revealed as politically hoaxed.
> 
> In fact, COVID-19 will go down as one of the political world’s biggest, most shamefully overblown, overhyped, overly and irrationally inflated and outright deceptively flawed responses to a health matter in American history, one that was carried largely on the lips of medical professionals who have no business running a national economy or government.
> 
> The facts are this: COVID-19 is a real disease that sickens some, proves fatal to others, mostly the elderly — and does nothing to the vast majority.
> That’s it.


https://www.washingtontimes.com/new...U-PgutcoT8smCR5ScKxnHan1bKhtlq0fqTt48mdOlQriA


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> So essentially, he's also saying that urging people to get flu vaccines is based on bogus data.


It presents that way, doesn't it?


----------



## CubaMark

SINC said:


> *Coronavirus hype biggest political hoax in history*
> 
> https://www.washingtontimes.com/new...U-PgutcoT8smCR5ScKxnHan1bKhtlq0fqTt48mdOlQriA


Isn't it a little early to be taking this opinion as fact?

Were the 27-thousand deaths in Italy a hoax? The 24-thousand deaths in Spain?

Reading the comments to that article (in a notoriously unreliable right-wing newspaper at that), this fellow put it pretty well:

*BlueChilli*
_This is the most ignorant and misguided article I've read to date on the Coronavirus. It is NOT like the flu, nor even close. There are vaccines for the flu. The death rate for the flu is at .1%. The death rate for the Coronavirus, IN THE U.S., is hovering around 5%. Simple math tells you the Coronavirus is 50 times more deadly than the flu. 

Also, your asinine proclamation the models were overblown. Yes, they account for worst-case scenarios. That's how they operate. But it's truly incredible - when scientists step in and give us ways to "slow the spread," and we actually enact those steps, and the numbers go down (as predicted) - idiots like yourself shout from the rooftops, "See! There was never anything to worry about!" 

And to say "it does nothing to the vast majority" is completely irresponsible. You have no facts or data to back that up, because right now, we simply have no idea the percentage of people that stay asymptomatic through the duration of the virus. The FACTS are, in a little over two months, the Coronavirus has infected over 1 million Americans, and killed over 50,000. 

THOSE are the facts. I'd love to see you sit down with the families of people killed by this virus and explain to them it's no big deal. Explain to the immunocompromised that they should sacrifice themselves so that you can go to church and worship a fake person in the sky. Explain to them that you getting a haircut is more important than their lives. You are truly ignorant and truly selfish._​
Politicians are damned if they do / damned if they don't. If they take actions as the have to lockdown the population and prevent the spread of coronavirus, they're criticized for "taking away our freedoms". If they leave it up to the public to be responsible, and keep everything open, they'll be vilified for not acting responsibly and -among the more wacko types- attempting to 'cull the herd' / population control / some other 'UN black helicopter' conspiracy.

Let's hope the post-crisis assessments are free of ideology and axe-grinding (a guy can dream, can't he?).


----------



## eMacMan

See that CM is still unable to figure out how to reduce his memes to a manageable size.

So we have 2 excellent closed system experiments. The Diamond Princess Cruise Ship and the Teddy Roosevelt Aircraft Carrier.

DP had a mixture of healthy staff, and largely older customers, many with pre-existing conditions. With none of the so called safety protocol, perfect conditions for spreading the virus, and 100% testing there was 17% infection and under 2% of those died.

TR was almost all healthy young individuals. Attempts were made to isolate but probably too late in the game. Again with perfect conditions to spread the virus and 100% testing, there were 17% (800) individuals infected, only 9 hospitalized and no deaths.

IOW for most people Covid not a threat. It is perhaps unusually deadly for those who have multiple pre-existing conditions alá any influenza outbreak. *Can anyone confirm that 80% of the Ontario deaths were in nursing homes?*

It is however a worldwide social oppression/control effort which would have left Hitler or Stalin green with envy.


----------



## Beej

NATO Goes to War With Universal Trolls
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/28/the...l-over-trolls-world-tour-digital-success.html


> Desperate times call for desperate measures. That’s how the National Association of Theatre Owners is explaining the digital success of Universal’s “Trolls World Tour.”


I made some minor edits to the article's title.


----------



## CubaMark

eMacMan said:


> See that CM is still unable to figure out how to reduce his memes to a manageable size.


Apologies - you seem to be the only person for whom ehmac doesn't automatically resize images on-the-fly. To resize the meme I have to download it, open in preview, resize, save, upload to my dropbox, copy the link, go back to ehMac, paste the link, modify the link so that it ends in "raw=1" instead of "dl=0" so that it hotlinks correctly.

Sometimes I'm pressed for time... I do not intentionally do it to bother you 



eMacMan said:


> It is however a worldwide social oppression/control effort which would have left Hitler or Stalin green with envy.


To what end? What is the point of every government on earth, with their various kinds of government, all implementing the same public policies on health? What exactly do you think the boogeymen in the shadows are attempting to gain by all of this?


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

No.



CubaMark said:


> Isn't it a little early to be taking this opinion as fact?


As opposed to all the notoriously unreliable & filled with outright lies Prog newspapers?



CubaMark said:


> Reading the comments to that article (in a notoriously unreliable right-wing newspaper at that)...


The models were outright _wrong_. Period. They were based on faulty input that was nowhere near grounded in reality.



CubaMark said:


> Also, your asinine proclamation the models were overblown.​


No, they don't. Asked & answered.



CubaMark said:


> Yes, they account for worst-case scenarios. That's how they operate.​


Correlation is not cause. The numbers could be going down simply because the disease has run its course.



CubaMark said:


> But it's truly incredible - when scientists step in and give us ways to "slow the spread," and we actually enact those steps, and the numbers go down (as predicted)...​


No, they're not. Politicians bring most of this upon themselves & deservedly so. You've got the idiot in New York criticizing open beaches while his subway remains open. You've got other idiots chasing down license numbers of vehicles attending drive-in church services all the while mosques are wide open. Law-abiding people are in lockdown while criminals are set free to roam the streets! You've got our own Prime Groper letting 2000 potential cases of the virus fly into the country direct from the source without quarantine! In addition, he ignored the very report that his current head doctor prepared on pandemics over 15 years ago. You've got Canada's top doctor contradicting herself every few days or on the chances of infection and the wearing of masks. Speaking of whom, she's also been parroting the crap from the WHO which has long since distinguished itself as been nothing more than a pro-Chi-Com mouthpiece. What about The Dope giving away our PPE & supplies to China? What about his decision to destroy thousands of pallets of gear & close down warehouses over the course of the last few years, not bothering to replace it? What about his decision to ignore Blue Dot?

At this point one could write a book about crap decisions made by politicians the world over regarding the Chinese coronavirus, yet the pandemic is not over & half of them haven't even come to light yet!

If these assholes had not worried about the political optics & slammed the borders shut on day one, thousands more people in Canada alone would still be alive today. Likely 10's of thousands the planet over. The politicians _own_ this clusterfukc.



CubaMark said:


> Politicians are damned if they do / damned if they don't.


<snort> Never happen. 'Cause the selfsame assholes who have been screwing over the population and making poor decisions during the pandemic will be the ones conducting the analysis. They'll pat themselves on the back, congratulate each other & go celebrate on the backs of we, the taxpayers.



CubaMark said:


> Let's hope the post-crisis assessments are free of ideology and axe-grinding (a guy can dream, can't he?).


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Control.



CubaMark said:


> What is the point of every government on earth, with their various kinds of government, all implementing the same public policies on health?


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Hello, Bigot.
> 
> Control.


Isn't that enough incentive for dimbulbs and mediocre people to act?


----------



## Macfury

Sorry to break your faith in "Blue Chilli" but we have no way of knowing the death rate in the U.S. until we have some good information on background infections and asymptomatic carriers. Given just a 10 to 1 rate of background infection to currently known infections overall, the death rate drops to 0.5%. Removing seniors (who should be quarantined if they wish) the death rate drops to about 0.25%. Unreasonably attributing co-morbidities to death by COVID-19 reduces the rate further.

"Simple math" fails to adequately represent reality.



CubaMark said:


> The death rate for the flu is at .1%. The death rate for the Coronavirus, IN THE U.S., is hovering around 5%. Simple math tells you the Coronavirus is 50 times more deadly than the flu.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Sorry to break your faith in "Blue Chilli" but we have no way of knowing the death rate in the U.S. until we have some good information on background infections and asymptomatic carriers. Given just a 10 to 1 rate of background infection to currently known infections overall, the death rate drops to 0.5%. Removing seniors (who should be quarantined if they wish) the death rate drops to about 0.25%. Unreasonably attributing co-morbidities to death by COVID-19 reduces the rate further.
> 
> "Simple math" fails to adequately represent reality.


Sorry CM but when you see 50,000 cases with 2500 deaths it means nothing unless you also factor in the number tested, then factor in total cases against number tested, and use that to extrapolate what portion of the general population has or has had the virus. Even then to be truly representative it has to be random sampling. Just testing those you believe have been exposed can still bias the totals. Should explain the value of the Diamond Princess and Teddy Roosevelt as data sources. 100% tested, two very different demographics and the virus has had sufficient time to run its course.

It is still straight forward math, which all of the lamestream propaganda believers consistently ignore. But when it's been carried out the death rate of those with the virus drops below the 0.1% bar associated with various influenza strains. 

So you have sacrificed your civil liberties for naught and I can guarantee the bums in charge will not willingly relinquish the power they have gained. Hell they even introduced anti-social distancing to make it nearly impossible for the well informed to protest.


----------



## Beej

Excess mortality information for Europe
https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps/

A fellow ehmacer shared this site with me, and it's worth checking out. It shows how deaths (all causes, from slips and falls to corona virus) have shot up in many European countries. Well beyond prior years when there was just the flu (and heart disease, and traffic accidents, etc.).

Or maybe a bunch of people just decided to die in March and April, well beyond rates seen in previous years. Could be corona virus, could be Rise of Skywalker. Nobody really knows.


----------



## eMacMan

Beej said:


> Excess mortality information for Europe
> https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps/
> 
> A fellow ehmacer shared this site with me, and it's worth checking out. It shows how deaths (all causes, from slips and falls to corona virus) have shot up in many European countries. Well beyond prior years when there was just the flu (and heart disease, and traffic accidents, etc.).
> 
> Or maybe a bunch of people just decided to die in March and April, well beyond rates seen in previous years. Could be corona virus, could be Rise of Skywalker. Nobody really knows.


Several studies have established that increasing unemployment dramayically increases pre-mature deaths. A lot of causes, domestic violence, suicide, stress induced disease, stress related heart attacks (routinely labeled covid, as heart attacks generate the same RNA fragment which is used to diagnose covid) and a whole bunch more. Sounds to me like those numbers simply confirm the studies.

It is almost certain that throwing this many people out of work will kill more people than covid. Then there is the impact the added stress places on the immune system, not to mention deliberately weakening immune systems via isolation and anti-social distancing.

Still if you are a Eugenicist, whose main goal is to kill off 90% of the planetary population, starting with the frail and elderly, then manufacturing a Covid crisis is a blockbuster start. If your goal is to bring North Korean style repression to the western world, then Covid has been a roaring success. If your goal is to devastate economies world wide, you've drawn a royal flush. If your goal was to see billionaires further stuff their vaults, by selling short just before the lock down, you're grinning like a $#!t rolling dog. If your goal is raking in $Billion$ by forcing mandatory vaccinations world wide, it's wet dream territory.


----------



## Beej

eMacMan said:


> Several studies have established that increasing unemployment dramayically increases pre-mature deaths. A lot of causes, domestic violence, suicide, stress induced disease, stress related heart attacks (routinely labeled covid, as heart attacks generate the same RNA fragment which is used to diagnose covid) and a whole bunch more. Sounds to me like those numbers simply confirm the studies.


Raising unemployment causes large numbers of seniors to die in a month or two? You're not even trying anymore.

This is a Soros-Gates plot to use 5G combined with Rise of Skywalker to shut down the economies of the world. Most of all, shut down Big Potato, which has been their primary target all along.
https://globalnews.ca/news/6870689/coronavirus-canada-food-supply/

You see, Soros-Gates ancestors were killed in a tragic potato accident, and the orphans vowed to seek revenge. Anyone who can't see this loves tyranny, or something.


----------



## FeXL

~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!

On New Year’s Eve, when a Canadian company called BlueDot first got an alert from its computer system that a mysterious disease was spreading in China, their algorithm started churning through data to predict where coronavirus would go next.

Related:

BlueDot warnings ignored by officials for three months



> The Americans are agog over the fact that a “little” Canadian company raised warnings about a strange virus in Wuhan back on Dec. 31.


—

Big government failed in COVID-19 pandemic



> Contrary to myth, Canada’s response to the COVID-19 pandemic hasn’t been an argument in favour of big government *but a savage indictment of it.*


Bold mine.

Related:

Poilievre says Trudeau is using 'freakonomics' during pandemic, says response is a 'governmental failure'



> Conservative Shadow Finance Minister Pierre Poilievre gave a held a press conference Sunday, calling the situation coronavirus has put Canada in a "governmental failure."
> 
> Poilievre criticized Trudeau for his decision to ignore the Canadian intelligence community's warning of a fast-spreading virus that had swept through China, with Trudeau deciding to still allow flights from China.


Related, too:

Rex Murphy on the COVID crisis: Our Parliament has 'evanished.' Does no one care?



> Is it really true that we, Canada, more precisely the Canadian government, has received a shipment of faulty medical masks from the Communist regency of China?
> 
> Surely this cannot be. China? Sending our country defective medical devices during a global pandemic? Unthinkable.


Right?

Related, 3:

Caution: Link to MotherCorpse inside.

CBC runs cover for WHO flunky Tam



> ‘Was it perfect? No’: Theresa Tam discusses Canada’s early pandemic response


There's the understatement of the decade...

Related, 4:

Hey, Trudles: Life won't return to normal until we oust the f'ing Progs from Ottawa...

Trudeau says that life won't return to normal even when we have a vaccine 'two or three years from now'



> "What is a normal life will take a long time to return, and even at this point, two or three years from now, even once a vaccine against COVID-19 is available, we will have changed our behaviour. We will have taken measures as a society that will be different from what we used to do," Trudeau said in French.


Related, 5:

Canada could reach 66,835 cases by May 5, with 3,883 deaths



> Canada is closing in on 50,000 known cases, of which more than 2,700 have been fatal


Related, 6:

Let's just consider that a rhetorical question...

Is Canada’s Response to COVID-19 Led by China Sympathizers?



> Tam’s public record is deplorable. Indeed, she has been wrong at every turn. “Right now," she said at a critical juncture, “the risk is low in Canada.” She assured us that travel bans were not necessary since they were not recommended by the WHO. Recently, Conservative Member of Parliament Derek Sloan, one of the four contenders for the party leadership vacated by Andrew Scheer, circulated an email highly critical of Tam recommending that she either resign or be fired. Sloan pointed out her failure on several counts, including:
> 
> Dr. Theresa Tam has continually cited the WHO as an authority.
> 
> Dr. Tam said face masks don’t work. Not true.
> 
> She said closing the borders to travelers arriving from virus hotspots wouldn’t work. Not true.
> 
> She spent the month of January echoing the WHO’s contention that anyone worried about the virus was indulging in racism.
> 
> She was wrong on travel bans.
> 
> She was wrong on asymptomatic transmission.
> 
> She was wrong on voluntary quarantines.​


But 54% of Canadians still swear Blackie & his crew did a good job! XX)

Related, 7:

Canada’s Theresa Tam knew in January that China lied about the Wuhan coronavirus



> Health Committee documents reveal the Public Health Agency of Canada led by Dr. Theresa Tam knew explicitly that there was person to person spread of the coronavirus in China as early as January 15, 2020.


Related, 8:

Again, love the meme.

Federal government projects nearly 3,900 coronavirus deaths by next week



> Chief public health officer Dr. Theresa Tam says the percentage of people who have died of the virus has also grown by several percentage points since federal officials released their original models.


Related, 9:

John Robson on COVID-19: Why can't politicians just tell us the truth?



> Now that various jurisdictions are wrestling with unlocking the economy, we need to take off the bubble wrap. Especially from our minds. There is no perfect solution and seeking one is dangerous, here as everywhere.


Related, 10:

The Gropenfuhrer is absolutely right! We need to stop shipping these items to Kaybeck _immediately_...

Trudeau regrets lack of French labels during the pandemic



> Trudeau said many companies that are now manufacturing medical equipment or hand sanitizers don’t have bilingual staff or the capabilities “to make that happen”.


Qui sait? She may be fish tank cleaner. Tabernac!

Related, 11:

Dr. Theresa Tam should answer questions about COVID-19 failures or resign



> What kind of a public servant dodges valid questions from elected officials about an unprecedented national crisis?


Related, 12:

Dr. Theresa Tam owes MPs answers to tough questions



> Imagine being the woman in charge of Canada’s medical response to COVID-19 and you are too busy to answer questions from the elected officials you report to.
> 
> That’s the position we find ourselves in with Dr. Theresa Tam.


Related, 13:

Still doesn't let the bastards off the hook for not closing the border quick enough.

Canada's early COVID-19 cases came from the U.S. not China, provincial data shows



> The global COVID-19 pandemic began in Wuhan, China, but data from Canada’s largest provinces show it was American travellers, not Chinese, who brought the deadly virus to our shores.
> 
> Despite this evidence, the federal government brought in travel restrictions on China first and American border restrictions were the last to be put in place.


Related, 14:

United Front groups in Canada helped Beijing stockpile coronavirus safety supplies



> By late January, sources in manufacturing and military circles were warning western governments that China seemed to be covertly seizing global PPE supply, O’Toole and Guajardo said.
> 
> *But leaders in Canada didn’t act*, according to O’Toole.


Bold mine.

Shocka. The Chi-Coms could steal this country blind & the only time Blackie would say anything is if they went after his precious f'ing socks...

Related, 15:

Canadians need to know what models Trudeau's government used to justify coronavirus restrictions



> Nearly six weeks into a crisis that has brought about the most extreme shutdown of the economy and curtailment of civil liberties in most people’s living memory, and governments have still not released the data and assumptions on which their fear-inducing COVID-19 predictions are based. Models based on speculation and insufficiently-cited sources, even when combined with good intentions, should not form the basis of public policy, which must comply with the _Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms_.


Honestly now... Would it surprise anyone if it became public knowledge that Blackie never used a model upon which to make this decision?

Related, 16:

In 2010 Video, Theresa Tam Mused About ‘Putting Bracelets On Arms’ To Track People During Pandemic



> A recent video of Theresa Tam is making the rounds, and raising eyebrows for two reasons.
> 
> It’s from a 2010 documentary on a hypothetical pandemic, and a hypothetical response.
> 
> The first part is the disturbing discussion of ‘putting bracelets on arms’ to track people and enforce non-compliance with mandatory quarantines. Tam goes into detail on the draconian measures that could be used within a country, a marked contrast from her refusal (and the refusal of Trudeau & Hajdu) to impose even the most minor restrictions on non-Citizens entering the country.
> 
> Secondly, Tam talks about the importance of ‘over-preparing,’ saying it would be better to get criticized for over-reacting than under-reacting.
> 
> That makes Tam’s response to the virus crisis even more strange.


Watch it before the PC Police delete it...

—

Love the meme.

Lessons Unlearned That Have Come Back to Haunt Us – A pandemic reveals the collectivist enemy.

As I write this, there are over a quarter of a million recorded deaths from the corona virus and many many more to come. We know now that the virus originated in Wuhan China, probably in its virology lab, and that the Chinese concealed the fact that it was contagious between humans and deadly for weeks.

—

If you like the pandemic lockdown, you're going to love the 'Green New Deal'



> Now, however, thanks to the pandemic lockdown of society, the public is in a position to judge what the “Green New Deal” revolution would look like. It's like redoing this global pandemic and economic slump every year.


—

Shocka...

There’s more evidence that the ‘Trump made us eat fish tank cleaner’ story is fake

—

Hey, Prime Moistener: Hold _this..._

The provinces are moving ahead with reopenings, even as the feds try to hold them back



> On Thursday, Saskatchewan Premier Scott Moe released his “Re-Open Saskatchewan” plan, which cautiously brings society back to life starting May 4.


—

At least 12 UK children have needed intensive care due to illness linked to Covid-19



> More than a dozen children have fallen ill with a new and potentially fatal combination of symptoms apparently linked to Covid-19, including a sore stomach and heart problems.
> 
> The children affected appear to have been struck by a form of toxic shock syndrome. All have been left so seriously unwell that they have had to be treated in intensive care.


—

RACIS'!!!

Mexico Deports Nearly All Of Its Illegal Migrants Amid Coronavirus Fears, Government Reveals



> Mexico has almost completely cleared out its migrant centers as a precaution against the coronavirus outbreak, its government announced.
> 
> The National Migration Institute (INM), the agency in Mexico that manages immigration, said it has been deporting immigrants from the country’s 65 migrant facilities since March 21, according to Reuters. The actions are being made in order to comply with safety and health guidelines amid the coronavirus pandemic.


Curious The Bigot hasn't noted this...

—

India cancels order for 'faulty' China rapid test kits



> India has cancelled orders for about half a million coronavirus rapid testing kits from China after they were found to be "faulty".


----------



## FeXL

Insanity: Wash. State Came One Vote Away From Releasing Green River Serial Killer So He Wouldn't Get Wuhan Virus



> The man we now know as the Green River Killer, Gary Ridgeway, was sent to prison for more than 500 years. He was convicted of 49 murders of prostitutes, girls on the streets and vulnerable runaways, but he was suspected of committing 71 murders in the 1970s, '80s and '90s.
> 
> He would take the women and girls, have sex with them, and then strangle them, watching the light go out of their eyes as he squeezed the life out of them. Sometimes he'd use a rope and sometimes he'd use his bare hands. He'd pose their bodies and sometimes come back and have sex with the corpses. His first victims were found in the Green River, giving the monster his moniker.
> 
> He was arrested in the '80s but let go for lack of evidence. A task force was formed to track down the serial killer and in 2001, decades and multiple victims later, Gary Ridgeway was busted again and confessed to 71 murders.


—

Caution: Link to MotherCorpse inside.

May as well move CBC HQ to Beijing now – CBC Launches attack on Epoch Times over Chinese Virus coverage



> ‘Racist and inflammatory’: Canadians upset by Epoch Times claim China behind virus, made it as a bioweapon


Related:

CBC Intentionally Excludes Crucial Facts About Epoch Times and Our Coverage of Beijing’s Coverup of Virus Outbreak



> The Epoch Times recently published a special edition on how Beijing’s coverup of the coronavirus outbreak in Wuhan led to the global pandemic with the front-page headline “How the Chinese Communist Party Endangered the World.” It’s an eight-page collection of Epoch Times articles distributed to select areas in Canada, as we believe it contains important information for Canadians to have.


Related, too:

Love the meme.

Exposing CBC’s disgraceful story attacking anti-Communist China Epoch Times



> Are “Canadians upset” at the “racist and inflammatory” Epoch Times sending free copies of their anti-CCP newspaper to some major urban centres and smaller communities? Or is the CBC publishing fake news?


—

Damn, that virus is strong! It can break through plate glass windows in a singe leap!

City of Ottawa’s New Motto – ‘Karen Makes Us Stronger’



> City tells families to stop visiting loved ones at long-term care windows


—

Shocka.

Canada donated masks to China. Chinese mask makers now price-gouging Canada.



> In early February, Canada donated 16 tonnes of personal protective equipment, such as clothing, face shields, masks, goggles and gloves to China to help the Chinese doctors and nurses battling the original Covid-19 outbreak in Wuhan.
> 
> But now as Canada desperately tries to replenish the nation’s PPE supply, Chinese manufacturers are charging prices that are five times what they were before the coronavirus crisis.


—

MPs vote to summon key WHO adviser after global body refuses to let him testify



> A parliamentary committee has voted to employ a rarely used power to summon key World Health Organization adviser Bruce Aylward after the global body declined to allow him to testify before MPs on how it responded to the COVID-19 pandemic.
> 
> The Commons health committee on Thursday voted unanimously in favour of a motion to call Dr. Aylward to appear before the committee. MPs for the Liberals, Conservatives, Bloc Québécois and NDP all backed it.


Doesn't matter. They'll all give the WHO a pass anyway.


----------



## FeXL

Funeral Directors Blow the Whistle on Deaths Falsely Attributed to Coronavirus



> “Basically, every death certificate that comes across our desk now has COVID on it,” said a funeral director in Williston Park, N.Y., on a recorded phone call with Project Veritas in a newly-released video. James O’Keefe has been asking for people inside the medical system to blow the whistle if they see corruption or inconsistencies in reports about the Chinese WuFlu known as COVID-19. In conversations with several funeral directors across New York City, O’Keefe uncovered a shocking narrative where, without fail, every director he spoke to expressed his or her concern that coronavirus deaths are being inflated and every death in NYC is being recorded as a COVID death with or without testing to confirm.


—

Respiratory Expert Says People Are Leaving A Critical Tool Unused In Coronavirus Fight



> Respiratory Expert Dr. Bruce Davidson says the same principles that allow people to expect a downturn in the coronavirus pandemic during the summer can be used to eliminate the virus indoors as well.
> 
> Davidson, a pulmonary physician and former president of the National Tuberculosis Controllers Association, sat down with White House correspondent Anders Hagstrom to discuss in detail his op-ed on the potential use of UV-C ceiling lamps to kill coronavirus germs in hospitals and even homes. Ultraviolet rays, which are present in sunlight, are believed by many to kill COVID-19, and Davidson says lamps emitting similar light could be installed inexpensively and at low risk to others.


—

Rules are for the little people...

Barack Obama Goes Golfing at Country Club the Day After Michelle Urged African Americans to Stay Home



> On Friday, two PSAs featuring former first lady Michelle Obama urging African Americans to stay home in order to prevent the spread of the coronavirus were released. Prominent African American radio hosts who have nationally syndicated shows shared the PSAs.
> 
> ...
> 
> Apparently, her husband didn’t get the memo. The day after the PSAs were released, Barack Obama was seen playing golf at Robert Trent Golf Club in Gainesville, Virginia. Politico Playbook reported on Sunday


—

The Morning Rant: Minimalist Edition



> Cuomo on COVID-19 in Nursing Homes: 'It's Not Our Job'
> 
> At the same time Gov. Andrew Cuomo was using his daily press briefings to berate President Trump for his inability to provide New York with 36,000 ventilators that his state never needed, along with demanding that the federal government supply his state with sufficient personal protective equipment, he was ignoring the pleas from administrators at his own state’s nursing homes for help in stemming the tide of deaths in their facilities.
> 
> Fifty-eight percent of all COVID-19 deaths in the state of New York have occurred in nursing homes in New York City. Gov. Cuomo is complicit in these deaths by making the fateful decision to force nursing homes to take in patients infected with the deadly virus. Yet the governor continues to refuse to take responsibility for that decision. In fact, Gov. Cuomo recently implied that it was greedy health-care facility owners that were to blame for the deaths. As the New York Post editorial board wrote, “Gov. Andrew Cuomo has taken to answering questions on the subject with insults. ‘Ohh, money,’ the gov snarked Monday, suggesting a nonprofit nursing home didn’t relocate its infected residents to hospitals because it would then ‘no longer be getting paid.’ ”​
> "It's not our job?" Who's fvcking job is it then? You squawk and preen and crow about your responsibility to save lives and take care of New Yorkers, but it looks suspiciously like all you want to do is bolster your own power-mad ego and further your pathetic and ridiculous political fantasies.


—

Will the actual numbers...



> ...end up justifying all the hysteria?
> 
> It sure doesn't look like it...
> 
> _Why are *death rates falling* while COVID-19 deaths continue to grow? It may be that many deaths that *aren’t really COVID-19 related* are counted as that anyway. The net effect is to exaggerate COVID-19 deaths, while underestimating others.
> 
> Employing simple arithmetic, in a pandemic you would expect a surge in overall deaths, all things being equal.
> 
> Could it be that the number of COVID-19 deaths has been inflated? There’s *strong evidence* for this._​


—

Wuhan Flu



> A morning sampling.
> 
> This is insane: _In a memo this week, Dean Lett, director of long-term care for the city [of Ottawa], asked families to stop visiting their loved ones at windows “to help ensure that physical distancing remains in place for all our residents.”_
> 
> Practicing communist _De Blasio’s stubborn refusal to take the coronavirus seriously may have caused thousands of deaths._
> 
> Ask him about Taiwan: _The WHO refuses to clear WHO official Dr. Bruce Aylward to speak at the Parliamentary Health Committee. The committee may take the unusual step of issuing a summons, which would force Aylward to testify._
> 
> At Instapundit:
> 
> Patterns of COVID-19 Mortality and Vitamin D: An Indonesian Study. A Facebook friend’s succinct summary of the findings in this study: “Just under half (49.7%) of cases had normal vitamin D status, and only 4% of them died. Just over a quarter (27%) had insufficient vitamin D status, and most of them (88%) died. Just under a quarter (23%) had deficient vitamin D status, and almost all of them (99%) died.”
> 
> The study calls anything over 30 ng/ml as normal Vitamin D; my doctor prefers in the neighborhood of 60. No guarantee from these data, though, that more is better, but I wouldn’t be surprised if that were the case. On the other hand, you’d expect lower death rates in Italy and Spain than Germany, then, wouldn’t you? Or are that many Germans going on winter holidays in the Greek islands?​
> Cardiac risks are not getting nearly enough attention: _Retrospective study of out-of-hospital cardiac arrest in Lombardy, Italy, during first 40 days of #COVID19 outbreak. There was a 58% increase compared with same period in previous year. Of the extra cases, 77.4% suspected or confirmed to have Covid-19._
> 
> Hydroxychloroquine by the state: Cases vs Recoveries
> 
> *Please let this be true: Tests in recovered patients in S. Korea found false positives, not reinfections*


Bold mine.

—

~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!

Better Dead Than Red, White And Blue



> *When pushed by Scheer as to why Health Canada will not accept FDA approval for a C19 treatment or cure, Trudeau answer, "We will not give up our sovereignty". Yes, die people, waiting for Canadian pencil pushers dotting i's.*


Bold mine.

—

New York City Mayor Bill DiBlasio to Jews: Drop Dead



> My message to the Jewish community, and all communities, is this simple: the time for warnings has passed. I have instructed the NYPD to proceed immediately to summons or even arrest those who gather in large groups. This is about stopping this disease and saving lives. Period.
> — Mayor Bill de Blasio (@NYCMayor) April 29, 2020​


—

WHOhan Flu



> China's puppet, the WHO, "accidentally" published negative (and presumably untrue) data about remdesivir while China was actively stealing Gilead's IP by trying to patent it in China. #DecouplefromChina https://t.co/93fNfc1tU7
> 
> — Scott Adams (@ScottAdamsSays) April 29, 2020​


—

The Plague Of Heroes



> Given the facts emerging about the Chinese flu virus, the panic should be subsiding, but too many people are too invested in the panic, for personal and political reasons, to let this thing go away quietly. Instead we have a new round of drama as the heroic politicians listen to the heroic TikTok workers about when they can safely stop tormenting people over what is looking like a real life example of this famous quote. If it ever was, it is no longer about public safety. Instead it is about the drama queens.
> 
> Here in Lagos, the local dictator has issued an edict requiring everyone to wear their underwear over their heads if they go outside. That’s a slight exaggeration, but not that much of one. The requirement to wear masks, something unavailable for months, means people are wearing all sorts of outlandish get-ups. More than a few times I have seen women with what looks like feminine napkins on their face. There have undoubtedly been men wearing briefs on their heads just to go outside.


—

Hawaiian Brewery Under Investigation for Hand Sanitizer Giveaway



> A brewing company in Hawaii is being investigated by a liquor board for giving away hand sanitizer during the COVID-19 outbreak with alcohol purchases.
> 
> With the temporary death of the bar scene across the country due to stay-at-home orders, brewers and distillers large and small have adjusted on the fly and have started converting to the production of sanitizer instead of beer or liquor, for now.
> 
> Maui Brewing Co. in Hawaii began manufacturing hand sanitizer late in March after shutting down its restaurants and brewery to anything but takeout sales. They've been giving away hand sanitizer with purchases at their Kihei location, and they've also donated more than 1,000 gallons of hand sanitizer to local first responders.


I've had Maui Brewing beer. Their Coconut Porter is excellent.

—

Wuhan Flu



> Your morning grab bag.
> 
> This earns a gold star: NYC mayor Bill De Blasio to start rounding up Jews
> 
> Is hydroxychloroquine helping in New Brunswick? Maybe. It didn’t prevent serious disease in a small study of Lupus patients. So, results remain mixed.
> 
> Trump signs an _executive order on Tuesday invoking the Defense Production Act to keep meat processing plants open, a senior White House official told CBS News. Plants owned by some of the country’s largest food companies have struggled with outbreaks of the coronavirus among workers and a growing death toll._
> 
> Consumer activity has yet to return in China, despite an economic re-opening.
> 
> Nothing to hide: _Australia will continue campaigning for an inquiry into the origins of the coronavirus outbreak despite a furious reaction from Beijing_
> 
> Alex Baldwin gives his Stamp Of Approval: Wash. State Came One Vote Away From Releasing Green River Serial Killer So He Wouldn’t Get Wuhan Virus
> 
> Better news;
> 
> _A new antibody test to check whether someone has been infected with coronavirus which claims to be 99 per cent accurate has been certified for use across Europe. Global diagnostics specialists Abbott, which has a UK base in Maidenhead, has said it is expecting to have shipped millions of the laboratory based lab tests across Europe by the end of May._
> 
> …accumulating data on Remdesivir suggests it’s active against covid and there’s now enough data to support consideration of access under an emergency use authorization by FDA. The data from NIAID study should push this firmly over the line.


—

Western University study finds evidence COVID-19 had origins in bats



> A team of computer scientists and biologists at Western University says their data concurs with the belief bats are the origin of COVID-19.
> 
> The conclusion comes after high-powered computers at the university analyzed the 29 SARS-CoV2 RNA sequences against 5,300 known viruses in animals.
> 
> The study was co-led by Western Biology Professor Kathleen Hill and University of Waterloo Computer Science Professor Lila Kari with the support of students at Western and Waterloo.


—

The Politics of Science in the Time of the Virus



> Remember how President Trump was widely mocked for suggesting that light could be inserted inside of a patient to kill the Wuhan virus? Josh Disbrow, the CEO of Aytu BioScience, has just written an Op-Ed about his company being thrust into the public spotlight:
> 
> _ My team and I knew the president’s comments could trigger a backlash against the idea of UV light as a treatment, which might hinder our ability to get the word out. We decided to create a YouTube account, upload a video animation we had created, and tweet it out. It received some 50,000 views in 24 hours.
> 
> Then YouTube took it down. So did Vimeo. Twitter suspended our account. The narrative changed from whether UV light can be used to treat Covid-19 to “Aytu is being censored.”
> 
> These days, politics seems to dictate that if one party says, “The sky is blue,” the other party is obligated to reply, “No, it’s not, and you’re a terrible human being for thinking that.” That leaves no room for science, in which the data speak for themselves, regardless of ideology, and only when they’re ready. Unfortunately, the visceral excitement of political conflict draws far more clicks and better ratings than the methodical world of science._​


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Davidson, a pulmonary physician and former president of the National Tuberculosis Controllers Association, sat down with White House correspondent Anders Hagstrom to discuss in detail his op-ed on the potential use of UV-C ceiling lamps to kill coronavirus germs in hospitals and even homes. Ultraviolet rays, which are present in sunlight, are believed by many to kill COVID-19, and Davidson says lamps emitting similar light could be installed inexpensively and at low risk to others.


CM will be putting up an ass-end cartoon by a fifth rate cartoonist on this subject any time now.


----------



## Beej

I can respect this kind of protester, while disagreeing with their opinion. Peaceful, and puts in the effort to communicate a message effectively, instead of yelling.

https://twitter.com/SirajAHashmi/status/1256320929447047170

Could be a hoax video. Most protesters are jackasses.


----------



## eMacMan

.


----------



## eMacMan

https://news.yahoo.com/im-starving-now-world-faces-224051093.html


> It's Friday morning in Alexandra township – a poor neighborhood on the outskirts of South Africa's largest city, Johannesburg – and dozens of people are gathered in a field outside a food distribution point, hoping today might be the day they get something to eat.
> 
> "If you're hungry, it's easy to get sick from stress and everything," says Mduduzi Khumalo, who's been lining up every day for two weeks. To get food your name has to be on the list and, so far, despite registering multiple times, his hasn't been.
> 
> Khumalo worked as a delivery man before South Africa's coronavirus lockdown decimated his income. His children used to get two meals a day at school, but schools are closed now. Every day, the kids wait for him at the family's tiny home, and every day brings the same bad news.
> 
> "They know that if I don't get anything for them, it's over," Khumalo tells CBS News.


This was of course an entirely predictable consequence of the turning homes into prisons, devastating economies, and shutting down many of the resources that go into making up a viable food supply chain.

I am sure that those whose ultimate goal is to reduce the world population to less than a billion souls, are joyfully gloating as they jet from one home to the next. However the main thrust of the attack will come after Covid vaccine 1.0, 2.0, 3.0... It will be Covid Vaccine XP and billions will die as a result.


----------



## FeXL

What's this???!!! :yikes:

'GIVE PEOPLE BACK THEIR GODDAMN FREEDOM': Elon Musk bashes US shelter-in-place orders as 'fascist,' says they're 'forcibly imprisoning' people in their homes



> In a short rant complete with expletives, Elon Musk doubled down on his stance against the shelter-in-place orders introduced by various US states in recent weeks in an effort to stop the novel coronavirus' spread.


Can't be. Whaddya s'pose the angle is...

—

Interesting read.

Wuhan Flu: Lung Disease Or Blood Disease?



> “The disease itself appears to be shape-shifting before our eyes.”


—

CHINADA (Your Government Is Here For You)



> Hajdu had the gall to accuse a reporter of feeding conspiracy theories for asking about something the Five Eyes alliance — of which Canada is a member — believes.
> 
> — Andrew Lawton (@AndrewLawton) May 2, 2020​


—

Ah, the compassionate, intellectual, left...

California city official ousted over his pandemic remarks



> A Northern California city official has been ousted after he suggested on social media that sick, old and homeless people should be left to meet their “natural course in nature” during the coronavirus pandemic.


Related:

Weatherman fired over post calling open-America crowd ‘white nationalist Nazi sympathizer gun fetishist miscreants’



> Sven Sundgaard, a left-wing Minnesota weatherman, was fired from his gig at Minneapolis station KARE this week after he republished a Facebook post that smeared lockdown protesters as “white nationalist Nazi sympathizer gun fetishist miscreants.”


He forgot "deplorables"...

—

Trump administration pushing to rip global supply chains from China: officials



> The Trump administration is “turbocharging” an initiative to remove global industrial supply chains from China as it weighs new tariffs to punish Beijing for its handling of the coronavirus outbreak, according to officials familiar with U.S. planning.


—

Wuhan Flu



> Hospitalizations as a measure of infection curve, a good thread (starts at the beginning).
> 
> I talk a lot about whether or not peaks have been reached.
> 
> A good metric for this is hospitalisations:
> • More reliable than confirmed cases (not influenced by testing regimes)
> • Shorter lag than deaths
> 
> So here are some charts showing hospitalisations in various countries:
> 
> — John Burn-Murdoch (@jburnmurdoch) May 2, 2020​
> More:
> 
> • 153k more deaths than usual across the 21 countries we‘re tracking
> • 58k above reported Covid deaths at the time (+60%)​


​
—

Curious how Progs suddenly find religion...

Pelosi Quotes ‘the Gospel of Matthew’ in Calling for Federal Prisoners To Be Released



> ‘In our caucus, we are very devoted to the Gospel of Matthew’


Related:

More sex offenders released nationwide as peaceful Americans arrested



> Does Bill de Blasio find it “unconscionable” that an accused rapist released from jail would try to rape again?
> 
> Among the thousands of criminals released by the New York mayor thanks to politically motivated “science” was Robert Pondexter, 57. Putting aside even the veneer of limiting the jailbreak to “low-level” criminals, Pondexter was released on April 15 even though he had a prior rape charge on his rap sheet. On Saturday, just 10 days later, Pondexter was arrested and charged with sexual assault and attempted rape. He allegedly grabbed a random stranger by the shirt collar, forced her to perform a sexual act, and then tried to rape her, but she was able to escape.


Related, too:

California court orders release of 7 high-level sex offenders as gov criminalizes beach attendance



> Just days before California's Gov. Gavin Newsom ordered the closure of parks and beaches in Orange County, making it a criminal offense to step foot in the sand, the state ordered the release of seven high-risk sex offenders from the county's jails over concerns they could contract coronavirus.
> 
> The court-ordered move prompted the District Attorney's Office to issue a safety warning to the community this week, highlighting that the men are likely to re-offend.


—

China Lied About Danger of Wuhan Flu So They Could Secretly Purchase Medical Supplies From Around the World and Hoard Them



> quick let's export more critical manufacturing base to china while there's still time
> 
> U.S. officials believe China covered up the extent of the coronavirus outbreak -- and how contagious the disease is -- to stock up on medical supplies needed to respond to it, intelligence documents show.
> 
> Chinese leaders "intentionally concealed the severity" of the pandemic from the world in early January, according to a four-page Department of Homeland Security intelligence report dated May 1 and obtained by The Associated Press. The revelation comes as the Trump administration has intensified its criticism of China, with Secretary of State Mike Pompeo saying Sunday that that country was responsible for the spread of disease and must be held accountable.​
> As Bonchie puts it:
> 
> In other words, *China let the world burn for almost a month to try to save themselves. That's the country the WHO and many American media companies have chosen to side with routinely.* That’s the country some like Bill Gates are claiming did a good job early on with the virus. All so they can snipe at the orange man.​


Bold mine.

Nails it.

Related:

Intel Report: China Hid Coronavirus’ Severity to Hoard Supplies



> U.S. officials believe China covered up the extent of the coronavirus outbreak — and how contagious the disease is — to stock up on medical supplies needed to respond to it, intelligence documents show.
> 
> Chinese leaders “intentionally concealed the severity” of the pandemic from the world in early January, according to a four-page Department of Homeland Security report dated May 1 and obtained by The Associated Press. The revelation comes as the Trump administration has intensified its criticism of China, with Secretary of State Mike Pompeo saying Sunday that China was responsible for the spread of disease and must be held accountable.


Related, too:

China Hid Coronavirus’ Severity to Hoard Supplies



> U.S. officials believe China covered up the extent of the coronavirus outbreak — and how contagious the disease is — to stock up on medical supplies needed to respond to it, intelligence documents show.


Related, 3:

China hid virus’ severity to hoard supplies



> U.S. officials believe China covered up the extent of the coronavirus outbreak — and how contagious the disease is — to stock up on medical supplies needed to respond to it, intelligence documents show.
> 
> Chinese leaders “intentionally concealed the severity” of the pandemic from the world in early January, according to a four-page Department of Homeland Security intelligence report dated May 1 and obtained by The Associated Press. The revelation comes as the Trump administration has intensified its criticism of China, with Secretary of State Mike Pompeo saying Sunday that that country was responsible for the spread of disease and must be held accountable.


—

Hey Kidz, Look at all of the Fun Things the Dear Leader of California Has Permitted!



> In an act of magnificent benevolence, his Holiness, California Leader Governor Gavin Newsom, has permitted the great unwashed plebs of the his state to now freely do all of these fun activities:


—

Wuhan Flu



> For May 4th, 101 days since Canada’s first diagnosed case and we record the biggest yet one day jump (+2,760) in new cases.


—

Shocka! Internal Chinese report warns Beijing faces Tiananmen-like global backlash over virus



> An internal Chinese report warns that Beijing faces a rising wave of hostility in the wake of the coronavirus outbreak that could tip relations with the United States into confrontation, people familiar with the paper told Reuters.
> 
> ...
> 
> _Don’t worry Xi! Justin luvs you!_


Related:

China’s Secret Speech: Pandemic Plan to Murder 200 Million Americans with Biowarfare



> As explained in Gen. Chi’s speech, the Chinese Communist Party’s intention is to militarily defeat, occupy, and colonize the United States. This plan has been confirmed by a Russian defector source who worked in China and had information about a joint Sino-Russian plan to invade North America. *This plan was drawn up in 1992, after the fall of the Soviet Union. The division of spoils was described thus: “Russia would get Alaska and parts of Canada. China would get the lower 48 states, with other countries invited in for ‘looting rights.’*”


Bold mine.

—

New Report Will Reveal True Origins of Virus



> President Donald Trump on May 3 said China was “embarrassed” by the CCP virus outbreak and that a new report will reveal what really happened in the country to cause the global pandemic.


Related:

Pompeo says 'enormous evidence' virus came from Wuhan lab



> Washington: US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said Sunday that there was "enormous evidence" that the coronavirus pandemic originated in a laboratory in Wuhan, China.


Related, too:

Wuhan biosafety expert admits widespread security and maintenance concerns at China's top-secret labs which carry out research on lethal diseases



> nternational pressure was last night building on Beijing following the leak of a bombshell intelligence dossier which accuses China of having lied about the origins of Covid-19 – and cites evidence that the virus was passed to humans via the Wuhan Institute of Virology.
> 
> The dossier, which has been circulated between Western governments including Britain, also says China persecuted whistleblowers as part of the cover-up and obstructed efforts by other countries to develop a vaccine.


—

Here's why you can't find frozen fries, while U.S. farmers are sitting on tons of potatoes



> The main hurdle is the extra-large size of foodservice packages that are meant for kitchens that turn out dozens if not hundreds of meals each day.
> 
> "Think Costco, but bigger," said International Foodservice Distributors Association (IFDA) CEO Mark Allen, referring to the oversized products sold at warehouse retailer Costco Wholesale Corp.


----------



## FeXL

~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!

Political correctness: Theresa Tam REMOVED “China” from airport screens during COVID-19



> The Public Health Agency of Canada altered health information in Canadian airports by removing mentions of China from warnings about the coronavirus on the on-screen information offered to arriving travellers.
> 
> Once again, agency head, Theresa Tam, chose her foreign World Health Organization bosses over Canadian citizens.


Shocka...

—

Meme nails it.

Why did Canada drag its feet on N95 advice? Some experts say it’s because we had none to spare… See that pic? There’s your answer.



> But more recently, it has served as backdrop for a quietly expressed hypothesis among researchers and public health experts: Did a shortage of personal protective equipment influence Canada’s decision to hold back on aggressive protective protocols for health-care workers other countries have adopted?
> 
> _See that pic? There’s your answer._


Related:

Makes me want to puke

In technicolour...

Related, too:

COVID-19 confusion hurt Canada's response



> Chief Public Health Officer, Dr. Theresa Tam, told the CBC last week she’s “not sure what more could have been done” at the beginning of the COVID-19 pandemic because “the estimations of how transmissible the virus was and how severe it was (were) unclear at the start.”


Ummm...your resignation?

—

Leaked Documents: China’s Lab Biosafety Concerns Point to Beijing’s Coverup of CCP Virus



> A series of internal Chinese government documents on biosafety guidelines for research labs has revealed that Beijing issued guidelines on how to study the CCP virus and knew of its potential to spread among humans before disclosing such risks with the public.


—

‘Happy hypoxia’: unusual coronavirus effect baffles doctors



> It is a mystery that has left doctors questioning the basic tenets of biology: Covid-19 patients who are talking and apparently not in distress, but who have oxygen levels low enough to typically cause unconsciousness or even death.


—

Curious, that...

Third Russian doctor ‘falls’ from hospital window just hours after complaining of PPE shortages and being forced to work



> Alexander Shulepov, 37, is fighting for his life after taking part in a video in which it was claimed he was ordered to work on despite testing positive for Covid-19.


—

Hell no!!!

Privacy at stake as Canadian tracing apps introduced by provinces



> Privacy watch groups have raised concerns over proposals to implement tracking apps all across Canada. New Brunswick, Manitoba, Saskatchewan, and Newfoundland and Labrador are among the first provinces looking to introduce smartphone apps that would keep tabs on a user’s whereabouts, according to Global News.
> 
> The technology is known as “contact tracing,” where the app tracks who the user comes into contact with by accessing the user’s Bluetooth signal.


—

Ah, the Goracle...

Al Gore: ‘Climate Crisis and the COVID-19 Pandemic Are Linked’



> According to former Vice President Al Gore, there is a link between global warming and the current coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> Gore, during an interview with MSNBC’s Chris Hayes, argued other emissions from fossil fuels besides carbon dioxide, were responsible for “preconditions” that are increasing the risk of the COVID-19 virus.


Of course they are.


----------



## SINC

*Chinese government report warns of armed confrontation with U.S. over coronavirus outbreak*



> An internal Chinese report warns that Beijing faces a rising wave of hostility in the wake of the coronavirus outbreak that could tip relations with the United States into confrontation, people familiar with the paper told Reuters.
> 
> The report, presented early last month by the Ministry of State Security to top Beijing leaders including President Xi Jinping, concluded that global anti-China sentiment is at its highest since the 1989 Tiananmen Square crackdown, the sources said.
> 
> As a result, Beijing faces a wave of anti-China sentiment led by the United States in the aftermath of the pandemic and needs to be prepared in a worst-case scenario for armed confrontation between the two global powers, according to people familiar with the report’s content, who declined to be identified given the sensitivity of the matter.


https://globalnews.ca/news/6905295/...medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark


----------



## Macfury

Unseen report described by unidentified sources. This is not top-notch reporting.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Unseen report described by unidentified sources. This is not top-notch reporting.


Typical MSM...


----------



## SINC

Maybe not quality reporting for sources, but gives reason to consider the possibility it raises.


----------



## eMacMan

SINC said:


> Maybe not quality reporting for sources, but gives reason to consider the possibility it raises.


One cannot ignore the possibility that the idiots in charge have dug such a deep economic hole, that they believe triggering WWIII is the only possible solution. Double bonus if like Bill Gates you believe the planet needs to shed over 6 Billion surplus people. 

Since the super elite seem to be still jetting around at will, I have to wonder if they have any clue what it will be like living out the rest of their lives in their underground cities?


----------



## SINC

*A billion for WHO? Trudeau throws money at China while Canada burns*

https://www.westernstandardonline.c...zGir46TORiPhJTRaJVZ4DbAQys6-Q-e8TAsRLwk9Wc5u8


----------



## Macfury

SINC said:


> *A billion for WHO? Trudeau throws money at China while Canada burns*
> 
> https://www.westernstandardonline.c...zGir46TORiPhJTRaJVZ4DbAQys6-Q-e8TAsRLwk9Wc5u8


That's simply insane. Greasing the wheels for a UN appointment. What a jerk.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> That's simply insane. Greasing the wheels for a UN appointment. What a jerk.


Unfukcingbelievable.

WEXIT.

Now!


----------



## eMacMan

SINC said:


> *A billion for WHO? Trudeau throws money at China while Canada burns*
> 
> https://www.westernstandardonline.c...zGir46TORiPhJTRaJVZ4DbAQys6-Q-e8TAsRLwk9Wc5u8



Well nothing there that would change my opinion. He's Justa TrueDope, a lying idiot with zero math skills.


----------



## FeXL

Rex Murphy: COVID-19 and our new Government at the Bottom of the Cottage Doorsteps



> It’s been something like 40 days now that we've had this new-style Canadian government — coincidentally the number of Ali Baba’s thieves


—

Sheep...

Newfoundland police receive powers to enter homes, stop vehicles, detain citizens during pandemic



> The government of Newfoundland and Labrador has given police new powers to enforce public health orders amid the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> The Public Health Protection and Promotion act authorizes police officers to enter any premises, stop vehicles and detain people. They can also bring people that are not following public health measures to the border, according to CBC News.
> 
> "You can be put on the Marine Atlantic ferry and sent back to Nova Scotia," Premier Dwight Ball said to reporters on Tuesday
> 
> Bill 38 allows inspectors to go to any premises, collect samples for testing, make copies and also take photo or video evidence. They can inspect books and records as well.


And NLL's are okay with this?

BOHICA...


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> And NLL's are okay with this?


Part of a proud tradition of acquiescence and dependence?


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Part of a proud tradition of acquiescence and dependence?


Apparently. Certainly doesn't reflect the pride from WWII I'd heard so much about.


----------



## CubaMark

*‘Finally, a virus got me.’ Scientist who fought Ebola and HIV reflects on facing death from COVID-19*

“ON 19 MARCH, I SUDDENLY HAD A HIGH FEVER and a stabbing headache. My skull and hair felt very painful, which was bizarre. I didn’t have a cough at the time, but still, my first reflex was: I have it. I kept working—I’m a workaholic—but from home. We put a lot of effort into teleworking at the London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine last year, so that we didn’t have to travel as much. ...

I tested positive for COVID-19, as I suspected. I put myself in isolation in the guest room at home. But the fever didn’t go away. I had never been seriously ill and have not taken a day of sick leave the past 10 years. I live a pretty healthy life and walk regularly. The only risk factor for corona is my age—I’m 71. I’m an optimist, so I thought it would pass. But on 1 April, a doctor friend advised me to get a thorough examination because the fever and especially the exhaustion were getting worse and worse.

It turned out I had severe oxygen deficiency, although I still wasn’t short of breath. Lung images showed I had severe pneumonia, typical of COVID-19, as well as bacterial pneumonia. I constantly felt exhausted, while normally I’m always buzzing with energy. It wasn’t just fatigue, but complete exhaustion; I’ll never forget that feeling. I had to be hospitalized, although I tested negative for the virus in the meantime. This is also typical for COVID-19: The virus disappears, but its consequences linger for weeks.

(...)

I was released from the hospital after a long week. ... I couldn’t walk properly because my muscles were weakened from lying down and from the lack of movement, which is not a good thing when you’re treating a lung condition. At home, I cried for a long time. I also slept badly for a while. The risk that something could still go seriously wrong keeps going through your head. 

(...)

One week after I was discharged, I became increasingly short of breath. I had to go to the hospital again, but fortunately, I could be treated on an outpatient basis. I turned out to have an organizing pneumonia-induced lung disease, caused by a so-called cytokine storm. It’s a result of your immune defense going into overdrive. Many people do not die from the tissue damage caused by the virus, but from the exaggerated response of their immune system, which doesn’t know what to do with the virus. I’m still under treatment for that, with high doses of corticosteroids that slow down the immune system. If I had had that storm along with the symptoms of the viral outbreak in my body, I wouldn’t have survived. I had atrial fibrillation, with my heart rate going up to 170 beats per minute; that also needs to be controlled with therapy, particularly to prevent blood clotting events, including stroke. This is an underestimated ability of the virus: It can probably affect all the organs in our body.

Many people think COVID-19 kills 1% of patients, and the rest get away with some flulike symptoms. But the story gets more complicated. Many people will be left with chronic kidney and heart problems. Even their neural system is disrupted. There will be hundreds of thousands of people worldwide, possibly more, who will need treatments such as renal dialysis for the rest of their lives. The more we learn about the coronavirus, the more questions arise. We are learning while we are sailing. That’s why I get so annoyed by the many commentators on the sidelines who, without much insight, criticize the scientists and policymakers trying hard to get the epidemic under control. That’s very unfair.

(ScienceMag)​


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Yeah. And?



CubaMark said:


> Finally, a virus got me.’ Scientist who fought Ebola and HIV reflects on facing death from COVID-19


----------



## Macfury

I have no problems with scientists trying to get the the virus under control. I have a lot of problem with policymakers who sequester people to flatten the curve and then decide to simply continue to sequester them after the curve has been flattened. Policymakers can't "get it under control." They can only postpone it while causing irresponsible damage to lives and livelihoods.



CubaMark said:


> [That’s why I get so annoyed by the many commentators on the sidelines who, without much insight, criticize the scientists and policymakers trying hard to get the epidemic under control. That’s very unfair.
> 
> (ScienceMag)​[/INDENT]


----------



## chasMac

A lot of folks are failing to grasp that this whole exercise was never intended to reduce the amount of infections, but to limit the impact on our ICU capacity: the area under both curves _is the same_.




Macfury said:


> I have no problems with scientists trying to get the the virus under control. I have a lot of problem with policymakers who sequester people to flatten the curve and then decide to simply continue to sequester them after the curve has been flattened. Policymakers can't "get it under control." They can only postpone it while causing irresponsible damage to lives and livelihoods.


----------



## SINC

Well, here is an interesting, but no real source story about the virus posted on Linked-In.

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/auto...o0N90N6y3IfgMYZhDotZhIcLcy8YSek4e4ggNBxVnuitY


----------



## eMacMan

chasMac said:


> A lot of folks are failing to grasp that this whole exercise was never intended to reduce the amount of infections, but to limit the impact on our ICU capacity: the area under both curves _is the same_.


Actually the total increases, as there is also the deadly impact from pulling the plug on so many peoples livelihood. No to mention that isolation is itself a torture method that will drive some to suicide and has also been proven to increase domestic violence. The latter was probably deliberate as they did leave the liquor stores open.


----------



## Macfury

chasMac said:


> A lot of folks are failing to grasp that this whole exercise was never intended to reduce the amount of infections, but to limit the impact on our ICU capacity: the area under both curves _is the same_.


Meanwhile, lockdowns are also dooming millions to contract tuberculosis:

https://www.theguardian.com/global-...ons-develop-tuberculosis-tb-covid-19-lockdown


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Meanwhile, lockdowns are also dooming millions to contract tuberculosis:


Those that survive bankruptcy...


----------



## FeXL

eMacMan said:


> No to mention that isolation is itself a torture method that will drive some to suicide and has also been proven to increase domestic violence.


You mean, like this?

Never let a "crisis" go to waste... right?



> Apparently *10-12 billion dollars every year* with zero audit controls just isn't enough for our aboriginal brothers & sisters...
> 
> _ Native Women's Association President Lorraine Whitman says she *finds the numbers "shocking"* and is *deeply concerned* about the safety of Indigenous women in Canada.
> 
> "Because we are facing the *impact of colonialism*, we are not a top priority and we can see it with COVID right now."_​
> Lorraine, hang on a sec... are you saying you just discovered *domestic violence among aboriginal peoples*? And how exactly is *'colonialism' or 'coronavirus'* beating the snot out of aboriginal women?
> 
> I'm so confused.
> 
> _ "With the *increasing rate of violence*, which has occurred during COVID, we are now in an even worse crisis," said NDP MP Leah Gazan.
> 
> "We need to move swiftly. This is a *life and death* situation."_​


----------



## Macfury

For the COVID-19 panic set, here's what your "public service quarantine" fear mongering is costing:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-real-death-toll-covid-29-cases-a9504911.html


----------



## FeXL

I still luvs me that meme...:lmao::lmao::lmao:

Canada Should Join Allies to Seek Virus Inquiry, Hold Chinese Regime Accountable, Say MPs



> As the world grapples with the COVID-19 pandemic, several MPs say Canada should join its allies in calling for an international, independent inquiry into the Chinese Communist Party’s handling of the outbreak and hold the regime accountable for its actions that led to the pandemic.
> 
> “An investigation has to take place, and we need to make sure that everybody understands the gravity of what’s happened and also start talking about the consequences that the Chinese Communist Party [CCP] will face,” MP James Bezan, the Conservative shadow minister for national defence, said in an interview.
> 
> _Communist China has greased too many LPC palms for that to happen._


Yeppers.

—



> https://unherd.com/2020/05/fake-news-isnt-the-problem-fake-authority-is/





> During the early weeks of the Corona virus pandemic, there was a fair amount of this erroneous narrative-gatekeeping. Outside of a relatively narrow group of experts, few public figures or institutions were warning people about the likelihood of the events that we are all now living through. And many of those who were focused on other problems — especially those individuals and institutions that seek relevance in order to secure funding – have had to do a sharp pivot.


—

Damn those Jews!!!

Pakistani Terror Cleric: Jews Created Coronavirus, Will Control Any Future Vaccine



> A Pakistani Islamist cleric has concocted an elaborate conspiracy theory to explain the coronavirus pandemic, charging that “the Jews” created Covid-19 to accelerate their bid for “global governance” and that they would similarly decide who was eligible for a vaccine, should one be developed.


—

Love the meme again.

Trudeau government suckered again – sold eight million rejected “Made In China” N95 masks



> The federal government has suspended shipments of N95 masks from a Montreal-based supplier after about eight million masks made in China failed to meet specifications.
> 
> The office of Procurement Minister Anita Anand says that of the nearly 11 million masks received from the distributor, about one million met federal standards and another 1.6 million masks are still being tested.


More:



> The department says *none of the approximately eight million masks that did not meet federal standards were distributed for medical use, though assessment is ongoing for other uses.*


Bold mine.

I know!!! TP!!!

Idiots. Why isn't each & every one of them being sent back, freight collect?

—

The curve is flat enough so why are the lockdowns continuing?



> In March, governments across Canada began violating our _Charter_ freedoms to move, travel, assemble, associate and practice one’s faith or religion. Initially, most Canadians (myself included) were deferential to government. However, citizens must never forget that when governments violate our _Charter_ rights—as they are clearly doing now, with continued lockdown measures that are enforced by heavy fines—the _Charter_ requires governments to explain and justify their freedom-restricting policies as rational, minimal, and truly necessary.


The answer to the headline? Once again: Control.

—

<sniff> :---(

UN Chief Calls for Social Media To Censor ‘Racist, Misogynist,’ Ageist, and ‘Harmful’ Memes



> In a bizarre tirade that tackled subjects such as memes that poke fun at the elderly, “ethno-nationalism,” and anti-Semitic conspiracy theories,” Guterres argued that the COVID-19 pandemic has unleashed a “tsunami of hate and xenophobia, scapegoating and scare-mongering.”


Why, yes. Yes, it has. And most of it has been promoted by the WHO, a commie-lovin' vassal of the commie-lovin' UN!

—

~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!

Trudeau government gives $500 MILLION in coronavirus aid to groups that promote antifa and sex work



> On Friday, Justin Trudeau’s Heritage Minister Steven Guilbeault announced that $500 million of taxpayers’ money will be spent on arts and culture in the context of coronavirus relief.
> 
> The funding will be based on "needs assessment" with $198 million handed out to the Canadian Music Fund, Canada Book Fund, and the Canadian Periodical Fund.
> 
> $116 million is earmarked for the television and film industry via the Canada Media Fund ($89 million) and Telefilm Canada ($27 million).
> 
> The Canada Council for the Arts is set to receive $55 million.
> 
> The Digital Citizen Initiative, a project that claims to "counter online disinformation" will receive $3.5 million.


Canada Backs U.S.-Led Effort for Taiwan at WHO Over China’s Objections – Who Twisted Junior’s Arm?



> Canada has backed an American−led effort to allow Taiwan to be granted observer status at the World Health Organization because of its early success in containing COVID−19.
> 
> Beijing says Taiwan is a Chinese province and should be under its rule, while pressuring other countries to not recognize the self-ruled island and preventing its membership at WHO.


More:



> *Last week Franky Champagne couldn’t even mention Taiwan by name to thank them for their mask donation.*
> 
> _ SHOCK VIDEO: Twice Justin Trudeau’s foreign minister is asked to thank Taiwan for a huge gift of face masks. Twice he refuses, and won’t even say the word “Taiwan”. pic.twitter.com/KIDVyjLzmo
> 
> — Ezra Levant 🇨🇳🦠 (@ezralevant) May 7, 2020_​


Benito Trudolini is so desperate for that UN seat, he's even willing to go against the grain here.

Trudeau is still gonna make Canadians pay for crappy masks from his friends in Communist China



> Prime Minister Justin Trudeau says Canada will not pay the full price for medical masks that do not live up to medical standards.
> 
> ...
> 
> Trudeau says the discovery speaks to the government’s “rigorous verification system” overseen by the Public Health Agency of Canada.
> 
> _Read “rigorous verification system” as “Did a Liberal Party backer get his payola?”_


Yeppers.

Our leaders fretted about racism more than COVID-19



> One of the most infuriating blunders of Canada’s political class in the ongoing pandemic was obsessing about alleged massive societal racism against Canadians of Chinese origin, when the real crisis was the looming carnage of COVID-19.
> 
> Politicians and public health officials overestimated the threat posed by racism, while underestimating the threat posed by the coronavirus, in particular the threat to the elderly in long-term care homes.
> 
> That’s become a real national disgrace as opposed to an imaginary one.


Pandemic Should Be Wake-Up for Ottawa Call to ‘Dangers’ of Chinese Regime: Expert



> As more damning information comes to light regarding Beijing’s handling of the COVID-19 outbreak, calls are increasing for countries impacted by the pandemic to hold the Chinese regime to account.
> 
> One expert says the crisis should be a wake-up call for the Canadian government as to the true nature of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP) and provides an ideal opportunity to start taking a hard line toward the regime.


Won't happen. Not when Junior admires their basic dictatorship...

Justin Trudeau warns if Canada opens too early, the country could be sent 'back into confinement'



> Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau warned that if provinces reopen too quickly, a second wave of the coronavirus pandemic could send the country "back into confinement this summer," Reuters reported.


Bite me, Trudles...

—

China Asked WHO To Delay Pandemic Announcement, Deny Human-To-Human Transmission: German Intelligence



> German intelligence has revealed that Chinese President Xi Jinping asked World Health Organization (WHO) Director-General Tedros Adhanom Thebreyesus to cover up the severity of the coronavirus pandemic in January, according to _Der Spiegel_.


Nice.

—

Good luck with that.

Coronavirus crime worries are making New Yorkers want guns



> With thousands of cops out sick, cocky criminals on the loose, and people running out of money for food and rent because of COVID-19, the Rosario sisters of Staten Island want to arm themselves for what they fear could be a coming crime surge.


—

New CCP Virus Spread Swiftly Around World From Late 2019, Study Finds



> A genetic study of samples from more than 7,500 people infected with COVID-19 suggests the CCP virus spread quickly around the world after it emerged in China sometime between October and December last year, scientists said on May 6.
> 
> Scientists at University College London’s Genetics Institute found almost 200 recurrent genetic mutations of the CCP (Chinese Communist Party) virus—SARS-CoV-2—which the UCL researchers said showed how it is adapting to its human hosts as it spreads.


—

The CBC, the CCP and COVID-19



> Research we have done since 2006 on the mass killing in China of prisoners of conscience for their organs has led us inevitably to learn about other more general subjects. The coronavirus disease of 2019 caught the world by surprise. But, to us, many of its features were repetitions of familiar patterns.


—

And, I saved the best for last. *Hey, Bigot!!!*

FDA Says Hydroxychloroquine and Chloroquine Can Be Used to Treat Coronavirus



> he U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has approved the use of two anti-malaria drugs to treat patients infected by the new coronavirus.
> 
> On Sunday, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) said in a statement that chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine could be prescribed to teens and adults with COVID-19 "as appropriate, when a clinical trial is not available or feasible," after the FDA issued an Emergency Use Authorization. (EUA) That marked the first EUA for a drug related to COVID-19 in the U.S., according to the statement.


No double blind studies required.

Sonuvagun...


----------



## FeXL

A lot of candor here... (language warning)

Lysol Injections and UV Enemas...



> We've reached Peak ****tard.


—

But Christians are the crazy religious ones...

Virginia Imam: ‘It is Allah's Reminder from Heaven to the Whole Earth.’



> In a video clip posted by MEMRI, the Middle East Media Research Institute, imam Shaker Elsayed of the Dar Al-Hijrah Islamic Center in Fairfax County, Va., says, "Every year, Allah tests humanity with the flu, but this doesn't seem to be getting the message [across] and the attention. So this year, He is sending something like the flu, even with less damage than the flu, but it has created more fear than the flu ever has."


—

Costco limits meat purchases in U.S. as supply shortages loom



> America’s biggest meat processor says food supply chain is ‘breaking’ and millions of pounds of meat will vanish from grocery stores


—

Researcher Close To ‘Very Significant Findings’ In Coronavirus Study Killed In Murder-Suicide



> A University of Pittsburgh researcher that was close to “making very significant findings” in his coronavirus studies was killed in a murder-suicide, numerous sources reported.
> 
> Bing Liu, 37, was found dead in his home in Ross Township, near Pittsburgh, May 2. Police found Liu with apparent gunshot wounds in his head, neck and torso. According to KDKA News, police ruled his death to be a homicide.


—

Wuhan Flu: Transmission Dynamics



> 1/ 2147 close contacts of 157 #COVID19 cases were followed up: Overall infection rate was 6%, higher infection rate among friends (22%) and household (18%), and main risk factors include contact in household (13%), transport (11%), dining (7%). https://t.co/QBSZVSjylU (4/3/20) pic.twitter.com/sh6hH0WjTw
> 
> — Dr Muge Cevik (@mugecevik) May 4, 2020​
> Finally, some solid data on transmission risks. It’s mostly good news, meaning that mitigation can be more accurately targeted. It largely explains the infection clusters — high density populations, nursing homes, plant workers living in close quarters. Read the full thread.


—


Wuhan Flu



> _COVID-19 has cracked open the vulnerabilities in Canada’s beef supply chains, exposing some disturbing realities about the challenges faced by this workforce so important to the success of Canada’s beef sector._
> 
> Related.
> 
> Yet currently, deaths in the US are dropping: Scott Gottlieb MD: _New projections from CDC in documents obtained by New York Times shows steady rise in number of cases and deaths from #covid19 over next several weeks, reaching about 3,000 daily deaths on June 1st and about 200,000 new cases each day by end of the month._ (pdf)
> 
> Update: The study above “obtained by the New York Times”? _The researcher who developed a model predicting a steep surge in the country’s coronavirus cases and deaths has said that he was not aware that his work, which “was not in any way intended to be a forecast,” had been drafted into a government report._ OH.
> 
> Just leaving the ER.
> 
> For the first time in nearly two months, the number of non-COVID19 patients outnumbered the number of #COVIDー19 patients I saw today.
> 
> Certainly better.
> 
> But definitely not over.
> 
> — Craig Spencer MD MPH (@Craig_A_Spencer) May 4, 2020​
> Meanwhile, in a Texas seniors home: _Armstrong doesn’t call the Hydroxychloroquine a cure and is aware of all the recent reports that say the drug shouldn’t be used to treat COVID-19. But he points out only one of the nursing homes COVID-19 patients has died…_


—

“Put on a mask and shut up” China’s undiplomatic diplomats hit back at critics



> The newscast blares from a television set in a Beijing apartment, carrying through an open window and echoing across the compound. The refrain is the same every evening: praise for China’s handling of the coronavirus, dire scenes from foreign hospitals and condemnations of the United States.
> 
> The tone is often withering. Last week, U.S. Secretary of State Michael R. Pompeo was declared “the public enemy of humanity.” A few nights later, the anchor feigned sympathy for Americans, who she said were left to die while their government railed against China.
> 
> Beijing has pushed this story line at home for months — a mixture of self-congratulation for defeating the virus, denial of central government missteps, and horror at other countries’ failures to contain the pandemic.


—

The invisible pandemic



> Many countries (and members of their press media) have marvelled at Sweden's relaxed strategy in the face of the coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) pandemic: schools and most workplaces have remained open, and police officers were not checking one's errands in the street. Severe critics have described it as Sweden sacrificing its (elderly) citizens to quickly reach herd immunity.1
> The death toll has surpassed our three closest neighbours, Denmark, Norway, and Finland, but the mortality remains lower than in the UK, Spain, and Belgium.2
> 
> It has become clear that a hard lockdown does not protect old and frail people living in care homes—a population the lockdown was designed to protect.3
> Neither does it decrease mortality from COVID-19, which is evident when comparing the UK's experience with that of other European countries.


—

Neil ‘Lockdown’ Ferguson Gets Caught With His Pants, And His Credibility, Down



> t sounds like great tabloid fare: A leading disease expert in the United Kingdom is discovered to have violated the country’s stay-at-home order during the COVID-19 pandemic so he could canoodle with a married woman. And, yes, the British tabloids ate it up.
> 
> But the scientist in this case was the highly respected Neil Ferguson, the person who more than anyone on the planet is responsible for the lockdown that has cost the U.S. economy trillions of dollars.


Related:

The Ferguson effect



> We have now met the Imperial College London epidemiologist and professor of mathematical biology Neil Ferguson — *the “gold standard” of disease modeling*, according to the New York Times and Washington Post. Ferguson is of course the expert whose projections of huge death tolls from COVID-19 in the United States and the United Kingdom have supported the ongoing shutdowns. Ferguson projected as many as 2,200,000 deaths in the United States and 500,000 deaths in the United Kingdom.
> 
> Looking back at that Guardian article, Bill observes that Ferguson has a record of making stupid worst-case predictions about the threat of new viruses. Bill cites “what Prof. Gold Standard said in 2005 about the projected Bird Flu death toll to the Guardian”:


Bold mine.

Related, too:

What Has Cheating, Scare-Mongering Coronavirus Modeler Neil Ferguson Ever Gotten Right?



> Neil Ferguson, epidemiologist and lead author of the Imperial College of London’s coronavirus model that led the world’s leaders to shut down economies and lock us all in our homes, cheated on the lockdown he proposed. At least twice. He was also cheating on his wife with a woman in an open marriage.
> 
> But it’s cheating on the lockdown that led to his abrupt resignation from his posts atop Britain’s top science advisory groups. He broke the lockdown that he prescribed for the rest of us. Wrap your mind around that.


—

Project Veritas: CBS "News" Faked Footage of Cars Lining Up at a Covid Testing Site To Make the Lines Appear Much Longer Than They Actually Were



> [Mamaroneck, N.Y.—May 6, 2020] A CBS News crew pulled medical professionals off the floor at the Cherry Medical Center in Grand Rapids, Michigan, to line up in their vehicles so a CBS film crew would have a long line for their COVID-19 coverage.
> 
> ...
> 
> 'Apparently, the news crew wanted more people in the line,' said a Cherry Health Supervisor.
> 
> "We pretended. _There were a couple of real patients, which made it worse,_" Said Another Registered Nurse.​
> In other words, CBS delayed the treatment of real patients so they could get their shot of fake patients waiting in long lines.


—

D'oh!!!


Missouri Informants Who Snitched on Fellow Citizens For Violating Stay-At-Home Orders Surprised To Learn That Their Snitching is Subject to Open Records Laws



> I think this phenomenon of people rushing to play the role of Uncompensated Volunteer Informant for the state is closely related to the Surveillance Society that social media has bequeathed us, with everyone eager to "call out" and "cancel" other fellow human beings.
> 
> **** these people. If they feel threatened -- good. If they resent the all-seeing eyes of the Panopticon -- good.
> 
> Enjoy the hell you made, brick by miserable, hateful brick.


—

'Sacrificed in the name of COVID patients': Tens of thousands affected by surgery cancellations



> Almost 200,000 surgeries and other procedures were shelved indefinitely, as hospitals braced for a deluge that never quite materialized


—

Idiot.

COVID Country



> Premier Doug Ford was the one who said not to go to the cottage.
> 
> “There’s no one that loves the cottage more than I do, but I’m not going to my cottage,” Ford said at an April news conference just before Easter. “Please, this long weekend, do not go to your cottage. We can’t stress that enough.”​
> I won’t spoil the ending.


—

Wuhan Flu



> Rossana Segreto, University of Innsbruck | Institute of Microbiology
> 
> Abstract
> 
> Based on my experience in genetic manipulation I do not exclude a synthetic origin of SARS-CoV-2 and I believe that the topic should not be censored. I did a literature review on this subject and I suggest in my manuscript a possible experiment that could have originated SARS-CoV-2, known to be chimeric. Moreover, I do a critical analysis of the paper of Andersen and colleagues recently published in Nature on the Proximal Origin of SARS-CoV-2. This paper is considered a proof that SARS-CoV-2 has a natural origin, but in my opinion lacks scientific evidence. With my work I do not want to accuse a specific research group, but raise attention of the scientific community on this topic.​
> @hollyanndoan – Prime Minister office sued over media ‘blacklisting’ at #COVID19Canada briefings.
> 
> Coronavirus lessons on density, mass transit, bureaucracy and censorship
> 
> One reason vaccine development takes so long: _There is a condition in humans called antibody dependent enhancement (ADE). It turns out if you have no antibodies you get the disease and if you have a lot you are protected. If you have this in between level (of antibodies) and you get the disease it actually enhances the disease and the immune response is really destructive._
> 
> Saputo confirms COVID-19 case at Wakooma Street dairy facility in Saskatoon
> 
> Excess mortality data of April 11th:
> 
> NEW: we’ve updated our excess mortality tracker, the gold-standard measure for Covid deaths, allowing like-for-like comparisons btwn countries
> 
> UK had 43,000 more deaths than usual in March & April vs 22,000 reported Covid deaths at the time
> 
> Free to read: https://t.co/pSx03b2kdL pic.twitter.com/loM7I78yqc
> 
> — John Burn-Murdoch (@jburnmurdoch) May 6, 2020​


—

Wall Street Journal: Economic Lockdown Is the 'Catastrophe'



> Those saying we had to sacrifice the economy to save lives have succeeded in only the former, The Wall Street Journal writes in a scathing rebuke of lockdowns at all costs amid the global coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> "The tradeoff isn't between lives and livelihoods," the Journal editorial board concluded. "The policy goal has to be to protect both as much as possible.
> 
> "Deploy more personal protective equipment, greatly increase testing, build surge capability to handle flare-ups, and isolate society's most vulnerable to keep hospitals from getting overwhelmed.
> 
> "But for heaven's sake reopen the economy so we don't consign millions to years of poverty."


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> Fauci and heads of CDC and FDA in self quarantine, as a growing number of White House associates and staff test positive.
> 
> Mask-wearing policy in Canada has resembled Orwell's 1984, where warring nations would be transformed into loyal allies overnight and everyone was expected to forget what they'd been told the day before.
> 
> @AlissaStollwerk – _A sobering way to look at it. 1 out of 154 NYC adults hospitalized. 1 out of 361 NYC adults dead. Among 75 and older, 1 out of 60 are dead._
> 
> Apparently rare, but concerning — _Nearly 100 children in the U.S. have been diagnosed with the newly identified syndrome associated with COVID-19._
> 
> But still, there are positive developments stateside: _Good news as covid testing expands and the positivity rate continues to fall._
> 
> *More unusable masks from China and Trudeau pledges we “won’t be paying the full price”.
> 
> That’ll teach ’em.*


Bold mine.

Yep.

—

Has The WHO Done Anything Correctly? One More Example Of their Incompetence...Or Malfeasance (You Be The Judge)



> It's obvious that the clinical experience of the physicians treating Sino-Lung-Rot is important, and as they try different therapies a standard is developed. It is also obvious that rapid dissemination of that information is vital to our success in treating this disease, yet the WHO (or should we call it "People's Republic of China, World Health Division?) has stumbled and fumbled to what seems like the exact wrong conclusion.
> 
> 
> A Report From the Front: Positive, life-saving news from the trenches that's going unreported by those fearful of ending the lockdown.
> 
> But here's a question: why weren't physicians from the very onset of the pandemic using this or a similar strategy to treat the inflammation caused by SARS-CoV-2? As stated in Dr. Marik's treatment protocol, the consortium provides this disturbing answer:​


—

Even the State-Sponsored Karen Propaganda Network BBC Admits That Deaths Due to the Lockdown Will Soon Exceed Deaths Due to Covid that the Lockdown Is Intended to Prevent



> By the way, Boris Johnson announced a shift from "stay home" to return to work but "stay alert."
> 
> The Karens, led by CNN, of course began attacking him.


—

RACIS'!!!

Andrew Cuomo Flacks for the Chinese Communist Party, Repeatedly Calling Wuhan Virus "The European Virus"



> It's not racist to blame Europeans for things, I guess!


—

Coronavirus DID leak from a Wuhan lab, Australian China expert claims, as he details why wildlife wet market theory 'doesn't stack up' and accuses Beijing of a cover-up



> A respected author and China expert claims bombshell evidence suggests coronavirus must have leaked from a Wuhan laboratory - not from wildlife wet markets.
> 
> 'The argument that the coronavirus emerged from the South China Seafood market just no longer stacks up,' Professor Clive Hamilton told Sky News on Sunday night.
> 
> Professor Hamilton said the earliest cases of COVID-19 were in people who had no contact with the Wuhan wet market, which was first blamed for the outbreak.


—

Nothing To See Here, Please Move Along



> Sydney Morning Herald;
> 
> US intelligence agencies are reportedly examining mobile phone data suggesting there could have been an emergency shutdown in October at the Wuhan Institute of Virology.
> 
> According to a report, obtained by NBC News, there was no mobile phone activity in a high-security part of the Chinese laboratory complex from October 7 to 24. Previously, there had been consistent use of mobile phones.
> 
> The report, carried out by private experts, suggested there may have been a “hazardous event”, specifically at the institute’s National Biosafety Laboratory, between October 6 and 11. Analysis of mobile phone data from around the institute also suggested roadblocks were in place between October 14 and 19.​
> More: China’s Incestuous Relationship with the WHO Might Be Worse Than We Originally Thought


—

Wuhan Flu



> _I don’t think most Americans fully understand the lengths that South Korea has undergone, so I’ll try my best to explain._
> 
> H/T Craig: This is an interesting hypothesis that could explain the clotting issue
> 
> Boris Johnson’s three step plan to reopening.
> 
> The virus is natural, nothing here to see: _US and British intelligence agencies are reportedly examining mobile phone data suggesting there could have been an emergency shutdown in October at the Wuhan Institute of Virology._
> 
> Theresa Tam, party animal.
> 
> #CCP’s consulate in Los Angeles gets some free decoration.


—

One Flu Out Of The Wuhan Nest



> Did Shi Zhengli's team's own virus database get deleted? It is described as having 61.5 Mb of data here:https://t.co/6gsEinkbOZ
> 
> But if I try to download the files from here:https://t.co/D7L7Cjyg8j
> 
> All I get is an empty 1 Kb zip file. pic.twitter.com/x1QbvBBu9i
> 
> — Yuri Deigin (@ydeigin) May 11, 2020​


—

Media Offers No Apologies As Georgia -- Which They Scolded for Practicing "Human Sacrifice" in Reopening -- Posts Lowest COVID Numbers In a Month



> There won’t be any contrition. There won’t be any apology. But they’ll pretend to wonder why people don’t trust them. pic.twitter.com/zk77QNUqCE
> — Jon Levine (@LevineJonathan) May 10, 2020​
> Matt Taibbi has a good piece about the "liberal" drive for Chinese-style authoritarian censorship to make certain only the "experts" have the right to speak publicly.


—

Fine. Then set up opposing roadblocks 1/4 mile down the road for outgoing traffic. Wouldn't want any coronavirus leaking out, either...

Coronavirus: South Dakota Sioux refuse to take down 'illegal' checkpoints



> South Dakota Governor Kristi Noem wrote to several tribal leaders last week saying the checkpoints were illegal.
> 
> But the Sioux say they are the only way of making sure the virus does not enter their reservations.


—

How coronavirus attacks the entire body — damaging the brain, kidneys and more



> While the coronavirus is known to cause deadly respiratory problems, research is showing the multitude of ways the disease can ravage the entire body.
> 
> Through a growing number of studies, reports and doctors’ experiences, the deadly virus has been linked to issues in everything from the brain to the toes.


—

Ah, yes. All those nasty conservatives who don't believe in "the science". Perhaps, just maybe, all those conservatives are more concerned about their civil rights being abrogated than "the science"...

Calls Come for Canada to Make COVID-19 Vaccine Mandatory for All Citizens While Protecting Civil Rights



> As the COVID-19 virus now counts millions of victims worldwide, and deaths number into the hundreds of thousands – along with making a secondary casualty of the global economy – the race to discover and produce a vaccine proceed continues apace around the globe, with a successful vaccine being the world’s best chance to stop the virus and return a degree of normality to national and global affairs.
> 
> However, health analysts are concerned that large numbers of badly informed citizens with conservative beliefs, refusing to believe in science and accept vaccinations, could thwart the needed herd immunity that makes a broad-scale vaccination program effective.
> 
> As a result, calls have come for the vaccination, once tested, available, and safe, to be made mandatory by Canada’s federal government, while continuing to respect the civil rights of Canadians.


—

All the freaks & weirdos...

Contact Tracing Group Funded By Soros and Gates, Has Chelsea Clinton on Board



> Partners in Health was recently selected by Massachusetts governor Charlie Baker to conduct Coronavirus “contact tracing,” a process that involves teams of investigators finding out who infected people have come into contact with. The group is already “training and deploying hundreds of contact tracers.” Some citizens fear the potential for mass surveillance posed by contact tracing, especially in light of a Democrat-introduced bill in Congress to authorize contact tracing “at individuals’ residences.” Partners In Health’s involvement will not assuage many fears, considering the group has received funding from George Soros and Bill Gates organizations and counts Chelsea Clinton on its board of trustees.


—

Wuhan Flu: It Escaped From A Nasty Chinese Lab, Or It Emerged From A Nasty Chinese Wet Market



> PICK A LANE.
> 
> He's blaming the people of China for the global spread of COVID-19 when those responsible were China's dictators. https://t.co/EOUsQbInjj
> 
> — Lorrie Goldstein (@sunlorrie) May 12, 2020​
> For those keeping score: You’re an paranoid conspiracy theorist if you ponder the lab-made hypothesis, and a cancel-worthy racist if you accept the approved wet-market hypothesis.
> 
> That is all.


—

Wuhan Flu



> Montréal among the worst cities in the world [in 5th place of 35 cities surveyed for deaths/100K] (h/t joe)
> 
> Trudeau forbids investigations into vote buying scheme: _A memo told employees not to halt payment or trigger investigations for potential abuse, while department has suspended “compliance and enforcement” of EI program_
> 
> Get Out Of Jail Free card: Inmates at a Los Angeles County jail intentionally tried to infect themselves with COVID-19
> 
> Huawei joins in the CCP propaganda effort. But I repeat myself.
> 
> Baseball makes a pitch to return.
> 
> "The challenge here is that we are resuming activity off a high baseline of spread. We have more cases than we thought we'd be having at this point," says @ScottGottliebMD. "We are in a tough spot right now." pic.twitter.com/1WsEhzehLV
> 
> — Squawk Box (@SquawkCNBC) May 12, 2020​
> Gottlieb’s Twitter stream is a good daily go-to. Knowledgeable, balanced, analytical.


----------



## Macfury

Stop attacking the WHO FeXL. Sure, they're 100% wrong, but they provide the science-based information that people like CubaMark rely on.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Stop attacking the WHO FeXL. Sure, they're 100% wrong, but they provide the science-based information that people like CubaMark rely on.


Yer right.

Ahm sorry...


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Stop attacking the WHO FeXL. Sure, they're 100% wrong, but they provide the science-based information that people like CubaMark rely on.





FeXL said:


> Yer right.
> 
> Ahm sorry...


Besides your just gonna love being forced to take The Bill & Melinda Gates Covid vaccine XP-SP1.

I understand it's guaranteed to wipe out 90% of the planets population. Verified by Gates demand that he be indemnified from any legal responsibility.


----------



## FeXL

eMacMan said:


> Besides your just gonna love being forced to take The Bill & Melinda Gates Covid vaccine XP-SP1.


I may end up injected against my will.

Gonna be a lot of broken bones prior to that... beejacon


----------



## CubaMark




----------



## Macfury

They would be Darwin Awards if healthy people were dying in great numbers as predicted. 

They're not.


----------



## eMacMan

CM feel free to be first in line for the Gates Corona Virus vaccine version XP-SP1. While you're at it insist on the rfd chip implant. That way the globalists won't have to track your iPhone to know your every move.

Personally I avoid vaccines like the plague as I am sensitive to formaldehyde and formalin, which are found in all vaccines. Beyond that putting things like Mercury (Thimiserol), Aluminum and/or Squalene directly into the bloodstream is outright dumb, particularly when all you are trying to avoid is the common cold or flu.

Beyond that, I am in my seventies and everything I can find suggests that vaccines are not good news for those in my age bracket. At best only somewhat effective, at worst somewhat dangerous.


----------



## FeXL

The government can give you money, but it can't make you toilet paper



> Congress can pass legislation and give you $1,200, but Congress can't give you a pork chop. Congress does not have any special ability to make it possible for you to turn money it gives you into a pork chop. Producing a pork chop at a minimum requires a farmer and employees to raise a pig, a truck-driver to transport the pig to a processing plant, owners and workers at a processing plant, then another truck-driver to transport the processed pig to a grocery store and then finally a grocer and employees to sell the resulting pork chop to you. This does not even consider any workers involved in producing any machine, such as a truck, used in the pork chop supply chain. So, again, Congress can give you money, but if the supply chain breaks down at any point, legislators cannot make it so you can turn that money into a pork chop.


—

Woohoo!!!

Free Booze, Pot, and Smokes for San Francisco’s Homeless



> San Francisco officials deny direct involvement in a controversial program, funded by private sources, that provides free alcohol, cannabis, and cigarettes to homeless people living in the city’s hotels during the Covid-19 outbreak. After news about the special deliveries was leaked and caused embarrassment on social media, the city’s Department of Public Health issued a statement claiming that “rumors that guests of San Francisco’s alternative housing program are receiving taxpayer-funded deliveries of alcohol, cannabis and tobacco are false.”


—

Speaking of spending, here's Malig-Nancy's latest tour-de-force:

Sen. John Kennedy: Pelosi’s $3 Trillion Bill ‘Dead as Fried Chicken’



> House Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s (D-Calif.) $3 trillion phase four coronavirus stimulus bill dubbed “The Heroes Act,” is “dead as fried chicken with the American people once they find out what’s in it,” Sen. John Kennedy (R-La.) told Fox News’ “Hannity” on Tuesday.


More:



> “In my opinion, the speaker has moved from folly to farce, and when I saw it, it reminded me of that old Jack Nicholson line: ‘Go sell crazy somewhere else. We’re all stocked up here,’” the senator said.


Yeppers.

Where'e the hue & cry from the left, who were critical of Trump for a helluva lot less than $3,000,000,000,000?

Related:

Nancy Pelosi's $3 Trillion Bailout: Billions for Illegal Aliens, Mass Amnesty, Bailouts for Lobbyists, End to All Voter Integrity Laws



> Does the We Have to Keep The Country Locked Down Forever caucus of make-pretend conservatives want to argue that we have to agree to this because it's that important that we keep locked down forever?
> 
> She's holding a gun to the head of America and saying that she will starve citizens who have been made unemployed _forcibly by the government_ unless we give billions of _American_ dollars to foreign criminals and also give them amnesty.
> 
> And also give a bailout to _political lobbyists_.
> 
> They've also snuck in a loophole that cancels all laws that require _Voter ID_ at elections.
> 
> The bill also immediately releases all federal prisoners if they have asthma or diabetes or who are older than fifty (50??!) . All federal prisoners, including murderers and rapists.
> 
> To save them from coronavirus.
> 
> *There is one exception: They don't get released if it can be affirmatively proven they'll murder a specific person.
> 
> If they're likely to murder random people, that's fine, they're still ordered released.*


Bold mine.

Well, in _that_ case...

Related, too:

Democrats’ New $3 Trillion COVID Stimulus Includes The Word ‘Cannabis’ 68 Times



> :House Democrats’ phase four coronavirus stimulus package includes provisions that would allow banks to work with “cannabis-related” businesses without risking retaliation from federal regulators.
> 
> The measures would prohibit federal banking regulators from taking adverse actions against financial institutions that provide services to businesses that cultivate, produce, manufacture, sell, transport, display or purchase cannabis products in states where the substance is legalized.


Step 1 towards national legalization.

—

Wisconsin Supreme Court strikes down Wisconsin's stay-at-home order that closed businesses to limit spread of coronavirus



> The Wisconsin Supreme Court has struck down Gov. Tony Evers' order shutting down daily life to limit the spread of coronavirus — marking the first time a statewide order of its kind has been knocked down by a court of last resort.
> 
> The state's highest court sided with Republican lawmakers Wednesday in a decision that curbed the power of Democratic Gov. Tony Evers' administration to act unilaterally during public health emergencies.


—

Riddle me this one, Batman... (And, it's _not_ California )

Latest Coronavirus Insanity: Surfing Is Allowed But Swimming Is Not



> Imagine a government that would “allow” citizens to surf at the beach but would forbid them from swimming. How would police go about enforcing this rule? Would they watch surfers continuously, and swim out to arrest them the instant they fell off their surfboards? Would surfers have to freeze in the water and drown if they wished to avoid arrest?
> 
> You don’t have to imagine this kind of insanity — you can witness it on the beaches of Ocean City, New Jersey. Ocean City even has a helpful sign explaining what is and isn’t allowed at the partially reopened beaches.


—

New York Attorney General Demands NYPD Stop Enforcing Social Distancing Rules for Minorities



> New York State Attorney General Letitia James (D-N.Y.) has publicly called on the New York Police Department to stop enforcing social distancing measures for African-Americans and Hispanic Americans, claiming that there is a disparity between punishments for minorities and punishments for white Americans, according to Fox News.


h/t AoS's JJ Sefton, who noted:



> NY's Letitia James evidently thinks black people are not human, and therefore exempt from social distancing. Racist.


Yeppers.

—

One Flu Out Of The Wuhan Nest



> Chinese Hackers Are Targeting Virus Research
> 
> Hackers working for the Chinese government are trying to steal valuable research on coronavirus vaccines and treatments from U.S. health care, pharmaceutical and research organizations, the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security warned Wednesday.
> 
> “China’s efforts to target these sectors pose a significant threat to our nation’s response to Covid-19,” the Federal Bureau of Investigation and DHS’s Cybersecurity Infrastructure Security Agency said in a joint statement.
> 
> “The potential theft of this information jeopardizes the delivery of secure, effective and efficient treatment options,” the agencies said.
> 
> The announcement represents an escalation in U.S. efforts to combat Chinese espionage and cyber-attacks. It comes as President Donald Trump attempts to blame the Chinese government for not doing more to prevent the global spread of the coronavirus, which has killed more than 80,000 people in the U.S. and ravaged the economy.​
> “attempts to blame”…
> 
> Related:
> 
> China’s People’s Liberation Army has been involved in scientific research, co-funded by the Australian government, into the origins of the coronavirus which has been published in esteemed medical journals.
> 
> In an explosive revelation, a study co-funded by the Australian Research Council and the Chinese government, and trumpeted by The University of Sydney as helping to solve the puzzle of how COVID-19 transferred from animals to humans, relied on a key laboratory in an institute in the People’s Liberation Army’s Academy of Military Medical Sciences to conduct its “genetic sequencing” and “virus isolation”.​
> Also…
> 
> * It is indeed curious that on Dec 30 Shi Zhengli's database description was changed. In particular, it is interesting to see "vector insects" changed to "rats". Weren't they also working on mosquito-transmitted viruses like Zika/dengue? Why would they start distancing from that?* pic.twitter.com/rGGcqY2vLW
> 
> — Yuri Deigin (@ydeigin) May 14, 2020​


Bold mine.

Questions, questions, questions...

—

One Flu Out Of The Wuhan Nest



> 2/ investigating a still-unexplained outbreak of fatal pneumonias in a bat-infested disused mineshaft located in Mojiang County of Yunnan Province.
> 
> — Luigi Warren (@luigi_warren) May 11, 2020​
> Via Yuri Deigin.
> 
> Related: _A leaked database from a Chinese military-run university suggests the country may have at least 640,000 COVID-19 cases — a figure substantially higher than Beijing’s dubious claim that it has seen just 80,000 coronavirus infections._


The CCP lying about the number of coronavirus infections? Shocka...

—


----------



## eMacMan

I think everyone is lying about both the number of deaths and the number of cases. 

China is almost certainly low balling both. US and many western nations are high balling deaths having been caught red-handed labeling many normal deaths including heart attack , Flu, and COPD as Covid. OTOH they are lowballing cases referring only to confirmed cases rather than properly extrapolating to get a good estimate of total cases. Doing it their way creates the fear mongerers delight; A death rate of over 5%. Doing it correctly gives a death rate of between .09% and .2% of those infected. 

They further complicate the issue by referring to total number of individuals who test positive versus total tests performed, when the denominator should be total number of people tested. That really leaves us having to guess whether the real infection rate is around 6.2% or somewhat closer to 15%. Still I think we can be quite confident it lies somewhere in that range at least for Canada.


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> Make it so;
> 
> A California-based biopharmaceutical company claims to have discovered an antibody that could shield the human body from the coronavirus and flush it out of a person’s system within four days, Fox News has exclusively learned.
> 
> Later Friday, Sorrento Therapeutics will announce their discovery of the STI-1499 antibody, which the San Diego company said can provide “100% inhibition” of COVID-19, adding that a treatment could be available months before a vaccine hits the market.​
> _As chemists, we are troubled by the challenges to mass producing remdesivir. We aren’t alone._
> 
> J’Accuse…! _“The society failed”._
> 
> CNN was unavailable for comment: Greta Thunberg admits to lack of Coronavirus expertise
> 
> Chinada — _The litany of apologies and obsequiousness by Canada is one that only a lickspittle would salute_
> 
> ZERO CASES IN THE REGION and Sask Health is also closing ER’s in Preeceville, Herbert, Arcola, and Davidson as farm activity ramps up for seeding. This is madness.


—

Grandma Killer: Andrew Cuomo Murdered 5300 Elderly New Yorkers But He's a Hero Because He's a Liberal Psychopath



> As you probably know, Andrew Cuomo _ordered_ elderly persons infected with coronavirus _back into their nursing homes_, where they could -- and did -- infect all the other nursing home residents and kill thousands of them.
> 
> 
> He did this deliberately. Why?
> 
> It's hard to think of a reason why -- these people could have been isolated in the _thousands of unused temporary hospital berths_ built to... well, to keep coronavirus patients isolated.
> 
> Instead he ordered them back into nursing homes, to infect other people of a very high risk of dying from the disease.
> 
> And die they did.
> 
> By the thousands.
> 
> All the while, as thousands were dying, the press just could not pour enough praise on Andrew Cuomo.
> 
> *He killed them.*


Bold mine.

—

Former and Current Reality TV Show Host Anderson Cooper Has Meltdown Over Completely Valid Criticism Over CNN's Carnival-Barker Move of Naming Greta Thunberg a Covid Expert



> He whines about the "phony outrage" and demands that the GOP start listening to experts-- even as CNN trots out an ignorant teenager who has already quit school to lecture us about things she hasn't studied.
> 
> Anderson Cooper ended Thursday’s latest CNN coronavirus town hall with an emotion-driven, hypocritical, and sophomoric rant complaining about "the phony online outrage machine," after CNN received widespread blowback for having climate change activist Greta Thunberg as a guest. This was despite the town hall's billing of facts, science, and part of the show title having the phrase Facts and Fears.​


—

The Karenwaffe Propadanda Media Which Has Demanded That Americans Gladly Give Up Their Livelihoods Now Whines and Cries When Covid Comes to Claim Their Jobs



> Bethany Mandel has already been in Learn to Code mode, roasting Buzzfeed for whining about losing their jobs as they shriek that everyone else should be jazzed to lose their jobs.


—

Excellent read.

Featured Comment



> In response to this posting, SDA regular John Robertson offered this astute comment:
> 
> If the tax paying citizens are paying attention, the days of big government are numbered.
> Our high priced help turned out to be easily panicked, clueless and unprepared at the most basic levels, PPE and hospital beds.
> The advice to the public, when you follow the time line, is idiotic and contradictory.
> The shutdown was chaotic with no plan for returning to work.
> The conditions for return keep changing.


I don't agree with his observation about big gov't being numbered. There are still far too many spineless sheep out there who need to be ruled. That said, much of what he notes is salient.

—

Your Moral And Intellectual Superiors



> As soon as the press briefing is over all the media and politicians takeoff their masks…
> What looks to be happening is they are only wearing masks for the television…
> 👇🏻👇🏻👇🏻👇🏻 pic.twitter.com/PbJRCFbhHW
> 
> — Jerry (@Acadiansheperd) May 12, 2020​


----------



## FeXL

Gitcher butts outside!

Vitamin D appears to play role in COVID-19 mortality rates



> After studying global data from the novel coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic, researchers have discovered a strong correlation between severe vitamin D deficiency and mortality rates.
> 
> Led by Northwestern University, the research team conducted a statistical analysis of data from hospitals and clinics across China, France, Germany, Italy, Iran, South Korea, Spain, Switzerland, the United Kingdom (UK) and the United States.
> 
> The researchers noted that patients from countries with high COVID-19 mortality rates, such as Italy, Spain and the UK, had lower levels of vitamin D compared to patients in countries that were not as severely affected.


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu: Heads Should Roll



> The lock down was supposed to prevent this, not _ensure_ it.
> 
> Tens of thousands of medical procedures have been postponed in Ontario, Canada, anticipating a novel coronavirus patient surge that has yet to come, a report from the independent Financial Accountability Office (FAO) found late last month.
> 
> Delayed heart surgeries, for example, have already resulted in around 35 deaths, a University Health Network (UHN) report states.
> 
> “A report has been released today by UHN with respect to cardiac deaths and it has been estimated that approximately 35 people may have passed away because their surgeries were not performed,” Health Minister Christine Elliott acknowledged last Tuesday, according to _Toronto Star_.​
> The same ridiculous situation is happening across the country, including Saskatchewan – with only 13 COVID cases in hospital, the “plan” to resume thousands of postponed “elective” surgeries is still two weeks away.


—

One Flu Out Of The Wuhan Nest



> Juxtapose time!


D'oh!

—

Good!

Wisconsin Lawmakers to Illinois: We're Not Bailing Out States With History of 'Reckless Budgeting'



> A group of 43 Republican lawmakers from Wisconsin has sent a letter to the state’s congressional delegation in Washington asking them not to support any coronavirus relief bill that gives money to Illinois and other states with a history of “reckless budgeting.”
> 
> “These responses to the disease have led to drastic changes in budget projections for states around the country: sales tax collections are down, income tax deadlines have been extended, unemployment rates are at historic levels and more businesses are permanently closing every day,” the letter said.
> 
> “That being said, Wisconsin has spent eight years making the tough choices to get our fiscal house in order,” the letter said. “We do know that our neighbors to the south have spent decades spending and borrowing recklessly.”​
> Democrats in Illinois who run the state are allergic to “hard choices.” Pension and health care costs for retired state workers are out of control and only a federal bailout can save the politicians from having to file bankruptcy — an embarrassment that would almost certainly lead to a Republican takeover of the legislature.


—

Little too radical?

Gov. Jay Inslee retracts requirement that diners provide contact info when restaurants reopen



> When dining rooms in Washington start to reopen in the coming months, restaurants will not be required to record customers’ contact information after all.
> 
> In a walk-back of a controversial component of the restaurant reopening guidance issued earlier this week, Gov. Jay Inslee’s office issued a statement on Friday evening “clarifying” that the state will not require customers to provide their contact information when they go out to eat.
> 
> *Instead, businesses are asked to maintain a list of customers who voluntarily do so.*


Bold mine.

Wonder how many Prog sheep will sign up?

—

One from the Good News file:

When A Garbage Company Noticed An Elderly Customer Had Not Put Trash Out, They Called Her And Saved Her Life



> Jake Bland, with Hometown Hauling in Louisville, Kentucky, noticed a woman hadn't put out trash in more than two weeks.
> 
> He knew something was off. So, Bland asked dispatch to call the customer.
> 
> Bernice Arthur called the 90-year-old woman and discovered the heartbreaking reason she had no trash to put out.
> 
> "She just didn't have nothing to eat," Arthur said, "and that's why she had no trash to put out there."


—

Moderna vaccine initial trial shows promising results



> The pharmaceutical company Moderna announced Monday that its vaccine, the first to be tested in people, appears to be safe and is stimulating an immune response against the novel virus.
> 
> The trial's results are base around eight people who received doses of the virus beginning in March. The volunteers, who were healthy, produced antibodies that were determined to be effective in preventing the virus from replicating.
> 
> The company will now proceed along an accelerated timetable by moving to immediately begin a second phase involving 600 people. The third trial will begin in July, and will involve thousands of healthy volunteers.


—

A Kentucky woman gave birth in a hospital parking lot — and her husband used a face mask to tie off the umbilical cord



> A Kentucky woman, with the help of her husband, gave birth over Mother's Day weekend in a hospital parking lot just steps away from the entrance. It was the middle of the night, the hospital doors were locked and the couple had to use a handmade face mask to tie off the umbilical cord.


—

Derek H. Burney on COVID-19: It's hard for Canada to stand up to China while it's bowing



> The litany of apologies and obsequiousness by Canada is one that only a lickspittle would salute


—

~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!

Meme nails it.

You first Justin ….Trudeau wants to test COVID vaccine developed by Chinese army on Canadians



> Justin Trudeau has invited the Chinese Army to inoculate Canadians with an alleged vaccine developed by the Chinese.


Again, meme nails it:

Canadian-approved N95 mask targeted by Chinese counterfeiters



> A Chinese-made mask approved by Health Canada is the subject of a counterfeit warning issued by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in the U.S.


Nah...

Business and health leaders accuse Trudeau of 'shifting the goalposts' for reopening economy 



> Prime Minister Justin Trudeau has been “shifting the goalposts” in justifying the lockdowns over COVID-19, while portraying as “selfish” any hopes to reopen an increasingly damaged economy, a coalition of health experts and business executives say.


—

Taiwan says WHO has 'forgotten' neutrality by barring island



> Taiwan says China and the WHO have conspired for political purposes to keep it out of key meetings, that the WHO has not responded to requests for coronavirus information and has misreported the number of its infections.


Related:

Meme nails it again.

Canada’s weaselly “support” of Taiwan



> “…But Mr. Champagne added a qualification to Canada’s support that departed from precedent – and may in fact have contradicted Canada’s long-standing position on Beijing’s “one China” policy. “We believe that Taiwan’s role as a non-state observer in the World Health Assembly meetings is in the interest of the international health,” he said.


Uh-oh. Xi ain't gonna be happy with P'tit P'tat...

—

They can learn to code alongside the "journalists"...

Hollywood Faces Carnage as Mass Unemployment Hits Entertainment Industry



> Hollywood is seeing a wave of staff reductions from the corporate suites to the theme park turnstiles as entertainment giants including the Walt Disney Co. and Endeavor implement layoffs and furloughs in response to the Chinese coronavirus pandemic.


—

Don't laugh. Canada's not that far behind. The only difference is, Trudles will tax it...

As lockdown hurts, desperate Venezuelans turn to cow blood soup



> Since Venezuela went into its coronavirus lockdown, dozens of needy people have been lining up at a slaughterhouse in the western town of San Cristobal to pick up the only protein they can find for free: cattle blood.


—

New Zealand deputy leader reveals China pressured the country NOT to go into lockdown - accusing Kiwis of 'overreacting' to the deadly coronavirus



> China tried to persuade New Zealand not to go into lockdown despite the threat of the deadly coronavirus, the country's foreign minister Winston Peters has claimed.
> 
> He revealed Chinese politicians accused the country of 'overreacting' to the impending crisis.
> 
> *Australia and New Zealand both acted quickly to shut their borders - particularly with China, where the outbreak began - leading to some of the lowest infection rates in the world.*


Bold mine.

But it's OK! Juthdin had thigns...

—

Good!

The president strikes back: Trump blocks shipments of semiconductors to China’s Huawei



> President Trump moved on Friday to block shipments of semiconductors to Chinese giant Huawei Technologies from global chipmakers, a step that could escalate tensions with Beijing.
> 
> The Commerce Department announced it is amending an export rule to “strategically target Huawei’s acquisition of semiconductors that are the direct product of certain U.S. software and technology.”


—

Shocka...

CIA report: China pressured WHO to downplay coronavirus

—

Frankly, I'm surprised Kenney had the stones...

China hits back at Alberta Premier Jason Kenney after he called for a 'reckoning'



> The Chinese consulate in Calgary has hit back at Jason Kenney after the Alberta premier called for “a reckoning” with China over the COVID-19 pandemic.
> 
> The consulate in Calgary accused Kenney of criticizing China to please U.S. President Donald Trump and said there was a “large body of facts and data” proving China did not downplay or obfuscate the damaging effects of the novel coronavirus.


Related:

‘China is a victim’ of coronavirus disinformation, says Lying Bastard Communist Chinese ambassador to Canada



> China‘s ambassador to Canada is insisting his country is being victimized by a campaign of disinformation about its role in the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.


—

NIH Investigates Hydroxychloroquine



> The National Institutes of Health is finally getting more serious about investigating hydroxychloroquine, 2 months after the President of the USA brought it to our attention on March 19 as a promising treatment for COVID-19, and more than a month after countermoonbat-governed South Dakota announced a statewide trial.


—

Taiwan, unlike Canada, has defeated COVID-19



> From the day China notified the World Health Organization on Dec. 31, 2019, that a new pneumonia of unknown cause was circulating in Wuhan — while concealing that it was spreading by human transmission — Taiwan did everything to protect its citizens but Canada did not.


—

Xi's not gonna be happy...

62 Nations Back Australia‘s Demand for Chinese Coronavirus Probe… allegedly includes Canada



> _Did I miss the official announcement on this?_


—

Four out of five COVID-19 deaths have been linked to seniors homes. That says a lot about how Canada regards its elders



> The deaths reveal the weak points of an elder care system that has long been recognized as failing, but never actually made to succeed, until too late


----------



## eMacMan

Cuomo should be on trial for first degree mass murder. Pure and simple. Glad someone else picked up on that one as well.

Been seeing some doctors claiming that recent flu vaccinations may make the elderly and those with pre-existing cardio vascular issues more susceptible to deadly outcomes if the do come down with Covid-19.

Notice the vaccine bunch has been skipping animal trials and going straight to human testing. Is that because with previous attempts at Corona vaccines, the animals showed good anti-body results, but then their immune systems went haywire when exposed to the virus, resulting in death? That is one of the reasons there has never been a Corona Virus vaccine.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Four out of five COVID-19 deaths have been linked to seniors homes. That says a lot about how Canada regards its elders


If we had concentrated on quarantining the elderly, the sick and the vulnerable instead of 99% of the population, we might have saved lives.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> If we had concentrated on quarantining the elderly, the sick and the vulnerable instead of 99% of the population, we might have saved lives.


I am convinced that the approach used was intended to cost lives rather than save them. Isolation, having ones livelihood destroyed or impaired, anti-social distancing are all designed to increase stress. And that increased stress will cost many of us our lives.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> If we had concentrated on quarantining the elderly, the sick and the vulnerable instead of 99% of the population, we might have saved lives.


I'm sure of it.


----------



## FeXL

eMacMan said:


> I am convinced that the approach used was intended to cost lives rather than save them.


After watching this TGF, it's difficult, if not downright impossible, to be cynical.


----------



## FeXL

In _October..._

Why DID so many athletes fall sick in Wuhan in October? More competitors reveal they were ill at the World Military Games months before China admitted coronavirus could be passed between humans



> More athletes have revealed they fell ill at a sports event in Wuhan in October – adding to fears the coronavirus was widespread months before China admitted it could be passed between humans.
> 
> Almost 10,000 competitors from more than 100 countries – but not Britain – attended the nine-day World Military Games.
> 
> Jacqueline Bock, part of the German volleyball team, told The Mail on Sunday how she and her colleagues contracted Covid-19 at the event in the city.
> 
> ‘After a few days, some athletes from my team got ill,’ she said. I got sick in the last two days.’


—

Good enough for gov't work.

Computer code for Prof Lockdown's model which predicted 500,000 would die from Covid-19 and inspired Britain's 'Stay Home' plan is a 'mess which would get you fired in private industry' say data experts



> Scientists have levelled a flurry of criticism against Professor Neil Ferguson's modelling which warned 500,000 people could die from coronavirus and prompted Britain to go into lockdown.
> 
> Modelling from Imperial College London epidemiologist Professor Ferguson, who stepped down from the government's Sage group at the start of May, has been described as 'totally unreliable' by other experts.
> 
> The coding that produced the sobering death figures was impossible to read, and therefore cast doubts on its strength, The Telegraph reported. It is also some 13 years old, it said.
> 
> When other scientists have tried to replicate the findings using the same model, they have repeatedly failed to do.


—

Chinese Official Confirms That China Ordered Labs To Destroy Coronavirus Samples



> A senior Chinese government official confirmed Friday that authorities ordered laboratories to destroy samples of coronavirus in early January.
> 
> Secretary of State Mike Pompeo had accused Chinese officials of ordering the samples’ destruction as part of the regime’s cover-up of the coronavirus outbreak in its early stages.
> 
> Pompeo said on April 22 that China “censored those who tried to warn the world, it ordered a halt to testing of new samples, and it destroyed existing samples.” He offered more specificity on May 6, stating that China’s National Health Commission [NHC] ordered virus samples destroyed on Jan. 3.


—

'They told us it wasn't contagious': Chinese blogger Fang Fang's forbidden diary reveals how Wuhan authorities told people coronavirus could NOT be passed between people



> A Chinese author who kept an online diary about her lockdown life in Wuhan has revealed how authorities initially told residents the deadly coronavirus was 'not contagious between people.'
> 
> Wuhan-native Fang Fang, 64, launched a 'forbidden' journal to capture what she heard, read and saw during the epidemic from the viewpoint of an ordinary resident at the epicentre of the crisis.
> 
> In a gripping new extract published by the Sunday Times, the author confessed it was her brother who first told her the virus was contagious, having previously been informed it was 'controllable and preventable.'


—

The Coronavirus Lies Just Keep on Coming



> Check out this little video clip from Chicago. Corrupt Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot has just finished up holding her latest briefing, during which she and all of the reporters in the room dutifully wore their masks while they knew the TV cameras were rolling. As the presser ends, everyone immediately takes off their masks, as several reporters approach Lightfoot to ask a few more questions.


—

Again, the meme nails it.

Beijing Exploits Identity Politics to Deflect Pandemic Blame, Expert Says



> The Chinese regime has leveraged identity politics in the West to deflect attention from its role in causing the global COVID-19 pandemic, according to historian Victor Davis Hanson.
> 
> Over the past few months, Beijing has deployed an aggressive information campaign aimed at shaping the narratives surrounding the pandemic in its favor. That involves trumpeting itself as a global leader in fighting the disease, suggesting that the virus originated from outside of China, and criticizing other countries’ handling of the outbreak, while obscuring its coverup of the initial outbreak.


----------



## eMacMan

Trump has never come across as particularly intelligent. From what I have been able to track down the value of Hydroxychloroquine comes about when the virus goes sideways, properly administered at that point in time it is almost always a lifesaver. Used prophylactically it has proven more fatal than effective. OTOH it's Trump's ass in the sling he's welcome to do as he wishes. As to Zinc it can cause copper deficiency if overdone. As the damage can be permanent he would do well to stick with minimal dosing.

I would suggest the nasal irrigation protocol which does seem highly effective at prevention. 'Course waterboarding a current Prez may not be considered Kosher.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/risks-trump-taking-hydroxychloroquine-70759464



> WASHINGTON (AP) — The White House hurried Tuesday to defend President Donald Trump's decision to take a malaria drug to protect against the coronavirus, despite warnings from his own government that it should only be administered for COVID-19 in a hospital or research setting due to potentially fatal side effects.
> 
> 
> Trump told reporters a day earlier that he has been taking the drug, hydroxychloroquine, and a zinc supplement daily “for about a week and a half now," after two White House staffers tested positive for the coronavirus. Trump has spent months pushing hydroxychloroquine as a potential cure or preventive drug for COVID-19 against the cautionary advice of many of his administration’s top medical professionals. The drug has the potential to cause significant side effects in some patients and has not been shown to combat the new coronavirus.


----------



## SINC

*The FDA has shut down a Bill Gates-backed coronavirus testing program*



> “Please discontinue patient testing and return of diagnostic results to patients until proper authorization is obtained,” the FDA told the Seattle Coronavirus Assessment Network (SCAN) in a memo, according to The New York Times.
> 
> “The FDA has not raised any concerns regarding the safety and accuracy of SCAN’s test, but we have been asked to pause testing until we receive that additional authorization,” according to an update on the SCAN website. There are currently only a couple of at-home coronavirus tests with FDA authorization.
> 
> SCAN, which involved a number of institutions, including the University of Washington Medicine and backed by The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, was sending free test kits to participants.


https://finance.yahoo.com/news/fda-shut-down-bill-gates-222549546.html


----------



## FeXL

Nice!!!

WHOhan Flu



> This is the letter sent to Dr. Tedros of the World Health Organization. It is self-explanatory! pic.twitter.com/pF2kzPUpDv
> 
> — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) May 19, 2020​


Comments nail it.

—

Wuhan Flu



> China – 108 MILLION now back into lockdown.
> 
> But they’ve learned their lessons well: Xi’s 50 Cent Armyis hard at work spreading _blame America_ propaganda.
> 
> Ontario sees spike in new cases.
> 
> Covid Patients Testing Positive After Recovery Aren’t Infectious, Study Shows
> 
> Trump Takes ‘Historic’ Action To Move Pharmaceutical Manufacturing Out Of China, Back To U.S.
> 
> *If hydroxychloroquine were as dangerous as they say, you'd think the media would be delighted @realDonaldTrump is taking it.*
> 
> — Joel B. Pollak (@joelpollak) May 18, 2020​
> Related: A Neil Cavuto segment goes horribly wrong.


Bold mine.

Yeppers

—

Yeah, good luck with that...

Alan Dershowitz: State has right to 'plunge a needle into your arm'



> Harvard Law School emeritus professor Alan Dershowitz claimed in an interview that the government has a constitutional right under the 10th Amendment to forcibly vaccinate a citizen to curb the spread of a contagious disease.
> 
> Advertisement - story continues below
> 
> "Let me put it very clearly, you have no constitutional right to endanger the public and spread the disease, even if you disagree. You have no right not to be vaccinated, you have no right not to wear a mask, you have no right to open up your business," he said.


—

*Hey, Bigot: This one's for you!*

An NIH study on chloroquine & SARS.

Chloroquine is a potent inhibitor of SARS coronavirus infection and spread



> Conclusion
> 
> Chloroquine is effective in preventing the spread of SARS CoV in cell culture. Favorable inhibition of virus spread was observed when the cells were either treated with chloroquine prior to or after SARS CoV infection. In addition, the indirect immunofluorescence assay described herein represents a simple and rapid method for screening SARS-CoV antiviral compounds.


Wait! Never mind. The empirical data in this article is 15 years old. The Progs have newer Assbook & Twatter data than that...

—

Good!

Trump Administration Awards Contract to Shift Drug Manufacturing to the United States



> The White House announced Tuesday a decision to award a $354 million contract to a Virginia pharmaceutical manufacturer to shift drug manufacturing to the United States.
> 
> The contract was awarded by the federal government’s Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority to Phlow Corp. of Richmond, who released the news Tuesday morning. The initial contract can also be extended after the first four years for up to $812 million.
> 
> The company will use a continuous chemical process to develop coronavirus drugs in the United States, rather than use ingredients produced overseas.
> 
> *“For far too long, we’ve relied on foreign manufacturing and supply chains for our most important medicines and active pharmaceutical ingredients while placing America’s health, safety, and national security at grave risk,” Director of the White House Office of Trade and Manufacturing Policy Peter Navarro said.*


Bold mine.

Yeppers.

—

And, where would a Chinese coronavirus link dump be without a closer look at things in Prog paradise, Venezuelahhhhh!

Lockdown III: Dreams of Shower



> The third month of Venezuela’s lockdown has just started, the quarantine has been extended until June 12 and boy, it has felt like an eternity so far. What better way to celebrate this continued reality of ours with a bang—a literal explosion that has knocked down water distribution to Caracas right as at the start of this third month of quarantine.
> 
> *If that’s not enough entertainment for you, then may I suggest a party at one of the endless gasoline lines because lo and behold, the country with the largest proven oil reserves in the world has run out of gasoline.* I am genuinely curious if someone is going to dare make the case that the gasoline and water shortages are actually good because we’re helping heal the environment or something.


Bold mine.

—

Related:


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> The third month of Venezuela’s lockdown has just started, the quarantine has been extended until June 12 and boy, it has felt like an eternity so far. What better way to celebrate this continued reality of ours with a bang—a literal explosion that has knocked down water distribution to Caracas right as at the start of this third month of quarantine.
> 
> If that’s not enough entertainment for you, then may I suggest a party at one of the endless gasoline lines because lo and behold, the country with the largest proven oil reserves in the world has run out of gasoline. I am genuinely curious if someone is going to dare make the case that the gasoline and water shortages are actually good because we’re helping heal the environment or something.


Radio signals from the U.S. are undermining the efforts of the Heroes of the Venezuela Revolution to provide gasoline and showers.


----------



## FeXL

macfury said:


> radio signals from the u.s. Are undermining the efforts of the heroes of the venezuela revolution to provide gasoline and showers.


rotflmao...


----------



## FeXL

Wuhan Flu



> WooOOOOooflu…
> 
> *So… this is the "Doctor" that Chris Cuomo's wife was getting coronavirus treatment advice from that included bathing in bleach*…https://t.co/HThU8SXuSm pic.twitter.com/wcS8TV0pG5
> 
> — Greg Price (@greg_price11) May 20, 2020​
> Sweden’s path is not living up to the hype. They currently have the highest COVID death rate in the world among reports of inadequate treatment. As for herd immunity — _Important COVID19 update today on Sweden, from official press conference: serology survey of ~1100 people from 9 regions during week 18, with sensitivity 98.3% & specificity 97.7% was completed. Age pattern is as expected but seroprevalence is low, alas._
> 
> All 50 states are starting to re-open — in contrast to Saskatchewan where rural ER’s remain shuttered by order of a paralyzed Sask Health bureaucracy, while the border to Montana is closed and flights to Montreal remain open.
> 
> *Another week, another Theresa Tam flip flop on masks.*
> 
> CDC: “Hold my hand sanitizer”.
> 
> ⚠@CDCgov now says #coronavirus mainly spreads via contact with an infected person—NOT by touching contaminated surfaces: “This (surfaces) is not thought to be the main way the virus spreads, but we are still learning more about this virus.”@Pinche_Pihttps://t.co/sZK3k1tol8
> 
> — Dr. Dena Grayson (@DrDenaGrayson) May 19, 2020​


Bold mine.

—

Pennsylvania Lawmakers Demand the Resignation or Firing of Dr. "Rachel" Levine, the Health Secretary Who Removed His Own Mother from Nursing Homes Even As he 



> **** right the **** off with the "Don't misgender me" horse****.
> 
> Dr. "Rachel" Levine took his mother out of a nursing home just as he was signing new orders that sick nursing home patients must be mixed in with the uninfected residents of nursing homes.
> 
> This, of course, had the result of killing thousands of elderly residents.
> 
> But not Dr. Levine's mom!
> 
> Lawmakers are demanding this specimen resign or be fired due to his direct involvement with the premeditated deaths of thousands as well as his refusal to turn over data and information about his decisons and the death toll those decisions have caused.


—

Gretchen Whitmer Allows Gay Swinger's Club to Operate While Barber Loses License



> There is perhaps nothing more confusing than Democrat governors’ orders during the Chinese WuFlu pandemic. Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer is by far the worst. That was made clear with the news that a gay swinger’s club with “glory holes” is being allowed to operate under her nose in Lansing while she aims her business-killing death ray on 77-year-old barber Karl Manke for giving haircuts.
> 
> *Gay swinger’s club is essential.*
> 
> But strangers servicing each other through holes in a basement wall in the state capitol is perfectly fine. I guess group sex is an “essential” activity in the Democrat-run state of Michigan. The underground private club, Club Tabu, has a website that describes what goes on there.


:yikes:

—

~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!

Your Government Is Here For You



> *The Same Fools Who Called Us Racist For Wanting Early Border Closures Now Admit They Should Have Closed The Borders Earlier.*
> 
> Update.
> 
> These are the same people that want to set up laws to “prevent the spread of misinformation on COVID”. pic.twitter.com/9TzJEqWRA3
> 
> — Michelle Rempel Garner (@MichelleRempel) May 21, 2020​
> Also Related.


Bold mine.

And the same fools who are fellating the WHO & Xi. BIRM...

—

Wuhan Flu



> Covid death, or passive euthanization? _A nurse told her he’d had a morphine shot in the hours before he passed away, but he was not given oxygen, nor did staff call an ambulance._
> 
> Florida Governor DeSantis delivers a media smackdown.
> 
> Trust the experts: ‘How Could the CDC Make That Mistake?’
> 
> The problems in meat packing plants continue. (link fixed)


—

I approve!!! :clap::clap::clap:

Nurse Caught On Camera Wearing Nothing But Underwear Under Clear Gown — Her Bosses Were Not Amused



> A Russian nurse is facing disciplinary actions after she wore just her bra and panties under a clear protective suit while treating COVID-19 patients.
> 
> The unnamed nurse is reportedly in her twenties and had previously complained that her regular uniform was “too hot” under the additional protective gear required to treat patients with coronavirus. Her photo was taken as she wore what appeared to be either a bathing suit or simply a bra and panties under her suit as she treated patients in an all-male COVID ward.


—

Study: Infection Rates Have _Fallen_ In States That Ended Lockdowns, While States That Remained Locked Down _Still_ Have Infection Spikes



> Oh.
> 
> "Blood on their hands."
> 
> How much longer will they lie just to delay facing their next massive loss of credibility?
> 
> I wonder, is the White Labcoat League of Fake Twitter Scientists discussing this study, or are xhey pretending it doesn't exist?
> 
> Please, someone alert the Twitter Fake Epidemiology Council of Tom Nichols, Ron Fournier, Karenpundit, and Dr. Guy P. Benson. I need to know what _The Experts_ think.
> 
> Gentlemen, you have guided us through this crisis with your many, many uninformed Twitter Pronouncements -- pray, do not abandon us now in our time of greatest Tweet need!


—

Caution: Link to MotherCorpse inside.

“I knew nothing about it until I saw it on Facebook”



> CBC: Local leaders are refuting claims made by Saskatchewan Health Authority that they were consulted on hospital closures;
> 
> “They may think that an off-the-cuff remark about doing this is consultation, where I don’t,” he said. “That seems to be a big problem with this government. *They say they consult but they really don’t consult. They talk about something and then that’s it and then they go down their path they want to go.*”​
> The red stars mark the locations of the rural ER’s involved in the closures.
> 
> That’s free money laying on the table for the NDP’s Ryan Meili, should he simply choose to pick it up.


Bold mine.

Precisely how Red Rachel got elected in AB...

—

AHHHHHHHHHH!!! 

Victoria’s Secret Closing 250 Stores After Company Suffers a $275.2 Million Quarterly Loss



> Victoria’s Secret will permanently close around 250 stores in the U.S. and Canada in 2020, parent company L Brands announced Wednesday.


—

Wuhan Virus Watch: YouTube Reinstates Video in Which Doctors Say Hydroxychloroquine Treats COVID-19



> oday’s update begins with the news that Youtube was, once again, censoring another video in which medical doctors were expressing their opinion that hydroxychloroquine could help treat COVID-19.
> 
> Fortunately, it was reinstated. However, the repercussions of media misrepresentations are serious.
> 
> YouTube on Wednesday reinstated a video it has previously censored in which several medical doctors suggested that the drug hydroxychloroquine might be useful in treating coronavirus, *with the company reportedly claiming at the time of censorship that the presentation was “dangerous.”*


Bold mine.

More dangerous than, say, pig-ignorant Prog censorship?


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Sweden’s path is not living up to the hype. They currently have the highest COVID death rate in the world among reports of inadequate treatment.


They don't have the highest death rate by a longshot, but you should expect more people to die early on if their people are not sequestered. The others are simply delaying the deaths.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> They don't have the highest death rate by a longshot, but you should expect more people to die early on if their people are not sequestered. The others are simply delaying the deaths.


Yep when Sweden is back to normal, our world will be locking us down again because of the second wave.

The intent was never to prevent deaths but to build an authoritarian template and get the sheeple to go along. By that definition Canada's Corona Cage has been a roaring success. The TrueDope can report back to his puppet masters that Canada is ready to submit to the One World Government.


----------



## FeXL

Canadians Turn Decisively AGAINST Trade With China



> A mere 11% of Canadians think our country should focus on closer trade ties with China, according to a new Angus Reid poll.
> 
> That represents a massive drop, and is part of a trend against more trade with the Communist State.


Huh. 11%. Any bets it's the Laurentian Elite? Again?

Related:

Ouch: Even WHO’s Advisers Believe Director General Tedros Is ‘Naive’



> The World Health Organization’s Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus wanted to praise China in late January for the country’s response to the Wuhan coronavirus. According to Reuters, Tedros “was impressed by their knowledge of the new flu-like virus and their efforts to contain the disease.”
> 
> Despite wanting to praise China, WHO advisers encouraged Tedros to tone down his language, out of fear of how the rest of the world would react. Tedros was adamant about praising China in hopes of receiving their cooperation in helping to contain the virus.


Related, too:

Canada, allies express concern over exclusion of Taiwan from WHO: letter



> _…Canadian health officials also took part Friday in a videoconference that was hosted by Taiwan’s Ministry of Health and Welfare, said a senior government official, who was not authorized to speak publicly about the issue due to its sensitivity._ Read – The LPC doesn’t want to run afoul of their CCP backers.


Yeppers.

Related, 3:

China seems to have infiltrated Canada’s highest intelligence agency – and it’s not the first time



> In September of this past year, a very senior level Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) official named Cameron Ortis was arrested for a number of charges including one under the security information law, which is used to prosecute espionage cases. At the time of his arrest, Mr. Ortis was the director-general of the RCMP’s National Intelligence Coordination Centre. As such he had almost unlimited access to both Canadian intelligence and the large volumes of classified information shared by the Five Eyes allies.
> 
> Mr. Ortis was also the national security advisor for former RCMP Commissioner (a position similar to the FBI director) Bob Paulson. Paulson served as commissioner from 2011-2017. *Some of the charges against Mr. Ortis go back as far as 2015 which means he was likely spying for China from at least 2015 and perhaps much longer.* It has been reported that Mr. Ortis was issued technical devices for secret communication but no one has reported on the significance of this fact. In the trade, a secret communications device would be called CovCom or a covert communications device. Chinese intelligence would not supply this kind of device to Mr. Ortis if they did not consider him to be fully vetted and a trusted spy. That means he gave them everything he could get his hands on.


Bold mine.

Nice.


----------



## FeXL

WE NEED BETTER EXPERTS: CDC Admits Coronavirus Mortality Ratio is Similar to 1957-58 Flu Pandemic Where No Lockdown Was Needed



> The CDC admitted this week that the mortality ratio for the COVID-19 virus is simlar to the mortality rate of 1957-1958 flu pandemic.


—

An Important Question



> Here is a thought: Of the people who most staunchly support the lockdown, what is the percentage of those who have jobs with guaranteed income? It’s easy to pontificate “science” when your kids are not going to bed hungry.
> 
> — Gad Saad (@GadSaad) May 22, 2020​


—

Mississippi Church That Resisted Orders to Shut Down Burns Down/Explodes;
_Trump Orders Governors to Treat Religious Services as "Essential Services"_



> Is this an inside job or a false flag? Or is the left dropping all masks?
> 
> The First Pentecostal Church of Holly Springs in Mississippi burned down early Wednesday morning. The congregation had been in a legal battle to continue holding services despite the novel coronavirus outbreak and subsequent lockdown orders.
> 
> The building went up in flames between 2-4 a.m. Investigators said the church was spray-painted with graffiti before an explosion blew out the front of the building, according to Fox 13. Maj. Kelly McMillian of the Marshall Count Sheriff’s Department confirmed the fire to be a criminal act of arson.​


—

Could You Have Picked Up a Resistance to Covid... Without Having Ever Been Infected with Covid?



> A new paper suggests that 40-60% of the population already has T-cells which are activated to defend against covid, even though they've never actually encountered covid-19, because covid-19 is so similar to other coronaviruses.


—

Kamala Harris Tries to Get Granpa Sexknuckles' Attention With Yet Another #Woke Politics Stunt



> And that little Karen was me.
> 
> Kamala Harris is running hard to be the Democrat VP, and by running hard to be the Democrat VP, I mean pushing frivolous Identity Politics gambits to please the Democrats' real constituency, Twitter.
> 
> Democratic California Sen. Kamala Harris introduced a resolution last week calling on the Senate to condemn the term "Wuhan virus" as racist.​


—

Michigan Judge Rebukes Transexual Governor "Gretchen" Whitmer and "Her" Fascist AG, Telling Them the Barber Has the Right to Remain Open



> Update: You don't say, Genius?
> 
> Stay-at-home orders intended to curb the spread of the coronavirus could end up causing “irreparable damage” if imposed for too long, White House health advisor Dr. Anthony Fauci told CNBC on Friday.
> 
> “I don’t want people to think that any of us feel that staying locked down for a prolonged period of time is the way to go,” Fauci said during an interview with CNBC’s Meg Tirrell on “Halftime Report.”
> 
> He said the U.S. had to institute severe measures because Covid-19 cases were exploding then. “But now is the time, depending upon where you are and what your situation is, to begin to seriously look at reopening the economy, reopening the country to try to get back to some degree of normal.”​
> Are you ****ing kidding me right now.


—

Poll: Up to 94 Percent of Americans Want Economic Nationalist Overhaul in Wake of Chinese Coronavirus Crisis



> A survey conducted by FTI Consulting finds that American voters overwhelmingly want economic nationalist policies implemented — including more tariffs on foreign imports, mandatory country-of-origin labeling, and a requirement that goods be made in the U.S.
> 
> In total, about 66 percent of Americans support increasing tariffs on foreign imports while only 34 percent want more free trade agreements between the U.S. and other countries.


34% who still haven't grabbed a clew...

—

Wuhan Virus Watch: All the catastrophic predictions about reopening Georgia, Florida, and Texas were spectacularly wrong



> Three large Southern states that moved aggressively to reopen amid the coronavirus crisis have seen new cases and deaths largely hold steady since then — despite several controversies over some of their data.


—

Coronavirus is 'uniquely adapted to infect humans': Top vaccine scientist says it could only have come from an animal through a 'freak of nature' - and the possibility it leaked from Wuhan lab MUST be investigated



> A team of scientists has produced evidence that the pandemic virus is ‘uniquely adapted to infect humans’, raising fresh questions over whether its origins were natural or could have occurred in a laboratory.
> 
> Professor Nikolai Petrovsky, a top vaccine researcher who headed the Australian team, said the virus was ‘not typical of a normal zoonotic [animal to human] infection’ since it appeared with the ‘exceptional’ ability to enter human bodies from day one.
> 
> He said the virus should have emerged from an animal through ‘a freak event of nature’ but the possibility that it had leaked from a laboratory could not be ruled out.


—

Ontario records another spike in new COVID-19 cases



> Ontario health officials have reported another spike in the number of new COVID-19 cases.
> 
> The province recorded 460 new cases of the novel coronavirus Sunday morning, the fourth straight day that daily case numbers have been above 400.
> 
> Sunday’s report marks the highest number of new cases reported in Ontario since May 8. when 477 new cases were confirmed. The rise represents a 1.8 per cent increase over yesterday's total.


Related:

How a haven for refugees became home to the worst COVID-19 outbreak in Toronto’s shelter system



> In March, staff at Willowdale Welcome Centre, which would become the site of the largest COVID-19 outbreak in the city’s shelter system, grew concerned about infection control at the facility.
> 
> The refugee centre had opened in the fall. It housed about 200 men and women on separate floors, many of them professionals from Uganda and Nigeria seeking a better life in Canada.
> 
> It was soon operating seamlessly and clients quickly found housing and jobs.


—

Caution: Link to The Grunion.

Wuhan lab says its bat strains were not Covid-19 as US nears 100,000 deaths



> The virology lab in Wuhan, the city at the heart of the outbreak, was working on three live strains of bat coronavirus, but none of them match the one that has caused the Covid-19 pandemic, its director has said.
> 
> Wang Yanyi, the director of the Wuhan Institute of Virology, told Chinese state broadcaster CGTN that the closest genetic match to the virus spreading around the world was only 79.8%, adding that claims made by US president Donald Trump and others that the virus could have leaked from the facility were “pure fabrication”.


—

Pandemic is an extended holiday for public-sector workers



> Let’s see if we’ve got this right: millions of workers in the private sector have lost their jobs and livelihoods, but an army of workers in the public sector are sitting at home and receiving full pay and benefits.
> 
> If this sounds slightly unfair, consider also that the still-flowing paycheques and benefits for public-sector workers are funded by the taxes paid by the millions who have lost their jobs and now rely on various government aid programs and Liberal largesse.
> 
> Maybe now, amidst the carnage the COVID-19 pandemic has wrought on the private sector, the leaders of public-sector unions will finally admit that their members are a separate, privileged class of worker. Try to do it without uttering the insulting phrase, “race to the bottom,” because these days only one sector is sinking, and it isn’t the ship civil servants sail on.


—

Ottawa's trust in China has left us more vulnerable to COVID-19



> During a recent phone call with a friend who was born and raised in Taiwan and whose parents still live there, we discussed how well the tiny Asian nation off the coast of China has done during the COVID-19 pandemic.
> 
> Its economy and schools were never shut down and life goes on essentially like before, except with vigilance against the novel coronavirus. Is it because it’s an island, I wondered?
> 
> “That helps,” my friend said. *“But the biggest reason is because us Taiwanese are skeptical of everything the Chinese communist government says. We assume that every official piece of information that comes out of Beijing is a lie.”*


Bold mine.

Huh. Kinda like me and all levels of gov't...

—

Huh. Lieberals lying.

Shocka...

Liberals not telling the truth on PPE and the stockpile



> The Trudeau government continues to try to rewrite history and even drag civil servants into the fray while deflecting blame for their handling of the COVID-19 pandemic.
> 
> Health Minister Patty Hajdu and Canada’s Chief Medical Officer, Dr. Theresa Tam, appeared before the House of Commons Government Operations Committee on Friday, both singing from the same hymnbook as they proclaimed Canada’s National Emergency Strategic Stockpile was never meant to carry the much sought after personal protective equipment now needed by frontline healthcare workers.
> 
> *“The National Emergency Stockpile was never actually meant to accumulate personal protective equipment,” Hajdu said.*


Bold mine.

'Course not!

—

And the good little Progs will all line up to be tracked...

Trudeau will work with big tech to create app to track Canadians



> Prime Minister Justin Trudeau has said that the government is looking to produce a contact tracing app to fight coronavirus in a press conference today.
> 
> "We will be able to recommend strongly to Canadians a particular app that will help us manage the spread of COVID-19," said Trudeau.


How about an app that warns Canadian's when a politician is near?

—

The question isn't whether we can weather another lockdown. The rhetorical question is, can we handle any further federal, provincial & municipal gov't stupidity?

Can Canadians handle another lockdown? Our governments aren't sure



> How are we going to handle a second wave?
> 
> It’s a question governments across the country are nervously contemplating as Canada eases into a summer downswing of the COVID-19 outbreak and prepares for a potential resurgence in the fall.


—

:---(

Mayor John Tory outlines ‘devastating’ cuts required if other governments don’t bail Toronto out



> Mayor John Tory has outlined a doomsday scenario if other levels of governments don't step in to save the city financially.
> 
> In a message aimed directly at Ottawa and Queen’s Park — which have yet to commit to substantial funding to cover the estimated $1.5-billion shortfall in Toronto this year — Tory laid out what he called “devastating” slashing of TTC, police and library budgets *as well as mass layoffs*.


Bold mine.

I fail to see the problem...

—

The Global Economy’s Fuel Gauge



> China is about one month ahead of the United States in exiting the Covid-19 shutdown. That country’s rush-hour traffic jams now equal or exceeded pre-lockdown levels, even in Wuhan. This quick reversal happened despite claims that telecommuting would “change everything,” especially old-fashioned commuting and, thus, oil demand.
> 
> *At a global level, the pandemic didn’t change the fact that oil powers 97 percent of transportation.* All commerce requires moving materials, food, finished goods, and people. Thus the oil used by planes, trains, and automobiles serves as the fuel gauge for the economy. The reaction to the coronavirus was, effectively, an x-ray of this reality.


Bold mine.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> ... Tory laid out what he called “devastating” slashing of TTC, police and library budgets as well as mass layoffs.


Pinch me! Please don't tell me this is a dream!

The coronavirus didn't cause the shortfall--it was Tory's edicts that did.


----------



## FeXL

:clap::clap::clap:

WHOhan Flu



> No more money for you.
> 
> We are terminating our relationship with the World Health Organization, which acts at the behest of China. pic.twitter.com/QmTKmsLSbP
> 
> — The White House (@WhiteHouse) May 29, 2020​The apoplectic press remains apoplectic.


<sigh> If only Canada had a leader... :-(


----------



## Macfury

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-ta...trated-in-democratic-congressional-districts/



> Of the more than 92,000 Americans who had died of COVID-19 as of May 20 (the date that the data in this analysis was collected), nearly 75,000 were in Democratic congressional districts.


This was surmised earlier.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-ta...trated-in-democratic-congressional-districts/
> This was surmised earlier.


Is the implication that Nursing care facilities in Rebloodlican districts better managed than those in Democryptic districts?


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> Is the implication that Nursing care facilities in Rebloodlican districts better managed than those in Democryptic districts?


Difficult to say because we don't yet know how many people have gotten the virus and never knew it. So all we have is deaths, which may correlate entirely to the number of people who got the illness... or something else. Population density may have something to do with it.


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> *Hey, Bigot: This one's for you!*
> 
> An NIH study on chloroquine & SARS.
> 
> Chloroquine is a potent inhibitor of SARS coronavirus infection and spread
> 
> Wait! Never mind. The empirical data in this article is 15 years old. The Progs have newer Assbook & Twatter data than that...


As usual, FeXL backed the wrong horse:

*Hydroxychloroquine doesn’t prevent COVID-19 in people exposed to the virus, study finds*

Hydroxychloroquine is not effective in preventing the development of COVID-19 in people exposed to the novel coronavirus, a new study involving Canadian researchers concludes.

The results are published today in the New England Journal of Medicine.

* * *

It is the first double-blind, randomized, placebo-controlled trial to be completed assessing the effectiveness of the malaria drug hydroxychloroquine in preventing COVID-19.

* * *

“We conducted an international, randomized controlled trial to look at whether the use of hydroxychloroquine in patients who’d had a high-risk exposure to COVID-19 would prevent the development of symptomatic disease compared to placebo,” Lee said in an interview.

Participants were recruited from Quebec, Manitoba, Alberta and across the United States. In total, the study involved 821 asymptomatic adults who had been exposed at home or in the health-care setting to someone with COVID-19.

* * *

Within four days of exposure, participants received the placebo or hydroxychloroquine by mail, to be taken for a period of five days, beginning with a higher dose on the first day. Researchers and participants were not told which treatment was being administered.

“The approach was if we could load the patient with hydroxychloroquine in the tissues before the incubation period was over, then maybe we could prevent those people who’ve been exposed from getting sick,” Lee said.

* * *

Out of 821 participants, 107 developed COVID-19 — confirmed either by a test or by compatible symptoms — during the 14 days of followup.

Among those who received hydroxychloroquine, 49 developed the disease or symptoms like fever and cough, compared to 58 in the group who received the placebo, meaning that statistically, the drug was no more effective than the placebo.

“We found that there was no statistical difference between patients who got the placebo — which was a vitamin pill — versus those who received the active drug hydroxychloroquine,” Lee said.

* * *

“I would have loved to have a positive study, but in circumstances like this you need the negative studies too so you can redirect attention,” Lee said.

(GlobalNews)​


----------



## Macfury

You don't ever seem to pay attention. The effective treatment includes zinc, missing from this study.



CubaMark said:


> As usual, FeXL backed the wrong horse:


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> You don't ever seem to pay attention. The effective treatment includes zinc, missing from this study.


But, but, but... Hydroxychloroquine!!! The Bigot says so!!!

Related:

The Sound Of Settled Science



> A mysterious company’s coronavirus papers in top medical journals may be unraveling
> 
> On its face, it was a major finding: Antimalarial drugs touted by the White House as possible COVID-19 treatments looked to be not just ineffective, but downright deadly. A study published on 22 May in The Lancet used hospital records procured by a little-known data analytics company called Surgisphere to conclude that coronavirus patients taking chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine were more likely to show an irregular heart rhythm—a known side effect thought to be rare—and were more likely to die in the hospital.
> 
> Within days, some large randomized trials of the drugs—the type that might prove or disprove the retrospective study’s analysis—screeched to a halt. Solidarity, the World Health Organization’s (WHO’s) megatrial of potential COVID-19 treatments, paused recruitment into its hydroxychloroquine arm, for example.
> 
> But just as quickly, the Lancet results have begun to unravel—and Surgisphere, which provided patient data for two other high-profile COVID-19 papers, has come under withering online scrutiny from researchers and amateur sleuths. They have pointed out many red flags in the Lancet paper, including the astonishing number of patients involved and details about their demographics and prescribed dosing that seem implausible. “It began to stretch and stretch and stretch credulity,” says Nicholas White, a malaria researcher at Mahidol University in Bangkok.​
> Related: *Consumption of four or more maintenance doses of HCQ was associated with a significant decline in the odds of getting infected*


Bold mine.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> But, but, but... Hydroxychloroquine!!! The Bigot says so!!!


It amazes me that the left is so angry that it would rather take joy in seeing drugs used to treat critically ill patients with COVID-19 fail, than to see president Trump receive even an iota of credit... for simply talking about something.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> It amazes me that the left is so angry that it would rather take joy in seeing drugs used to treat critically ill patients with COVID-19 fail, than to see president Trump receive even an iota of credit... for simply talking about something.


TDS at its finest. Yet the political right is bigoted. Mirror, much?


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> TDS at its finest. Yet the political right is bigoted. Mirror, much?


An now, Lancet just withdrew the study that CM was crowing about. The researchers apologize for the embarrassment they've caused by relying on faulty data:


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> An now, Lancet just withdrew the study that CM was crowing about. The researchers apologize for the embarrassment they've caused by relying on faulty data:


Huh... Who looks like the horse's ass now?

:lmao::lmao::lmao:


----------



## CubaMark

FeXL said:


> Huh... Who looks like the horse's ass now?
> 
> :lmao::lmao::lmao:


Perhaps *MacFury* and *FeXL*?

Two people who are unable to distinguish between The Lancet and the New England Journal of Medicine?

:lmao:

*Try again, fellas.*


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Let's examine this for a minute, shall we?

Your hysteria: TRUMP! TRUMP is an idiot!!! He claims fish tank cleaner, aka hydroxychloroquine, is an effective treatment for Chinese coronavirus! He told people to drink fish tank cleaner!!! He's killing people! AHHHHHHH!!!

My response: There are a number of anecdotal stories whereby hydroxychloroquine, in combination with other compounds (eg. zinc), seems to treat Chinese coronavirus.

Your hysteria: GOTTA BE A PEER REVIEWED STUDY WITH EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE AN' EVERYTHING!!! FISH TANK CLEANER!!! KILLING PEOPLE!!! TRUMP!!!

My response: Here's a peer-reviewed study from 15 years ago that indicates chloroquine is an effective inhibitor of SARS-CoV.

Your hysteria: YOU'RE ON THE WRONG HORSE!! FISH TANK CLEANER! TRUMP!!! Hydroxychloroquine doesn't work!!! AHHHHHH!!!

MF'S response: You left out the zinc...

My response: What an idiot. Here's a paper from _The Lancet_ that's falling apart at the seams in its claim that antimalarial drugs are killing people & ineffective. Here's another paper that indicates four or more doses of hydroxychloroquine is associated with a significant decline in getting infected.

MF'S response: Yep. The Lancet is pulling it's support from the paper CM quoted.

Your hysteria: CROW!!! YOU GOTTA EAT CROW! YOU'RE ALL WRONG!!! CROW, I SAY! AHHHHHH!!!

The summary? You've claimed since minute one that hydroxychloroquine does not work. Period. MF & I have posted anecdotal evidence (upon which you said, It don't count), as well as various peer-reviewed papers (which, by your request, certainly do count) that it does work, in combination with other compounds (eg. zinc). Period.

Even if the study wasn't in _The Lancet_, it doesn't change the fact that you have not provided evidence to support your claim and we have.

You can snicker behind your little crow meme all you want, but once again, you've been <snort> Trumped. 

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

:lmao::lmao::lmao:

You are _still_ the horse's ass.



CubaMark said:


> Perhaps *MacFury* and *FeXL*?


----------



## Macfury

Another NEJM hydroxychloroquine study bites the dust:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/04/health/retraction-coronavirus-studies-lancet-nejm/index.html


----------



## CubaMark

Macfury said:


> An now, Lancet just withdrew the study that CM was crowing about. The researchers apologize for the embarrassment they've caused by relying on faulty data:


*MacFury was wrong.*

And I made no comment on the unrelated studies / stories to which you linked.

Of course peer-reviewed, scientifically-conducted studies hold more weight with me than your cousin Bubba's third-hand restating of Trump's ramblings.

The fact that some studies are being retracted shows that the integrity of the scientific publishing methodology works, despite your wild-eyed conspiracies that all them brainiacs out there just don't understand how the real world works, gosh golly gee!

The anti-science, anti-knowledge, boot-shaking rage that certain right-wing circles embrace is concerning. Y'all should have your heads examined.


----------



## Macfury

I misidentified the study in NEMJ. You misidentified the treatment we were talking about, which included zinc.



CubaMark said:


> *MacFury was wrong.*
> 
> And I made no comment on the unrelated studies / stories to which you linked.
> 
> Of course peer-reviewed, scientifically-conducted studies hold more weight with me than your cousin Bubba's third-hand restating of Trump's ramblings.
> 
> The fact that some studies are being retracted shows that the integrity of the scientific publishing methodology works, despite your wild-eyed conspiracies that all them brainiacs out there just don't understand how the real world works, gosh golly gee!
> 
> The anti-science, anti-knowledge, boot-shaking rage that certain right-wing circles embrace is concerning. Y'all should have your heads examined.


----------



## Macfury

I read the study. You should be ashamed of yourself for citing it. The test was conducted via Internet and did not involve actually testing all participants for COVID-19.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2016638#article_references



CubaMark said:


> *MacFury was wrong.*
> 
> And I made no comment on the unrelated studies / stories to which you linked.
> 
> Of course peer-reviewed, scientifically-conducted studies hold more weight with me than your cousin Bubba's third-hand restating of Trump's ramblings.
> 
> The fact that some studies are being retracted shows that the integrity of the scientific publishing methodology works, despite your wild-eyed conspiracies that all them brainiacs out there just don't understand how the real world works, gosh golly gee!
> 
> The anti-science, anti-knowledge, boot-shaking rage that certain right-wing circles embrace is concerning. Y'all should have your heads examined.


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

*You were wrong. And still are.*



CubaMark said:


> *MacFury was wrong.*


Which is typical when you've been shown to be *wrong*. Your silence is always deafening _and_ always telling.



CubaMark said:


> And I made no comment on the unrelated studies / stories to which you linked.


Yet you are more than willing to accept Bubba the First Immigrant's oral traditions as fact. Curious, that...



CubaMark said:


> Of course peer-reviewed, scientifically-conducted studies hold more weight with me than your cousin Bubba's third-hand restating of Trump's ramblings.


The fact that studies are being regularly retracted throws into sharp relief the failure of publication companies worldwide to conduct due diligence. In their rush to be the _first one out_ they're eschewing the rigor of quality control. This is demonstrated on a regular basis, as illustrated by recent example here & in sum here.



CubaMark said:


> The fact that some studies are being retracted shows that the integrity of the scientific publishing methodology works, despite your wild-eyed conspiracies that all them brainiacs out there just don't understand how the real world works, gosh golly gee!


The iron... You, of all people on these boards, claiming someone else is anti-science and anti-knowledge. Not limited to your uninformed views on Globull Warming, gun control, progressive politics and alternative energy (among a veritable slew of others) but _especially_ in light of what MF has pointed out above. That's some rigorous research yer citin' there, Bigot. I bet you're a supporter of mail-in ballots, too. :lmao::lmao::lmao:



CubaMark said:


> The anti-science, anti-knowledge, boot-shaking rage that certain right-wing circles embrace is concerning.


Lemme guess: More Prog logic & science on display. I don't agree with your _feels_, therefore _I'm_ the problem. And you wonder why I call you Bigot...



CubaMark said:


> Y'all should have your heads examined.


----------



## FeXL

And speaking of Retraction Watch & Chinese coronavirus...

Retracted coronavirus (COVID-19) papers

_Fifteen_ papers retracted in _4 months_.

Yet we should believe all "experts".

As JJ Sefton noted yesterday at AoS:



> "Hey look at me, I'm a scientist. See, I'm walking around in a white lab coat and carrying a clipboard, upon which there is written Important Data. Listen to what I'm telling you, you rubes! RESPEC' MAH AUTHORITAH!"


Pardon me to hell if I don't exactly lap up the Prog swill handed me by such questionable "experts" as the Chi-Com gov't, the WHO, Teresa Tam und Prinz Dummkopf (BIRM).

Bubba may not don a white lab coat when he goes to work in the morning but I'll accept his common sense approach over many of these so-called "experts" any day of the week & twice on Sundays.

On a related side note, anybody else notice how the areas in Canusa most affected by Chinese coronavirus are blue? On both sides of the border?

Curious, that.

Oh, my apologies, Bigot. I keep forgetting. Anecdotal evidence ist verboten. It makes the Progs look worse...


----------



## FeXL

Don't click on the link if you are easily offended.

Related:

Leftist "Experts" and Leftist "Science" Becoming Too ****ing Ridculous and Spiteful to Tolerate



> Did you know that The Science now says that coronavirus is not contagious in protests of 100 people, but is extremely contagious in non-protest outdoor gatherings of 12?
> 
> You didn't?
> 
> LOL, what a deporable Science-Hater you are.


More:



> A lot of people are noticing that leftists' ideas of "The Science" seems to be "Whatever antifa and Black Lives Matter say it is."


Further:



> Many people--out of a respect for social distancing--missed a parent's dying hours. If you think experiencing that--while watching mass gatherings praised by the same scolds who prevented you from seeing family--doesn't erode trust in authorities, you're actually an idiot. https://t.co/SpXVpCPs67
> — J.D. Vance (@JDVance1) June 3, 2020​


On a side note, drove out to Med Hat a coupla days back. Fifteen miles or so west of Med Hat there is an overpass on Hiway 3 built to go over a set of train tracks. Eastbound land was closed due to some bridge construction. Speed zones, flag person, etc. Pulled up to her stop sign, waited for the other lane to clear. She gave us the go ahead & as I drove past her, noted that she had a face mask on. Fifteen miles out in the bald ass prairie, sunny skies, 23°, no verbal interaction with the traffic, not a job requirement (as her cohort on the other end of the bridge wasn't wearing one, nor any of the workers 50 yards away).

As brain dead as the idiots driving their vehicles around town with masks on...


----------



## eMacMan

FeXL said:


> On a side note, drove out to Med Hat a coupla days back. Fifteen miles or so west of Med Hat there is an overpass on Hiway 3 built to go over a set of train tracks. Eastbound land was closed due to some bridge construction. Speed zones, flag person, etc. Pulled up to her stop sign, waited for the other lane to clear. She gave us the go ahead & as I drove past her, noted that she had a face mask on. Fifteen miles out in the bald ass prairie, sunny skies, 23°, no verbal interaction with the traffic, not a job requirement (as her cohort on the other end of the bridge wasn't wearing one, nor any of the workers 50 yards away).
> 
> As brain dead as the idiots driving their vehicles around town with masks on...


The entire social oppression concept is based on a third place high school science fair project. A computer model no less which fails to differentiate between outdoor and indoor environments.

Hint to the idiots out there: Outdoor air is exchanged in a matter of seconds, indoors a three hour exchange is considered optimal. Even if you buy into the brain dead anti-social distancing concept there is no way that the distance in and out-of doors would be exactly the same. Third place was entirely too generous even if there were only two entries.

The purpose of the masks is much more directly related to dehumanization than safety. But that of course is a primary goal in the early stages of building a communistic regime.


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

Your Government Is Here For You, You Dirty Racist



> The politicians and ‘experts’ have not yet comprehended the damage they did to their own credibility by shifting messaging on lockdowns based on politics. For many people, this is waking them up to how truly *dishonest and despicable the government has become.*
> 
> — Spencer Fernando 🇨🇦 (@SpencerFernando) June 5, 2020


Spencer, millions of us have known this for years.


----------



## FeXL

Just caught a news report from Kenney. Alberta is moving the stage 2 relaunch ahead by a week, to this Friday, June 12. In addition, some of the things planned for stage 3 have been moved ahead to stage 2.


----------



## eMacMan

FeXL said:


> Just caught a news report from Kenney. Alberta is moving the stage 2 relaunch ahead by a week, to this Friday, June 12. In addition, some of the things planned for stage 3 have been moved ahead to stage 2.


Hopefully the latter includes opening swimming pools. It was a brain dead move to close them in the first place. The Chlorine is there to kill any viruses and change rooms get far better and more frequent sanitization than the local gym.

Beyond that provincial park campsites at half capacity also more evidence of a severe brain deficiency on the part of Kenney's advisors. They're outdoors where rapid air exchange makes disease transmission almost impossible. And the spacing between campsites is more than adequate, without reducing capacity one iota.

Final example of absolute brain deficiency, is the notice on many Provincial Park outhouses. "Half the stalls are closed to reduce contact."??? Duh! if the same number of people use half as many stalls you have doubled the contact! Only someone who went to school under the new math could believe that would somehow reduce contact.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> Hopefully the latter includes opening swimming pools. It was a brain dead move to close them in the first place. The Chlorine is there to kill any viruses and change rooms get far better and more frequent sanitization than the local gym.
> 
> Beyond that provincial park campsites at half capacity also more evidence of a severe brain deficiency on the part of Kenney's advisors. They're outdoors where rapid air exchange makes disease transmission almost impossible. And the spacing between campsites is more than adequate, without reducing capacity one iota.
> 
> Final example of absolute brain deficiency, is the notice on many Provincial Park outhouses. "Half the stalls are closed to reduce contact."??? Duh! if the same number of people use half as many stalls you have doubled the contact! Only someone who went to school under the new math could believe that would somehow reduce contact.


Like all of the grocery stores that reduced their hours by half, resulting in twice as many shoppers in the store at any given time--or in a line-up.


----------



## FeXL

eMacMan said:


> Hopefully the latter includes opening swimming pools.


Yeah, they mentioned gyms, pools & athletic areas.

Don't get me started on the utter stupidity of most international, federal, provincial & municipal diktats regarding Chinese coronavirus...


----------



## FeXL

Just in case you needed another reason to tell the WHO to get stuffed. Compare & contrast...

Yesterday's narrative:

The W.H.O. Just Gave Us Another Great Reason to End the Coronavirus Lockdowns RIGHT NOW



> “From the data we have, it still seems to be rare that an asymptomatic person actually transmits onward to a secondary individual,” said Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove, the head of the emerging diseases and zoonosis unit at the WHO.
> 
> Van Kerkhove believes that governments should focus on the detection and isolation of infected people, and those they came in contact with.
> 
> “We have a number of reports from countries who are doing very detailed contact tracing,” she added. “They’re following asymptomatic cases. They’re following contacts. And they’re not finding secondary transmission onward. It’s very rare.”


Today's narrative:

WHO Walks Back Statement That Asymptomatic Coronavirus Transmission Is ‘Very Rare,’ Now Says It Could Be ‘Around 40%’



> The World Health Organization (WHO) walked back a statement made yesterday that asymptomatic transmission is “very rare,” saying at a press conference Tuesday morning that some estimates show asymptomatic transmission rate could be as high as 40%.
> 
> The organization’s technical lead for COVID-19, Maria Van Kerkhov, said at a press conference Monday that it’s ‘very rare’ for patients who have coronavirus without showing any symptoms to transmit the virus to another person.
> 
> “From the data we have, it still seems to be rare that an asymptomatic person actually transmits onward to a secondary individual,” she said Monday according to CNBC.
> 
> Tuesday morning, the WHO said at a press conference that some estimates show that “around 40%” of transmission may be due to asymptomatic transmission.


But trust the authorities!!!

XX)


----------



## FeXL

*~v Becauth ith's 2015!!!*

tptptptp

Fukc me...

Canada-U.S. border to remain closed to non-essential travel for another month



> An agreement has once again been reached between Canada and the United States to keep the border closed to all non-essential or "discretionary" travel for another month, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau has announced.
> 
> The extension on the existing agreement means that the border restrictions will stay in place until July 21, even as both countries continue to reopen their economies.
> 
> "This is an important decision that will keep people *in both of our countries safe*," Trudeau said Tuesday.


Bold mine.

What a crock of horse$h!t. If Prinz Dummkopf was truly interested in keeping people safe, airports would be closed down and temporary foreign workers would not be allowed to pass. Hundreds of thousands of people have arrived in Canada over the course of the last couple of months via plane. Where's the "safety" outcry? I can book a flight from CGY to DFW tonight but I can't drive a couple hours to the relative isolation of northern Montana.

This is nothing more than controlling the population via Cottage Diktat. Frankly, I'm sick of it.

Speaking of cottages, we're paying thousands of $$$ in property taxes on a cabin we aren't allowed to visit. Just because the Prime Groper is hiding under the bed in his...


----------



## FeXL

Jews Say "**** You" to Antisemitic Communist Mayor DeBlasio, and Cut the Chains He Put Around Their Park



> People are calling this "hypocrisy." It's not that.
> 
> This is nothing short of the intentional, coercive subjugation of some people into serf status, while the gangster government elevates its client races/client ideologies to aristocrat status.
> 
> This is, in fact, a hill to die upon.
> 
> *Jews have "liberated" a park from the antisemite communist DeBlasio.*


Bold mine.

:clap::clap::clap:


----------



## CubaMark

*Gee, I wonder if they gave any thought to adding Zinc? * :lmao:


*Hydroxychloroquine: US revokes emergency approval of malaria drug for Covid-19*
_Food and Drug Administration says drug is unlikely to work against coronavirus and notes heart risks_

US regulators revoked the emergency authorization for malaria drugs championed by Donald Trump for treating Covid-19, amid growing evidence they don’t work and could cause serious side effects.

The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) said on Monday the drugs hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine were unlikely to be effective in treating the coronavirus. Citing reports of heart complications, the agency said the drugs’ unproven benefits “do not outweigh the known and potential risks”.

Trump criticized the FDA decision. “I took it and I felt good about taking it. I don’t know if it had an impact, but it certainly didn’t hurt me,” Trump said on Monday.

(The Guardian)​


----------



## Macfury

It's like CIMAvax, that Cuban lung cancer vaccine you're always crowing about. It needs to be administered with nivolumab to provide sufficient clinical results. Hawwwww! Hawwwwww! Isn't that a knee slapper? 

Thank goodness doctors all over the U.S. and the rest of the world continue to prescribe hydroxychloroquine with zinc... and are saving lives, while partisans such as yourself hiss and boo on the sidelines.



CubaMark said:


> *Gee, I wonder if they gave any thought to adding Zinc? * :lmao:


----------



## eMacMan

Looking at the 7 day running averages for new deaths, Canada peaked on May 7th @ 180-185/day. 

The exact # is vague as on June 1 there were 165 Quebec deaths from May23 and earlier dumped into 1 day. The 7 day average peak depends on if/how you factor in those deaths.

Running average today was 49 or about 27% of the May 7th peak. 

It is way past time to put an end to this experiment in Social and Fiscal Devastation.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> Looking at the 7 day running averages for new deaths, Canada peaked on May 7th @ 180-185/day.
> 
> The exact # is vague as on June 1 there were 165 Quebec deaths from May23 and earlier dumped into 1 day. The 7 day average peak depends on if/how you factor in those deaths.
> 
> Running average today was 49 or about 27% of the May 7th peak.
> 
> It is way past time to put an end to this experiment in Social and Fiscal Devastation.


And no differentiation between "new case" and "newly tested."


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> And no differentiation between "new case" and "newly tested."


 I honesty pay no attention to number of cases as it's irrelevant. 

A valid stat would be number of people tested versus number who tested positive. That would allow you to extrapolate to what portion of the general population has (had) the disease, which in turn would let you approximate the actual death rate of those who are infected. Of course that number is a closely guarded secret.

Still the current average daily death toll is less than 1/3 of the May 7th peak. Those are about the only almost real numbers we have to go on.


----------



## FeXL

Trump better not endorse it, otherwise The Bigot will just write it off...

Widely Used And Inexpensive Drug Offers New Hope For Severe COVID-19 Cases



> Trials of the steroid dexamethasone suggest its viability as an effective method for curing seriously ill COVID-19 patients. Its initial success in trials administered across the U.K. comes as welcome news of a cost effective treatment option, especially as the virus has seen a recent uptick in less affluent nations across Africa and Asia.
> 
> The drug is readily available, requires a low dosage, and production can be scaled to account for increased demand globally, according to the BBC.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Trump better not endorse it, otherwise The Bigot will just write it off...
> 
> Widely Used And Inexpensive Drug Offers New Hope For Severe COVID-19 Cases


It would appear he'd rather that people die than be cured by a Trump-approved medication.

On the other hand, if he or a loved one caught the coronavrius, he'd be on his knees begging his doctor for it... with zinc, pleasssssssssse.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> On the other hand, if he or a loved one caught the coronavrius, he'd be on his knees begging his doctor for it... with zinc, pleasssssssssse.


I'm not convinced. The Bigot is so ideological I think he'd rather a loved one die than admit Trump was correct...


----------



## CubaMark

*Today's Coronavirus roundup:*

U.S. Daily Cases Top 60,000; Record Texas Deaths: Virus Update (Yahoo! Finance)

Covid-19 virus '1,000 times more effective at infecting humans than closest relative' because of evolutionary history, study finds (MSNBC)

Hundreds seen lining up for Downtown Disney reopening as coronavirus cases in California spike (FOX News)

'Just connect the dots': Tulsa sees COVID-19 surge after Trump's June rally (CTV)

Italy likely to extend state of emergency due to coronavirus crisis - PM (MSN)

Florida emerges as world's latest COVID-19 epicenter (FOX News)

Trump news – live: President attempts to blame Fauci for coronavirus ‘mistakes’ as California, Florida and Texas all set new daily death highs (MSN)

New coronavirus cases hit 6th record in 10 days (MSN)
_The surge of about 60,000 new cases was driven by spiking infections across the South and the West, mostly in states that eased lockdowns and reopened their economies early after the first spike in the spring._​
Coronavirus: Canada adds 370 new cases, 12 deaths Thursday (Global)

Ontario records highest number of new COVID-19 cases since end of June (CTV)



*Related:*

​—Raging Pencils​


----------



## Macfury

They're not as afraid of COVID as you are, CubaMark. Ultimately, we will have to achieve herd immunity--sooner or later.

I love that the MSN article doesn't consider the possibility of "forced evolution" of the coronavirus.


----------



## eMacMan

The current 7-day running average for Covid deaths in Canada is under 20. That is about 10% of the May 7th peak. More relevantly it currently makes up about 2% of daily deaths. 

CM and other true believers should perhaps try to break their addiction to the Covid Kool-aid. The kool-aid which is being passed out so freely by the lame-stream WHO pimps.


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Yet, curiously, not single word of criticism for all the participants of those "peaceful" protests. Perhaps you think Chinese coronavirus has difficulty surviving smoke, flames & gunfire...



CubaMark said:


> Today's Coronavirus roundup: TRUMP RALLY!!!


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Hello, Bigot.
> 
> Yet, curiously, not single word of criticism for all the participants of those "peaceful" protests. Perhaps you think Chinese coronavirus has difficulty surviving smoke, flames & gunfire...


The virus only spins left.


----------



## eMacMan

.


----------



## eMacMan

I have maintained from the get-go that the Covid planned panicdemic response would cause far more deaths than covid itself.

Just one example from West Virginia and it even made the lamestream, so there is no way the Covid Koolaid drinkers can deny its veracity.

https://news.yahoo.com/opioid-overdoses-skyrocketing-covid-19-100004802.html



> Now coronavirus looks to be undoing the advances made against a drug epidemic that has claimed close to 600,000 lives in the US over the past two decades. Worse, it is also laying the ground for a long-term resurgence of addiction by exacerbating many of the conditions, including unemployment, low incomes and isolation, that contributed to the rise of the opioid epidemic and “deaths of despair”.
> 
> “The number of opioid overdoses is skyrocketing and I don’t think it will be easily turned back,” said Dr Mike Brumage, former director of the West Virginia office of drug control policy.
> 
> “Once the tsunami of Covid-19 finally recedes, we’re going to be left with the social conditions that enabled the opioid crisis to emerge in the first place, and those are not going to go away.”


----------



## CubaMark

Well, if you won't believe the seriousness of the matter based on mainstream media or those **spit** _prog misinformation factories_, then perhaps you'll believe it when the message comes from a source of unquestionable conservative credentials:

*Coronavirus Kills More Americans in One Month Than the Flu Kills in One Year*

*Beware a second wave.*

Although there is still much we don’t know about the coronavirus, we know enough to say that it is far more dangerous and deadly than the flu. It took twelve months and 61 million infections for the H1N1 swine flu to kill 12,500 Americans in 2009–10. The Centers for Disease Control estimated that the seasonal flu killed 34,200 Americans during the 2018–19 flu season. In 2019, car crashes killed 38,800 Americans.

As for the new coronavirus? On March 20, the death toll in the United States was 225. By April 20, the coronavirus had killed more than 42,000 Americans.

Last week The New Atlantis produced a chart that starkly portrays just how quickly COVID-19 became one of the leading causes of death in the United States:



Despite the rapidity with which the coronavirus has killed tens of thousands of Americans, some on the right have continued to argue that the pandemic will end up being no more serious than a bad flu season. On Fox News last week, Bill Bennett said that “we’re going to have fewer fatalities from this than from the flu.” He pointed to the fact that the IMHE model from the University of Washington estimated that COVID-19 would most likely kill about 60,000 Americans and that the seasonal flu killed 61,000 Americans in 2017–18, a particularly bad flu season.

But as Rich Lowry pointed out last week, “if we are going to have 60,000 deaths with people not leaving their homes for more than a month, the number of deaths obviously would have been higher — much higher — if everyone had gone about business as usual.” Indeed, the IMHE model is making an estimate of the death toll only for a first wave of infections, and most of the country will still be vulnerable to infection after the first wave passes.

* * *

We are talking not about statistical models of what might happen in the future but about the reality of what has already happened. The virus has killed 100 Italian doctors. That doesn’t happen during a bad flu season. The virus has killed 30 employees of the New York City Police Department. That doesn’t happen during a bad flu season.

And then there’s the experience of China, where the official death toll in Wuhan is 2,500, according to the Communist regime. But there are reports that the true death toll in Wuhan (a city of 10 million) was more than 40,000 people. That’s 0.4 percent of the city’s entire population.

Almost all conservatives are skeptical of Communist China’s official coronavirus death toll. Why, then, do some think that the coronavirus is not much more deadly than the flu? Did Communist China, a regime not known for valuing human life, shut down much of its economy for a couple of months because of a bad flu? Or did Communist leaders fear that without the costly shutdown the virus would inflict much greater harm on their nation and threaten their grip on power?

_____________________________________
JOHN MCCORMACK is the Washington 
correspondent for National Review and 
a fellow at the National Review Institute. 
@mccormackjohn

(The National Review)​


----------



## FeXL

Hello, Bigot.

Not all <spit> Progs claim to be from the left. And, citing the _National Laughingstock_ as some sort of conservative authority? HA!!!

As far as your shiny chart is concerned, all it is is data. In this instance, the Chinese coronavirus data is portrayed in it's worst light. It's up to the individual to separate the wheat from the chaff, something which you have obviously been unable to do.

Try harder.



CubaMark said:


> Well, if you won't believe the seriousness of the matter based on mainstream media or those **spit** _prog misinformation factories_, then perhaps you'll believe it when the message comes from a source of unquestionable conservative credentials


----------



## Macfury

CubaMark said:


> And then there’s the experience of China, where the official death toll in Wuhan is 2,500, according to the Communist regime. But there are reports that the true death toll in Wuhan (a city of 10 million) was more than 40,000 people. That’s 0.4 percent of the city’s entire population.


The "Communist regime"? What makes you want to doubt the word of a communist all of a sudden?


----------



## eMacMan

CM. If you take Wuhan to mean just the city, based on a comparison to Canada's number, 5000 deaths out of 11 Million is probably a bit too high. It should be in the 3000-4000 range.

If you mean the entire Huwei province with a population of 60 million then 40,000 is still about double the death rate of Canada, but even so 40,000 is only .07% of the regional population.

Conclude from that whatever you will but trying to pass off a number pulled from thin air as meaning that the city lost .4% of its population, is flat out fear mongering, propagandistic, bull 5#!t. Only someone filled to the gills with Covid Kool-aid would take that 40,000 seriously.

Another point. To give you some idea how totally out whack US figures are. The US has recorded 24% of the world's Covid(?) deaths even though they have only 5% of the worlds population. A statistical anomaly like that is screaming that the US numbers are being manipulated upwards. Look more closely and New York city and New Jersey account for a lot of that discrepancy.


----------



## CubaMark

Now that your Orange Messiah has taken up the mask, I expect the rest of you to follow suit, or have your Cheetoh-in-Chief fanboi cards revoked....









(WSBTV Atlanta)


----------



## Macfury

Nobody gives a crap whether Trump wears a mask or not, CM. It's a sacred moment only to you. He was visiting a military hospital, so of course he wanted to protect the patients. You would have screamed if he hadn't worn the mask as well. Your permanent state of rage is incredible to behold.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> CM. If you take Wuhan to mean just the city, based on a comparison to Canada's number, 5000 deaths out of 11 Million is probably a bit too high. It should be in the 3000-4000 range.
> 
> If you mean the entire Huwei province with a population of 60 million then 40,000 is still about double the death rate of Canada, but even so 40,000 is only .07% of the regional population.
> 
> Conclude from that whatever you will but trying to pass off a number pulled from thin air as meaning that the city lost .4% of its population, is flat out fear mongering, propagandistic, bull 5#!t. Only someone filled to the gills with Covid Kool-aid would take that 40,000 seriously.
> 
> Another point. To give you some idea how totally out whack US figures are. The US has recorded 24% of the world's Covid(?) deaths even though they have only 5% of the worlds population. A statistical anomaly like that is screaming that the US numbers are being manipulated upwards. Look more closely and New York city and New Jersey account for a lot of that discrepancy.



Don't try to confuse him with numbers.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Don't try to confuse him with numbers.


Yes that was rather cruel of me. I find mathematics a rather valuable tool in identifying lamestream BS, and tend to forget that some who walk amongst us view basic math with total terror. Of course that makes them easy targets for the fearmongering, propaganda Meißters who are pimping the Covid Kool-aid.


----------



## Macfury

The WHO is hot on the trail of COVID-19's origins, I see...

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...an-lab-who-visit-covid-19-china-a9614391.html



> A coronavirus research lab in Wuhan, the Chinese city where Covid-19 first emerged, will not be visited by World Health Organisation (WHO) investigators looking into the origins of the pandemic.
> 
> WHO is sending a mission to Wuhan, in Hubei province, but has said investigators will be there only to “advance the understanding of animal hosts for Covid-19 and ascertain how the disease jumped between animals and humans”. ⁠


The WHO is an international disgrace.


----------



## Macfury

Infectious progs:

https://thehill.com/changing-americ...-director-says-northerners-visiting-the-south



> ...Robert Redfield, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), is now pointing the finger at Americans traveling across state boundaries.
> 
> “If you look at the South, everything happened around June 12 to June 16. It all simultaneously kind of popped,” he told the Journal of the American Medical Association. “We’re of the view that there was something else that was the driver. Maybe the Memorial Day, not weekend, but the Memorial Day week, where a lot of Northerners decided to go South for vacations.”


----------



## FeXL

International air travel to Canada continues to rise, despite coronavirus border restrictions



> Despite growing concerns about the spread of the novel coronavirus abroad, including record-breaking numbers in several U.S. states, the volume of international travellers arriving at Canadian airports each week continues to rise.
> 
> *Between June 29 and July 12, roughly 91,300 travellers entered Canada by air, according to statistics released by the Canada Border Services Agency*


Nearly 200,000 air travellers/month entering Canuckistan, yet my family isn't allowed to cross the 49th & see if the cabin burned down in the last 9 months.

h/t Neo, who noted, "That's some lockdown"...

Related:

Canada-U.S. border to remain closed to non-essential travel until at least Aug. 21, sources say



> Despite mounting pressure from some U.S. politicians in northern states and border communities to reopen the border, *Prime Minister Justin Trudeau made clear Monday that he has serious concerns about a major spike in coronavirus infections in most of the American states.*


1) What an asshole.
2) Where was his concern months ago when this $h!tstorm first started?
3) Perhaps he should learn how to read data instead of hysterical Prog blogs.
4) What an asshole...

Related, too:

Death By Policy



> Only part of the discrepancy between excess deaths and official Covid deaths results from undercounting of Covid deaths. In New York City, when excess deaths between March 11 (the first recorded Covid-19 death) and May 2 were examined, only 57 percent had laboratory-confirmed Covid-19. Yet when probable deaths—deaths for which Covid-19, SARS-CoV-2, or an equivalent term was listed on the death certificate as an immediate, underlying, or contributing cause of death, but that did not have laboratory confirmation of Covid-19—were added in, 22 percent of excess deaths were still not attributed to Covid-19.
> 
> *The indirect effect of the pandemic—deaths caused by the social and economic responses to the pandemic, including lockdowns—appears to explain the balance*. For instance, people delayed needed medical care because they were instructed to shelter in place, were too scared to go to the doctor, or were unable to obtain care because of limitations on available care, including a moratorium on elective procedures.


Bold mine.

Related, 3:

Thousands of scientists and doctors condemn COVID-19 panic



> Censensus! Since May literally thousands of scientists and doctors, including a Nobel Prize winner, have publicly condemned the heavy-handed lockdowns and restrictions on freedom imposed by governments because of its panic over COVID-19.
> 
> The article provides details. It is very clear that a very large number of scientists are appalled by the over-reach by government health officials that has led to the shut downs and the requirements for mask use. (Obviously these scientists are all white supremacists and racists, and should be cancelled immediately!)
> 
> The article also led me to this research from Oxford University, which concluded in April that the death rate from the Wuhan virus is just about the same as the flu:


Fukc you, Thockboy...


----------



## CubaMark

*Trump Administration Strips C.D.C. of Control of Coronavirus Data*
*Hospitals have been ordered to bypass the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and send all patient information to a central database in Washington, raising questions about transparency.*

_By Sheryl Gay Stolberg
July 14, 2020_

WASHINGTON — The Trump administration has ordered hospitals to bypass the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and send all Covid-19 patient information to a central database in Washington beginning on Wednesday. The move has alarmed health experts who fear the data will be politicized or withheld from the public.

The new instructions were posted recently in a little-noticed document on the Department of Health and Human Services website. From now on, the department — not the C.D.C. — will collect daily reports about the patients that each hospital is treating, the number of available beds and ventilators, and other information vital to tracking the pandemic.

Officials say the change will streamline data gathering and assist the White House coronavirus task force in allocating scarce supplies like personal protective gear and remdesivir, the first drug shown to be effective against the virus. But the Health and Human Services database that will receive new information is not open to the public, which could affect the work of scores of researchers, modelers and health officials who rely on C.D.C. data to make projections and crucial decisions.

“Historically, C.D.C. has been the place where public health data has been sent, and this raises questions about not just access for researchers but access for reporters, access for the public to try to better understand what is happening with the outbreak," said Jen Kates, the director of global health and H.I.V. policy with the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation.

“How will the data be protected?” she asked. “Will there be transparency, will there be access, and what is the role of the C.D.C. in understanding the data?”

News of the change came as a shock at the C.D.C., according to two officials who spoke on the condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the matter. Michael R. Caputo, a Health and Human Services spokesman, called the C.D.C.’s system inadequate and said the two systems would be linked. The C.D.C. would continue to make data public, he said.

“Today, the C.D.C. still has at least a week lag in reporting hospital data,” Mr. Caputo said. “America requires it in real time. The new, faster and complete data system is what our nation needs to defeat the coronavirus, and the C.D.C., an operating division of H.H.S., will certainly participate in this streamlined all-of-government response. They will simply no longer control it.”

But the instructions to hospitals in the department guidance are explicit and underscored: “As of July 15, 2020, hospitals should no longer report the Covid-19 information in this document to the National Healthcare Safety Network site,” the C.D.C.’s system for gathering data from more than 25,000 medical centers around the country.

Public health experts have long expressed concerns that the Trump administration is politicizing science and undermining its health experts, in particular the C.D.C.; four of the agency’s former directors, spanning both Republican and Democratic administrations, said as much in an opinion piece published Tuesday in The Washington Post. The data collection shift reinforced those fears.

“Centralizing control of all data under the umbrella of an inherently political apparatus is dangerous and breeds distrust,” said Dr. Nicole Lurie, who served as assistant secretary for preparedness and response under former President Barack Obama. “It appears to cut off the ability of agencies like C.D.C. to do its basic job.”

The shift grew out of a tense conference call several weeks ago between hospital executives and Dr. Deborah L. Birx, the White House coronavirus response coordinator. After Dr. Birx said hospitals were not adequately reporting their data, she convened a working group of government and hospital officials who devised the new plan, according to Dr. Janis Orlowski, the chief health care officer of the Association of American Medical Colleges, who participated in the group’s meetings.

While she said she understood Dr. Lurie’s concern, Dr. Orlowski said the administration had pledged in “a verbal discussion” to make the data public — or at least give hospitals access to it.

“We are comfortable with that as long as they continue to work with us, as long as they continue to make the information public, and as long as we’re able to continue to advise them and look at the data,” she said, calling the switch “a sincere effort to streamline and improve data collection.’’

The change exposes the vast gaps in the government’s ability to collect and manage health data — an antiquated system at best, experts say. The C.D.C. has been collecting coronavirus data through its National Healthcare Safety Network, which was expanded at the outset of the pandemic to track hospital capacity and patient information specific to Covid-19.

In its new guidance, Health and Human Services said that going forward, hospitals should report detailed information on a daily basis directly to the new centralized system, which is managed by TeleTracking, a health data firm with headquarters in Pittsburgh. However, if hospitals were already reporting such information to their states, they could continue to do so if they received a written release saying the state would handle reporting.

Senator Patty Murray of Washington, the top Democrat on the Senate health committee, has raised *questions about the TeleTracking contract, calling it a “noncompetitive, multimillion-dollar contract” for a “duplicative health data system.”*

Both the C.D.C. network and the TeleTracking system set up by Health and Human Services rely on so-called push data, meaning hospital employees must manually enter data, rather than the government tapping into an electronic system to obtain the information.

“The whole thing needs to be scrapped and started anew,” said Dr. Dan Hanfling, an expert in medical and disaster preparedness and a vice president at In-Q-Tel, a nonprofit strategic investment firm focused on national security. “It is laughable that this administration can’t find the wherewithal to bring 21st-century technologies in data management to the fight.”

Dr. Hanfling and others agree that information does need to be centralized, but they disagree on how that should happen. Dr. Hanfling called for a new “national data coordination center” that would be used for “forecasting, identifying, detecting, tracking and reporting on emerging diseases.”

Representative Donna E. Shalala of Florida, who served as health secretary under former President Bill Clinton, said the C.D.C. was the proper agency to gather health data. If there were flaws in the C.D.C.’s systems, she said, they should be fixed.

“Only the C.D.C. has the expertise to collect data,” Ms. Shalala said. “I think any move to take responsibility away from the people who have the expertise is politicizing.”

Hospitals say the previous reporting requirements were cumbersome, partly because they frequently changed.

“It has been an administrative hassle and confusing to constantly be shifting gears on reporting while hospitals are on the front lines during a pandemic,” Carrie Williams, a spokeswoman for the Texas Hospital Association, wrote in an email.

At Rush University Medical Center in Chicago as the pandemic raged, the hospital had four full-time employees reporting coronavirus data to four different agencies, said Dr. Bala N. Hota, the hospital’s chief analytics officer. Rush collected more than 100 different measures, some of which determined how much money it would receive under different federal programs.

But while Dr. Hota said he supported streamlining the process and the involvement of state and local agencies in reporting, he was also concerned that months into the pandemic, the United States still did not have an established system of collecting the kind of information it needed to seamlessly move patients from a full hospital to one with available beds.

“The C.D.C. is the right agency to be at the forefront of collecting the data,” Dr. Hota said.

The C.D.C. has been criticized for its data collection, however. In May, the agency acknowledged that in tracking the spread of the virus, it had been combining tests that detect active infection with those that detect recovery from Covid-19. That system muddied the picture of the pandemic but raised the percentage of Americans tested as President Trump was boasting about the number of tests the United States was conducting.

Similar complaints about coronavirus data have bubbled up around the country.

In Florida, a former data manager for the Health Department accused one of her superiors of directing her to “manipulate” data used in the state’s plan to lift stay-at-home orders this spring. Ms. Shalala said the mayor of Miami-Dade County “was so concerned about the state data that he has the hospitals reporting their data directly to him as well.”

And Arizona ended its partnership with a university modeling team whose projections showed a rising caseload, prompting pushback from Will Humble, the executive director of the Arizona Public Health Association and a former director of the state’s Health Services Department.

“Trust and accountability and transparency — all three go together,” Mr. Humble said. Of the federal government’s new system, he said: “They’d better keep it transparent, or else people are going to think that it was an ulterior motive.”

(NYT)​
​


----------



## Macfury

Good choice. The CDC has responded with appalling ineptitude to COVID-19.


----------



## CubaMark

*Is anyone really surprised about this?*










This "very impressive" Doctor that Trump saw on a Breitbart video and thought "Yeah, she's a smart cookie! Gotta Tweet this!" :lmao: 

For those who can stomach so much kookiness, here's her Facebook page for "Fire Power Ministries" (yep, she's also a wacko pastor)

The jokes - they write themselves with this bunch! :lmao:

* * *

*Trump walks out of briefing after CNN question*

_Situation Room_

President Donald Trump abruptly ended his coronavirus briefing at the White House following a question about his tweets by CNN's Kaitlan Collins. Trump defended the tweets in support of hydroxychloroquine saying that the drug is still "very positive" and called a doctor who was spreading conspiracy theories on Covid-19 in a now deleted video "very impressive."
(CNN)​
* * *

*Social media giants remove viral video with false coronavirus claims that Trump retweeted*

A video featuring a group of doctors making false and dubious claims related to the coronavirus was removed by Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube after going viral online Monday.

The video, published by the right-wing media outlet Breitbart News, featured a group of people wearing white lab coats calling themselves "America's Frontline Doctors" staging a press conference in front of the US Supreme Court in Washington, DC.
President Trump shared multiple versions of the video with his 84 million Twitter followers Monday night despite the dubious claims running counter to his administration's own public health experts. Spokespersons for the White House did not immediately respond to requests for comment.
(CNN)​
* * *


----------



## Macfury

So does hydroxychloroquine work?


----------



## CubaMark

Macfury said:


> So does hydroxychloroquine work?


I am not a medical doctor. I suspect neither are you 

But from the publicly-available information from authoritative sources, like Trump's own Food & Drug Administration (FDA), we have this:

*July 1, 2020 Update:* A summary of the FDA review of safety issues with the use of hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine to treat hospitalized patients with COVID-19 is now available. This includes reports of serious heart rhythm problems and other safety issues, including blood and lymph system disorders, kidney injuries, and liver problems and failure.

*June 15, 2020 Update:* Based on ongoing analysis and emerging scientific data, FDA has revoked the emergency use authorization (EUA) to use hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine to treat COVID-19 in certain hospitalized patients when a clinical trial is unavailable or participation is not feasible. We made this determination based on recent results from a large, randomized clinical trial in hospitalized patients that found these medicines showed no benefit for decreasing the likelihood of death or speeding recovery. This outcome was consistent with other new data, including those showing the suggested dosing for these medicines are unlikely to kill or inhibit the virus that causes COVID-19. As a result, we determined that the legal criteria for the EUA are no longer met. Please refer to the Revocation of the EUA Letter and FAQs on the Revocation of the EUA for Hydroxychloroquine Sulfate and Chloroquine Phosphate for more information.​
An actual scientific study - randomized trial of patients with covid-19 - shows no effect of the malaria drug, with or without azithromycin (published 23 July 2020 in the New England Journal of Medicine):

Among patients hospitalized with mild-to-moderate Covid-19, the use of hydroxychloroquine, alone or with azithromycin, did not improve clinical status at 15 days as compared with standard care. (Funded by the Coalition Covid-19 Brazil and EMS Pharma; ClinicalTrials.gov number, NCT04322123.)​
Another study by the Henry Ford Health System, published on 02 July 2020, came to a different conclusion:

Treatment with hydroxychloroquine cut the death rate significantly in sick patients hospitalized with COVID-19 – and without heart-related side-effects, according to a new study published by Henry Ford Health System.

In a large-scale retrospective analysis of 2,541 patients hospitalized between March 10 and May 2, 2020 across the system’s six hospitals, the study found 13% of those treated with hydroxychloroquine alone died compared to 26.4% not treated with hydroxychloroquine. None of the patients had documented serious heart abnormalities; however, patients were monitored for a heart condition routinely pointed to as a reason to avoid the drug as a treatment for COVID-19.

* * *

“The findings have been highly analyzed and peer-reviewed,” said Dr. Marcus Zervos, division head of Infectious Disease for Henry Ford Health System, who co-authored the study with Henry Ford epidemiologist Samia Arshad. “We attribute our findings that differ from other studies to early treatment, and part of a combination of interventions that were done in supportive care of patients, including careful cardiac monitoring. Our dosing also differed from other studies not showing a benefit of the drug. And other studies are either not peer reviewed, have limited numbers of patients, different patient populations or other differences from our patients.”

Zervos said the potential for a surge in the fall or sooner, and infections continuing worldwide, show an urgency to identifying inexpensive and effective therapies and preventions.

* * *

The study also found those treated with azithromycin alone or a combination of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin also fared slightly better than those not treated with the drugs, according to the Henry Ford data. The analysis found 22.4% of those treated only with azithromycin died, and 20.1% treated with a combination of azithromycin and hydroxychloroquine died, compared to 26.4% of patients dying who were not treated with either medication.

* * *

Dr. Zervos also pointed out, as does the paper, that the study results should be interpreted with some caution, should not be applied to patients treated outside of hospital settings and require further confirmation in prospective, randomized controlled trials that rigorously evaluate the safety and efficacy of hydroxychloroquine therapy for COVID-19.

“Currently, the drug should be used only in hospitalized patients with appropriate monitoring, and as part of study protocols, in accordance with all relevant federal regulations,” Dr. Zervos said.​
_ _ _ _

And we can continue to post pro- and counter- studies until the cows come home, achieving nothing. Ultimately it's the federal authorities and medical researchers who will determine a course of action and the appropriate medications to employ.

The concern many of us have is simply with the ridiculousness of a major political leader touting a particular drug from a pulpit from which he has spewed lies, misdirection, misconception, etc. and who has ZERO credibility, less knowledge, on the matter(s) of which he loves to "speak" (if you can call his three-year-old vocabulary speech).

Even more ridiculous are those of you who take his words as gospel. Those of you who have pointed to other medical studies which are peer-reviewed as having authority, when you yourselves have lambasted peer-review as some kind of lefty communist plot to pull one over on god-fearing 'mericuns.

IF there are definitive, reproducible, randomized and controlled research showing that hydroxychloroquine (with or without supplements) can be effectively used against covid-19, that's great! 

But damned if I'm going to take the word of the Cheetoh-in-Chief, particularly with the politicization of such a serious matter. I mean, look what the administration has done with covid-19 data - taking it out of the hands of the top organization responsible for tracking it, and putting it into the hands of... who, exactly? 











I have been watching COVID data closely since March. The presence of a sharp break in COVID data in mid July is clearly a statistically anomalous. Nothing else like it appears in the data. When you look at it closely, that break is as sudden as the data are capable of showing. 

It is consistent with being a knife edge. That is difficult to accomplish in national data because it seems to require lots of uncoordinated behaviors around the nation to suddenly converge in a single thunderclap. That is a bit like sand spread out over the floor deciding to organize itself into one neat little pile.

Regardless of details of how data are handled, that knife-edge in the data coincides to the day to when health care providers stopped reporting data to the CDC and started reporting data to HHS instead.

(Dr. Jeff Hester **Not an MD, but a scientist with expertise in data analysis*)​
Hester's video on the covid-19 / CDC / HHS data anomaly:

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsSwzVomWhU[/ame]


----------



## Macfury

You've never trusted US authorities before. Now you're taking the word of the FDA--the same people who protect Monsanto--as gospel?


----------



## CubaMark

*Former GOP presidential candidate Herman Cain dies of COVID-19*









Herman Cain, a successful businessman who ran for the 2012 Republican presidential nomination and later became a backer of President Donald Trump, has died from complications from COVID-19, according to a statement posted Thursday on his personal website.

He was 74.

"Herman Cain — our boss, our friend, like a father to so many of us — has passed away," the statement posted to his website said.

"We knew when he was first hospitalized with COVID-19 that this was going to be a rough fight. He had trouble breathing and was taken to the hospital by ambulance. We all prayed that the initial meds they gave him would get his breathing back to normal, but it became clear pretty quickly that he was in for a battle," the statement said.

The statement noted that Cain, who survived a battle with Stage 4 colon cancer, had been “pretty healthy in recent years” but was considered to be in a “high-risk group” for COVID-19 complications due to his history with cancer.

Last month, Cain had tested positive for COVID-19, just a little over a week after he had attended a Trump campaign rally in Tulsa, Oklahoma on June 20.

While there’s no way to pinpoint exactly where he contracted the virus, Cain posted a photo of himself with others at the event, which showed him without a mask on.

More than 150,000 people in the U.S. have died from COVID-19.

(NBC)​*
Hmmmm... I wonder if his doctors tried hydroxychloroquine?*


----------



## Macfury

It's a bit sad that you, who have two elderly parents, are poking fun at a senior citizen in a high-risk group dying of COVID to make some sort of incomprehensible statement.



CubaMark said:


> *Hmmmm... I wonder if his doctors tried hydroxychloroquine?*


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> It's a bit sad that you, who have two elderly parents, are poking fun at a senior citizen in a high-risk group dying of COVID to make some sort of incomprehensible statement.


Karma's a bitch.

Oh, and I disagree. His statement is crystal clear: He's an asshole...


----------



## CubaMark

Yeah, but, y'know, 2 people died of Ebola under Obama, and 4 during *BENGHAZIIIIII!!!!!!!*, so, of course, _perspective_...


----------



## Macfury

Any more straw men for your wizened little fist to punch down today?



CubaMark said:


> Yeah, but, y'know, 2 people died of Ebola under Obama, and 4 during *BENGHAZIIIIII!!!!!!!*, so, of course, _perspective_...


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> Yeah, but, y'know, 2 people died of Ebola under Obama, and 4 during *BENGHAZIIIIII!!!!!!!*, so, of course, _perspective_...


I notice there was no mention of getting people back to work. Canada's average daily death totals are now averaging in the single digits. Meaning if you die in Canada today, the cause is 100 times more likely to be something other than Corona. The 7 day average peaked back on May 7th at ~185/day. I say approximately because there was a huge dump of 165 old Quebec deaths into the June 1st report, so the exact number at peak depends on how you average in those 165 misplaced deaths.

Way past time to get people back to work and forget the mask BS as well. Every study ever done concluded those masks were useless against viruses. Plus around 50% of the masks I see have a gap around the nose and about 90% have a gap on the sides. IOW people are breathing around the masks rather than through them. On the plus side no danger of hypoxia when the mask does not make a tight seal. And as I pointed out earlier all indicators suggest the virus is way past its most lethal period, or maybe they are just running out of nursing homes to infect.


----------



## Macfury

Stop confusing him with numbers. Canada's "Little Man" is waiting for government to look after him.



eMacMan said:


> I notice there was no mention of getting people back to work. Canada's average daily death totals are now averaging in the single digits. Meaning if you die in Canada today, the cause is 100 times more likely to be something other than Corona. The 7 day average peaked back on May 7th at ~185/day. I say approximately because there was a huge dump of 165 old Quebec deaths into the June 1st report, so the exact number at peak depends on how you average in those 165 misplaced deaths.
> 
> Way past time to get people back to work and forget the mask BS as well. Every study ever done concluded those masks were useless against viruses. Plus around 50% of the masks I see have a gap around the nose and about 90% have a gap on the sides. IOW people are breathing around the masks rather than through them. On the plus side no danger of hypoxia when the mask does not make a tight seal. And as I pointed out earlier all indicators suggest the virus is way past its most lethal period, or maybe they are just running out of nursing homes to infect.


----------



## Macfury

Good to see that fatuous ass, Anthony Fauci, losing his federal government pulpit to Dr. Scott Atlas, someone who understands herd immunity and the enormous societal cost of futile lock downs, which only delay infection from COVID-19.


----------



## FeXL

The Sound Of Settled Science



> It's almost as if the virus spreads more readily in lockdown, precisely as every study has thus far shown. But opening up is a lot less fun for would-be dictators. pic.twitter.com/0Qga1GhMO2
> 
> — Jeffrey A Tucker (@jeffreyatucker) August 20, 2020​
> And a would be dictator she is.


Because...TRUMP!!!

Why Is The Media Suppressing Information About Hydroxychloroquine’s Effectiveness Against COVID?



> On July 31, in a column ostensibly dealing with health care “misinformation,” Washington Post media critic Margaret Sullivan opened by lambasting “fringe doctors spouting dangerous falsehoods about hydroxychloroquine as a COVID-19 wonder cure.”
> 
> Actually, it was Sullivan who was spouting dangerous falsehoods about this drug, something the Washington Post and much of the rest of the media have been doing for months. On May 15, the Post offered a stark warning to any Americans who may have taken hope in a possible therapy for COVID-19. In the newspaper’s telling, there was nothing unambiguous about the science — or the politics — of hydroxychloroquine: “Drug promoted by Trump as coronavirus game-changer increasingly linked to deaths,” blared the headline.
> 
> Written by three Post staff writers, the story asserted that the effectiveness of hydroxychloroquine in treating COVID-19 is scant and that the drug is inherently unsafe. This claim is nonsense.


Horowitz: Study: In 2 weeks in Denver, more people died of heart attacks in lockdown than of coronavirus



> Something uncanny happens when the government exaggerates the threat level of one particular virus and tells people they must stay home. People get scared and stay home … even when they are having a heart attack. A new study indicates that more people might have died at home from untreated heart attacks for fear of coming to hospitals than from coronavirus in Denver, Colorado. This would be yet another example of the man-made plague of lockdown and fear causing more deaths than the virus itself.
> 
> A group of doctors at Denver Health Medical Center led by Brian Stauffer were baffled by what many other hospitals have noticed across the world – that the number of people coming into emergency rooms for heart attacks plummeted during the lockdowns in late March and April. Rather than positing some voodoo explanation of coronavirus curing heart attacks, Stauffer’s teams observed an obvious anomaly in the data on emergency calls that gives away the culprit in this mystery.


Could the key to COVID be found in the Russian pandemic?



> The killer came from the east in winter: fever, cough, sore throat, aching muscles, headache and sometimes death. It spread quickly to all parts of the globe, from city to city, using new transport networks. In many cities, the streets were empty and shops and schools deserted. A million died. The Russian influenza pandemic of 1889-90 may hold clues to what happens next — not least because the latest thinking is that it, too, may have been caused by a new coronavirus.
> 
> In addition to the new diseases of Sars, Mers and COVID-19, there are four other coronaviruses that infect people. They all cause common colds and are responsible for about one in five such sniffles, the rest being rhinoviruses and adenoviruses. As far as we can tell from their genes, two of these coronaviruses came from African bats (one of them bizarrely via alpacas or camels), and two from Asian rodents, one of them via cattle.


Good question:

When Did “Flatten The Curve” Become “Put Your Hands Behind Your Back” ?



> Steal freely.


Progs'll hate it:

‘A Major Advance’: Trump Announces COVID-19 Treatment; Experts Cite Mortality Reduction of Up to 35%



> The Food and Drug Administration on Sunday issued an “emergency use authorization” for transfusions into COVID-19 patients of plasma donated by those who have recovered from the disease, citing data showing a significant – up to 35 percent in some cases – reduction in mortality rates.
> 
> Americans who have recovered from the disease caused by the coronavirus that emerged in Wuhan late last year are being urged to donate plasma, the liquid component of blood, for injection into COVID-19 patients.
> 
> Speaking at the White House, President Trump, FDA Commissioner Stephen Hahn, and Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar, all voiced optimism about the “convalescent plasma” treatment, as America and the world continues to confront the deadly respiratory disease.


A Pandemic of Socialism



> In mid-March of 2020, the United States of America became a socialist country, despite President Trump's promise in his State of the Union address one year prior. To those who lost their non-essential jobs, those who met empty shelves, those who discovered that their "free" education was too costly, those driven insane by incessant fear-mongering, and those faced with capricious and nonsensical restrictions — welcome to socialism. Deceived by the arrogance of science and appeal to authority, or perhaps with false science to mask nefarious motives, public health and safety were used as a contrivance to replace liberty, freedom, and democracy with the Game of Socialism, in which (elected) tyrants play with our lives. Do health and safety trump liberty and freedom, and must we sacrifice one for the other?
> 
> The Constitution of the United States provides for no limitation of our liberty, freedom, or democracy in an emergency. Is this because our Founding Fathers had never heard of the Black Death (1347, multiple) or the Great Plague of Marseille (1720) or the Yellow Fever from the Caribbean (1793) or smallpox (vaccine 1770)? Why, then, did they limit powers in the face of such great calamities?
> 
> Absent such powers, the federal government cannot take advantage of panic, real or contrived, to tyrannize the states or the people, and with the 9th and 14th Amendments, neither can the states (or cities) tyrannize their people. The protections of our Constitution have been eroded over the last century by a crisis culture that has people abandoning liberty for (illusory) safety, as notes Robert Higgs,


Wuhan Flu



> This is news.
> 
> Study: Asymptomatic index cases infected 1 out of 305 close contacts in Hubei. (This might be why China no longer counts asymptomatic infections as cases.)https://t.co/f5cnUJvKio pic.twitter.com/ALx5iIb0UU
> 
> — Phil Kerpen (@kerpen) August 18, 2020​
> More: _In summary, all the 455 contacts were excluded from SARS-CoV-2 infection and we conclude that the infectivity of some asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 carriers might be weak._
> 
> Related: _*55 flights into Canada in August carried passengers infected with COVID-19*_


Bold mine.

One Flu Out Of The Wuhan Nest



> Where IS the Wuhan virus researcher who was named as Patient Zero?
> 
> The US government’s leading health research body has raised a series of bombshell concerns over the origins of the coronavirus pandemic and the activities of a secretive Chinese laboratory that was investigating bat diseases.
> 
> The National Institutes of Health has asked if Covid-19 was linked to the deaths of three miners eight years ago and questioned whether the high-security laboratory in Wuhan possessed samples of the virus prior to the pandemic’s outbreak late last year.
> 
> The agency also demanded to know more about the ‘apparent disappearance’ of a scientist at the lab rumoured to be Patient Zero, and questioned if roadblocks were placed around the Wuhan Institute of Virology between October 14 and 19 last year.​


He Admires Their Basic Dictatorship



> Concentration Camp Tested and Approved.
> 
> A collaboration between a Chinese company and a Halifax research team aiming to carry out Canada’s first clinical trials of a potential COVID-19 vaccine has been abandoned amid rising tensions between the two countries.
> 
> The partnership between the National Research Council of Canada and CanSino Biologics was announced by the federal government in May.
> 
> A team at the Canadian Centre for Vaccinology at Dalhousie University was supposed to work with CanSino to run the first Canadian clinical trials for a possible COVID-19 vaccine. CanSino’s vaccine, called Ad5-nCoV, was already being run through human trials in China and has shown promising results.​


From the comments:



> Let’s see if i have this right , pm zoolander bought 37 million syringes from china for a vaccine he wants to buy from china and make the vaccinations mandatory …….. think you’re sticking that in me , i wish you the best of luck . *The shotgun is mightier than the syringe*


Bold mine...


----------



## eMacMan

https://news.yahoo.com/south-dakota-dismisses-elite-class-015351950.html

What's interesting is that the so-called surge in cases is about 1% of those tested which is, wait for it, what you would have expected had there been no rally whatsoever.

Case totals mean nothing. How many required hospitalization? How many deaths? Are we going to continue to let Gates, Soros and the rest of the WHO thugs disrupt our lives and livelihoods over a common cold?


----------



## eMacMan

This is criminal. How come BLM protestors can gather freely ourtdoors with no fear from the dreaded SARS-2, but an event like this is compromised. Truth is air exchange in the great outdoors is so rapid, that disease transmission is very unlikely as proved just recenthly in Sturgis, SD

https://gazette.com/news/annual-mem...cle_896b7792-fa97-11ea-bc58-f3e1d14ee825.html

Hopefully you can access without hitting the paywall.



> Memorial Park would normally have filled with bagpipers, a motorcycle rally and grieving families Saturday in honor of fallen firefighters and paramedics who died in the line of duty. Instead, solemn songs and tributes for the annual Fallen Fire Fighter Memorial Remembrance echoed through computer screens.
> 
> Members of the International Association of Fire Fighters honored members of the union who died on the job, of a work-related illness or by suicide from Illinois, Florida, California, Canada's British Columbia, Colorado Springs and elsewhere through song, prayer and ringing bells. The names of those who died will also be etched on the walls of the Fallen Fire Fighter Memorial in Colorado Springs.
> 
> The remote ceremony was intended to keep grieving co-workers and families safe during the coronavirus pandemic, while still paying tribute to their loved-ones, said Harold Schaitberger president of the union.


----------



## CubaMark




----------



## Macfury

Last I saw, Nova Scotia had well over 1,000 cases in total.


----------



## CubaMark

Macfury said:


> Last I saw, Nova Scotia had well over 1,000 cases in total.


1089, in fact, but only three active cases currently, one of which is in hospital.

DeAdder was obviously referring to _active_ cases.


----------



## CubaMark

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2IWafjn9p0[/ame]


----------



## CubaMark

*Prime Minister Boris Johnson imposes stay-at-home order in England as coronavirus cases surge*

England will adopt a second national lockdown as coronavirus cases run rampant in the United Kingdom, closing all nonessential businesses but leaving schools open for the next four weeks as it tries to suppress the virus, Prime Minister Boris Johnson announced on Saturday.

People will be ordered to stay at home unless it’s for essential purposes, including education, medical reasons, or to shop for groceries, Johnson said during a press conference in London. Pubs, bars and restaurants must close except for takeaway and delivery.

Some industries that can’t work from home, like construction and manufacturing, will continue. The lockdown will take effect starting Thursday and will end on Dec. 2, he said.

(...)

The U.K. is reporting more than 22,600 Covid-19 cases based on a weekly average — far higher than its first peak in the spring when it reported an average of 4,800 new cases...

(CNBC)​
What the heck, Boris? I mean, _it's just the flu_, right?


----------



## Macfury

Boris is off his nut. Exactly the wrong approach.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Boris is off his nut. Exactly the wrong approach.



Wrong unless the real intent is to destroy any small businesses left standing, dis-employ anyone still working, increase deaths by neglect in nursing homes, increase homelessness, increase suicides, increase the number of deaths due to delayed, diagnosis treatment and surgery, increase overdose deaths...

If those are the goals, then approach is deviously and callously perfect.

BTW I wonder if CM is aware that the UK as of Oct 19 is openly labeling flu deaths and all pneumonia deaths as covid. The latter is particularly diabolical as we are starting to see bacterial pneumonia deaths caused by wearing masks for extended time frames.


----------



## CubaMark

eMacMan said:


> BTW I wonder if CM is aware that the UK as of Oct 19 is openly labeling flu deaths and all pneumonia deaths as covid. The latter is particularly diabolical as we are starting to see bacterial pneumonia deaths caused by wearing masks for extended time frames.


*Source?*

I found this article from Fox News in April, in which any flu or pneumonia death in patients who also tested positive for coronavirus were included in the corona statistics, as a contributory cause (which is normal operating procedure, nothing new unless you're a conspiracy nut).

Folks whose overall health is affected by coronavirus but die from a pre-existing condition nontheless are covid victims, regardless of how you spin it. 

Someone who has a heart attack in the ambulance on the way to hospital after having been shot are still included in the statistics on shooting deaths, not just those who died from a heart attack.


----------



## Macfury

If you die of a very similar ailment, I can understand the confusion. If you die while infected with COVID of something unrelated, of course it shouldn't be counted as COVID.



CubaMark said:


> Folks whose overall health is affected by coronavirus but die from a pre-existing condition nontheless are covid victims, regardless of how you spin it.


----------



## CubaMark

*Dr. Fauci Has This Message for the Skeptics*

Dr. Fauci was asked if the skeptics could be reached. On every story written about the rise in cases or record deaths, at least one commenter—or maybe hundreds—will post that it's "fake news." "It's very frustrating and, in many respects, it is beyond frustrating because as a person of science, you're guided by the data. Sometimes the data are not clear. Sometimes you get studies that vary a bit and confuse people. But sometimes data are really solid, and you can't run away from data that's solid."

Those who say it's no worse that the flu baffle him, in particular. "You have (over 250,000 coronavirus) deaths, 11 million infections and 70,000 people in the hospital. *Flu doesn't even come close*," he said. "When you ask me about frustration, which borders on pain, it's that either people don't want to look at the data or they look at the data and they say it's fake. No, it isn't fake. … This is a global issue. I tell the people who deny or think that this is nothing, do you mean that every single country in Europe is doing the same thing, is making things up?

(Yahoo)​


----------



## 18m2

I think the virus's nickname should be changed to the American Virus or perhaps the tRump Virus.


----------



## polywog

Macfury said:


> If you die of a very similar ailment, I can understand the confusion. If you die while infected with COVID of something unrelated, of course it shouldn't be counted as COVID.


Defining unrelated might be difficult? I mean, if you die in a car wreck and had COVID, you can likely eliminate it as a cause. But if you had lifelong asthma (and survived just fine) up until you contracted COVID? I feel that would be misleading whichever cause you listed.


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> Defining unrelated might be difficult? I mean, if you die in a car wreck and had COVID, you can likely eliminate it as a cause. But if you had lifelong asthma (and survived just fine) up until you contracted COVID? I feel that would be misleading whichever cause you listed.


OTOH if you die of a heart attack and happen to test positive for Covid, the real cause of death is the heart attack but the Official cause is now covid. Ditto for strokes, liver failure, kidney failure and COPD.

Beyond that, the current Covid PCR testing is using 40+ amplification cycles, which is way above the 35 where you start to get a lot of false positives.

Anyways looking at Quebec ~2.5% of the deaths are people under 60. Over 90% are over 70 again almost all with multiple co-mordities. Way over half were in long term care and may well have died of neglect, or despair. Which while they call it Covid, would be more properly labeled Covid mismanagement. 

Meanwhile as the TrueDope is desperately fudging numbers so he can shut down any surviving small businesses before the big Christmas shopping season and Killer Kenney et al are gleefully falling in line, who cares about these folks:


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Anyways looking at Quebec ~2.5% of the deaths are people under 60. Over 90% are over 70 again almost all with multiple co-mordities. Way over half were in long term care and may well have died of neglect, or despair. Which while they call it Covid, would be more properly labeled Covid mismanagement.


What do those figures look like without any intervention? What about deaths caused simply because the ICUs are filled to the brim, or would have been?

Not saying covid hasn't been mismanaged, we've seen what happens on both ends of the spectrum, be it caution or laissez faire. I'm not sure there is a correct answer.


----------



## eMacMan

Not sure what you mean by 'without intervention'.

We do know that stateside the CDC has admitted that only 6% of the Covid deaths had no other underlying cause. In Canada that would translate to under 700 deaths.

In Covid pneumonia cases Canada has consistently failed to intervene with either HCQ therapy or nebulized cortico-steroids, both of which have proven extremely effective in places like Japan, Taiwan and Singapore. So I guess in that respect you can say those numbers are indeed without intervention.

Nationwide as of Tuesday Canada has 1167 Covid deaths in the under 70 age brackets. Look at under 60s and that number drops to; 359.

For this the TrueDope is determined to destroy any Canadian small businesses who have as yet to declare bankruptcy.


----------



## FeXL

Quelle surprise...

Major Study Finds Masks Don’t Reduce COVID-19 Infection Rates



> A high-quality, large-scale Danish study finds no evidence that wearing a face mask significantly minimizes people’s risk of contracting COVID-19. The randomized-control trial found no statistically significant difference in coronavirus infection rates between mask-wearers and non-mask-wearers. In fact, according to the data, mask usage may actually increase the likelihood of infection.


More:



> “In the third post hoc analysis, which investigated constellations of patient characteristics, we did not find a subgroup where face masks were effective at conventional levels of statistical significance,” researchers found.
> 
> The randomized-control trial, which is considered the “gold-standard” design for scientific research, had a large sample size of more than 6,000 people. Most studies conducted on various kinds of face masks against various coronaviruses are neither randomized, controlled trials nor conducted regarding the specific SARS-CoV-2 virus currently affecting the world.


Shocka...

Justin Trudeau's _"Great Reset"_ hits...



> ...a bump in the ****-strewn socialist road...
> 
> _ *Top pathologist Dr. Roger Hodkinson* told government officials in Alberta during a zoom conference call that the current coronavirus crisis is “*the greatest hoax ever perpetrated* on an unsuspecting public.”
> 
> “There is *utterly unfounded public hysteria* driven by the media and politicians, it’s outrageous. All testing should stop because *the false numbers* are '*driving public hysteria*'.”
> 
> “This is not Ebola. It’s not SARS. *It’s politics playing medicine*. And that’s a very dangerous game.”_​


Much more at the link inside.


----------



## eMacMan

FeXL said:


> Quelle surprise...
> 
> Major Study Finds Masks Don’t Reduce COVID-19 Infection Rates


Hmm weren't there already 14 CDC certified studies saying exactly the same thing? Course pointing out that there are zero competent studies contradicting this makes me a tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorist. 




FeXL said:


> Shocka...
> 
> Justin Trudeau's _"Great Reset"_ hits...
> 
> Much more at the link inside.


Didn't someone recently call me a tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorist for attempting to point this out?


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Not sure what you mean by 'without intervention'.


By no intervention, I mean we carry on with ours days as though there's no pandemic; no tests, no masks, everything running at capacity. Would there have only been 1167 Covid deaths in the under 70 age brackets without controls in place?

If hospitals are above capacity, people who needed the ICU die, even if they don't have COVID, after all.



eMacMan said:


> Hmm weren't there already 14 CDC certified studies saying exactly the same thing? Course pointing out that there are zero competent studies contradicting this makes me a tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorist.


That headline, and conclusion are very misleading. Firstly, just the claim that masks don't reduce the risk is wrong. Besides, I'm not sure who says masks reduce the wearers risk of infection; my understanding is the intent all along has been to reduce the risk of _infecting others_.

---

From the study itself:

_"Although the difference observed was not statistically significant, the 95% CIs are compatible with a 46% reduction to a 23% increase in infection."_

So, masks do provide some protection to the wearer even if it's statistically insignificant. 

_"Limitation:

Inconclusive results, missing data, variable adherence, patient-reported findings on home tests, no blinding, and *no assessment of whether masks could decrease disease transmission from mask wearers to others*."_


https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-6817


----------



## CubaMark

polywog said:


> ..._the intent all along has been to reduce the risk of infecting others.
> ---
> From the study itself:
> (...)
> "Limitation:
> 
> Inconclusive results, missing data, variable adherence, patient-reported findings on home tests, no blinding, and *no assessment of whether masks could decrease disease transmission from mask wearers to others*."
> 
> 
> https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-6817_


_

*Exactly this*. I can see why the anti-maskers want to jump on this study as PROOF! PROOF I TELL YOU!!!! of their skewed perspective, the issue has always been masks as method of preventing an infected person from easily spreading that infection._


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> By no intervention, I mean we carry on with ours days as though there's no pandemic; no tests, no masks, everything running at capacity. Would there have only been 1167 Covid deaths in the under 70 age brackets without controls in place?
> 
> If hospitals are above capacity, people who needed the ICU die, even if they don't have COVID, after all.
> 
> That headline, and conclusion are very misleading. Firstly, just the claim that masks don't reduce the risk is wrong. Besides, I'm not sure who says masks reduce the wearers risk of infection; my understanding is the intent all along has been to reduce the risk of _infecting others_.
> 
> ---
> 
> From the study itself:
> 
> _"Although the difference observed was not statistically significant, the 95% CIs are compatible with a 46% reduction to a 23% increase in infection."_
> 
> So, masks do provide some protection to the wearer even if it's statistically insignificant.
> 
> _"Limitation:
> 
> Inconclusive results, missing data, variable adherence, patient-reported findings on home tests, no blinding, and *no assessment of whether masks could decrease disease transmission from mask wearers to others*."_
> 
> 
> https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-6817


Every study contains CYA language such as that. What we can take away is that statistically there was no benefit to wearing masks. So given that and all the other studies which establish that masks are ineffective, *why are the WHO-Puppets attempting to force us to wear them?*

However if the masks do keep me from spreading the virus if I have the virus but am not diagnosed, *then why would I need to self-isolate the instant I am diagnosed?
*
*Where are the actual peer reviewed studies contradicting all the CDC studies which claim masks don't work? *I mean real studies not opinion pieces.

In a 15 minute visit to a local coffee shop I talked to: A woman whose daughter developed a severe facial rash from wearing a mask at work; A woman whose son developed a severe case of acne from wearing a mask at school; And a woman whose sister is a health professional and has developed such a severe allergy to the commercial masks she has to wear, that she is currently unable to work. This in a town where masking is not mandatory and no-one has even been hospitalized with covid. *So where are the studies establishing the safety of these masks? *

*Ever worn a scarf over your nose in cold weather? Does it keep you from seeing your breath? *You know, that water vapour which supposedly carries the virus piggy back and is also supposed to be stopped cold by the masks.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Uhh if the masks do keep me from spreading the virus if I have it but am not diagnosed, then why would I need to self-isolate the instant I am diagnosed?


Succinctly, Masks reduce the risk, they don't eliminate it. They aren't 100% effective. Breath is not the only vector.



eMacMan said:


> Where are the actual peer reviewed studies contradicting all the CDC studies that claim masks don't work? I mean real studies not opinion pieces.


You gave a nod to what amounts to an opinion piece. That's a bit of a double standard. However.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.05.20207241v3
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32624649/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30787335/
https://arxiv.org/abs/2005.10720

And of course FROM the CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/more/masking-science-sars-cov2.html

"*Conclusions*
_Experimental and epidemiological data support community masking to reduce the spread of SARS-CoV-2. The prevention benefit of masking is derived from the combination of source control and personal protection for the mask wearer..._"




eMacMan said:


> In a 15 minute visit to a local coffee shop I talked to: A woman whose daughter developed a severe facial rash from wearing a mask at work; A woman whose son developed a severe case of acne from wearing a mask at school; And a woman whose sister is a health professional and has developed such a severe allergy to the commercial masks she has to wear, that she is currently unable to work. This in a town where masking is not mandatory and no-one has even been hospitalized with covid. So where are the studies establishing the safety of these masks?


You're moving the goalpost. Also, you're asking for studies from others, but only providing anecdotal evidence. Do you have access to anything that corroborates the diagnosis? Have you provided any studies showing that masks DO cause those issues at all, and if so, how often?



eMacMan said:


> Ever worn a scarf over your nose in cold weather? Does it keep you from seeing your breath? You know, that water vapour which supposedly carries the virus piggy back and is also supposed to be stopped cold by the masks.


I'm not aware of any medical grade winter scarfs. I suppose there could be some. Do you see as much of your breath with a scarf and without? Does it go as far? Repeat with a mask, bearing in mind that a) none of the Ps in PPE stand for "Proof" and b) No one claimed they are 100% effective.


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> Succinctly, Masks reduce the risk, they don't eliminate it. They aren't 100% effective. Breath is not the only vector.
> 
> 
> 
> You gave a nod to what amounts to an opinion piece. That's a bit of a double standard. However.
> 
> https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.05.20207241v3
> https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32624649/
> https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30787335/
> https://arxiv.org/abs/2005.10720


So all of the studies concentrated on coughs and none of them studied or claimed real life reductions in transmission of the disease. We do have one large scale body of evidence we can refer to. Long Term Care Centers. Mask compliance is almost 100% and lock downs outright brutal and never ending. Last I checked about 80% of those who died from Covid contracted it at long term care facilities. Speaks volumes as to the efficacy of masks.

We have also seen the number of cases skyrocket after masking became mandatory in Ontario and Quebec.


----------



## CubaMark

eMacMan said:


> So all of the studies concentrated on coughs and none of them studied or claimed real life reductions in transmission of the disease. We do have one large scale body of evidence we can refer to. Long Term Care Centers. Mask compliance is almost 100% and lock downs outright brutal and never ending. Last I checked about 80% of those who died from Covid contracted it at long term care facilities. Speaks volumes as to the efficacy of masks.


Again, anecdotal. There's a reason why scientific, controlled parameter studies are useful: they help weed out ambiguous scenarios and contextual characteristics that contaminate the data.

LTC facilities were the first, principal source of uncontrolled spread of the virus due mainly to close-quarters population of chronically-ill persons, often with at least two persons per room (i.e., overcrowding) if not more, and that pesky two-week incubation period. It was out of control before it could be contained.

In Nova Scotia, the vast percentage of fatalities and cases were contained to one LTC facility in Halifax (currently the subject of an investigation into how it was allowed to go so bad, so quickly. I'll answer the question before you ask it: profit-seeking private corporations. Wage suppression through temporary contracts that avoided full-time employees who would need to be paid benefits / higher wages, so workers were pulling shifts in multiple LTC facilities and themselves became the disease vector, combined with crowded conditions). 

Since the LTC situation was brought under control, our *only* contamination vector has been out-of-province travel: our current spike (51 cases in the month of November, which has the government freaking out - you Ontarians may wish you had those numbers) is due to a traveller who did not isolate on arrival. 



eMacMan said:


> We have also seen the number of cases skyrocket after masking became mandatory in Ontario and Quebec.


Correlation is not causation. Mandatory mask orders came into force as cases began to rise, and with the incubation period, of course you saw a skyrocketing of cases after that order. You're drawing a connection where there is none, and have nothing more than anecdotes - flawed and paranoia-fuelled - to back it up.

But some people will never be convinced. 

That's why mental health care is important.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> So all of the studies concentrated on coughs and none of them studied or claimed real life reductions in transmission of the disease.


You left out quoting the link to the CDC itself, and the conclusion provided by the CDC when you quoted me. You asked for proof contradicting the CDCs claims that masks weren't effective. You asked, you were provided plenty of actual papers. Provided with such, you move the goalposts yet again.



eMacMan said:


> We do have one large scale body of evidence we can refer to. Long Term Care Centers. Mask compliance is almost 100% and lock downs outright brutal and never ending. Last I checked about 80% of those who died from Covid contracted it at long term care facilities. Speaks volumes as to the efficacy of masks.


You keep focusing on masks, but they are_ part of_ a protocol, the aren't the protocol themselves. Clearly if these people are dying, hand washing and disinfecting aren't effective. Let's not bother with those! Also, I assume a lot of the people in long term care are actually in the high risk age category? As in, if they contract COVID they're at a high risk of dying. Maybe that has something to do with the statistic? 

My wife works at a retirement community. There has not been a single case of a resident contracting COVID at all. They enacted protocols before there was a mandate to do so. I could say, "See, that's 100% proof that masks work!" but I'm not going to make such a ridiculous claim, because it's absurd to attribute it to only masks in the first place. 

All staff have to wear masks AND face shields, sure. But there are also very strict cleaning guidelines, since COVID is not JUST AIRBORN. Deliveries must be sanitized. Cardboard is put aside for 4 days to ensure it's clean. None of the staff can work for any other retirement community.


----------



## CubaMark




----------



## 18m2

polywog said:


> None of the staff can work for any other retirement community.


Here in BC, the high infection rate in long-term care facilities was attributed (in part) to care-staff who worked in more than one facility and were able to easily spread the virus. Many care-workers picked up shifts at facilities to supplement their income and some care homes used only part-time staff as a money-saving strategy.

At the time of the early infections, no one wore masks unless the resident had some condition where special care must be exercised to protect the patient or the care-aide. Since the COVID pandemic all staff and visitors must be masked.


----------



## Macfury

Masks will be _partially_ effective at controlling infections, both through filtering of moisture particles and through electrostatic effects.

And Dr. Fauci is a damned fool who has an embarrassing record of being wrong about crucial strategies.


----------



## CubaMark

Well, there goes the neighbourhood. Some yahoos came to Halifax, didn't isolate, some went to a party at Dalhousie University campus, and Boom! We have a bunch of new cases and the "Atlantic Bubble" —composed of NB, NS, PEI and NL— is now burst. PEI and NL now require all new arrivals to the province to isolate for 14 days.

Those numbers may not seem like much to those of you in ON, PQ, AB, but when we were at zero not that long ago, this is a troubling new spread.

*Riding the second wave* (The Halifax Examiner)


----------



## Macfury

Any temporary "defeat" of the virus is an illusion. You either find a cure or achieve herd immunity. I don't have a beef with young people making a choice to congregate. It's the vulnerable who need to isolate.



CubaMark said:


> Well, there goes the neighbourhood. Some yahoos came to Halifax, didn't isolate, some went to a party at Dalhousie University campus, and Boom! We have a bunch of new cases and the "Atlantic Bubble" —composed of NB, NS, PEI and NL— is now burst. PEI and NL now require all new arrivals to the province to isolate for 14 days.
> 
> Those numbers may not seem like much to those of you in ON, PQ, AB, but when we were at zero not that long ago, this is a troubling new spread.
> 
> *Riding the second wave* (The Halifax Examiner)


----------



## eMacMan

Let's see NS has zero 'cases' in the hospital and zero in the ICU. Unless medical attention is required, labeling a positive test as a 'case' is extremely and deliberately misleading. However if one wishes to panic over such a headline; they are free to drink the Kool-aid, wear the mask, cringe when someone is 119cm away, or surrender their humanity in whatever other way they choose. Just do not demand I do the same.

BTW Ontario recorded 14 deaths yesterday. Nine were in long term care where masking is 100% for staff and close to 100% for the inmates. Unknown if any of the other 5 may have been long term care but transferred to hospital prior to their deaths as the quoted stat is: Deaths *in* Long term Care. Also unknown if some of those 14 deaths were really bacterial pneumonia caused by wearing masks for extended periods of time.


----------



## CubaMark

Another angle on the covid-19 pandemic that folks aren't too aware of: the long-term, debilitating effects suffered by some patients. Never heard of Influenza doing this to a person...

_It’s been eight months since Doug Cochrane tested positive for COVID-19. These days, the 55-year-old from Hacketts Cove, N.S. said he feels more like 75.

Cochrane finds it challenging to talk for longer than 10 minutes, and his voice is raspy when he does. The professional genealogist who’s worked on projects for Warner Brothers, major TV shows, and law firms now finds it difficult to remember three items on a list. He regularly experiences dizziness, extreme fatigue, and muscle pains that are particularly intense in his hands and feet.

“Sometimes I get out of bed and my feet are so sore I can’t stand on them to use the washroom or to let the dogs out. I just can’t walk,” Cochrane said in an interview late last week. “I don’t want to sound maudlin or anything like that, but sometimes I feel like I’m feeling what the end of life feels like, some days it’s just really that bad, not mentally but physically. It’s not a good feeling.”_

(The Halifax Examiner)​


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> Another angle on the covid-19 pandemic that folks aren't too aware of: the long-term, debilitating effects suffered by some patients. Never heard of Influenza doing this to a person..._It’s been eight months since Doug Cochrane tested positive for COVID-19. These days, the 55-year-old from Hacketts Cove, N.S. said he feels more like 75.
> 
> Cochrane finds it challenging to talk for longer than 10 minutes, and his voice is raspy when he does. The professional genealogist who’s worked on projects for Warner Brothers, major TV shows, and law firms now finds it difficult to remember three items on a list. He regularly experiences dizziness, extreme fatigue, and muscle pains that are particularly intense in his hands and feet.
> 
> “Sometimes I get out of bed and my feet are so sore I can’t stand on them to use the washroom or to let the dogs out. I just can’t walk,” Cochrane said in an interview late last week. “I don’t want to sound maudlin or anything like that, but sometimes I feel like I’m feeling what the end of life feels like, some days it’s just really that bad, not mentally but physically. It’s not a good feeling.”_
> 
> (The Halifax Examiner)​


Incredibly rare, you can tell it's rare because it makes the Lamestream every time it happens.

Meanwhile CTV reported that 98.5% of deaths were Long Term Care patients. Later pulled but the percentage is incredibly high. 

Good graph from today's Quebec summary, if you can claw your way through the French. If I chipped off enough rust from my Jr. High French, it shows deaths/100,000 group population for each age group. So close to zero for those under 60 that they don't even register.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> Incredibly rare, you can tell it's rare because it makes the Lamestream every time it happens.


Nobody should want to catch COVID-19, but this is the type of anecdotal report that is amplified by its rarity. People worried about themselves or the people they live with should voluntarily sequester. The rest should go about their business as usual, wearing a mask if requested on private property or heavily traveled public property, but doing exactly as they wish everywhere else.


----------



## CubaMark

*U.S. hospitalizations top 90,000 for the first time*

More Americans than ever are in the hospital with the coronavirus. On Thanksgiving Day, hospitalizations hit a record high of more than 90,000 people, according to the COVID Tracking Project, and about 50 Americans are now dying every hour. 

More than 13 million Americans have now been infected with the virus — and it shows no signs of slowing down. Hospitals, already at the brink, are bracing for a new surge after 6.5 million people flew this holiday week. 

Thirty-two states are seeing increases in new daily cases, with Pennsylvania, Arkansas and Massachusetts breaking records. And the true case count could be much higher, considering an expected dip in positivity rates linked to a surge in pre-holiday testing. 

"A lot of people flooded into testing programs to get tested before they traveled for Thanksgiving," said Dr. Emily Landon of the University of Chicago Medical Center, adding, "But they do bring the positivity rates down by flooding the testing market with a number of low risk individuals." 

Landon advised those who learn that someone from their Thanksgiving gathering tested positive to quarantine, and warned that "there are so many cases right now that you will probably not hear from a contact tracer."

The CDC now says the real U.S. case count is likely eight times higher than previously thought, due to underreporting, false negatives and asymptomatic carriers who were never tested. 

(CBS)​


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> *U.S. hospitalizations top 90,000 for the first time*More Americans than ever are in the hospital with the coronavirus. On Thanksgiving Day, hospitalizations hit a record high of more than 90,000 people, according to the COVID Tracking Project, and about 50 Americans are now dying every hour.
> 
> More than 13 million Americans have now been infected with the virus — and it shows no signs of slowing down. Hospitals, already at the brink, are bracing for a new surge after 6.5 million people flew this holiday week.
> 
> Thirty-two states are seeing increases in new daily cases, with Pennsylvania, Arkansas and Massachusetts breaking records. And the true case count could be much higher, considering an expected dip in positivity rates linked to a surge in pre-holiday testing.
> 
> "A lot of people flooded into testing programs to get tested before they traveled for Thanksgiving," said Dr. Emily Landon of the University of Chicago Medical Center, adding, "But they do bring the positivity rates down by flooding the testing market with a number of low risk individuals."
> 
> Landon advised those who learn that someone from their Thanksgiving gathering tested positive to quarantine, and warned that "there are so many cases right now that you will probably not hear from a contact tracer."
> 
> The CDC now says the real U.S. case count is likely eight times higher than previously thought, due to underreporting, false negatives and asymptomatic carriers who were never tested.
> 
> (CBS)​


The usual atrocious fearmongering reporting. 90,000 hospitalized with Corona. So what were they hospitalized because of? We know from the CDC's own admission that only 6% of Corona deaths are only from the virus. Interpolating that to hospitalizations, a reasonable guess would be that roughly 85,000 of those hospitalizations were for other causes. Minor things like heart attacks, strokes, influenza, mask induced(?) bacterial pneumonia, cancer, internal injuries, broken bones, COPD... They just had the misfortune to test positive for Corona. 'Course those that die will be labeled Corona deaths regardless of whether Corona had any impact at all on the outcome.​


----------



## Macfury

Your narratives are now so screwed up, they make no sense at all. It's a jumble of false negatives, false positives, mixed up statistics. Fauci was right when he said millions of Americans would die from COVID, or right when he said that people should book a cruise in March? Or, after telling us that you can catch COVID repeatedly, are you still pushing for a vaccine that will allow... I don't know... people to catch COVID repeatedly?

If the US has eight times the number of cases previously believed then the fallout is amazingly low. Herd immunity is around the corner.

You're posting like a chicken with its head cut off. Don't let this level of fear control your life.



CubaMark said:


> The CDC now says the real U.S. case count is likely eight times higher than previously thought, due to underreporting, false negatives and asymptomatic carriers who were never tested.


----------



## CubaMark

eMacMan said:


> ....We know from the CDC's own admission that only 6% of Corona deaths are only from the virus. .... ... They just had the misfortune to test positive for Corona. 'Course those that die will be labeled Corona deaths regardless of whether Corona had any impact at all on the outcome.


You continue to regurgitate false information. What is your agenda in doing so?

The right-wing Miami Herald sets you straight:

*Did COVID-19 cause only 6% of coronavirus deaths? Viral posts misrepresent CDC report*​


----------



## Macfury

That's exactly what eMacMan said (emphasis mine):

"...only 6% of Corona deaths are only from the virus."



CubaMark said:


> You continue to regurgitate false information. What is your agenda in doing so?
> 
> The right-wing Miami Herald sets you straight:
> 
> *Did COVID-19 cause only 6% of coronavirus deaths? Viral posts misrepresent CDC report*​


----------



## Dr.G.

The 1918 Spanish Flu curtailed retail hours, movie house operating schedules and many other social gatherings. All this and World War I, too! Feeling better about 2020? Déja flu all over again, to paraphrase Yogi Berra!


----------



## Macfury

Dr.G. said:


> The 1918 Spanish Flu curtailed retail hours, movie house operating schedules and many other social gatherings. All this and World War I, too! Feeling better about 2020? Déja flu all over again, to paraphrase Yogi Berra!


Business shutdowns were voluntary during the Spanish Flu.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> That's exactly what eMacMan said (emphasis mine):
> 
> "...only 6% of Corona deaths are only from the virus."


If CM's reading skills were even marginally better than Freddie's Math skills you would not have had to underline that.

As of today a mere 400 Canadians under age 60 have died with Corona virus. If the US math transfers across the border, that would mean that just 24 of them died only because of the Corona virus. 

Now how many young Canadians have felt so hopeless that they have turned to drugs or alcohol? How many will die of overdoses? How many have committed suicide? How many have lost it and beat their wives or children? Why are the lamestream media outlets not looking into those deaths? How many have lost their homes or businesses? Why do Freddie, CM and others not care about these individuals.

BTW lower the bar to under 70 and you still only have 1262 deaths with Corona. Which translates to just a whisker shy of 76 Corona only deaths. 

That leaves more than 10,000 Canadians who had already outlived their expected lifespan when they died with Corona. I will die someday, but I am horrified by the destruction and chaos being wrought on younger Canadians. Damage supposedly done to protect those of us who have already lived most of our lives. As with any protection racket it is the protectors who are far and away the greatest threat.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> Why do Freddie, CM and others not care about these individuals.


Because they themselves aren't affected financially. The rest of the population can eat cake.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Because they themselves aren't affected financially. The rest of the population can eat cake.


I too am not really affected financially, but I can still find empathy for those who are. But then I do not limit my vision to the politically correct narrative.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> I too am not really affected financially, but I can still find empathy for those who are. But then I do not limit my vision to the politically correct narrative.


Exactly. Not so, this pair of "rebels."


----------



## CubaMark

You both make pretty large assumptions about other folks.... 

Meanwhile, on the West Coast:

*An unprecedented 46 people die of COVID-19 in B.C. over the weekend*

...most of whom were elderly and in long-term care, so of course the usual suspects in here will dismiss their passings as inevitable, _not really _because of covid because, you know, _they were gonna die anyway_ of something they already had...someday....


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> You both make pretty large assumptions about other folks....
> 
> Meanwhile, on the West Coast:
> 
> *An unprecedented 46 people die of COVID-19 in B.C. over the weekend*
> 
> ...most of whom were elderly and in long-term care, so of course the usual suspects in here will dismiss their passings as inevitable, _not really _because of covid because, you know, _they were gonna die anyway_ of something they already had...someday....



I thought it was really suspicious when BC went three days without reporting any deaths or anything else. Without the blinders you'd have recognized that the books were being cooked. Comparing an accumulation of 3 days deaths to single or 2 day totals. Works well if you can find someone with blinders to buy it.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> I thought it was really suspicious when BC went three days without reporting any deaths or anything else. Without the blinders you'd have recognized that the books were being cooked. Comparing an accumulation of 3 days deaths to single or 2 day totals. Works well if you can find someone with blinders to buy it.


COVID porn.


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> You both make pretty large assumptions about other folks....
> 
> Meanwhile, on the West Coast:
> 
> *An unprecedented 46 people die of COVID-19 in B.C. over the weekend*
> 
> ...most of whom were elderly and in long-term care, so of course the usual suspects in here will dismiss their passings as inevitable, _not really _because of covid because, you know, _they were gonna die anyway_ of something they already had...someday....


Turns out it was fake news. BC did not report Saturday or Sunday deaths. Therefore the table would typically have BC combining Saturday, Sunday and Monday and that came in at 14.









So maybe BC got lazy and forgot to submit a combined total after skipping Saturday and Sunday. Maybe the person submitting the totals was suffering from oxygen deprivation after wearing a mask for an extended peiod of time. Approached from a different direction (Mondays total BC deaths 441)-(14 Deaths on Monday)-(Fridays total deaths 395)=32 deaths over the weekend.

Either way you approach it your lamestream darlings have once again been caught fudging numbers, with the most plausible explanation being; To spread fear. Should they not be charged with terrorism?


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Turns out it was fake news. BC did not report Saturday or Sunday deaths. Therefore the table would typically have BC combining Saturday, Sunday and Monday and that came in at 14.


Feel free to link to your actual sources, before claiming other news sources are fake.

I tend to trust raw data over a screenshot that appears to be from a Numbers spreadsheet.

For what it's worth Johns Hopkins reports +46 deaths.

https://github.com/CSSEGISandData/COVID-19




eMacMan said:


> Either way you approach it your lamestream darlings have once again been caught fudging numbers, with the most plausible explanation being; To spread fear. Should they not be charged with terrorism?


Yes, that's clearly the most likely reason.


----------



## 18m2

BC has never reported cases on the weekend. Might be some union agreement preventing civil servants from working on the weekend.

I don't really know ......


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> Feel free to link to your actual sources, before claiming other news sources are fake.
> 
> I tend to trust raw data over a screenshot that appears to be from a Numbers spreadsheet.
> 
> For what it's worth Johns Hopkins reports +46 deaths.
> 
> https://github.com/CSSEGISandData/COVID-19
> 
> Yes, that's clearly the most likely reason.


All data and previous screenshot taken from here, comparison is to screen shots from here at earlier dates;
https://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/epidemiological-summary-covid-19-cases.html

Now I don't trust the government of Canada either, which is why I do daily screen shots, including provincial data also accessed from that site. That way when someone tosses out a bogus number I know its bogus. If you chose to believe those Bogus numbers, it may just be as a result of Oxygen deprivation from excessive mask usage.
Screenshots are BC dashboard taken on Saturday AM, Sunday AM, Monday AM and this Tuesday AM. Totals relate to Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday PM. 












.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> All data and screenshot taken from here, comparison is to screen shots from here at earlier dates;
> https://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/epidemiological-summary-covid-19-cases.html
> 
> Now I don't trust the government of Canada either, which is why I do daily screen shots, including provincial data also accessed from that site.


Thank you.

Screenshots are good but the CSV file they generate the tables from is available on the same page. Here's the BC numbers for the 27th to the 30th.

British Columbia	Colombie-Britannique	2020-11-30	33238	441	14
British Columbia	Colombie-Britannique	2020-11-29	32642	427	17
British Columbia	Colombie-Britannique	2020-11-28	31634	410	15
British Columbia	Colombie-Britannique	2020-11-27	30884	395	11

Last column is the number of deaths, the preceding one is the cumulative total. The 30th would be as at 7PM of that day.

Takeaways are the 14 you cite is Monday only, not Sat, Sun and Mon. And there doesn't seem to be any grand conspiracy to withhold number and cook them - they are right there in the data.


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> Thank you.
> 
> Screenshots are good but the CSV file they generate the tables from is available on the same page. Here's the BC numbers for the 27th to the 30th.
> 
> British Columbia Colombie-Britannique 2020-11-30 33238 441 14
> British Columbia Colombie-Britannique 2020-11-29 32642 427 17
> British Columbia Colombie-Britannique 2020-11-28 31634 410 15
> British Columbia Colombie-Britannique 2020-11-27 30884 395 11
> 
> Last column is the number of deaths, the preceding one is the cumulative total. The 30th would be as at 7PM of that day.
> 
> Takeaways are the 14 you cite is Monday only, not Sat, Sun and Mon. And there doesn't seem to be any grand conspiracy to withhold number and cook them - they are right there in the data.



Yep and the 32 deaths for the weekend which I quoted is also accurate. Not the 46 being pimped by the Lamestream believers.


----------



## Macfury

polywog said:


> Thank you.
> 
> Screenshots are good but the CSV file they generate the tables from is available on the same page. Here's the BC numbers for the 27th to the 30th.
> 
> British Columbia	Colombie-Britannique	2020-11-30	33238	441	14
> British Columbia	Colombie-Britannique	2020-11-29	32642	427	17
> British Columbia	Colombie-Britannique	2020-11-28	31634	410	15
> British Columbia	Colombie-Britannique	2020-11-27	30884	395	11
> 
> Last column is the number of deaths, the preceding one is the cumulative total. The 30th would be as at 7PM of that day.
> 
> Takeaways are the 14 you cite is Monday only, not Sat, Sun and Mon. And there doesn't seem to be any grand conspiracy to withhold number and cook them - they are right there in the data.


It's not the numbers. it's the way CM and the media present them.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Yep and the 32 deaths for the weekend which I quoted is also accurate. Not the 46 being pimped by the Lamestream believers.


"British Columbia reported 46 COVID-19 deaths and 2,077 new cases of the disease over the weekend, *between noon on Friday* (Nov. 27) and noon on Monday[/B] (Nov. 30)."

I'll concede the headline is misleading. But that's the claim being made by the 'lamestream media.'

Given that the CSV lacks the granularity to refute that claim in hindsight (We don't know what the Monday numbers looked like at Noon Monday) how are you arriving at your conclusion? If there were only 3 reported cases by noon Monday, we still arrive at 46.


----------



## polywog

Macfury said:


> It's not the numbers. it's the way CM and the media present them.


Fair enough. Like I said, the headline is misleading (even sensational) if you don't get to the meat of the article. But if that's how they report *all* weekends I feel it's important they do it consistently.


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> "British Columbia reported 46 COVID-19 deaths and 2,077 new cases of the disease over the weekend, *between noon on Friday* (Nov. 27) and noon on Monday[/B] (Nov. 30)."
> 
> I'll concede the headline is misleading. But that's the claim being made by the 'lamestream media.'
> 
> Given that the CSV lacks the granularity to refute that claim in hindsight (We don't know what the Monday numbers looked like at Noon Monday) how are you arriving at your conclusion? If there were only 3 reported cases by noon Monday, we still arrive at 46.


Regardless. The weekend was deliberately stretched an extra day in order to skew the total. Fearmongering 101.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Regardless. The weekend was deliberately stretched an extra day in order to skew the total. Fearmongering 101.


It was stretched, sure. it’s also a stretch to call it fearmongering. That just as sensational as the headline you’re calling out.


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> It was stretched, sure. it’s also a stretch to call it fearmongering. That just as sensational as the headline you’re calling out.



Nope fearmongering. JH disappeared a very well researched article by JHs Genevieve Briand today. It pointed out that increasing Covid deaths were almost exactly offset by drops in other deaths such as heart attacks and flu, which of course undermines the official narrative. Fortunately it is still to be found on at least one Wayback site. Will link tomorrow when I am at the other computer.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Nope fearmongering. JH disappeared a very well researched article by JHs Genevieve Briand today. It pointed out that increasing Covid deaths were almost exactly offset by drops in other deaths such as heart attacks and flu, which of course undermines the official narrative. Fortunately it is still to be found on at least one Wayback site. Will link tomorrow when I am at the other computer.


As long as we're on fear mongering: 


The _student newspaper_ at Johns Hopkins published the article, JHs did not.
It _covered a presentation by Genevieve Briand_. The article was not written by her.
Genevieve Briand is the_ Assistant Director for MS in Applied Economics_ at Johns Hopkins.
It wasn't "today" or "yesterday." It was published the 22nd and retracted the 26th.


Here's the retraction letter: https://www.jhunewsletter.com/article/2020/11/a-closer-look-at-u-s-deaths-due-to-covid-19

And here's the article: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Md5h1_farrLKoBDZzJ56YGbDFVXZRqXT/view?usp=sharing


Some notable quotes from the retraction letter:
"We decided on Nov. 26 to retract this article to _stop the spread of misinformation, as we explained on social media_."

"Briand’s study _should not be used exclusively in understanding the impact of COVID-19_, but should be taken in context with the countless other data published by Hopkins, the World Health Organization and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)."

"As assistant director for the Master’s in Applied Economics program at Hopkins, Briand is *neither a medical professional nor a disease researcher*."


----------



## eMacMan

Of course we can actually look at the article and make up our own minds.
https://www.jhunewsletter.com/article/2020/11/a-closer-look-at-u-s-deaths-due-to-covid-19


The chart seems to leave out some minor categories and therefore does not balance perfectly. Also a suspected typo in the heart disease category of the first week. Probably the reason for the article being withdrawn. Even so it does nicely illustrate a correlation the fearmongers would prefer does not become general knowledge.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> This chart, from the period of the most rapid increase during the first wave, probably had a lot to do with the article being disappeared. It illustrates in a crystal clear manner, a correlation which the lamestream has been attempting to either deny or downplay as completely irrelevant.


So to recap; a single news article in a _student newspaper_ covering a presentation made by the assistant director for the Master’s in Applied Economics at Johns Hopkins, on a subject not even remotely in her wheelhouse, that just happens to confirm your bias, is trustworthy?


----------



## eMacMan

Applied economics types are pretty damn good at correlating data, which is what this article does. 

Might even explain why even though we are well into flu season, Canada has thus far seemingly recorded zero influenza deaths. The other good news is we also seem to have greatly reduced heart disease. Although my neighbour would disagree. His uncle died after needed heart surgery was delayed multiple times due to Covid response protocols. 

I also know of a big jump in suicide and OD deaths at a nearby reserve. No Covid deaths there but TrueDope and Kenney have certainly managed to turn despair into despair with no possibility of improvement and it's reflected in those two stats.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Applied economics types are pretty damn good at correlating data, which is what this article does.


I can crunch numbers all day long. Unless that data represents anything remotely in my fields of expertise, that's where it ends; I can tell you how the numbers add up but I absolutely _cannot_ speak to their significance. 

I can plug numbers into E=mc^2. I bet you can too. Can we say how it remotely matters, just because we plugged numbers into it? E=12 mean anything to you? Are we now both astrophysicist? 

Similarly, she isn't remotely qualified to speak to the significance of the numbers she presented, unless being at Johns Hopkins somehow qualifies her? 

I'm not going to tell you what the numbers in that table mean, because I'm no more qualified to do so than she is. Assuming that she's correct though, we can expect a trove of peer reviewed studies confirming her findings, right?


----------



## eMacMan

Interesting how these deaths are so unimportant to the Covid clique. Haven't heard a peep from the true believers on this issue. They just don't care about lost jobs, destroyed business, repossessed homes, suicides and OD deaths.
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/28/asia/japan-suicide-women-covid-dst-intl-hnk/index.html







Note that Japan's October suicide total exceeded their grand total of Covid deaths for the entire fiasco.

Why are Japan's Covid death totals so low? Look into Dr. Bartlett's protocol, very successful and quite similar to the Japanese approach.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Interesting how these deaths are so unimportant to the Covid clique. Haven't heard a peep from the true believers on this issue. They just don't care about lost jobs, destroyed business, repossessed homes, suicides and OD deaths.


Who said the 'covid clique' don't think those deaths are unimportant? Who says they just don't care about lost jobs, destroyed business, repossessed homes, suicides and OD deaths? I hope you have a Fox and Friends or Breitbart article to back those claims up. Otherwise, it's you making unwarranted and baseless assumption. And it's you fear mongering, demonizing anyone who supports COVID-19 protocols. I'd prefer you stick to the facts.

I found this quote from the article you linked interesting : "Kyoko Kimura says coronavirus restrictions prevented her daughter, Hana, from wrestling. _Hana became overwhelmed by negative comments on social media and subsequently took her own life_."

You keep saying only 6% of COVID deaths are only from COVID. Given the rate of suicide in that graph, what's the actual increase specifically because of COVID measures? Have you changed your position? Is it OK to lump these deaths together, but not COVID deaths?



eMacMan said:


> Note that Japan's October suicide total exceeded their grand total of Covid deaths for the entire fiasco.


Note how there were more suicides in 2015 in that one month than died from suicide in October 2020. Did you not see it? Clearly COVID restrictions have _lowered Japan's suicide rate since 2015_. You ditched the topic, but you said it's perfectly OK for someone without expertise in a field to just crunch numbers. So there's my interpretation. And it's perfectly true _ just look at the numbers._

MOST interesting though, I was under the impression based on some of your previous comments, that CNN was fake news lamestream media, and yet here you are commenting on and linking to an article of theirs. So it's only fake news if you don't like it?


----------



## Macfury

These are good points polywog. I think we can agree that the available information is not being leveraged honestly to develop informed policy regarding COVID-19. It's a hammer, when a scalpel is more appropriate.


----------



## eMacMan

The fearmongers have been hammering away at the number of 'cases', more accurately described as positive tests. So I put together a quick spreadsheet and chart showing totals to date for; Positive tests, Hospitalizations, ICU admissions and Deaths. All data from the Government of Canada Epidemiological summary as of 8am MST Dec 3, 2020.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> The fearmongers have been hammering away at the number of 'cases', more accurately described as positive tests. So I put together a quick spreadsheet and chart showing totals to date for; Positive tests, Hospitalizations, ICU admissions and Deaths. All data from the Government of Canada Epidemiological summary as of 8am MST Dec 3, 2020.


So, a graph that says COVID carries higher risks in the elderly. Illustrated by hospitalizations, ICU, and deaths. We've known that all along, haven't we?

And also a graph that shows a steep drop in the number of positive cases starting at the 60 age category? The age categories where folks start going to retirement communities/long term care? Seems to me that says masks affect transmission in a positive way.

Thanks for the info.


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> So, a graph that says COVID carries higher risks in the elderly. Illustrated by hospitalizations, ICU, and deaths. We've known that all along, haven't we?
> 
> And also a graph that shows a steep drop in the number of positive cases starting at the 60 age category? The age categories where folks start going to retirement communities/long term care? Seems to me that says masks affect transmission in a positive way.
> 
> Thanks for the info.


Now there's a real stretch. I do note that positive tests in the 80+ category is higher than the 70-79 category. I would suggest that those over 80 are more likely to be in a masked LTC environment, so by your logic masking fails.

More likely it reflects lower rate of testing in those categories, as those of us over 60 who are not in LTC have no real need or desire to be tested, and are unlikely to do so, unless we are actually showing at least moderate symptoms and have known co-morbidities. 

All it really shows is that the vast majority of positive tests are in the under 60 category, and that very few deaths, hospitalizations or ICU admissions occur in that age range. From that, we can reasonably conclude that the governments response to positive tests falls at the hysteric end of the scale. I doubt that you can infer anything else at all from it, nor did I intend to imply you could.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> .I doubt that you can infer anything else at all from it nor did I intend to imply you could.


I doubt that the authors of countless studies intended to imply that you could infer whatever you like from their studies, either.

But I did just that all the same.

My first theory was that exposure to first run episodes of The Lawrence Welk Show might have given some resistance to contacting COVID, but also lead to a more unfavourable outcome if one DID contract it. It needs peer review though. 

So I gave an entirely plausible explanation for a steep drop in green lines instead, which fits the facts as I imagine them to be, but happens to be contrary to your mask narrative. I freely admit though that I totally made it up and that I have _no qualifications whatsoever_ to make such a claim. 

It no fun unless we both get to make wild predictions based on wild assumptions from data in a table.


----------



## Macfury

polywog said:


> My first theory was that exposure to first run episodes of The Lawrence Welk Show might have given some resistance to contacting COVID...


Only episodes featuring the Lennon Sisters.


----------



## CubaMark

*ICUs in Alberta are drowning, say doctors. 'I've never had this happen in all my years of practice.'*https://www.macleans.ca/society/hea...-had-this-happen-in-all-my-years-of-practice/
_Hospitals in Calgary are running out of space and there are also concerns about having 
enough staff—and enough oxygen—to treat patients_

As the number of COVID-19 patients climbs in Alberta hospitals, its doctors are taking to social media to explain how serious the situation is, and how bad it may still get. In the early hours of Nov. 30, Dr. Daisy Fung, a family physician in Edmonton, tweeted that the intensive care unit at the University of Alberta Hospital was having to double-bunk COVID-19 patients, meaning each room has to accommodate two patients—and all their equipment, including ventilators—instead of one. Dr. Ilan Schwartz, an infectious diseases assistant professor at the University of Alberta, told Maclean’s that he’s seen double bunking in the ICU of University of Alberta Hospital. In a tweet, Schwartz explained the impact of adding beds to existing ICU rooms. “Worth stating the obvious but we can’t provide optimal care like this. Best practice for ventilated ICU patients with COVID-19 includes proning (turning patient intermittently onto their front). This takes many HCWs [health care workers] who need a lot of room. You can’t do that when double bunking.”

Kerry Williamson, executive director of issues management communications at University of Alberta Hospital, would not say definitively whether the hospital is currently double-bunking as the situation is “constantly changing. Patients are admitted and discharged from ICU numerous times per day,” he told Maclean’s by email. “We have the ability to safely cohort more than one COVID-19 positive patient in the same room, if space requires it.” Williamson said that the hospital, which has recently expanded its ICU from 23 to 28 beds, “continues to monitor and respond to the trend in demand for ICU beds by adding beds and teams.” *(Update: Late on Nov. 30, Williamson confirmed that University of Alberta Hospital is “cohorting some COVID patients together in two-bed ICU rooms.”) *

The demand for intensive care treatment isn’t restricted to that hospital. “Other ICUs have either been pushed to the edge as well, or are just absolutely drowning,” Fung explained. “And just because we are finding ways to cram physical beds and equipment into other spaces, it does not mean that there are more of us to take care of you.”

On Friday, a memo was sent by Alberta Health Services to Calgary hospitals warning that “due to limitations of the bulk oxygen systems at some adult acute care sites in Calgary and the expected increase in demand due to the COVID-19 pandemic, we need to reduce the demand on the bulk oxygen system.” Dr. Miriam Berchuk, an anaesthesiologist in Calgary, who tweeted an image of the memo, wrote, “I’ve never had this happen in all my years of practice.”

As of Sunday, another seven COVID-19 patients were admitted to Alberta ICUs, bringing the total to 95, well above the government’s benchmark of 70 ICU beds, beyond which the province had warned that restrictions would be needed. With 435 people in hospital with the coronavirus, Alberta is doing everything it can to expand capacity for COVID-19 patients to as many as 400 ICU beds, as well as more than 2,000 acute care beds. 

The repercussions go beyond COVID-19 patients. Virtually every Albertan will be affected—crossing that 70-bed threshold meant “we’d be crossing into territory where we’d be impacting other patients’ care,” explained Dr. Deena Hinshaw, the provincial chief medical officer of health, last Wednesday. “Unfortunately, the way that [extra] space is made available is winding down care for people who can wait a little longer for it.”

(Macleans)​


----------



## polywog

" As face masks became mandatory at different points in time across German regions, we can compare the rise in infections in regions with masks and regions without masks. Weighing various estimates, we conclude that 20 d after becoming mandatory face masks have reduced the number of new infections by around 45%. As economic costs are close to zero compared to other public health measures, masks seem to be a cost-effective means to combat COVID-19."

Face masks considerably reduce COVID-19 cases in Germany


----------



## CubaMark

*The Netherlands goes into hard lockdown until January 19.*

*Germany will go into a strict lockdown over Christmas to curb COVID-19 cases* (until Jan 10th)


----------



## Macfury

B-b-b-b-b-ut the vaccine!



CubaMark said:


> *The Netherlands goes into hard lockdown until January 19.*
> 
> *Germany will go into a strict lockdown over Christmas to curb COVID-19 cases* (until Jan 10th)


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> B-b-b-b-b-ut the vaccine!


The purpose of the lockdowns is to force acceptance of a vaccine whose side effects, now known as immune responses, are worse and more prevalent than the disease they don't prevent. We know they don't prevent it 'cause Fauci tells us we will still have to be muzzled and anti-social distanced after we've been jabbed. Still the Truedope is now going to make those vaccines mandatory.

A side benefit as far as the Gates-Soros Cabal is concerned, is the destruction of Christmas. Didn't they pull that stunt last Easter as well? That crowd is as anti-Christian as they come.

Sad how Kenney has fallen obediently in line. I doubt that New World Order position he has been promised will actually materialize. Any legislation involving lockdowns should include a clause proroguing MPs or MLAs salaries and pensions until the lockdowns end, and those they put out of work are working again.


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> *The Netherlands goes into hard lockdown until January 19.*
> 
> *Germany will go into a strict lockdown over Christmas to curb COVID-19 cases* (until Jan 10th)


Because someone does it, does not make it right. Otherwise you could argue that Hitler was right in attempting to exterminate Jews.


----------



## Macfury

Leftism is herd-ism.


----------



## CubaMark

*Los Angeles Covid-19 Update: Ambulances Waiting 4 Hours To Offload Patients As L.A. Has Just 56 Adult ICU Beds Left, Orange County Has None*

As the first dose of Covid-19 vaccine was delivered at a Los Angeles-area hospital, the county’s hospital and ICU capacity dropped to alarming lows.

According to Dr. Christina Ghaly, director of L.A. County Health and Human Services, there were only 370 available hospital beds for the county of 10 million. ICU availability was even worse, with just 56 adult ICU beds remaining. That is only the second time availability has dipped below 100, she said.

Orange County on Monday set new records for new coronavirus diagnoses — 3,250 — and hospitalizations, with the county’s adjusted intensive care unit capacity reaching zero. While that capacity was about 11% over the weekend, it has obviously since fallen. And the adjusted rate filters out capacity such as NICU beds for children. For comparison, Orange County’s daily positive case count was 1,056 on November 29, so the daily umber has risen over 200% in just 2 weeks.

(Deadline)​


----------



## CubaMark

*Nora Loreto*
@NoLore
Interested in Alberta outbreak information? Here you go...

There are currently 


20 outbreaks at acute care facilities

60 outbreaks at LTC

98 at other supportive care (RRs etc.)

64 in businesses

353 schools
​


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> *Nora Loreto*
> @NoLoreInterested in Alberta outbreak information? Here you go...
> 
> There are currently
> 
> 20 outbreaks at acute care facilities
> 60 outbreaks at LTC
> 98 at other supportive care (RRs etc.)
> 64 in businesses
> 353 schools


Without information as to how many from each are hospitalized or in ICU, that's absolutely meaningless. The 353 school outbreaks seems particularly suspicious as most Alberta schools were locked down again a couple of weeks ago. And in all of Canada the increase in total ICU admissions, for the under 20 crowd, between Dec 1 and Dec 15; was 7. Hospitalizations same group and time increased by just over 100. 

So clearly 353 outbreaks in schools in one province, refers mainly to kids who would not even know they have Covid had they tested positive or were just in a class with someone who tested positive. 

Further I am aware of at least 1 instance where one kid in a class tested positive (no symptoms), and the other 29 were isolated and listed as cases without ever being tested at all. Hardly what you could call a genuine outbreak. However it perfectly fills the bill for the fearmongers propaganda machine.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> The purpose of the lockdowns is to force acceptance of a vaccine whose side effects, now known as immune responses, are worse and more prevalent than the disease they don't prevent. We know they don't prevent it 'cause Fauci tells us we will still have to be muzzled and anti-social distanced after we've been jabbed. Still the Truedope is now going to make those vaccines mandatory.


Heck yeah! The important bits are the why of it all though; the mind control and tracking found in the vaccine. This is why the Truedope demands vaccination; so he can know if you are complying with quarantine. If not, zap, you've been reprogrammed. Part of the reprogramming is wiping any recollection of having been vaccinated in the first place. That way, you'll gladly line up for a refresher in case the nanobot batteries run low. Why do you think they need two per person?


(I'll show you my credible, peer reviewed sources for my revelation, if you show me yours.)


----------



## eMacMan

We also have direct confirmation from Calgary Mayor Nenshi that the vaccines don't work. He's just extended the masking mandate until the end of 2021. To be fair his medical credentials are pretty much on a par with Bill Gates, but then so are mine.

Funny how deaths and cases started to skyrocket after all those major cities and now provinces mandated masks. Also funny how it just happens to be happening during normal cold and flu season. Funny how confirmed cases of the flu from week 39-45 for all of Canada were just 41 compared to a 5 year average of 3500+. Funny how a flu case is someone who seeks medical attention. Whereas a Covid 'case' is determined by the PCR test, and most who test positive would not otherwise know thy even have Covid.

As to vaccines give my 10 doses, to Kenney or Henshaw. If it's really as safe as claimed it shouldn't harm them. Yep the Province of Alberta really did order 10 doses for every resident of the province.


----------



## polywog

I've looked for any quote where Calgary Mayor Nenshi states vaccines don't work. Coming up empty?


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> I've looked for any quote where Calgary Mayor Nenshi states vaccines don't work. Coming up empty?


I never go by anything a polietician says. In this case he actions speak volumes. No justifiable reason to extend the mask mandate for a year if he honestly believes the vaccines will work.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> I never go by anything a polietician says. In this case he actions speak volumes. No justifiable reason to extend the mask mandate for a year if he honestly believes the vaccines will work.


As long as you discount that vaccines protect the person receiving it, where masks protect others. But you already knew that since it's been pointed out several times. Other than that, you're right, there aren't any justifiable reasons. Except maybe that they are so fashionable, comfortable and everyone loves wearing them. 

Dozens of people are vaccinated already! We're done here boys, pitch the protocols out the window!


----------



## CubaMark

_It's no worse than the flu... nosireeeee. This closet prog should just buck up, shut up, and deal with it. Remember, Trump doesn't like losers!_

*White House security director has part of leg amputated after falling severely ill with COVID-19, fundraiser says*

The director of the White House security office, Crede Bailey, was in an intensive care unit for three months and had part of his leg amputated after contracting COVID-19 several months ago, according to a fundraising campaign set up to help him.

Bailey, who recently moved to a full-time rehabilitation facility, now faces significant medical bills, according to the online fundraiser. He was hospitalized in September after falling ill with the coronavirus, people familiar with his condition told ABC News.

His illness came as dozens of White House staffers and allies of President Donald Trump tested positive for COVID-19 in a series of outbreaks tied to the White House. 

(...)

According to the fundraising page, Bailey suffered permanent injuries from his bout with COVID-19, including the amputations of his right foot, lower right leg, and big toe on his left foot.

In appealing for donations, the person listed as the campaign's organizer, Dawn McCrobie, wrote that Bailey would need to pay for a prosthetic leg, a wheelchair and modifications to his home, among other medical expenses. McCrobie said that "even with insurance," the expenses were "astronomical."

(...)

The White House last week declined to comment to ABC News on his condition, but asked about him at a news conference on Tuesday, White House press secretary Kayleigh McEnany for the first time publicly acknowledged his battle with the virus.

"Our heart goes out to his family," McEnany said. "They have asked for privacy. And he is recovering, from what I understand. We are very pleased to see that. But he and his family will be in our prayers."

(ABC News)​


As of Thursday morning, the GoFundMe tops $73-thousand.

_The White House security office director needs a GoFundMe to cover his medical expenses._

*'murica.*


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> _It's no worse than the flu... nosireeeee. This closet prog should just buck up, shut up, and deal with it. Remember, Trump doesn't like losers!_*White House security director has part of leg amputated after falling severely ill with COVID-19, fundraiser says*The director of the White House security office, Crede Bailey, was in an intensive care unit for three months and had part of his leg amputated after contracting COVID-19 several months ago, according to a fundraising campaign set up to help him.
> 
> Bailey, who recently moved to a full-time rehabilitation facility, now faces significant medical bills, according to the online fundraiser. He was hospitalized in September after falling ill with the coronavirus, people familiar with his condition told ABC News.
> 
> His illness came as dozens of White House staffers and allies of President Donald Trump tested positive for COVID-19 in a series of outbreaks tied to the White House.
> 
> (...)
> 
> According to the fundraising page, Bailey suffered permanent injuries from his bout with COVID-19, including the amputations of his right foot, lower right leg, and big toe on his left foot.
> 
> In appealing for donations, the person listed as the campaign's organizer, Dawn McCrobie, wrote that Bailey would need to pay for a prosthetic leg, a wheelchair and modifications to his home, among other medical expenses. McCrobie said that "even with insurance," the expenses were "astronomical."
> 
> (...)
> 
> The White House last week declined to comment to ABC News on his condition, but asked about him at a news conference on Tuesday, White House press secretary Kayleigh McEnany for the first time publicly acknowledged his battle with the virus.
> 
> "Our heart goes out to his family," McEnany said. "They have asked for privacy. And he is recovering, from what I understand. We are very pleased to see that. But he and his family will be in our prayers."
> 
> (ABC News)​
> 
> As of Thursday morning, the GoFundMe tops $73-thousand.
> 
> _The White House security office director needs a GoFundMe to cover his medical expenses._
> 
> *'murica.*



Complete lack of pertinent information as is typical of the fearmongers. You do not lose limbs to Covid. Was it diabetic complications relating to poor blood sugar management? Did he encounter flesh eating bacteria during a hospital stay?

Did he receive HCQ or mild inhaled cortico-steroid tratment when his oxygen levels started to drop? If not why not? Both of those treatment protocols have proven very effective.

Finally why on earth are the medical expenses of any one working in the White House not fully covered?


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Complete lack of pertinent information as is typical of the fearmongers.


Like claiming vaccines don't work because masks are still mandated? That kind of lack of pertinent information? Does that too constitute fear mongering?


----------



## CubaMark

*Alberta reports record-breaking 30 COVID-19 deaths over past 24 hours*
*Total number of deaths since pandemic began reaches 790*

Alberta recorded a record-breaking 30 COVID-19 deaths Thursday, the highest number ever reported on a single day.

"This is a heartbreaking figure," Dr. Deena Hinshaw, the province's chief medical officer of health, said Thursday at a news conference. "While these deaths did not all occur yesterday, this is the highest figure that I have had the sad task of reporting.

"If anyone still needs reminding of the seriousness of this virus, of the importance of the restrictions that are currently in place, and the importance of doing everything possible to limit our interactions and break the chains of transmission, this is it," Hinshaw said.

"There are now 790 Albertans who have died as a result of COVID-19."

The province reported 1,571 new cases over the 24-hour period that ended at midnight Wednesday. There were 763 people being treated in Alberta hospitals for the illness, including 138 in ICU beds.

There were 19,865 active cases as of Wednesday, the first time that total has dropped below 20,000 since Dec. 5.

The regional breakdown of active cases was:


Edmonton zone: 9,525
Calgary zone: 7,043
Central zone: 1,462
North zone: 1,214
South zone: 541
Unknown: 80
Laboratories completed 19,800 more tests, for a positivity rate of 7.9 per cent.

Hinshaw noted that seasonal holidays are about a week away and reminded the public to follow the restrictions put in place by the province.

(CBC)​


----------



## wonderings

CubaMark said:


> _It's no worse than the flu... nosireeeee. This closet prog should just buck up, shut up, and deal with it. Remember, Trump doesn't like losers!_
> 
> *White House security director has part of leg amputated after falling severely ill with COVID-19, fundraiser says*
> 
> The director of the White House security office, Crede Bailey, was in an intensive care unit for three months and had part of his leg amputated after contracting COVID-19 several months ago, according to a fundraising campaign set up to help him.
> 
> Bailey, who recently moved to a full-time rehabilitation facility, now faces significant medical bills, according to the online fundraiser. He was hospitalized in September after falling ill with the coronavirus, people familiar with his condition told ABC News.
> 
> His illness came as dozens of White House staffers and allies of President Donald Trump tested positive for COVID-19 in a series of outbreaks tied to the White House.
> 
> (...)
> 
> According to the fundraising page, Bailey suffered permanent injuries from his bout with COVID-19, including the amputations of his right foot, lower right leg, and big toe on his left foot.
> 
> In appealing for donations, the person listed as the campaign's organizer, Dawn McCrobie, wrote that Bailey would need to pay for a prosthetic leg, a wheelchair and modifications to his home, among other medical expenses. McCrobie said that "even with insurance," the expenses were "astronomical."
> 
> (...)
> 
> The White House last week declined to comment to ABC News on his condition, but asked about him at a news conference on Tuesday, White House press secretary Kayleigh McEnany for the first time publicly acknowledged his battle with the virus.
> 
> "Our heart goes out to his family," McEnany said. "They have asked for privacy. And he is recovering, from what I understand. We are very pleased to see that. But he and his family will be in our prayers."
> 
> (ABC News)​
> 
> 
> As of Thursday morning, the GoFundMe tops $73-thousand.
> 
> _The White House security office director needs a GoFundMe to cover his medical expenses._
> 
> *'murica.*



All these articles due is create more fear and I do not think serve a reasonable purpose. Sure you could say you want to scare people so much they start wearing masks and taking it seriously, but then you are really just lying to them in order to get what you want done done. Slippery slope and one that should not be attempted in my opinion. There will be other reasons why he lost his legs, this is not a normal reaction to COVID otherwise I am sure people would be looking at this very differently if a high percentage of people were losing limbs due to COVID. There was a police officer in Calgary who lost his legs due to a strain of the flu, you could use the same thing to try and get people to get their flu shots, but it would not be right and all it is is fear mongering. 
https://globalnews.ca/news/7245961/calgary-police-officer-loses-legs-influenza/

Now I don't think COVID is something to be taken lightly but I think these types of reports offer nothing of value and again only create fear and to me it just feels like click bait.


----------



## polywog

wonderings said:


> There was a police officer in Calgary who lost his legs due to a strain of the flu, you could use the same thing to try and get people to get their flu shots, but it would not be right and all it is is fear mongering.
> 
> Now I don't think COVID is something to be taken lightly but I think these types of reports offer nothing of value and again only create fear and to me it just feels like click bait.


Agreed, I feel it goes to both extremes though; the "it's no big deal" crowd similarly downplays the pandemic, despite evidence that supports its severity.


----------



## wonderings

polywog said:


> Agreed, I feel it goes to both extremes though; the "it's no big deal" crowd similarly downplays the pandemic, despite evidence that supports its severity.


I would agree with that, I think both sides of the pendulum are getting things wrong and with the western world so divided at the moment there is no meeting in them middle.


----------



## CubaMark

eMacMan said:


> Complete lack of pertinent information as is typical of the fearmongers. You do not lose limbs to Covid. Was it diabetic complications relating to poor blood sugar management? Did he encounter flesh eating bacteria during a hospital stay?
> 
> Did he receive HCQ or mild inhaled cortico-steroid tratment when his oxygen levels started to drop? If not why not? Both of those treatment protocols have proven very effective.
> 
> Finally why on earth are the medical expenses of any one working in the White House not fully covered?


Even in the early months of the pandemic, we were aware of the broader effects of a covid-19 infection, such as blood clotting - like the kind that cost Canadian actor Nik Cordero his leg, and ultimately, his life.

Studies are showing a two-to-three times greater risk for amputation among patients who undergo vascular surgery.


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> Even in the early months of the pandemic, we were aware of the broader effects of a covid-19 infection, such as blood clotting - like the kind that cost Canadian actor Nik Cordero his leg, and ultimately, his life.
> 
> Studies are showing a two-to-three times greater risk for amputation among patients who undergo vascular surgery.


We were also aware that the HCQ protocol was a very effective treatment, if begun in time. The AMA responded by threatening to pull the licenses of Docs who used that protocol, based entirely on a bogus Fauci initiated study. The study that was withdrawn shortly after it was published.

Just a day or so ago the AMA reversed that decision, but I do not think Canada has done the same. This could have saved up to 85% of those lives lost due to Covid, or where Covid was a complicating factor. Of course it would have no impact on those who died of other causes but conveniently tested positive for Covid.

FWIW the only Covid death in our region has to border on bogus status for 2 reasons. First the gentleman had so many problems that there was no local long term care facility that could handle him. He was sent to Foothills in Calgary, but was not Covid positive when he was admitted. He died not too long after, testing positive then. Bogus because death was attributed to Covid when Covid probably played at most a bit part. Bogus again because even though he acquired Covid in Calgary and died there, the death is being charged to our region. 

Maybe he even died twice as I am sure he would also be listed among the 47 Covid deaths at Foothills Long Term. I am absolutely certain he was socially isolated, anti-social distanced, and that the staff all looked like bandits. Clearly none of these things protected him from contracting Covid.

Forgive the digression. Seems to me that knowing there was a safe effective treatment and banning it has to be considered genocidal. Admittedly more than 90% of the deaths fell within a major Eugenics hit list category, moreover they would no doubt have died with or without the aid of Covid. We've all seen Gates smirk as he talks about them. Also consider that most of them had loved ones, who because of the Covid Protection Racketeers, were unable to be there. That is way beyond cruel.


----------



## eMacMan

Wow even the Gates Soros subsidiary WHO has finally admitted it:
https://principia-scientific.com/wh...1EC0WqYpSQEb7rNTJb9eHF5fjmcvG_0CXMxLMFaPnQ8AI


> In a statement released on December 14, 2020 the World Health Organization finally owned up to what 100,000’s of doctors and medical professionals have been saying for months: the PCR test used to diagnose COVID-19 is a hit and miss process with way too many false positives.
> 
> This WHO-admitted “Problem” comes in the wake of international lawsuits exposing the incompetence and malfeasance of public health officials and policymakers for reliance on a diagnostic test _not fit for purpose._
> 
> This World Health Organization admission is that the crux of the “_*problem*_” is a wholly arbitrary cycling process which “_means that many cycles were required to detect virus. In some circumstances,* the distinction between background noise and actual presence of the target virus is difficult to ascertain*.” _ [emphasis added]
> 
> The UN body is now clearly looking to distance itself from the fatally flawed test as a growing number of lawsuits are processing through the courts exposing the insanity of relying on a test that even the inventor, Professor Kary B. Mullis said was _*never designed to diagnose diseases*_. [1]


----------



## eMacMan

From a recently filed court brief in Alberta.


> “The mere existence of COVID-19 in Alberta does not constitute an emergency. For Albertans under the age of 60 years, the chances of dying of COVID-19 in Alberta are currently 1 in 210,000, while the murder rate in Calgary is 6.1 per 100,000. Put in another way, a Calgar(ian) under the age of 60 is 12 times more likely to be murdered than to die of COVID-19.”


Pretty much nails it. Interestingly the government wants to wait until after Christmas to address a lawsuit intended to restore Christmas.


> The Government of Alberta requested an adjournment of the December 17, 2020, Hearing to 9:30 am on December 21, 2020. The Province of Alberta has been seeking to delay and adjourn this matter until well after Christmas, claiming to the Court that they required additional time to gather evidence to justify the present lockdown Orders.
> ​
> *Jeffrey Rath submitted to the Court that the Province’s suggestion that they needed further time to gather evidence was shocking under the circumstances. Mr. Rath advised the Court the Government should have had evidence to justify incarcerating 4.5 million Albertans in their home for Christmas before issuing Orders.*


----------



## eMacMan

Pretty solid proof that mask mandates have failed to have any negative effect on the growth of Covid. I will remind the true believers that Horowitz's medical credentials are very bit as solid as Killer Gates. The same Gates who is the primary promoter of masking, forced vaccination and personal tracking. Long read but here it is. 

https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horo...tates-shows-greater-spread-with-mask-mandates
*Warning to Freddie and CM contains real data and graphs, I take no responsibility should your heads explode.*


> BREAKING! Do mask mandates work? Our analysis below. We looked at cases on days where mask mandates were in place vs when they were not. We calculated the cases per day adjusted for population and: WITH MASK MANDATE: 27 cases per day per 100K people NO MASK MA(N)DATE 17 cases














> The burden is on those who want to violate the Constitution with such a draconian mandate for the rest of our lives to present affirmative evidence that their religious symbol works. The phony "fact checkers" will always find ways to show that we can't prove beyond a shadow of doubt that masks will never work. But while they force us to prove 100% that they don't work, mandaters don't have to prove any efficacy at all, even as 2-year-olds are forced to have their faces covered on planes.
> 
> 
> We used to all scoff at the Islamic fundamentalist for believing that if they just waged jihad a little harder, they'd earn their 72 virgins. Well, those people can learn a thing or two about faith from the mask fundamentalists who believe it's never too late for masks to magically stop a virus after months of failure.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Pretty solid proof that mask mandates have failed to have any negative effect on the growth of Covid. I will remind the true believers that Horowitz's medical credentials are very bit as solid as Killer Gates. The same Gates who is the primary promoter of masking, forced vaccination and personal tracking. Long read but here it is.
> 
> https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horo...tates-shows-greater-spread-with-mask-mandates
> *Warning to Freddie and CM contains real data and graphs, I take no responsibility should your heads explode.*
> 
> View attachment 93212


If it had no negative effects, clearly we should be wearing masks. Nice.

"They studied the number of cases over a 229-day period from May 1 through Dec. 15 and divided the results of the two study groups by days with mask mandates and days without mask mandates."

That's a pretty boneheaded approach. If the mask mandates happened during either wave, and the no-masks happened between them, how does their data reflect that masks might have lead to a state being in a position to remove mask mandates?


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> If it had no negative effects, clearly we should be wearing masks. Nice.
> 
> "They studied the number of cases over a 229-day period from May 1 through Dec. 15 and divided the results of the two study groups by days with mask mandates and days without mask mandates."
> 
> That's a pretty boneheaded approach. If the mask mandates happened during either wave, and the no-masks happened between them, how does their data reflect that masks might have lead to a state being in a position to remove mask mandates?


They were comparing apples to apples as best as possible. Point is masking clearly does not reduce the incidence of positive tests. You can argue all you want as to what extent masking increases your risk. If masking cannot be shown to significantly reduce positive tests or deaths, then it should be tossed out on its ear. 

Negative effect on growth would be to reduce growth. Masks have had a positive effect on the growth of Covid 'cases'. Yep nearly 60% higher in masked areas as opposed to non masked. 

'Course true believers understand how important it is to signal virtue. Never mind if it increases your odds of testing positive by almost 60%. You have every right to your religious beliefs but stop trying to force them on others.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> They were comparing apples to apples as best as possible. Point is masking clearly does not reduce the incidence of positive tests. You can argue all you want as to what extent masking increases your risk. If masking cannot be shown to significantly reduce positive tests or deaths, then it should be tossed out on its ear.


Not at all. They were being overly broad. You can't take a huge period and declare a conclusion on something that only applies to certain intervals of that period. It's completely misleading. You're accepting one 'study' simply because it confirms your bias, though.

"You can argue all you want as to what extent masking increases your risk." isn't a valid argument if you've already discarded the possibility that it reduces risks. 



eMacMan said:


> Negative effect on growth would be to reduce growth. Masks have had a positive effect on the growth of Covid 'cases'.


A negative effect would increase the growth rate, since the intended outcome is to reduce it. 




eMacMan said:


> 'Course true believers understand how important it is to signal virtue. Never mind if it increases your odds of testing positive by almost 60%. You have every right to your religious beliefs but stop trying to force them on others.


Calling it a religious belief is a mile long stretch. 

If you can't back up your claims with reputable, peer reviewed studies that's on you. You're free to believe what you like. I certainly haven't seen anything to back your claim that masks increase the chance of infection, much less by 60%. And I'm not waiting on bated breath for it to happen. You consistently accuse people with opposing views of fear mongering without considering that is exactly what you're doing.

And for the I lost count of how many times time - masks aren't to reduce the wearers risk. That has been clearly communicated from the beginning. You have yet to acknowledge that.


----------



## eMacMan

Still haven't seen a peer reviewed study that shows masks actually reduce transmission. Best they can come up with is that if you have Covid but don't know it, and cough on me, your mask will prevent virus attached to saliva droplets from hitting me. If you do know you have it then masks become totally useless and you must self-isolate.

So what are the odds. No one since the start of the Pandemic has coughed on me at all, with or without a mask. Let's be really generous and arbitrarily set the odds of this occurrence at 1:100. We do know the odds of having Covid but not knowing it are about ~1:100. The odds of one of those droplets hitting me in the nose, mouth, eyes or ears? Again unknown but we'll be really generous and say 1:5. The odds of said target failing to do the job nature designed it to do and allowing the virus to enter the system? Again unknown but we can again be quite generous and say 1:2.

So that all comes down to .01*.01*.2*.5 or about 1 in 100,000 of being on the receiving end of the virus in this manner. All of course assuming that the PCR test accurately tests for the virus. Completely overlooking that the Nobel Prize winning discoverer of the PCR stated in no uncertain terms that this style of test was useless for diagnostic purposes, but what would he know about it, after all he was referring to testing for HIV not Covid.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> Still haven't seen a peer reviewed study that shows masks actually reduce transmission. Best they can come up with is that if you have Covid but don't know it, and cough on me, your mask will prevent virus attached to saliva droplets from hitting me. If you do know you have it then masks become totally useless and you must self-isolate.


You absolutely have. I remember pasting a few from NIHL and CDC for you quite a few pages back, when you posted a singular study on masks that was not peer reviewed at the time, and claimed it to be the holy bible. I'm not going to dig for you, since you don't seem interested in doing actual balanced research, but here's a good starting point:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/more/masking-science-sars-cov2.html

As for " If you do know you have it then masks become totally useless and you must self-isolate."... I really hope that's just sarcasm. Otherwise how you can make a leap like that is confounding.



eMacMan said:


> So what are the odds. No one since the start of the Pandemic has coughed on me at all, with or without a mask. Let's be really generous and arbitrarily set the odds of this occurrence at 1:100. We do know the odds of having Covid but not knowing it are about ~1:100. The odds of one of those droplets hitting me in the nose, mouth, eyes or ears? Again unknown but we'll be really generous and say 1:5. The odds of said target failing to do the job nature designed it to do and allowing the virus to enter the system? Again unknown but we can again be quite generous and say 1:2.


I have never been bitten by a shark. That makes the odds of getting bitten by a shark 0, right? Statistics are fun! I have no background in shark attacks, and have never been in the ocean. But lobbing out random numbers is fun.



eMacMan said:


> Completely overlooking that the Nobel Prize winning discoverer of the PCR stated in no uncertain terms that this style of test was useless for diagnostic purposes, but what would he know about it, after all he was referring to testing for HIV not Covid.


Kary Mullis never spoke those words. If you can't even attribute that properly, how on earth can there be no uncertain terms?


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> You absolutely have. I remember pasting a few from NIHL and CDC for you quite a few pages back, when you posted a singular study on masks that was not peer reviewed at the time, and claimed it to be the holy bible. I'm not going to dig for you, since you don't seem interested in doing actual balanced research, but here's a good starting point:
> 
> https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/more/masking-science-sars-cov2.html
> 
> As for " If you do know you have it then masks become totally useless and you must self-isolate."... I really hope that's just sarcasm. Otherwise how you can make a leap like that is confounding.
> 
> I have never been bitten by a shark. That makes the odds of getting bitten by a shark 0, right? Statistics are fun! I have no background in shark attacks, and have never been in the ocean. But lobbing out random numbers is fun.
> 
> 
> 
> Kary Mullis never spoke those words. If you can't even attribute that properly, how on earth can there be no uncertain terms?


What were quoted were in effect sneeze studies, nothing that actually established that masks significantly reduced transmission.

Actually he did, the videos are all over the intertubes if you care to open your eyes. The fact that I paraphrased did not in the least alter his meaning. Even if PCRs are of some diagnostic value, increasing the cycle numbers from the claimed optimum of 28-32 to the current 39-41 creates enough false positives to make them meaningless. Furthermore since the virus itself was never properly isolated and purified, if those RNA fragments being tested for, actually relate to Corona virus(es) is at best a guess.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> What were quoted were in effect sneeze studies, nothing that actually established that masks significantly reduced transmission.
> 
> Actually he did, the videos are all over the intertubes if you care to open your eyes. The fact that I paraphrased did not in the least alter his meaning. Even if PCRs are of some diagnostic value, increasing the cycle numbers from the claimed optimum of 28-32 to the current 39-41 creates enough false positives to make them meaningless. Furthermore since the virus itself was never properly isolated and purified, if those RNA fragments being tested for, actually relate to Corona virus(es) is at best a guess.


Mullis did actually say the words “anything in anybody” – but his quote has been taken out of context and presented in a misleading way by claims on social media.

The line comes from a discussion panel Mullis spoke at in 1993, a clip from which has been shared widely on social media pages making false claims about Covid-19 or the effectiveness of PCR testing, such as this one.

Specifically discussing the experience of people with HIV, Mullis said that “someone with HIV generally is going to have almost anything that you can test for”.

“If you have it, there’s a good chance you’ve also got a lot of other ones,” Mullis said, so “to test for that one and say that has any special meaning is what I think is the problem, not that PCR has been misused.”

He said: “If they could find this virus in you at all, with PCR, if you do it well, you can find almost anything in anybody, it starts making you believe in the Buddhist notion that everything is contained in everything else.”

The claims on social media have left out that Mullis was specifically discussing HIV and the experience of people with HIV who also contract other viruses.


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> Mullis did actually say the words “anything in anybody” – but his quote has been taken out of context and presented in a misleading way by claims on social media.
> 
> The line comes from a discussion panel Mullis spoke at in 1993, a clip from which has been shared widely on social media pages making false claims about Covid-19 or the effectiveness of PCR testing, such as this one.
> 
> Specifically discussing the experience of people with HIV, Mullis said that “someone with HIV generally is going to have almost anything that you can test for”.
> 
> “If you have it, there’s a good chance you’ve also got a lot of other ones,” Mullis said, so “to test for that one and say that has any special meaning is what I think is the problem, not that PCR has been misused.”
> 
> He said: “If they could find this virus in you at all, with PCR, if you do it well, you can find almost anything in anybody, it starts making you believe in the Buddhist notion that everything is contained in everything else.”
> 
> The claims on social media have left out that Mullis was specifically discussing HIV and the experience of people with HIV who also contract other viruses.



I specifically stated the quote was in relation to HIV. Having failed to isolate and purify this virus means similar criticisms for using PCR also apply to SARs Cov2. More so as the current cycling being used is much higher than the levels Fauci stated were optimum.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> I specifically stated the quote was in relation to HIV. Having failed to isolate and purify this virus means similar criticisms for using PCR also apply to SARs Cov2.


Did you just skim for a paragraph that confirms your bias? Did you miss *“If you have it, there’s a good chance you’ve also got a lot of other ones,” Mullis said, so “to test for that one and say that has any special meaning is what I think is the problem, not that PCR has been misused.”* 

You do understand what happens to HIV patients right?

Regardless I was speaking to your claim "Completely overlooking that the Nobel Prize winning discoverer of the PCR stated in no uncertain terms that this style of test was useless for diagnostic purposes" which is false. You took something with context (HIV in this case) and disregarded the context to form a conclusion. For someone at odds with fake news, you certainly spread a lot of it.



eMacMan said:


> More so as the current cycling being used is much higher than the levels Fauci stated were optimum.


How are you in any position to determine that given "To be fair his medical credentials are pretty much on a par with Bill Gates, but then so are mine?" (That's a quote from you by the way.)


----------



## CubaMark

Polywog's best efforts, sadly, will be for naught against the impenetrable wall of disbelief...


----------



## Macfury

They are both involved in an actual debate which I find fascinating and useful.

You, CM, on the other hand, take a massive data dump of quoted material, wipe your ass and then disappear for two weeks.




CubaMark said:


> Polywog's best efforts, sadly, will be for naught against the impenetrable wall of disbelief...


----------



## polywog

Macfury said:


> They are both involved in an actual debate which I find fascinating and useful.
> 
> You, CM, on the other hand, take a massive data dump of quoted material, wipe your ass and then disappear for two weeks.


Thanks, it certainly is fun. I'm not sure how or if it ends, or if someone from the other extreme will chime in. I'm purposefully avoiding making assertions while trying to focus on evidence. But it's pretty hard to stay in the middle lane on a topic that really shouldn't be so polarizing.


----------



## eMacMan

When you hear how safe these experimental untested vaccines are, you might keep in mind this tidbit from the Daily Mail


> A Portuguese health worker has died two days after getting the Pfizer coronavirus vaccine.
> 
> Sonia Acevedo, 41, suffered a 'sudden death' at home on New Year's Day 48 hours after receiving the jab. An autopsy is expected to take place later today or tomorrow.
> 
> *The mother-of-two, who worked in paediatrics at the Portuguese Institute of Oncology in Porto, is not said to have suffered any adverse side-effects after being vaccinated.*


Sounds like not even death is considered an adverse side effect.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> When you hear how safe these experimental untested vaccines are, you might keep in mind this tidbit from the Daily Mail
> 
> Sounds like not even death is considered an adverse side effect.


If it turns out that she had a pre-existing condition prior to receiving the vaccine, are you still going to blame the vaccine? After all, COVID deaths aren't COVID deaths if they have pre-existing conditions, right?

It's also interesting how you want to open everything up because so few people have died from COVID, but ONE _alleged_ death from a vaccine is totally worthy of attention.


----------



## eMacMan

polywog said:


> If it turns out that she had a pre-existing condition prior to receiving the vaccine, are you still going to blame the vaccine? After all, COVID deaths aren't COVID deaths if they have pre-existing conditions, right?
> 
> It's also interesting how you want to open everything up because so few people have died from COVID, but ONE _alleged_ death from a vaccine is totally worthy of attention.


Yep if you believe that testing positive for Covid makes a death a covid death, then surely a covid vaccine triggering a pre-existing condition must be a vaccine death. Kill Gate$ has said he expects a 20 times return on his huge investment in this scam. $oRo$ is similarly vested and positioned. With that sort of money on the line, I would have said the odds of her being found to have a pre-existing condition were 100%. Witness the carefully pre-screened trial participants who suddenly had undiagnosed Multiple Sclerosis, after developing a serious neurological disorder during the trials. Yep there were two of them.


----------



## CubaMark

"It's just a flu"

"The number of deaths are inflated (for reason x, y, z, or some other nonsensical reason)"

"It's only killing people in old folks' homes"

"The same # of people have died who would normally have died"

_....or, you know, it's not the flu, and the repercussions of having covid-19 go far beyond what many people understand:_

*76 per cent of hospitalized COVID-19 patients experience symptoms six months later: study*

A new study from China shows that more than three quarters of COVID-19 patients who were sent to hospital experienced at least one symptom of the virus six months after first falling ill.

The cohort study, published on Friday in The Lancet, looked at 1,733 COVID-19 patients who were discharged from the Jin Yin-tan Hospital in Wuhan, China between January and May 2020 and found that 76 per cent of them continued to experience at least one of the symptoms six months later.

Among those who continued to experience symptoms, 63 per cent of patients had experienced persistent fatigue or muscle weakness, while 26 per cent had experienced difficulty sleeping and 23 per cent reported depression or anxiety.

* * *​
When it came to kidney function, 107 of the 822 patients who had normal kidneys while in the hospital had reduced kidney function six months later.

Another 94 patients were tested for neutralizing antibodies, and researchers found that 53 per cent of them had reduced antibody levels six months after their visit to the hospital. 

* * *​
“Even though the study offers a comprehensive clinical picture of the aftermath of COVID-19 in hospitalized patients, only 4 per cent were admitted to an intensive care unit (ICU), rendering the information about the long-term consequences in this particular cohort inconclusive,” the authors wrote in the news release.

“Nonetheless, previous research on patient outcomes after ICU stays suggests that several COVID-19 patients who were critically ill while hospitalized will subsequently face impairments regarding their cognitive and mental health and/or physical function far beyond their hospital discharge.”

(CTV)​
For those who find anecdotal evidence interesting, this Reddit thread is full of people who are reporting long-term health effects ranging from diminished lung capacity, kidney damage, heart damage, etc. months after contracting and recovering from covid-19... and damage is also noted in people who had mild symptoms.


----------



## eMacMan

To help put that previous post into perspective. As I've said before, normal recovery time for every pneumonia victim I have ever met is at least a year. 

Also remember going by CDC numbers roughly 6% of Covid deaths were due only to Covid, it seems likely that a similar percentage would apply to hospitalizations. Make that number as high as 10%, and we have fewer than 800 Canadians under 60 who have been hospitalized just for Covid. And that's over what would normally be considered most of two seasons, but for fearmongering purposes has been consolidated into one. 

Also note that about 70% of those hospitalized are over 60. This from today's Canadian epidemiological summary, the numbers in normal age groups is way too small to deserve this level of fearmonger style of propaganda. Again that's over what would normally be considered most of two seasons, but for fearmongering purposes has been consolidated into one.









On a personal note, I have had after effects from a flu vaccine linger for several months and those effects included surprise, surprise; extreme fatigue, muscle aches, headaches, and sinus congestion that I just could not shake even though it was the middle of winter. Believe me, were I put in that position again, I would have given up a very well paying job rather than take that 'mandatory' vaccine.


----------



## Macfury

There's the gold standard of research, but I demand corroboration from Moscow!



CubaMark said:


> "It's just a flu"
> 
> "The number of deaths are inflated (for reason x, y, z, or some other nonsensical reason)"
> 
> "It's only killing people in old folks' homes"
> 
> "The same # of people have died who would normally have died"
> 
> _....or, you know, it's not the flu, and the repercussions of having covid-19 go far beyond what many people understand:_
> 
> *A new study from China* shows that more than three quarters of COVID-19 patients who were sent to hospital experienced at least one symptom of the virus six months after first falling ill.​


​


----------



## CubaMark

*Ontario's new COVID-19 modelling to show ICUs full by early February: sources*

Ontario's latest COVID-19 modelling will project the province's intensive care units to be filled beyond capacity by early February, and will also show how a new, more contagious variant of the coronavirus risks accelerating the spread of infections, sources tell CBC News. 

Premier Doug Ford has warned he is ready to impose further restrictions based on the modelling, but no announcement is planned before Tuesday, according to government sources. 

Although the projections by Ontario's scientific advisers were presented to cabinet on Friday, the information is not slated to be made public until Tuesday.

Multiple sources who have seen the modelling tell CBC News it includes: 


Forecasts putting the province on track to report an average of 6,000 new cases of COVID-19 daily before the end of January.

Survey data indicating that a large proportion of Ontarians are not following basic public health guidelines to slow the spread of COVID-19.

Mobility data showing a spike in movement by Ontarians in the days just before Christmas when the government imposed what it described as a provincewide lockdown, beginning Boxing Day.

(CBC)​


----------



## eMacMan

CubaMark said:


> *Ontario's new COVID-19 modelling to show ICUs full by early February: sources*Ontario's latest COVID-19 modelling will project the province's intensive care units to be filled beyond capacity by early February, and will also show how a new, more contagious variant of the coronavirus risks accelerating the spread of infections, sources tell CBC News.
> 
> Premier Doug Ford has warned he is ready to impose further restrictions based on the modelling, but no announcement is planned before Tuesday, according to government sources.
> 
> Although the projections by Ontario's scientific advisers were presented to cabinet on Friday, the information is not slated to be made public until Tuesday.
> 
> Multiple sources who have seen the modelling tell CBC News it includes:
> 
> 
> Forecasts putting the province on track to report an average of 6,000 new cases of COVID-19 daily before the end of January.
> Survey data indicating that a large proportion of Ontarians are not following basic public health guidelines to slow the spread of COVID-19.
> Mobility data showing a spike in movement by Ontarians in the days just before Christmas when the government imposed what it described as a provincewide lockdown, beginning Boxing Day.
> (CBC)​


No doubt the same modellers who justified the lockdowns and all that followed on their prediction of 250,000+ Canadian deaths. 

FWIW Our current toll is at about 17,000 and most of the so-called second wave are normal deaths who happened to test positive or were even just labeled positive to inflate totals. No effort at all is being made to distinguish between cases where covid caused death, contributed to death or was merely in the same room.

The only two 'Covid' deaths where I have reasonably direct knowledge, the families are quite adamant Covid played absolutely no role in those deaths.

Incidentally on Oct 17, close to the start of the second wave 79.4% of total deaths were over 70. Currently the total is 79.2%. So no reason to suspect deaths are any more frequent amongst the young and healthy this time around.


----------



## polywog

eMacMan said:


> No doubt the same modellers who justified the lockdowns and all that followed on their prediction of 250,000+ Canadian deaths.
> 
> FWIW Our current toll is at about 17,000 and most of the so-called second wave are normal deaths who happened to test positive or were even just labeled positive to inflate totals. No effort at all is being made to distinguish between cases where covid caused death, contributed to death or was merely in the same room.


Since you're up on all the modelling, what would the death toll be, had there not been any interventions at all?



eMacMan said:


> The only two 'Covid' deaths where I have reasonably direct knowledge, the families are quite adamant Covid played absolutely no role in those deaths.


I can say with absolute certainty it wasn't lupus either. I can play from home, can't I? I watched lots of Dr. House, and since any old person is qualified to determine cause of death, that's my vote.




eMacMan said:


> Incidentally on Oct 17, close to the start of the second wave 79.4% of total deaths were over 70. Currently the total is 79.2%. So no reason to suspect deaths are any more frequent amongst the young and healthy this time around.


I'm sure when people start dying while just waiting for an ICU bed, you'll be quick to point out those deaths weren't from covid. Small comfort to the people who died waiting for it, or their families though. If you'll recall is exactly what they were trying to avoid all along; overwhelming the ICUs.


----------



## wonderings

polywog said:


> I'm sure when people start dying while just waiting for an ICU bed, you'll be quick to point out those deaths weren't from covid. Small comfort to the people who died waiting for it, or their families though. If you'll recall is exactly what they were trying to avoid all along; overwhelming the ICUs.


I think it is dangerous to simply look at people as numbers and statistics. I do think COVID is made out to be worse then it actually is but I am not a denier and think it is bad, just not as world destroyingly bad as they make it out. I know a few people who have had it, thankfully they have all come out of it ok, just as the vast majority of people who catch it will. I am in the high risk category being a T1 diabetic so I do stay away from large gatherings/church, things like that but other then that I live my life pretty normally while wearing the mask the least amount I need to.


----------



## CubaMark

In the past hour, I've learned of several of our friends in Mexico and Bolivia who have tested positive for covid, and some have been hospitalized. This is not the flu.


----------



## polywog

wonderings said:


> I think it is dangerous to simply look at people as numbers and statistics.


In Toronto, the ICUs are at 70% capacity. That's only because they cancelled all surgeries that they possibly could. Otherwise, they'd be at very near 100%. And it's only going to get worse.

I get your point, don't get me wrong. Dealing with the pandemic has many other factors outside of the pandemic itself. Everyone is sick and tired of it all. But some things come down to numbers. And at those numbers, I feel for the medical professionals who are just getting slammed by all of this.


----------



## eMacMan

No mention as to how that 70% compares to previous years, but that seems par for he course.

Anyways we can look to our polieticians if we want to know how dangerous they believe this is. Just key on what they do not what they say.


----------



## eMacMan

Did a quick summary. Ontario shows about 24% of its 'Covid' patients as in ICU. For all of Canada other than Ontario it's about 16%. Beyond that Ontario is showing 72% of its Covid ICU patients on ventilators. New York and Italy established with a very high degree of certainty that putting a Covid patient on a ventilator is pretty much the same as executing them. 

We now know the HCQ and Ivermectin protocols work about 95% of the time and usually without resorting to putting the patient on a ventilator, so the question becomes: Is Ontario deliberately killing as many as they can to keep their numbers high, thereby giving them an excuse to maintain or increase the oppressive measures?


----------



## CubaMark

_"it's just like the flu...."_



*Post-COVID lungs worse than the worst smokers' lungs, surgeon says*

A Texas trauma surgeon says it's rare that X-rays from any of her COVID-19 patients come back without dense scarring. Dr. Brittany Bankhead-Kendall tweeted, "Post-COVID lungs look worse than any type of terrible smoker's lung we've ever seen. And they collapse. And they clot off. And the shortness of breath lingers on... & on... & on."

"Everyone's just so worried about the mortality thing and that's terrible and it's awful," she told CBS Dallas-Fort Worth. "But man, for all the survivors and the people who have tested positive this is — it's going to be a problem."

Bankhead-Kendall, an assistant professor of surgery with Texas Tech University, in Lubbock, has treated thousands of patients since the pandemic began in March.










She says patients who've had COVID-19 symptoms show a severe chest X-ray every time, and those who were asymptomatic show a severe chest X-ray 70% to 80% of the time.

"There are still people who say 'I'm fine. I don't have any issues,' and you pull up their chest X-ray and they absolutely have a bad chest X-ray," she said.

In X-ray photos of a normal lung, a smoker's lung and a COVID-19 lung that Bankhead-Kendall shared with CBS Dallas, the healthy lungs are clean with a lot of black, which is mainly air. In the smoker's lung, white lines are indicative of scarring and congestion, while the COVID lung is filled with white.

(CBS News)​


----------



## CubaMark

*COVID Long-Haulers Support Group Canada*

Covid Long Haulers Support Group Canada is Canada's largest online support group, a Canadian movement to connect covid long haulers to support and information. The group, founded by long haul survivors, was unable to find viable information or answers to their medical needs, so they came together to pool resources. The group has become a hub of information and support network to survivors with the latest relevant information of the pandemic. 

(Facebook)​
_Related:_

*60% of COVID-19 long-haulers say government is 'absolutely ignoring them,' Marketplace questionnaire finds*

Susie Goulding said she feels like she's living with a "broken brain." 

Some days, she can't remember her dog's name. Other days, she can't remember how to make a phone call from her car.

"It's like a computer that's processing," said Goulding, who lives in Oakville, Ont. "It's spinning and I'm just waiting for the information to come to my brain, but it doesn't come."

Goulding started experiencing symptoms of COVID-19 in March 2020. She was not tested during her initial illness because her symptoms didn't match up with early testing criteria. She said her doctor has since made a working diagnosis of COVID-19 based on her ongoing symptoms. 

Today, she is just one of a growing number of Canadians who say they're suffering from so-called long COVID, a condition where people who contract even a mild case of COVID-19 experience symptoms for weeks or months after their initial illness.

Recent research has found that one in three of those who contract COVID-19 can go on to develop persistent symptoms, with studies citing heart, lung and cognitive issues, as well as debilitating fatigue and pain. They've come to be known as COVID long-haulers, and based on these recent statistics, Canada could have more than 200,000 of them at this point in the pandemic.

* * *

More than 60 per cent reported that they have not been able to access the care they believe they need to recover.

Symptoms experienced by respondents to our questionnaire include:


Cognitive issues, such as brain fog and memory loss. 

Lung issues, such as shortness of breath and chest pain. 

Pain, such as joint pain and body pain.

Fatigue.

* * *

In the U.K., the National Health Service (NHS) England is spending at least 10 million pounds, or $17.3 million Cdn, to open 81 long COVID specialist clinics across the country. U.K. Health Secretary Matt Hancock said "they will bring together doctors, nurses, therapists and other NHS staff like physiotherapists."

Meanwhile, Canada has six in-person post-COVID clinics that take on long-haulers: two in Ontario, three in the greater Vancouver area, and one in Sherbrooke, Que. These clinics are funded through hospital operating budgets, charitable donations and research dollars.

(CBC)​


----------



## eMacMan

Buried deep I accidentally discovered that in Alberta, the average age of covid deaths is 82. Isn't our average lifespan 82?

IOW though claiming 1500 covid deaths for Alberta, the aggregate total of shortened lifespans in Alberta is ZERO, NADA, GOOSE EGG........


----------



## eMacMan

So Canada, like the UK and the US, is labeling as Covid caused anyone who tests positive and dies. This regardless of the actual cause, and even when Covid played no role in the death. Great if your job is to pedal fear. FWIW The only two 'Covid' deaths where I have some personal knowledge the families have clearly stated that Covid did not play any role in the deaths.

Meanwhile I pulled this interesting quote from an AP article in reference to several Norwegian long term care residents who died shortly after receiving the vaccine:



> Across the world, officials expect deaths and other severe side effects to be reported after any mass vaccination campaign given the huge numbers of people involved. But determining whether or not the vaccine caused deaths can be very challenging and requires that all other potential causes be ruled out first.


Excuse me but if you are going to rule out all other causes first, should you not be applying the same standard in declaring Covid deaths? 

Still I'm sure that Hank Aaron can rest easier knowing that maybe that Covid jab didn't really kill him, or if it did the blame will be shifted elsewhere.


----------



## CubaMark

"Just a flu"


*Alberta has recorded more COVID-19 deaths in 10 months than flu deaths in 20 years*

Data from the Government of Alberta shows the province has recorded more COVID-19 deaths in 10 months than influenza deaths in the last 20 years combined.

Alberta reported its first death from COVID-19 on March 19, 2020. In the time since, 1,389 people have lost their lives to the coronavirus as of Thursday.

Nationally, the number of deaths from the virus are similar and it shows how deadly COVID-19 is, health experts say.


“We are now at about 17,000 deaths nationally from COVID-19 and a typically bad year for flu is about 3,500. So we’re at five times the number of deaths,” says Craig Jenne, who teaches in the department of Microbiology Immunology and Infectious Disease at U of C’s Cumming School of Medicine.

CTV News used provincial data to tally the flu death numbers from each influenza season since 2000.

“Anywhere from 25-30 per cent of Canadians catch the flu every year,” Dr. Jenne said. 

“If we look at COVID, less than two per cent of Canadians have actually had this virus, yet our death count is five times higher than an entire year of flu.”

Alberta has yet to report a lab confirmed case of influenza during the 2020-‘21 flu season.

(CTV News Calgary)​
*AND*

"This is not a result of no longer testing for influenza or testing fewer samples," Hinshaw said Thursday. "In fact, our labs are doing more weekly influenza testing than they ever have before they're completing about 300 per cent more influenza tests than they would usually do in a typical year."
(Global News)​


----------



## eMacMan

Yet in Alberta the average lifespan is 81.6 years and average age at death from Covid is 82 years. Docs are still prohibited from using either Ivermectin or HCQ, two protocols that have proven to be extremely effective as treatment and preventing long term complications. Flu deaths have plummeted to zero, heart attack, cancer and pneumonia deaths are also way down.

Again anything with a positive PCR test is labeled Covid. Even end stage cancer. 

Clearly there are deaths from Covid, based on CDC stats those are about 6% of the total figure. 

There are also deaths where Covid is a contributor. A good example would be someone with multiple co-morbidities who develops secondary pneumonia after seeing their blood-oxygen levels drop to about 50%. Of course if this pneumonia happens to be bacterial, our Docs are not allowed to prescribe anti-biotics because it's Covid. Should those deaths be more accurately labeled as homicides? 

Then there are those who die of other causes and Covid gets the blame, even though it made no contribution whatsoever. Knowing that over half of the positive tests show zero symptoms, it is a reasonable guess that at least half of the second wave Covid deaths were of the variety where Covid played no part. This is certainly reflected in the role Covid has played in reducing deaths from flu, heart attacks, and cancer.

All this information is readily available outside of the lamestream fearstream.


----------



## groovetube

CubaMark said:


> *COVID Long-Haulers Support Group Canada*
> 
> Covid Long Haulers Support Group Canada is Canada's largest online support group, a Canadian movement to connect covid long haulers to support and information. The group, founded by long haul survivors, was unable to find viable information or answers to their medical needs, so they came together to pool resources. The group has become a hub of information and support network to survivors with the latest relevant information of the pandemic.
> 
> (Facebook)​
> _Related:_
> 
> *60% of COVID-19 long-haulers say government is 'absolutely ignoring them,' Marketplace questionnaire finds*
> 
> Susie Goulding said she feels like she's living with a "broken brain."
> 
> Some days, she can't remember her dog's name. Other days, she can't remember how to make a phone call from her car.
> 
> "It's like a computer that's processing," said Goulding, who lives in Oakville, Ont. "It's spinning and I'm just waiting for the information to come to my brain, but it doesn't come."
> 
> Goulding started experiencing symptoms of COVID-19 in March 2020. She was not tested during her initial illness because her symptoms didn't match up with early testing criteria. She said her doctor has since made a working diagnosis of COVID-19 based on her ongoing symptoms.
> 
> Today, she is just one of a growing number of Canadians who say they're suffering from so-called long COVID, a condition where people who contract even a mild case of COVID-19 experience symptoms for weeks or months after their initial illness.
> 
> Recent research has found that one in three of those who contract COVID-19 can go on to develop persistent symptoms, with studies citing heart, lung and cognitive issues, as well as debilitating fatigue and pain. They've come to be known as COVID long-haulers, and based on these recent statistics, Canada could have more than 200,000 of them at this point in the pandemic.
> 
> * * *
> 
> More than 60 per cent reported that they have not been able to access the care they believe they need to recover.
> 
> Symptoms experienced by respondents to our questionnaire include:
> 
> 
> Cognitive issues, such as brain fog and memory loss.
> 
> Lung issues, such as shortness of breath and chest pain.
> 
> Pain, such as joint pain and body pain.
> 
> Fatigue.
> 
> * * *
> 
> In the U.K., the National Health Service (NHS) England is spending at least 10 million pounds, or $17.3 million Cdn, to open 81 long COVID specialist clinics across the country. U.K. Health Secretary Matt Hancock said "they will bring together doctors, nurses, therapists and other NHS staff like physiotherapists."
> 
> Meanwhile, Canada has six in-person post-COVID clinics that take on long-haulers: two in Ontario, three in the greater Vancouver area, and one in Sherbrooke, Que. These clinics are funded through hospital operating budgets, charitable donations and research dollars.
> 
> (CBC)​


I know several long haulers and this is no joke. Many only focus on the death rates, the dispute of what constitutes a covid death and not, is pure stupidity. None of the numbskulls have ever set foot in a ER and have frontline experience with this. Oh maybe the youtube doctor. Who (with a no doubt monetized channel) has more credibility than the entire world's medical community of experts on the frontlines. 


Having lost a few friends now, a very good friend this weekend to cover, it just disturbs me to see people so incredibly classless as to continue to spout nonsense. The best response to them, is either silence, or pure mockery.


----------



## eMacMan

Meanwhile an interesting stat. Government of Canada is now only doing weekly reports as to hospital and ICU totals.

Interestingly the totals for Jan 15 to 22 averaged to about 175 hospital admissions/day and 33 ICU admissions/day. However from the 22nd to the 29th the daily averages are 445 and 68 respectively.

On Jan 15, I added up provincial numbers from BC as far east as Quebec. There were 4671 in hospital, of whom 885 were in ICU.

On Jan 22 there were 4343 in hospital and 844 in ICU.

On January 29 there were 3816 in hospital and 819 in ICU.

Yet we are supposed to believe that the daily number being admitted to hospitals between Jan 22 and Jan 29 was 2.5 times greater than between the 15th and the 22nd. And daily ICU admissions more than doubled????

As always throughout this planned panicdemic, when you take the time to do the math, the only possible conclusion is that we are being lied to.


----------



## eMacMan

groovetube said:


> I know several long haulers and this is no joke. Many only focus on the death rates, the dispute of what constitutes a covid death and not, is pure stupidity. None of the numbskulls have ever set foot in a ER and have frontline experience with this. Oh maybe the youtube doctor. Who (with a no doubt monetized channel) has more credibility than the entire world's medical community of experts on the frontlines.
> 
> 
> Having lost a few friends now, a very good friend this weekend to cover, it just disturbs me to see people so incredibly classless as to continue to spout nonsense. The best response to them, is either silence, or pure mockery.


The long haul fearmongering is certainly a reflection on the folly of forbidding the use of HCQ and Ivermectin protocols which have both proven quite effective, not just at saving lives but preventing long term effects.

Fauci himself supposedly authored a study on SARS-1, establishing the effectiveness of HCQ. I say supposedly as Fauci has been rumoured to use his control over funding to get his name on studies where he made zero contributions. Based on the overall level of corruption on the soused side of 49, I believe this is extremely likely to be true. However I have no idea if it applies to that particular study.

And yes I will believe the front line workers, who knowingly risk their jobs and even their careers, when they go public with their doubts about the official narrative. Always remembering that official narrative comes from those whose positions are entirely political and are clearly simply obeying their globalist masters orders. Those orders come from Gates and Soros, and neither is worthy of trust. Especially when it may be your life at risk.


----------



## groovetube

Derp!


----------



## groovetube

Macfury and emacman. Is this the face of ehmac now? One tries to compare this pandemic to h1n1, and the other, is openly promoting anti parasite medication often used for dog heart worm or against head lice as the miracle cure.

true brilliance.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> The long haul fearmongering is certainly a reflection on the folly of forbidding the use of HCQ and Ivermectin protocols which have both proven quite effective, not just at saving lives but preventing long term effects.


Next thing you know, you'll be telling me that bread mould can be used to fight infections!


----------



## groovetube

How’s the hydroxychloriquin craze working out?

maybe a little bleach?

I heard the mypillow guy has a miracle cure too!

sure try to compare unproven bullsh!t with vast science. Classic troll macfury. But incredibly lame, even for you.


----------



## eMacMan

groovetube said:


> How’s the hydroxychloriquin craze working out?
> 
> maybe a little bleach?
> 
> I heard the mypillow guy has a miracle cure too!
> 
> sure try to compare unproven bullsh!t with vast science. Classic troll macfury. But incredibly lame, even for you.


Let's see, Fauci himself supposedly authored a study in 2005(?), which claimed the HCQ, zinc, C, D, antibiotic protocol was extremely effective in treating SARS-1. The study was real and very well done, it is Fauci's contribution which I question.

Fauci then commissioned two studies in early 2020 which claimed to discredit his earlier study, but were so riddled with bad science they were withdrawn within hours. Thanks to the withdrawals being totally ignored by the Lamestream media, those 2020 studies are still the gold standard for the Covid Kool-Aid Crowd.

Other than that, the doctors who have defied the AMA and used the HCQ/Zinc or Ivermectin/Zinc approach, claim and have documented far better success than the standard Ontario-NY approach. That ON_NY approach is to wait until it becomes life-threatening then put them on ventilators and wait for them to die, which happens to 95+% of those who are placed on ventilators. Good news is that you are in Ontario so should you come down with a serious case, you will no doubt be treated exactly as I just described. BTW how did not using HCQ/Zinc or Ivermectin/Zinc in the early stages work out for the friend you lost?

Interestingly when you look at all of Canada, excluding Ontario 18-20% of those hospitalized are in ICU, whereas in Ontario that number is 35-40%. For all of Canada 18% of those admitted to ICU with Covid are placed on ventilators, whereas in Ontario that number jumps to 65-70%. Which begs the question; Is Ontario official Covid protocol deliberately murdering SARS-2 victims?


----------



## groovetube

what could possibly be running through your insane mind that you would think anyone is interested in listening to yet more conspiracy laden numbskull copy/pasted nonsense that I have already seen constantly from the idiots in facebook? You followed me into the shang while I spoke of a close friend dying of covid you began mouthing off about a med for head lice uninvited. Are you a medical doctor? That’s the way here now eh? No wonder none of the former people here I know would ever return. It’s one thing to post about ongoing studies but to practically give medical advice here as it you know anything is beyond description.


And the fact that you macfury have been reduced to defending this crap because of your desperate need to troll -something-, wow. Comparing a study with no real conclusions not peer reviewed nothing that says it’s effective, to pennicilin? You’ve fallen on hard times here my friend.

And before you go whimpering about free speech, remember that it’s also someone else’s free speech to confront utter bullshyte.


----------



## Macfury

groovetube said:


> No wonder none of the former people here I know would ever return.


Return from where? Those communities were all destroyed by the collective interactions of all the people who don't like the only community that survived.

Why not show us how it's done by completing your plans for the new Mac Magic? You know, the place where all the "good people" want to go.


----------



## groovetube

Turn your auto repeat off man. It’s just really, really tired. And, truly pathetic. Well, you got your little conspiracy buddy to hi five with anyway.

not much more to say on this.


----------



## Macfury

That's great. At last you are at peace.



groovetube said:


> not much more to say on this.


----------



## groovetube

As for peace, I doubt there’ll be any. Particularly having so many of you numbskulls constantly filling social media with just brainless idiocy that can possibly get people killed.

Unless you’re a medical doctor, you’re nothing but a moron with google, so stop dishing out medical advice on forums and STFU.


----------



## Macfury

Good to have someone of your calibre here to echo the etablishment line and get everyone thinking inside the box!


----------



## groovetube

If by ‘your calibre’ you mean, not stupid enough to listen idiot conspiracy theorists on Facebook or YouTube, and then go copy and paste them everywhere, sure. You’ve set the bar pretty low for yourself.


----------



## Macfury

No copying and pasting YouTube — that's just the type of stuff you've been selflessly bringing to the table, day after day. A national treasure!



groovetube said:


> If by ‘your calibre’ you mean, not stupid enough to listen idiot conspiracy theorists on Facebook or YouTube, and then go copy and paste them everywhere, sure. You’ve set the bar pretty low for yourself.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> No copying and pasting YouTube — that's just the type of stuff you've been selflessly bringing to the table, day after day. A national treasure!


Im enjoying a number of conversations with a few forum members I enjoy interacting with. What exactly is it, that you do here? I don't see you having many conversations. You're pretty much anonymous there, mr. 'my life is my own'... I know you mentioned you are 'changing minds here'. But this is thing macfury, pretty much all of our interactions are pretty childish. Like, not beyond 5 year old childish. Have you noticed that? But here's the thing..., so are most of your other interactions here with others I see. Not much in the way of normal friendly conversations like others. So you might consider that, before you go throwing the 'you're a treasure' insult around.


----------



## Macfury

As long as you're getting what you want from EhMac, i'm happy!


----------



## eMacMan

Might as well go with a CM/GT style post.


----------



## groovetube

Hmmm. Let me go ask 3 of my friends who had a severe bout of it.

Oh right I can’t because they’re dead.

We get that you have some deep seated issues and don’t believe any of this, but there are a lot of people who are suffering and dying, so just try to have some decency.


----------



## pm-r

groovetube said:


> but there are a lot of people who are suffering and dying, so just try to have some decency.



I just discovered that a school Chum of mine, slightly older than myself at 80, succumbed to the covid virus last week, which was a bit of a shock as he led a pretty good healthy lifestyle in his retirement.


- Patrick
=======


----------



## groovetube

Really sorry to hear that Patrick. I know of a few much younger athletic types that succumbed to this as well. The last person I knew was a good friend who’d still be here. Peace.


----------



## eMacMan

Mayor Nincompoop strikes again!


----------



## eMacMan

Different Pastor, but the Crown lunatics finally released Pastor Coates who was being held in jail for offenses that would not have resulted in jail time should he have been convicted.








Pastor James Coates to be released from jail as Crown withdraws charges | Justice Centre for Constitutional Freedoms


EDMONTON: The Justice Centre today announced that Crown Prosecutors have agreed to withdraw all but one of the Public Health Act offences that Pastor James Coates has been charged with. The Justice Centre expects Pastor Coates will be released from jail in the coming days, without any...




www.jccf.ca







> Grace Life is a church of nearly 400 congregants who have exercised their _Charter_ rights and freedoms normally since July of 2020, including their freedoms of assembly, association, expression, religion and conscience. Not one congregant has been lost to Covid, but, *sadly, a congregant was lost to the Alberta Government lockdown in the first week of February when he died prematurely because he couldn’t get the cancer treatment he needed due to government lockdown restrictions.*


Pretty sure this one will have the Kovid Kool-aid Krew's undies in a knot.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> Different Pastor, but the Crown lunatics finally released Pastor Coates who was being held in jail for offenses that would not have resulted in jail time should he have been convicted.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pastor James Coates to be released from jail as Crown withdraws charges | Justice Centre for Constitutional Freedoms
> 
> 
> EDMONTON: The Justice Centre today announced that Crown Prosecutors have agreed to withdraw all but one of the Public Health Act offences that Pastor James Coates has been charged with. The Justice Centre expects Pastor Coates will be released from jail in the coming days, without any...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.jccf.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pretty sure this one will have the Kovid Kool-aid Krew's undies in a knot.


If a Liberal was responsible for laying charges, your post is just a bunch of garbage! Next?


----------



## groovetube

Sure, let them congregate. Just let them sign a document that states if anyone dies as a result of it, they are criminally responsible. A manslaughter charge for instance. Only fair right?

Simple. If you think there's no danger and all that jazz, there should be no issue. Right?

Just ignore troll weenies liberal stupidity. It's all he's capable of now it seems.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

There’s plenty of other churches in Alberta who manage to follow public health orders. Grace life should not get a pass just “because charter rights.” Violating a public health order endangers everyone else’s rights.


----------



## Macfury

Which of "everyone else's rights" would it violate. Not trying to catch you, just curious.



Freddie_Biff said:


> There’s plenty of other churches in Alberta who manage to follow public health orders. Grace life should not get a pass just “because charter rights.” Violating a public health order endangers everyone else’s rights.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Which of "everyone else's rights" would it violate. Not trying to catch you, just curious.


How about the right to life. Or the right to not have Covid circulating by community transmission. Grace life parishioners are being incredibly selfish and think they’re above the law. My church has only had minimal participation over the past year, and it can hold well over 1000 in non-CoVid times. Most worship is done online for now.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> How about the right to life. Or the right to not have Covid circulating by community transmission. Grace life parishioners are being incredibly selfish and think they’re above the law. My church has only had minimal participation over the past year, and it can hold well over 1000 in non-CoVid times. Most worship is done online for now.


Ive seen this circular argument happen here over, and over, and over again. It never resolves. One big problem is often the ones fighting for a particular group's rights fail to comprehend what you have already basically said and was ignored. "*Your Liberty To Swing Your Fist Ends Just Where My Nose Begins"*

No one has the right to do anything that endangers someone else's rights. That's obvious (well except to some people I guess...) More specifically, someone else's life. So the argument will now proceed to failing to recognize the dangers of allowing people to risk being infected and then bringing that infection into their homes and communities. But that's the circle, as it no longer is a debate over rights, but one where people disagree with public health rules.


----------



## Macfury

It sounds like you're using Libertarian principles to get results on a single illness. Do we have the right, for example, not to have drug-resistant venereal diseases vectoring across the population?



Freddie_Biff said:


> How about the right to life. Or the right to not have Covid circulating by community transmission. Grace life parishioners are being incredibly selfish and think they’re above the law. My church has only had minimal participation over the past year, and it can hold well over 1000 in non-CoVid times. Most worship is done online for now.


----------



## groovetube

here comes the wind up to the pitch...

I gotta say, you're pretty consistent Macfury. You fool enough to have.. I dunno... some fun I guess. But right, it's "your opinion". Carry on 

I think first you will need to explain how on earth comparing an example of diseases that -only- spread through sexual contact between consenting adults, to a disease that is primarily airborne where many people have gotten severely ill and died as a result of someone else's reckless actions, is in any way, worth debating.

Unless of course, you're one of those who try to tell people you can get herpes or hiv from a toilet seat...

So, in short, nice try.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> It sounds like you're using Libertarian principles to get results on a single illness. Do we have the right, for example, not to have drug-resistant venereal diseases vectoring across the population?


Yeah, I’m not seeing the correlation between STI’s which happen between consenting adults and contaminating the air that we all breathe. I also don’t see how it relates to libertarianism. Perhaps you could explain.


----------



## Macfury

Libertarianism says that individuals should be free to pursue their choices in living their own lives while they respect the same rights in others. This seemed to be what you were saying regarding COVID-19. Live your life, provided you don't carelessly infect me with COVID against my will. 

So if I want to congregate with a large group in an enclosed space, that part should be fine. All of the people congregating are doing so of their own free will. Would you agree that far?


----------



## Dr.G.

Macfury said:


> Libertarianism says that individuals should be free to pursue their choices in living their own lives while they respect the same rights in others. This seemed to be what you were saying regarding COVID-19. Live your life, provided you don't carelessly infect me with COVID against my will.
> 
> So if I want to congregate with a large group in an enclosed space, that part should be fine. All of the people congregating are doing so of their own free will. Would you agree that far?


But then those people go out into the general public. It is like we are all in a big row boat and some people want to assert their right to drill a hole in the bottom of the boat. They have this right, and may suffer the consequences of the boat sinking in the middle of the North Atlantic ............. but then the others in the boat suffer as well. With rights come responsibilities. Thus, do what you want if it only endangers you and you are willing to pay the consequences, but we live in a civil society with both rights and responsibilities. Paix, mon ami.


----------



## groovetube

There simply isn't a "part" of this that "should be fine". 









‘Spread like wildfire’: Churchgoer spread COVID-19 to at least 91 other people, cases from family gatherings continue to rise


As he has during previous briefings, Ohio Gov. Mike DeWine took a moment out of Tuesday’s press conference to describe several scenarios where COVID-19 spread among individuals attending public or family gatherings.




www.cleveland19.com





There are scores of examples of this reported on all manner of news outlets across the globe. We've had a year of this playing out globally, and this should be obvious to anyone (rational) by now.


----------



## groovetube

Dr.G. said:


> But then those people go out into the general public. It is like we are all in a big row boat and some people want to assert their right to drill a hole in the bottom of the boat. They have this right, and may suffer the consequences of the boat sinking in the middle of the North Atlantic ............. but then the others in the boat suffer as well. With rights come responsibilities. Thus, do what you want if it only endangers you and you are willing to pay the consequences, *but we live in a civil society with both rights and responsibilities*. Paix, mon ami.


I bolded what's important. thanks dr. G.


----------



## Macfury

Dr.G. said:


> But then those people go out into the general public. It is like we are all in a big row boat and some people want to assert their right to drill a hole in the bottom of the boat. They have this right, and may suffer the consequences of the boat sinking in the middle of the North Atlantic ............. but then the others in the boat suffer as well. With rights come responsibilities. Thus, do what you want if it only endangers you and you are willing to pay the consequences, but we live in a civil society with both rights and responsibilities. Paix, mon ami.


Well, let's continue with a thought experiment. Theoretically, if they agreed to quarantine themselves for two weeks following a service, would that be acceptable?


----------



## Dr.G.

Macfury said:


> Well, let's continue with a thought experiment. Theoretically, if they agreed to quarantine themselves for two weeks following a service, would that be acceptable?


Yes, if if they agreed to be quarantined and tested, that would be acceptable to me. However, how many would want to self-isolate for that period of time? If you came to visit me, you would have to self-isolate or we would all have to self-isolate in our home. Hope you like dogs.


----------



## groovetube

In theory, only if all church goers agree to isolate for the require time period (14 days?) and that includes all members of their households, no exceptions. AND, if taxpayers are willing to foot the bill for the enforcement/monitoring process as experience has shown the honor system fails spectacularly. Not to mention, the concept of "libertarianism" fails if you're forcing others to foot the bill for someone else's rick taking 'rights'.

So, still a pretty big NO.


----------



## Dr.G.

groovetube said:


> In theory, only if all church goers agree to isolate for the require time period (14 days?) and that includes all members of their households, no exceptions. AND, if taxpayers are willing to foot the bill for the enforcement/monitoring process as experience has shown the donor system fails spectacularly.
> 
> So, still a pretty big NO.


No???? But what if they could prove that God would protect them? What it they did not need to have taxpayer money for the testing and monitoring? They could enter the church on day one, throw all their money into the air. What God wants, God will take. The rest that falls to the ground will be used for this testing. Would that be acceptable?


----------



## groovetube

Dr.G. said:


> No???? But what if they could prove that God would protect them? What it they did not need to have taxpayer money for the testing and monitoring? They could enter the church on day one, throw all their money into the air. What God wants, God will take. The rest that falls to the ground will be used for this testing. Would that be acceptable?


True. If they could prove that god will protect them, then all bets are off. Then they wouldn't need taxpayers money to monitor them as well. Win win! Well except for the proving the god part I guess. 

Such is life


----------



## Dr.G.

groovetube said:


> True. If they could prove that god will protect them, then all bets are off. Then they wouldn't need taxpayers money to monitor them as well. Win win! Well except for the proving the god part I guess.
> 
> Such is life


Picky, picky, picky. 

"Ayn Rand supporters will also claim that libertarians must have commitment to truth and knowledge. She strongly condemns anything that is mystical, or simply based on faith instead of hard evidence. She argues that religion itself is a product of a bygone age where humans had little knowledge of events, and would use God to explain these events. Libertarians could also argue that what makes humans special is our ability to use reason to innovate, create and advance human civilisation. Therefore faith, as such, could be considered as detrimental to human life: by its very definition it is the negation of reason."

Is Libertarianism and Religion Compatible? - Being Libertarian


----------



## groovetube

> She strongly condemns anything that is mystical, or simply based on faith instead of hard evidence...


oh. Damn. You got us there. That's a really tough one to wriggle out of. 

There must be a way


----------



## Dr.G.

groovetube said:


> oh. Damn. You got us there. That's a really tough one to wriggle out of.
> 
> There must be a way





groovetube said:


> oh. Damn. You got us there. That's a really tough one to wriggle out of.
> 
> There must be a way


 In the Book of Macfury it is written "I am the way" ............ "all who follow what I say will be considered 'the chosen ones' who will be seen as always correct." This is why I don't bother arguing with Macfury. To be against him is to be against God, and I do NOT want it to be written that I fought the Law of Macfury and his Law won. Bonne chance, mon ami. Paix.

I Fought The Law Bobby Fuller Four STEREO HiQ Hybrid JARichardsFilm 720p - YouTube


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Well, let's continue with a thought experiment. Theoretically, if they agreed to quarantine themselves for two weeks following a service, would that be acceptable?


Nope, because there’ll be another service again next week, which they’ll feel entitled to attend again, because screw the rules. It won’t end until someone shuts the church down indefinitely, which they should should absolutely do. The right to hold superstitious beliefs does not override public health orders.


----------



## groovetube

Dr.G. said:


> In the Book of Macfury it is written "I am the way" ............ "all who follow what I say will be considered 'the chosen ones' who will be seen as always correct." This is why I don't bother arguing with Macfury. To be against him is to be against God, and I do NOT want it to be written that I fought the Law of Macfury and his Law won. Bonne chance, mon ami. Paix.
> 
> I Fought The Law Bobby Fuller Four STEREO HiQ Hybrid JARichardsFilm 720p - YouTube





> Matthew 12:30-32: "Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. And so I tell you, any sin and blasphemy can be forgiven. But blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come."


Whoa unto those who blaspheme against "the Spirit" as this is the unforgivable sin.

I will tread carefully.


----------



## Dr.G.

Freddie_Biff said:


> Nope, because there’ll be another service again next week, which they’ll feel entitled to attend again, because screw the rules. It won’t end until someone shuts the church down indefinitely, which they should should absolutely do. The right to hold superstitious beliefs does not override public health orders.


Another infidel unbeliever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is written in The Book of Macfury that "I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your impurities and from all your idols and false beliefs. The one who believes in me*,* even if he or she is incorrect, will be considered wise and correct. Stupid is as stupid does."


----------



## Dr.G.

groovetube said:


> Whoa unto those who blaspheme against "the Spirit" as this is the unforgivable sin.
> 
> I will tread carefully.


Very wise, Steve. As it is written in The Book of Macfury, "To tread carefully means to be very careful in what you do and say, so that you don’t make a big mistake and go against what I say or do. You have freedom of thought and action so long as you think and act as I do. So let it be written, so let it be done." So endeth the lesson.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Dr.G. said:


> Another infidel unbeliever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is written in The Book of Macfury that "I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your impurities and from all your idols and false beliefs. The one who believes in me*,* even if he or she is incorrect, will be considered wise and correct. Stupid is as stupid does."


And inside every prog is a libertarian just bursting to emerge and embrace the truth!


----------



## Dr.G.

Freddie_Biff said:


> And inside every prog is a libertarian just bursting to emerge and embrace the truth!


Careful. Remember as it is written in The Book of Macfury, ""*I* am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have *the* *light* of correctness." "


----------



## Macfury

Dr.G. said:


> Yes, if if they agreed to be quarantined and tested, that would be acceptable to me. However, how many would want to self-isolate for that period of time? If you came to visit me, you would have to self-isolate or we would all have to self-isolate in our home. Hope you like dogs.


Well of course, I love dogs!

But essentially what it comes down to is not whether they have the right to infect others within their own congregational bubble. It's what you believe they need to do following that crowded service to protect others outside of their congregational bubble.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Well of course, I love dogs!
> 
> But essentially what it comes down to is not whether they have the right to infect others within their own congregational bubble. It's what you believe they need to do following that crowded service to protect others outside of their congregational bubble.


Pretty much. If they want to infect each other, that’s one thing. If they want to throw caution to the wind and risk infecting everyone else, that’s a problem. It’s like if I wanted to exercise my right to sneeze mask less on a transit bus. The right of my fist ends where the right of your nose begins.


----------



## Macfury

Freddie_Biff said:


> Pretty much. If they want to infect each other, that’s one thing.


This is the crux of it. I believe that their right of religious assembly should not be abrogated. It's what they do afterward to avoid giving an illness to others that is important. I think a better way of handling ths would be to say that they can have a full-house religious assembly if they want to, but the result of that is a set of requirements they must take on to prevent the potential spread of illness.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> This is the crux of it. I believe that their right of religious assembly should not be abrogated. It's what they do afterward to avoid giving an illness to others that is important. I think a better way of handling ths would be to say that they can have a full-house religious assembly if they want to, but the result of that is a set of requirements they must take on to prevent the potential spread of illness.


Fine in theory but difficult in practice. Too hard to monitor. Why don’t they just do church online for now like the other religions do? These fine folks remind of the anti-masker crowd who think their somehow immune because of their faith. Shut the church down if they can’t or won’t follow the rules. This isn’t about liberty or freedom.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Fine in theory but difficult in practice. Too hard to monitor. Why don’t they just do church online for now like the other religions do? These fine folks remind of the anti-masker crowd who think their somehow immune because of their faith. Shut the church down if they can’t or won’t follow the rules. This isn’t about liberty or freedom.


Exactly. This issue was never about freedom. We have countless examples, as I’ve already pointed out, of how this goes down with these fake freedom people. If these church goers proved they would fully isolate after taking these risks then perhaps they would have been allowed.

So it’s hard to imagine why this dead horse is being... oh wait


----------



## groovetube

.


----------



## Dr.G.

Macfury said:


> Well of course, I love dogs!
> 
> But essentially what it comes down to is not whether they have the right to infect others within their own congregational bubble. It's what you believe they need to do following that crowded service to protect others outside of their congregational bubble.


They have to power to infect others, but not the right. Glad you like dogs.


----------



## Macfury

Protesters last year were not prevented from exercising the right to congregate and their health was impossible to monitor. Somebody made a calculation as to which charter rights to uphold.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Fine in theory but difficult in practice. Too hard to monitor.


Of course it's about liberty and freedom. Even shutting down stores when the owner wants to keep them open is about liberty and freedom. You may not think that going to church in person is important. Others hold it as among their most cherished values. Most churches calculated that the risk to their membership was greater than the value they saw in in-person services and shut down voluntarily. Only a very few didn't, because of what they valued. Opening liquor and pot stores during the worst of the pandemic also indicates a calculated risk and one that authorities were keen to take.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Why don’t they just do church online for now like the other religions do? These fine folks remind of the anti-masker crowd who think their somehow immune because of their faith. Shut the church down if they can’t or won’t follow the rules. This isn’t about liberty or freedom.


----------



## groovetube

The protestors were outside, not inside a building which is vastly different, and most of them were wearing masks. But this is rather obvious isn’t it. Perhaps if the church wanted to hold a service outside and everyone wore masks, then sure, compare that!!

I think you’ll find that if you make a sensible analogy, it’ll sound less troll like.

Still not a rights issue, but a public health one.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> The protestors were outside, not inside a building which is vastly different, and most of them were wearing masks. But this is rather obvious isn’t it. Perhaps if the church wanted to hold a service outside and everyone wore masks, then sure, compare that!!
> 
> I think you’ll find that if you make a sensible analogy, it’ll sound less troll like.
> 
> Still not a rights issue, but a public health one.


It’s okay, he’s on a roll. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Macfury

Rolls? Tasty after a big helping of word salad!



Freddie_Biff said:


> It’s okay, he’s on a roll.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> It’s okay, he’s on a roll.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


He always heads for the word salad thing when it gets awkward. He’s been using it since mid 2000s.

yawn.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> He always heads for the word salad thing when it gets awkward. He’s been using it since mid 2000s.
> 
> yawn.


Yup. Kind of predictable.


----------



## Macfury

Absolutely. You predicted it right here before it happened! _(Can't find that prediction right now.)_

However, you haven't managed to follow through on the discussion we were having. Have you grown tired?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Yup. Kind of predictable.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Yup. Kind of predictable.


Just a waste of time.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Just a waste of time.


How about some tasty word salad?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> How about some tasty word salad?


It's more like brain salad around here.


----------



## Macfury

Is that the extent of your intellectual foray regarding church closures and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms? You started relatively strong, but your carry-through could use some work.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Yup. Kind of predictable.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> It's more like brain salad around here.


Same old same old.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Same old same old.


God it’s still trying to troll.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> God it’s still trying to troll.


Please don’t feed the trolls.


----------



## polywog

Macfury said:


> Most churches calculated that the risk to their membership was greater than the value they saw in in-person services and shut down voluntarily. Only a very few didn't, because of what they valued


I agree to an extent. The churches are only considering the risk to their members, not any and every person their members may (or may have) come in contact with. Suppose my town has service available, where your neighbouring town does not. There's a very good chance that people from your town will come to mine for service, possibly introducing risks that would not otherwise have been there, simply because said service was available. At that point it doesn't matter that my town has agreed to self isolate after service...



Macfury said:


> Opening liquor and pot stores during the worst of the pandemic also indicates a calculated risk and one that authorities were keen to take.


I feel that liquor stores should have been closed. Full stop. It can be delivered, with far less risk than groceries. But the government makes big bucks on sales and they don't want those to drop when one can expect them to go up.


----------



## wonderings

polywog said:


> I agree to an extent. The churches are only considering the risk to their members, not any and every person their members may (or may have) come in contact with. Suppose my town has service available, where your neighbouring town does not. There's a very good chance that people from your town will come to mine for service, possibly introducing risks that would not otherwise have been there, simply because said service was available. At that point it doesn't matter that my town has agreed to self isolate after service...
> 
> 
> 
> I feel that liquor stores should have been closed. Full stop. It can be delivered, with far less risk than groceries. But the government makes big bucks on sales and they don't want those to drop when one can expect them to go up.


Not sure what most churches are doing but mine you need to reserve your spot basically. They have limited numbers they can allow in. I think more people are congregating in Walmart and Costco than in churches, of course no issue there because.... well not sure why. Masks are required, you get screened before attending and you are seated and spaced out all per the governments guidelines and there has been no issues or cases so far. I still do the online as I am in the high risk category being diabetic. 

Liquor stores should have definitely been shut down and this is part of the mixed message the government is giving. The world is ending COVID 19 oh no! But lets keep the LCBO (Ontario liquor store) open, pro sports and other things. It is either as bad as they say and they are not taking appropriate measures or it is part of the hygiene theatre and things are not quite as bad as they say.


----------



## groovetube

I think you need to remember that in stores (like grocery, liquor etc) you just go in, walk around and grab what you want/need, and pay and leave. In a church, at least ones Ive been to, you sit down and don't move much for at least an hour. This is much much riskier accordion to medical experts, so that is the reason for the difference.

Liquor stores, not sure where I stand on that, but personally I think if Doug Ford is going to close all the other small businesses, he should have been consistent in this regard and closed LCBO to curbsude/delivery as well.


----------



## Macfury

wonderings said:


> Not sure what most churches are doing but mine you need to reserve your spot basically. They have limited numbers they can allow in. I think more people are congregating in Walmart and Costco than in churches, of course no issue there because.... well not sure why. Masks are required, you get screened before attending and you are seated and spaced out all per the governments guidelines and there has been no issues or cases so far. I still do the online as I am in the high risk category being diabetic.
> 
> Liquor stores should have definitely been shut down and this is part of the mixed message the government is giving. The world is ending COVID 19 oh no! But lets keep the LCBO (Ontario liquor store) open, pro sports and other things. It is either as bad as they say and they are not taking appropriate measures or it is part of the hygiene theatre and things are not quite as bad as they say.


This is what I was getting at before others dropped out of the discussion. There are risks to everything we do, just as there are risks with potential exposure to COVID-19. There a very few situations where the risk is non-zero. But church attendance, covered by the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, was among the easiest for local governments to dispose of. People are flying airliners to go on a completely optional vacation and there are protocols in place for that stuation on their return — even though tropical vacations are not specifically Charter protected. We saw various approaches to gambling halls, liquor stores, cheek-by-jowl unmasked protests, and Wal-Mart shopping where the government chose to tread lightly. In the absence of strong case law precedents, they chose to tread heavily on religious assembly: "Shut 'em down." But no options for member screening, taking temperature, opening church windows to improve ventilation, contact screening, possible quarantines.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> This is what I was getting at before others dropped out of the discussion. There are risks to everything we do, just as there are risks with potential exposure to COVID-19. There a very few situations where the risk is non-zero. But church attendance, covered by the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, was among the easiest for local governments to dispose of. People are flying airliners to go on a completely optional vacation and there are protocols in place for that stuation on their return — even though tropical vacations are not specifically Charter protected. We saw various approaches to gambling halls, liquor stores, cheek-by-jowl unmasked protests, and Wal-Mart shopping where the government chose to tread lightly. In the absence of strong case law precedents, they chose to tread heavily on religious assembly: "Shut 'em down." But no options for member screening, taking temperature, opening church windows to improve ventilation, contact screening, possible quarantines.


How is in-person church attendance covered by the Charter of Rights and Freedoms? Quote the section, please.


----------



## wonderings

Freddie_Biff said:


> How is in-person church attendance covered by the Charter of Rights and Freedoms? Quote the section, please.


Not a lawyer but would not the simple right to a peaceful assembly apply or can the charter of rights and freedoms be turned off when needed?


----------



## groovetube

.


----------



## groovetube

wonderings said:


> Not sure of the science on that one, seems people walking around, touching things around a store would be more dangerous then people sitting in one place wearing a mask the whole time. Are the masks not doing something?
> 
> I wonder with the LCBO if it is a union thing, same with the teachers. No pay cuts there, no lost wages while everyone else is cut back. I get the reason no one probably wants to say that people use alcohol to deal with things and pulling that would most likely have enraged a large portion of the population, light drinker or heavier, it is a simple luxury. But again if lives are really on the line here you would think it would have been closed. Personally I am glad they did not shut down, as well as other stores as I think shops of all kinds can safely operate. It is just the inconsistency of it all. Read last week from a Bishop in Toronto complaining (I believe rightly so) that a funeral in his 1,500 capacity church could only have 10 people in it but the LCBO around the could have more people in a significantly smaller place. I would not go as far to say it is anything against the church, just an over sight and people not thinking
> 
> 
> Not a lawyer but would not the simple right to a peaceful assembly apply or can the charter of rights and freedoms be turned off when needed?


I can't give an expert opinion on that, as, Im not an expert.  But from what Ive read of the experts, it seems the risk is far higher when one is in close proximity to others for extended periods of time, compared to being somewhere in a shorter time frame, even touching things as we all (should be) wash our hands diligently. Though I think there's nothing wrong with questioning the government's decisions. Im critical of our provincial government's hamfisted way of locking us down and well, in my opinion, unfairly targeting the many small business owners who were following guidelines carefully and often invested money into that, simply because enough idiots business owners flaunted the rules. But it's merely my own opinion. Certainly seeing the massive lineups into big box stores is frustrating.

I posted a link to something that may shed some light on the constitutional question. Based on what Ive read, church services are not covered by the charter entirely. I think there is currently a challenge to the ford government over allowing churches to have drive in services. It's my opinion that that, should be allowed, for obvious reasons.


----------



## wonderings

groovetube said:


> I can't give an expert opinion on that, as, Im not an expert.  I think there's nothing wrong with questioning the government's decisions. Im critical of our provincial government's hamfisted way of locking us down and well, in my opinion, unfairly targeting the many small business owners who were following guidelines carefully and often invested money into that, simply because enough idiots business owners flaunted the rules. But it's merely my own opinion.
> 
> I posted a link to something that may shed some light on the constitutional question. Based on what Ive read, church services are not covered by the charter entirely. I think there is currently a challenge to the ford government over allowing churches to have drive in services. It's my opinion that that, should be allowed, for obvious reasons.


I removed my post as I posted that by accident before finishing my thoughts, I do like that ehMac will not save posts you are working on though in this case when replying to something that did not require as much though I forgot to remove it before posting!

I agree there is nothing wrong with questioning our governments decisions, we should very well be keeping them accountable (though not sure how that is possible outside of not electing them next go around). 

I am not sure how a church service could not be covered by the charter, it is a peaceful assembly. Though I think it can be suspended if it poses a public threat. Not a lawyer, just someone googling away. 

Not sure how practical a drive in service is, I think at that point you might as well just watch online and save the gridlock when the service is over!


----------



## Macfury

wonderings said:


> Not a lawyer but would not the simple right to a peaceful assembly apply or can the charter of rights and freedoms be turned off when needed?


Exactly. The "Fundamental Freedoms" section of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms states that everyone has the following fundamental freedoms:

(a) freedom of conscience and religion;
(b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication;
(c) freedom of peaceful assembly; and
(d) freedom of association.

The "reasonable limits"clause suggest that these right are not absolute--however, it also allows that limits to these freedoms must be justified by the courts.


----------



## Macfury

wonderings said:


> Not sure how practical a drive in service is, I think at that point you might as well just watch online and save the gridlock when the service is over!


In the city, may people don't even own cars. The question isn't whether a drive-in church would make non-members happier. It's about understanding Charter freedoms.


----------



## Macfury

wonderings said:


> I am not sure how a church service could not be covered by the charter, it is a peaceful assembly. Though I think it can be suspended if it poses a public threat. Not a lawyer, just someone googling away.


Limits to Charter rights must be examined by courts under the "Oakes clause" as supported by case law in _R v Oakes (1986)_.


----------



## polywog

Silly question, but, if it's a constitutional issue, have there been any legal challenges issued? I'm only aware of a bunch of news article arguing one way or another, and the legal consensus being that it would need to be tested in courts. I haven't seen anything concrete to say this is actually happening, but I'm not even sure where to check.



> ENFORCEMENT OF GUARANTEED RIGHTS AND FREEDOMS / Exclusion of evidence bringing administration of justice into disrepute.
> *24. (1)* Anyone whose rights or freedoms, as guaranteed by this Charter, have been infringed or denied may apply to a court of competent jurisdiction to obtain such remedy as the court considers appropriate and just in the circumstances.
> *(2)* Where, in proceedings under subsection (1), a court concludes that evidence was obtained in a manner that infringed or denied any rights or freedoms guaranteed by this Charter, the evidence shall be excluded if it is established that, having regard to all the circumstances, the admission of it in the proceedings would bring the administration of justice into disrepute.


----------



## groovetube

wonderings said:


> I removed my post as I posted that by accident before finishing my thoughts, I do like that ehMac will not save posts you are working on though in this case when replying to something that did not require as much though I forgot to remove it before posting!
> 
> I agree there is nothing wrong with questioning our governments decisions, we should very well be keeping them accountable (though not sure how that is possible outside of not electing them next go around).
> 
> I am not sure how a church service could not be covered by the charter, it is a peaceful assembly. Though I think it can be suspended if it poses a public threat. Not a lawyer, just someone googling away.
> 
> Not sure how practical a drive in service is, I think at that point you might as well just watch online and save the gridlock when the service is over!


That's happened to me too many times. I like that it saves posts, but sometimes, you get a nasty surprise...

As far as drive in service, I may not understand it, as having grown up in a Christian house I was taught that god is supposed to be all around us, etc., however, back to the justifiable limit thing, if they can't justify limiting the drive in option, who am I to judge?


----------



## Macfury

polywog said:


> Silly question, but, if it's a constitutional issue, have there been any legal challenges issued? I'm only aware of a bunch of news article arguing one way or another, and the legal consensus being that it would need to be tested in courts. I haven't seen anything concrete to say this is actually happening, but I'm not even sure where to check.


I haven't seen any as yet, but in Canada these things don't move quickly. Redress would first be sought at the most local level.

In the U.S., there have already been several Supreme Court decisions regarding the issue.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Limits to Charter rights must be examined by courts under the "Oakes clause" as supported by case law in _R v Oakes (1986)_.


Im glad you’ve returned to conversing rather than useless goading, but I’ve already provided this info. ^^


----------



## Freddie_Biff

wonderings said:


> Not a lawyer but would not the simple right to a peaceful assembly apply or can the charter of rights and freedoms be turned off when needed?


Absolutely your rights can be suspended. Just ask David Suzuki’s family during WWII or anyone who’s experienced the War Measures Act. A health code policy would be another exception to the 1982 charter.


----------



## Macfury

It_ could_ be, but it is not an exception established by case law.



Freddie_Biff said:


> A health code policy would be another exception to the 1982 charter.


----------



## wonderings

Freddie_Biff said:


> Absolutely your rights can be suspended. Just ask David Suzuki’s family during WWII or anyone who’s experienced the War Measures Act. A health code policy would be another exception to the 1982 charter.


Thankfully the War Measures Act was repealed and no longer something that can be used. Was difficult times for many many people from those countries we were at war with.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Absolutely your rights can be suspended. Just ask David Suzuki’s family during WWII or anyone who’s experienced the War Measures Act. A health code policy would be another exception to the 1982 charter.


agreed. I’d rather listen to a constitutional law expert than an anonymous forum troll on this matter


----------



## wonderings

groovetube said:


> agreed. I’d rather listen to a constitutional law expert than an anonymous forum troll on this matter


Is someone on this forum a constitutional law expert?


----------



## groovetube

someone seems to be pretending to be one.

See my quote and link to one above  who gave an eloquent piece on this.


----------



## Macfury

wonderings said:


> Is someone on this forum a constitutional law expert?


I know some professors in constitutional law, so I guess you should all listen to me until a bona fide EhMac constitutional law expert steps up!


----------



## groovetube

Imagine that. Someone on da internet “knows some experts”.

lol.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Imagine that. Someone on da internet “knows some experts”.
> 
> lol.


I’m not a constitutional expert, but I play one on TV.


----------



## groovetube

My brother bob has an awesome set of tools.


----------



## eMacMan

Couple of great memes though I expect the oxygen deprived kool-aid krowd may find them too intellectually challenging to comprehend.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Ooh. Those are pretty deep. And funny.


----------



## groovetube

I wouldn’t be too loud about others being oxygen deprived when posting this lazy stupidity. Does anyone even try any more, past lazy viral Facebook crap?


----------



## FeXL

So, here were are, back on the Chinese Coronavirus thread.

Has anyone else been monitoring the latest fear-porn? The extremely RAYCISS!!! Greek alphabet "Delta" variant? With symptoms "nearly identical" to common colds & hay fever? Can you see where this is going?

At any rate, apparently it kills greater than 3 times more "vaccinated" people than non-"vaccinated" people. Anybody here on ehMac know any fools stupid enough to get "vaccinated"?

*Newest COVID Lie: Fear Delta Variant and Get Vaccinated*



> Now the biggest pandemic liar, Fauci, is saying that the delta variant of the COVID virus is the “greatest threat” facing people. True, that variant looks like it is rapidly becoming the dominant one in the global pandemic. But what should you fear?
> 
> Here is the big new lie. Get vaccinated so you can be protected against the delta variant. In truth, data has just been released from the UK showing that vaccinated people are three times more likely to die from infection by the delta variant than unvaccinated people.


----------



## eMacMan

FeXL said:


> So, here were are, back on the Chinese Coronavirus thread.
> 
> Has anyone else been monitoring the latest fear-porn? The extremely RAYCISS!!! Greek alphabet "Delta" variant? With symptoms "nearly identical" to common colds & hay fever? Can you see where this is going?
> 
> At any rate, apparently it kills greater than 3 times more "vaccinated" people than non-"vaccinated" people. Anybody here on ehMac know any fools stupid enough to get "vaccinated"?
> 
> *Newest COVID Lie: Fear Delta Variant and Get Vaccinated*


No fears. If they just take that third or fourth jab they'll be just fine, and of course the Gatesosauros will get even richer.

'Course if they happen to die of internal bleeding, myocarditis, or blood clots on the brain, the fact checkers tell us the jabs could not possibly have been the cause. Otherwise they would have been obliged to tell of the risk before giving the jab.


----------



## FeXL

For the next installment on the Chinese Coronavirus thread:

*The Iron Law of Woke Projection*



> If they’re accusing you of something it’s usually something that they themselves are doing.
> 
> There’s a lot of stories like this floating around right now* ‘Variant factory’: The unvaccinated pose a risk to more than just themselves*, designed to bully, scare, shame and guilt people into doing something they may not want to do.
> 
> Geert Vanden Bossche Has a thing or two to say about this claim.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> non-vaccinated people are not to be considered factories of variants as there is no evidence whatsoever that they transmit more virus or shed for a longer time than asymptomatically infected vaccinees. As explained in the above-mentioned article, non-vaccinated people are not responsible for selecting immune escape variants and enabling adaptation of increasingly anti-S Ab-resistant variants. *Vaccines, however, are to be seen as the breeding ground and ‘pilot plants’ for these variants.*
Click to expand...



Bold mine.

So, for those of you who gleefully claim to be "doing your thing" by getting "vaccinated", you are actually the ones responsible for the new variants.

Congratulations.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> For the next installment on the Chinese Coronavirus thread:
> 
> *The Iron Law of Woke Projection*
> 
> 
> 
> Bold mine.
> 
> So, for those of you who gleefully claim to be "doing your thing" by getting "vaccinated", you are actually the ones responsible for the new variants.
> 
> Congratulations.


Sense. You make no. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## FeXL

Read the linked articles, Freddie. If that doesn't work, consider yourself beyond help.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Sense. You make no.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Read the linked articles, Freddie. If that doesn't work, consider yourself beyond help.


Have you been vaccinated? Are you planning to be? Scared of a little needle?


----------



## eMacMan

Still can't figure out why anyone would take a jab:
That has an absolute risk reduction of about 1%
That does not prevent you from getting or transmitting the virus.
That skipped animal, medium and long term testing.
That involves altering your genetic make-up.
That is still considered very much an experimental technique.
That has killed as many as 25% of the recipients in several Long Term Care centers.

But if that's your thing you go right ahead. You might remember that Gates and Soros are primary movers of the vaccine campaign, that both consider it highly desirable to reduce planetary population by about 90%. That the most likely way to accomplish that population reduction goal would almost certainly involve a mass vaccination campaign.

No one in our small community has died of Covid. Pretty easy to document at least 20 people who have died within less than a month of receiving one of their two jabs. If you like those odds by all means please take the jabs.


----------



## FeXL

Dodge harder, Freddie.

No. Not a chance. And, no. I had more needles before I turned 10 than you have all your life.

And just as a side point, it's _not_ a vaccination...



Freddie_Biff said:


> Have you been vaccinated? Are you planning to be? Scared of a little needle?


----------



## Macfury

People on EhMac were bragging about their vaccination selfies...



eMacMan said:


> Still can't figure out why anyone would take a jab:


----------



## smashedbanana

eMacMan said:


> Still can't figure out why anyone would take a jab:
> That has an absolute risk reduction of about 1%
> That does not prevent you from getting or transmitting the virus.
> That skipped animal, medium and long term testing.
> That involves altering your genetic make-up.
> That is still considered very much an experimental technique.
> That has killed as many as 25% of the recipients in several Long Term Care centers.
> 
> But if that's your thing you go right ahead. You might remember that Gates and Soros are primary movers of the vaccine campaign, that both consider it highly desirable to reduce planetary population by about 90%. That the most likely way to accomplish that population reduction goal would almost certainly involve a mass vaccination campaign.
> 
> No one in our small community has died of Covid. Pretty easy to document at least 20 people who have died within less than a month of receiving one of their two jabs. If you like those odds by all means please take the jabs.


Sad state to read this.

You don't want to be vaccinated that's fine. It's your right.

But don't pretend some sort of science behind it.

I know several people who have/had covid. 1 was in a coma. 

The world needs to move on, 78% of adults over 18 have had 1st shot in Ontario.

As if the universe is listening there is a real world tragic story about lack of access to vaccines. Mass graves dug up at residential schools. Government too cheap to vaccinate against TB. We need to learn from our history not repeat it.


----------



## Macfury

Historical perspective.

Death rate for tuberculosis is 66% across the board. Death rate in Canada for COVID-19 is 1.8%. COVID injections are reported to be 95% effective at best. Tuberculosis vaccines 51% effective at best. Their histories are not really comparable and people will most certainly calculate a different risk-benefit analysis for prevention of each disease.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Historical perspective.
> 
> Death rate for tuberculosis is 66% across the board. Death rate in Canada for COVID-19 is 1.8%. COVID injections are reported to be 95% effective at best. Tuberculosis vaccines 51% effective at best. Their histories are not really comparable and people will most certainly calculate a different risk-benefit analysis for prevention of each disease.


95% efficacy simply means that 95% of the jabbed test subjects who got Covid had slightly less severe symptoms than those who got Covid but were not jabbed. The Absolute Risk Reduction, is about 1%. That is 1% fewer of the genetically modified subjects developed severe Covid symptoms, when compared to the non genetically modified control group.

I have talked to 2 individuals who lost loved ones within a month of the second jab. Both are 100% convinced the jab was partly or entirely responsible for the death, as symptoms developed quickly after that jab and kept getting worse. Both cases were labeled natural deaths. One was in his mid seventies and in excellent health prior to the jab. The other in her 90s with Alzheimers but otherwise still sound.

Since this is still very much an experimental (non)vaccine, sound scientific protocol would demand that the jab at least be listed as a possible contributing factor to those deaths, as well as another 20 or so that have occurred locally within a month of the second jab.

Keep in mind that had these same individuals tested positive for Covid and died of any cause up to and including end-stage cancer, the deaths would have been labeled Covid.


----------



## eMacMan

smashedbanana said:


> Sad state to read this.
> 
> You don't want to be vaccinated that's fine. It's your right.
> 
> But don't pretend some sort of science behind it.


Science is observation. I have observed far more people who have died from or suffered serious ill effects from the jab, than from Covid. I base my decision on those direct observations. As I say locally at least 20 possible jab deaths as opposed to zero Covid deaths and one recovered Covid coma case.

You are free to believe that the jab protects you. After all there has been a 24/7, 16 month long fear based propaganda campaign to convince you that is so. Seems to me if it were true there would have been no need for the fear style propaganda campaign. The question you should ask yourself is why are they so anxious that you be jabbed? Given the approach being taken to force that, it is very unlikely the motives are benevolent.


----------



## eMacMan

So an interesting example of deceptive government weasel wording. Note it says approved vaccines. The mRNA vaccines still have not done the animal trials or any medium or long term human trials and are therefore no where close to having cleared all of the hurdles. In fact those longer term trials have been compromised by vaccinating the control groups.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

smashedbanana said:


> Sad state to read this.
> 
> You don't want to be vaccinated that's fine. It's your right.
> 
> But don't pretend some sort of science behind it.
> 
> I know several people who have/had covid. 1 was in a coma.
> 
> The world needs to move on, 78% of adults over 18 have had 1st shot in Ontario.
> 
> As if the universe is listening there is a real world tragic story about lack of access to vaccines. Mass graves dug up at residential schools. Government too cheap to vaccinate against TB. We need to learn from our history not repeat it.


Deniers gonna deny. And so many of them appear to be conservatives sadly.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> Science is observation. I have observed far more people who have died from or suffered serious ill effects from the jab, than from Covid. I base my decision on those direct observations. As I say locally at least 20 possible jab deaths as opposed to zero Covid deaths and one recovered Covid coma case.
> 
> You are free to believe that the jab protects you. After all there has been a 24/7, 16 month long fear based propaganda campaign to convince you that is so. Seems to me if it were true there would have been no need for the fear style propaganda campaign. The question you should ask yourself is why are they so anxious that you be jabbed? Given the approach being taken to force that, it is very unlikely the motives are benevolent.


Do you even know what herd immunity means? You don’t reach it by not vaccinating the population, unless you think you’ll build up enough immunity by having everyone get the disease. Honestly, your perspective is so unscientific but you have convinced yourself that conspiracy theory is preferable to reality.


----------



## Macfury

The science says that the four jabs available in Canada can not stop you from spreading or being infected by the coronavirus--you still need to wear a mask, for example. If the jab does not confer individual immunity, how can mass injections create herd immunity? 



Freddie_Biff said:


> Do you even know what herd immunity means? You don’t reach it by not vaccinating the population, unless you think you’ll build up enough immunity by having everyone get the disease. Honestly, your perspective is so unscientific but you have convinced yourself that conspiracy theory is preferable to reality.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> The science says that the four jabs available in Canada can not stop you from spreading or being infected by the coronavirus--you still need to wear a mask, for example. If the jab does not confer individual immunity, how can mass injections create herd immunity?


I don’t what the rules are where you’re living, but they lifted almost all restrictions including masks here in Alberta on July 1. They are optional almost everywhere. Why? Because we’re hitting out vaccination targets. And yes, it IS a vaccine, even if it’s classified as experimental. It is strange that you would rather risk dying from Covid than getting a tiny needle in your arm, but hey, you do you.


----------



## Macfury

I never mentioned whether or not I had received any of the drugs.

But I ask you again, if the four COVID drugs don't prevent you from transmitting the disease, how do they create herd immunity?




Freddie_Biff said:


> I don’t what the rules are where you’re living, but they lifted almost all restrictions including masks here in Alberta on July 1. They are optional almost everywhere. Why? Because we’re hitting out vaccination targets. And yes, it IS a vaccine, even if it’s classified as experimental. It is strange that you would rather risk dying from Covid than getting a tiny needle in your arm, but hey, you do you.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I never mentioned whether or not I had received any of the drugs.
> 
> But I ask you again, if the four COVID drugs don't prevent you from transmitting the disease, how do they create herd immunity?


If the chances of getting severely ill or dying from an illness are significantly decreased, that’s also considered a win. The more people who are in that position, the less the chance of the virus spreading and doing damage. It’s not that tough of a concept. The vaccines we have available are not perfect, but they’re far better than doing nothing, eMacMan’s objections notwithstanding. 

So tell me, which jab did you get if you got the jab? I had two of Pfizer with no side effects apart from a sore shoulder the next day.


----------



## Macfury

Earlier you said that "the science" said it would provide herd immunity. Now you're saying it only lessens the symptoms. Why not make that claim in the first place, instead of herd immunity?


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> I don’t what the rules are where you’re living, but they lifted almost all restrictions including masks here in Alberta on July 1. They are optional almost everywhere. Why? Because we’re hitting out vaccination targets. And yes, it IS a vaccine, even if it’s classified as experimental. It is strange that you would rather risk dying from Covid than getting a tiny needle in your arm, but hey, you do you.


Uh no. It's the end of cold and flu season. On July 7, 2020 the 7 day Canadian average of Covid deaths was 18 deaths/day and dropping rapidly. July, 2021 despite vaccines and all, that 7 day average is 15.4 deaths/day and dropping somewhat more slowly. Given that a sizeable portion of the population has been exposed and therefore has natural immunity, I would argue the vaccines have made absolutely no difference whatsoever.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> Uh no. It's the end of cold and flu season. On July 7, 2020 the 7 day Canadian average of Covid deaths was 18 deaths/day and dropping rapidly. July, 2021 despite vaccines and all, that 7 day average is 15.4 deaths/day and dropping somewhat more slowly. Given that a sizeable portion of the population has been exposed and therefore has natural immunity, I would argue the vaccines have made absolutely no difference whatsoever.


Of course you would. That’s why you’re a conspiracy theorist. You believe what you want to believe no matter what the science says. Good luck with that.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Earlier you said that "the science" said it would provide herd immunity. Now you're saying it only lessens the symptoms. Why not make that claim in the first place, instead of herd immunity?


You’re looking for some kind of no-exceptions guarantee. Man, nature doesn’t work that way. Yes, herd immunity makes a huge difference in the transmissibility of the disease, but it’s not a guarantee. Never has been. And most of the cases now are ami g the unvaccinated. You really ought to do a little reading before you beak off.

So again, which jab did you get? I noticed you’re evading the question.


----------



## Macfury

Nature _does _work that way. Herd immunity has a definition, but it is not a claim made by the various COVID-19 medications. They offer a reduction in symptoms over the short term.


----------



## smashedbanana

eMacMan said:


> Science is observation. I have observed far more people who have died from or suffered serious ill effects from the jab, than from Covid. I base my decision on those direct observations. As I say locally at least 20 possible jab deaths as opposed to zero Covid deaths and one recovered Covid coma case.
> 
> You are free to believe that the jab protects you. After all there has been a 24/7, 16 month long fear based propaganda campaign to convince you that is so. Seems to me if it were true there would have been no need for the fear style propaganda campaign. The question you should ask yourself is why are they so anxious that you be jabbed? Given the approach being taken to force that, it is very unlikely the motives are benevolent.


Science is for sure about observation. Repeated observation. 

Saying I'm excited to get the jab is a stretch on your part. 
It's a necessary step. That's it that's all.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Nature _does _work that way. Herd immunity has a definition, but it is not a claim made by the various COVID-19 medications. They offer a reduction in symptoms over the short term.


So again—which jab did you get? Or are you afraid to share that information because your buddies here will think less of you?


----------



## Macfury

I never share personal medical information in an open forum... least of all because some guy is daring me to.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I never share personal medical information in an open forum... least of all because some guy is daring me to.


More like because you’re a coward. Either you got jabbed or you didn’t. Sounds like you did to cover your ass but you don’t want the homeboys like FeXL and eMacMan to know. Pathetic that you won’t even stand by your convictions.


----------



## Macfury

Stop torturing me, Freddie!


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> More like because you’re a coward. Either you got jabbed or you didn’t. Sounds like you did to cover your ass but you don’t want the homeboys like FeXL and eMacMan to know. Pathetic that you won’t even stand by your convictions.


Don't you just love it when the civil posting advocates trot out this sort of BS. Hypocrisy thy handle is Freddie Biff.

Neither FeXL or I give a rat's ass whether you, Macfury or anyone else voluntarily (or otherwise) took the needle. Nor should we and nor should you.

NOTE: Normally I don't try to speak for others, but I am reasonably sure FeXL will agree with me on this one, though he would probably be understandably less polite in how he words it. If I am out of line I am sure he will let me know.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> Don't you just love it when the civil posting advocates trot out this sort of BS.


Remember when the wokesters were crying that they were being harrassed by people asking questions about their posts?


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Remember when the wokesters were crying that they were being harrassed by people asking questions about their posts?


Indeed I do! Still if Bill C-36 passes you'll be able to take Freddie for everything he has.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Seeing as this is a thread about the Coronavirus, discussion of vaccination status would seem to be relevant. If you are afraid to talk about your status, that’s entirely your decision. I am among the more than 50% of the Canadian population who has been double-vaxxed and happy to know I am part of the solution rather than providing a place for the variants to incubate. But hey, you do you.


----------



## Macfury

Did the pharmaceutical company providing your drug say you could no longer spread COVID-19? The drugs promise to reduce severe symptoms.



Freddie_Biff said:


> I am among the more than 50% of the Canadian population who has been double-vaxxed and happy to know I am part of the solution rather than providing a place for the variants to incubate. But hey, you do you.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Did the pharmaceutical company providing your drug say you could no longer spread COVID-19? The drugs promise to reduce severe symptoms.


I don’t know. What did yours say?


----------



## Macfury

I'm not surprised that you don't know.



Freddie_Biff said:


> I don’t know. What did yours say?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I'm not surprised that you don't know.


I’m not surprised that you didn’t answer the question.


----------



## Macfury

Since I already told you I would not discuss medical information here, it doesn't take a genius to predict that!



Freddie_Biff said:


> I’m not surprised that you didn’t answer the question.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Since I already told you I would not discuss medical information here, it doesn't take a genius to predict that!


I’m not sure why saying whether or not you were vaccinated qualifies as private medical information. You’re afraid the homeboys are gonna disrespect you if you’ve been vaxxed. An interesting situation you find yourself in. Everyone in my family’s been vaxxed. Twice. And I’m certainly not afraid to admit it. 

I can barely feel the tiny cameras in my bloodstream, and my 5G reception is better than ever. I am a little concerned by what feels like a third eye growing in my forehead however.


----------



## Macfury

People of a certain ilk are very proud of their injections.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> People of a certain ilk are very proud of their injections.


It must be the kool-aid. Either that or brain damage from oxygen starvation.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Deniers gonna deny. Conspiracy theorists gonna conspire.


----------



## smashedbanana

eMacMan said:


> e the kool-aid. Either that or brain damag


If you don't want to share any information about yourself. Medical or other that's your right.

If someone chooses to share something like vaccination info that's equally their right.

There are benefits to just simple societal engagement that maybe you don't see or care about. 
Many things that were private simply are not viewed that way by everyone anymore. 
Especially as time has passed.

Absolutely nothing to do with kool-aid or IQ.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

smashedbanana said:


> If you don't want to share any information about yourself. Medical or other that's your right.
> 
> If someone chooses to share something like vaccination info that's equally their right.
> 
> There are benefits to just simple societal engagement that maybe you don't see or care about.
> Many things that were private simply are not viewed that way by everyone anymore.
> Especially as time has passed.
> 
> Absolutely nothing to do with kool-aid or IQ.


Kudos for trying, but you’re not likely to engage these two in a meaningful conversation. Meanwhile, almost all new CoVid cases are appearing in unvaccinated people. Who’d’ve thought?


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> There are benefits to just simple societal engagement that maybe you don't see or care about.
> Many things that were private simply are not viewed that way by everyone anymore.
> Especially as time has passed.
> 
> Absolutely nothing to do with kool-aid or IQ.


Yes, I see those benefits as so minor that they don't outweigh my desire for privacy. In a civil society, simply stating one doesn't wish to share should be more than enough to avoid being harangued.


----------



## Macfury

Almost all. That's what I would have expected.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Meanwhile, almost all new CoVid cases are appearing in unvaccinated people. Who’d’ve thought?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Almost all. That's what I would have expected.


So how does this help your case against vaccinations?


----------



## Macfury

I'm not against them. Based on their statements, I believe many people don't understand what the medications actually claim to offer.



Freddie_Biff said:


> So how does this help your case against vaccinations?


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> I’m not sure why saying whether or not you were vaccinated qualifies as private medical information. You’re afraid the homeboys are gonna disrespect you if you’ve been vaxxed. An interesting situation you find yourself in. Everyone in my family’s been vaxxed. Twice. And I’m certainly not afraid to admit it.
> 
> I can barely feel the tiny cameras in my bloodstream, and my 5G reception is better than ever. I am a little concerned by what feels like a third eye growing in my forehead however.


Hey Freddie there's a name for that. They've even got a T-shirt about you. Toss your mailing address out and I'll see what I can do about sending you one of these, on my dime.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> Hey Freddie there's a name for that. They've even got a T-shirt about you. Toss your mailing address out and I'll see what I can do about sending you one of these, on my dime.
> View attachment 94013


Funny! But people who don’t get it aren’t evil—just cowards. Have a great day!


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> Funny! But people who don’t get it aren’t evil—just cowards. Have a great day!


Freddie the doctors who stand up and tell the truth are having their licenses removed without a hearing. They aren't cowards, they are incredibly brave!.

Meanwhile a story of just a tiny bit of collateral damage that actually made the lame stream news. These type of deaths may not count in the minds of the kool-aid krowd, but thinking individuals can see how tragically avoidable they really are.








Halifax family calling for change after 19-year-old’s sudden death from meningitis - Halifax | Globalnews.ca


Kai's family has launched a platform called BforKai.org to help educate people about meningitis B and increase vaccination rates.




globalnews.ca





Edit: Despite what the lamestream article says, in a much longer interview with Trisha Woods the father said his son had had both Meningitis jabs.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> Freddie the doctors who stand up and tell the truth are having their licenses removed without a hearing. They aren't cowards, they are incredibly brave!.
> 
> Meanwhile a story of just a tiny bit of collateral damage that actually made the lame stream news. These type of deaths may not count in the minds of the kool-aid krowd, but thinking individuals can see how tragically avoidable they really are.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Halifax family calling for change after 19-year-old’s sudden death from meningitis - Halifax | Globalnews.ca
> 
> 
> Kai's family has launched a platform called BforKai.org to help educate people about meningitis B and increase vaccination rates.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> globalnews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Despite what the lamestream article says, in a much longer interview with Trisha Woods the father said his son had had both Meningitis jabs.


Meningitis is a very rapid disease that kills quickly. Kai’s death is a tragedy and seems to point to negligence on the part of the hospital that he went to. But this is only tangentially related to CoVid. Why do you think the story is relevant?


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> Meningitis is a very rapid disease that kills quickly. Kai’s death is a tragedy and seems to point to negligence on the part of the hospital that he went to. But this is only tangentially related to CoVid. Why do you think the story is relevant?


Because the medical staff was so fixated on the possibility of Covid that they failed to properly evaluate him, not once but numerous times. That gross panicdemic fed negligence was directly responsible for the failure to treat him in a timely manor. Bet the farm he is not only one. Ask yourself why on earth was there not a way to admit or examine him regardless of Covid status?

Similarly as of today Ontario listed almost 50 Covid patients in intensive care who test negative for covid. About half of them are on ventilators. Wanna bet that a lot of those are suffering from bacterial pneumonia and are not being given antibiotics because they have been falsely diagnosed as having Covid. Does make one suspect that the intent is to kill as many as possible.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> Because the medical staff was so fixated on the possibility of Covid that they failed to properly evaluate him, not once but numerous times. That gross panicdemic fed negligence was directly responsible for the failure to treat him in a timely manor. Bet the farm he is not only one. Ask yourself why on earth was there not a way to admit or examine him regardless of Covid status?
> 
> Similarly as of today Ontario listed almost 50 Covid patients in intensive care who test negative for covid. About half of them are on ventilators. Wanna bet that a lot of those are suffering from bacterial pneumonia and are not being given antibiotics because they have been falsely diagnosed as having Covid. Does make one suspect that the intent is to kill as many as possible.


Well that’s a bit of a reach. I don’t think any hospitals or health care workers are seeking to harm patients. Yes, CoVid has been getting most of the headlines, understandably so, but they are still attending to other patients the best they can. One thing that would help is if everyone got vaccinated so that we could make CoVid a minor thing than a major thing. But I understand this strategy conflicts with your world view.


----------



## eMacMan

More of those unimportant collateral damage deaths that the kool-aid krew refuses to even acknowledge. Worse this comes from the very essence of lamestream media, the AP.
[QUOTE unfurl="true"]
NEW YORK (AP) — Overdose deaths soared to a record 93,000 last year in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic, the U.S. government reported Wednesday.
That estimate far eclipses the high of about 72,000 drug overdose deaths reached the previous year and amounts to a 29% increase.
“This is a staggering loss of human life,” said Brandon Marshall, a Brown University public health researcher who tracks overdose trends.

The nation was already struggling with its worst overdose epidemic but clearly "COVID has greatly exacerbated the crisis,” he added.
Lockdowns and other pandemic restrictions isolated those with drug addictions and made treatment harder to get, experts said.
[/QUOTE]


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> More of those unimportant collateral damage deaths that the kool-aid krew refuses to even acknowledge. Worse this comes from the very essence of lamestream media, the AP.
> [QUOTE unfurl="true"]
> NEW YORK (AP) — Overdose deaths soared to a record 93,000 last year in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic, the U.S. government reported Wednesday.
> That estimate far eclipses the high of about 72,000 drug overdose deaths reached the previous year and amounts to a 29% increase.
> “This is a staggering loss of human life,” said Brandon Marshall, a Brown University public health researcher who tracks overdose trends.
> 
> The nation was already struggling with its worst overdose epidemic but clearly "COVID has greatly exacerbated the crisis,” he added.
> Lockdowns and other pandemic restrictions isolated those with drug addictions and made treatment harder to get, experts said.


[/QUOTE]

You realize of course that 99% of CoVid cases are now occurring in the unvaccinated population. Some might call it “thinning the herd.”


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> You realize of course that 99% of CoVid cases are now occurring in the unvaccinated population. Some might call it “thinning the herd.”


Sounds bogus to me. Just did a fairly complete search of the Canadian Epidemiological summary and found no such breakdown. Nor did I find that breakdown in either the Alberta or Ontario sites.

I also know that 99% of those who test positive for Covid recover completely in a period of time comparable to flu infection. Beyond that I know that around 80% of the population has natural immunity.

More interesting is the growing list of adverse reactions to the (not a)vaccine. These are just the ones that are more or less permanently debilitating and most of them are really nasty.


----------



## eMacMan

You realize of course that 99% of CoVid cases are now occurring in the unvaccinated population. Some might call it “thinning the herd.”
[/QUOTE]
Certainly explains the drum pounding about the Delta Variant (politically corrected from the Indian Variant). Seems that the vaccinated are twice as likely to die from that one than the unvaccinated.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> You realize of course that 99% of CoVid cases are now occurring in the unvaccinated population. Some might call it “thinning the herd.”
> 
> Certainly explains the drum pounding about the Delta Variant (politically corrected from the Indian Variant). Seems that the vaccinated are twice as likely to die from that one than the unvaccinated.


Cite?


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> Seems that the vaccinated are twice as likely to die from that one than the unvaccinated.


The number is oddly derived. Maybe they're counting totals, rather than likelihood. But I see that Israel is already considering a third jab because their heavily vaccinated population is reporting susceptibility to Delta.


----------



## FeXL

For my next installment on the Chinese Corornavirus thread...

Caution: Link to the Grunion inside.

*Today in Corona-stan*



> Interesting article in The Guardian regarding seasonality and epidemic equilibrium. Berenson is of the opinion that the vaccines work for 3-4 months . And…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Something really odd is going on: In Europe we are seeing surges at many places where most of the population has already been vaccinated. At the same time, the 15 least vaccinated countries don‘t seem to face any problem.* (long twitter thread, follow it down)
Click to expand...



Bold mine.

Huh.

Anybody know anyone foolish enough to get a Chinese Coronavirus jab?


----------



## FeXL

No, it's _not_ a vaccine.

In layman terms (which even you should be able to comprehend, Freddie) a vaccine contains a portion of the microorganism (either killed or reduced in strength) which is then injected into your shoulder, where it stays. The presence of the microorganism stimulates your body to produce an immune response against it.

With the mRNA jabs, 1) there is none, zero, of the Chinese coronavirus in the injection because the key ingredient hasn't been isolated in the lab yet, and 2) after receiving the jab studies have shown mRNA has been found throughout the body, including testes and ovaries. 

This in itself should cause concern for any sentient human being, especially those prior to or just getting into child-bearing age. There is zero medium to long-term data on the side effects of these jabs and anyone who receives one is taking a gamble.



Freddie_Biff said:


> And yes, it IS a vaccine, even if it’s classified as experimental.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> No, it's _not_ a vaccine.
> 
> In layman terms (which even you should be able to comprehend, Freddie) a vaccine contains a portion of the microorganism (either killed or reduced in strength) which is then injected into your shoulder, where it stays. The presence of the microorganism stimulates your body to produce an immune response against it.
> 
> With the mRNA jabs, 1) there is none, zero, of the Chinese coronavirus in the injection because the key ingredient hasn't been isolated in the lab yet, and 2) after receiving the jab studies have shown mRNA has been found throughout the body, including testes and ovaries.
> 
> This in itself should cause concern for any sentient human being, especially those prior to or just getting into child-bearing age. There is zero medium to long-term data on the side effects of these jabs and anyone who receives one is taking a gamble.


Hey FeXL! Good to hear from you again. I was wondering where you’d gone. Like most people, I choose to take my chances with the “experimental” (and approved) vaccine than with the virus itself. Hope your immune system is strong enough to withstand it.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> Certainly explains the drum pounding about the Delta Variant (politically corrected from the Indian Variant). Seems that the vaccinated are twice as likely to die from that one than the unvaccinated.


Again, cite?


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> Again, cite?


Interesting nothing cited in your claim that 99% of new cases are unvaccinated, so you deflect by asking others to cite. Feel free to lead by example.

BTW Freddie, the not-a-vaccine is several years away from approval. A key missing component of that approval is animal trials which were bypassed altogether as previous SARS_1 mRNA animal trials had to be discontinued due to way too many subject deaths. The only reason it can be used is under a declared state of emergency. Furthermore the only reason it is being called a vaccine is that label allows the manufacturers to completely dodge liability for any harm it does. So far in the first month of use those so-called vaccines caused more deaths in just the UK, than Ivermectin has caused in 40 years of use throughout the world.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Again, emacman, where did you get your idea that the vaccinated are twice as likely to die from the Delta variant as the unvaccinated? Or do you not have a source? Did you just pull this one out of your ass?

The 99% stat was for deaths, not cases. My apologies. At least I HAVE a source. 



> 99% of COVID-19 deaths in U.S. involve unvaccinated people, Fauci says


 https://www.google.ca/amp/s/globalnews.ca/news/8001754/u-s-covid-deaths-unvaccinated-people/amp/


----------



## Macfury

Fauci says?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Fauci says?


Much more reliable than Macfury says.


----------



## Macfury

Fauci is the guy who told everybody in February 2020 that COVID would be a nothing-burger and advised people to make good on their cruise ship bookings.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Fauci is the guy who told everybody in February 2020 that COVID would be a nothing-burger and advised people to make good on their cruise ship bookings.


He was also pimping Remdezevir as the only possible treatment. When Rem was evaluated along with 8 other treatments around the world, it was the only one which proved more fatal than standard medical procedure.

Further from that study: The HCQ protocol was quite effective if used at the first sign of symptoms, less so for advanced cases. The Suramin protocol was extremely effective at all stages, with the Budesidone protocol was a close second. All of these protocols recognize that pneumonia is a secondary infection and include antibiotics in case the pneumonia is bacterial instead of viral. Sadly as of last October, standard medical practice has been altered to label all pneumonia cases as Covid, even if they test negative. Standard medical practice for Covid withholds antibiotics on the assumption that the infection is viral. IOW people are needlessly dying from bacterial pneumonia and their deaths are being labeled as Covid. They are also dying needlessly because effective treatments are being deliberately withheld. Great for inflating the death toll and the fear factor. A real sinister thing to do if you value lives or truth.

BTW Ivermectin was not tested but is similar enough to Suramin that the results should be similar.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> He was also pimping Remdezevir as the only possible treatment. When Rem was evaluated along with 8 other treatments around the world, it was the only one which proved more fatal than standard medical procedure.
> 
> Further from that study: The HCQ protocol was quite effective if used at the first sign of symptoms, less so for advanced cases. The Suramin protocol was extremely effective at all stages, with the Budesidone protocol was a close second. All of these protocols recognize that pneumonia is a secondary infection and include antibiotics in case the pneumonia is bacterial instead of viral. Sadly as of last October, standard medical practice has been altered to label all pneumonia cases as Covid, even if they test negative. Standard medical practice for Covid withholds antibiotics on the assumption that the infection is viral. IOW people are needlessly dying from bacterial pneumonia and their deaths are being labeled as Covid. They are also dying needlessly because effective treatments are being deliberately withheld. Great for inflating the death toll and the fear factor. A real sinister thing to do if you value lives or truth.
> 
> BTW Ivermectin was not tested but is similar enough to Suramin that the results should be similar.


Again, eMacMan, got a citation for your contention that the delta variant is twice as deadly in vaccinated people? It’s been like a couple days now. You seem to be avoiding the question.


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> Again, eMacMan, got a citation for your contention that the delta variant is twice as deadly in vaccinated people? It’s been like a couple days now. You seem to be avoiding the question.


I posted it right after your citation about 99% of current cases are unvaccinated. As I said earlier feel free to lead by example.

BTW got a handout from Alberta health this week. Turns out the vaccines are so effective that you still need to wear masks, stay 2 meters apart and avoid gatherings. If Freddie logic is on a par with his math skills that probably actually makes sense to him.


----------



## FeXL

I was out on the coast doing my part to contribute to a super-spreader event. You know, herd immunity and all.

Curious how many kool-aid drinking idiots in Vancouver still wearing a mask, outside, in the hot sun...



Freddie_Biff said:


> I was wondering where you’d gone.


That & the Ivermectin I have in safe-keeping.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Hope your immune system is strong enough to withstand it.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> I posted it right after your citation about 99% of current cases are unvaccinated. As I said earlier feel free to lead by example.
> 
> BTW got a handout from Alberta health this week. Turns out the vaccines are so effective that you still need to wear masks, stay 2 meters apart and avoid gatherings. If Freddie logic is on a par with his math skills that probably actually makes sense to him.


You’re an idiot. Restrictions are lifted for almost everything but medical facilities in Alberta. I’d ask you again for the source of your information but I know that makes you uncomfortable. In the meantime, feel free to reread the link I posted from Dr. Fauci about how nearly all deaths are now among the unvaccinated population. Good luck with your conspiracy theories.

And no, you still haven’t provided a source for your previous allegation.


----------



## Macfury

Flip-flop Fauci is some sort of authority?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Flip-flop Fauci is some sort of authority?


More than you are, Peter.


----------



## Macfury

This is your gold standard of proof? He's more of an authority than eMacMan, therefore he must be right.


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> You’re an idiot. Restrictions are lifted for almost everything but medical facilities in Alberta. I’d ask you again for the source of your information but I know that makes you uncomfortable. In the meantime, feel free to reread the link I posted from Dr. Fauci about how nearly all deaths are now among the unvaccinated population. Good luck with your conspiracy theories.
> 
> And no, you still haven’t provided a source for your previous allegation.


Just telling you what last weeks mailing from the Alberta government said. Don't like it? take that up with Diabolical Deena!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

> Mask use in public indoor settings is no longer required except for some specific situations:
> working in or visiting any continuing care facility, as well as any facility operated by AHS, Covenant or their contracted service providers
> using public transit, including ride share vehicles, taxis, motor coaches and shuttles
> Note: Municipalities and businesses are free to set masking requirements as they see fit. For example, businesses may require staff and/or customers to wear masks inside their place of business.
> While masking is no longer required in most situations, it is important to support those who may wish to continue wearing masks while adjusting to Stage 3.
> Learn more about masking, including how to wear and care for your mask.
> 
> Lifted restrictions
> All other public health measures have been lifted. This includes all restrictions on:
> social gatherings – there are no longer capacity limits on either indoor or outdoor gatherings
> recreation, performance and entertainment activities
> business closures and capacity restrictions
> large events, including concerts, sporting events, exhibitions and festivals


This is from the Alberta government website 30 seconds ago. Where did you say your information was from? 

 https://www.alberta.ca/covid-19-pu...MIioeElY_r8QIVExvnCh16lwT8EAAYASAAEgJj9_D_BwE

Criticize my math all you want, but you’ve got some pretty obvious problems with basic comprehension.


----------



## FeXL

I'm not taking this as gospel, nor am I disregarding it as bunk. It's merely one more piece of information. Do with it what you will.

*Canadian Doctor: 62% of Patients Vaccinated for COVID Have Permanent Heart Damage*



> We have previously covered the story of Dr. Charles Hoffe, the brave doctor who has been practicing medicine for 28 years in the small, rural town of Lytton in British Columbia, Canada.
> 
> After he had administered about 900 doses of the Moderna experimental mRNA COVID-19 injections, he sounded the alarm over the severe reactions he was observing in his patients who chose to get the shot (he chose NOT to get it himself), which included death.
> 
> The result of him sounding the alarm was a gag order issued against him by the medical authorities in his community. He defied this gag order and was interviewed by Laura-Lynn Tyler Thompson on her show where he sounded the alarm.




Further:




> In this latest interview, Dr. Hoffe states that the blood clots that are being reported in the corporate media as being “rare” are anything but rare, based on his own testing of his own patients who had recently received one of the shots.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _The blood clots we hear about which the media claim are very rare are the big blood clots which are the ones that cause strokes and show up on CT scans, MRI, etc. The clots I’m talking about are microscopic and too small to find on any scan. They can thus only be detected using the D-dimer test._
> 
> 
> 
> Using this test with his own patients, Dr. Hoffe claims that he has found evidence of small blood clots in 62% of his patients who have been injected with an mRNA shot.
> 
> He states that these people are now permanently disabled, and they will no longer “be able to do what they used to do.”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _These people have no idea they are even having these microscopic blood clots. The most alarming part of this is that there are some parts of the body like the brain, spinal cord, heart and lungs which cannot re-generate. When those tissues are damaged by blood clots they are permanently damaged._
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> His warning is very dire: “These shots are causing huge damage and the worst is yet to come.”
Click to expand...


----------



## FeXL

Ya think?! 

*WHO Chief: It Was ‘Premature’ to Rule Out Lab-Leak Theory; ‘Lab Accidents Happen. It’s Common’*




> More than three months after the World Health Organization released a report that controversially all but ruled out the likelihood the coronavirus could have leaked from a Wuhan lab, WHO Director-General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said Thursday that conclusion was “premature” and reiterated calls for China to provide more data.


----------



## FeXL

'Parently Fausti could use a little history lesson...

*Dr. Fauci Embarrasses Himself While Trying to Mock Fox News*



> On Saturday, Dr. Anthony Fauci told CNN’s Jim Acosta that if the smallpox vaccine and the polio vaccine faced the kind of “misinformation” directed at the COVID-19 vaccine, both diseases would still be a problem in the United States today. Yet a recent MIT study found that vaccine hesitancy is “highly informed, scientifically literate,” and “sophisticated,” and both the smallpox vaccine and the polio vaccine faced steep hurdles and opposition.
> 
> Fauci made his historically illiterate remark after Acosta condemned Fox News’ Tucker Carlson.




More:



> Both Acosta and Fauci intended to smear Fox News and conservatives as anti-science, but Fauci exposed himself as woefully historically ignorant. Vaccine hesitancy traces back centuries, and if people organized to oppose smallpox vaccines and polio vaccines when those vaccines took decades — and in the case of smallpox, arguably centuries — to develop, it seems extremely reasonable that there will be some mild hesitancy about the COVID-19 vaccines, which were developed in less than a year.


Oh, and a quick quote from that MIT study noted above:



> But a study done at MIT showed that *a substantial portion of public-health skepticism was highly informed, scientifically literate, and sophisticated in the use of data*. Skeptics used the same data sets as those with the orthodox views on public health.


Bold mine.

Shocka...


----------



## FeXL

*Sacrificing the Young*



> After sacrificing the old and the vulnerable.
> 
> Lets not let the headline fool us, they did it on purpose. _Gambling that they could save more lives in one column on the spreadsheet than they’d lose in another._ They lost that bet.
> 
> More young Canadians died from ‘unintentional side effects’ of the pandemic, not COVID
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The latest data from Statistics Canada, released Monday, is titled “Provisional death counts and excess mortality, January 2020 to April 2021,” and found there were 5,535 deaths in those younger than 65 years of age.
> There were 1,380 COVID-related deaths for that same age group, according to StatCan.
> *That’s more than four times the amount of deaths.*
> The report from the Canadian Vital Statistics Death Database suggests that “the excess mortality is, in large part, related to other factors such as increases in the number deaths attributed to causes associated with substance use and misuse, including unintentional (accidental) poisonings and diseases and conditions related to alcohol consumption.”
Click to expand...



Italics mine, links' bold.


----------



## FeXL

Huh.

*New UK Study: People Who Have Been Vaccinated Make Up 47% of New COVID Cases*



> Data from a recently released study out of the UK, that uses data compiled from their Orwellian symptom-tracking app, shows vaccinated people account for almost half of the country’s new COVID cases.
> 
> The experimental jab has been getting worse results as time progresses. Just a few months ago, only 25% of people who had received the shot caught the wu-flu afterwards, and that number has now risen to 47% according to the study.




Why, it's almost as if the <snort> _vaccine_ is doing nothing...


----------



## FeXL

Actually, it's 5 now. And, _and_, Harris, after meeting in person with the fleebags, made a sudden _scheduled _(riiight...) visit to the hospital on _Sunday_.

*3 Fully Vaccinated Democrats Test Positive For Covid After Packing Private Plane, Fleeing Texas to Block GOP From Passing Voting Laws*



> At least three fully vaccinated Texas Democrat state lawmakers tested positive for Covid-19 after packing in a private plane and fleeing to DC.
> 
> On Monday at least *58 Democrat members of the state House of Representatives fled Texas to Washington DC* to block Republicans from advancing new voting laws through a special session of the legislature.
> 
> Democrat lawmakers were seen packed on a private plane, maskless flying from Texas to DC.




Links' bold.

Karma's a bitch...


----------



## Freddie_Biff

So any of you anti-vaxxers ever ask yourself why Trump himself decided to get vaccinated before leaving office?


----------



## FeXL

Exactly which of us on these boards is an _anti-vaxxer_? Be precise.



Freddie_Biff said:


> So any of you anti-vaxxers ever ask yourself why Trump himself decided to get vaccinated before leaving office?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Exactly which of us on these boards is an _anti-vaxxer_? Be precise.


Uh, gee….whoever’s been mouthing off about how bad vaccines are. That would be you and eMacMan for starters. I suspect Peter’s been vaccinated to cover his ass although he doesn’t want to admit it.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Exactly which of us on these boards is an _anti-vaxxer_? Be precise.


Being an anti-vaxxer would mean that one opposes the use of vaccines, would it not?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Being an anti-vaxxer would mean that one opposes the use of vaccines, would it not?


Yup. Or one who disparages them constantly. Or one who discouraged others from getting vaxxed and hasn’t been vaxxed themselves.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Being an anti-vaxxer would mean that one opposes the use of vaccines, would it not?


Exactly what I was thinking. Haven't seen evidence of any of them on these boards.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Exactly what I was thinking. Haven't seen evidence of any of them on these boards.


So now you’re advocating that people get vaccinated? Just asking you to clarify since you seem to talking out of both sides of your mouth.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Freddie_Biff said:


> So any of you anti-vaxxers ever ask yourself why Trump himself decided to get vaccinated before leaving office?


Perhaps one of you fine gentlemen, anti-vaxxers or not, can attempt to actually answer the question. Why did Trump get vaccinated and why do his followers seem to think it’s a bad idea?


----------



## Macfury

I think you would need to ask Trump that question. Republicans are more likely to think for themselves, so their reasons for not doing as Trump does would be many and varied.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Perhaps one of you fine gentlemen, anti-vaxxers or not, can attempt to actually answer the question. Why did Trump get vaccinated and why do his followers seem to think it’s a bad idea?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I think you would need to ask Trump that question. Republicans are more likely to think for themselves, so their reasons for not doing as Trump does would be many and varied.


Think for themselves? Ha! Good one. They’re more likely to drink from the Konpiracy Koolaid, you mean. Stop the steal! Stop the steal!


----------



## Macfury

Apparently they love that "Konpiracy" beverage brand.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Think for themselves? Ha! Good one. They’re more likely to drink from the Konpiracy Koolaid, you mean. Stop the steal! Stop the steal!


----------



## FeXL

I'm sorry, Freddie. MF & I were having a conversation. Did you speak?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Blah, blah, blah...


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Being an anti-vaxxer would mean that one opposes the use of vaccines, would it not?


Was thinking about this earlier. I actually do know some anti-vaxxers: JayDubs, all. Wonder if they can get a religious exemption...


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Was thinking about this earlier. I actually do know some anti-vaxxers: JayDubs, all. Wonder if they can get a religious exemption...


.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! I’m glad you finally got around to reading that one and can quote it! I was worried that you might have avoided it. Hey, how are those eighteen other threads you started doing? I can’t seem to find them anywhere.


----------



## eMacMan

For the record, I am am neither pro, nor anti-vaccine. I've had a couple of serious reactions to vaccines and therefore personally abstain. 

However the Covid 'vaccine' is a different ballgame. Previous attempts at mRNA vaccines were discontinued at the animal phase of testing when the animals died. So the manufacturers got around that by bypassing animal trials altogether. They could've run animal trials concurrently with their short term human trials but did not. Furthermore this is a vaccine in name only. The way it works is by altering cells to generate a spike protein which scientists believe is associated with Covid SARS_2, the body then presumably generates anti-bodies to attack that spike protein and the cell to which it is attached. This is an unproven approach and skipping animal, medium and long term human trials is extremely irresponsible. Also there is a lot more that can go wrong with this approach, but maybe we should just forget Thalidomide and jab away?

Then there is personal observation. Despite labeling anyone who dies after testing positive as a Covid death, our little community has recorded zero covid deaths. However within a week of the second dose at our LTC centers we saw 4 deaths. And another 4 in the following 2 weeks. An incredibly high death rate within a small community. All were recorded as natural causes without bothering to investigate how much of a roll the 'vaccine' played. A similar flurry occurred after the second round in our general population. Not sure what the total is, but I have personally talked to family members of three of those deaths who claim their loved one was in good health prior to the vaccine. Given that this treatment is still very much experimental, foregoing forensic autopsies of these deaths is getting into the realm of criminal conduct.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> For the record, I am am neither pro, nor anti-vaccine. I've had a couple of serious reactions to vaccines and therefore personally abstain.
> 
> However the Covid 'vaccine' is a different ballgame. Previous attempts at mRNA vaccines were discontinued at the animal phase of testing when the animals died. So the manufacturers got around that by bypassing animal trials altogether. They could've run animal trials concurrently with their short term human trials but did not. Furthermore this is a vaccine in name only. The way it works is by altering cells to generate a spike protein which scientists believe is associated with Covid SARS_2, the body then presumably generates anti-bodies to attack that spike protein and the cell to which it is attached. This is an unproven approach and skipping animal, medium and long term human trials is extremely irresponsible. Also there is a lot more that can go wrong with this approach, but maybe we should just forget Thalidomide and jab away?
> 
> Then there is personal observation. Despite labeling anyone who dies after testing positive as a Covid death, our little community has recorded zero covid deaths. However within a week of the second dose at our LTC centers we saw 4 deaths. And another 4 in the following 2 weeks. An incredibly high death rate within a small community. All were recorded as natural causes without bothering to investigate how much of a roll the 'vaccine' played. A similar flurry occurred after the second round in our general population. Not sure what the total is, but I have personally talked to family members of three of those deaths who claim their loved one was in good health prior to the vaccine. Given that this treatment is still very much experimental, foregoing forensic autopsies of these deaths is getting into the realm of criminal conduct.


Thanks for taking the time to explain your view, eMacMan. I can certainly understand your vaccine hesitancy, at least as far as these particular CoVid vaccines go. They don’t seem to be getting the desired results where you live, and CoVid hasn’t been as much of a threat in your world as it has in other places. There’s no denying personal experience. 

Perhaps I’ve been brainwashed by the “lame stream media” but where I live, there’s no doubt that vaccinations, experimental as they may be, are having a huge impact on bringing the CoVid numbers down. I don’t know what the long term consequences may be, but I’m willing to trust the science over the paranoia. 

Nice to have an actual intelligent conversation with you for a change.


----------



## FeXL

Oh, it was quoted before, Freddie. As usual, your powers of observation fail you.

Eighteen? I recall maybe a dozen. As to where they went? They made their point & were disappeared, just like conservative posts on social & main stream media. For those of you on the left unfamiliar with the concept, it's called "censorship" & usually occurs after mods have been hired.

Not to worry, tho. The alligator will eat you last...



Freddie_Biff said:


> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! I’m glad you finally got around to reading that one and can quote it! I was worried that you might have avoided it. Hey, how are those eighteen other threads you started doing? I can’t seem to find them anywhere.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Oh, it was quoted before, Freddie. As usual, your powers of observation fail you.
> 
> Eighteen? I recall maybe a dozen. As to where they went? They made their point & were disappeared, just like conservative posts on social & main stream media. For those of you on the left unfamiliar with the concept, it's called "censorship" & usually occurs after mods have been hired.
> 
> Not to worry, tho. The alligator will eat you last...


Haha! And what purpose did they serve, exactly? Other than to show how an immature child desperately needed attention? Look at me! Look at me! 

I doubt that you’re even conservative. Just a wanna-be.


----------



## FeXL

Whooooosh!!!

Quelle surprise.



Freddie_Biff said:


> And what purpose did they serve, exactly?


<sigh> You're right, Freddie. I'm so busted. Deep, deep down inside, I'm a bleeding heart Prog, just like you...



Freddie_Biff said:


> I doubt that you’re even conservative. Just a wanna-be.


----------



## FeXL

Further fallout from the fleebags.

*Pelosi, ” Masks Up!”*



> Staffers in White House, Pelosi’s office test positive for coronavirus
> 
> 
> 
> Drew Hammill, deputy chief of staff for Pelosi, said a senior spokesperson in the Speaker’s office tested positive on Monday, days after aides met with Democratic Texas state lawmakers who traveled to Washington, D.C., in a bid to stop the passage of a new state elections law.
> The staffer is *fully vaccinated*, Hammill said, and they have had no contact with Pelosi since testing positive.
> “The entire Press Office is working remotely today with the exception of individuals who have had no exposure to the individual or have had a recent negative test,” Hammill said in a statement. “Our office will continue to follow the guidance of the Office of Attending Physician closely.”
> Pelosi, who is 81, was *fully vaccinated* in January.
> 
> 
> 
> Life imitates Monty Python.
Click to expand...



From the comments:

*Psaki Says White House Still Testing for COVID Every 2 Weeks Even Though Everyone Is Vaccinated with Fake Vaccine*




> White House spokesperson Jen Psaki told reporters today that the White House personnel is getting tested every two weeks for the COVID virus even though everyone is vaccinated. Psaki is getting tested twice a week for the COVID virus.


Related:

*For Second Week in a Row: More COVID-19 Vaccination Deaths than COVID-19 Deaths in the US According to CDC and VAERS Websites*



> *Last Week:* there were *1,918 total COVID-19 deaths* *in the United States.*
> 
> Last Week: There were 2,092 deaths from the COVID Vaccines — According to the CDC-linked VAERS website.
> 
> *That means there were 174 more Covid vaccine deaths in the United States last week than Covid deaths in the United States last week.*
> 
> Why is this not making headlines?




Links' bold.


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> *For Second Week in a Row: More COVID-19 Vaccination Deaths than COVID-19 Deaths in the US According to CDC and VAERS Websites*
> 
> Links' bold.


This has been fact checked, and is not the case.

Further to that VAERS while it could be a useful tool, but it is not. Relies on honest self-reporting with no verification. It's like our useless COVID alert Canada app.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

smashedbanana said:


> This has been fact checked, and is not the case.
> 
> Further to that VAERS while it could be a useful tool, but it is not. Relies on honest self-reporting with no verification. It's like our useless COVID alert Canada app.


Please. You’re trying to confuse the narrative with truth.


----------



## Macfury

Should we take your word for it, or are you going to show us an explanation?



smashedbanana said:


> This has been fact checked, and is not the case.


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> Should we take your word for it, or are you going to show us an explanation?


No, you don't have to take my word for anything.
I'm not challenging the established data.
What should have pass muster is the presentation of that "data" from the "source" the Gateway Pundit.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Deniers gonna deny. Conspiracy theorists gonna conspire.


----------



## FeXL

TGP merely reported the data sourced from the CDC & VAERS websites. If you have an issue with the data, refute it.



smashedbanana said:


> What should have pass muster is the presentation of that "data" from the "source" the Gateway Pundit.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> No, you don't have to take my word for anything.
> I'm not challenging the established data.
> What should have pass muster is the presentation of that "data" from the "source" the Gateway Pundit.


I typically follow the links beyond Gateway Pundit to see if the reporting is accurate. Sometimes it is.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

The Gateway Pundit, eh? With an endorsement by Breitbart. Yes, that sounds like a VERY credible and balanced source. 

“Jim Hoft is the founder and editor of The Gateway Pundit, one of the top conservative news outlets in America. Jim was awarded the Reed Irvine Accuracy in Media Award in 2013 and is the proud recipient of the Breitbart Award for Excellence in Online Journalism from the Americans for Prosperity Foundation in May 2016.”


----------



## Macfury

Um-hm. What about the source Gateway Pundit is citing? Or is _ad hominem_ enough satisfaction for you?



Freddie_Biff said:


> The Gateway Pundit, eh? With an endorsement by Breitbart. Yes, that sounds like a VERY credible and balanced source.
> 
> “Jim Hoft is the founder and editor of The Gateway Pundit, one of the top conservative news outlets in America. Jim was awarded the Reed Irvine Accuracy in Media Award in 2013 and is the proud recipient of the Breitbart Award for Excellence in Online Journalism from the Americans for Prosperity Foundation in May 2016.”


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Or is _ad hominem_ enough satisfaction for you?


Close enough for the _Party of Science_.


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> TGP merely reported the data sourced from the CDC & VAERS websites. If you have an issue with the data, refute it.


Check again.

It takes data from OpenVaers and Vaers. Openvaers is a private site with no oversight or published ownership. It purports to pull data from Vaers. 

The title of the article credits the CDC, but offers nothing beyond the link to Vaers. The CDC is one of the funders of Vaers but as mentioned the data is self reported.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Um-hm. What about the source Gateway Pundit is citing? Or is _ad hominem_ enough satisfaction for you?


Well, Peter, there’s enough red flags here for me to question anything in this link. VAERS does not sound like a source I’d trust. But hey, you do you, buddy.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Very proud of my province today. Fortunately the anti-vaxxers are in the minority and we may actually achieve something close to herd immunity if we can get 75% of the population fully vaxxed. Fingers crossed. 



> CALGARY — More than five million doses of COVID-19 vaccine have been administered in Alberta.
> 
> The province surpassed the milestone after more than 15,000 doses were issued over the last day — 1,574 of which were first dose appointments.
> 
> To date, 74.8 per cent of Alberta’s eligible population have received at least one dose of a COVID-19 vaccine, while nearly 60 per cent are now fully vaccinated.


 https://www.660citynews.com/2021/0...0pRQqwWOZ-gsN3Akx2E6rTly3f-c7Ac4GbEkSJ2x07ycc


----------



## Macfury

Great, so you didn't need the other 25 per cent at all!



Freddie_Biff said:


> Very proud of my province.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> Check again.
> 
> It takes data from OpenVaers and Vaers. Openvaers is a private site with no oversight or published ownership. It purports to pull data from Vaers.
> 
> The title of the article credits the CDC, but offers nothing beyond the link to Vaers. The CDC is one of the funders of Vaers but as mentioned the data is self reported.


VAERS includes reports from healthcare workers. As an adverse affect early warning system it's pretty much all the government has on which to base ongoing judgements on vaccine safety.


----------



## FeXL

So, what's the thrust here? Self-reported data is the issue? I agree! By all indicators, the incidents are under reported by one to two orders of magnitude!

Still waiting for the alleged debunking.



smashedbanana said:


> The CDC is one of the funders of Vaers but as mentioned the data is self reported.


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> Well, Peter, there’s enough red flags here for me to question anything in this link. VAERS does not sound like a source I’d trust. But hey, you do you, buddy.


You are of course correct. For the simple reason that; for an incident to be reported to VAERS usually requires the family be aware that VAERS exists and put a lot of pressure on the medicos to report. Best guesses claim that adverse reactions are under-reported by a factor of at least 10x and possibly by as much as 100x. 

Even so VAERS is now reporting deaths from the Covid jabs in the 1000s, and that's just for the USofA. For comparison the H1N1 vaccine was pulled after 53 deaths were reported.

Like it or not Freddie the globalists are trying to kill a lot of people and the jab is just one of the weapons they are deploying.


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> So, what's the thrust here? Self-reported data is the issue? I agree! By all indicators, the incidents are under reported by one to two orders of magnitude!
> 
> Still waiting for the alleged debunking.


_All _indicators eh?


----------



## FeXL

Every analysis I've read on VAERS (dozens, BTW) has noted the same thing: under reported by one to two orders of magnitude.

If you can find one that doesn't agree, congratulations! That's one more than the alleged debunking you claim.

Still waiting...



smashedbanana said:


> _All _indicators eh?


----------



## FeXL

For my next installment on the Chinese Coronavirus thread...

*Covid, Covid, Covid

*


> Guess what happens when you go crazy with the cleaners.
> 
> CDC study matches up with Stats Canada report, study of 540,667 adult hospitalized patients with COVID-19, 94.9% had at least 1 underlying medical condition. And just like we see in unvaccinated people “We found that severe COVID-19 infection, associated with a high mortality rate, might develop in a minority of fully vaccinated individuals with multiple co-morbidities”
> 
> That’s strange, CDC now says it has received reports of 12,313 deaths following Covid vaccination in the US – compared to under 6,000 last week.
> 
> More news out of Israel. “Preliminary data from an analysis conducted by the Health Ministry shows 42% decrease in vaccine protection from infections and up to 60% from severe illness among vaccinated; Israel mulls 3rd booster shot for all over 65s.”
> 
> Even more interesting.  “in ALL of Israel, population ~9 million, SEVEN people under 40 have been hospitalized with severe Covid in the last two weeks.”
> 
> Another positive Ivermectin study
> 
> Did somebody say, ” move the goalposts”?


----------



## groovetube

smashedbanana said:


> Check again.
> 
> It takes data from OpenVaers and Vaers. Openvaers is a private site with no oversight or published ownership. It purports to pull data from Vaers.
> 
> The title of the article credits the CDC, but offers nothing beyond the link to Vaers. The CDC is one of the funders of Vaers but as mentioned the data is self reported.


Exactly. I did some digging on this as well after I saw this same exact link to the junk science nonsense being passed off as fact by anti-vaxxers on Facebook as well. I watched the arguments go on, and predictably, once they were outted making these unsubstantiated claims of more vaccine deaths than covid, they immediately demanded that people 'do their research', much like here, the demands to challenge data that they themselves, cant even verify, and is quite obviously very unreliable. And then further, this link then tries to insinuate that the CDC is reporting these vaccine death numbers, when in fact, that's a bald faced lie. The CDC merely provides the data collected from the Vaers, but is not 'reporting this data' as fact. It quite simply isn't.

And they would do well to check their own links. Reporting wildly inflated and unsubstantiated numbers 'in one week', when in fact, it is merely the unverified reports from Vaers from a much longer period time, dec.14 2020 to July 13 2021. Not one week.









COVID-19 Vaccination


COVID-19 vaccines protect against COVID-19. Get safety info and more.




www.cdc.gov






> Reports of death after COVID-19 vaccination are rare. More than 334 million doses of COVID-19 vaccines were administered in the United States from December 14, 2020, through July 13, 2021. During this time, VAERS received 6,079 reports of death (0.0018%) among people who received a COVID-19 vaccine. FDA requires healthcare providers to report any death after COVID-19 vaccination to VAERS, even if it’s unclear whether the vaccine was the cause. Reports of adverse events to VAERS following vaccination, including deaths, do not necessarily mean that a vaccine caused a health problem. A review of available clinical information, including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records, has not established a causal link to COVID-19 vaccines. However, recent reports indicate a plausible causal relationship between the J&J/Janssen COVID-19 Vaccine and TTS, a rare and serious adverse event—blood clots with low platelets—which has caused deaths.


Note that this is over 6k in 7 months reported (allegedly) not in one week... and this isnt the CDC numbers as claimed, but merely what is taken from VAERS. Which as you well put it:


smashedbanana said:


> This has been fact checked, and is not the case.
> 
> Further to that VAERS while it could be a useful tool, but it is not. Relies on honest self-reporting with no verification. It's like our useless COVID alert Canada app.


But more importantly, the CDC site very clearly said (see my quote) that none of these deaths can be verified as being because of the vaccine. But no matter, because facts, data, they aren't needed I guess...

Look how quickly the same ones who without any facts claiming the hospitals are inflating the number of covid deaths, resort to just flagrant out and out lies and manipulations, to make ridiculous claims. Not to be deterred, the doubling down begins, and in fact, the claims have been amplified to there are more deaths in the order of (insert made up number here) without so much as a shred of any evidence. Apparently, this is what passes as 'handing their asses to them' when debating anything.

Make no mistake. If there were actually that many thousands of deaths a week as the anti-vaxxers I saw on Facebook claimed there were, and there was actually reliable data to back this up... after the huge freak out I saw on all media outlets over the blood clots with AZ/J&J and the the possible heart inflammation with the mRNA, you can bet those same media outlets would be chomping at the bit for that tasty bit of clickbait for ad revenue. But it seems only the dreck are willing to make these bold salacious claims based on junk science because well, the bills don't pay themselves!, and hey, the money's good!


----------



## FeXL

Hey!!! If it isn't the Little Lying Drummer Boy. Nice to see you back!

How's alla yer wimmens? Still shaking in their boots that bad ol' FeXL is gonna show up at yer office? Yeah, thought so...


----------



## groovetube

Ah yeah! Here's our epic little child, who I see went on one of the most incredibly childish temper tantrums I think Ive seen yet on EhMac! all those empty thread titles over what? WHAAAAAAAAA. And then the complaints about no content posts... you cant make this shyte up.

No one's shaken their boots. No one really gives a shyte about your drama dude. Like, no one apparently.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Exactly. I did some digging on this as well after I saw this same exact link to the junk science nonsense being passed off as fact by anti-vaxxers on Facebook as well. I watched the arguments go on, and predictably, once they were outted making these unsubstantiated claims of more vaccine deaths than covid, they immediately demanded that people 'do their research', much like here, the demands to challenge data that they themselves, cant even verify, and is quite obviously very unreliable. And then further, this link then tries to insinuate that the CDC is reporting these vaccine death numbers, when in fact, that's a bald faced lie. The CDC merely provides the data collected from the Vaers, but is not 'reporting this data' as fact. It quite simply isn't.
> 
> And they would do well to check their own links. Reporting wildly inflated and unsubstantiated numbers 'in one week', when in fact, it is merely the unverified reports from Vaers from a much longer period time, dec.14 2020 to July 13 2021. Not one week.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19 Vaccination
> 
> 
> COVID-19 vaccines protect against COVID-19. Get safety info and more.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cdc.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Note that this is over 6k in 7 months reported (allegedly) not in one week... and this isnt the CDC numbers as claimed, but merely what is taken from VAERS. Which as you well put it:
> 
> 
> But more importantly, the CDC site very clearly said (see my quote) that none of these deaths can be verified as being because of the vaccine. But no matter, because facts, data, they aren't needed I guess...
> 
> Look how quickly the same ones who without any facts claiming the hospitals are inflating the number of covid deaths, resort to just flagrant out and out lies and manipulations, to make ridiculous claims. Not to be deterred, the doubling down begins, and in fact, the claims have been amplified to there are more deaths in the order of (insert made up number here) without so much as a shred of any evidence. Apparently, this is what passes as 'handing their asses to them' when debating anything.
> 
> Make no mistake. If there were actually that many thousands of deaths a week as the anti-vaxxers I saw on Facebook claimed there were, and there was actually reliable data to back this up... after the huge freak out I saw on all media outlets over the blood clots with AZ/J&J and the the possible heart inflammation with the mRNA, you can bet those same media outlets would be chomping at the bit for that tasty bit of clickbait for ad revenue. But it seems only the dreck are willing to make these bold salacious claims based on junk science because well, the bills don't pay themselves!, and hey, the money's good!


Nice to read an intelligent response for a change. People believe what they want to believe these days, and deniers gonna deny.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Hey!!! If it isn't the Little Lying Drummer Boy. Nice to see you back!
> 
> How's alla yer wimmens? Still shaking in their boots that bad ol' FeXL is gonna show up at yer office? Yeah, thought so...


Aaaand…we’re back to classic form. Trying to threaten and intimidate. Why do you do that? You can be such an ass. Ever tried just having a conversation?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Nice to read an intelligent response for a change. People believe what they want to believe these days, and deniers gonna deny.


Listen, if there was reliable data that there are lots of deaths due to vaccine, post it. But don't give me this unsubstantiated crap and demand we do the work for you when it doesn't pass the smell test.

For someone that brags endlessly about credibility and ass handing and the questioning of posts, this isnt off to a very good start. Pretty pathetic Id say.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Aaaand…we’re back to classic form. Trying to threaten and intimidate. Why do you do that? You can be such an ass. Ever tried just having a conversation?


It's just what they do. When they cant win an argument, that's what they resort to. As I said, pathetic.

No one cares.

Come ooooonnnnn macfury! yer next up at bat! The band's getting back together man! Giv'er! you must have some nice shiny troll crap to derail stuff at the ready. 

Come ooooonnnn!!!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Ah yeah! Here's our epic little child, who I see went on one of the most incredibly childish temper tantrums I think Ive seen yet on EhMac! all those empty thread titles over what? WHAAAAAAAAA. And then the complaints about no content posts... you cant make this shyte up.
> 
> No one's shaken their boots. No one really gives a shyte about your drama dude. Like, no one apparently.


Yeah he really did have a tantrum about all those threads being pulled. Poor baby. Somebody actually put him in his place for a change.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Listen, if there was reliable data that there are lots of deaths due to vaccine, post it. But don't give me this unsubstantiated crap and demand we do the work for you when it doesn't pass the smell test.
> 
> For someone that brags endlessly about credibility and ass handing and the questioning of posts, this isnt off to a very good start. Pretty pathetic Id say.


It’s the way they work and they’ve been getting away with it for years. They think this is how a forum is normally run. Couldn’t be more wrong though.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Yeah he really did have a tantrum about all those threads being pulled. Poor baby. Somebody actually put him in his place for a change.


It was seriously entertaining. Well, for a few minutes. Unfortunate for the mod who had to waste their time having to clean up such an epic mess. Wonder who 'got the point'.

LOL


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> It was seriously entertaining. Well, for a few minutes. Unfortunate for the mod who had to waste their time having to clean up such an epic mess. Wonder who 'got the point'.
> 
> LOL


Shocka!


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> How's alla yer wimmens? Still shaking in their boots that bad ol' FeXL is gonna show up at yer office? Yeah, thought so...


Oh man, that was classic!


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Oh man, that was classic!


come oooonnnn little doogie!

seriously y'all aren't still butthurt over 8 years ago. REEEEALLY? wow.

Now, jes' so we clear here... before anyone gets all whiney that groovetube derailed a good conversation, I didn't start the mud flinging here. But I'll return it as needed. You wanna return to the topic, by all means. I guess my post hit a nerve so someone had to leave the topic and get all butthurt. Must be that 'ass handing' it keeps promising.

Your choice.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Oh man, that was classic!


Yeah, Peter, you would applaud the threat of assault. Just a fine upstanding libertarian member of the community you are.


----------



## Macfury

What's the deal with "peter" — is that supposed to mean something?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Yeah, Peter, you would applaud the threat of assault. Just a fine upstanding libertarian member of the community you are.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Aaaaand….on the topic of Coronavirus, the numbers seems to be increasing for delta variants south of the border and in many places in the world, including previously mostly CoVid free Australia. In Alberta we’ve hit 75% first dose and 60% fully vaccinated (two dose). Any predictions on what’s going to happen next?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> What's the deal with "peter" — is that supposed to mean something?


Yeah, it’s your nickname, Peter. Didn’t you run as a rep for the libertarian party at one time? Forgive me if I’ve got you mixed up with someone else.


----------



## Macfury

Nope! There was someone on here years ago who I believe ran as a libertarian for a city council position, but I don't even remember which city.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Yeah, it’s your nickname, Peter. Didn’t you run as a rep for the libertarian party at one time? Forgive me if I’ve got you mixed up with someone else.


----------



## groovetube

So I hear they’re piling up the bodies from all the vaccinated deaths. How about that eh? 

I read it on the internet, the CDC says it’s true even! All indications are!


----------



## Macfury

My guess is increased infections, but decreased death rates, along with a new run of Delta infections noted among the single- and double-jabbed as seen in Israel.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Aaaaand….on the topic of Coronavirus, the numbers seems to be increasing for delta variants south of the border and in many places in the world, including previously mostly CoVid free Australia. In Alberta we’ve hit 75% first dose and 60% fully vaccinated (two dose). Any predictions on what’s going to happen next?


----------



## groovetube

I don’t think they are as worried about double vaxxed people having a small chance of a mild infection (which is pretty much what a vaccine promises) as they are about the unvaccinated and the immune compromised. We can just look south of the border and see what’s happening as well for a good picture. Severe hospitalizations and deaths are pretty much the unvaccinated and immune compromised at this point, and the more we get people vaccinated, the sooner we can return to normal and reduce transmission/deaths.

BTW Israel was only considering possible boosters for the elderly and immune compromised, and this is far from for sure at this point, not the vaccinated general population.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Nope! There was someone on here years ago who I believe ran as a libertarian for a city council position, but I don't even remember which city.


Fair enough. My bad.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> My guess is increased infections, but decreased death rates, along with a new run of Delta infections noted among the single- and double-jabbed as seen in Israel.


Well the vaccination is certainly no guarantee, but every piece of evidence I’ve seen is that it’s a hell of a lot more effective than doing nothing. We’ll probably end up needing yearly booster shots like we do for the flu. I really hope we don’t have to wear masks at school again in September, but the rumours are not looking good.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I don’t think they are as worried about double vaxxed people having a small chance of a mild infection (which is pretty much what a vaccine promises) as they are about the unvaccinated and the immune compromised. We can just look south of the border and see what’s happening as well for a good picture. Severe hospitalizations and deaths are pretty much the unvaccinated and immune compromised at this point, and the more we get people vaccinated, the sooner we can return to normal and reduce transmission/deaths.
> 
> BTW Israel was only considering possible boosters for the elderly and immune compromised, and this is far from for sure at this point, not the vaccinated general population.


But what if all these vaccines suddenly give everyone autism??


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Well the vaccination is certainly no guarantee, but every piece of evidence I’ve seen is that it’s a hell of a lot more effective than doing nothing. We’ll probably end up needing yearly booster shots like we do for the flu. I really hope we don’t have to wear masks at school again in September, but the rumours are not looking good.


I think the K-8 is going to be challenging, dear friends teach that and don’t know what to expect. Auth for vaccines for under 12 isn’t expected initial late fall. 


Freddie_Biff said:


> But what if all these vaccines suddenly give everyone autism??


Well it sure would make things… interesting if we all had it!

maybe that’s the issue here??


----------



## Macfury

The kids don't really need them--just the adults staff.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Well the vaccination is certainly no guarantee, but every piece of evidence I’ve seen is that it’s a hell of a lot more effective than doing nothing. We’ll probably end up needing yearly booster shots like we do for the flu. I really hope we don’t have to wear masks at school again in September, but the rumours are not looking good.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> The kids don't really need them--just the adults staff.


MOST of the kids don’t, but there are kids that are immuno-compromised as part of the school population, and the more transmissible delta variant threatens younger kids as well as adults from what I understand.


----------



## FeXL

Broaden your research. 47% of new Chinese coronavirus infections from the India variant are with people who have already been jabbed. That's nearly a 1 in 2 chance, either way.



Freddie_Biff said:


> ...but every piece of evidence I’ve seen is that it’s a hell of a lot more effective than doing nothing.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Oh man, that was classic!


Yeah, I could hear the cries of terror from downtown Tranna all the way out here.


----------



## groovetube

Do your research!!! Here’s some more factless nonsense! Because do your research!!!!!

Oh and in case no one knew, the covid virus originated in CHINA! CHINA! CHINA! CHINA! CHINA! CHINA!CHINA! CHINA!

well gee thank GAWD someone pointed this out because we would have NEVER known this facinating and useful fact!


----------



## groovetube

Lookout there might be another childish temper tantrum comin!!!

WAAAAAAHHHHHH!

pathetic.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Do your research!!! Here’s some more factless nonsense! Because do your research!!!!!
> 
> Oh and in case no one knew, the covid virus originated in CHINA! CHINA!CHINA! CHINA!CHINA! CHINA!CHINA! CHINA!


I think he’d like us all to do HIS research, truth be known.


----------



## groovetube

It’s the usual go to when someone posts a bold claim supported by total nonsense that even they can’t defend. So they immediately demand that you do it for them! It’s the height of entitlement I tell ya  

I saw a pile of anti-vaxxers on Facebook this morning all pulling the same nonsense. Not a single one could defend the sorry ass crap they tried to pass off as fact. It doesn’t further any useful discussion, all it does is create frustration as anyone can see, I just have no patience for that sort of uselessness anymore.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Yeah, I could hear the cries of terror from downtown Tranna all the way out here.


It wasn't the gals who were bawling either. They were being instructed to call the cops while someone else was hiding!


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> It wasn't the gals who were bawling either.


<snort> Yeppers.

The same one who is bawling on this thread about childish temper tantrums, yet he was the one pissing & moaning about the thread title being RAYCISS!!!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> It’s the usual go to when someone posts a bold claim supported by total nonsense that even they can’t defend. So they immediately demand that you do it for them! It’s the height of entitlement I tell ya
> 
> I saw a pile of anti-vaxxers on Facebook this morning all pulling the same nonsense. Not a single one could defend the sorry ass crap they tried to pass off as fact. It doesn’t further any useful discussion, all it does is create frustration as anyone can see, I just have no patience for that sort of uselessness anymore.


Some people just live to piss people off. I know a few myself. But it does get boring after a while.


----------



## groovetube

FeXL said:


> <snort> Yeppers.
> 
> The same one who is bawling on this thread about childish temper tantrums, yet he was the one pissing & moaning about the thread title being RAYCISS!!!


If all it takes to make the pair of you ninnies to lose your shyte and go of on a tear of the same no content and LOLz posts you both whine about is a single post with an opinion, well, looks like someone has some seriously thin skin!!!

Pathetic dude. Pull yourself together. You've got some bold claims you made that you have failed miserably to defend. If you want respect around here, earn it. Right now with that epic display of the most childish temper tantrum in emac's history we've ever seen, you've got some making up to do.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Some people just live to piss people off. I know a few myself. But it does get boring after a while.


They're literally posting the same no content LOLz stuff they complained about. You can't make this up. Let's be clear here, it was the thin skinned 'hairy ath' that lost it because I guess a 'prog's' opinion got under it's skin.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> If all it takes to make the pair of you ninnies to lose your shyte and go of on a tear of the same no content and LOLz posts you both whine about is a single post with an opinion, well, looks like someone has some seriously thin skin!!!
> 
> Pathetic dude. Pull yourself together. You've got some bold claims you made that you have failed miserably to defend. If you want respect around here, earn it. Right now with that epic display of the most childish temper tantrum in emac's history we've ever seen, you've got some making up to do.
> 
> 
> They're literally posting the same no content LOLz stuff they complained about. You can't make this up. Let's be clear here, it was the thin skinned 'hairy ath' that lost it because I guess a 'prog's' opinion got under it's skin.


Nailed it. LOL


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> Every analysis I've read on VAERS (dozens, BTW) has noted the same thing: under reported by one to two orders of magnitude.
> 
> If you can find one that doesn't agree, congratulations! That's one more than the alleged debunking you claim.
> 
> Still waiting...


You found self reported cases in Vaers. ok.

Is that really _all_ indicators? Come on.

At best it's an indicator. And not a substantive one.

You know I've installed hardwood flooring about a dozen times (family, friends, etc.). Do I consider myself an expert? Hell no. Do I go around extolling my knowledge and opinions on flooring install? No.

And that's something I've done with my hands and it's all turned out great.

So why is real, researched medical data is being supplanted by Randoms googling info that just confirms their predispositions? Why is that enough to displace real experts?


----------



## FeXL

Quit squirming. This is pretty simple.

The article noted that two weeks in a row the VAERS data indicated more deaths from Chinese coronavirus vaccines than from Chinese coronavirus itself. Agreed?

You noted that observation had been "fact checked, and is not the case." Agreed?

Still waiting for said fact check. You may not like the data. You may not agree with the data. You may claim the data is wrong from 36 different angles. I don't care. Show me where the data does not indicate what is claimed.



smashedbanana said:


> So why is real, researched medical data is being supplanted by Randoms googling info that just confirms their predispositions? Why is that enough to displace real experts?


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> Quit squirming. This is pretty simple.
> 
> The article noted that two weeks in a row the VAERS data indicated more deaths from Chinese coronavirus vaccines than from Chinese coronavirus itself. Agreed?
> 
> You noted that observation had been "fact checked, and is not the case." Agreed?
> 
> Still waiting for said fact check. You may not like the data. You may not agree with the data. You may claim the data is wrong from 36 different angles. I don't care. Show me where the data does not indicate what is claimed.



Yes I am squirming. Good work reading my comments, you really got to the meat of it.

I pointed out that the article you linked had a false headline. Crickets.

I pointed out the articled used Openvaers. I website with an unknown agenda, with no oversight, and a FAQ that says this: "OpenVAERS is a project developed by a small team of people with vaccine injuries or have children with vaccine injuries."

I then discussed the intrinsic problems with Vaers self reporting. Which you agreed upon?

And yes these number have been fact checked by several publications including Reuters. How about you do even a tacit search and find them? Show me that you are at least trying to read both sides rather than just looking for articles that confirm your predisposition and dumping them here.


----------



## groovetube

smashedbanana said:


> Yes I am squirming. Good work reading my comments, you really got to the meat of it.
> 
> I pointed out that the article you linked had a false headline. Crickets.
> 
> I pointed out the articled used Openvaers. I website with an unknown agenda, with no oversight, and a FAQ that says this: "OpenVAERS is a project developed by a small team of people with vaccine injuries or have children with vaccine injuries."
> 
> I then discussed the intrinsic problems with Vaers self reporting. Which you agreed upon?
> 
> And yes these number have been fact checked by several publications including Reuters. How about you do even a tacit search and find them? Show me that you are at least trying to read both sides rather than just looking for articles that confirm your predisposition and dumping them here.


Glad this is back to the topic...

Ive already pointed this out, but the glaring issue here is right on the first couple pages at CDC directly from the link provided in said Gateway Pundit article. Not sure if anyone who read that headline took the time to read the information pertinent to interpreting this data before making rash conclusions.

from the CDC disclaimer page to the data:
( The Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) Request )



> Key considerations and limitations of VAERS data:
> 
> 
> Vaccine providers are encouraged to report any clinically significant health problem following vaccination to VAERS, whether or not they believe the vaccine was the cause.
> Reports may include incomplete, inaccurate, coincidental and unverified information.
> The number of reports alone cannot be interpreted or used to reach conclusions about the existence, severity, frequency, or rates of problems associated with vaccines.
> VAERS data are limited to vaccine adverse event reports received between 1990 and the most recent date for which data are available.
> VAERS data do not represent all known safety information for a vaccine and should be interpreted in the context of other scientific information.
> VAERS data available to the public include only the initial report data to VAERS. Updated data which contains data from medical records and corrections reported during follow up are used by the government for analysis. However, for numerous reasons including data consistency, these amended data are not available to the public.


I expect this to be ignored, but damn! Did Gateway Pundit assume their readers wouldn't notice? Perhaps they knew many wouldn't... or, more likely, refuse to acknowledge  That last paragraph, is a doozy! Correct me if Im wrong here, but does this mean that when medical professionals follow up on say, the deaths reported, that this updated info _is not available to the public?_ Meaning, if the reported death was bogus or clearly not because of the vaccine, the data in VAERS is not updated? Huge red flag, and clearly pulling the numbers from VAERS (or OPENVAERS) isnt reliable enough to be making any conclusions, at all!

now this, right on the CDC's website:
( COVID-19 Vaccination )


> Reports of death after COVID-19 vaccination are rare. More than 339 million doses of COVID-19 vaccines were administered in the United States from December 14, 2020, through July 19, 2021. During this time, VAERS received 6,207 reports of death (0.0018%) among people who received a COVID-19 vaccine. FDA requires healthcare providers to report any death after COVID-19 vaccination to VAERS, even if it’s unclear whether the vaccine was the cause. Reports of adverse events to VAERS following vaccination, including deaths, do not necessarily mean that a vaccine caused a health problem. A review of available clinical information, including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records, has not established a causal link to COVID-19 vaccines. However, recent reports indicate a plausible causal relationship between the J&J/Janssen COVID-19 Vaccine and TTS, a rare and serious adverse event—blood clots with low platelets—which has caused deaths.


Let me highlight the lines of particular interest again:



> FDA requires healthcare providers to report any death after COVID-19 vaccination to VAERS, even if it’s unclear whether the vaccine was the cause. Reports of adverse events to VAERS following vaccination, including deaths, do not necessarily mean that a vaccine caused a health problem. A review of available clinical information, including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records, has not established a causal link to COVID-19 vaccines.


Oh. So making a bold claim that there are more deaths from COVID Vaccines than covid itself, is not based on anything reliable, much less correct. Before anyone can demand others refute data, they must first provide reliable facts and data in the first place, rather than slamming headlines based on dodgy information.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

I’m sitting here eating popcorn watching the day’s entertainment. This is getting interesting.


----------



## Macfury

Glad to see that the cut-and-paste function works well on EhMac!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Glad to see that Macfury once again offers nothing of substance in response to the posts of smashedbanana and Groovetube.


----------



## Macfury

I always welcome smashedbanana's posts.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Glad to see that Macfury once again offers nothing of substance in response to the posts of smashedbanana and Groovetube.


----------



## Macfury

The truth is that the CDC has since withdrawn the numbers as a likely error.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Glad to see that the cut-and-paste function works well on EhMac!


At least I make the effort to address the topic with something meaningful even if you disagree, and provide sources. All you do is sit there and snipe and criticize, or egg someone else on in a scrap. If you ever did post a well reasoned argument in any thread, it’d be a rarity!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> At least I make the effort to address the topic with something meaningful even if you disagree, and provide sources. All you do is sit there and snipe and criticize, or egg someone else on in a scrap. If you ever did post a well reasoned argument in any thread, it’d be a rarity!


That’s his MO. Just like Waldorf and Statler up in the balcony.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> That’s his MO. Just like Waldorf and Statler up in the balcony.


They were actually kinda funny though. But seriously, has macfury actually thrown it down with a decent well reasoned post like, ever, during the 8 years I wasn’t here? Or was he like this the whole time… for… years.


----------



## Macfury

Had to look that up. If you're referencing Waldorf and Statler at this point in time, you pretty much ARE Waldorf and Statler.



Freddie_Biff said:


> That’s his MO. Just like Waldorf and Statler up in the balcony.


----------



## groovetube

I was under the impression you were in a similar age range as us macfury. Did you watch tv in the 80s?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> They were actually kinda funny though. But seriously, has macfury actually thrown it down with a decent well reasoned post like, ever, during the 8 years I wasn’t here? Or was he like this the whole time… for… years.


Nope. He just comments on other’s responses without offering any substance of his own. Very predictable. And boring.


----------



## Macfury

But good enough to keep you coming back!



Freddie_Biff said:


> Nope. He just comments on other’s responses without offering any substance of his own. Very predictable. And boring.


----------



## groovetube

Yes macfury, there are throngs coming back for your wit! Look at them all!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> But good enough to keep you coming back!


Coming back? I never left. It’s not like it’s your site anyway.


----------



## Macfury

Day after day!


Freddie_Biff said:


> Coming back? I never left. It’s not like it’s your site anyway.


----------



## groovetube

He’s mostly proud of the web address.


----------



## groovetube

Unvaccinated Albertans are majority of COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations, deaths: Hinshaw


Alberta's top doctor says the majority of the province's new COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations and deaths are among those who are unvaccinated or within two weeks of their first shot.




calgary.ctvnews.ca





This is the same story that is occurring in region after region. You can try to pass this off as some ‘narrative’ if you want, but at some point, people will begin to realize this isn’t any conspiracy anymore, it’s impossible that this many regions and health systems could possibly all get together and conspire together in secret. But I think we are aware that there is a group of people where facts won’t matter. They’ll dig in no matter what, and now we’re hearing many reports of these people ending up intubated and dead.

I believe that these individuals can indeed have their choice, it’s their right. But it is not their right to cause the death of others by continuing to fill up our hospitals and ICU units. So, if someone wishes to exercise their right to refuse a covid vaccination, it should be entered as such in the health system so that should they present at an emergency room with severe covid, their only option besides going back home is to be transported to a centralized field hospital. (Billed to them of course) where they will receive minimal care to make them comfortable. Perhaps morphine til the end if needed, with a limited number of vents only if there is surplus.

Because the rest of us should not have to be denied hospital care because these fools refused vaccination. I’m serious here. When the delta begins to really fly through the unvaxxed population, we may possibly see major issues if people are still continually denied surgery and emergency hospital care because of overstretched resources.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Thanks for the link.

“Dr. Craig Jenne, an infectious disease expert at the University of Calgary, said Alberta is making good progress in combating COVID-19 but risks remain.

“We do still have almost a third of Albertans with no protection and that does pose a risk,” said Jenne.

“It doesn't mean we're going to have a problem. But this is very much like a dry forest. And there is a forest fire risk that if we do get an uptick, it can spread fast and far with low vaccine rates.”

Jenne said Alberta has one of the lowest rates of vaccination in the country, despite previously leading the way.

Nearly 75 per cent of eligible Albertans have received at least one dose, while more than 60 per cent are fully vaccinated. By comparison, Ontario is nearing 80 per cent and 64 per cent, respectively.

For effective herd immunity, Jenne said more than 80 per cent of the total population needs to be fully vaccinated. Otherwise, he said Alberta could see a resurgence in COVID-19 cases.

“We will not be able to achieve herd immunity, which is a powerful aspect of public health due to vaccination, unless some of these vaccine hesitant people do get vaccinated,” he said.”

We may be enjoying our lifted restrictions at the moment but it doesn’t take a lot for the numbers to go back up again. I like the comparison to a dry forest because it’s something we can relate to with all the forest fires this summer. I just hope vaccinations will be enough, “experimental” as they may be. They’re far better than nothing.


----------



## groovetube

They won't be 'experimental' for long as they'll be fully approved very soon. I believe one of them as already submitted for approval (moderna?) I'll check again.

Oh yeah. To address yet another stupid lie. The one about skipping over testing on animals. Incredible that people can't take 5 minutes to check. It was actually, on mice and macaques. Both Pfizer and Moderna conducted these tests simultaneously as phase one was happening, to save time as a worldwide pandemic was taking down economies around the world. 








Pfizer and Moderna did not skip animal trials


CLAIM: The Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are mRNAs vaccines that skipped animal trials because using mRNA vaccines on animals triggers dangerous inflammation...




apnews.com


----------



## Macfury

I remember someone saying that drug abusers shouldn't receive medical care. I don't think that would go over too well with many people.


----------



## groovetube

And nor should it. Only an idiot would compare addiction to pure stupidity.


----------



## groovetube

Conservative radio host Phil Valentine hospitalized with COVID: 'Fighting for his life'


The SuperTalk 99.7 WTN's family said he was in a "very serious condition" and planned to "vigorously advocate" for COVID vaccines if he recovered.




www.newsweek.com





Here’s another one, who claims that well, he’s not reeeeeally an anti-vaxxer… (riiiiight…) but oh now that he’s fighting for his life with covid he plans to vigorously advocate everyone get vaccinated!

Yet another with a come to Jesus moment. Hallelujah!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Ze problem is vee get too soon oldt und too late schmart.


----------



## groovetube

The best part is he's not really an anti-vaxxer.

ha ha. pwned!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> The best part is he's not really an anti-vaxxer.
> 
> ha ha. pwned!


People claim all kinds of things when it comes to what’s politically expedient. Some even talk sh!t about vaccines but choose not to disclose their own vaccination status. Some appeal to others to get vaxxed now when they should have been advocating this for many months now. Some just don’t understand how vaccines work and speak out of ignorance. There are all kinds.


----------



## Macfury

You tell 'em Freddie... you haven't even begun to list all the kinds!


----------



## groovetube

So now we’re back to childish tantrums.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Same old same old. Anything to avoid a meaningful conversation.


----------



## eMacMan

groovetube said:


> Unvaccinated Albertans are majority of COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations, deaths: Hinshaw
> 
> 
> Alberta's top doctor says the majority of the province's new COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations and deaths are among those who are unvaccinated or within two weeks of their first shot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> calgary.ctvnews.ca


*Again fear mongering propaganda at it's best. Let's look at what diabolical Deena is not telling you.*
_Alberta Covid hospitalizations peaked on May 13 with 737 in hospital, but it's unknown how many were there at least partly due to Covid. Best guess 350-400
The peak for those in ICU with Covid was on May 19 with 187 in ICU, but again unknown how many were there at least partly due to Covid. Best guess 90-100.
Average daily 'covid' deaths for May was 4.6/day. Going by CDC stats that's about 0.45 deaths/day due only to Covid. Perhaps 1.85 deaths/day where Covid was a contributing factor and about 2.3 deaths/day who tested positive for Covid but Covid did not contribute in any way to the death.

Alberta 'Covid' Hospitalizations on July 24 are 84, which is 11.4% of peak.
Alberta Covid ICU patients are 26, which is 14% of peak
Average 'Covid' daily deaths for July to date is a smidge less than 1 per day. Again that includes deaths because of Covid, deaths where Covid was a contributing factor, and deaths testing positive but Covid played no part in the death.

Going by previous years best guess is that Alberta should see about 78 deaths per day from all causes._


----------



## groovetube

So you’re questioning whether the cases in hospital, are even Covid. Once again! What evidence have you got? I’m afraid your intuition or previous sources aren’t good enough. Because the last time it was, ‘they didn’t test the vaccine on animals (bald faced lie) all the people dying from vaccination (again no evidence whatsoever) constant declarations that they’re are over reporting cases and deaths.

Sorry but you’re just going to have to present hard facts before any of it can be taken seriously. No matter how many angry ‘kool aid klatch’ swipes you can muster it still doesn’t change the fact that all you’ve offered, is a big fat zero.


----------



## Freddie_Biff




----------



## Macfury

Don't even try to present statistics, eMacMan. Some folks are married to COVID.



eMacMan said:


> *Again fear mongering propaganda at it's best. Let's look at what diabolical Deena is not telling you.*
> _Alberta Covid hospitalizations peaked on May 13 with 737 in hospital, but it's unknown how many were there at least partly due to Covid. Best guess 350-400
> The peak for those in ICU with Covid was on May 19 with 187 in ICU, but again unknown how many were there at least partly due to Covid. Best guess 90-100.
> Average daily 'covid' deaths for May was 4.6/day. Going by CDC stats that's about 0.45 deaths/day due only to Covid. Perhaps 1.85 deaths/day where Covid was a contributing factor and about 2.3 deaths/day who tested positive for Covid but Covid did not contribute in any way to the death.
> 
> Alberta 'Covid' Hospitalizations on July 24 are 84, which is 11.4% of peak.
> Alberta Covid ICU patients are 26, which is 14% of peak
> Average 'Covid' daily deaths for July to date is a smidge less than 1 per day. Again that includes deaths because of Covid, deaths where Covid was a contributing factor, and deaths testing positive but Covid played no part in the death.
> 
> Going by previous years best guess is that Alberta should see about 78 deaths per day from all causes._


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Don't even try to present statistics, eMacMan. Some folks are married to COVID.


Makes me chuckle to see you ending up at the bottom of the barrel with that sort. That and your web address. You made it! 

LOL.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Don't even try to present statistics, eMacMan. Some folks are married to COVID.


I do forget how terrified the Kovid Kool-aid Krew members are of numbers and math. Personally when someone tells me to be afraid the first thing I do is look at the numbers. In this case the numbers were screaming that Diabolical Deena was blowing smoke.

Probably should also have mentioned that the first wave peaked on May 7, 2020 with a seven day average of 186 deaths/day. That's for all of Canada. By July 25, 2020 that average was down to 6.0 deaths/day. The second wave peaked on January 24, 2021 at 154 deaths/day. By July 25, 2021 it was at 7.6 deaths/day. The clear conclusion is that the vaccines and masks have accomplished no more in 2021, than did the end of cold and flu season in 2020.


----------



## groovetube

See? Told you it would be back snarling about the ‘Kool aid klatch’ because that’s all it can do. It’s just an angry nobody that obviously, isn’t playing with a full deck.

Let’s see here. First we had vaccines are killing more people than covid, based on… zero. Unreliable data that even the site they got it from can barely defend.

Then we had the covid cases hospitals are reporting are way over reported. Again, no evidence. Zero, just a bunch of stats with no rhyme or reason, but enough to impress macfury!!

Now, it completely ignores that the surges were all tamed by mask mandates and lockdowns. Even to most conservative premiers who resisted these had to give in and admit, this was effective. 

There is now the ridiculous “clear conclusions” that masks and vaccines don’t work. Again, based on, nothing. Zero, zilch. But admitting this would require one to accept the obvious, that current surges in the US is almost all unvaccinated. But these types are simply, too stupid, too proud to admit they’re wrong.

So that’s where this thread will go. Continuous, useless numbskull crap, with a healthy sprinkling of macfury cozying up to the nutjobs.

Awesome job making this a place of real rational discussion guys! 👏👏👏👏👏😂😂😂😂😂🍺🍺🍺🍺


----------



## groovetube

Oh. And I almost forgot. While macfury was so busy cozying up to the anti- vaxxers, he was posting chicken little articles that declared Canada wouldn’t reach 20% til well in October! An odd thing to complain about given his support of all the nonsense about vaccines killing people!

Well we’ve now surpassed even the U.K. 60% plus and going strong. We will soon see, the absolute sheer stupidity of these claims when the delta starts surging through the unvaccinated. But I suspect, much like the feeble minded ones that still declare covid a Democrat hoax as they are pulled from ventilators, they will still not admit it.

And you are all the same bunch of clowns that complained about Freddie’s math? Ha ha ha. Priceless!!! 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂


----------



## Freddie_Biff

As Robert Plant once said, ooooh, it makes me wonder. 

It has failed to explain why, if vaccines don’t work, the number of cases of CoVid have decreased dramatically since vaccines have been introduced. And it has also not explained why cases increase in places where there are very few vaccinated people. It probably has no idea why variants flourish in unvaccinated populations. That’s some interesting math for sure. And so it goes.


----------



## groovetube

Insanity is, expecting any kind of rational argument with real facts from the anti-vaxx covid is a democrat hoax crowd. Oh oops they don’t like being called anti-vaxx. Except that they are posting all of the same fake made up nonsense the anti-vaxxers are posting on social media. Or did they… not notice. It’s the new thing right? Spout all the white anti-vaxxers do and whine you’re not an anti-vaxxer.

They act as though no one else wants to seek the truth. That’s kinda the basis of their stupidity. The rest of us in no way wNt to be swept up in some kind of global conspiracy anymore than they do. But these types fall prey to the ‘truth they don’t want you to hear’ scams. Trump was brilliant at manipulating the dumbest of the dumb down south. Now, he and his pals are just lootin the idiots down there with stop the steal, throwing a wrench into Biden’s vaccination drive (which is the real basis for all that anti vaccination crap you saw on fox and all the right wing dummy channels) I hear he’s got 75 million in his slush…er, super pac that isn’t being spent on election saving but apparently, for his personal and staff travel and uh, expenses. And his legal costs. Because you know these billionaires who care about you so much, they don’t pay their own legal costs. These yokels repeating anti-vaxx stop the steal da Mexicans will pay for the wall numbskullery.

They never did address the head scratcher that, not only was the vaccines developed under trumps time in office with his support, but he and his whole family, likely all his rich buddies too, all took the vaccine. Then the reports of how Fox News themselves, even while spewing anti-vaxx crap on their airwaves got their own form of vaccine passport system for all employees before entering their buildings! You simply cannot make this stuff up!!! Oh right. We got some feeble crap about trump supporters being more likely to think for themselves. HA! Well reality just slapped that in the face!

This is the kind of mind set you are asking to rationally explain how they came to their conclusions. It’s also why you very rarely see anyone else really ask questions here. Despite the bragging about handing their asses and people not being brave enough to come in here to be questioned, they sure go off like a Roman candle if you ever dare question these types!


----------



## Macfury

The question is not whether they work at all, but what they actually state they will do.

Freddie, on a very basic informational level would you agree that public health information states that if you have a COVID jab, that it has a high efficacy (90+%)in preventing severe symptoms, but that it is unclear how effective they are in preventing you from getting or transmitting COVID?



Freddie_Biff said:


> It has failed to explain why, if vaccines don’t work, the number of cases of CoVid have decreased dramatically since vaccines have been introduced. And it has also not explained why cases increase in places where there are very few vaccinated people. It probably has no idea why variants flourish in unvaccinated populations.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> The question is not whether they work at all, but what they actually state they will do.
> 
> Freddie, on a very basic informational level would you agree that public health information states that if you have a COVID jab, that it has a high efficacy (90+%)in preventing severe symptoms, but that it is unclear how effective they are in preventing you from getting or transmitting COVID?


You keep implying that this is some big secret of scam they're playing on us, with trickery of numbers...

The fact that you are asking one of the most basic questions with easily found information makes your sniping in here laughable. With a newly vaccinated population it takes time to determine a hard enough number for actual transmission, if they released early and changed it later y'all would just screech flip-flopping. (Like y'all did with Fauci on masks...) . Especially given the newer growing dominance of a way more infectious variant now ripping through the countries which would change this number possibly in real time... This is painfully simple, yet you delve into this debate, with that??? They have determined it is significantly less likely to transmit, and we will likely begin to see more concrete numbers on this soon enough. But given pretty much all the reasons for us needing lockdowns and various mitigation efforts is now happening amongst the unvaccinated, it's time to stop pretending that vaccination is bad. This will become much clearer as the big drop in covid numbers rises again come the fall and we'll see where the hospitalizations and death are. When that happens I bet there'll be a lot of anti-vaxxers suddenly changing their tune pretty fast. You wanna put your trust into ivermectin? All the best to ya I guess.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> As Robert Plant once said, ooooh, it makes me wonder.
> 
> It has failed to explain why, if vaccines don’t work, the number of cases of CoVid have decreased dramatically since vaccines have been introduced. And it has also not explained why cases increase in places where there are very few vaccinated people. It probably has no idea why variants flourish in unvaccinated populations. That’s some interesting math for sure. And so it goes.


I think what Macfury here really wants to do, is get you entangled in a useless back and forth over the rate of transmissibility between vaccinated people, and skip over the obvious, which is the whole reason for these punishing lockdowns in the first place is precisely what these vaccines are proving to solve.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Insanity is, expecting any kind of rational argument with real facts from the anti-vaxx covid is a democrat hoax crowd. Oh oops they don’t like being called anti-vaxx. Except that they are posting all of the same fake made up nonsense the anti-vaxxers are posting on social media. Or did they… not notice. It’s the new thing right? Spout all the white anti-vaxxers do and whine you’re not an anti-vaxxer.
> 
> They act as though no one else wants to seek the truth. That’s kinda the basis of their stupidity. The rest of us in no way wNt to be swept up in some kind of global conspiracy anymore than they do. But these types fall prey to the ‘truth they don’t want you to hear’ scams. Trump was brilliant at manipulating the dumbest of the dumb down south. Now, he and his pals are just lootin the idiots down there with stop the steal, throwing a wrench into Biden’s vaccination drive (which is the real basis for all that anti vaccination crap you saw on fox and all the right wing dummy channels) I hear he’s got 75 million in his slush…er, super pac that isn’t being spent on election saving but apparently, for his personal and staff travel and uh, expenses. And his legal costs. Because you know these billionaires who care about you so much, they don’t pay their own legal costs. These yokels repeating anti-vaxx stop the steal da Mexicans will pay for the wall numbskullery.
> 
> They never did address the head scratcher that, not only was the vaccines developed under trumps time in office with his support, but he and his whole family, likely all his rich buddies too, all took the vaccine. Then the reports of how Fox News themselves, even while spewing anti-vaxx crap on their airwaves got their own form of vaccine passport system for all employees before entering their buildings! You simply cannot make this stuff up!!! Oh right. We got some feeble crap about trump supporters being more likely to think for themselves. HA! Well reality just slapped that in the face!
> 
> This is the kind of mind set you are asking to rationally explain how they came to their conclusions. It’s also why you very rarely see anyone else really ask questions here. Despite the bragging about handing their asses and people not being brave enough to come in here to be questioned, they sure go off like a Roman candle if you ever dare question these types!


You’re right. Pretty much a dead end. Deniers gonna deny.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> The question is not whether they work at all, but what they actually state they will do.
> 
> Freddie, on a very basic informational level would you agree that public health information states that if you have a COVID jab, that it has a high efficacy (90+%)in preventing severe symptoms, but that it is unclear how effective they are in preventing you from getting or transmitting COVID?


Yup. No one has ever claimed they are 100% guaranteed to prevent you from getting Covid. But they’re a hell of a lot better than nothing at all. Your point?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

S’more from Alabama. 



> An Alabama mother who lost her son to covid says not getting the vaccine is her biggest regret
> 
> These days, Christy Carpenter finds strength in her family and faith. But on some days, one question keeps ringing in her head: “Why?”
> 
> After weeks of battling through oxygen treatments, her 28-year-old son died in the hospital two months after being diagnosed with covid-19.
> 
> Now in Carpenter’s Alabama home, the room belonging to Curt, her “beautiful baby boy” and firstborn, remains empty — a painful reminder of a life that could have been saved if the family had decided to get vaccinated, she said.
> 
> “It took watching my son die and me suffering the effects of covid for us to realize we need the vaccine,” the mother said. “We did not get vaccinated when we had the opportunity and regret that so much now.”


 https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/07/26/covid-vaccine-regrets/]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Macfury

Nope. Neither am I claiming they are 0% effective. You consider Dr. Fauci an expert. His latest statement is that people who have received double jabs need to wear masks. My point is that you can't blame the Delta variant on people who haven't been jabbed. Everyone is capable of spreading it, according to Fauci, even though those who have been jabbed will be less severely affected.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Yup. No one has ever claimed they are 100% guaranteed to prevent you from getting Covid. But they’re a hell of a lot better than nothing at all. Your point?


----------



## groovetube

And he’s gonna keep beatin that dead horse. It’s just what he does!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> And he’s gonna keep beatin that dead horse. It’s just what he does!


He must have a thing for dead horses. Or for beating things.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> He must have a thing for dead horses. Or for beating things.


Wait til he finds out that the suggestion for fully vaccinated people wearing masks is more about mitigating the impact on the unvaccinated than the vaccinated population. Since the unvaccinated is now overwhelmingly the problem that is beginning to fill Hospitals again. Wait til the fall. Many of these sorts will begin to change their tune or become ghosts…

Oh yeah. KOOL AID KLATCH! 😂😂😂🍺🍺🍺


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Wait til he finds out that the suggestion for fully vaccinated people wearing masks is more about mitigating the impact on the unvaccinated than the vaccinated population. Since the unvaccinated is now overwhelmingly the problem that is beginning to fill Hospitals again. Wait til the fall. Many of these sorts will begin to change their tune or become ghosts…
> 
> Oh yeah. KOOL AID KLATCH!


And for the record, is was actually Flavor Aid, though they did use some Koolaid as well.


----------



## groovetube

Just mocking it’s useless responses.


----------



## Macfury

Even though you're something of a dead horse, I would never beat you.

Still, that post should have been easy for you to refute, instead of sidestep.



Freddie_Biff said:


> He must have a thing for dead horses. Or for beating things.


----------



## groovetube

Refute what? You won’t even admit you’re vaccinated!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Refute what? You won’t even admit you’re vaccinated!


Bwahahahahahahahaha!!


----------



## Macfury

I'll bet "all the good people" will come back after seeing that string of high-level thoughts!


----------



## Macfury

With the Delta variant becoming the predominant strain in the UK, these numbers are interesting. As numbers rise, deaths are declining significantly. It looks like the Delta variant is more transmissive, far less deadly.
















.


----------



## groovetube

My god. Macfury is still thinking people will magically show back up here. It’s like the glass managerie it’s so sad.

sorry pal that ship sailed a loooooooong time ago.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> My god. Macfury is still thinking people will magically show back up here. It’s like the glass managerie it’s so sad.
> 
> sorry pal that ship sailed a loooooooong time ago.


Like a good four or five years at least. You lose track of time in an echo chamber.


----------



## groovetube

I LOL-ed at this headline this morning. I thought of the crew here, with a fake moustache and nose, trench coat and hat. ha ha ha ha. It's okaaaaay, we won't laugh....


----------



## groovetube

Imagine, taking a life saving vaccine, and having to make up some crap to hide it.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Imagine, taking a life saving vaccine, and having to make up some crap to hide it.


Sounds like a certain libertarian we know…


----------



## groovetube

It’s really just, unbelievably childish. Really. I’ve pretty much said it all here now, there’s nothing I’ve said that many who left haven’t said amongst everyone at one point. I know the fav thing is well forums are a dying breed but we all know that ain’t why there was a mass fleeing here.

law long as it keeps on keeping on, the idea that there’s be any more traffic here behind a few stragglers here and there, well they’ve had 8 years to find ‘normalacy’. There could be a somewhat decent chat about covid here but, well, just scan back to the start.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Same old same old. Some things never change.


----------



## Macfury

News from the US:









CDC study shows 74% of people infected in Massachusetts Covid outbreak were fully vaccinated


The CDC data published Friday was based on 469 cases of Covid associated with multiple summer events and large public gatherings in July in Massachusetts.




www.cnbc.com


----------



## groovetube

If you had been following the latest from the CDC etc., you would have learned that they are finding that with the delta variant it's so infectious and deadly that even vaccinated can get infected in higher numbers making it far more dangerous for those unvaccinated. But if you read further, its the vaccinated population that is overwhelming protected from severe disease, and only a small number (in this case hundreds I guess) test positive and may have very mild symptoms. There is a very small number that may have to go to hospital but they are usually those with compromised immune systems and other co-morbidities. It shows how effective the vaccine is in preventing disease beyond what one might experience with cold or flu at worst.

Still overwhelmingly unvaccinated in hospital and almost all deaths are unvaccinated. As everything opens wide open, infections are going to skyrocket and if you're still dumb enough to be anti-covid vax, good luck to ya. Yer gonna need it... Hope that Ivermectin or whatever snake oil that's been sold you works out for ya!


----------



## groovetube

There are now calls for Ontario to close its borders to people living in Alberta


With case counts staying relatively low and more than 80 per cent of adults now at least partially-vaccinated against COVID-19, Ontario seems to be...




www.blogto.com





Ha! Even Doug Ford isn’t as stupid as Jason Kenny


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> If you had been following the latest from the CDC etc., you would have learned that they are finding that with the delta variant it's so infectious and deadly that even vaccinated can get infected in higher numbers making it far more dangerous for those unvaccinated. But if you read further, its the vaccinated population that is overwhelming protected from severe disease, and only a small number (in this case hundreds I guess) test positive and may have very mild symptoms. There is a very small number that may have to go to hospital but they are usually those with compromised immune systems and other co-morbidities. It shows how effective the vaccine is in preventing disease beyond what one might experience with cold or flu at worst.
> 
> Still overwhelmingly unvaccinated in hospital and almost all deaths are unvaccinated. As everything opens wide open, infections are going to skyrocket and if you're still dumb enough to be anti-covid vax, good luck to ya. Yer gonna need it... Hope that Ivermectin or whatever snake oil that's been sold you works out for ya!


And don’t forget the bleach and get some UV rays in those lungs.


----------



## Macfury

You do realize that this is an actual treatment for severe lung infection, right?



Freddie_Biff said:


> ...and get some UV rays in those lungs.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> And don’t forget the bleach and get some UV rays in those lungs.


The amount of misinformation these sorts have shoveled of late, they have zero credibility whatsoever. They won’t even admit they got the vaccine because they’re terrified their buddies will mock them.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> The amount of misinformation these sorts have shoveled of late, they have zero credibility whatsoever. They won’t even admit they got the vaccine because they’re terrified their buddies will mock them.


Pretty predictable.


----------



## groovetube

Its funny. All the bragging about 'giving as good as it gets', well it seems it's actually the other way around now eh? Suddenly quiet. I guess some don't like having it handed back. not so pleasant is it?

It's only bad when groovetube does it. It's ok if they do though eh? same old. I guess that's the 'normal' they want to return to. where its ok for them to run around harassing others with 'hey bigot' and if that person leaves they'll just find someone else to harass until they leave too. There's almost 8 years of this pattern here.


----------



## groovetube

So now that that is out of the way, back to reality. By now, most have seen the news that unpublished data is showing that the new delta variant is as contagious as chicken pox, except now, it is surging in the unvaccinated population, particularly hitting health units hard. While the feeble minded spend useless time on mewling that vaccinated people can get infected as well (duh...), and they'll gleefully post articles showing that vaccinated people can get infected as well, people smart enough to get vaccinated are largely protected from hospitalization and death, which pretty much what we need to return to normal. 

Right wing news er, 'entertainment' sources have been flooding social media and their channels with misinformation about the vaccine to the point where now, there is a very clear difference in the number of vaccinated between right wing republicans and those able to think for themselves, and get protected. While those same feeble minded sorts argue amongst themselves crying that their fake data showed that more people died of the vaccine than covid itself, they're now about to be schooled on what fake news can do to people lives. All the railing against lockdowns, well, ironically, they themselves will be the reason for added restrictions, and we can all expect these dimwits to get outraged by it still.

Man. There truly are, a lot of incredibly stupid people in this world. I wouldn't care really, but unfortunately these idiots are getting people killed.


----------



## eMacMan

The fear mongers have been pushing the Indian Variant, now politically corrected to the Delta Variant, since about the beginning of the year. Some charts to illustrate the 'devastating impact' of same. First two are from the Canadian epidemiology website. On the cases chart you will note the huge uptick in cases once vaccination program got into full swing. Probably because they were testing the vaccinated and the spike protein that vaccine generates was causing a lot of false positives.
















The final chart I put together after noticing that there were no charts on current hospitalizations and ICU patients. Patched together from daily provincial reports from the beginning of the year.
NOTE: I did not discover that Ontario did not include ICU hospitalizations in the the regular Covid hospitalization category until the end of June. When I discovered that I also discovered that about 25-30% of their Covid labeled ICU patients are testing negative.
IOW Until the end of June Hospitalizations should be a bit higher than shown and ICU numbers a bit lower. Either way it's accurate enough to show you how accurate the claims about Indian Variant are.








An interesting correlation between the beginning of March through June. Hospitalizations, and ICU hospitalizations went up at about the same time as the jab program got into high gear. Quite possibly these were admissions relating to adverse reactions to the jab, as those who have been jabbed will test positive for the spike protein until their body stops generating it. Remember PCR tests for that spike protein, not the virus itself.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> The fear mongers have been pushing the Indian Variant, now politically corrected to the Delta Variant, since about the beginning of the year. Some charts to illustrate the 'devastating impact' of same. First two are from the Canadian epidemiology website. Remember PCR tests for that spike protein, not the virus itself.


I've been trying to find out how they test for "the Delta variant" as opposed to any other, when the PCR test recognizes only the basic spike protein.


----------



## groovetube

Because it’s a huge conspiracy. Every top virologist on the planet is all in on it. And you two geniuses have discovered it!

good work you two! 😂😂😂


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> I've been trying to find out how they test for "the Delta variant" as opposed to any other, when the PCR test recognizes only the basic spike protein.





groovetube said:


> Because it’s a huge conspiracy. Every top virologist on the planet is all in on it. And you two geniuses have discovered it!
> 
> good work you two! 😂😂😂


Interesting that GT chose to side step. Surely his globalist heroes, have told him exactly how they do it. That said I too have as yet to track down any clearly written explanation. Guess we'll just have to give GT another chance to demonstrate his prowess at the two step.

Actually most of the top virologists dispute the officially sanctioned narrative, often at the risk of their livelihoods.


----------



## groovetube

After your being totally wrong about not testing on animals and claiming the vaccine kills more than covid does and many more, I’ll sidestep the rest of your stupidity thanks. Pretty much everything you’ve posted is unintelligible nonsense. Why would anyone address it directly?

maybe your buddy macfury admires you but I really doubt anyone else really does. Keep on keepin on!


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> I've been trying to find out how they test for "the Delta variant" as opposed to any other, when the PCR test recognizes only the basic spike protein.


As I said before. It makes chuckle how you’ve been reduced to cozying up to this misinformation genius to pull off your trolls.
My work here is done!


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> I've been trying to find out how they test for "the Delta variant" as opposed to any other, when the PCR test recognizes only the basic spike protein.


PCR doesn't identify variant.

Identified by difference in symptoms or in some cases antigen tests (hospital stays).


----------



## smashedbanana

eMacMan said:


> The fear mongers have been pushing the Indian Variant, now politically corrected to the Delta Variant, since about the beginning of the year. Some charts to illustrate the 'devastating impact' of same. First two are from the Canadian epidemiology website. On the cases chart you will note the huge uptick in cases once vaccination program got into full swing. Probably because they were testing the vaccinated and the spike protein that vaccine generates was causing a lot of false positives.
> View attachment 94036
> 
> View attachment 94037
> 
> The final chart I put together after noticing that there were no charts on current hospitalizations and ICU patients. Patched together from daily provincial reports from the beginning of the year.
> NOTE: I did not discover that Ontario did not include ICU hospitalizations in the the regular Covid hospitalization category until the end of June. When I discovered that I also discovered that about 25-30% of their Covid labeled ICU patients are testing negative.
> IOW Until the end of June Hospitalizations should be a bit higher than shown and ICU numbers a bit lower. Either way it's accurate enough to show you how accurate the claims about Indian Variant are.
> View attachment 94039
> 
> An interesting correlation between the beginning of March through June. Hospitalizations, and ICU hospitalizations went up at about the same time as the jab program got into high gear. Quite possibly these were admissions relating to adverse reactions to the jab, as those who have been jabbed will test positive for the spike protein until their body stops generating it. Remember PCR tests for that spike protein, not the virus itself.


I will say it again, if you don't want to get the vaccine don't.

But stop deluding yourself that you can do valid, accurate medical research over the internet.

Medicine is not a hobby. Leave it to the experts!!!


----------



## groovetube

Indeed. After losing a few dear friends I lost patience with this sort of thing. Science changes as more data is gathered. There will more relevations as this whole thing progresses, but what’s clear right now, given 97% plus of hospitalizations and deaths are unvaccinated, that now more than ever, it is important to put aside political agendas, and listen to the science that is saving lives right now, in real time. 

Spreading misinformation, is resulting people losing their lives. This is why even media like Fox News is backpedaling, they’ve realized there’s likely liability issues.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> PCR doesn't identify variant.
> 
> Identified by difference in symptoms or in some cases antigen tests (hospital stays).


Antigen tests are not going to be conducted on many people (few require hospitalization), so that leaves self-reported symptoms from people not requiring hospitalization to track the ascendance of variants. Does that seem accurate to you?


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> Antigen tests are not going to be conducted on many people (few require hospitalization), so that leaves self-reported symptoms from people not requiring hospitalization to track the ascendance of variants. Does that seem accurate to you?


If you get a positive PCR test you receive additional contact from a Ontario Public Health unit. There is a questionnaire to identify symptoms, exposure risks, etc. I think some variant information is extrapolated from that.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Antigen tests are not going to be conducted on many people (few require hospitalization), so that leaves self-reported symptoms from people not requiring hospitalization to track the ascendance of variants. Does that seem accurate to you?


yet more misinformation…

Here. Let me google that for you: How are COVID-19 variants discovered, tested and tracked?

for non medical people it’s fairly simple to find obvious answers. I would suggest this as a basic effort.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> If you get a positive PCR test you receive additional contact from a Ontario Public Health unit. There is a questionnaire to identify symptoms, exposure risks, etc. I think some variant information is extrapolated from that.


So essentially a very small sampling are antigen-tested. This is why I don't have a lot of confidence in variant tracking. If one can attack VAERS for self-reporting of symptoms, even to health care authorities, then self-reporting of symptoms should also be questioned in identification of variants.


----------



## groovetube

Incredible that you were all over the VAERS debacle, which is totally without any verification and even the CDC themselves declared the data completely unreliable entirely, yet here you are moaning that small samplings from medical labs and the conclusions of top medical experts is suspect. I realize that’s kinda what you do though…

unless you are a medical professional in this field, I will listen to the opinion of experts, and not a pair of nobodies on a forum. Therefore, no one cares that you have confidence in variant tracking unless you can offer something real.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Deniers gonna deny. But some will still get vaxxed and just not tell the homeboys. The best of both worlds!


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> So essentially a very small sampling are antigen-tested. This is why I don't have a lot of confidence in variant tracking. If one can attack VAERS for self-reporting of symptoms, even to health care authorities, then self-reporting of symptoms should also be questioned in identification of variants.


Yes I agree.

Self reporting does not work. I had a near miss at work when someone came into the office one day and got a positive test the next day. I got a call from HR a couple days later and had to get tested. I asked why my covid app didnt notifiy me. Guess the person never bothered to use the app..

The broader question is do we as lay people care about variant tracking? Covid is covid to us.

The delta variant is more contagious so that is the important message.

But then again everything is more contageous! Being issolated has lowered everyones immune systems to record lows. RSV is running rampant in kids right now..


----------



## groovetube

I think dismissing medical experts using smaller sampling to determine trends is very wrong headed. There's no question self reporting is problematic, but it is particularly problematic if that's all someone relies on for a major conclusion, such as what we saw with the declaration that vaccines are killing more than Covid is. 

That simply isn't the case here at all, but that isn't stopping macfury from implying it is. Comparing this to the VAERS debacle here in this thread is quite simply false equivalency.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> Yes I agree.
> 
> Self reporting does not work. I had a near miss at work when someone came into the office one day and got a positive test the next day. I got a call from HR a couple days later and had to get tested. I asked why my covid app didnt notifiy me. Guess the person never bothered to use the app..
> 
> The broader question is do we as lay people care about variant tracking? Covid is covid to us.
> 
> The delta variant is more contagious so that is the important message.
> 
> But then again everything is more contageous! Being issolated has lowered everyones immune systems to record lows. RSV is running rampant in kids right now..


I'm interested in which variants are at play, because it tells you about the way that a specific variant acts. What we've seen in the UK is a large increase in case numbers, at the same time as a sharp reduction in number of deaths:









United Kingdom COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer


United Kingdom Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.




www.worldometers.info





That path appears to be likely in a few US states where Delta appears dominant as well. Though not a rule, typical long-term evoloution of a virus such as this involves increasing transmissibility, and decreasing fatality, which is optimum for virus survival. Hoping that this is the case.

As usual, nice to have a reasonable discussion with you.


----------



## groovetube

Oh macfury. Don’t pretend. Everyone here has seen your troll tactics on full display for years. You aren’t fooling anyone. If you really were about reasonable discussion then you would cease your incessant need to wind up and troll people. We both know what I’m talking about here don't we. Then I'll back off calling you out. Win win. I won't hold my breath though.

Before anyone can declare the delta variant as having a sharp decrease in deaths, they should first see what the medical experts are saying right now, and what the data is currently showing. Because that is NOT what they are saying. It isn't just about the decrease in deaths, it's also about overwhelming the hospitals, which is now seeing younger people in ICU, combined with a significant number of the older population being vaccinated, which may be more of a factor in less deaths. That doesn't however help with a sustainable health system and not to mention, a large number of younger people impacted possibly for life health wise. There is far more to this than you seem to imply. Let’s also not forget, the country where this variant was first discovered, largely unvaccinated, and the catastrophic infections and death! Still going to pull that nonsense? So I don’t think your uneducated reference to worldometers is a better opinion than all the medical experts around the world. Sorry. E for effort on that attemp on a wind up!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I'm interested in which variants are at play, because it tells you about the way that a specific variant acts. What we've seen in the UK is a large increase in case numbers, at the same time as a sharp reduction in number of deaths:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> United Kingdom COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
> 
> 
> United Kingdom Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.worldometers.info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That path appears to be likely in a few US states where Delta appears dominant as well. Though not a rule, typical long-term evoloution of a virus such as this involves increasing transmissibility, and decreasing fatality, which is optimum for virus survival. Hoping that this is the case.
> 
> As usual, nice to have a reasonable discussion with you.


Hey Macfury: you can have a reasonable discussion with anyone if you just try. It’s not that difficult.


----------



## groovetube

He pulls this ‘I’m a victim who just wants reasonable discussion’ routine all the time. How pathetic is it he’s still here pulling the same childish crap, still!

People just got tired of his antics and just left. Uh hey it’s groovetubes fault because I call him out. That’s called gaslighting. EhMax failed to stand up to these jerks and look what was left at this place! These arseholes would wind people up until they got frustrated and lashed out and ehMax would ban them. Watched it happen over and over until well, the mods were ditched and then it was a free for all for these jerks.

Now look. Ghost town. Good job macfury and pals!


----------



## groovetube

Sky News Australia barred for week by YouTube over Covid misinformation


The digital giant bans the channel from uploading new content for a week over misinformation breaches.



www.bbc.com





So apparently, spreading clear misinformation that has been shown to cause people to lose their lives, is “thinking freely”.

Much like how Jim Jones’s followers were “thinking freely” I guess!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

The mind boggles.


----------



## groovetube

Florida breaks record for COVID-19 hospitalizations


A day after it recorded the most new daily cases since the start of the pandemic, Florida on Sunday broke a previous record for current hospitalizations set more than a year ago before vaccines were available.




www.ctvnews.ca





Alright Florida!!! How’s that “don’t Fauci my florida” working for you?

Dumber than a bag of hammers. It’s unfortunate to see the same stupidity play out in a number of states, and in a few places here as well. At what point are right wing politicians going to stop playing politics with people’s lives and listen to science. This is beyond frustrating and heartbreaking to watch.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Texas, Florida, California, some of the most densely populated states are all going up, thanks mostly to the unvaccinated holdouts. How long do these anti-maskers and Covid-deniers want this to go on? The delta variant is here and it really doesn’t care what your political affiliation is. It’s just looking for more bodies to use as hosts. Viruses just want to survive and will mutate to do so. For God’s sake people, get vaccinated. It would be good to see an end to this pandemic someday.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Texas, Florida, California, some of the most densely populated states are all going up, thanks mostly to the unvaccinated holdouts. How long do these anti-maskers and Covid-deniers want this to go on? The delta variant is here and it really doesn’t care what your political affiliation is. It’s just looking for more bodies to use as hosts. Viruses just want to survive and will mutate to do so. For God’s sake people, get vaccinated. It would be good to see an end to this pandemic someday.


It doesn't matter that we all watched in horror as the delta variant took India down, images of them running out of wood to cremate the bodies. But still, you've got the non-medical trolls that think it's clever to snag a couple numbers from worldometer, and act like they know more than the majority of the world's medical experts on this. This kind of, not just brainless, but outright malicious spreading of misinformation is causing millions to make choices based on this. And many are losing their lives. And that is 'thinking freely for yourself?' And no matter what, they will ignore this reality. No. Matter. What.

This isn't about difference of opinion. This is life and death. And any of those sorts need to think long and hard about the spread of misinformation. Because I can pretty much guarantee history will not be kind to them any more than it's been to the lunatics that got in the way in times past with terrible diseases.


----------



## groovetube

Delta spreads 'like wildfire' as doctors study whether it makes patients sicker


With a new wave of COVID-19 infections fueled by the Delta variant striking countries worldwide, disease experts are scrambling to learn whether the latest version of coronavirus is making people - mainly the unvaccinated - sicker than before.




www.ctvnews.ca







> The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention warned that Delta, first identified in India and now dominant worldwide, is "likely more severe" than earlier versions of the virus, according to an internal report made public on Friday.


“Likely more severe”??? Don’t these doctors know that macfury on ehmac studied wodometers and has declared the death rate way down so, we have nothing to worry about! Don’t these doctors have worlometer??


----------



## groovetube

Utah will give KN95 masks to children as the Delta variant fuels Covid-19 hospitalizations nationwide | CNN


The surge of Covid-19 fueled by the Delta variant and low vaccination rates is sending the country backward in the pandemic, with hospitalizations reaching wintertime levels.




www.cnn.com





Hospitals everywhere are filling up with youngerpatients getting sicker??? What? Don’t they know macfury on ehmac checked worldometer and said everything is going down?

what’s wrong with these people??? Macfury you better call them up and set them straight!!!


----------



## groovetube

Saw some nincompoop on Facebook share this:



> ME: hello CDC, should I get poke if I already had Covid?
> 
> CDC: “Yes, you should be poked regardless of whether you already had COVID-19. That’s because experts do not yet know how long you are protected from getting sick again after recovering from COVID-19.”
> 
> ME: Oh, okay, we don’t know how long natural immunity lasts. Got it. So, how long does poke-induced immunity last?
> 
> CDC: “There is still a lot we are learning about COVID-19 pokes and CDC is constantly reviewing evidence and updating guidance. We don’t know how long protection lasts for those who are poked.”
> 
> ME: Okay … but wait a second. I thought you said the reason I need the poke was because we don’t know how long my natural immunity lasts, but it seems like you’re saying we ALSO don’t know how long poke immunity lasts either. So, how exactly is the poke immunity better than my natural immunity?
> 
> CDC: …
> 
> ME: Uh … alright. But, haven’t there been a bunch of studies suggesting that natural immunity could last for years or decades?
> 
> CDC: Yes.
> 
> NEWYORKTIMES: “Years, maybe even decades, according to a new study.”
> 
> ME: Ah. So natural immunity might last longer than poke immunity?
> 
> CDC: Possibly. You never know.
> 
> ME: Okay. If I get the poke, does that mean I won’t get sick?
> 
> BRITAIN: Nope. We are just now entering a seasonal spike and about half of our infections and hospital admissions are poked people.
> 
> ME: CDC, is this true? Are there a lot of people in the U.S. catching Covid after getting the poke?
> 
> CDC: We stopped tracking breakthrough cases. We accept voluntary reports of breakthroughs but aren’t out there looking for them.
> 
> ME: Does that mean that if someone comes in the hospital with Covid, you don’t track them because they’ve been poked? You only track the UN-poked Covid cases?
> 
> CDC: That’s right.
> 
> ME: Oh, okay. Hmm. Well, if I can still get sick after I get the poke, how is it helping me?
> 
> CDC: We never said you wouldn’t get sick. We said it would reduce your chances of serious illness or death.
> 
> ME: Oh, sorry. Alright, exactly how much does it reduce my chance of serious illness or death.
> 
> CDC: We don’t know “exactly.”
> 
> ME: Oh. Then what’s your best estimate for how much risk reduction there is?
> 
> CDC: We don’t know, okay? Next question.
> 
> ME: Um, if I’m healthy and don’t want the poke, is there any reason I should get it?
> 
> CDC: Yes, for the collective.
> 
> ME: How does the collective benefit from me getting poked?
> 
> CDC: Because you could spread the virus to someone else who might get sick and die.
> 
> ME: Can a poked person spread the virus to someone else?
> 
> CDC: Yes.
> 
> ME: So if I get poked, I could still spread the virus to someone else?
> 
> CDC: Yes.
> 
> ME: But I thought you just said, the REASON I should get poked was to prevent me spreading the virus? How does that make sense if I can still catch Covid and spread it after getting the poke?
> 
> CDC: Never mind that. The other thing is, if you stay unpoked, there’s a chance the virus could possibly mutate into a strain that escapes the pokes protection, putting all poked people at risk.
> 
> ME: So the poke stops the virus from mutating?
> 
> CDC: No.
> 
> ME: So it can still mutate in poked people?
> 
> CDC: Yes.
> 
> ME: This seems confusing. If the poke doesn’t stop mutations, and it doesn’t stop infections, then how does me getting poked help prevent a more deadly strain from evolving to escape the poke?
> 
> CDC: You aren’t listening, okay? The bottom line is: as long as you are unpoked, you pose a threat to poked people.
> 
> ME: But what KIND of threat??
> 
> CDC: The threat that they could get a serious case of Covid and possibly die.
> 
> ME: My brain hurts. Didn’t you JUST say that the poke doesn’t keep people from catching Covid, but prevents a serious case or dying? Now it seems like you’re saying poked people can still easily die from Covid even after they got the poke just by running into an unpoked person! Which is it??
> 
> CDC: That’s it, we’re hanging up now.
> 
> ME: Wait! I just want to make sure I understand all this. So, even if I ALREADY had Covid, I should STILL get poked, because we don’t know how long natural immunity lasts, and we also don’t know how long poke immunity lasts. And I should get the poke to keep a poked person from catching Covid from me, but even if I get the poke, I can give it to the poked person anyways. And, the other poked person can still easily catch a serious case of Covid from me and die. Do I have all that right?
> And now you want me to wear a mask also.
> 
> click…
> 
> ME: Um, hello? Is anyone there?


this is the kind of absolutely numbskullery being passed around on facebook. Someone actually spent that much time writing all this out, to demonstrate just what a complete moron they are. The level of dumbassitude here is incredible.

life little wonder why, there are that many people getting the wrong information and falling for conspiracy theories.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

I think some people are just really afraid of needles and they don’t want to admit it.


----------



## groovetube

This kind sheer stupidity just galled me. I thought no one can be this stupid but, sadly I’m always proven wrong. The directive from the alt right corners is, don’t trust the vaccine, it’s all a Democrat fear campaign, masks don’t work, etc etc, despite the overwhelming evidence they’re being played. Despite the fact the top republican sleazebags shoveling this crap because it’s getting them attention and possible votes (desantis and his delusionary idea of a presidential run) all, and I mean ALL of them, got the vaccine. Even Fox News, while pedaling bullshyte conspiracy crap about “maybe they’re not telling you the vaccine doesn’t work” require vaccination proof to enter their buildings, while their supporters, are now reportedly begging for the vaccine wise the nurse has to incubate them. Only to be told, it’s too late. Good luck.

Oh! but that’s “thinking for yourself”. What a pile of shyt. What a pile of cowardly sleabag lying. Lying that leads to people losing their lives.

I have no respect for anyone playing these games. None. You want to put your life at risk, then STFU about it and do it. And don’t play the “freedom victim” when you’re asked for proof of vaccination to enter an indoor event or fly somewhere.


----------



## Macfury

If you already had COVID, would you also get injected?



Freddie_Biff said:


> I think some people are just really afraid of needles and they don’t want to admit it.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> If you already had COVID, would you also get injected?


Trump did. Would you?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Trump did. Would you?


BAM!

ha ha ha


----------



## Macfury

No. You?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Trump did. Would you?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Wouldn’t or didn’t? I believe you already know my answer to that question. You can’t be too protected.


----------



## groovetube

Shhhh. He’s thinking for himself.

ha ha ha


----------



## groovetube

Shots give COVID-19 survivors big immune boost, studies show


Even people who have recovered from COVID-19 are urged to get vaccinated, especially as the extra-contagious Delta variant surges, and a new study shows survivors who ignored that advice were more than twice as likely to get reinfected.




www.ctvnews.ca





See kids, this is why you don’t listen to anonymous dingbats on forums, and pay attention to medical experts studying this.


----------



## eMacMan

groovetube said:


> Shots give COVID-19 survivors big immune boost, studies show
> 
> 
> Even people who have recovered from COVID-19 are urged to get vaccinated, especially as the extra-contagious Delta variant surges, and a new study shows survivors who ignored that advice were more than twice as likely to get reinfected.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ctvnews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See kids, this is why you don’t listen to anonymous dingbats on forums, and pay attention to medical experts studying this.


Sometimes the key words are those that are left out. It says laboratory confirmed infections, but no mention of the original infections or the reinfections being symptomatic. Given the extremely high rate of false PCR positives, it is quite possible that an extremely high percentage of these 're-infections' were never infected the first time. 

Also likely that a high percentage of the re-infections are false positives.


----------



## groovetube

“High rate of false positives…”

Is this kinda like your lies of the vaccine not being tested on animals, knowing 20 people that died of the vaccine and more people die of the vaccine than covid?

Just spewing more horse****. C’mon, mouth off about the “Kool-aid klatch” some more! That gives you more credibility. 😂

Is this the best ehmac has to offer? This crap???


----------



## groovetube

C’mon macfury, this is your cue for another useless cherry picked right wing “factoid” to make yourselves feel empowered.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> “High rate of false positives…”
> 
> Is this kinda like your lies of the vaccine not being tested on animals, knowing 20 people that died of the vaccine and more people die of the vaccine than covid?
> 
> Just spewing more horse****. C’mon, mouth off about the “Kool-aid klatch” some more! That gives you more credibility.
> 
> Is this the best ehmac has to offer? This crap???


I like that it didn’t censor “horse****.” Cool! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## groovetube

Whoops.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Whoops.


No no! No apologies! The Straight Dope has been allowing it for years. It’s so freeing! Horse****! Horse****! Horse****!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Bull****! Thought I’d try.


----------



## Macfury

Maybe you can go to the zoo and join the primates fliniging poop against the walls! Oh, so free!



Freddie_Biff said:


> It’s so freeing! Horse****! Horse****! Horse****!


----------



## groovetube

Why, you and your pals have been doin it just fine for years here!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Maybe you can go to the zoo and join the primates fliniging poop against the walls! Oh, so free!


For ****’s sake, Macfury—it’s just a word.


----------



## groovetube

Ha. Buddy walked right into that one.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

****in’ eh.


----------



## groovetube

Well, so now it's becoming clear that the huge surge in hospitalizations are the unvaccinated. While the feeble minded mutter about how vaccinated people can acquire and pass the infection, it doesnt seem to dawn on them the looming disasters their 'opinions' causes. While these morons think it's their choice to get the vaccination, what should not be their choice, is overwhelming hospitals to the point where people who require emergency medical help and surgeries get impacted to the point where they die.

I think it's time we have a database of those who refused the vaccine. If so, and you end up at hospital, you'll be redirected to a field hospital with minimal staff to keep you comfortable. And, good luck. There'll be refrigerated trucks for the bodies parked beside the field hospitals. Id say, that's one way to deal with the morons, so that they dont screw things up for the rest of us who wish to get back to our normal lives with lockdowns or disruptions in our healthcare.

I find it interesting that the anti vax types are suddenly becoming rather quiet now. Good luck with the stockpile of ivermectin!


----------



## Macfury

Here's an interesting letter eMacMan:



https://tulsaworld.com/opinion/letters/letter-unvaccinated-people-arent-going-to-change-their-minds/article_b3e70ea0-f0d2-11eb-83a9-3f61111a3540.html





> I think it is time to accept that unvaccinated people have made their decisions and move on.
> Bullying, cajoling, name-calling and demonizing folks is just as effective as getting me to lose weight.
> News flash: It's not and never has been!
> 
> I love many unvaccinated people! I love many fat people and drug addicts and smokers and people who support President Donald Trump.
> 
> While I may wish that we all make better choices, we've had ample opportunities to choose otherwise and are well aware of the consequences.
> 
> Hopefully, the health care and support systems we've set up will help if and when needed.


The healthcare system has long been supporting people who make choices others don't agree with. What do you think?


----------



## groovetube

False equivalency. But this is your specialty isn't it?

I don't really recall a time when the entire state's hospitals are so completely overwhelmed with one thing that is purely preventable, to the point where the state's population can't even get basic hospital care. Neither you, or your little buddy who spews utter bull daily seem capable of understanding this glaring problem. And you think it's bad now? ha!

This is why real action must be taken against the unvaccinated idiots who are putting everyone else's lives at risk by saturating our hospitals with their stupidity. NOW.

I suspect as the majority grows who have been vaccinated begin to see why our hospitals are in crisis and disruptions to or getting back to normal, things are going to continue to get mighty uncomfortable for those who chose to be total sheep, falling for an endless spew of absolute lies. But hey, there are lot of republican scumbags making hay on this...

Still haven't heard back on why right wing dumbasses think they're "thinking for themselves' while Trump and all his rich right wing pals, all got vaccinated, some, even after they got covid.

Silence. LOL


----------



## Freddie_Biff

The vast majority of infections and death have always been among the unvaccinated throughout the pandemic.


----------



## groovetube

It’s as if they are completely unconscious. They’ll continue to post delusions that totally ignore what’s actually occurring in the real world. Please let it conform to how I see things! Please! Hopefully that ivermectin saves them!!

But I somehow suspect even macfury is aware of this. But given his court jester status here, he'll continue stoking the other nitwit into fits of anti-vaxx spouts, because he enjoys that sort of thing.

Because you know, he appreciates "reasonable discussion" LOL.


----------



## groovetube

Dr. Catherine O'Neal: These are the darkest days of this pandemic. | There are no beds left. These are the darkest days of this pandemic. We are no longer giving adequate care to these patients. — Dr. Catherine O’Neal,... | By Our Lady of the Lake | Facebook


21M views, 31K likes, 3.2K loves, 12K comments, 210K shares, Facebook Watch Videos from Our Lady of the Lake: There are no beds left. These are the darkest days of this pandemic. We are no longer...




fb.watch





This is merely a snapshot of what’s happening at one hospital. It’s happening at many now, and is getting worse.

And the unvaccinated want to whine about being shamed? Screw’em. People are dying because of these selfish pieces of crap. Herd them into field hospitals and deny them ICU beds!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Dr. Catherine O'Neal: These are the darkest days of this pandemic. | There are no beds left. These are the darkest days of this pandemic. We are no longer giving adequate care to these patients. — Dr. Catherine O’Neal,... | By Our Lady of the Lake | Facebook
> 
> 
> 21M views, 31K likes, 3.2K loves, 12K comments, 210K shares, Facebook Watch Videos from Our Lady of the Lake: There are no beds left. These are the darkest days of this pandemic. We are no longer...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> fb.watch
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is merely a snapshot of what’s happening at one hospital. It’s happening at many now, and is getting worse.
> 
> And the unvaccinated want to whine about being shamed? Screw’em. People are dying because of these selfish pieces of crap. Herd them into field hospitals and deny them ICU beds!


No more beds means no more beds. There are no shortcuts. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## groovetube

Yep. What I suggested sounds harsh. But think about it. With almost half of the US population still yet unvaccinated, just how long do your think the rest are going to put up with no healthcare and constant disruptions? At what point does ‘don’t fauci my florida’ begin to backfire? I saw desantis mouth off about the border when he was pressed about the worsening crisis in Florida, it was just pathetic.

Then we’re treated to some asinine stupidity that the current crisis leaving those with medical emergencies turned away due to the lack of ICU beds in major hospitals somehow compares to regular times where some people who made some unhealthy choices end up in hospital. If you want reasonable discussion macfury you’re going to have to give up the court jester routine.


----------



## Macfury

Looks like only 202 serious cases across Canada right now.



Freddie_Biff said:


> No more beds means no more beds. There are no shortcuts.


----------



## groovetube

Possibly because the virus looked at Canada and thought, oh, Canada. Maybe I’ll go easier on them.

LOL


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> No more beds means no more beds. There are no shortcuts.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Honestly, I know I said I’d give this a go, but dealing with these fools I’ve had more meaningful interactions with the pissed off feral cat out in the laneway. Macfury is just a child. It’s been here for how many years, says it wants reasonable discussion but clearly, he isn’t capable. The other thing is just a complete imbecile and he’s even cozying up to that.

That’s what this is. Loserville. It’s sad to see this place that was once so vibrant, but any idea this place will pickup, is a pipe dream with this **** being flung at the wall every day. All he does is wind up anuone until they get frustrated, and that’s his childish game. As a good member here once said years ago, you’re never going to change it.

So be it.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Dr. Catherine O'Neal: These are the darkest days of this pandemic. | There are no beds left. These are the darkest days of this pandemic. We are no longer giving adequate care to these patients. — Dr. Catherine O’Neal,... | By Our Lady of the Lake | Facebook
> 
> 
> 21M views, 31K likes, 3.2K loves, 12K comments, 210K shares, Facebook Watch Videos from Our Lady of the Lake: There are no beds left. These are the darkest days of this pandemic. We are no longer...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> fb.watch
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is merely a snapshot of what’s happening at one hospital. It’s happening at many now, and is getting worse.
> 
> And the unvaccinated want to whine about being shamed? Screw’em. People are dying because of these selfish pieces of crap. Herd them into field hospitals and deny them ICU beds!


It would be nice if it were as simple as “thinning the herd” and only the unvaccinated were affected by the delta variant. But it doesn’t work that way, and all kinds of innocent people, including those under 12, also get sacrificed. I’m not sure when or if the anti-vaxxers think the vaccines will ever be safe enough.


----------



## groovetube

I no longer care about the unvaccinated. They made their choice. I’m merely suggesting it’s time to minimize the carnage they are causing the rest of us in areas of low vaccination rates. My suggestion may seem outrageous, but trust me, the majority isn’t going to stand for it for long. That’s coming, and it’s not going to be pretty. Wait til those areas go back to school with the state having banned mask mandates with the delta ripping through schools…


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Yeah I don’t think it’s right that the kids (or their teachers and school staff) should have pay the price for the ignorance of the unvaccinated. Maybe they should rebrand Pfizer as Patriot Juice.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Looks like only 202 serious cases across Canada right now.


Cite please.


----------



## groovetube

Don’t get caught up in his childish pivots. He can’t begin to address the disaster in the US right now so he’s cherry picking somewhere else. It’s what he does. Ignore him. If he decides to have a reasonable discussion sure.


----------



## Macfury

As of August 2, only 186 ICU cases across Canada:





__





COVID-19 epidemiology update: Detailed data, maps, charts – Canada.ca


Canadian cases and spread over time and by region, breakdowns by age and sex or gender, testing, variants of concern, cases following vaccination, illness and outcomes.




health-infobase.canada.ca







Freddie_Biff said:


> Cite please.


----------



## groovetube

You really are shameless, aren't you macfury. The one thing you won't do, is explain why you brought up this carefully sliced number somewhere else from a major crisis, and how it is relevant to the facts on the ground in crisis states in the US.

Because, you're interested in 'reasonable discussion' aren't ya.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> As of August 2, only 186 ICU cases across Canada:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19 epidemiology update: Detailed data, maps, charts – Canada.ca
> 
> 
> Canadian cases and spread over time and by region, breakdowns by age and sex or gender, testing, variants of concern, cases following vaccination, illness and outcomes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> health-infobase.canada.ca


And what do you think this tells us?


----------



## Macfury

That there's currently no hospital facility crisis for COVID-19.



Freddie_Biff said:


> And what do you think this tells us?


----------



## groovetube

The thinking on this is, I have a full belly so therefore there’s no hunger problem anywhere! 

that’s a uh… excellent yet unfortunately useless observation, without any reason as to why you think this is relevant in any way macfury!

There ya go Freddie. This is the extent of what you'll get in his wind up.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> The thinking on this is, I have a full belly so therefore there’s no hunger problem anywhere!
> 
> that’s a uh… excellent yet unfortunately useless observation, without any reason as to why you think this is relevant in any way macfury!
> 
> There ya go Freddie. This is the extent of what you'll get in his wind up.


Well it was fun while it lasted. Deniers gonna deny.


----------



## groovetube

U.S. government sends hundreds of ventilators to Florida as Covid surge continues


As of Tuesday, 14,787 people were hospitalized, 145 percent more than during the state's previous peak in July 2020, a state hospital group said.




www.nbcnews.com





Desantis, isn’t even aware of the vents being sent 😂

But it’s da immigrants fault! Numbskull factor here is off the charts. What is it about right wing conservatives that just simply refuse to handle this properly?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

And the hits keep coming. Here is a different story than that which mf reports.



> 'No doubt' Canada now in 4th wave of COVID-19 as cases spike across much of the country
> 
> With COVID-19 cases rising in multiple provinces after a summer lull, more signs point to Canada entering an expected fourth wave of the pandemic — one which could be dramatically different from earlier surges, thanks to rising vaccination rates, but not entirely pain-free.
> 
> The country's seven-day average for new daily cases is now close to 1,300 — an increase of nearly 60 per cent over the previous week, with cases ticking back up mainly in B.C., Alberta, Saskatchewan, Ontario and Quebec.
> 
> "We're absolutely in the fourth wave," said Dr. Peter Juni, who is the scientific director of Ontario's COVID-19 Science Advisory Table. "There's no doubt about that."


 https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/covid-4th-wave-arrival-1.6136506


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> And the hits keep coming. Here is a different story than that which mf reports.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/covid-4th-wave-arrival-1.6136506


Of course it's different. It's just what he does. He's never going to join a decent conversation without his games.

Im hoping the 'wave' is blunted by more reasonable governments here keeping some restrictions masks indoors etc for now. That, and the fact our fully vaccinated is much higher than the states is currently. But it seems there will be regions harder hit, and unfortunately, there will be more people who either die or are impacted healthwise for life because they bought into the lies these clowns are shoving. A day doesnt go by without many reports of people who, all of a sudden, have this come to Jesus moment after losing a family member or having barely survived covid in hospital themselves and declare that everyone should get the vaccine. Its unfortunate that we also hear about many who on their dying breath, regret not being vaccinated.

And then you see these clowns spewing their toxic crap. The crap that because they're a part of spreading it, people end up dead. Id say you'd have to be a special kind of low life, to be vaccinated, and then spread this crap. I think lowlife is too good a word for that sort.


----------



## groovetube

> "If we now just let things rip, and have an approach similar to what Alberta does now, we could have 20,000 ICU admissions happen in a relatively short time frame of six to eight weeks," he said.


Meanwhile you have doofus mewling about 200 ICU patients.


----------



## groovetube

> "If we now just let things rip, and have an approach similar to what Alberta does now, we could have 20,000 ICU admissions happen in a relatively short time frame of six to eight weeks," he said.


 _Dr. Peter Juni, who is the scientific director of Ontario's COVID-19 Science Advisory Table._

Bu-bu-but macfury on ehmac says don't worry be happy!


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> Looks like only 202 serious cases across Canada right now.


Judging by the responses you caused a lot of brain damage by daring to use numbers.

FWIW the World-o-Meter numbers for serious cases are not super reliable. As of today there are ~165 ICU cases in Canada. I say approximately as Saskatchewan only lists hospitalizations and I have to guess at ICU based on percentages for the rest of Canada. Ontario lists an additional 30 Covid cases in ICU. These are labeled Covid even though they test negative. Best guess Ontario hopes they will catch Covid and has put them in a Covid ward for that reason. I did not include that 30 as part of the 165.

Anyways with so many clear examples of the massive confusion that posting numbers causes the Kool-aid Klan, I have attached a picture. Notice the big spike coinciding with the heart of the not-a-vaccine rush. Since the jab induces it's victim to produce the very same spike protein that the PCR tests for, it is very likely that spike in hospitalizations and ICU relates more to adverse jab reactions than it does to actual Covid infections.

Chart is derived from daily provincial numbers posted on the Government of Canada Epidemiological Summary page.


----------



## groovetube

Speaking of brain damage... here comes your pal macfury, captain misinformation again.

Incredible how when more and more people got vaccinated, the numbers plummeted, instead of going up. So, there goes your idiot conclusion pal.

So, like your earlier fibs about the vaccine not being tested on animals and causing more deaths than covid you sir, are a moron, spreading dangerous lies that could cause someone to lose theirs or a loved one's life if they listen to your anti covid vaccine rhetoric.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> Judging by the responses you caused a lot of brain damage by daring to use numbers.
> 
> FWIW the World-o-Meter numbers for serious cases are not super reliable. As of today there are ~165 ICU cases in Canada. I say approximately as Saskatchewan only lists hospitalizations and I have to guess at ICU based on percentages for the rest of Canada. Ontario lists an additional 30 Covid cases in ICU. These are labeled Covid even though they test negative. Best guess Ontario hopes they will catch Covid and has put them in a Covid ward for that reason. I did not include that 30 as part of the 165.
> 
> Anyways with so many clear examples of the massive confusion that posting numbers causes the Kool-aid Klan, I have attached a picture. Notice the big spike coinciding with the heart of the not-a-vaccine rush. Since the jab induces it's victim to produce the very same spike protein that the PCR tests for, it is very likely that spike in hospitalizations and ICU relates more to adverse jab reactions than it does to actual Covid infections.
> 
> Chart is derived from daily provincial numbers posted on the Government of Canada Epidemiological Summary page.
> View attachment 94064


And created by you, no? So, not an official chart in any way, shape or form. Okay boomer.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> Judging by the responses you caused a lot of brain damage by daring to use numbers.


Whether people agree with you or not, innumeracy prevents them from comprehending your argument. It seems to provoke loud gobbling.


----------



## groovetube

See, there ya go freddie. If you had any inkling you get anything reasonable out of macfury, his last post demonstrates his willingness to get into bed with a deranged anti-vaxxer, because he's only here for a windup.

That's pretty pathetic macfury. You having to cozy up to a deranged anti-vaxxer for a cheap windup. wow.


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> And created by you, no? So, not an official chart in any way, shape or form. Okay boomer.


If you don't like my chart take it up with the Government of Canada. The numbers were not created as you libelously implied, they were taken from the Government of Canada Epidemiological summary website, every day since the beginning of the year. I do have screen shots.

If there are errors they are minor and revolve around Ontario including about 25-30% negative testing Covid ICU cases in their daily reports. I discovered this around the beginning of July and have corrected for it since then.


----------



## groovetube

ooooh Freddie, "libel"... 

The stupid, it burns.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> If you don't like my chart take it up with the Government of Canada. The numbers were not created as you libelously implied, they were taken from the Government of Canada Epidemiological summary website, every day since the beginning of the year. I do have screen shots.
> 
> If there are errors they are minor and revolve around Ontario including about 25-30% negative testing Covid ICU cases in their daily reports. I discovered this around the beginning of July and have corrected for it since then.


Wahhhhh! Numbers!!!!!!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> ooooh Freddie, "libel"...
> 
> The stupid, it burns.


I’d never heard the term “libelously” before. Perhaps there’s a reason for that. LOL


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Wahhhhh! Numbers!!!!!!


More like bull**** numbers. How de we know he didn’t invent every piece of data in that chart? That’s why we cite REAL sources.

Just like we use real, commonly understood words. We don’t invent new ones.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> I’d never heard the term “libelously” before. Perhaps there’s a reason for that. LOL





Freddie_Biff said:


> More like bull**** numbers. How de we know he didn’t invent every piece of data in that chart? That’s why we cite REAL sources.


Dude, seriously. These two clowns are only here for a windup. That’s it. If it isn’t you, or I, they’ll simply move on to someone else who mistakenly tries to have a conversation. They’ll only mock you if you attempt a conversation. They know they haven’t got anything to contribute, that’s why.

That’s why I just laugh at them. You can’t take any post of theirs seriously in any way. I mean, look at the **** they posted. It’s a joke!


----------



## Macfury

*Libelously* 
Libelous \Li"bel*ous\ (l[imac]"b[e^]l*[u^]s), a. Containing or involving a libel; defamatory; containing that which exposes some person to public hatred, contempt, or ridicule; as, a libelous pamphlet. [Written also libellous.] -- Li"bel*ous*ly,

Just because you don't know a word, doesn't mean someobody made it up.




Freddie_Biff said:


> More like bull**** numbers. How de we know he didn’t invent every piece of data in that chart? That’s why we cite REAL sources.
> 
> Just like we use real, commonly understood words. We don’t invent new ones.


----------



## eMacMan

Macfury said:


> *Libelously*
> Libelous \Li"bel*ous\ (l[imac]"b[e^]l*[u^]s), a. Containing or involving a libel; defamatory; containing that which exposes some person to public hatred, contempt, or ridicule; as, a libelous pamphlet. [Written also libellous.] -- Li"bel*ous*ly,
> 
> Just because you don't know a word, doesn't mean someobody made it up.


I knew the Kool-aid crowd was numerically and logically challenged (AKA retarded), was unaware their retardation was vocabularic as well.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Dude, seriously. These two clowns are only here for a windup. That’s it. If it isn’t you, or I, they’ll simply move on to someone else who mistakenly tries to have a conversation. They’ll only mock you if you attempt a conversation. They know they haven’t got anything to contribute, that’s why.
> 
> That’s why I just laugh at them. You can’t take any post of theirs seriously in any way. I mean, look at the **** they posted. It’s a joke!


Like spiders waiting to catch a fly. Except minus the intelligence one might normally ascribe to a spider.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> I knew the Kool-aid crowd was numerically and logically challenged (AKA retarded), was unaware their retardation was vocabularic as well.


You really are clueless about acceptable language, aren’t you? And you wonder why no one wants to talk to you.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> *Libelously*
> Libelous \Li"bel*ous\ (l[imac]"b[e^]l*[u^]s), a. Containing or involving a libel; defamatory; containing that which exposes some person to public hatred, contempt, or ridicule; as, a libelous pamphlet. [Written also libellous.] -- Li"bel*ous*ly,
> 
> Just because you don't know a word, doesn't mean someobody made it up.


Uh huh. And what is the libel exactly in me criticizing eMacMan’s bull**** chart? Seems a couple people here have no idea what the term “libel” actually refers to.


----------



## Macfury

You implied that he deliberately provided inaccurate numbers, impugning his honesty.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Uh huh. And what is the libel exactly in me criticizing eMacMan’s bull**** chart? Seems a couple people here have no idea what the term “libel” actually refers to.


----------



## groovetube

Look at these two. One is quite literally posting that the vaccine caused the covid spike (while showing a chart that shows covid plummeting as vaccinations spiked) and macfury, desperate for a windup fix like a $20 crack whore, is actually defending him. Now he’s mewling about libel!

That’s where he has this thread now. And he’s relishing in it. Admittedly I didn’t think he’d head down that far but I suspect he may sink further!

awesome work on ‘reasonable discussion’ macfury!! 👏👏👏


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> You implied that he deliberately provided inaccurate numbers, impugning his honesty.


Libel involves sone type of audience to which your reputation has been maligned. What’s the audience here? Four people? Has your friend suffered some loss of income as a result? Is it worse than you maligning my math competency on a regular basis as you and buddy have done repeatedly? Seriously macfury, grow up.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Look at these two. One is quite literally posting that the vaccine caused the covid spike (while showing a chart that shows covid plummeting as vaccinations spiked) and macfury, desperate for a windup fix like a $20 crack whore, is actually defending him. Now he’s mewling about libel!
> 
> That’s where he has this thread now. And he’s relishing in it. Admittedly I didn’t think he’d head down that far but I suspect he may sink further!
> 
> awesome work on ‘reasonable discussion’ macfury!!


Careful! You’re libelously impugning his character!


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Careful! You’re libelously impugning his character!


You’re suggesting that he’s better than them? I dunno, that’s opening quite the can of worms I think!


----------



## Macfury

The defense against libel, is a demonstration of the truth of the accusation.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Is it worse than you maligning my math competency on a regular basis as you and buddy have done repeatedly?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> The defense against libel, is a demonstration of the truth of the accusation.


Hey Macfury: what’s five times eight?


----------



## groovetube

I think anyone reading this thread is like, uh, where’s the back button…

I can’t imagine one of the companies paying to have their ads get impressions would love this really. Especially with all the alt right anti vaxx stuff.


----------



## Macfury

You would have to answer questions like that in court.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Hey Macfury: what’s five times eight?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> You would have to answer questions like that in court.


Hilarious that you can’t answer such a simple question!


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Hilarious that you can’t answer such a simple question!


While I think most of us know what an emac is, I don’t think an ‘emacman’ is an identifiable person. At least around here, it seems to be someone who is possibly a man (not sure), possibly uses an emac (still?) and seems to post a lot of rather wild and unsubstantiated anti covid vaccine theories. Often with charts that disprove the very theory it’s purported to support. After that, we got nuthin.

these guys are just winding you up. Again. Now if, for example, someone were to refer to my professional life in an identifiable way and make public untrue statements, then we’re getting a little closer to a fairly easy payday.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> While I think most of us know what an emac is, I don’t think an ‘emacman’ is an identifiable person. At least around here, it seems to be someone who is possibly a man (not sure), possibly uses an emac (still?) and seems to post a lot of rather wild and unsubstantiated anti covid vaccine theories. Often with charts that disprove the very theory it’s purported to support. After that, we got nuthin.
> 
> these guys are just winding you up. Again. Now if, for example, someone were to refer to my professional life in an identifiable way and make public untrue statements, then we’re getting a little closer to a fairly easy payday.


They’re not winding me up, trust me. To be wound up, I’d need to be upset. I’m not. Puzzled, sure. Amazed by the stupidity, certainly. But if the intent is to wind someone up, it isn’t working. The attempts are so transparent. 

And for what it’s worth, some adjectives can be turned into adverbs with the addition of -ly. She passed me the receipt coolly, for example. He drove the car quickly. The giant towered tally over the villagers doesn’t. She made a climate change prediction very greenly. Not so much. 

He made a libellous statement about the idiot eMacMan on a seldom read bulletin board. No problem there. eMacMan retorted that he spoke libellously—technically correct, perhaps, but very awkward and something that anyone with any intelligence would laugh at.


----------



## Macfury

Technically correct wording is frequently laughed at by the intelligent, I hear.



Freddie_Biff said:


> ...technically correct, perhaps, but very awkward and something that anyone with any intelligence would laugh at.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> They’re not winding me up, trust me. To be wound up, I’d need to be upset. I’m not. Puzzled, sure. Amazed by the stupidity, certainly. But if the intent is to wind someone up, it isn’t working. The attempts are so transparent.
> 
> And for what it’s worth, some adjectives can be turned into adverbs with the addition of -ly. She passed me the receipt coolly, for example. He drove the car quickly. The giant towered tally over the villagers doesn’t. She made a climate change prediction very greenly. Not so much.
> 
> He made a libellous statement about the idiot eMacMan on a seldom read bulletin board. No problem there. eMacMan retorted that he spoke libellously—technically correct, perhaps, but very awkward and something that anyone with any intelligence would laugh at.


Not even technically correct. To be uh, technical.

meanwhile, while they’ve derailed the conversation yet again to wild claims of libel, these two seemed to have completely forgotten about their wild claims that the vaccine had caused a huge covid surge. Now that we’re approaching 70% of our entire population fully vaccinated, it must be triple by now!

lt’s hard to keep track of these two. I think one of them referred to flinging feces about.I think it was quite accurate!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Not even technically correct. To be uh, technical.
> 
> meanwhile, while they’ve derailed the conversation yet again to wild claims of libel, these two seemed to have completely forgotten about their wild claims that the vaccine had caused a huge covid surge. Now that we’re approaching 70% of our entire population fully vaccinated, it must be triple by now!
> 
> lt’s hard to keep track of these two. I think one of them referred to flinging feces about.I think it was quite accurate!


Say, isn’t this supposed to be the Coronavirus Thread? LOL


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Technically correct wording is frequently laughed at by the intelligent, I hear.


Care to address the rest of the post?


----------



## groovetube

I think things got a bit uncomfortable when their claims that only had a graph (that lacked half the information!) and a couple declarations were questioned. They suddenly got a little angry and hostile.

So, suddenly, we’re talking about libel.  perhaps they’ll settle if nurse ratched comes around.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I think things got a bit uncomfortable when their claims that only had a graph (that lacked half the information!) and a couple declarations were questioned. They suddenly got a little angry and hostile.
> 
> So, suddenly, we’re talking about libel.  perhaps they’ll settle if nurse ratched comes around.


Sad, as their hero would say.


----------



## groovetube

It's why you never see anyone hang around long for conversation. Its usually pop in for a few, and GTFO. 

Good job macfury!


----------



## eMacMan

Well this has certainly been entertaining. 

One of the Kool-Aid Klan echoed the lamestream claiming that our hospital ICU beds were being stretched beyond their limit. 

MF replied that according to World-O-Meter there were currently 202 Canadians in serious or critical condition. Being a number this confused and greatly agitated the Kool-Aid Korps.

Thinking that the Kool-aid Klatch might have better success looking at a picture, I posted a chart showing daily hospital and ICU numbers from the beginning of the year. It clearly indicated that ICU units were working well short of proven capacity. 

This prompted Freddie to accuse me of faking the numbers, but he made no effort to back up the accusation. Obviously Freddie found impugning my reputation and violating his self proclaimed respectful posting standards, preferable to admitting that his lamestream gods were lying to him.

From here the Kool-aid Klowns reverted to their normal drivel and attack style, offering absolutely nothing of substance.

So just to get things back on topic, while the first wave WOM ICU numbers made no sense whatsoever, I have still been tracking them. For the second wave Canadian hospitals seem to have done a better job of keeping them up to date. Here is a chart comparing those numbers to mine. NOTE; The peak according to WOM was early May 2021 at 1456 in ICU or critical care. It actually closely matches my chart, until July 1. At that point I discovered that Ontario was calling some negative testing ICU patients Covid. I chose to not include these in my chart. BTW the blue line is 7 day average deaths. You'll note that the deaths do not reflect the huge May spike in ICU covid patients.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Oh good! Another chart to mock.


----------



## groovetube

Jesus Christ. The guy is like the energizer bunny. No one said our hospitals are currently stretched beyond capacity. No one. It’s like someone who got smashed drunk and started farting on his computer keyboard or something.

You can just feel the anger seething from his posts. Still hasn’t explained why he said the vaccine wasn’t tested on animals, still thinks the vaccine caused the covid spike. Gets angrier if someone questions him though. A true sign of a well reasoned factual argument!

I hope it got the vaccine though because before long, it’s gonna be a sad lonely existence if you’re not allowedanywhere without a vaccine passport. Man that’s gonna enrage a small, and I’m sure, vocal minority. Can hardly wait for the YouTube’s of the angry outbursts!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Jesus Christ. The guy is like the energizer bunny. No one said our hospitals are currently stretched beyond capacity. No one. It’s like someone who got smashed drunk and started farting on his computer keyboard or something.
> 
> You can just feel the anger seething from his posts. Still hasn’t explained why he said the vaccine wasn’t tested on animals, still thinks the vaccine caused the covid spike. Gets angrier if someone questions him though. A true sign of a well reasoned factual argument!
> 
> I hope it got the vaccine though because before long, it’s gonna be a sad lonely existence if you’re not allowedanywhere without a vaccine passport. Man that’s gonna enrage a small, and I’m sure, vocal minority. Can hardly wait for the YouTube’s of the angry outbursts!


Hey, maybe that’s a way to keep it contained! Whatever you do eMacMac, do NOT get vaccinated with the experimental virus! And stay away from people who have due to viral shedding.


----------



## Macfury

Freddie, don't dismiss what you can't understand. We're talking about ICU beds here - a definitive number — not whether you are happy with your jabs.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

You may be talking about ICU beds with your selected numbers and eMacMan’s bull**** charts, but the rest of us are looking at the whole picture and all of the actual stats. 501 new cases in Alberta in one day, almost all variants, and almost all unvaccinated. These are Alberta’s stats. Do try to keep up. 



> Alberta reports highest daily COVID-19 case count since late May
> 
> Alberta public health officials reported 501 net new cases of COVID-19 Wednesday — the highest daily increase since May 27.
> 
> The number of known active cases is now up to 3,769, an increase of 306 since the last update.
> 
> Here's how active cases break down across the province:
> 
> Calgary zone: 1,651
> Edmonton zone: 837
> South zone: 527
> North zone: 500
> Central zone: 246
> Unknown: 8
> Meanwhile, 311 more cases of coronavirus variants of concern have been identified in Alberta. The total of known active variant cases is up to 3,046 — or about 81 per cent of all known active COVID-19 cases in Alberta.
> 
> Since early July, the highly-infectious delta variant has made up most cases of variants of concern detected in the province.
> 
> Public health officials report one more Albertan died from COVID-19 last spring, after confirming COVID-19 as a cause post-mortem, an Alberta government spokesperson said. That individual, a man in his 50s living in the Calgary zone, died April 11.
> 
> A total of 2,331 Albertans have now died due to the illness.
> 
> Five more people were admitted to hospital to be treated for COVID-19 since the previous update. There are now 138 hospitalizations, including 31 patients in intensive care units.
> 
> Those in hospital are mostly unvaccinated: 72 per cent of people not receiving critical care are unvaccinated, while 13.9 per cent are only partially vaccinated, according to Alberta chief medical officer of health Deena Hinshaw.
> 
> Meanwhile, 90.3 per cent of ICU patients are unvaccinated and 3.2 per cent only partially vaccinated, Hinshaw said on Twitter.
> 
> The remaining patients have received two doses of COVID-19 vaccine, a government spokesperson confirmed.
> 
> Another 8,613 COVID-19 tests were conducted Tuesday. The province's test-positivity rate is 5.93 per cent.
> 
> Meanwhile, 7,295 doses of vaccine were administered Tuesday.
> 
> About 76 per cent of Albertans aged 12 and up have received at least one dose of a vaccine; 67.2 per cent have received two doses.


 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/covid-19-alberta-update-1.6138039?__vfz=medium=sharebar


----------



## Macfury

That looks about right!



Freddie_Biff said:


> 31 patients in intensive care units.


----------



## groovetube

Oh stop being such a child macfury. No one is talking about Canada’s ICU right now because currently our numbers are low. Except for you and your little deranged pal that are derailing any conversation that could be had here.

Grow up.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> You may be talking about ICU beds with your selected numbers and eMacMan’s bull**** charts, but the rest of us are looking at the whole picture and all of the actual stats. 501 new cases in Alberta in one day, almost all variants, and almost all unvaccinated. These are Alberta’s stats. Do try to keep up.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/covid-19-alberta-update-1.6138039?__vfz=medium=sharebar


They aren’t interested in talking about covid. At all. The childishness shown by these two is pathetic.

That’s why I just mock them.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> They aren’t interested in talking about covid. At all. The childishness shown by these two is pathetic.
> 
> That’s why I just mock them.


So easy to do too. But the ICU’s! But her e-mails!


----------



## groovetube

Wingnut literally opened his post with making something up. Neither of us said anything remotely what he alleged. But no matter! Is this what passes for reasoned debate now? Then the troll dives in for the shameless wind up.

macfurys clear objective seems to be to drive any reasonable person from these threads. Looking back, before I came back for bit, I notice that anyone somewhat sane who pops in, doesn’t stay very long. Just look at the last couple pages and I see why!

Imagine having a forum and allowing some disturbed individual who spends years, 24/7 just driving everyone away. I doubt he’s in any other forum. He’d either be laughed at or banned.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Wingnut literally opened his post with making something up. Neither of us said anything remotely what he alleged. But no matter! Is this what passes for reasoned debate now? Then the troll dives in for the shameless wind up.
> 
> macfurys clear objective seems to be to drive any reasonable person from these threads. Looking back, before I came back for bit, I notice that anyone somewhat sane who pops in, doesn’t stay very long. Just look at the last couple pages and I see why!
> 
> Imagine having a forum and allowing some disturbed individual who spends years, 24/7 just driving everyone away. I doubt he’s in any other forum. He’d either be laughed at or banned.


Sad. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Freddie_Biff

The Terminator has spoken. 



> Arnold Schwarzenegger takes on anti-maskers: ‘Screw your freedom’
> 
> “I always say you should know your strengths and listen to the experts. If you want to learn about building biceps, listen to me, because I’ve spent my life studying how to get the perfect peak and I have been called the greatest bodybuilder of all time. We all have different specialties,” he said.
> 
> “Dr. Fauci and all of the virologists and epidemiologists and doctors have studied diseases and vaccines for their entire lives, so I listen to them and I urge you to do the same. None of us are going to learn more than them by watching a few hours of videos. It’s simple: if your house is on fire, you don’t go on YouTube, you call the damn fire department. If you have a heart attack, you don’t check your Facebook group, you call an ambulance. If 9 doctors tell you you have cancer and need to treat it or you will die, and one doctor says the cancer will disappear, you should always side with the 9.


 https://globalnews.ca/news/8106446/arnold-schwarzenegger-covid-19-masks-freedom/


----------



## Macfury

Maybe the Terminator can give lessons on cheating on his spouse — I hear he's an expert at that too!




Freddie_Biff said:


> The Terminator has spoken.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Maybe the Terminator can give lessons on cheating on his spouse — I hear he's an expert at that too!


Uh….off topic much?


----------



## groovetube

Cue attempted windups about Schwarzenegger.


----------



## groovetube

Oh look. 


Freddie_Biff said:


> Uh….off topic much?


He’s just jealous. I’m guessing from his 24/7 obsession here for that many years, the only action he gets is the ol leftie.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Oh look.
> 
> He’s just jealous. I’m guessing from his 24/7 obsession here for that many years, the only action he gets is the ol leftie.


Bwahahahahahahhaa!


----------



## groovetube

Just responding with the same level of intelligence.


----------



## groovetube

bu-bu-bu-but mah rights! And mah fweeeedumbs!!!


----------



## eMacMan

^^As Adolph would say Papiere Bitte!^^

Anyways this 25 minute segment with Eric Clapton is definitely worth watching.




__





Eric Clapton - Two Shots - Big Regrets 06142021 - Rumble






rumble.com


----------



## groovetube

The only thing more pathetic than whining about vaccine requirements (which we’ve had for decades) is making comparisons to Hitler. But you went there. But the best part was missing the irony of that. Spectacularly moronic.

Eric Clapton is currently the laughing stock. But yeah sure watch anyone and anything that floats yer boat.


----------



## smashedbanana

eMacMan said:


> ^^As Adolph would say Papiere Bitte!^^
> 
> Anyways this 25 minute segment with Eric Clapton is definitely worth watching.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eric Clapton - Two Shots - Big Regrets 06142021 - Rumble
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rumble.com


Going to ignore your Nazi reference.

I tried hard to watch that interview objectively. 24 minutes of all over the place.

Eric, you are 76 years old. You have sever underlying medical conditions as you noted. You had an adverse reaction compounded by your conditions. It sucks, truly it sounds horrible. But consider if you did get real covid 100% you'd be done for.


----------



## Macfury

eMacMan said:


> ...this 25 minute segment with Eric Clapton is definitely worth watching.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eric Clapton - Two Shots - Big Regrets 06142021 - Rumble
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rumble.com


Good video and well reasoned by Mr. Clapton. He states fairly his adverse reaction, pre-existing conditions, etc.


----------



## groovetube

smashedbanana said:


> Going to ignore your Nazi reference.
> 
> I tried hard to watch that interview objectively. 24 minutes of all over the place.
> 
> Eric, you are 76 years old. You have sever underlying medical conditions as you noted. You had an adverse reaction compounded by your conditions. It sucks, truly it sounds horrible. But consider if you did get real covid 100% you'd be done for.


I think that’s pretty much what that member does, the shock value deal, the nazi thing isn’t surprising.

It’s as if suddenly, everyone forgot that all medications, vaccines, have side effects and risks. My 79 year old father who is quite frail and in very ill health got the Pfizer then moderna for the second and didn’t even flinch, as did the vast majority of all seniors. But since Eric Clapton had adverse reactions, we’re expected to tell all our seniors, dying of covid is a much better odds. There’s nothing well reasoned about this whatsoever.

As I mentioned, his declaration that he won’t play venues that require vaccines has made him a total joke in the industry. And it appears that soon, if he sticks to that he won’t be playing very many venues at all, certainly none here and likely things will get cancelled stateside unless you’re in one of the yeehaw! Giv’er! states.

edit: I forgot that live nation will require all concert goers as well as all artists crew etc to be vaccinated as of oct 4. Regardless of the state. So good luck Eric! Hopefully you can milk a bit more out of that horrible swing version of Layla!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I think that’s pretty much what that member does, the shock value deal, the nazi thing isn’t surprising.
> 
> It’s as if suddenly, everyone forgot that all medications, vaccines, have side effects and risks. My 79 year old father who is quite frail and in very ill health got the Pfizer then moderna for the second and didn’t even flinch, as did the vast majority of all seniors. But since Eric Clapton had adverse reactions, we’re expected to tell all our seniors, dying of covid is a much better odds. There’s nothing well reasoned about this whatsoever.
> 
> As I mentioned, his declaration that he won’t play venues that require vaccines has made him a total joke in the industry. And it appears that soon, if he sticks to that he won’t be playing very many venues at all, certainly none here and likely things will get cancelled stateside unless you’re in one of the yeehaw! Giv’er! states.
> 
> edit: I forgot that live nation will require all concert goers as well as all artists crew etc to be vaccinated as of oct 4. Regardless of the state. So good luck Eric! Hopefully you can milk a bit more out of that horrible swing version of Layla!


Wait. Isn’t this the same dude that stole his best friend’s wife?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Wait. Isn’t this the same dude that stole his best friend’s wife?


indeed. Though folklore has it that she got the uh, short end of that deal, but Im sure she had a "well reasoned argument".


----------



## groovetube

Canadian banks to require employees working in its offices to be fully vaccinated


Canadian companies in federally regulated industries are starting to announce mandatory vaccination policies, in a bid to protect staff and abide by a recent government request.




www.ctvnews.ca





And so it begins to fall. The resistance to requiring vaccines to work or visit major finance buildings, and we have many small businesses clamouring for the province to provide a vaccine passport system to protect their businesses. Yet our 'for the people for small businesses' Ford government here in Ontario, is completely out of touch.

In the US I’m now reading about major bands requiringfull vaccination or negative test to attend, and cancelling shows in states that limit vaccine mandates such as Iowa. I guess maybe Clapton might get a gig there?


----------



## Macfury

He and Arnold Schwarzenegger should form a guild.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Wait. Isn’t this the same dude that stole his best friend’s wife?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Canadian banks to require employees working in its offices to be fully vaccinated
> 
> 
> Canadian companies in federally regulated industries are starting to announce mandatory vaccination policies, in a bid to protect staff and abide by a recent government request.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ctvnews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And so it begins to fall. The resistance to requiring vaccines to work or visit major finance buildings, and we have many small businesses clamouring for the province to provide a vaccine passport system to protect their businesses. Yet our 'for the people for small businesses' Ford government here in Ontario, is completely out of touch.
> 
> In the US I’m now reading about major bands requiringfull vaccination or negative test to attend, and cancelling shows in states that limit vaccine mandates such as Iowa. I guess maybe Clapton might get a gig there?


All depends where the majority decide to put the pressure. Fortunately, the unvaccinated remain in the minority but it’s a large enough minority (around 30%) to **** things up for everyone else.


----------



## groovetube

The only way they’re going to screw it up is if they end up filling the hospitals and dying again. And it’s over 82% who’ve gotten at least one shot over 12, it’ll likely get there with fully soon so, we’re looking at 15-17% max of over 12 unvaccinated. The majority, isn’t going to give a crap about the whiners. The rest of us don’t want lockdowns anymore. Trolls can spin it and wind it any way they like, but that’s becoming the reality.

Not sure what you’re seeing in Alberta, but it’s pretty clear here most want the vaccine passport like the do in a couple other provinces like Quebec. I had to laugh last week, someone posted pics of the protests against the passports, the pics were from a massive protest in Russia 1991 ha ha ha ha ha.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> The only way they’re going to screw it up is if they end up filling the hospitals and dying again. And it’s over 82% who’ve gotten at least one shot over 12, it’ll likely get there with fully soon so, we’re looking at 15-17% max of over 12 unvaccinated. The majority, isn’t going to give a crap about the whiners. The rest of us don’t want lockdowns anymore. Trolls can spin it and wind it any way they like, but that’s becoming the reality.
> 
> Not sure what you’re seeing in Alberta, but it’s pretty clear here most want the vaccine passport like the do in a couple other provinces like Quebec. I had to laugh last week, someone posted pics of the protests against the passports, the pics were from a massive protest in Russia 1991 ha ha ha ha ha.


I dunno. Our numbers are rising in Alberta. About 749 or so a couple days ago, the highest number of cases in one day for three months. Nobody’s looking forward to masking up again, but I think it’s inevitable. Being vaccinated will help you and make the discomfort milder, if at all, but it won’t stop you from spreading it to others. That’s what masks are for. I know we’re all tired of restrictions, but the virus could date less. In fact it kind of counts on our complacency. We’re not out of the woods yet.


----------



## groovetube

What happens when the vaccinated say to hell with the unvaccinated, screw the masks. You want to be protected get the jab. Otherwise, hope your immune system is up to the job and if you survive you are not one of the growing numbers of people with severe lung or organ damage.

I think this is what’s going to happen when 85% of the population realizes they can return to normal life without lockdowns if we restrict the numbskulls from overwhelming our hospitals.


----------



## groovetube

Ha. Heard someone pointing out the irony of recommending those who feel the vaccine is experimental or don’t like putting things into their bodies, put monoclonal antibodies in their bodies when they’re sick which has less chance of helping them at that point.


----------



## MacDoc

Got my second Astro shot yesterday, minor fever and headache gone now.









No cases in Cairns, no lockdown even Queensland only 2 cases - both were detected in quarantine.
Very happy to be here instead of the mess in the GTA ...mind you 75% vaccinated in Ontario is impressive - tho Delta still an issue.

I got enough of a taste of breathless at 15,500' in Chile to want to entirely avoid it.


----------



## Macfury

So what percentage of natural immunity plus injections, do you think will confer herd immunity at this point?



Freddie_Biff said:


> All depends where the majority decide to put the pressure. Fortunately, the unvaccinated remain in the minority but it’s a large enough minority (around 30%) to **** things up for everyone else.


----------



## groovetube

You’ve asked this question a number of times, but I think the reason you’ve not figured this out is that you keep asking people who aren’t medical experts. And if they refer you to a medical experts opinion, you just **** on it anyway.

How long are you going to continue this game?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> Got my second Astro shot yesterday, minor fever and headache gone now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No cases in Cairns, no lockdown even Queensland only 2 cases - both were detected in quarantine.
> Very happy to be here instead of the mess in the GTA ...mind you 75% vaccinated in Ontario is impressive - tho Delta still an issue.
> 
> I got enough of a taste of breathless at 15,500' in Chile to want to entirely avoid it.


Good for you, MacDoc. Being breathless doesn’t seem like that big a deal until you experience it firsthand. Hope you stay healthy.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> What happens when the vaccinated say to hell with the unvaccinated, screw the masks. You want to be protected get the jab. Otherwise, hope your immune system is up to the job and if you survive you are not one of the growing numbers of people with severe lung or organ damage.
> 
> I think this is what’s going to happen when 85% of the population realizes they can return to normal life without lockdowns if we restrict the numbskulls from overwhelming our hospitals.


I imagine the unvaccinated would be happy to go along with that, since they don’t believe in masks in the first place.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> So what percentage of natural immunity plus injections, do you think will confer herd immunity at this point?


Don’t know. I’ve heard as high as 85-90%. What’s your estimate?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Don’t know. I’ve heard as high as 85-90%. What’s your estimate?


This has been the estimate by top medical experts for some time now. But as we can all see, we can see what political group is working feverishly to derail that. Spreading nonsense. Ironically, those very same leaders, pretty much all fully vaccinated.

some people are just so incredibly gullible.


----------



## groovetube

Conservative talk show host Phil Valentine dies after battle with Covid-19, his employer says


Phil Valentine, a Nashville-based conservative radio talk show host who had questioned whether it was necessary for all people to get Covid-19 vaccines, died on Saturday, his employer, WWTN Radio, announced on Twitter. Valentine was 61 years old.




www.cnn.com





He said his odds of dying were way less than 1%. Well, I guess he lost that bet didn’t he? How many times have you heard covidiots online say the same thing? We’ve listened to endless numbers games play out everywhere for some time now, and thousands have gotten nailed by the stupidity and either lost their life or ended up with severely damaged lungs or other complications.


----------



## Macfury

I don't think it will happen. I think it's more likely that more transmissible, but less deadly variants will take its place.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Don’t know. I’ve heard as high as 85-90%. What’s your estimate?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I don't think it will happen. I think it's more likely that more transmissible, but less deadly variants will take its place.


I’ll buy that fora dollar. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Macfury

Bixby Snyder? 


Freddie_Biff said:


> I’ll buy that fora dollar.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Bixby Snyder?


Budda bing!


----------



## groovetube

Unfortunately, the opposite is occurring right now. As the variants become far more transmissible, they have also become more deadly. While it is possible that in the future, variants may become less deadly, it’s more important to see the reality of what is in front of us right now.


----------



## groovetube

Suddenly, conservatives are very concerned about preserving a person right to choose in regards to their own bodies.

the irony is lost on them.


----------



## eMacMan

So let's address some deceptive posts over the past couple of weeks. Off the top we have the mantra 99% of whatever are unvaccinated. From Government of Canada Epidemiological Summary web page we have this:









*NOTE: That the data goes from Dec 14, 2020 to the end of July. Now prior to mid February very few people were vaccinated. However the peak number of hospitalizations and death happened beginning in late December through most of January. IOW the 99% claim is deliberately deceptive as it is biased by an extended period where there were a large number of hospitalizations and deaths but very few individuals were vaccinated.*

From today's Ontario website:









*For the numerically challenged almost 25% of the current non ICU Ontario patients are fully or partially vaccinated, and almost 20% of the ICU patients are fully or partially vaccinated.*


----------



## eMacMan

Now about Freddie's claim that my charts are bull****. We have my first chart based on my tracking of provincial hospitalizations from the beginning of the year. Said chart clearly showing a huge bump in ICU patients coinciding with the peak of the vaccination campaign.








Then we have this chart where I added the ICU numbers which I had compiled from the world-o-meter page.









And according to Freddie the King of Bull****. This too is bull ****.

So just for fun I pulled the official charts from the Government of Canada Epidemiological page.









*If you look closely the official charts match my charts. Now admittedly this is old school logic not Freddie logic, but clearly if the King of Bull **** proclaims my charts to be bull **** and the official charts mirror my charts then the official charts are officially Bull ****.

IOW it seems extremely likely that the unexplained May peak of ICU admissions was fabricated to push people into getting the jab. Either that or Freddie was shoveling bull**** when he proclaimed those charts to be bull ****.*


----------



## eMacMan

groovetube said:


> Captain idiot strikes again.
> 
> you cannot include partially unvaccinated in your fantasy percentages because they do NOT have sufficient protection against hospitalization and severe disease. It that didn’t stop you from trying to mislead. Just like how you lied about the vaccines not being tested on animals. I say lied because it takes anyone 30 seconds to find out that they in fact were. Or we could go with that you are quite brainless. Either will do.
> 
> In the US particularly in the states where the delta has caused surges filling their hospitals all of the medical experts have all said, the vast majority of all cases, are vaccinated. So will you stop posting bull****.
> 
> werent you one of the dildos that went after Freddie for his math? I bet you were…


Not even a reasonable attempted diversion. The claim was 99% unvaccinated, I clearly illustrated the claim was BS.


----------



## groovetube

No, the top medical doctors have all said it’s the vast majority. The actual percentage varies from hospital to hospital, but the number generally hovers above 90% particularly in ICU. In fact your chart shows 92% of ICU patients are either unvaccinated or partially vaccinated. Simply hospitalized, includes those possibly with other conditions making them more susceptible to covid even fully vaccinated, but they aren’t severe enough to be in ICU. Still, even your chart shows that to be just over 80% as unvaccinated or partial.

so we aren’t sure exactly who or what you are arguing. Take it up with all the medical experts running the hospitals. That’s who we are listening to. I’m sorry but your buddies on Facebook who got their ‘medical degrees’ on YouTube is of no use here.

And if you think the late winter spring surge was ‘unexplained’, you really haven’t any clue of anything do you? I’m sure your buddy macfury will offer you some help soon enough.


----------



## Macfury

So let's see some proof of only that one item.



eMacMan said:


> The claim was 99% unvaccinated, I clearly illustrated the claim was BS.


----------



## groovetube

Now who could have predicted captain strawman to swoop in to support his anti-vaxx little pal?

Oh! I did!


----------



## Macfury

Macfury said:


> I don't think it will happen. I think it's more likely that more transmissible, but less deadly variants will take its place.


Here's some explanation for what I mean.



> Reaching herd immunity is “not a possibility” with the current Delta variant, the head of the Oxford Vaccine Group has said.
> 
> Giving evidence to MPs on Tuesday, Prof Sir Andrew Pollard said the fact that vaccines did not stop the spread of Covid meant reaching the threshold for overall immunity in the population was “mythical”.
> 
> “The problem with this virus is [it is] not measles. If 95% of people were vaccinated against measles, the virus cannot transmit in the population,” he told the all-party parliamentary group (APPG) on coronavirus.
> 
> “The Delta variant will still infect people who have been vaccinated. And that does mean that anyone who’s still unvaccinated at some point will meet the virus … and we don’t have anything that will [completely] stop that transmission.”
> 
> Although the existing vaccines are very effective at preventing serious Covid illness and death, they do not stop a fully vaccinated person from being infected by the virus that causes Covid-19.











Delta variant renders herd immunity from Covid ‘mythical’


Head of Oxford Vaccine Group rules out overall immunity, but also questions need for booster jabs




www.theguardian.com





Even at 95%, the last group of unvaccinated people would get infected and 99.9% of them would survive — but you would still have the development of new variants among the population that was jabbed .


----------



## groovetube

Your pal that you are defending has blatantly given misinformation about this whole thing, and now you are implying (multiple times) that the variants are mutating in the vaccinated. Except the current variants occurred before the populations were vaccinated. And if viral mutations were to occur later in vaccinated populations, what exactly, is your point?

I suspect you don’t have one.


----------



## groovetube

I would also point out, that both of these anti-vaxx posters have hilariously posted info that actually supports vaccinating the population. If the article he posted is credible, then Id say virtually eliminating the threat of large hospitalization numbers and cutting transmissibility in at least half, would mean vaccinations is the path to a return to normal.

But macfury and his pal, being the trolls, wants to wind the conversation around "99%" and the definition of herd immunity.

Unfortunate.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> Now about Freddie's claim that my charts are bull****. We have my first chart based on my tracking of provincial hospitalizations from the beginning of the year. Said chart clearly showing a huge bump in ICU patients coinciding with the peak of the vaccination campaign.
> View attachment 94082
> 
> Then we have this chart where I added the ICU numbers which I had compiled from the world-o-meter page.
> View attachment 94083
> 
> 
> And according to Freddie the King of Bull****. This too is bull ****.
> 
> So just for fun I pulled the official charts from the Government of Canada Epidemiological page.
> View attachment 94084
> 
> 
> *If you look closely the official charts match my charts. Now admittedly this is old school logic not Freddie logic, but clearly if the King of Bull **** proclaims my charts to be bull **** and the official charts mirror my charts then the official charts are officially Bull ****.
> 
> IOW it seems extremely likely that the unexplained May peak of ICU admissions was fabricated to push people into getting the jab. Either that or Freddie was shoveling bull**** when he proclaimed those charts to be bull ****.*


Me not accepting your charts as legit really seems to bother you, doesn’t it? That’s hilarious.


----------



## Macfury

Maybe if you were Freddie Mercury....



Freddie_Biff said:


> Me not accepting your charts as legit really seems to bother you, doesn’t it? That’s hilarious.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Captain idiot strikes again.
> 
> you cannot include partially unvaccinated in your fantasy percentages because they do NOT have sufficient protection against hospitalization and severe disease. But that didn’t stop you from trying to mislead. Just like how you lied about the vaccines not being tested on animals. I say lied because it takes anyone 30 seconds to find out that they in fact were. Or we could go with that you are quite brainless. Either will do.
> 
> In the US, particularly in the states where the delta has caused surges filling their hospitals all of the medical experts have all said, the vast majority of all cases, are unvaccinated. I’d like to see you contact them and set them straight! No? So will you stop posting bull****.
> 
> werent you one of the dildos that went after Freddie for his math? I bet you were…


Yup. He couldn’t even answer the question what’s 5 x 8. LOL


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Maybe if you were Freddie Mercury....


??


----------



## Macfury

...your approval might mean something.



Freddie_Biff said:


> ??


----------



## groovetube

Your attempt at humor is about as effective as your arguments.


----------



## Macfury

Austalia's PM is getting the message:









Delta Forces New Zealand, Australia to Rethink Covid Strategies


The Covid-19 delta variant has forced Australia and New Zealand to review their strategies of eliminating infections of the virus, and prompted Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison to say it’s highly unlikely his country will ever return to zero cases.




www.bloomberg.com





_Australia’s Morrison said it was highly unlikely the country would return to being free of Covid infections. When vaccination rates reach the targets of 70% to 80% of the eligible population, curbs would begin to be lifted, the prime minister said.

“You can’t live with lockdowns forever, and at some point you need to make that gear change,“ he said._


----------



## groovetube

See, this is why you listen to the medical experts. Because they have been saying this for a long time now. And you’re acting as though this is somehow newsworthy???

You doohickeys can’t seem to figure out that covid is only a problem when it overwhelms our hospital system with people getting severely ill and dying. And this, is precisely what the vaccine can accomplish.

Meanwhile you pair are yukking it about how fully vaccinated people can and do get infected.


----------



## groovetube

Nearly 100 per cent of COVID-19 hospitalizations in Toronto involve patients who are not fully vaccinated: city


The City of Toronto says that nearly all patients hospitalized with COVID-19 in the last three months involved people who are not fully vaccinated against the virus.




toronto.ctvnews.ca






> TORONTO -- The City of Toronto says that nearly all patients hospitalized with COVID-19 in the last three months involved people who are not fully vaccinated against the virus.
> 
> In a news release issued Monday, the city said that 98.7 per cent of those hospitalized since May 1 with a known vaccination status had not yet received both doses.


Freddie, I love that the troll character is quite upset you dissed his charts. I wonder if he’ll angrily email all the top doctors in the city of Toronto and demand they listen to him and see his charts? Maybe he can also angrily tell them that the vaccine wasn’t tested on animals so it can’t be safe or effective!!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Nearly 100 per cent of COVID-19 hospitalizations in Toronto involve patients who are not fully vaccinated: city
> 
> 
> The City of Toronto says that nearly all patients hospitalized with COVID-19 in the last three months involved people who are not fully vaccinated against the virus.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toronto.ctvnews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freddie, I love that the troll character is quite upset you dissed his charts. I wonder if he’ll angrily email all the top doctors in the city of Toronto and demand they listen to him and see his charts? Maybe he can also angrily tell them that the vaccine wasn’t tested on animals so it can’t be safe or effective!!


He doesn’t seem to get that you can manipulate charts to portray anything you want, and given his predilection for a lack of objectivity in the past, it’s quite understandable that someone wouldn’t trust his charts. Source matters. I get that he put a little of time into them and is very proud of them, but they’re tainted.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> ...your approval might mean something.


This comment is just plain stupid, MacFury. Freddie Mercury’s been dead for 30 years. It’s the people around now who need convincing. Homemade charts are not going to do it.


----------



## Macfury

Mercury's dead? Oh, man, I've really blown it haven't I?



Freddie_Biff said:


> This comment is just plain stupid, MacFury. Freddie Mercury’s been dead for 30 years. It’s the people around now who need convincing. Homemade charts are not going to do it.


----------



## groovetube

As COVID-19 surges in Mississippi, some people are ingesting an unproven livestock dewormer


Between March and this month, Fox News hosts Tucker Carlson, Sean Hannity and Laura Ingraham promoted the use of ivermectin as an alternative COVID treatment…




nationalpost.com





Ohhhh man… imagine, being this stupid. A Fox news host (amongst other right wing quacks) tells viewers to use a livestock dewormer to prevent and treat Covid. No scientific evidence whatsoever. Meanwhile, this same Fox news host, is not only vaccinated, but Fox News itself has its own vaccine passports to even enter their buildings.

Probably the same morons that fell for the ‘stop the steal’ and sent in millions for Trump’s family to have a slush fund for their travel/expenses and of course, legal fees.

wow.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Grifters gonna grift. Conspiracy theorists gonna conspire. Deniers gonna deny.


----------



## groovetube

I shouldn't be surprised at this point, but it seems the level of stupid really hasn't found a bottom yet.


----------



## groovetube

__





CityNews







toronto.citynews.ca





So much for the “experimental vaccine” stupidity.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CityNews
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> toronto.citynews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So much for the “experimental vaccine” stupidity.


Haha! Awesome. It won’t shut them up though.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

And the hits just keep coming. Alberta’s numbers are growing again and the premier and health minister are nowhere to be found. 



> The number of active COVID-19 cases in Alberta have soared to 7,777, increasing by 1,068 over the weekend as cases continue to rise in the province.
> 
> Alberta released COVID-19 data for the previous three days on Monday. An additional 821 cases were confirmed on Friday, surpassing the 817 cases identified on Wednesday, which was the highest single-day increase in three months. Another 678 cases were confirmed on Saturday and 473 were identified on Sunday…


 https://edmontonjournal.com/news/l...WIYwxivNMIY5TknZLaYMGe96mcGZ1BpWbeeu2mptcONQ0


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## groovetube

Ontario is up as well, apparently 91 more in one day. Total 295 now in hospital. Remember when they were bragging it was only 200 all in Canada? Like barely last week? All you have to do is just wait a little and their nonsense quickly falls apart.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Ontario is up as well, apparently 91 more in one day. Total 295 now in hospital. Remember when they were bragging it was only 200 all in Canada? Like barely last week? All you have to do is just wait a little and their nonsense quickly falls apart.


That’s the thing with math and working with numbers; some people just don’t understand how an exponential increase works.


----------



## groovetube

They’re not really interested in the topic itself, just to wind people up and be a jerk.


----------



## Macfury

That would be a geometric increase.



Freddie_Biff said:


> That’s the thing with math and working with numbers; some people just don’t understand how an exponential increase works.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> That would be a geometric increase.


No, I’m pretty sure I’m referring to exponential growth. Perhaps you’d care to explain why you prefer to use “geometric growth” when it comes to data about the increases in incidence of covid19. 

 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exponential_growth


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> They’re not really interested in the topic itself, just to wind people up and be a jerk.


Predictable as the boom-bust cycle of oil and gas.


----------



## Macfury

Because even if the exponent was the number 2, all of Canada would have been infected by Spring 2020.



Freddie_Biff said:


> No, I’m pretty sure I’m referring to exponential growth. Perhaps you’d care to explain why you prefer to use “geometric growth” when it comes to data about the increases in incidence of covid19.
> 
> Exponential growth - Wikipedia


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Hmm. There’s that word again. 



> The study published Tuesday was based on 43,127 infections in residents of Los Angeles County, California. Covid hospitalizations were defined as hospital admissions occurring within 14 days after infection, the agency said.
> 
> Among all county residents, hospitalization rates increased "exponentially" among unvaccinated, fully vaccinated and partially vaccinated people, with the highest rates among unvaccinated people in late June, the agency said.


 https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/24/cd...ore-likely-to-be-hospitalized-with-covid.html


----------



## MacDoc

****...








Colorado fitness trainer declined vaccine. Stunning photos show what happened to him - CNN Video


Colorado fitness coach Bill Phillips is urging others to get the Covid-19 vaccine after ending up in the emergency room and losing 70 pounds fighting for his life from coronavirus. CNN affiliate KUSA reports.




edition.cnn.com


----------



## groovetube

MacDoc said:


> ****...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Colorado fitness trainer declined vaccine. Stunning photos show what happened to him - CNN Video
> 
> 
> Colorado fitness coach Bill Phillips is urging others to get the Covid-19 vaccine after ending up in the emergency room and losing 70 pounds fighting for his life from coronavirus. CNN affiliate KUSA reports.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edition.cnn.com


right but oh, stocking up on livestock dewormer is smarter. The level of stupid is astounding. 

The word is Ontario is likely in for a very grim fall winter here. Can't imagine how it'll be in provinces like Alberta. Stay safe!


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Hmm. There’s that word again.
> 
> 
> 
> CDC study shows unvaccinated people are 29 times more likely to be hospitalized with Covid


Once again, the troll winds people into a useless debate on something brainless. His stupidity is, exponential!









Why ‘Comirnaty’ Is The New Name For Pfizer Covid-19 Vaccines, ‘Spikevax’ For Moderna


Comirnaty was the subject of some name calling on social media.




www.forbes.com




In other news, now that the Pfizer vaccine has full FDA approval (there goes the 'experimental' thing...) they have a brand name, "Comirnaty". It's a bit close to, illuminati, communist, you get the picture. Coming to a wing nut lunatic anti-vaxx placard near you.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> ****...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Colorado fitness trainer declined vaccine. Stunning photos show what happened to him - CNN Video
> 
> 
> Colorado fitness coach Bill Phillips is urging others to get the Covid-19 vaccine after ending up in the emergency room and losing 70 pounds fighting for his life from coronavirus. CNN affiliate KUSA reports.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edition.cnn.com


And the hits just keep coming. What will it take for the holdouts to be persuaded?


----------



## groovetube

Apparently almost dying.


----------



## Macfury

That's why I don't blame you. It's being fed to you all the time.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Hmm. There’s that word again.
> 
> 
> 
> CDC study shows unvaccinated people are 29 times more likely to be hospitalized with Covid


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Apparently almost dying.


And sometimes not even then. Some deniers deny even with their final breath. Others make the realization too late and their dying wish is for everyone to get vaccinated. The mind boggles.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> That's why I don't blame you. It's being fed to you all the time.


You still haven’t explained why you prefer the term geometric growth. Did you forget?


----------



## Macfury

You have a much greater chance of cutting your life short through obesity. What's it going to take to get you to drop that gut? When you can address the complex questions of how people calculate their odds, you will have an answer.



Freddie_Biff said:


> And the hits just keep coming. What will it take for the holdouts to be persuaded?


----------



## Macfury

I've told you. Anything close to logarithmic growth would have seen Canada's population completely infected within a month. You might get a short spate of it here and there, but the real world doesn't allow for it.



Freddie_Biff said:


> You still haven’t explained why you prefer the term geometric growth. Did you forget?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I've told you. Anything close to logarithmic growth would have seen Canada's population completely infected within a month. You might get a short spate of it here and there, but the real world doesn't allow for it.


That’s not an explanation for geometric growth. And you wonder why the other kids don’t like to play with you.


----------



## groovetube

God it just won’t shut up. It can’t help itself.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> And sometimes not even then. Some deniers deny even with their final breath. Others make the realization too late and their dying wish is for everyone to get vaccinated. The mind boggles.


There was literally hundreds of mouth breathing numbskulls yelling about lockdowns and vaccines a block away from the downtown hospitals right at the time they were so overwhelmed scheduled surgeries were cancelled and they built a field hospital. Never mind the nincompoop sniveling about some mathematical idiocy, it’s just trying to distract. No one cares about the voices in it’s head.


----------



## groovetube

Apparently there was a lab error in Saskatchewan resulting in some false positives.

just wait, it’s coming on a placard near you!!


----------



## Macfury

If variants continue to be generated by a widely vaccinated population, the triple jabbers will probably start blaming the double jabbers for not being patriotic enough.


----------



## groovetube

Ahhhhhhh shaaaadup.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> If variants continue to be generated by a widely vaccinated population, the triple jabbers will probably start blaming the double jabbers for not being patriotic enough.


Still avoiding the question.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Still avoiding the question.


pfffft! Of course he did! ha ha ha ha. Even he knows it's pure garbage!


----------



## groovetube

Alberta reports over 1,000 new COVID-19 cases for first time in more than three months


Wednesday marked the first time that Alberta recorded more than 1,000 new COVID-19 cases in one day since May 15.




edmonton.ctvnews.ca





Freddie, saw this, what’s happening in Alberta? You guys are spiking much harder than we are but then, we are beginning to head there, our hospitalization is up as well. Mostly unvaccinated.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Alberta reports over 1,000 new COVID-19 cases for first time in more than three months
> 
> 
> Wednesday marked the first time that Alberta recorded more than 1,000 new COVID-19 cases in one day since May 15.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edmonton.ctvnews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freddie, saw this, what’s happening in Alberta? You guys are spiking much harder than we are but then, we are beginning to head there, our hospitalization is up as well. Mostly unvaccinated.


Maybe eMacMan can create a nice little graph that doesn’t look so bad.


----------



## groovetube

I think you're talking about someone who, despite a massive amount of study testing and now over 5 billion shots given across the globe, thinks a livestock dewormer with next to nothing in testing and study in comparison, is a better bet.

Not playing with a a full deck. Then you have the troll, who despite the anti-vaxx windups, very likely got the vaccine himself but won't admit it. Makes for great discussions eh?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I think you're talking about someone who, despite a massive amount of study testing and now over 5 billion shots given across the globe, thinks a livestock dewormer with next to nothing in testing and study in comparison, is a better bet.
> 
> Not playing with a a full deck. Then you have the troll, who despite the anti-vaxx windups, very likely got the vaccine himself but won't admit it. Makes for great discussions eh?


 Sounds about right.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Alberta reports over 1,000 new COVID-19 cases for first time in more than three months
> 
> 
> Wednesday marked the first time that Alberta recorded more than 1,000 new COVID-19 cases in one day since May 15.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edmonton.ctvnews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freddie, saw this, what’s happening in Alberta? You guys are spiking much harder than we are but then, we are beginning to head there, our hospitalization is up as well. Mostly unvaccinated.


But seriously, you’re right. Our numbers are climbing exponentially in Alberta. We had nearly 1100 new cases in one day. The highest we ever hit was about 2400 and at this exponential growth rate, we will hit that very soon. Meanwhile the premier is MIA, apparently “on vacation” while the fed election rolls along so as not to taint O’Toole’s chances due to Kenney’s unpopularity. And students are back in class next Wednesday. And no more contract tracing or isolation very soon. Talk about a ****show. I am not looking forward to the start of this school year.


----------



## groovetube

Strangely our provincial government is also, completely missing in action. I know it’s usually an unsaid that provincial governments tend to stay mostly out of the way of a federal election, but the silence from both Ford and Kenny, is rather unusual.


----------



## Macfury

Wow! At what exponent is it growing?



Freddie_Biff said:


> But seriously, you’re right. Our numbers are climbing exponentially in Alberta. We had nearly 1100 new cases in one day. The highest we ever hit was about 2400 and at this exponential growth rate, we will hit that very soon. Meanwhile the premier is MIA, apparently “on vacation” while the fed election rolls along so as not to taint O’Toole’s chances due to Kenney’s unpopularity. And students are back in class next Wednesday. And no more contract tracing or isolation very soon. Talk about a ****show. I am not looking forward to the start of this school year.


----------



## groovetube

The one in your head.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> But seriously, you’re right. Our numbers are climbing exponentially in Alberta. We had nearly 1100 new cases in one day. The highest we ever hit was about 2400 and at this exponential growth rate, we will hit that very soon. Meanwhile the premier is MIA, apparently “on vacation” while the fed election rolls along so as not to taint O’Toole’s chances due to Kenney’s unpopularity. And students are back in class next Wednesday. And no more contract tracing or isolation very soon. Talk about a ****show. I am not looking forward to the start of this school year.


I listened to a report today where the doctors projected where your numbers could go if left unchecked, saying this could grow exponentially quite quickly.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I listened to a report today where the doctors projected where your numbers could go if left unchecked, saying this could grow exponentially quite quickly.


We keep using that word. Macfury doesn’t think it means what we think it means.


----------



## Macfury

Exponentially, like a Zombie apocalypse!



Freddie_Biff said:


> We keep using that word. Macfury doesn’t think it means what we think it means.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> We keep using that word. Macfury doesn’t think it means what we think it means.


Well that’s because he too Isosceles for his own good.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Well that’s because he too Isosceles for his own good.


And let’s not forget his algorithmic observations!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

At least Rachel Notley keeps us updated in Alberta while Jason Kenney and Tyler Shandro (health minister) are playing hide and seek. We are also running out of staff to care for the people in hospitals and medical staff are being recalled from their summer vacations (not Kenney or Shandro though) to try to keep up. School starts up next Wednesday. 


Today's COVID update:

1,112 new COVID cases 
10.6% positivity rate
308 in hospital (+24) with 64 in the ICU (+5)
9,066 active cases (+570)

Sadly, there have been four additional deaths. My condolences to the families that lost loved ones. 

I urge Albertans to get vaccinated. Because that's how we will finally put this pandemic behind us.


----------



## groovetube

Why are we surprised? We’ve had the benefit of watching this whole thing go down right in front of our faces down in the states. It makes no difference what these dip****s jaw off about around here. Let them swallow their dewormers and go screw off. No one cares. And history ain't gonna be kind to these numbskulls.


----------



## Macfury

Canada should have followed the US lead in securing monoclonal antibodies for treatment:









After slow start, demand for COVID monoclonal antibodies treatment skyrockets


Monoclonal antibodies can reduce the risk of severe COVID-19, but they've been underused. Demand has soared with the rise of the delta variant.



www.usatoday.com


----------



## groovetube

Yeah! It’s not like we have an even more effective vaccine that even has full authorization!

the stupid continues!

Freddie, cue the windups on effectiveness percentages. It just won’t quit.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Yeah! It’s not like we have an even more effective vaccine that even has full authorization!
> 
> the stupid continues!
> 
> Freddie, cue the windups on effectiveness percentages. It just won’t quit.


Deniers gonna deny. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## groovetube

Make the unvaccinated pay out for their deadly decisions | CNN


Covid-19 is now an "epidemic of the unvaccinated," writes John Banzhaf, but we the vaccinated, are still being unnecessarily exposed to its serious risks -- wearing masks because of the unvaccinated and forced to bear lockdowns, restrictions and most of the financial costs so that some can...




www.cnn.com





This is now showing up in many more circles (besides CNN of course). I've been saying this for some time now, and this snip pretty much articulates it perfectly.



> We need to make sure that those financial costs at least are borne as much as possible by those who are responsible for them, and not by the majority who got their shots.
> 
> People may claim that they have a right to refuse vaccination. But that does not give them the right to put the lives of others at risk, nor to force the majority to pay for their bad decision.
> 
> Once the American public began to focus on the huge costs of smoking rather than simply the risks smoking posed to bystanders, many steps were taken to require smokers to bear more of their fair share of those unnecessary financial costs.


----------



## Macfury

This study overhwelmigly supports natural immunity against Delta as far superior to that conferred by MRNA technology.

_The new analysis relies on the database of Maccabi Healthcare Services, which enrolls about 2.5 million Israelis. The study, led by Tal Patalon and Sivan Gazit at KSM, the system’s research and innovation arm, found in two analyses that people who were vaccinated in January and February were, in June, July, and the first half of August, six to 13 times more likely to get infected than unvaccinated people who were previously infected with the coronavirus. In one analysis, comparing more than 32,000 people in the health system, the risk of developing symptomatic COVID-19 was 27 times higher among the vaccinated, and the risk of hospitalization eight times higher.









Having SARS-CoV-2 once confers much greater immunity than a vaccine—but no infection parties, please


Israelis who had an infection were more protected against the Delta coronavirus variant than those who had an already highly effective COVID-19 vaccine




www.sciencemag.org




_


----------



## groovetube

You really have to stop reading headlines and actually _read_ the article. Because that is NOT the conclusion nor the full story at all.

Otherwise you're simply embarrassing yourself.


----------



## Macfury

As the jabs begin to demonstrate waning efficacy, monoclonal antibodies can help people with breakthrough infections.









Monoclonal Antibodies vs. Vaccines vs. COVID-19: What to Know


Whether you’ve just tested positive or been exposed, monoclonal antibodies could help you and your loved ones stave off COVID-19. Here’s what you need to know.




www.webmd.com


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Agreed. And yet we still see people posting from media sources as though they are authoritative.


Ima just gonna leave this right here.

Freddie, did I not call the ensuing windups? Macfury is like the energizer bunny. Just likely a whole lot dumber.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Ima just gonna leave this right here.
> 
> Freddie, did I not call the ensuing windups? Macfury is like the energizer bunny. Just likely a whole lot dumber.


Like clockwork.


----------



## groovetube

Obviously my calling out his stupidity stung enough to pull this display of even more brainlessness. Touched a nerve I guess.

wait til he finds out there has been testing on monoclonal antibodies here in Canada for a long time!


----------



## groovetube

Sometimes it’s good to step away from the stupid, and get back to what’s really happening. I did find it interesting to watch the Israeli PM with Biden today, since we’ve heard a confused attempt at reporting something out of Israel, declare that their pandemic was a “pandemic of the unvaccinated”.

though I’m sure there’ll be some howls of something or other nonsense, I did think this was rather, timely


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Sometimes it’s good to step away from the stupid, and get back to what’s really happening. I did find it interesting to watch the Israeli PM with Biden today, since we’ve heard a confused attempt at reporting something out of Israel, declare that their pandemic was a “pandemic of the unvaccinated”.
> 
> though I’m sure there’ll be some howls of something or other nonsense, I did think this was rather, timely


I wonder if their numbers are rising exponentially.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## groovetube

If only they would listen to macfury. He’s clearly much more in the know with his headlines! 

As long as they don’t read the rest of the article is LOL.


----------



## groovetube

Ha. I looked about a ways back randomly to see if it was always spouting stupidity. Rhetorical question I guess 



Macfury said:


> Tucker Carlson is spot on bout the "lockdown":


Wow. Tucker Carlson eh? Wasn't he the dude that spouted the anti-vax stuff while he and all his Fox News co-horts were all vaxxed? ha ha ha.



Macfury said:


> Good video. Thanks for sharing it. Herd immunity will likely prevail before that vaccine is developed. Hopefully some anti-viral drug will beat it to market.


Wasn't he going after you Freddie about herd immunity not long ago?

Talk about being wrong like, the whole time! Herd immunity before, the vaccine? ha ha ha ha LOL This is just pathetic and boring. 

There's probably some bragging about 'lib tears' or something regarding Trump that would be a hoot to see.  

In 2 weeks!! ha ha ha ha.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Ha. I looked about a ways back randomly to see if it was always spouting stupidity. Rhetorical question I guess
> 
> 
> 
> Wow. Tucker Carlson eh? Wasn't he the dude that spouted the anti-vax stuff while he and all his Fox News co-horts were all vaxxed? ha ha ha.
> 
> 
> 
> Wasn't he going after you Freddie about herd immunity not long ago?
> 
> Talk about being wrong like, the whole time! Herd immunity before, the vaccine? ha ha ha ha LOL This is just pathetic and boring.
> 
> There's probably some bragging about 'lib tears' or something regarding Trump that would be a hoot to see.
> 
> In 2 weeks!! ha ha ha ha.


Some people live for the windup. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## groovetube

Just constant! No wonder no ones around anymore.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Well, we are. 

Alberta today, courtesy of former Premier Rachel Notley. At least SOMEONE takes their job seriously. 

Today's COVID update:

1,183 new cases
336 in hospital (+28) with 74 in the ICU (+10)
10 % positivity rate
9,655 active cases (+589)

Sadly, 4 Albertans have passed away. My condolences to the loved ones they've left behind. 

Today, the government also announced surgeries will be delayed in order to make space for the influx of COVID patients in hospitals. 

I feel for these families. They will have to wait even longer due to the lack of leadership from the UCP government in the middle of a public health crisis.

As COVID cases and hospitalizations continue to rise, the Premier and his ministers continue to avoid Albertans and accountability. 

It’s time for them to present a plan to slow the spread of COVID-19 and protect the health of Albertans.


----------



## groovetube

Ontario is also headed north, I think it’s a forgone conclusion it will continue. But, word is, Doug Ford is finally giving in to the demand by all top doctors to bring in a provincial vaccine passport. Wonder if Kenny will be the holdout? 









Ontario will unveil COVID-19 vaccine passport system, source confirms


The Doug Ford government will unveil a COVID-19 vaccine passport system this week, a senior government source confirms.




toronto.ctvnews.ca





O’Toole will have egg on his face. But I suspect that Doug Ford, couldn’t give a **** about O’Toole, as he probably knows O’Tooles goose is already cooked by the party’s lunatics that don’t think he’s far right enough, and Ford is up for re-election in less than a year and he’s very unpopular right now.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Yeah I don’t know much about the relationship between Ford and O’Toole, but word is that Kenney is toxic right now which is why he’s been off the radar (“on holidays” as they say). There’s no plans yet for a vaccine passport in AB but it’s the one thing that would get some of these people off their asses to get vaccinated. Imagine not being able to go to hockey games, which is already in the works despite the prov gov’t. I don’t think these numbers are going down on their own, and if we’re not wearing masks when school resumes next Wednesday, we will be soon.


----------



## groovetube

Vaccines are experimental you don’t know what’s in them! But hey oh look, how about these antivirals that are still being tested let’s take those!!! There’s a link that’s says they’re better!!!!The variants? It’s because of the vaccines man!!! 

I saw this doofus today at spadina and queen standing there with a big sign declaring that the vaccine has dead fetus cells or some insane crap afterwards and I thought of macfury ha ha.

It’s because of these lunatics spreading this crap far and wide. Vaccine passports will make people finally do the right thing. They were already closing up events to the unvaccinated here and many businesses were smartly looking to have their own passport system. Either Doug Ford got on board or he was going going to be left at the station.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Vaccines are experimental you don’t know what’s in them! But hey oh look, how about these antivirals that are still being tested let’s take those!!! There’s a link that’s says they’re better!!!!The variants? It’s because of the vaccines man!!!
> 
> I saw this doofus today at spadina and queen standing there with a big sign declaring that the vaccine has dead fetus cells or some insane crap afterwards and I thought of macfury ha ha.
> 
> It’s because of these lunatics spreading this crap far and wide. Vaccine passports will make people finally do the right thing. They were already closing up events to the unvaccinated here and many businesses were smartly looking to have their own passport system. Either Doug Ford got on board or he was going going to be left at the station.


Let’s see how Kenney responds, if he ever resurfaces. Word on the street is no way, no how, never. Alberta is the Florida of the North, doncha know.


----------



## Macfury

If you bawl hard enough you can find government agencies who would be happy to track you everywhere you go! 

Is that "freedom" I smell?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Let’s see how Kenney responds, if he ever resurfaces. Word on the street is no way, no how, never. Alberta is the Florida of the North, doncha know.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie, I think I hear someone already bawling hard about the fact he's about to be forced, FORCED to use a government controlled passport system to even access any non-essential businesses and be tracked everywhere he goes HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

Im literally grinning ear to ear ha ha.

I have a feeling Alberta won't have a choice soon. But failing that, I suspect there'll be some bawling (pretty loud I suspect) when the unVaxxed can't travel...


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Isn't that enough incentive for dimbulbs and mediocre people to act?


Oh yeah I found this gem. Because I think there was some mewling some time ago about my lack of "civility", while this troll runs and hides. Just giving what I see it gives too and gets away with it.


----------



## groovetube

Second week of campaign ends with Trudeau rally cancelled for safety concerns


The Liberal campaign cancelled an early evening rally Friday after an unruly group of demonstrators denouncing Justin Trudeau and pandemic policies set off security concerns, with Trudeau himself saying that going ahead with the event would have put people at risk.



www.ctvnews.ca





I love the fact that these screaming drooling morons have quite literally played right into Trudeau's hands. He couldn't ask for a better help, to place vaccines and the passports on the national election stage. 

Good going idiots!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Trudeau is no hero, but these Conservatives come across as total idiots. We shall see.


----------



## groovetube

I have a hard time listening to the guy at all really, but I LOVE how he drives these bawling er, "dim bulbs and mediocre people" just bonkers!!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I have a hard time listening to the guy at all really, but I LOVE how he drives these bawling er, "dim bulbs and mediocre people" just bonkers!!


Yup, he’s a winner.


----------



## eMacMan

Freddie_Biff said:


> Sadly, 4 Albertans have passed away. My condolences to the loved ones they've left behind.
> 
> Today, the government also announced surgeries will be delayed in order to make space for the influx of COVID patients in hospitals.
> 
> I feel for these families. They will have to wait even longer due to the lack of leadership from the UCP government in the middle of a public health crisis.
> 
> As COVID cases and hospitalizations continue to rise, the Premier and his ministers continue to avoid Albertans and accountability.
> 
> It’s time for them to present a plan to slow the spread of COVID-19 and protect the health of Albertans.


Uh you do realize that about 100 Albertans die every day?

Also to restate the obvious, anybody who tests positive on a PCR is labeled Covid, including end stage cancers, strokes, heart attacks, kidney failure............

And to restate the obvious when you overclock the PCR test as severely as Alberta is, then at least half of those positive tests are false positives. BTW the average age of death with Covid in Alberta is four months beyond the average Albertan's lifespan.


----------



## groovetube

Oh stop it. No one cares about your bull**** conspiracy nonsense.

Except maybe macfury. He loves it.


----------



## eMacMan

Another one of those official bull **** charts that terrify Freddie and the rest of the Kool-aid crowd into incoherent babble. Anyone who is not graphically retarded can figure out that almost 80% of all Albertans who died had at least three other potentially fatal conditions, over 90% had at least two, and over 95% had at least one other potentially fatal condition.

Even in the ICU over 80% were there for other potentially fatal conditions besides Covid.


----------



## eMacMan

I noticed that some brain dead idiot is claiming that the variants are being caused by the unvaccinated. No doubt they also believe anti-biotic resistant bacteria develop because some people are not taking anti-biotics. If a drug challenges a germ the germ evolves to survive the drug. It is the jabs which are responsible for the jab resistant variants.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

eMacMan said:


> Uh you do realize that about 100 Albertans die every day.
> 
> Also to restate the obvious anybody who tests positive on a PCR is labeled Covid, including end stage cancers, strokes, heart attacks, kidney failure............
> 
> And to restate the obvious when you overclock the PCR test as severely as Alberta is, then at least half of those positive tests are false positives. BTW the average age of death with Covid in Alberta is four months beyond the average Albertan's lifespan.


Perhaps you could create a little chart to explain that better. They’re so much more fun to read than real charts.


----------



## groovetube

We have a live one here Freddie. Just mouths off and mouths off but doesn’t provide a shred of evidence to back up its brainless claims. Then gets all mad and snarly when you call it out.

The variants we currently have were created before we had the vaccine. So it’s incorrect that vaccines will cause mutations. They will happen regardless. Unless it will come up with some wingnut theory that everybody was secretly vaccinated as the alpha, South African, Brazilian, lambda and now the delta were found well before people started getting vaccinated.

Does anyone here, have a goddam brain? What’s the point of anyone participating with these two numbskulls? Seriously.


----------



## groovetube

Here your chance macfury, repeat your stupidity about the vaccinated and variants. Come on, you’re stupid enough aren’t ya? 

I know you are. The floors yours. Turn this place into a bigger ****hole I dare you!


----------



## groovetube

Come on tell us some stories about the people that were turned magnetic and spoons and **** are sticking to their chests! More! Yeah! Tell us some MORE BULLCRAP!

That’ll show how smart you idiots are.


----------



## smashedbanana

eMacMan said:


> I noticed that some brain dead idiot is claiming that the variants are being caused by the unvaccinated. No doubt they also believe anti-biotic resistant bacteria develop because some people are not taking anti-biotics. If a drug challenges a germ the germ evolves to survive the drug. It is the jabs which are responsible for the jab resistant variants.


Neither of these statements are correct.

Viral mutation happens as a result of the virus's lifespan. The longer it is around the more it mutates due to errors in copying, drift, shift, etc.


----------



## Macfury

It's tough to be yelled at, but I know Trudeau can bear the brunt of these terrible verbal attacks. He's just that kind of leader!



Freddie_Biff said:


> Trudeau is no hero, but these Conservatives come across as total idiots. We shall see.


----------



## groovetube

smashedbanana said:


> Neither of these statements are correct.
> 
> Viral mutation happens as a result of the virus's lifespan. The longer it is around the more it mutates due to errors in copying, drift, shift, etc.


Thanks for some sanity, though I don’t know that either emac or macfury will pay attention to it. They’ve managed to turn things into a vaccinated versus unvaccinated thing. Emacman is clearly, like macfury only here to cause nonsense. He is also incorrect that I said that only the unvaccinated caused mutations, he is either lying or has trouble reading. I responded to both emac and macfurys ridiculous claims that it’s the vaccinated that will cause mutations by reminding them that the current mutations that we have were discovered before people were vaccinated. That doesn’t matter to either of them, as they’re only interested in a fight. Though macfury, in classic macfury fashion, worded his statement slightly differently so that he can change the goalposts when he’s called out on it. That’s kinda what he does though, and has left a years long trail of people who just got frustrated with his childish antics and gave up. He gets off on it is about the only explanation.

As far as my limited understanding was, you are correct, a virus mutates regardless. Though if a vaccine prevents infection to a fairly significant degree (I’m reading estimates are around 50% or more with the current vaccines) it will mean less chances for mutation as there would be far less hosts for mutation to happen.

I see that he’s invoked Robert Malone. That didn’t take much. Good luck


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> Viral mutation happens as a result of the virus's lifespan. The longer it is around the more it mutates due to errors in copying, drift, shift, etc.


But each human host is a petri dish with opportunistic viruses competing. In the same way that antibiotic-resistant strains of bacteria are created through the overuse of antibiotics, those vaccinated with drugs that still allow for infection, are perfect hosts to breed vaccine-resistant strains of COVID. This is not to say that variants can only be generated among people receiving these jabs, but if these hosts can ward off Alpha COVID (and maybe Delta), while still allowing for asymptomatic infection, then there is no competition for variants.

Robert Malone, who helped develop mRNA treatment, notes that what he's concerned about at this point is not Antibody Dependent Enhancement, but Vaccine Enhanced Replication.


----------



## groovetube

When in doubt, invoke Robert Malone. The refuge of many a Facebook anti-vaxxer!

First you say we’ll hit here immunity before we get a vaccine, then we get Robert Malone.

what did I tell ya Freddie, like the energizer bunny. It won’t quit until people just get pissed off and give up.

oh just don’t respond! Be civil! Look around.

good job macfury!


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Another NEJM hydroxychloroquine study bites the dust:
> 
> Two coronavirus studies retracted after questions emerge about data


Further to macfurys constant windups. So, how much hydroxychloroquine did you buy macfury? Did you stock up on zinc and livestock dewormer as well? Fell for that too?

I hope Robert Malone didn’t advise this…

your posts don’t tend to age well do they…


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> When in doubt, invoke Robert Malone. The refuge of many a Facebook anti-vaxxer!
> 
> First you say we’ll hit here immunity before we get a vaccine, then we get Robert Malone.
> 
> what did I tell ya Freddie, like the energizer bunny. It won’t quit until people just get pissed off and give up.
> 
> oh just don’t respond! Be civil! Look around.
> 
> good job macfury!


And the hits just keep coming. SMH


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## groovetube

Its really too bad these two have to run around in circles turning a simple conversation about mutations in this manner. We could be talking about what to do as this progresses in future, as Im sure there will be more mutations in future, whether it develops in unvaccinated or vaccinated... instead, we have everything from this is a hoax, to livestock dewormers, to the vaccines will cause mutations, nonsense charts, and the usual kind of stupidity that has prevented this place from being any fun to participate in.

Nice going guys.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Its really too bad these two have to run around in circles turning a simple conversation about mutations in this manner. We could be talking about what to do as this progresses in future, as Im sure there will be more mutations in future, whether it develops in unvaccinated or vaccinated... instead, we have everything from this is a hoax, to livestock dewormers, to the vaccines will cause mutations, nonsense charts, and the usual kind of stupidity that has prevented this place from being any fun to participate in.
> 
> Nice going guys.


And the irony of it is that I’ll bet they’ve both been vaccinated too. Macfury has, for sure. He just likes to play devil’s advocate.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> And the irony of it is that I’ll bet they’ve both been vaccinated too. Macfury has, for sure. He just likes to play devil’s advocate.


Of course he has. If he wasn’t he’d brag about it like all the other anti-vaxxers. Devil’s advocate? Naw he’s just being childish.

if emac is vaccinated, now that, would be hilarious after all that embarrassing garbage. If not, well, if he’s older this delta variant might be a bit of a crapshoot. Even if he survives. Good luck to him.


----------



## groovetube

The Vaccine Scientist Spreading Vaccine Misinformation


Robert Malone claims to have invented mRNA technology. Why is he trying so hard to undermine its use?




www.theatlantic.com







> It’s only in the curious world of fringe media that Malone has found the platform, and the recognition, he’s sought for so long. He talks to hosts who aren’t going to question whether he’s the brains behind the Pfizer and Moderna shots. They’re not going to quibble over whether credit should be shared with co-authors, or talk about how science is like a relay race, or point out that, absent the hard work of brilliant researchers who came before and after Malone, there would be no vaccine. He’s an upgrade over their typical guest list of chiropractors and naturopaths, and they’re perfectly happy to address him by the title he believes he’s earned: inventor of the mRNA vaccines.


Ouch. Im always amazed at how many people there are that are gullible enough to think that one person, so obviously a discredited and with obvious delusions of grandeur, in amongst a vast number of scientists involved in developing a medical breakthrough is someone to present as credible, particularly if their platform is Steve Bannon's podcast (LOL). Clearly, it's a case of someone who desperately clings to a particular view, and is willing to find anything, any one... no matter how dodgy any of it may be, to not only confirm their belief, but to so reverently push it on others, in an attempt to make themselves feel better.



> One target of Malone’s ire, the biochemist Katalin Karikó, has been featured in multiple news stories as an mRNA-vaccine pioneer. CNN called her work “the basis of the Covid-19 vaccine” while a _New York Times_ headline said she had “helped shield the world from the coronavirus.” None of those stories mentioned Malone. “I’ve been written out of the history,” he has said. “It’s all about Kati.” Karikó shared with me an email that Malone sent her in June, accusing her of feeding reporters bogus information and inflating her own accomplishments. “This is not going to end well,” Malone’s message says.
> 
> Karikó replied that she hadn’t told anyone that she is the inventor of mRNA vaccines and that “many many scientists” contributed to their success. “I have never claimed more than discovering a way to make RNA less inflammatory,” she wrote to him. She told me that Malone referred to himself in an email as her “mentor” and “coach,” though she says they’ve met in person only once, in 1997, when he invited her to give a talk. It’s Malone, according to Karikó, who has been overstating his accomplishments. There are “hundreds of scientists who contributed more to mRNA vaccines than he did.”


Wow. Sorry macfury. That was quite the fail.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

An interesting factoid about vaccines and blood clots.



> COVID-19 presents greater blood clot risk than vaccines, study finds
> 
> Coronavirus
> News
> Published Aug. 28, 2021 8:20 p.m. ET
> 
> By Anthony Vasquez-Peddie
> CTVNews.ca writer
> 
> TORONTO -- The risk of developing blood clots is substantially higher and more prolonged if you contract COVID-19 compared to receiving the Oxford-AstraZeneca or Pfizer-BioNTech vaccines, according to a new study.
> 
> The study found that while there is a small increased risk of potentially deadly clots for a short time after receiving a dose of the AstraZeneca vaccine, the chances of such adverse events are nearly 200 times higher if one becomes infected with the virus.
> 
> "People should be aware of these increased risks after COVID-19 vaccination and seek medical attention promptly if they develop symptoms, but also be aware that the risks are considerably higher and over longer periods of time if they become infected with SARS-CoV-2," Julia Hippisley-Cox, professor of clinical epidemiology and general practice at the University of Oxford and lead author of the study, said in a press release.
> 
> The study, published Friday in the British Medical Journal, analyzed the health data of over 29 million people in the U.K. within 28 days of receiving their first COVID-19 vaccine dose between Dec. 1, 2020 and April 24, 2021. Approximately 19.5 million received an AstraZeneca dose and 9.5 million a Pfizer shot. Data from these individuals were compared with those from about 1.75 million patients who tested positive for COVID-19 during the same period.
> 
> Newsletter sign-up: Get The COVID-19 Brief sent to your inbox
> Overall, researchers found the risk of blood clots, low platelet counts and stroke were much higher and more prolonged upon infection with COVID-19 than after receiving a dose of either vaccine.
> 
> Researchers estimated that for every 10 million COVID-19 cases or vaccine inoculations, there would be 66 additional cases of blood clots in the veins after a dose of the AstraZeneca vaccine compared to 12,614 among those infected with the virus.
> 
> AstraZeneca doses could introduce 107 additional cases of low platelet counts compared to 934 from those with the virus, while the Pfizer vaccine could result in 143 additional cases of stroke compared to 1,699 instances among those with COVID-19.
> 
> Jeffrey Weitz, executive director of the Thrombosis and Atherosclerosis Research Institute at McMaster University in Hamilton, Ont., said the risk of clotting after the first dose of a COVID-19 vaccine remains small.
> 
> "I think this information should just inform individuals that they need to get vaccinated," Weitz told CTV News Channel on Saturday. "[Compared] to not being vaccinated, your risk of getting a blood clot is at least 10 to 100 times higher."
> 
> Many provinces across Canada suspended rollouts of the AstraZeneca vaccine earlier this year due to reports of an increased risk of rare but serious blood clots associated with low levels of platelets.


 https://apple.news/AHjSqnWOBTf-OufxmMBLw-Q


----------



## groovetube

I guess that’s why someone I knew had his leg amputated, twice (below the knee then above) and ended up not surviving. Younger and healthy before anyone starts with nonsense.

While some focus on stats they are instructed to spin from conspiracy types, there’s a whole lot more in terms of life changing health issues on many who survive, many of whom are younger and healthy sadly. If someone wishes to point out what is often not talked about in the media, it's this.


----------



## Macfury

Yes, coronavirus can really turn the blood to jelly in some cases.



Freddie_Biff said:


> An interesting factoid about vaccines and blood clots.
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19 presents greater blood clot risk than vaccines, study finds — CTV News


----------



## groovetube

vaccine passport announced today in Ontario. Curiously, Doug Ford criticized Trudeau for not giving us a national vaccine passport. O'Toole in contrast, rejects doing so.

Probably won't be long before Kenny is brought kicking and screaming to his senses. So those taking horse dewormer (the poison centers are getting overwhelmed with calls because of these numbskulls...) will not only be total idiots, but won't be able to go anywhere either.

Guess you'll just have to get vaxxed. Holler away


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Are vaccine mandates constitutional? An article that takes a closer look at this argument and whether it would be successful. 



> Vaccine mandates are not “forced vaccination”
> 
> Would-be claimants would face multiple hurdles to prove their case. The first would involve establishing an infringement of a protected interest in “life, liberty or security of the person.”
> 
> But, contrary to claims otherwise, vaccine mandates do not constitute forced vaccination.
> 
> “There are some people who think that vaccine passports and the use of the word ‘mandate’ means that we’re holding people down and forcing them to be vaccinated,” Milne told CTVNews.ca by phone this week.
> “It’s just limiting the ability to participate in certain activities if they don’t have a vaccine. If, in fact, the government were forcing people to be vaccinated – like actually physically holding people down and giving them a vaccine – that would probably be a pretty clear charter breach.”
> 
> Mandates offer a choice: receive or decline the vaccine. Those who decline are instead presented with a different set of options.
> “In the case of students, you can try to enroll in online classes, or you can take a term off. In the case of employees, you can try to seek accommodation or take a leave,” Samuel E. Trosow, associate professor in the faculty of law and faculty of information and media studies at Western University, told CTVNews.ca by phone.
> 
> “These may be inconvenient and unwanted options, but they are options.”


 https://beta.ctvnews.ca/national/coronavirus/2021/9/1/1_5569971.amp.html


----------



## Macfury

Suppose I acept this argument and then create a mandate that all my employees be flu vaccinated? Vaccinated against anthrax?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Are vaccine mandates constitutional? An article that takes a closer look at this argument and whether it would be successful.
> 
> 
> 
> Do vaccine mandates violate Canadians' charter rights?


----------



## groovetube

Require vaccines? This has never happened before! Unprecedented! How dare!











I don't think anyone gives a rats ass about people's mewlings about constitutional challenges. People want a return to normal life. Businesses dont want another lockdown. The real irony here, is, these anti-vaxx nincompoops can't seem to fathom that when enough of them end up sick and clogging up our ICUs as is occurring in the US, that's when restrictions and lockdowns occur. How many more reports from those areas do we need to read about those with heart attack cancer etc that are being turned away from hospitals because they filled with unvaccinated f*wads before people will clue in???


----------



## groovetube

Risk of breakthrough infections remains very rare, 3 studies find


The vaccines continue to offer strong protection against severe illness and hospitalization.




www.nbcnews.com







> The researchers looked at data collected on more than 1 million people from December 2020 through July 2021, a period that spanned both the alpha and delta variant waves in the U.K. Participants received two doses of either the Pfizer-BioNTech, Moderna or AstraZeneca vaccine.
> 
> Overall, less than 0.2 percent of the participants reported a breakthrough infection, with such cases more likely in people already considered to be vulnerable, including older adults or people with underlying illnesses.
> 
> When breakthrough infections did occur, most were mild — just 6 percent of people with breakthrough infections reported symptoms. What's more, vaccination was shown to cut the risk of hospitalization by more than two-thirds.
> 
> Two other studies published Wednesday also found an extremely low rate of breakthrough infections.


bu-bu-but I have horse dewormer!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Oh my [email protected] god. An interesting perspective and one I happen to [email protected] agree with. 

 https://www.mcsweeneys.net/article..._0YJahPAzPmJxQNPFGXmISzj-bw4dobruI7parLnm_aR4


----------



## Macfury

Progressives ready to s*** themselves. Common species these days.



Freddie_Biff said:


> An interesting perspective and one I happen to [email protected] agree with.


----------



## groovetube

What does this have to do with progressives? You need to flick that auto-reply switch off macfury.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> What does this have to do with progressives? You need to flick that auto-reply switch off macfury.


No kidding. It’s so predictable.


----------



## groovetube

It’s funny, when you actually hand it right back to them they really don’t like it and stop responding.

I think it’s called thin skinned. If you cant take it, then stfu. Right, it’s only bad if groovetube does it I forgot…

In other news, apparently, shocking I know, number of jab appointments nearly doubled overnight after the vaccine passport announcement.

you don’t say.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> It’s funny, when you actually hand it right back to them they really don’t like it and stop responding.
> 
> I think it’s called thin skinned. If you cant take it, then stfu. Right, it’s only bad if groovetube does it I forgot…
> 
> In other news, apparently, shocking I know, number of jab appointments nearly doubled overnight after the vaccine passport announcement.
> 
> you don’t say.


Funny how that works. People respond when government grows a pair. I know many brainwashed people who swear they will never get “the jab,” but the concept of requiring documentation for certain activities is perfectly legal. We need to make sure the power is not abused of course, but it’s one effective way to get people to reconsider their decisions.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Then there’s this. 



> Vaccine protests threaten to disrupt essential services as crowds gather outside hospitals, police headquarters
> 
> Alex CyrPublished September 2, 2021
> 
> Protesters listen to a speaker as they gather outside Toronto police headquarters to voice opposition to COVID-19 vaccines and other pandemic-related restrictions on Sept. 2, 2021.
> 
> Indy Sahota, a Toronto physician, was on his way to work at Mount Sinai Hospital’s emergency department on Wednesday afternoon when he came upon a large protest outside the building.
> 
> As he got closer, he heard people chanting anti-vaccine slogans.
> 
> Hundreds of protesters were blocking the intersection in front of the hospital. “Cars weren’t able to go anywhere, which is a big problem for us because our ambulance bay is actually right at that intersection,” Dr. Sahota said.
> 
> Protesters in Ontario, British Columbia and Quebec have taken to busy streets and hospital entrances in the past week to voice their discontent with vaccine passports, which all three provinces have recently moved to implement.
> 
> Once the passports come into effect, they will prevent unvaccinated people from entering non-essential gathering places such as indoor restaurants and gyms. Surveys have shown that three-quarters of Canadians approve of the restrictions. But a vocal minority continues to oppose the idea. And their protests, medical professionals say, may in some cases be hindering health care.
> 
> “I was surprised by the audacity of doing this outside a hospital,” Dr. Sahota said. “I just felt so defeated.”


 https://www.theglobeandmail.com/ca...aten-to-disrupt-essential-services-as-crowds/


----------



## groovetube

Hospitals?? If any of them prevent emergency medical services from happening, handcuff them and haul their ass to covid hotel. Let them rot in there for a while unvaccinated. If anything bad happened because of their protest then bring in criminal charges that results in a few years. That's simply disgusting.

If you're going to protest, at least have the decency to do it somewhere where there isn't people's lives at stake. These anti-vaxxers are subhumans.


----------



## Macfury

You will never be sure the power won't be abused. And once they test that power on willing lab rats, they will extend its use.



Freddie_Biff said:


> We need to make sure the power is not abused of course, but it’s one effective way to get people to reconsider their decisions.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> No kidding. It’s so predictable.


And pathetic. I think it's 's**** himself!'. Maybe he's actually the 'progressive' he was referring to?


----------



## Macfury

One thing that "progressives" of the past would find themselves amazed at is to see their "woke" descendants transformed into lobbyists for big pharma and the biggest critics of universal healthcare over the space of just a few months!


----------



## groovetube

LOL. Struck a nerve I guess.

Now it's just flinging feces against the wall. It's been reduced to this.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> LOL. Struck a nerve I guess.
> 
> Now it's just flinging feces against the wall. It's been reduced to this.


“It do what it gonna do, baby.” - Ray Charles


----------



## groovetube

this coming from the dingbats that trust internet lore that horse dewormer is a legit cure.

Maybe it’s placating itself with the latest Canadian election polls.

Oh wait polls are bad. In 2 weeks we’ll all see!

hard to keep track.


----------



## groovetube

Canada on course for worst wave of COVID-19 yet, new modelling data shows


Reported daily COVID-19 caseloads in Canada could reach unprecedented highs later this month if current levels of virus transmission are not reduced, new federal modelling data shows.




www.ctvnews.ca





I bet that horse dewormer is just flying off the shelves!


----------



## Macfury

Har!









Joe Rogan Criticized As 'Anti-Science' For Surviving COVID


U.S.—Progressives have expressed their anger across the country as another person, Joe Rogan, recovered from COVID and did not die, harming their preferred narrative about the deadliness of the virus and what kind of treatments should be used. He has been called "anti-science" and "a purveyor of...




babylonbee.com


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Canada on course for worst wave of COVID-19 yet, new modelling data shows
> 
> 
> Reported daily COVID-19 caseloads in Canada could reach unprecedented highs later this month if current levels of virus transmission are not reduced, new federal modelling data shows.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ctvnews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I bet that horse dewormer is just flying off the shelves!


It is in Alberta—Texas of the North.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> It is in Alberta—Texas of the North.


If things don’t improve vaccination numbers wise, it’s gonna be a real wake up call for everyone. People can yuk yuk all they like, but there’s unfortunately, going to be a lot of unvaccinated in ICU and you’ll see more of the videos and reports of people urging others to get the vaccine before they pass away. 

But apparently if you protect yourself and listen to medical experts, that’s “progressive”

Well, ok!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> If things don’t improve vaccination numbers wise, it’s gonna be a real wake up call for everyone. People can yuk yuk all they like, but there’s unfortunately, going to be a lot of unvaccinated in ICU and you’ll see more of the videos and reports of people urging others to get the vaccine before they pass away.
> 
> But apparently if you protect yourself and listen to medical experts, that’s “progressive”
> 
> Well, ok!


Better progressive than regressive. In this province our ICU beds are 97% full. That’s pretty serious, despite Macfury’s insistence that it isn’t. Watch out eMacMan! More numbers.


----------



## Macfury

How full are Alberta's ICU beds normally?



Freddie_Biff said:


> In this province our ICU beds are 97% full.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> How full are Alberta's ICU beds normally?


How full do you think they should be?


----------



## Macfury

Absolutely no idea how full they should be. But "97%" is only meaningful against a normal context.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> How full do you think they should be?


Looks like someone is clueless and wants you to do his research for him. And if you did, he’ll just **** all over it and prance around like usual. 

If Alberta’s ICU capacity is 97% well before a projected surge, what does anyone think will happen, and what will happen with those who require emergency services with non covid emergencies?

Macfury is an idiot. It’s useless to give it oxygen.


----------



## Macfury

I'm disappointed with the media referring to Ivermectin as a "horse drug" when it has been FDA-approved as an anti-parasitic in humans for decades. Its novel action allows chloride ions to traverse cell walls where they can interfere with viral replication. It's certainly unwise to self-medicate using animal doses, but it's difficult to comprehend why the voices from the cheap seats scream and stamp their feet when anyone even contemplates Ivermectin's therapeutic use against COVID-19.

_The American Journal of Therapeutics _is a bimonthly peer-reviewed medical journal covering advances in drug therapy. Based on existing trials, a recent paper "Review of the Emerging Evidence Demonstrating the Efficacy of Ivermectin in the Prophylaxis and Treatment of COVID-19" concludes:

"..._based on the totality of the trials and epidemiologic evidence presented in this review along with the preliminary findings of the Unitaid/WHO meta-analysis of treatment RCTs and the guideline recommendation from the international BIRD conference, ivermectin should be globally and systematically deployed in the prevention and treatment of COVID-19._"









Review of the Emerging Evidence Demonstrating the Efficacy... : American Journal of Therapeutics


ed within clinical trials. Areas of Uncertainty: The majority of trialed agents have failed to provide reproducible, definitive proof of efficacy in reducing the mortality of COVID-19 with the exception of corticosteroids in moderate to severe disease. Recently, evidence has emerged that the...




journals.lww.com





Instead, we hear screams of derision over even a mention of Ivermectin, when people around the world could benefit from a safe and inexpensive medication that demonstrates strong indication of significant efficacy.


----------



## groovetube

That’s right dr. Macfury. You go tell all those medical experts around the world that they’re wrong!

The reason why the media is referring to a ‘horse drug’ is drooling numbskulls everywhere are buying up ivermectin at livestock supply outlets. Pay attention and stop trying to wind people up.

No one cares.


----------



## groovetube

PolitiFact - What to know about a pro-ivermectin group’s study touting the drug versus COVID-19


Is the anti-parasitic drug ivermectin a "cure" for COVID-19? We’ve rated False claims such as "moun




www.politifact.com




hope you didn’t invest too much into hydroxycloriquin or bleach… LOL


----------



## groovetube

I stole this


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Looks like someone is clueless and wants you to do his research for him. And if you did, he’ll just **** all over it and prance around like usual.
> 
> If Alberta’s ICU capacity is 97% well before a projected surge, what does anyone think will happen, and what will happen with those who require emergency services with non covid emergencies?
> 
> Macfury is an idiot. It’s useless to give it oxygen.


They’ve already diverted a lot of non-Covid patients from ICU. Point is, the medical system won’t hold together for much longer.


----------



## groovetube

In the real world we have many reports of non covid emergencies being turned away in regions where delta is ripping through the population and their hospitals are capacity.

None of these dimwits are listening to the doctors and nurses that actually on the front line in those hospitals. They’re sneering at them! I think these mewling little low life’s should have to sent in to do a few months of cleanup duty to give them a front row seat as to what’s really going on. I bet that would shut these uselsss trolls up for a while.

It’ll be back with some other useless hospital stat for a windup. With either a demand to answer a question ‘specifically’ or demanding some research. It’s getting reeeeally boring.


----------



## Macfury

Why would you do that at 97% capcity?



Freddie_Biff said:


> They’ve already diverted a lot of non-Covid patients from ICU.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Why would you do that at 97% capcity?


Seriously, mf, you really ought to think more about the questions you pose before you ask.


----------



## groovetube

It’s kinda like when a 5yr old gets into that ‘why’ stage.


----------



## Macfury

If you have no answer, I respect that.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Seriously, mf, you really ought to think more about the questions you pose before you ask.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> If you have no answer, I respect that.


SMH 🥱


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> It’s kinda like when a 5yr old gets into that ‘why’ stage.


Makes you want to reply with, “Ahhhh, shaddddup.”


----------



## groovetube

He’s been pulling the same childish crap for years. He defines a narrow stat, then demands you answer his question but only on that specific thing, and demands it. Then gets pissy and says you can’t answer his question so therefore…

10yr olds have better debate skills. Why do you think all that’s left is a couple people mocking him? He can join the ‘reasonable debate’ he claims to want any time.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> He’s been pulling the same childish crap for years. He defines a narrow stat, then demands you answer his question but only on that specific thing, and demands it. Then gets pissy and says you can’t answer his question so therefore…
> 
> 10yr olds have better debate skills. Why do you think all that’s left is a couple people mocking him? He can join the ‘reasonable debate’ he claims to want any time.


Hoisted by his own petards as the say. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Macfury

"The say" a lot of things.


----------



## groovetube

Awwwwww….


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Absolutely no idea how full they should be. But "97%" is only meaningful against a normal context.


Precisely. The 97% number that they're bandying about is just one more figure they arbitrarily pulled out of their asses, similar in form & substance to "6 feet", "two weeks to flatten the curve" and various other bull****.

It's all a crock to support the narrative.



> The National Telegraph was told by a former AHS regional director that the ICU capacity figure is nonsense and that it only shows how many ICU beds were arbitrarily earmarked for COVID-19 patients and that regular acute care beds can be easily converted into ICU beds.
> Kenney himself admitted back in April of 2020 that AHS could expand ICU capacity to over 1,000+ beds in the province, which raises the question of why that was not already done at least partially a long time ago?


Come Tuesday I'll be having a very interesting conversation with my MLA who told me to my face less than 3 weeks ago that this would never happen again.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Precisely. The 97% number that they're bandying about is just one more figure they arbitrarily pulled out of their asses, similar in form & substance to "6 feet", "two weeks to flatten the curve" and various other bull****.


Freddie says this is the number at which they pull needy patients out of the ICU--when they still have _a minimum of 3%_ capacity. "Move along ma'am, we have only so many empty ICU beds around you, so we need to move you out of ICU as well."


----------



## groovetube

Ther ya go Freddie. Now the two of these useless 5 yr old doorknobs are going to wind you up around a bunch of facts and figures neither of them have any idea what they mean. I doubt any of them will listen to the medical experts on the front lines. Because, that seems to be what they mean by the ‘narrative’. Idiots.

give their **** a hard pass. Morons both of them.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Freddie says this is the number at which they pull needy patients out of the ICU--when they still have _a minimum of 3%_ capacity. "Move along ma'am, we have only so many empty ICU beds around you, so we need to move you out of ICU as well."


'Nother thing I find interesting is that there is no mention of the Nobel Prize for Medicine awarded to the creators of ivermectin in 2015 for their so-called "horse dewormer". Curious, ain't it...

Nor is there ever any mention of the massive reduction in cases in India (especially in Delhi, that saw a 97% reduction in cases in less than 6 weeks) in all the areas that used "horse dewormer" to treat Chinese coronavirus. 'Course, that "medical expert" don't align with their <spit> Prog narrative so he, too, will be ignored. Not only that, but we'll be accused of being just like them, too stupid to read a graph.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Ther ya go Freddie. Now the two of these useless 5 yr old doorknobs are going to wind you up around a bunch of facts and figures neither of them have any idea what they mean. I doubt any of them will listen to the medical experts on the front lines. Because, that seems to be what they mean by the ‘narrative’. Idiots.
> 
> give their **** a hard pass. Morons both of them.


They can’t see the forest because of all the trees in the way.

Welcome back, Felix! Where’ve you been hiding?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> They can’t see the forest because of all the trees in the way.
> 
> Welcome back, Felix! Where’ve you been hiding?


Probably chasing progs who are hiding horse dewormer. Because I mean you know, that’s what progs do!

LOL


----------



## groovetube

Because ya know Freddie, giving a nation of a BILLION people horse dewormer and it CURES covid and the world doesn’t know… it’s hard to imagine anyone could be this… goddam stupid!


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> "Move along ma'am, we have only so many empty ICU beds around you, so we need to move you out of ICU as well."


Got one more for ya. It's a brief video by a pathologist on the effects of Chinese coronavirus "vaccines" on the human body. Once again, this "front line medical expert's" opinion will be ignored because it contradicts the narrative. You'd think that, rather than be considered right or wrong, they'd be interested in making informed decisions for themselves & their families, especially their children (and _especially_ considering some of the side effects in the reproductive systems). They're not.

If, at some point in the future, it's found out that these Chinese coronavirus "vaccines" have caused bodily harm I wonder how they're going to feel when they're told they don't deserve treatment or financial recompense? Just like some of them are now saying that anybody who avoids the "vaccine" should not receive medical treatment.

And, notice that one thinks t'other is so stupid that he advises against actually reading the accompanying link to find out for himself what it reads? Some friend. Heaven forbid there may actually be some useful information not found on MotherCorpse or other lamestream media. Wonder what he's so afraid of... (rhetorical question).


----------



## groovetube

“The narrative” Freddie! All ya gotta do is say “the narrative”!

strap in for just a total barrage of utter horse****. Don’t expect an explanation of how a nation of more than a billion people got horse dewormer that cured covid and the world never found out!

the “NARRATIVE”!!!!!


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Just like some of them are now saying that anybody who avoids the "vaccine" should not receive medical treatment.


People turning their back on universal healthcare. Drug addicts and the overweight made their own beds, so I guess they're next on the "no-care" list.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> People turning their back on universal healthcare. Drug addicts and the overweight made their own beds, so I guess they're next on the "no-care" list.


The only people abandoning universal healthcare are the numbskulls buying horse dewormer, and continually posting discredited “doctors” who even the authors of the papers they used as ‘proof’ debunked them directly.

you two are total morons.


----------



## groovetube

Come on macfury, tell us about the billion people taking horse dewormer and it cured covid!

BAH HA HA HA HA HA! Good going guys! Awesome factual information you’re posting!!

can you imagine the companies vertiscope is selling ad impressions to loving being associated with this kind of numbskull/idiot conspiracy theories from the far right? Yeah man!! Barrage this place with total horse**** that’s gonna make y’all feel better!

maybe you should pump the horse dewormer up yer asses while yer at it!!! YEEEEEEEEHAAAAWWWWW!!!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Because ya know Freddie, giving a nation of a BILLION people horse dewormer and it CURES covid and the world doesn’t know… it’s hard to imagine anyone could be this… goddam stupid!


And yet we see it here. All. The. Time.


----------



## groovetube

Did you check out the ‘doctor on the frontline’ it tried to pass off as something credible? These guys don’t even bother to read anything they post or look anything up. They just google a headline and go yeah! This supports my (brainless) point of view! I’ll post that! It’s like the hoardes of lazy people on Facebook, they get outraged and then they just hit share. Don’t bother to check it’s validity. But they just ignore it and just barrage with more crap. And then there’s little pathetic mewling troll. Can you imagine what a sad life it leads to have been here the WHOLE time pulling this crap? Then it whines about universal healthcare. A libertarian! Imagine that! Ha ha ha!

ha. Horse dewormer cured India! Now I’ve heard it all.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Did you check out the ‘doctor on the frontline’ it tried to pass off as something credible? These guys don’t even bother to read anything they post or look anything up. They just google a headline and go yeah! This supports my (brainless) point of view! I’ll post that! It’s like the hoardes of lazy people on Facebook, they get outraged and then they just hit share. Don’t bother to check it’s validity. But they just ignore it and just barrage with more crap. And then there’s little pathetic mewling troll. Can you imagine what a sad life it leads to have been here the WHOLE time pulling this crap? Then it whines about universal healthcare. A libertarian! Imagine that! Ha ha ha!
> 
> ha. Horse dewormer cured India! Now I’ve heard it all.


Oooh, it makes me wonder.


----------



## groovetube

I think we’re almost due for a few more thin skinned WAAAAAAH threads about its not fair! Threads. Maybe 18 of them! And then brilliantly whine about no content posts. No CLEW!!!

BAH HA HA HA HA HA


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Drug addicts and the overweight made their own beds, so I guess they're next on the "no-care" list.


Yep. First thing I thought of when I read that. Junkies should just be left on the street to die. Same thing with smokers who contract cancer. And vehicle collision survivors. After all, they all brought it upon themselves. 

What a waste of valuable resources. Do you know how many hospital beds would be available for important things like plastic surgery and abortions? Man...


----------



## groovetube

Why waste your breath on more stupid crap! Come on! Tell us more how they cured a billion people with horse dewormer! Yeah post some more brainless crap!

The pair of you are just full of priceless stupidity!

so where’s the ass handing with FACTS????


----------



## groovetube

I think you should post some more “doctors” lying on video. I think this is truly the way to show your true brilliance. And hey macfury will have your back! He’s a real fountain of real facts and “reasonable discussion”. I see in the oh, 8 years I was gone there was so much of it and so many people flocking to hear more facts and ASS HANDING!!

Are we having FUN YET???


----------



## Freddie_Biff

This isn’t even an argument. It’s just contradiction.


----------



## Macfury

It's a palindrome.



Freddie_Biff said:


> This isn’t even an argument. It’s just contradiction.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> It's a palindrome.


Hahaha!


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> This isn’t even an argument. It’s just contradiction.


heh.

It's merely just a barrage of total nonsense. It'll stamp it's feet and double down on it though, it's just what it does.

Let's recap here. A billion plus people were given horse dewormer, it cured covid and the world never noticed. Check. Then we see a discredited doctor mangling a paper which even the authors debunked this doctors stupidity. Can be found by any halfwit with 5 minutes of their time. Naw lets post that crap. Must the stockpiled horse dewormer! Then, those with the disease of addiction, compared to total right wing dumbasses who didn't get vaccinated because horse dewormer! are the same thing. Right lets add in a dose of plastic surgery and abortion to really up to stupid quotient.

YEEEEEHAAAAAAAWWWWW! Where's Mah 6! I'll back up yer 6 wooooooooooooo!

Well, maybe if the global medical community classifies far right wing darwinism as a disease, then maybe, there's some validity there...


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> It's neither. It's merely just a barrage of total nonsense. It'll stamp it's feet and double down on it though, it's just what it does.
> 
> Let's recap here. A billion plus people were given horse dewormer, it cured covid and the world never noticed. Check. Then we see a discredited doctor mangling a paper which even the authors debunked this doctors stupidity. Can be found by any halfwit with 5 minutes of their time. Naw lets post that crap. Must the stockpiled horse dewormer! Then, those with the disease of addiction, compared to total right wing dumbasses who didn't get vaccinated because horse dewormer! are the same thing. Right lets add in a dose of plastic surgery and abortion to really up to stupid quotient.
> 
> YEEEEEHAAAAAAAWWWWW! Where's Mah 6! I'll back up yer 6 wooooooooooooo!
> 
> Well, maybe if the global medical community classifies far right wing darwinism as a disease, then maybe, there's some validity there...


Well I would certainly have misgivings about taking an “experimental” substance like Ivermectin. At least Pfizer is FDA approved. It’s like cons just really don’t like being told what they should do, even if it saves lives and hospital space. Stubborn deniers gonna stubbornly deny.


----------



## groovetube

It sure gives new meaning to the term "sheeple"... but sheep don't "neigh"?


----------



## Macfury

Ivermectin was FDA-approved in 1996. 

Pfizer has not yet been FDA approved. Only the brand name drug, based on the emergency authorized drug, which is not yet available, has been approved by the FDA. If it had been approved, people could sue the drug company for complications.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Well I would certainly have misgivings about taking an “experimental” substance like Ivermectin. At least Pfizer is FDA approved. It’s like cons just really don’t like being told what they should do, even if it saves lives and hospital space. Stubborn deniers gonna stubbornly deny.


----------



## groovetube

You know macfury, you really need to learn to think for yourself, and not repeat the nonsense the hoardes of drooling fools are parroting all over social media. No matter how much you may wish it, it’s simply not a credible argument.


----------



## groovetube

What’s funny here, this is the stuff that’s being passed around on social media like wildfire. I’ve seen this stupidity about the pfizer vaccine approval as the latest nonsense, none of these idiots ever stopped to even think it through, but you can set your watch to it. If it appears posted by the hoardes of sheep on social media, you’ll see these dumbbells parrot it here. There’s a couple other real prize stupidity being passed around as well, let’s see if one of these idiots repeats it It’s as if none these people are capable of thinking for themselves and just allow themselves to be told what to post elsewhere.


----------



## FeXL

As do many with Chinese coronavirus "vaccines". And even more so because ivermectin has _decades_ of safe & successful treatment history in humans, not merely _months_ of very questionable history under emergency authorization.

See, Freddie? I just knew you would understand! Good for you!



Freddie_Biff said:


> Well I would certainly have misgivings about taking an “experimental” substance like Ivermectin.


----------



## groovetube

Hey Freddie! Horse dewormer has DECADES of proven success with covid! Did you hear that!

And a billion people were given it and it CURED COVID!

remember how they were bragging about ‘going after them’ to hand their asses to them with FACTS! Turns out, it’s only hunky dory when they do it!! 

the stupid continues.


----------



## groovetube

Oh did you know that the virus started in CHINA??? I mean THANK GOD we have brilliant people to tell us it’s a “Chinese virus” because oh my GAWD!!! No one would have ANY IDEA where this virus originated from thank god for this incredible brilliance!!!!!


----------



## groovetube

BAH HA HA HA HA HA


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Ivermectin was FDA-approved in 1996.
> 
> Pfizer has not yet been FDA approved. Only the brand name drug, based on the emergency authorized drug, which is not yet available, has been approved by the FDA. If it had been approved, people could sue the drug company for complications.


Wrong as usual. Ivermectin has never been approved for Covid19. Pfizer was approved this summer in the US and long before that in Canada.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Oh did you know that the virus started in CHINA??? I mean THANK GOD we have brilliant people to tell us it’s a “Chinese virus” because oh my GAWD!!! No one would have ANY IDEA where this virus originated from thank god for this incredible brilliance!!!!!


Maybe we should start 18 threads with different viruses and their places of origin to underscore the point.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Wrong as usual. Ivermectin has never been approved for Covid19. Pfizer was approved this summer in the US and long before that in Canada.


It’s difficult at times to take any of that stuff seriously. If you’re going to post on the subject, at least have some idea of what you’re talking about. The problem is ivermectin has very little clinical trials that show that it’s effective. If it did, they’d be using it, just as they began using the cheap steroid dexamethosone, which they found effective in cases to slow the immune system from freaking out. Not to mention atudies on monoclonal antibodies. Any idea that somehow doctors are preventing people from using an effective drug is quite simply brainless. Period. No evidence, just what they hoardes of lunatics on social media and blogs tell them. What’s really telling is how he tried to dismiss the trials and data of vaccine safety and efficacy directly on covid as a ‘few months’. The clinical trials and the data on the billions of jabs given this is year is vast, you can’t even begin to compare it to the near absence of any real data showing Ivermectin is effective (notice they try to spin the conversation around to the safety of the drug vs it’s efficacy…) Honestly, if you have to knowingly fudge stuff like this to make your point, you quite simply don’t have one.

I don’t care if someone wants to take a drug off label because some discredited doctor on YouTube told them it works despite evidence being lacking. But if they keep posting it publically, I’ll tear the ass out their nonsense, and smile while doing it.


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> Got one more for ya. It's a brief video by a pathologist on the effects of Chinese coronavirus "vaccines" on the human body. Once again, this "front line medical expert's" opinion will be ignored because it contradicts the narrative. You'd think that, rather than be considered right or wrong, they'd be interested in making informed decisions for themselves & their families, especially their children (and _especially_ considering some of the side effects in the reproductive systems). They're not.


Dr. Ryan Cole is not on the front line at all. He owns a lab. This talk is sponsored by the far-right LT. Gov of Idaho Janice McGeachin. She is also running for governor in 2022. Sadly he's put up his services and integrity up for paid booking! This talk was fact checked, google search will yield results. I guess he's moving up as he now has a board seat on state board of medicine.



> If, at some point in the future, it's found out that these Chinese coronavirus "vaccines" have caused bodily harm I wonder how they're going to feel when they're told they don't deserve treatment or financial recompense? Just like some of them are now saying that anybody who avoids the "vaccine" should not receive medical treatment.


Maybe. But the desire to say "I told you so" is not a sound reason to make critical medical decisions. No one can predict if there will be long term consequences to COVID, the Vaccine, or not taking the Vaccine. All that can be done is as much study as possible, which is what real scientists are doing all the time.

No one is really saying we should not treat the unvaccinated. You know that, everyone knows that. It's a discussion and point being made. Doubt science when it's convenient for you, but not when you really need it.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> No one is really saying we should not treat the unvaccinated.


They're saying, "put them at the end of the line and make them pay for their treatment."


----------



## Macfury

You said it was a horse drug never approved by the FDA. I did not say it was approved for COVID.

The drug that was approved by the FDA is Comirnaty, the drug name under whch Pfizer will market the drug. While these are identical drugs, Pfizer still maintains immunity against legal action until Comirnaty is launched.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Wrong as usual. Ivermectin has never been approved for Covid19. Pfizer was approved this summer in the US and long before that in Canada.


----------



## groovetube

Ah so he finally admits the truth.

Of course they are still covered by immunity for the drug before fda approval. So then what was your point again? I didn’t see one.

Freddie said the FDA didn’t approve it for treating covid so you are indeed, wrong. So why did the pair of you go on about ivermectin having had fda approval for something other than covid? That isn’t relevant. Was there a point there too because it appears there wasn’t one beyond you simple wanting to be ‘macfury’. 

Its funny how the truth shakes out after you confront them. The “oh but that’s not what I meant” eventually seeps out.


----------



## groovetube

smashedbanana said:


> Dr. Ryan Cole is not on the front line at all. He owns a lab. This talk is sponsored by the far-right LT. Gov of Idaho Janice McGeachin. She is also running for governor in 2022. Sadly he's put up his services and integrity up for paid booking! This talk was fact checked, google search will yield results. I guess he's moving up as he now has a board seat on state board of medicine.
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe. But the desire to say "I told you so" is not a sound reason to make critical medical decisions. No one can predict if there will be long term consequences to COVID, the Vaccine, or not taking the Vaccine. All that can be done is as much study as possible, which is what real scientists are doing all the time.
> 
> No one is really saying we should not treat the unvaccinated. You know that, everyone knows that. It's a discussion and point being made. Doubt science when it's convenient for you, but not when you really need it.


I get a bit of a chuckle when these guys do their best to wind us up but when you do it, well…

Yes, I don’t think we will reach the point where we deny health services to the unvaccinated, but the problem could be potentially dire and cause more people to die due to lack of care. Which of course can bring up further debates about spending more tax dollars on health care but, I doubt you’d get much interest from this crowd in that regard.

I’ve seen that doctor literally plastered everywhere on Facebook Twitter and beyond, I find it astounding how so many can be taken by this without doing the very basic level of research behind this. To say it’s frustrating to seeit continue is the understatement. What is interesting, is the lack of convincing clinical trials, even remotely a fraction of which exists for our current vaccines, that show any real truth to ivermectin being in any way an effective treatment. You don’t see anyone here who has ‘stockpiled ivermectin’ posting much beyond the already debunked stuff. But I bet the company(s) behind can’t keep up with production!!


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> They're saying, "put them at the end of the line and make them pay for their treatment."


The "no one" in my statement refers to anyone in charge of public policy, and/or healthcare. 

Unless you have a link that has your "they're" as one of those people there is nothing to talk about.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> The "no one" in my statement refers to anyone in charge of public policy, and/or healthcare.
> 
> Unless you have a link that has your "they're" as one of those people there is nothing to talk about.


I meant right here in this thread.


----------



## groovetube

Nuthin like trollin the troll. Ha ha ha.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Nuthin like trollin the troll. Ha ha ha.


He’s the gift that keeps on giving.


----------



## groovetube

We still haven’t heard back about the billion people who got cured of covid with horse dewormer.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> We still haven’t heard back about the billion people who got cured of covid with horse dewormer.


I think you’ll be waiting a while on that one.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> I think you’ll be waiting a while on that one.


Oh I have noooooo doubt on that


----------



## FeXL

He's a medical doctor who has examined dead, "vaccinated" bodies for side effects from the "vaccinations" and found them.

Period.

As far as his politics are concerned, so what? What about the far left UN? What about the far left CDC? What about far left Fauci? What about far left Biden? Trudeau? Tam? What about the far left "fact checkers"? There isn't a person involved in this whole Charlie-Foxtrot that isn't political. The only difference is the degree.



smashedbanana said:


> Dr. Ryan Cole is not on the front line at all. He owns a lab. This talk is sponsored by the far-right LT. Gov of Idaho Janice McGeachin. She is also running for governor in 2022. Sadly he's put up his services and integrity up for paid booking! This talk was fact checked, google search will yield results. I guess he's moving up as he now has a board seat on state board of medicine.


Yet that is precisely what the critics of those who are hesitant to get vaccinated are saying. "Better get the "vaccine" or we're going to put your ass at the end of a line in the middle of a field somewhere & maybe, just maybe, you'll get treated. After we say, "Told ya!"



smashedbanana said:


> Maybe. *But the desire to say "I told you so" is not a sound reason to make critical medical decisions.*


No, they can't. Which is precisely why this so-called treatment should not be rushed into, nor shoved down someone's throat. I find it ironic that many of the very same Prog idiots who swore they'd never get a treatment developed under Trump are now pushing that very treatment on everyone else.



smashedbanana said:


> No one can predict if there will be long term consequences to COVID, the Vaccine, or not taking the Vaccine. All that can be done is as much study as possible, which is what real scientists are doing all the time.


There are many who are saying precisely that. Please explain to me how else comments like that should be interpreted?



smashedbanana said:


> No one is really saying we should not treat the unvaccinated. You know that, everyone knows that. It's a discussion and point being made.


Ah, yes. "Trust the science". Always the fallback position. Precisely which "science" would that be? 

1. The "science" that claimed, variously, that no masks, one mask, two masks was better?
2. The "science" that claims PCR tests are accurate, even though they cannot distinguish between alpha, delta or regular, old-fashioned common flu or, OR, without producing up to a 90% error rate?
3. The "science" that claimed "two weeks to flatten the curve"?
4. The "science" that then claimed things would get back to normal "as soon as the most vulnerable" among us were vaccinated?
5. The "science" that later claimed things would get back to normal "as soon as 50%" of us were vaccinated?
6. The "science" that later claimed things would get back to normal "as soon as herd immunity" was reached?
7. The "science" that moved goalposts all over hell's half acre every time we came close?
8. The "science" that refuses to acknowledge effective, alternative treatments, despite dozens of studies (albeit smaller) illustrating high efficacy?
9. The "science" that covers up damaging side effects of the "vaccines", up to and including death?
10. The "science" that says it's OK for you to take your mask off in a group of people but not me? Or for you to go to a restaurant but not me? Or for you to attend a fiery, but mostly peaceful, Chinese coronavirus-free Pantifa "Rally" while accusing others of being super-spreaders? Or to have a 60th b-day party on Nantucket with hundreds of people attending, while the peasants were being told they couldn't go see grandma in the old folk's home?
11. The "science" that claims "vaccinated" immunity is better than natural immunity?
12. The "science" that claimed the virus came from a wet market and wasn't genetically engineered?
13. The "science" that showed infections had been underestimated by half and, subsequently, the death rate was cut by 50%?
14. The "science" that ignores grade school children struggling with language issues becasue of masking and the "science" that ignores school children of all ages struggling with online teaching, despite the fact that school-age children are among the least likely to transmit the disease?

I could go on at length, but is that the "science" you speak of?

And you wonder why some people are sceptical of so-called Chinese coronavirus "science" and so-called Chinese coronavirus "experts"? Based on the "science" it amazes me is that a single, sentient person rolled up their sleeve!

As far as me ever needing the "science", I'll deal with that if it comes. Until then, I'm not living in fear. If someone else is afraid of me, I guess that "vaccine" ain't nearly as effective as they were told and_ they_ can stay home, fully masked. Nor will I be ruled, either by the ignorant masses or the gov't (BIRM).



smashedbanana said:


> Doubt science when it's convenient for you, but not when you really need it.


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> ...


You are all over the map with this.

So are intermixing "science" with political decisions, speculation, the internet and supposition.

You are so laser focused on your predisposition that you don't really care about the quality of (for lack of a better term) "research" you find on the internet. The guy is in a labcoat at a speaking engage ffs. Why is that? Oh and in case you forgot he laments his own credentials in short order. Why don't you show some of that rigorous filtering you apply to other peoples links!


----------



## groovetube

Dear god it’s gonna double down with a barrage of non stop utter bull**** it made up.

Just stop. The doctor has been shown to be a total fraud. Give it up already.


----------



## groovetube

I’m still awaiting evidence that the billion plus in India was cured with horse dewormer. I can hardly wait for this one.


----------



## FeXL

Huh. In that case, my point was well made. Just following the "science", which is, indeed, all over the place. If you haven't seen that, you haven't been looking. Hence my scepticism.



smashedbanana said:


> You are all over the map with this.
> 
> So are intermixing "science" with political decisions, speculation, the internet and supposition.


One thing you may not know about me, sb: I'm agnostic on most things until proven otherwise. My so-called predisposition on Chinese coronavirus phophylactics, treatments & cures is still currently, "show me".

There is currently nothing anywhere that I have read (and yes, I have read extensively) that would convince me the current "vaccinations" have been researched enough to be considered safe. Not for me, not for my children. And, while they are old enough to make their own decisions, I have advised against it. They have taken that advice & made their own decisions.

Modern medications take a decade or more to be thoroughly tested and even then, issues can arise. Ever heard of Zantac? I was prescribed that for a period of time before it was pulled from the market last year. Can cause cancer. It received FDA approval in _1983! _These "vaccines" are less than a year old. I am not willing to risk my last years on a potential disaster, nor do I want my children to have (im)pregnancy issues (or gawd knows what).

As far as alternative treatments, my observation above stands. 

As to your observation about quality of research, I threw that one back at you in spades above. The only quality exhibited over the last 18 months or so is pure, unadulterated bull****. Do I believe everything I read on either side of the issue? Nope, but when I come across someone raising what appear to be salient questions, in a lab coat in front of a crowd or not, I take another look. His is not the first I've read of most of the symptoms noted. You may not agree with my standards & that's fine with me. 

If you think it's been debunked, good for you. Move on. Thus far, I haven't read anything that convinces me his observations should be written off. He is being cited by other medical doctors, FWIW.



smashedbanana said:


> You are so laser focused on your predisposition that you don't really care about the quality of (for lack of a better term) "research" you find on the internet. The guy is in a labcoat at a speaking engage ffs. Why is that? Oh and in case you forgot he laments his own credentials in short order. Why don't you show some of that rigorous filtering you apply to other peoples links!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

> A viral video features a doctor making dubious claims about COVID-19 vaccines and treatments at a forum hosted by Idaho’s lieutenant governor. Dr. Ryan Cole claims mRNA vaccines cause cancer and autoimmune diseases, but the lead author of the paper on which Cole based that claim told us there is no evidence mRNA vaccines cause those ailments.


 https://www.factcheck.org/person/ryan-cole/


----------



## FeXL

Did you watch the video I posted?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Ryan Cole Archives - FactCheck.org


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Did you watch the video I posted?


Skimmed it. Why would I pay much attention to a guy who’s been discredited?


----------



## Macfury

For the same reason that you linked to a fact-checking organization receiving funding from SciCheck’s COVID-19/Vaccination Project with financial support from the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation -- the family behind the Johnson & Johnson vaccine. They list this funding at the bottom of the article. 

Don't use these "fact checking" organizations to determine truth. Even when they're right, their potential bias makes them suspect.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Skimmed it. Why would I pay much attention to a guy who’s been discredited?


----------



## FeXL

So you never actually watched it.

Fine.

I have. Three times now. The first two were just before I posted it here, the last this evening after you posted your factcheck link.

I thought it was unusual I had no recollection of him claiming the "vaccine" caused cancer because that's a pretty heady accusation and it would have registered with me. As it turns out at no point does he claim it does. Neither do any of the slides on the screen behind him note that.

At 9 mins there is text on the screen behind him that reads, "No long term safety known. Autoimmune disease, cancer, fertility..." It presents like a question, not an accusation. This is confirmed by him orally at 9:45 when he clearly asks 3 questions, "What's the risk for cancer after the shot? What's the risk for autoimmune disease? What's the risk for impairing fertility for a lifetime?"

These are _not_ accusations, nor statements. They are clearly _questions_. He goes on to note at about 12:40 he's peronally seen an increased rate in uterine cancers since "vaccinations" started. The implication is that there may be a connection but that is all. He does note that there is an issue with cells that fight, among other things, cancer after the "vaccine" is administered. Dr Cole does not come out & actually say, "Chinese coronavirus "vaccinations" cause cancer".

Again, he is clearly asking questions & not making accusations. Therefore, any "fact check" based on accusations that he is saying "vaccines" is premature and unwarranted. In addition, Freddie, regarding your above link that reads "the lead author of the paper on which Cole based that claim": In the video I posted, Cole based his claim of increased uterine cancer on personal observations, not a research paper.

So, where are we?

1. Dr Cole hasn't been discredited because, at least in the video I posted, he never said the things factcheck.org said he did;
2. Like any good scientist he appears to be simply asking questions & examining data;
3. I've never looked up factcheck.org prior to tonite. I tend to be extremely sceptical of _all_ so-called "fact checking" sites, period (who fact checks the fact checkers?). After about 30 seconds on DuckDuckGo, I found an article that noted a connection with far left convicted criminal and Nazi collaborator, George Soros. That's strike 1 for factcheck.org's credibility;
4. According to the same article, they also received funding from lefty Google "to produce fact checks about COVID-19 immunization misinformation and short bilingual video explainers,". Google's leftist political leanings and their slant on all things Chinese coronavirus are well known. Strike 2;
5. There is no need to fact check something that was never said in the first place. Strike 3;
6. Dr Cole said nothing about data regarding uterine cancer in any research paper in that video. Strike 4;
7. Just because no evidence has yet been found connecting "vaccinations" with cancer, autoimmune disease and fertility issues does not mean it doesn't exist.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Skimmed it. Why would I pay much attention to a guy who’s been discredited?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> So you never actually watched it.
> 
> Fine.
> 
> I have. Three times now. The first two were just before I posted it here, the last this evening after you posted your factcheck link.
> 
> I thought it was unusual I had no recollection of him claiming the "vaccine" caused cancer because that's a pretty heady accusation and it would have registered with me. As it turns out at no point does he claim it does. Neither do any of the slides on the screen behind him note that.
> 
> At 9 mins there is text on the screen behind him that reads, "No long term safety known. Autoimmune disease, cancer, fertility..." It presents like a question, not an accusation. This is confirmed by him orally at 9:45 when he clearly asks 3 questions, "What's the risk for cancer after the shot? What's the risk for autoimmune disease? What's the risk for impairing fertility for a lifetime?"
> 
> These are _not_ accusations, nor statements. They are clearly _questions_. He goes on to note at about 12:40 he's peronally seen an increased rate in uterine cancers since "vaccinations" started. The implication is that there may be a connection but that is all. He does note that there is an issue with cells that fight, among other things, cancer after the "vaccine" is administered. Dr Cole does not come out & actually say, "Chinese coronavirus "vaccinations" cause cancer".
> 
> Again, he is clearly asking questions & not making accusations. Therefore, any "fact check" based on accusations that he is saying "vaccines" is premature and unwarranted. In addition, Freddie, regarding your above link that reads "the lead author of the paper on which Cole based that claim": In the video I posted, Cole based his claim of increased uterine cancer on personal observations, not a research paper.
> 
> So, where are we?
> 
> 1. Dr Cole hasn't been discredited because, at least in the video I posted, he never said the things factcheck.org said he did;
> 2. Like any good scientist he appears to be simply asking questions & examining data;
> 3. I've never looked up factcheck.org prior to tonite. I tend to be extremely sceptical of _all_ so-called "fact checking" sites, period (who fact checks the fact checkers?). After about 30 seconds on DuckDuckGo, I found an article that noted a connection with far left convicted criminal and Nazi collaborator, George Soros. That's strike 1 for factcheck.org's credibility;
> 4. According to the same article, they also received funding from lefty Google "to produce fact checks about COVID-19 immunization misinformation and short bilingual video explainers,". Google's leftist political leanings and their slant on all things Chinese coronavirus are well known. Strike 2;
> 5. There is no need to fact check something that was never said in the first place. Strike 3;
> 6. Dr Cole said nothing about data regarding uterine cancer in any research paper in that video. Strike 4;
> 7. Just because no evidence has yet been found connecting "vaccinations" with cancer, autoimmune disease and fertility issues does not mean it doesn't exist.


Thank you for a detailed response. We each have our trusted sources. Confirmation bias is alive and well.


----------



## groovetube

His point “was well made”.

There you have it. That’s why this place is a ghost town.


Freddie_Biff said:


> Thank you for a detailed response. We each have our trusted sources. Confirmation bias is alive and well.


See here's the windup. And why the discussion halts into a cesspool. They're mad now because Im simply using their tactics and throwing right back at them. And boy do they not like it. Wanna make a bet one of them whines to a moderator? I'll reeeeeallly laugh if that happens.

He posted a discredited doctor. Its well known he's a quack, and more than one of us pointed it out. That doctor is plastered everywhere by the drooling ani-vaxxers on social media, Im sure you've seen it. And despite the fact that he has been exposed as a quack and twisted information to create his video, these guys will double down and wind around in circles. "my point is made!!" they hiss. Riiiiight. Just like India cured their populations covid with Ivermectin and we all didn't know about it... (still haven't seen a shred of evidence yet and Im not holding my breath)

The truth is, Fexl just knee jerks his posts and barrages us with links he doesnt even read himself, so his complaint that you didn't is even funnier. It's just what he does. He once declared that he'd hand me what I handed (apparently) but now I guess that isnt welcome.

Too f*** bad. Let's remember. No one is forcing anyone to take the vaccine. You dont want it? Sure pal, it's your gamble. If you're over 60, overweight, or god help you if you have diabetes or heart conditions/cancer, well, delta is coming for you. If you want to insist on believing some discredited doctor or that ivermectin has more data on it's effectiveness, well, it's your life not mine. But don't expect that others won't confront the misinformation. And if you keep pushing it and become a jerk about it, expect the same. If they make stupid posts and then double down on it, I’m going to make fun of them. Just like they do to us. But watch them get all thin skinned about it…


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> So where are we?


I do find it interesting how you slip in and out of sniff testing things people post.
You agree with the message - absolute result orientation - no vetting needed
You don't agree - let's take this thing apart. Remember the post about that girl getting her hijab cut? Was perfectly reasonable to point out the suspicious nature of it. Never mind the message or whatever. Questionable motives doctor - no issue.

If this doctor is so up and up.
Why is he in a lab coat at a speaking engagement?
Why does he have to go through his prestigious credentials, and tell you they are relevant?
Why is he even at a republican sponsored event?
Is he receiving compensation for his talk?
He got a board seat after he started talking about covid in this way, how is that clouding any objectivity?
Why isn't he doing things the normal way? Publishing studies, being peer reviewed?

Those are just my immediate questions.
Enough to make me say no thanks to calling anything here imperical.


----------



## groovetube

I think getting embroiled into these useless tit for tat stuff over doctors that have been discredited, off label drugs that have very little data to prove their efficacy against covid, etc etc, really throws a smoke screen over what’s coming.

Most of the doctors I’ve spoken to (anecdotal evidence coming…) all seem to agree that there is a shift from preventing people from getting infected, to minimizing severe disease and overwhelming our hospitals. Because one thing everyone can agree on, and I think this is where the accusations of “progs want control” fall not only short but way down the mine shaft, is no one wants to go back to lockdowns. We’re tired, and we need to get back to our lives, without the fear of some of us dying from covid as has been happening. I lost 3 good friends, I’d like to think that won’t happen from covid in future.

I think there may be some ‘come to Jesus’ moments for a lot of people, because as we stay open and this very infectious variant delta begins to make its way through the population, those unvaccinated, especially those over 60 and those with risk factors are going to get hit hard. Even if they survive it, one thing that isn’t often discussed is the complications people are left with after a bad bout of it. The hope is, that we can very soon reach enough vaccinated that any peak we reach in infections but more specifically, hospitalizations can be blunted. I sure hope so. Mandates seem to be effective in bumping up vaccinations, hopefully we can get closer to 90% sooner than later. I see mr O’Toole has suddenly switched gears and is now promising a national vaccine passport. He swears it’s not about political expediency though  

There is real life out there outside this thread, and then, well, there’s this crap.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> If this doctor is so up and up.
> Why is he in a lab coat at a speaking engagement?
> Why does he have to go through his prestigious credentials, and tell you they are relevant?
> Why is he even at a republican sponsored event?
> Is he receiving compensation for his talk?
> He got a board seat after he started talking about covid in this way, how is that clouding any objectivity?
> Why isn't he doing things the normal way? Publishing studies, being peer reviewed?


'

But we could apply such questions to a lot of things. Why does Anthony Fauci wear a lab coat in certain photographs? Does he have financial investments in certain medications...


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> His point “was well made”.
> 
> There you have it. That’s why this place is a ghost town.
> 
> See here's the windup. And why the discussion halts into a cesspool. They're mad now because Im simply using their tactics and throwing right back at them. And boy do they not like it. Wanna make a bet one of them whines to a moderator? I'll reeeeeallly laugh if that happens.
> 
> He posted a discredited doctor. Its well known he's a quack, and more than one of us pointed it out. That doctor is plastered everywhere by the drooling ani-vaxxers on social media, Im sure you've seen it. And despite the fact that he has been exposed as a quack and twisted information to create his video, these guys will double down and wind around in circles. "my point is made!!" they hiss. Riiiiight. Just like India cured their populations covid with Ivermectin and we all didn't know about it... (still haven't seen a shred of evidence yet and Im not holding my breath)
> 
> The truth is, Fexl just knee jerks his posts and barrages us with links he doesnt even read himself, so his complaint that you didn't is even funnier. It's just what he does. He once declared that he'd hand me what I handed (apparently) but now I guess that isnt welcome.
> 
> Too f*** bad. Let's remember. No one is forcing anyone to take the vaccine. You dont want it? Sure pal, it's your gamble. If you're over 60, overweight, or god help you if you have diabetes or heart conditions/cancer, well, delta is coming for you. If you want to insist on believing some discredited doctor or that ivermectin has more data on it's effectiveness, well, it's your life not mine. But don't expect that others won't confront the misinformation. And if you keep pushing it and become a jerk about it, expect the same. If they make stupid posts and then double down on it, I’m going to make fun of them. Just like they do to us. But watch them get all thin skinned about it…


FeXL has the right to post his reasons. And I have the right to disregard those reasons if they sound like total bull****.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> '
> 
> But we could apply such questions to a lot of things. Why does Anthony Fauci wear a lab coat in certain photographs? Does he have financial investments in certain medications...


(facepalm)


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> '
> 
> But we could apply such questions to a lot of things. Why does Anthony Fauci wear a lab coat in certain photographs? Does he have financial investments in certain medications...


Come on man.

Have I posted anything from him?


----------



## groovetube

heh. lab coats now. Anything, but addressing this doctor having been discredited, even by author of the paper he referenced. The very term 'factcheck' seemed to set off alarm bells too.  

But, lab coats. People wonder why I make fun.


----------



## Macfury

Duplicate post.


----------



## Macfury

No. The point is that it's relatively easy to ask selective questions to dismiss an opinion. Fauci's investments in various drugs might make him suspect.


----------



## groovetube

FFS. The doctor isn't discredited because he wore a lab coat. Man. It's speaking to a child. Except perhaps a child would be quicker to understand this...



Macfury said:


> No. The point is that it's relatively easy to ask selective questions to dismiss an opinion. Fauci's investments in various drugs might make him suspect.


Sure it might. Absolutely even. But the trouble is, you often whittle things down into a narrow focus, ignoring everything else that is part of the bigger story, which is far more important, and that's where you want the conversation to go. You even on many occasions, demand that people answer your question within your narrow parameters, because it seems you don't want to address the far more important points.

That's why I make fun. If you really wanted to talk about this doctor reasonably, then why did you pick out the lab coat specifically out of a number of important points and derail things?

Rhetorical question


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> No. The point is that it's relatively easy to ask selective questions to dismiss an opinion. Fauci's investments in various drugs might make him suspect.


Fauci is not on my radar. I don't even know why we are talking about him. Honestly this is just deflective.

If someone posts something about him, sure lets talk about his conflict of interest.

I'm not the one challenging the common held beliefs in relation to covid and vaccines.

The real discussion should be why when someone posts a link that challenges the norm, the challenge ends. Why is it question some things but not others?


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> The real discussion should be why when someone posts a link that challenges the norm, the challenge ends. Why is it question some things but not others?


I disagree. It's often the norm that needs a thorough challenging.


----------



## FeXL

As I note above, much of what he speaks of is not news to me. I've read at least 3 articles by different authors on the movement of the "vaccine" from the deltoid to the testes & ovaries. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with anything. It's merely more information that appears to make sense. If you have any data actually disputing his observations, his slides, I'd be more than happy to read it. This time, let's find something that he actually said.

Read my sig: What does he start with, where does he end up, is it reasonable? In this case, yes. 

That's my sniff test. If it doesn't pass the sniff test then yes, I'll tear **** apart in an attempt to find out more. Hijab girl smelled like the inside of a hog barn, right from the getgo. It was an unreasonable conclusion.

As to your obsession about what Dr Cole is wearing, and where he's wearing it, I don't know & I don't care. I've never believed the clothes make the man. Why don't you ask him? One of the best profs I ever had would stroll into the lecture theater in worn Dingo's, faded Lee's, black BMW t-shirt, a leather jacket slung over one arm and a helmet in hand. Personally, I'm listening to his message, not whether his shirt matches his tie while wearing a 3 pc suit in a place sb considers suitable for elocution.

Same for your other questions: ask him.

In addition, perhaps he is working on a peer-reviewed paper. Ask him.

One more thing: I don't recall anybody, anywhere saying anything about empirical information. Dr Cole didn't in that vid & I certainly haven't. That said, it's still data.

Then again, most of the idiots pushing this **** on us have been sparse in the empirical data department. If they had, then the flawed 6 foot narrative would be public knowledge, as would be the myth of masks, among many others.



smashedbanana said:


> I do find it interesting how you slip in and out of sniff testing things people post.
> You agree with the message - absolute result orientation - no vetting needed
> You don't agree - let's take this thing apart. Remember the post about that girl getting her hijab cut? Was perfectly reasonable to point out the suspicious nature of it. Never mind the message or whatever. Questionable motives doctor - no issue.
> 
> If this doctor is so up and up.
> Why is he in a lab coat at a speaking engagement?
> Why does he have to go through his prestigious credentials, and tell you they are relevant?
> Why is he even at a republican sponsored event?
> Is he receiving compensation for his talk?
> He got a board seat after he started talking about covid in this way, how is that clouding any objectivity?
> Why isn't he doing things the normal way? Publishing studies, being peer reviewed?
> 
> Those are just my immediate questions.
> Enough to make me say no thanks to calling anything here imperical.


----------



## FeXL

Welcome.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Thank you for a detailed response.


Got nuttin' to do with confirnmation bias. You posted a link critical of statements he allegedly said, I showed he never said them.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Confirmation bias is alive and well.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

smashedbanana said:


> Fauci is not on my radar. I don't even know why we are talking about him. Honestly this is just deflective.
> 
> If someone posts something about him, sure lets talk about his conflict of interest.
> 
> I'm not the one challenging the common held beliefs in relation to covid and vaccines.
> 
> The real discussion should be why when someone posts a link that challenges the norm, the challenge ends. Why is it question some things but not others?


Deflective. Good word for it. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> FeXL has the right to post his reasons. And I have the right to disregard those reasons if they sound like total bull****.


mmmmm. But that would make you a ‘no content’ poster. 

I see this conversation, if you can call it that, going the same way conversations here with these two always end up. Reading some of the responses here remind me of the constant windups, demands for more research (that they themselves apparently refuse to do) until some of the participants just get tired of it and fade away for a while. Who has time for that?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Deflective. Good word for it.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Wasn’t it macfury who brought up Fauci?




Macfury said:


> '
> 
> But we could apply such questions to a lot of things. Why does Anthony Fauci wear a lab coat in certain photographs? Does he have financial investments in certain medications...


Yep. Ha ha ha.

funny that.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Wasn’t it macfury who brought up Fauci?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yep. Ha ha ha.
> 
> funny that.


Anything to redirect.


----------



## FeXL

Good! If it takes a death sentence to bring about some accountability, so be it.

*India Could Sentence WHO Chief Scientist to Death for Misleading Over Ivermectin and Killing Indians*



> The Indian Bar Association (IBA) sued WHO Chief Scientist Dr. Soumya Swaminathan on May 25, accusing her in a 71-point brief of causing the deaths of Indian citizens by misleading them about Ivermectin. There is also an updated legal notice on June 13, 2021.


----------



## FeXL

Related to the above:

*The false narrative on ivermectin*




> Ivermectin is an anti-parasitic drug that has been used since the mid-1970s to treat river blindness and intestinal infections. It has been documented by frontline doctors around the world to also be a safe and effective treatment for COVID-19. *Ivermectin has found widespread use in Latin America and India and was just greenlighted for treatment against COVID in Japan.*


Bold mine.

Slowly. Surely.


----------



## groovetube

Hah. I looked it up. Not a single credible news source anywhere is carrying this story. Of course this will merely feed into this whole bull**** about the ‘false narrative’. I won’t even dare ask for something more credible than a Wordpress address because well, we all know where that’ll lead.  But if a WHO chief scientist was being sentenced to death, this would be global news on every news channel imaginable. That’s just how insanely stupid this really is. This poster can’t be playing with a full deck. Or is really gullible.

a look to see what drugs Japan is allowing for covid treatment, sadly, for the ‘false narrative’ crowd, ivermectin wasn’t among them. All this crap is apparently based on an earlier fake news and rehashed. Gosh I hope those who stockpiled ivermectin aren’t put out _too much_ ‘cause that’s gotta suck…

man the number of nonsense crap posts here is enough to make anyone dizzy keeping up with the pace of the feces being flung. People really need to learn not to share everything they see on Facebook that ‘makes sense’ to them.

the bull**** barrage continues.


----------



## FeXL

A few assorted links.

*The COVID Vaccine: A Physician's Perspective*




> For centuries the scientific method invited questions, invited curiosity. Stupid questions and fringe ideas overturned scientific dogma throughout history. It is how we advance science. We question results, question truth, keep experimenting. But when politics and science mix, science loses. Fringe ideas such as a heliocentric solar system get Copernicus and Galileo thrown out of the church. Offering an alternative treatment to COVID, or questioning the effectiveness of masks gets you banned from Facebook and YouTube.


They look you in the eye and they lie:

*Newly Released Documents Show EcoHealth (And Fauci) Funding Gain-of-Function Research into Bat Viruses in Wuhan -- And In a Second Lab, Too*




> Not only did we fund "chimerical" virus engineering at the Wuhan Institute of Virology, but at _another_ Wuhan lab we haven't heard about until now --  the Wuhan Center for Animal Experiment.


Related:

*Top Scientist Claims Anthony Fauci ‘Untruthful’ About Chinese Lab Research*




> Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the U.S. National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID) and the chief medical advisor to Democrat President Joe Biden, has previously denied the National Institute of Health [NIH] has ever funded such research.


And the LLDB wonders why he can find no "reputable" links:

*YouTube Suppressing Any Mention of Ivermectin*

Related:

*The Government and CDC Are Lying About COVID-19 Vaccine and Ivermectin*



> Let's start with the vaccine itself. The results in Israel prove what a sham, charade and fraud this all is. The U.S. government and Centers for Disease Control and Prevention argue that the vaccine is our only chance to survive. And that people are hospitalized and dying with COVID-19 because they are unvaccinated.
> 
> Both arguments are pure fraud.


Too polite by half.

On the good side of things:

*The Highly Effective Covid Treatment Joe Biden Won’t Tell You About*



> There’s a free, highly effective treatment for Americans who contract COVID-19 and its variants that could immediately relieve hospitals and slow the pandemic, but President Joe Biden has been tight-lipped about the lifesaving care.
> Monoclonal antibody treatment has been found to reduce hospitalization and death from COVID by a stunning 70%, with almost no side effects, based on preliminary findings in recent studies. It’s also been shown to shorten the duration of symptoms by four days.



On the really crappy side of things:

*Nursing baby died with blood clots, inflamed arteries following mother’s Pfizer shot, VAERS report says*



> A six-week-old breastfeeding baby became inexplicably ill with a high fever after his mother received a COVID-19 vaccine and he died weeks later with blood clots in his “severely inflamed arteries,” according to a vaccine adverse event report filed with the U.S. government.
> 
> An unidentified 36-year-old woman from New Mexico said she received a first dose of Pfizer’s Covid-19 jab on June 4, 2021 when she was breastfeeding her six-week-old infant son, according to a report filed with the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS).
> 
> “On July 17, my baby passed away,” says the report, which first appeared on VAERS August 13, 2021.


And finally:

*Man urinates on Dairy Queen counter over mask policy*

Yep. Exactly how I feel...


----------



## groovetube

the poor people making minimum wage busting their asses serving people at a Dairy Queen only to have some loud mouth child screaming because he was asked to wear a mask, then pisses over their counter and then they have to not only deal with this asshole but then these people have to clean it up.

disgusting. Beyond childish. But given the barrage of posts unsurprising.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> the poor people making minimum wage busting their asses serving people at a Dairy Queen only to have some loud mouth child screaming because he was asked to wear a mask, then pisses over their counter and then they have to not only deal with this asshole but then these people have to clean it up.
> 
> disgusting. Beyond childish. But given the barrage of posts unsurprising.


Yeah, I can’t see anything to be proud of there. ****ing whiners.


----------



## groovetube

I was jus’ spitballin’ ya know, thinkin’ ‘bout those who loves a nice jaunt to say I donno Montana or some such a place. 

Shame that ain’t happenin’ til someone gets the jab!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I was jus’ spitballin’ ya know, thinkin’ ‘bout those who loves a nice jaunt to say I donno Montana or some such a place.
> 
> Shame that ain’t happenin’ til someone gets the jab!


Membership certainly has its benefits.


----------



## groovetube

And if his buddy O’Toole sneaks a win in, let’s remember he just announced a national vaccine mandate, so that means Alberta too. Good bye restaurants or on site work in many places too.

bu-bu-but I took horse dewormer!!!!


----------



## FeXL

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! 

You can drive no further across the US border today than I can, Freddie. Nice try. I have friends (foolish, I might add) who rationalized the jab strictly on that precept, including a buddy who turns the big 6-oh this Friday & wanted to celebrate at Moose's Saloon in Kalispell. Like you, they're still sitting at home. Only difference is, they now realize they've been had.

That's some benefit pkg, Freddie. What do they promise you if you jump through hoops? Hold yer breath & stand on one leg? Stick one forefinger in yer ear & the other one up yer arse?

My two favorite things to do in Montana are riding the twisties and visiting craft breweries. There are lots of twisties on western Alberta roads and all over BC. I put thousands of miles on them this year alone. Plus, Alberta has more craft breweries than Montana does, my money is worth 30% more, I don't have to spend hours in line to cross back and I don't have to deal with gov't bull**** when I do. That's 5 pluses. Tell me again why I should care if I'm not a "member".



Freddie_Biff said:


> Membership certainly has its benefits.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
> 
> You can drive no further across the US border today than I can, Freddie. Nice try. I have friends (foolish, I might add) who rationalized the jab strictly on that precept, including a buddy who turns the big 6-oh this Friday & wanted to celebrate at Moose's Saloon in Kalispell. Like you, they're still sitting at home. Only difference is, they now realize they've been had.
> 
> That's some benefit pkg, Freddie. What do they promise you if you jump through hoops? Hold yer breath & stand on one leg? Stick one forefinger in yer ear & the other one up yer arse?
> 
> My two favorite things to do in Montana are riding the twisties and visiting craft breweries. There are lots of twisties on western Alberta roads and all over BC. I put thousands of miles on them this year alone. Plus, Alberta has more craft breweries than Montana does, my money is worth 30% more, I don't have to spend hours in line to cross back and I don't have to deal with gov't bull**** when I do. That's 5 pluses. Tell me again why I should care if I'm not a "member".


I really couldn’t care less if you’re a member or not. You do you. Also, I haven’t been sitting at home. For the last year and a half I’ve been active at work. Haven’t gone to the States and haven’t needed to. I’ve been enjoying going out to restaurants especially over the summer. I’d like to see the stubborn assholes who make the choice not to get vaxxed (even when they can) not contaminate the air for the rest of us. If you reject science and medicine, fine. But don’t expect to enjoy all the same benefits as those who do. Also Kenney’s plan to pay $100 to the reluctant non-vaxxers is insulting to everyone, vaxxers and non-vaxxers alike.


----------



## MacDoc

A missing link in the Covid story - a treatment.









Pfizer gets moving on its anti-COVID-19 pill human trials


The first participants have been dosed in a large Phase 2/3 trial testing a novel oral treatment designed to alleviate symptoms of COVID-19. The first results are expected by the end of this year.




newatlas.com


----------



## groovetube

MacDoc said:


> A missing link in the Covid story - a treatment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pfizer gets moving on its anti-COVID-19 pill human trials
> 
> 
> The first participants have been dosed in a large Phase 2/3 trial testing a novel oral treatment designed to alleviate symptoms of COVID-19. The first results are expected by the end of this year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> newatlas.com


I read a out this some time back. Interesting development. Especially for those immune compromised and eithe tunable to get the **** or it doesn’t work well. I’m sure the horse dewormer crowd will still be unimpressed however.

There's a few other scientists I follow who have been talking about a number of other treatments in the works for some time. As the population becomes vaccinated/infected and antibodies develop, I think that's the next phase in dealing with this. There'll still be older/health issues who haven't the antibodies to fight the strong variants who will still fall through the cracks and die unfortunately, much like we have now with diseases like pneumonia etc.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> I really couldn’t care less if you’re a member or not. You do you. Also, I haven’t been sitting at home. For the last year and a half I’ve been active at work. Haven’t gone to the States and haven’t needed to. I’ve been enjoying going out to restaurants especially over the summer. I’d like to see the stubborn assholes who make the choice not to get vaxxed (even when they can) not contaminate the air for the rest of us. If you reject science and medicine, fine. But don’t expect to enjoy all the same benefits as those who do. Also Kenney’s plan to pay $100 to the reluctant non-vaxxers is insulting to everyone, vaxxers and non-vaxxers alike.


I think everyone knows the US border has been closed this whole time to non essential Canadian travellers. But when it does open, it's gonna be vaccinated only guaranteed. What Im referring to is the growing restrictions to those who aren't vaccinated. It hasn't quite started yet, even here in Ontario the mandates aren't in effect yet. But wait til October, the winter, things will become increasingly frustrating to those unvaccinated. And further, they will become a much smaller minority as likely half the unvaccinated currently will choose to do so (that's already happening). So they can "BAH HA HA" all they like, Im sitting back chuckling, jes wait.... 

Trust me, the screaming and hollering will be shrill, but it will come from a much smaller dwindling crowd.

I think one of the more curious things in this thread, is witnessing the troll in there like a dirty shirt, who’s vaccinated! BAH HA HA HA indeed!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I think everyone knows the US border has been closed this whole time to non essential Canadian travellers. But when it does open, it's gonna be vaccinated only guaranteed. What Im referring to is the growing restrictions to those who aren't vaccinated. It hasn't quite started yet, even here in Ontario the mandates aren't in effect yet. But wait til October, the winter, things will become increasingly frustrating to those unvaccinated. And further, they will become a much smaller minority as likely half the unvaccinated currently will choose to do so (that's already happening). So they can "BAH HA HA" all they like, Im sitting back chuckling, jes wait....
> 
> Trust me, the screaming and hollering will be shrill, but it will come from a much smaller dwindling crowd.
> 
> I think one of the more curious things in this thread, is witnessing the troll in there like a dirty shirt, who’s vaccinated! BAH HA HA HA indeed!


Exactement, as the French would say. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
> 
> You can drive no further across the US border today than I can, Freddie. Nice try. I have friends (foolish, I might add) who rationalized the jab strictly on that precept, including a buddy who turns the big 6-oh this Friday & wanted to celebrate at Moose's Saloon in Kalispell. Like you, they're still sitting at home. Only difference is, they now realize they've been had.


Border is quite porous if you're persistant. I've known people, jabbed or unjabbed, who have enjoyed time in the states.


----------



## groovetube

Hah! Not for long. Giddyup!


----------



## wonderings

Macfury said:


> Border is quite porous if you're persistant. I've known people, jabbed or unjabbed, who have enjoyed time in the states.


My parents have been down to see my sister in PA with no issue flying which seems to be the easiest way to get there. For some reason they are ok with a lot of people in one vehicle rather then a few people in a car crossing over. We have a worker here who has been down to the states 3 or 4 times during the pandemic. Not sure if she is just persistent or flying really is that easy.


----------



## groovetube

wonderings said:


> My parents have been down to see my sister in PA with no issue flying which seems to be the easiest way to get there. For some reason they are ok with a lot of people in one vehicle rather then a few people in a car crossing over. We have a worker here who has been down to the states 3 or 4 times during the pandemic. Not sure if she is just persistent or flying really is that easy.


I don’t think anyone said you cannot go to the US right now. I was actually referring to crossing in a vehicle (in this case a motorcycle likely) at a land border.

I think it was macfury that turned the conversation about whether you can go to the US at all (ie via an airport), so he must have misunderstood what was being said. Of course you can. I have plenty of pals flying to the US for work without issue. I think they’re vaxxed tho not sure what the current requirements are and if they will change soon as this news report suggests will happen in a phased system leading to a full requirement of vaccination for all travelers. 








U.S. To Require Foreign Visitors To Be Fully Vaccinated


The Biden administration's plan to reopen international travel is sounding a lot like Canada's.




www.forbes.com


----------



## Macfury

wonderings said:


> My parents have been down to see my sister in PA with no issue flying which seems to be the easiest way to get there. For some reason they are ok with a lot of people in one vehicle rather then a few people in a car crossing over. We have a worker here who has been down to the states 3 or 4 times during the pandemic. Not sure if she is just persistent or flying really is that easy.


I know unvaccinated people who have attended weddings in the U.S. and driven back as well. If you really want to go, go!


----------



## groovetube

That’s nice macfury. I know you desperately need to derail the topic to one of, "who I knew that crossed unvaccinated" for some ungodly reason (Likely because you're a troll...) but maybe try to follow the conversation.

Vaccinations to cross the borders are becoming a requirement. Canada is now requiring it as of September 7th so you're friends would possibly be out of luck or at the very least would require a negative PCR test. Not sure if that's even allowed anymore. And, the White House has signalled it will also require travellers who enter the US to be vaccinated as well pretty soon.









U.S. plans to require COVID-19 shots for foreign travellers


The Biden administration is taking the first steps toward requiring nearly all foreign visitors to the U.S. to be vaccinated for the coronavirus, a White House official said Wednesday.




www.ctvnews.ca





Good thing your pals went before this.

Like I said before, I look forward to the howls...


----------



## groovetube

'Boiling point': Alberta doctors warn of health system collapse as COVID-19 cases climb


Alberta's health-care system is on the verge of collapse, warns a group of physicians who are pleading with the government to strengthen public health measures to fend off a relentless fourth wave of COVID-19.




edmonton.ctvnews.ca





Freddie, recall when these guys were yukking it up with the summer’s lower ICU numbers. I think I said yeah let them yuk and just sit back and wait. Generally **** always comes to bite them in the ass eventually. The best they’ll have is some windup about whatever sites like rebel news tells them, but in the end, all they’re really doing is kicking the doctors and nurses who have had to put up with these numbskulls now for months right in the teeth.

that’s pretty much the size of it.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Elective surgeries cancelled in Calgary. But I hear the ICU’s are mostly empty according to Macfury.

 https://calgaryherald.com/news/loc...Lim2o3CeqbhQC7mgCZu_PEiNHhRL4afgyjnnaK4ngNm1A


----------



## groovetube

He knows some friends who visited there.


----------



## Macfury

Elective surgeries delayed by a week? That's a feature of socialized medicine!



Freddie_Biff said:


> Elective surgeries cancelled in Calgary.


----------



## groovetube

Looks like someone googled a headline to wind up but got it wrong again.

He’ll need iron horse to ‘back up his 6’ with another barrage of total nonsense.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Alberta ****ed up its Covid response pretty royally this summer. Best summer ever! 



> Alberta's rising COVID-19 cases due to faulty modelling and government inaction, experts say
> 
> Dr. Deena Hinshaw, Alberta's chief medical officer of health, is seen leaving the podium after a June 29 news conference. Hinshaw's next media availability, almost one month later, was the announcement that testing, contract tracing and mandatory isolation would be scaled back. (Chris Schwarz/Government of Alberta)
> 
> Alberta's plan to lift all pandemic restrictions and precautions appears to have been based on a scenario rooted more in wishful optimism and political expediency than obvious scientific evidence, say experts in infectious diseases and pandemic modelling.
> 
> But they say the problem was compounded as Premier Jason Kenney and Dr. Deena Hinshaw, the chief medical officer of health, failed to reimpose measures despite the steady rise of COVID-19 infections and hospitalizations through the summer.
> 
> "At this point in the pandemic, there is no excuse for this sort of negligence at the government level," said Dr. Ilan Schwartz, an associate professor of infectious diseases at the University of Alberta.
> 
> "The bottom line is that people are going to die and it is really tragic — but it is also infuriating, because this was all entirely preventable."
> 
> In late May, Kenney promised the "best summer ever" for Albertans as he announced the government's three-part plan to be the first and most open province in Canada, with no restrictions by July 1.
> 
> Then in late July, Hinshaw announced the province would end testing, contact tracing and mandatory isolation, a move that alarmed doctors and infectious disease experts across the country.
> 
> Based on U.K. data
> 
> According to Kenney and Hinshaw, the moves were based on data from the United Kingdom showing that high vaccination rates had "decoupled" infections from severe outcomes, which in turn had resulted in much lower rates of hospitalization.
> 
> But both Schwartz and Dean Karlen, a physics professor and expert in modelling at the University of Victoria, said Alberta's reliance on the U.K. experience made little sense.
> 
> "You don't just use one jurisdiction to base your best knowledge [on]. Especially you don't choose the one that has the most optimistic future," said Karlen, a member of British Columbia's independent COVID-19 Modelling Group, which has been publicly releasing modelling information about Alberta.
> 
> "You really should be looking at multiple jurisdictions."…..


 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/alberta-covid-19-modelling-1.6168948


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Border is quite porous if you're persistant. I've known people, jabbed or unjabbed, who have enjoyed time in the states.


Yeah, I can name probably a couple dozen, too. Among them, friends who wintered in AZ & plan on going back this fall. So much for the "essential travel" theory. Don't forget Roxham Rd, which has never closed down, either. Musn't halt the flow of all those illegal alien Liberal voters...


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Elective surgeries delayed by a week? That's a feature of socialized medicine!


Yep. After waiting for years & months, what the hell difference does another week make?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Alberta ****ed up its Covid response pretty royally this summer. Best summer ever!
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/alberta-covid-19-modelling-1.6168948


These doohickeys will never get it. I suspect they know so they're just being arse*oles about it now. It's the same sort of stupidity they'd pull on everyone else they didn't like that led to them being left to pretty much talk to themselves. "Whar'd everybody go?" Dumbasses.

Let them yuk it up all they like today. But lets review this in a couple weeks, and lets see. Let's see where the future travel restrictions are, and what happens in Alberta's hospitals. Quote their posts and compare. This sort of stupidity is useless.

I mean, why stop at dewormer AMIRITE?


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Looks like only 202 serious cases across Canada right now.


Here ya go Freddie. See this the fun you have when these fools spout. How many serious cases in hospital and ICU in Alberta alone now?

Weren't dimwits outraged by your math at one time? HAH.

Should be interesting to review in a few weeks.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Here ya go Freddie. See this the fun you have when these fools spout. How many serious cases in hospital and ICU in Alberta alone now?
> 
> Weren't dimwits outraged by your math at one time? HAH.
> 
> Should be interesting to review in a few weeks.


#mathishard LOL. It’s so hard that sometimes you have to make your own charts and graphs when the real ones do’t say what you want them to.


----------



## groovetube

And while they’re making posts yukkin it up about apparently their cousin bob got across the border, let’s review when the vaccination requirements hit. That should be fun too. See engaging these tools on horse dewormer is useless.


----------



## groovetube

From the NY Times: (which should make a couple of them shiver in terror... PROG!)



> President Biden on Thursday used the full force of his presidency to get two-thirds of the American work force vaccinated against the coronavirus, including private sector employees, health care workers and federal contractors — as well as the vast majority of federal workers, who could face disciplinary measures if they refuse.
> 
> The sweeping moves, which the president announced in a White House speech, are the most expansive actions he has taken to control the pandemic since he assumed the presidency in January, and will affect almost every aspect of American society.
> 
> Biden is acting through a combination of executive orders and new federal rules. Under his plan, federal workers, contractors and health care workers employed by institutions that accept Medicare and Medicaid reimbursement will also face strict new vaccination requirements. Private sector businesses that have 100 or more employees will have to require vaccination, or mandatory weekly testing, for their workers after Biden instructs the Occupational Safety and Health Administration to draft a rule.
> 
> The mandate for federal workers is an especially assertive move by the president. Jen Psaki, the White House press secretary, told reporters on Thursday that, aside from some religious and disability exemptions, a vast majority of federal workers would be subject to a 75-day grace period for receiving a vaccine.
> 
> If workers decline to receive shots in that time frame, Psaki said, they will “go through the standard H.R. process,” which she said would include progressive disciplinary action.
> 
> It is unclear how long it will take for the new requirements to go into effect, and some will almost certainly give rise to lawsuits. However, Lawrence O. Gostin, a professor of global health law at Georgetown University, said Biden had broad latitude to compel vaccination, even for workers in private businesses.


It's comin'. And for the borders. Doesn't matter many "cousin Bob's" you know who did whatever 2 months ago. Yuk it up all ya like.

YEEEEEHAAAAAWWWW! Stay at home I guess?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> From the NY Times: (which should make a couple of them shiver in terror... PROG!)
> 
> 
> 
> It's comin'. And for the borders. Doesn't matter many "cousin Bob's" you know who did whatever 2 months ago. Yuk it up all ya like.
> 
> YEEEEEHAAAAAWWWW! Stay at home I guess?


It’s about time. Good for Biden for growing a pair.


----------



## groovetube

Bu-bu-but my cousin bob went to the states a few months ago!!

the idiot brigade at ehmac in action.


----------



## Macfury

Don't even try, Freddie. It's not your strong suit.



Freddie_Biff said:


> #mathishard LOL. It’s so hard that sometimes you have to make your own charts and graphs when the real ones do’t say what you want them to.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Don't even try, Freddie. It's not your strong suit.


But but there’s only 200 serious cases in all of Canada right now!


----------



## Macfury

I think you're wrong on that. The number is higher right now.



Freddie_Biff said:


> But but there’s only 200 serious cases in all of Canada right now!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I think you're wrong on that. The number is higher right now.


Ya think?


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Don't even try, Freddie. It's not your strong suit.


Ha ha ha. You, telling someone else not to even try. Listen you dimwitted troll, no one cares about your windups. They’re obvious. Grow up.

Quit with the windups and either make some factual posts on the topic or shut the hell up.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> But but there’s only 200 serious cases in all of Canada right now!


Ha ha he didn't like that so much. Touched a nerve!

It's the best when they ensnare themselves in their nonsense. They think it's funny at the time to be jerks about it, but I love quoting their windups and rubbing their noses in it as they get their asses handed to them.

Of course the alternative is for them to quit being jerks about it and try joining a 'reasonable discussion'. You know, the one he claims to be interested in. But let's face it. It doesn't matter what old member it is that comes by, if you look back, me, you, macdoc, cubamark, the list goes on, he is always the common denominator in childish windups.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Ha ha he didn't like that so much. Touched a nerve!
> 
> It's the best when they ensnare themselves in their nonsense. They think it's funny at the time to be jerks about it, but I love quoting their windups and rubbing their noses in it as they get their asses handed to them.
> 
> Of course the alternative is for them to quit being jerks about it and try joining a 'reasonable discussion'. You know, the one he claims to be interested in. But let's face it. It doesn't matter what old member it is that comes by, if you look back, me, you, macdoc, cubamark, the list goes on, he is always the common denominator in childish windups.


There seems to be a bit of a pattern around here….


----------



## Macfury

Brace for this one Freddie: the numbers change over time.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Ya think?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> There seems to be a bit of a pattern around here….


Well Yeah. Look at the pattern over the last 8 years here. Did it work? Only if running any reasonable member out of here is the goal? You got this jerk running around winding people up constantly, and the other one playing tough guy (who does that on a forum, like really...) starting his posts with "hey bigot"... it's right there. Then it just barrages people with utter nonsense from far right wing blogs it doesn't even read half the time until people just give up. A couple pages back it didn't matter if a few people pointed the obvious, it just doubled down and became a Toal asshole to everyone. The best one can do, just laugh at it. Give up. Obviously, looking through a few of the threads, it was left in it's own echo chamber. Fitting.

But it's always someone else's fault if 'they respond'. Just ignore it. Right. that worked out well! Everyone ignored it so well they all fled!


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Brace for this one Freddie: the numbers change over time.


You don't say.


----------



## MacDoc

Good article - didn't know he was 80  








‘Maybe the guy’s a masochist’: how Anthony Fauci became a superstar


The US diseases expert has been spoofed by Brad Pitt and lauded as the ‘sexiest man alive’. Now the pop culture phenomenon is the focus of a documentary




www.theguardian.com


----------



## Macfury

Fauci is hero to a very small segment of the public. The man who told people in early 2020 that they shouldn't cancel their ocean cruises may earn kudos from a very forgiving audience with a need to look to others for leadership.



MacDoc said:


> Good article - didn't know he was 80
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ‘Maybe the guy’s a masochist’: how Anthony Fauci became a superstar
> 
> 
> The US diseases expert has been spoofed by Brad Pitt and lauded as the ‘sexiest man alive’. Now the pop culture phenomenon is the focus of a documentary
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com


----------



## groovetube

macfury if you can’t understand this stuff you should probably stop, and listen. It’s nonsense comments like this that display an embarrassing lack of a basic understanding of science. I realize there is a large number of drooling idiots out there that would buy this sort of low hanging fruit, but don’t expect the rest of us to let stupidity slide.

grow up.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Well Yeah. Look at the pattern over the last 8 years here. Did it work? Only if running any reasonable member out of here is the goal? You got this jerk running around winding people up constantly, and the other one playing tough guy (who does that on a forum, like really...) starting his posts with "hey bigot"... it's right there. Then it just barrages people with utter nonsense from far right wing blogs it doesn't even read half the time until people just give up. A couple pages back it didn't matter if a few people pointed the obvious, it just doubled down and became a Toal asshole to everyone. The best one can do, just laugh at it. Give up. Obviously, looking through a few of the threads, it was left in it's own echo chamber. Fitting.
> 
> But it's always someone else's fault if 'they respond'. Just ignore it. Right. that worked out well! Everyone ignored it so well they all fled!


Or even using “blah blah blah” as a substitute for someone else’s words. Very childish. That alone would get you a warning on other forums.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> macfury if you can’t understand this stuff you should probably stop, and listen. It’s nonsense comments like this that display an embarrassing lack of a basic understanding of science. I realize there is a large number of drooling idiots out there that would buy this sort of low hanging fruit, but don’t expect the rest of us to let stupidity slide.
> 
> grow up.


But there’s only 43 cases in the ICU in Alberta!


----------



## Macfury

What day was that?



Freddie_Biff said:


> But there’s only 43 cases in the ICU in Alberta!


----------



## groovetube

this pretty much sums it up here. Replace Afghanistan with any of the other topics, none of these fools are knowledgeable in this, the political or the GHG thread at all, it’s just a total barrage of stupidity. They figure the louder they stamp their feet the smarter they look unfortunately, no one cares.


----------



## groovetube

Oh, and in case no one sees it in the GHG thread, fexl and macfury. You can guess which is which.  
.


----------



## groovetube

Covid Live Updates: The Unvaccinated Are 11 Times More Likely to Die if Infected, C.D.C. Reports
This from the New York Times, (this article is a free article), data from some fairly large studies released. Despite some embarrassingly uninformed tap dancing around here it looks like the vaccines are in fact quite effective at preventing infection, very effective at preventing hospitalization and death. Interesting that we see absolutely no such data on horse dewormer, and likely nor will we. Of course we will continue to hear that the reason for this is because of some ‘false narrative’, but I believe the correct response would be, put up or shut up. 

hospitals are still continuing to report that the overwhelming majority of their hospitalizations are unvaccinated. Ironic that the possible reaching a peak and the numbers receding in this 4th wave, would likely be the result of high vaccination numbers in many regions in Canada. Here in Toronto we're almost 80% fully vaccinated for 12+ and they are pushing to get up to 90% which may be possible with the vaccine mandates. 

Alberta has some catching up to do, and it appears their health minister today admitted it was likely premature to begin treating covid as endemic. Wow. Ya think???

if they would only listen to a couple of dingbats on ehmac!


> Three studies that drew data from different U.S. regions evaluated the protective power of the vaccines. One looked at more than 600,000 virus cases in 13 states, representing about one quarter of the U.S. population, between April and July, and concluded that individuals who were not fully vaccinated were far more susceptible to infection and death from the virus.
> 
> They were 4.5 times more likely than vaccinated individuals to become infected, 10 times more likely to be hospitalized, and 11 times more likely to die from the coronavirus, the study found.


----------



## MacDoc

> *Intensive care beds are 130% over capacity
> The latest COVID-19 numbers:*
> 
> Alberta reported 10 more deaths from COVID on Friday. A total of 2,444 Albertans have died of COVID-19.
> Alberta reported 1,473 new cases out of more than 13,625 tests on Friday.
> The positivity rate was 11.65 per cent.
> The province is leading the country in daily new COVID cases and active cases.
> There were 16,265 active cases across Alberta.
> By comparison, Ontario, a province with more than three times the population, has less than half the number of active cases.





https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-covid-coronavirus-september-10-1.6170866


----------



## groovetube

I can hear the galloping of the troll already…


----------



## Macfury

How many people are in ICU beds, MacDoc?


----------



## groovetube

Why don’t you go find out for yourself troll.


----------



## MacDoc




----------



## MacDoc

remedial reading advised - that would be Alberta.


> Intensive care beds are *130% over capacity*


at the going rate we won't have to deal with the rightwingnuts in public service or public venues and even many stores, restaurants and theatres.









The vaccine passport debate isn't new. It started in 1897 during a plague pandemic


The debate over proof of vaccination as a requirement for entry dates back more than 120 years. The first time certificates of vaccines were required, health officials were fighting a plague pandemic.




www.ctvnews.ca


----------



## Macfury

Those are some startling patient stats, MacDoc! A list 130% long!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> How many people are in ICU beds, MacDoc?


Why don’t you tell us, mf?


----------



## Macfury

Because even the reports that MacDoc is citing won't say. You don't know either.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Why don’t you tell us, mf?


----------



## Macfury

If Europe is any indication of the enforceability of these "passports" you will have little solace.



MacDoc said:


> at the going rate we won't have to deal with the rightwingnuts in public service or public venues and even many stores, restaurants and theatres.


----------



## groovetube

You know how when little kids reach that age where they will pester you with questions that begin with why.

It’s a whole lot less adorable when it’s a forum troll.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Because even the reports that MacDoc is citing won't say. You don't know either.


There are currently 169 CoVid cases in the ICU in Alberta, triple, almost quadruple the number the last time you minimized it. 87% of hospital admissions are unvaccinated. These numbers are not that hard to find, dude. 

 https://www.alberta.ca/stats/covid-19-alberta-statistics.htm


----------



## Macfury

Yes, I can easily find the number of people in ICU with COVID. More difficult to find the number of people in ICU beds in total. That number appears to fluctuate wildly.



Freddie_Biff said:


> There are currently 169 CoVid cases in the ICU in Alberta, triple, almost quadruple the number the last time you minimized it. 87% of hospital admissions are unvaccinated. These numbers are not that hard to find, dude.
> 
> https://www.alberta.ca/stats/covid-19-alberta-statistics.htm


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Yes, I can easily find the number of people in ICU with COVID. More difficult to find the number of people in ICU beds in total. That number appears to fluctuate wildly.


Doesn’t change the fact that your intention seemed to be to minimize the problem. Which is what you often do.


----------



## groovetube

Yep. Always in like a dirty shirt to wind **** up and frustrate people til they walk away. It's not about differences of opinion, the posts of his Ive reviewed and reposted as the data comes out as we knew it would, he's almost always wrong, but the intention is pretty much to piss people off in a conversation, not to offer a different opinion at all.

he’s done it for years here. Useless.


----------



## groovetube

MacDoc said:


> remedial reading advised - that would be Alberta.
> 
> 
> at the going rate we won't have to deal with the rightwingnuts in public service or public venues and even many stores, restaurants and theatres.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The vaccine passport debate isn't new. It started in 1897 during a plague pandemic
> 
> 
> The debate over proof of vaccination as a requirement for entry dates back more than 120 years. The first time certificates of vaccines were required, health officials were fighting a plague pandemic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ctvnews.ca


What our resident troll isn't capable of understanding, is that it's less about the perfection of enforcement, and all about getting the majority of the unvaccinated convinced to get vaccinated. It was a gamble Macron took in France and it quite clearly paid off. The vaccination rates skyrocketed, even while the smaller group of idiots pretended they actually mattered to anyone protesting in the streets, huge numbers of people were getting vaccinated daily despite them. What has happened, which is likely to happen here in regions of high vaccination rates if they're any indication, as infection rates rise with the delta variant, it'll peak and hospitalization rates will go down as there are less idiots unvaccinated, because the data clearly shows without question the vast majority filling up hospitals, are unvaccinated. Period.

Here in Canada, where vaccine mandates have been announced there also has been clear spikes in vaccinations, and this is what will blunt the hospitalizations. If Alberta can get it's **** together despite their completely incompetent premier and health minister and focus on maintaining mask rules and getting as many people vaccinated as possible with a vaccine mandate of their own, perhaps they can hopefully blunt their looming hospital crisis that our idiot troll is furiously trying to ignore.

Still no word on the "ivermectin cure' for a billion plus in India. Can you imagine, being that incredibly gullible and stupid to fall for that?

Wow.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> What our resident troll isn't capable of understanding, is that it's less about the perfection of enforcement, and all about getting the majority of the unvaccinated convinced to get vaccinated. It was a gamble Macron took in France and it quite clearly paid off. The vaccination rates skyrocketed, even while the smaller group of idiots pretended they actually mattered to anyone protesting in the streets, huge numbers of people were getting vaccinated daily despite them. What has happened, which is likely to happen here in regions of high vaccination rates if they're any indication, as infection rates rise with the delta variant, it'll peak and hospitalization rates will go down as there are less idiots unvaccinated, because the data clearly shows without question the vast majority filling up hospitals, are unvaccinated. Period.
> 
> Here in Canada, where vaccine mandates have been announced there also has been clear spikes in vaccinations, and this is what will blunt the hospitalizations. If Alberta can get it's **** together despite their completely incompetent premier and health minister and focus on maintaining mask rules and getting as many people vaccinated as possible with a vaccine mandate of their own, perhaps they can hopefully blunt their looming hospital crisis that our idiot troll is furiously trying to ignore.
> 
> Still no word on the "ivermectin cure' for a billion plus in India. Can you imagine, being that incredibly gullible and stupid to fall for that?
> 
> Wow.


I wonder why the resident troll can’t just take the word of the doctors and nurses who work in the health care system that they’re almost out of room in the hospitals due to the influx of CoVid patients, mostly unvaccinated. They’re cancelling elective surgeries and the ICU bedspace is running out. Oh but it’s not a serious problem. Get ready for more windups courtesy of our own resident expert troll.


----------



## groovetube

Furiously spinning selected numbers, minimizing the pain of people with surgeries canceled falsely claiming ‘well it’s onkyndelayed a week they were already waiting a year!’ Or whatever hand waving this idiot engages in.

I think I may be right in that it’s mentally disturbed.


----------



## FeXL

This word, Freddie? The one that says about 1 in 4 health care workers, even though they're exposed to Chinese coronavirus on a regular basis, refuse to get "vaccinated"?

Is that the word that you're talking about?

'Cause that one word, a simple, "no", says more to many of us than all the screeching the control idiots can muster.

Here's another one:

*The vaccine hesitant are typically 40-something women in Ontario who tend to vote Liberal*

Prog heads exploding. I can hardly wait for Prinz Dumkopf Blackface of Sparkly Sox to issue his mandatory vaccination order. If he hasn't already lost the election, this will confirm it.

My body, my choice. A phrase that all Progs should be intimately familiar with. Don't like it? Go hide in your locked basement. Afraid _your_ "vaccine" doesn't work? Then why did you get the shot in the first place and why should I get a useless "vaccine", too? Buyer's remorse? Sounds like a personal problem. Put on your big girl panties & suck it up.

In 10 years time, when there is some long term data on the "vaccine" side effects, come talk to me about getting "vaccinated". If I kick off before then, at least I didn't live my final days in abject terror.



Freddie_Biff said:


> I wonder why the resident troll can’t just take the word of the doctors and nurses who work in the health care system ...


----------



## groovetube

First, who gives a **** WHO vaccine hesitant people are and how they vote? You’ll excuse me while I see that though with some skepticism, given the lower vaccine rates tend to be in conservative/trump land.

and it’s hard to imagine this even needs to be said, but hey, this is ehmac, where idiots seem to thrive. No one is being ‘forced’ to take a vaccine so quit playing “VICTIM!” over it. Don’t want it? Don’t get it. Don’t expect others to have to deal with the consequences of your choice. It works both ways bub. And before your little bum buddy comes a’galloping in here with some fake facts and about who transmits and who doesn’t, don’t bother. Most reasonable people are listening to the medical experts who have all been calling for vaccine mandates consistently for some time now.

thays the way it is. Deal with it. The rest of us who aren’t Whiny dumbasses would like to return to some semblance of normalacy without lockdowns without anti covid vax idiots filling up our hospitals thanks.


----------



## Macfury

It's because there is a lack of forthrightness in the numbers presented. If you knew how many ICU beds were available at all levels of ICU care, you would have a better idea of what is happening.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Doesn’t change the fact that your intention seemed to be to minimize the problem. Which is what you often do.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie. See? It won’t give up being a pathetic troll. It’s not capable of any real discussion at all.

lit won’t matter how many official numbers right from the hospitals are shown. It’ll still keep playing it’s clown game.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Afraid _your_ "vaccine" doesn't work? Then why did you get the shot in the first place and why should I get a useless "vaccine", too? Buyer's remorse? Sounds like a personal problem. Put on your big girl panties & suck it up.


This is what it's come down to. The biggest supporters of vaccines — the best protected in society — are afraid of the unprotected. 

Get the shots if you want a demonstrable chance of not becoming as sick if you catch the virus, particularly if you're really old or vulnerable. Weigh that against concerns about side effects, known and unknown, from getting the shot. Live with your choice. That's freedom of choice. We don't live in a medical autocracy where the "woke" can demand everyone makes the same choice they did.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Freddie. See? It won’t give up being a pathetic troll. It’s not capable of any real discussion at all.
> 
> lit won’t matter how many official numbers right from the hospitals are shown. It’ll still keep playing it’s clown game.


So much jibber jabber. I pity the fool.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> So much jibber jabber. I pity the fool.


These nimrods still think it’s about vaccinated people being afraid of unvaccinated people because the vaccine might not work.

seriously, either they are trolling, or they really are, that incredibly stupid. Maybe both? One takes horse dewormer so it’s anyone’s guess


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> These nimrods still think it’s about vaccinated people being afraid of unvaccinated people because the vaccine might not work.
> 
> seriously, either they are trolling, or they really are, that incredibly stupid. Maybe both? One takes horse dewormer so it’s anyone’s guess


Good to avoid those livestock parasites any way one can.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> This is what it's come down to. The biggest supporters of vaccines — the best protected in society — are afraid of the unprotected.


What's really funny is that the Chattering Class thinks I care about why they want to lockdown those of us who haven't partaken of the kool-aid. 

And why is it that only the medical experts that support their narrative are the ones worth listening to? Why not the medical experts on the other side of the story?

And, _and_, what about the medical experts, politicians, _et al.,_ on their side of the narrative that have changed their minds on an issue a number of times? Which version is one supposed to believe? The first? The last? The thirty-sixth?

*FLASHBACK: Biden Opposed Vaccine and Mask Mandates Eight Months Ago*

*Fauci One Year Ago: ‘You Cannot Force Someone to Take a Vaccine’*

And this, my favorite:

*Mixed messages in 2020 may be behind some ongoing vaccine resistance*



> For example, a Sept. 16, 2020 Associated Press story quotes then-candidate Joe Biden saying, ’I trust vaccines. I trust scientists, but I don’t trust Donald Trump, and at this moment, the American people can’t, either.” As Trump told Americans a vaccine would be ready by year-end, Biden was telling American to not believe him – and that’s what dominated the headlines.
> The publication Scientific American weighed in with a June 22, 2020, commentary headlined, “The Risks of Rushing a COVID-19 Vaccine, Telescoping testing time lines and approvals may expose all of us to unnecessary dangers.”




and




> A Sept. 3, 2020 *CNN Health Report* headlined blared, “Doctors warn against rushing a COVID-19 vaccine as Fauci says it's critical to have a safe Labor Day.” The report said many health experts thought a safe and effective vaccine could be ready by early 2021, but added warnings. A graphic illustrating five phases of vaccine development included, “Typically each step can take two years or more to complete.” The graphic was followed by this: “Some doctors say they'd rather see a vaccine go through all the rigors to get a full FDA approval.’
> ‘"How can you justify a substandard or lesser review for something that would be injected in tens of millions, maybe hundreds of millions of Americans?’ said Dr. Peter Hotez, dean of the National School of Tropical Medicine at Baylor College of Medicine.”



Bold mine.

In sum:



> What matters is the monthslong cumulative effect of warnings about a rushed vaccine and EUAs, regardless of whether those warnings were political, medical, or somewhere in-between. The message was planted – repeatedly – in Americans’ minds that a vaccine that didn’t take years to produce, or didn’t have full FDA approval, might endanger their health.


----------



## groovetube

You don’t listen to medical experts you nincompoop. YouTube and right wing blogs don’t count as medical experts I’m afraid. You have horse dewormer, which makes you a total joke. What makes you think any of us give two ****s what some dumbass with horse dewormer whines about? The overwhelming majority are getting vaxxed and WE DONT CARE.


WAAAAAHHHHHHHH THEIR NARRATIVE!!!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Why is it always the other guys that are drinking the Koolaid?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Why is it always the other guys that are drinking the Koolaid?


Probably better than horse dewormer


----------



## FeXL

Ummm... 'Cause you're the ones slurping up the Chinese coronavirus porn like it was the Last Supper? Gotta wash the bull**** down with something.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Why is it always the other guys that are drinking the Koolaid?


----------



## FeXL

Horse dewormer! Horse dewormer! AHHHHH!!!

*Head of Tokyo Medical Association recommends ivermectin for COVID treatment*




> Dr. Haruo Ozaki, chairman of the Tokyo Medical Association recommends ivermectin for use with COVID patients. He notes that the parts of Africa that use ivermectin to control parasites have a COVID death rate of just 2.2 per 100,000 population, as compared to 13 times that death rate among African countries that do not use ivermectin. Similarly, worldometer.com statistics say that the COVID death rate in India (which uses HCQ and Ivermectin to treat COVID) is 32 while the COVID death rate in the U.S.A. is 6.5 times higher at 205 per 100,000 population.


Related:

*If rat poison and mold can save lives, why not a 'horse de-wormer'?*

Questions, questions, questions...

BTW, has anyone else noted the irony of the Chattering Class LLDB, currently at 295 CFP's, accusing others of being like yappy little Chester? 

Further yapping in 3, 2,...


----------



## Macfury

Looks like the UK has had anough of the idea of vaccine passports:









No vaccine passports: UK PM to set out winter COVID-19 plan


British Prime Minister Boris Johnson will set out on Tuesday his plans to manage the COVID-19 pandemic in the winter months, announcing a decision to scrap the introduction of vaccine passports and steps to end some emergency powers.




www.reuters.com


----------



## groovetube

Oh! Boris Johnson eh? YeH he’s really the example the rest of us should follow!

next we’ll hear about how the rest of Canada should follow Jason Kenny’s shining example!!

LOL


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Horse dewormer! Horse dewormer! AHHHHH!!!
> 
> *Head of Tokyo Medical Association recommends ivermectin for COVID treatment*
> 
> 
> 
> Related:
> 
> *If rat poison and mold can save lives, why not a 'horse de-wormer'?*
> 
> Questions, questions, questions...
> 
> BTW, has anyone else noted the irony of the Chattering Class LLDB, currently at 295 CFP's, accusing others of being like yappy little Chester?
> 
> Further yapping in 3, 2,...


American Thinker? Okay, boomer. Please start quoting some credible sources. M’kay?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Oh! Boris Johnson eh? YeH he’s really the example the rest of us should follow!
> 
> next we’ll hear about how the rest of Canada should follow Jason Kenny’s shining example!!
> 
> LOL


Jason Kenney is a fool. People on the right hate him just as much as people on the left now, albeit for different reasons.


----------



## Macfury

Yeah, looks like Alberta is begging me to smothered by NDP-style socialism once again!



Freddie_Biff said:


> Jason Kenney is a fool. People on the right hate him just as much as people on the left now, albeit for different reasons.


----------



## groovetube

So far we have zero credibility sources on horse dewormer, oh look at what doofus over there is doing!

And that’s about it.

We just needs to sit back and wait for the **** to hit the fan on all their claims. Then repost their stupid posts, and laugh.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Yeah, looks like Albberta is begging me to smothered by NDP-style socialism once again!


With the surge in cases and cancelled surgeries that you nitwits dismissed as “delayed for a week”, I don’t think anyone is worried about socialism right now. Except you pair of numb nuts shivering under your beds.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Yeah, looks like Alberta is begging me to smothered by NDP-style socialism once again!


SMH. I didn’t say that, but there’s no question that Kenney is ****ing things up royally.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> So far we have zero credibility sources on horse dewormer, oh look at what doofus over there is doing!
> 
> And that’s about it.
> 
> We just needs to sit back and wait for the **** to hit the fan on all their claims. Then repost their stupid posts, and laugh.


Yeah, I’d also like to see these “studies” that prove how useful Invermectin has been around the world in stopping Covid. More effective than fish tank cleaner even?


----------



## Macfury

No government in Canada is really managing things particularly well--in part, that's because you can't manage a virus. At one point BC liked their MoH, but not sure if the opinion held.



Freddie_Biff said:


> SMH. I didn’t say that, but there’s no question that Kenney is ****ing things up royally.


----------



## groovetube

A declaration that no government in Canada managed the virus well, followed by… nothing.

useless troll.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Hey Macfury: still think there’s no problem with Covid and the ICU’s in Alberta? 



> Alberta breaks pandemic ICU record with 202 COVID-19 patients
> 
> Sep 13, 2021 • 25 minutes ago
> 
> Alberta broke a pandemic record for COVID-19 ICU admissions Monday morning as the province’s strained hospital system struggles to keep up amid a climbing fourth wave.
> 
> Story continues below
> 
> As of 11 a.m. Monday, there were 202 COVID-19 patients in ICU according to Alberta Health Services. Spokesman James Wood said 79 per cent of patients needing intensive care have COVID-19 and 90 per cent of Alberta’s 286 ICU beds were full. The previous ICU record was 182, set on May 18 during the second wave.
> 
> Patients needing intensive care rose by 19 per cent in the last week and the province added 37 more beds in that time frame in an effort to keep up, he said.
> 
> “AHS continues to do all it can to ensure we have enough ICU capacity to meet patient demand, including opening additional spaces and redeploying staff,” Wood said in an email.
> 
> The number of COVID-19 cases have spiked in recent weeks, putting increasing pressure on the province’s health-care system, despite the government’s earlier predictions that rising cases wouldn’t mean a subsequent spike in hospitalizations because of the availability of vaccines.
> 
> Story continues below
> 
> But the number of people falling seriously ill from the original and Delta variants of COVID-19 has risen sharply in recent weeks since the the fourth wave began mid-June — 803 in hospital by Monday — causing overwhelmed hospitals to increase surge capacity and postpone surgeries.
> 
> Most recently, AHS announced up to 70 per cent of Edmonton-area day surgeries had been cancelled with only priority cancer, urgent and emergent surgeries going ahead.
> 
> 
> 
> Hospitals in the Edmonton Zone were at 94 per cent ICU capacity as of 11 a.m. Monday. Of the 126 patients, 87 have COVID-19. If the province did not add additional beds it would be over capacity at 148 per cent.
> 
> NDP health critic David Shepherd said Monday Albertans deserve to hear from Premier Jason Kenney, Health Minister Tyler Shandro or chief medical officer of health Dr. Deena Hinshaw about how they plan to address this spike.
> 
> Story continues below
> 
> “This is the peak today (but) it’s entirely possible that we may surpass that peak tomorrow, or later this week unless this government does something more than the half-hearted, half measures that it’s barely had the courage to put in place so far,” he said.
> 
> Eighteen more people have died from COVID-19 since Friday, for a total of 2,462, provincial data shows.
> 
> Active cases climbed to 18,395 including 5,357 in the Edmonton Zone. Another 4,740 cases have been reported: 1,659 on Friday, 1,497 on Saturday, and 1,584 on Sunday.
> 
> Intensive care numbers provided by AHS were slightly higher than those released publicly by Alberta Health on Monday: 198. Data on the COVID-19 website is older — numbers are accurate as of the end of day Sunday. AHS also noted that ICU numbers can fluctuate.
> 
> Story continues below
> 
> This advertisement has not loaded yet, but your article continues below.
> 
> 
> 
> Pregnant COVID-19 patients in ICU
> 
> Six women placed in ICU due to COVID-19 last month were pregnant, according to AHS, who urged all expecting and new moms to immediately get fully vaccinated.
> 
> “COVID-19, particularly the Delta variant, is highly infectious and pregnant individuals are at a higher risk of getting very sick from COVID-19. Immunization is the best way to protect mother and child,” reads a statement from AHS on Monday.
> 
> All six admitted to ICU in August with COVID-19 were unimmunized. For context, only seven pregnant Albertans were admitted to ICU for COVID-19 during the entire first year of the pandemic, from March 2020 to March 2021.
> 
> And in the six cases last month, COVID-19 had severe impacts on the health of both the parent and child: there were five preterm births as early as 29 weeks.
> 
> “The COVID-19 vaccine is safe for pregnant individuals and their babies, as well as those trying to become pregnant. It is much safer to get the vaccine than to get COVID-19 disease,” AHS said.
> 
> Immunization passes immunity from mother to infant, helping to protect the baby for the first few months of life. The mRNA vaccines, like Pfizer and Moderna, are the safest type of COVID-19 vaccine to get at any time during pregnancy, adds AHS.
> 
> — With files from Ashley Joannou and Nicole Bergot


 https://edmontonjournal.com/news/l...G_geZxU__oOCA_f77opqu8hfIDXLd2CcAIXoOLxPEPuKQ


----------



## Macfury

I always accepted the there was pressure on the ICU system and that it presented a problem. MacDoc was referring to a statistic suggesting that ICU beds were `at 130% capacity, whch I don't believe was accurate (would have meant 372 ICU patients).This article is much more carefully researched, listing a 90% capacity and stating that this is for 286 ICU beds.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Hey Macfury: still think there’s no problem with Covid and the ICU’s in Alberta?
> 
> Alberta breaks pandemic ICU record with 202 COVID-19 patients


----------



## groovetube

It’s a bit of a mystery as to what macfurys point really is. He seems to be chasing some numbers without really giving a reason, (we can guess?) but is completely missing what’s actually occurring. I think it would be very interesting to see a video clip of him speaking to the head doctors in those ERs, especially the part if he gets dismissive of their growing crisis. I would pay money to see that.  Maybe iron horse could also set them straight that the billion plus people in India were cured of covid by horse dewormer according to a couple doctors and a curated selectgroup of right wing websites.

If only, all those doctors and nurses would just come here to ehmac and listen to these guys. They’d really be so much better off!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I always accepted the there was pressure on the ICU system and that it presented a problem. MacDoc was referring to a statistic suggesting that ICU beds were `at 130% capacity, whch I don't believe was accurate (would have meant 372 ICU patients).This article is much more carefully researched, listing a 90% capacity and stating that this is for 286 ICU beds.


Apparently Alberta added about 100 more temporary beds to its ICUs. Without those beds we’d reportedly be at 148% capacity. It’s a serious situation, worse than Ontario right now. About 1500 new cases a day.


----------



## MacDoc

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-icu-fourth-wave-internal-modelling-icu-capacity-1.6174329



this is the kind of horror story this virus can still inflict and getting vaccinated can almost certainly avoid


> The couple was unvaccinated and died on August 26 and September 9, respectively, leaving behind children ranging in age from 3 weeks to 8 years old, Macias told CNN on Monday.
> 
> "It wasn't that they didn't want to be vaccinated -- they planned on it," she said. She was adamant that this was a personal choice and each wanted to learn more about its safety prior to being inoculated.


https://edition.cnn.com/2021/09/13/us/california-family-covid-death-orphan-five-children/index.html


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Apparently Alberta added about 100 more temporary beds to its ICUs. Without those beds we’d reportedly be at 148% capacity. It’s a serious situation, worse than Ontario right now. About 1500 new cases a day.


Macfury's only intention here is to deflect and confuse. He cherry picks numbers and lists them to piss people off. Thats all he does, and continues to do. In other news, water is wet, and earth has one moon.

I hope Alberta sees a peak soon and get a hold of this before more people die. When your ICU is this packed, having the surge get worse, is a disaster, and Jason Kenny will wear this entirely. I saw "liberal light" candidate O'Toole the other day try to blame Trudeau for Kenny's disaster. Thats the sort of leadership we'll expect I suppose if he is successful in this election. 

Still awaiting peer reviewed science on horse dewormer, and the evidence of the population of India being cured of covid with it.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Macfury's only intention here is to deflect and confuse. He cherry picks numbers and lists them to piss people off. Thats all he does, and continues to do. In other news, water is wet, and earth has one moon.
> 
> I hope Alberta sees a peak soon and get a hold of this before more people die. When your ICU is this packed, having the surge get worse, is a disaster, and Jason Kenny will wear this entirely. I saw "liberal light" candidate O'Toole the other day try to blame Trudeau for Kenny's disaster. Thats the sort of leadership we'll expect I suppose if he is successful in this election.
> 
> Still awaiting peer reviewed science on horse dewormer, and the evidence of the population of India being cured of covid with it.


No news on the horse dewormer front. You’d think they’d be anxious to back that one up with some cites. Yes, Alberta is going totally in the wrong direction. Best summer ever! There’s a reason Kenney’s laying low to not taint O’Toole’s prospects.


----------



## groovetube

I’ve always found it facinating how the conservatives always do this song and dance running around hushing each other… shhhhhhh! Don’t say aaaaaaanything! The truth is, the vast majority of Canadians oppose most of the ‘lunatic’ side of that party by a wide margin, ironically, so if O’Toole does get in it’ll most likely be a minority if he’s lucky, given the political climate it’s gonna be a really rough ride for him. I get a good chuckle when I hear far right dunces like macfury musing that O’Toole should lie to get elected and then pivot to a much further right agenda (likely to troll but we already know that…) because it’s the far right swerve that will sink any conservative party’s chances of maintaining power. They’re only hope is landing a majority, and like Trump, it’s gonna be one ****ty term and they’ll be put way out to pasture again.


----------



## groovetube

Hinshaw says government knew since mid-August hospital demand would rise without provincial intervention


Alberta's chief medical officer of health has admitted the province's lifting of restrictions earlier this summer was the wrong approach.




calgary.ctvnews.ca





OH RLLY??? It’s funny how these dimwits do incredibly stupid things without listening to the medical experts, and somehow, oh my god it’s a disaster. As I said before, just let these idiots mouth off, and wait to see what happens. Suddenly, they’re silent, or, they pretend there is no crisis. As I said, I think macfury should video himself visiting one of those hospitals giving those doctors and nurses a piece of his mind! Come on do it! Put your money where your mouth is dumbass! LOL

and:


> On the topic of vaccine passports, Hinshaw did not give a direct answer, but did reference data from neighbouring B.C. She says since its announcement two weeks ago, B.C. has seen an increase in the younger population getting vaccinated. She says it shows that requiring vaccination to participate in discretionary activities has pushed demographics with the lowest immunization rates to get the shot.


again! OH RLLY??? and these dimwits here try to make it about the vaccinated being afraid of the unvaccinated. Nice try morons, but in the real world, these solutions are paying off in regions smart enough to enact them.

The fact is, the more people get vaccinated and push that percentage up, the less the impact on our hospital system will be. And that is the entire point of it all, to avoid lockdowns (like Australia may be looking at I heard with their low vax rate) and get back to normal. People will still get infected but it will be mostly like a mild cold or flu as a vaxxed person.

ironic that macfury is vaccinated LOL.


----------



## groovetube

> Anti-Vaxxers Are Now Gargling Iodine to Prevent Covid-19
> 
> One ER doc’s response to the new trend: “**** me! Of course they are”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anti-Vaxxers Are Now Gargling Iodine to Prevent Covid-19
> 
> 
> One ER doc’s response to the new trend: “**** me! Of course they are”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.rollingstone.com


I wanna laugh but not in a ha ha kinda way.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I wanna laugh but not in a ha ha kinda way.


The mind boggles.


----------



## groovetube

The conservative right, will do anything, including kill their own supporters in an effort to derail a Democrat White House. All these republican politicians and talking heads, all of them fully vaxxed all egging people in not to get vaxxed, spreading everything from hydroxycloriquin to bleach to horse dewormer and iodine.

There’s a fully vaxxed one here egging it on! Cowardly.

sadly, there’s lot of really, really stupid people out there hungry for ‘the truth they don’t want you to hear’.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

So how’s that billion people taking ivermectin research going there, kids? Is that just in India or worldwide?


----------



## groovetube

All yer gonna get, is a barrage of right wing blog links that contain much of the same passed around stupidity.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> All yer gonna get, is a barrage of right wing blog links that contain much of the same passed around stupidity.


We haven’t even got that! Talk about intellectually lazy.


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> I always accepted the there was pressure on the ICU system and that it presented a problem. MacDoc was referring to a statistic suggesting that ICU beds were `at 130% capacity, whch I don't believe was accurate (would have meant 372 ICU patients).This article is much more carefully researched, listing a 90% capacity and stating that this is for 286 ICU beds.


ICU Capacity is a bit ambiguous. 

Hospitals measure it in terms of staffed beds not physical beds.
A Hospital can have 500 physical beds but only staff to cover 300. So when they say 130% in that case they mean they have 390 people in beds buy only staff to support 300. Still workable but not without putting severe strains on staffing. But of course there are scenarios when all beds are taken and patients are not in beds..


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> ICU Capacity is a bit ambiguous.
> 
> Hospitals measure it in terms of staffed beds not physical beds.
> A Hospital can have 500 physical beds but only staff to cover 300. So when they say 130% in that case they mean they have 390 people in beds buy only staff to support 300. Still workable but not without putting severe strains on staffing. But of course there are scenarios when all beds are taken and patients are not in beds..


Interesting. But without knowing how many beds we're talking about,we need more than a percentage to describe the degree of the problem. Using the number 300, for example, gives us context.


----------



## groovetube

But, the percentage is the number that does in fact describe the problem. Smashedbanana just took the time to explain it simply for you!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> But, the percentage is the number that does in fact describe the problem. Smashedbanana just took the time to explain it simply for you!


Exactly. When the person in charge at the hospital says they’re at 97% or 130% or 256% capacity, that’s a comparison to what kind of staffing they would normally need to run the ICU at that hospital. Er should take their word for it. It’s not a fixed number because it depends on staffing levels. Not only that, but staff are burning out, which means there’ll be even less staff to go around if they have to take a leave. You know what they don’t need? ****ing protests in front of hospitals.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Exactly. When the person in charge at the hospital says they’re at 97% or 130% or 256% capacity, that’s a comparison to what kind of staffing they would normally need to run the ICU at that hospital. Er should take their word for it. It’s not a fixed number because it depends on staffing levels. Not only that, but staff are burning out, which means there’ll be even less staff to go around if they have to take a leave. You know what they don’t need? ****ing protests in front of hospitals.


He shows himself to be a troll right to the end, even with someone who took the time to explain it.

a school age kid would know to use a percentage of the beds given and use basic arithmetic to learn the number of staffed beds.


----------



## Macfury

It still requires context. 130% of 10 is 13. 130% of 100 is 130. Big difference.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Exactly. When the person in charge at the hospital says they’re at 97% or 130% or 256% capacity, that’s a comparison to what kind of staffing they would normally need to run the ICU at that hospital.


----------



## groovetube

Don’t bother with his windups. No one could possibly be that thick.









Mounting pressure on Alberta premier as doctors and experts call for his resignation


The calls from doctors and political experts for the premier to step down are growing louder following Chief Medical Officer of Health Dr. Deena Hinshaw's admission that lifting pandemic restrictions for the summer was a mistake.




calgary.ctvnews.ca





Kenny had his fans for lifting all the restrictions early. Now, after those fans jeered at those who said it was too early, including all the medical experts, now we see the stupidity come to roost.


----------



## groovetube

See, this is why you just wait while trolls wind themselves in circles. The truth eventually comes out.









Proof of vaccination program announced in Alberta as state of public health emergency declared


The government of Alberta has joined other provinces across Canada in announcing a proof of vaccination program as COVID-19 cases continue to soar to well over a thousand per day.




calgary.ctvnews.ca





While trolls continue mewling about bed numbers, there’s a real world out there.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> See, this is why you just wait while trolls wind themselves in circles. The truth eventually comes out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Proof of vaccination program announced in Alberta as state of public health emergency declared
> 
> 
> The government of Alberta has joined other provinces across Canada in announcing a proof of vaccination program as COVID-19 cases continue to soar to well over a thousand per day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> calgary.ctvnews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While trolls continue mewling about bed numbers, there’s a real world out there.


There certainly is, and I’m living in it. Hopefully these measures have not come too late to ward off a catastrophe.


----------



## groovetube

So much for “it’s gonna wane cause some other region that supports my view did.” Why do you think the troll is busy winding circles about bed numbers? He’s an idiot.

I do hope it’s not too late for Alberta to avoid a bigger crisis. It means more people will die, and something you don’t hear people talk about, the hefty complications left by surviving covid for many. Damaged lungs, organs etc.

Vaccine mandates are largely, to me, the way to get more people vaccinated hopefully to 90% in order to keep hospitals clearer, and no need for closures. I find it facinating how the same anti-vax idiots also claim to be anti-lockdown.


----------



## MacDoc

France has gotten very heavy handed, and here in Australia gov and health are completely fed up with any anti-vax nonsense.



> He took a risk to say I will make the life of the non-vaccinated very difficult, which is a very, very, very dangerous statement for an executive."
> As the proposal went to French lawmakers, protesters began weekly demonstrations against the health pass. On July 31, more than 200,000 people took to streets across France, a mix of those opposed to the health pass and its restrictions on freedoms, and people reluctant to get vaccinated entirely.
> Yet for all the noise, many more French people were voting with their feet in support of the pass, and extending their arms.* On the same day, 532,000 people were vaccinated*, according to France's health ministry.
> Despite some early opposition, Macron's risk looks to be reaping significant rewards.
> Immediately following Macron's speech on July 12, there was a spike in vaccination appointments in France. Doctolib, the main platform for booking jabs in the country, saw 1 million appointments made in 24 hours.











Will Biden's mandates work? Macron's vaccine pass gamble may hold some clues


After US President Joe Biden laid out a wide-ranging plan to tackle the worsening Covid pandemic in America with a raft of new vaccination rules last week, the big question on the minds of many is: Will mandating vaccines work? In France, it's a gamble that is beginning to pay off.




edition.cnn.com


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> So much for “it’s gonna wane cause some other region that supports my view did.” Why do you think the troll is busy winding circles about bed numbers? He’s an idiot.
> 
> I do hope it’s not too late for Alberta to avoid a bigger crisis. It means more people will die, and something you don’t hear people talk about, the hefty complications left by surviving covid for many. Damaged lungs, organs etc.
> 
> Vaccine mandates are largely, to me, the way to get more people vaccinated hopefully to 90% in order to keep hospitals clearer, and no need for closures. I find it facinating how the same anti-vax idiots also claim to be anti-lockdown.


Right now the problem isn’t even surviving Covid. Those patients get priority on the beds and staff. The problem is the people who had surgeries cancelled because they need the beds for CoVid patients, mostly unvaccinated ****ers too. Cal it collateral damage, but people will die from these complications of CoVid as well.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> France has gotten very heavy handed, and here in Australia gov and health are completely fed up with any anti-vax nonsense.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will Biden's mandates work? Macron's vaccine pass gamble may hold some clues
> 
> 
> After US President Joe Biden laid out a wide-ranging plan to tackle the worsening Covid pandemic in America with a raft of new vaccination rules last week, the big question on the minds of many is: Will mandating vaccines work? In France, it's a gamble that is beginning to pay off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edition.cnn.com


They’ve gotta do what they’ve gotta do. Much the same everywhere. And Australia was doing so well early on too that vaccination didn’t become a priority.


----------



## Macfury

I suppose one could move patients with obesity-related illnesses and conditions related to drug addiction out of the hospital for awhile. Like the unvaccinated, they made their own beds... right?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Right now the problem isn’t even surviving Covid. Those patients get priority on the beds and staff. The problem is the people who had surgeries cancelled because they need the beds for CoVid patients, mostly unvaccinated ****ers too. Cal it collateral damage, but people will die from these complications of CoVid as well.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I suppose one could move patients with obesity-related illnesses and conditions related to drug addiction out of the hospital for awhile. Like the unvaccinated, they made their own beds... right?


You could, but they’re not the ones taking up space. The problem is the number of unvaccinated people who have Covid. And that affects everyone else.


----------



## groovetube

He’s just winding again. anything to deflect from the fact that his position has been idiotic right from the start, and now we’re seeing those policies he’s been pushing coming to roost. Now all he’s doing is being a sick about cherry picking stays to whine that there’s no crisis. What sort of low life does this? I’ll say it again, go to the ERs for yourself asshole. Video yourself. We’re waiting…

only a numbskull would compare conditions like obesity and the disease of addiction to the, what shall we call it… the disease of stupidity?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> He’s just winding again. anything to deflect from the fact that his position has been idiotic right from the start, and now we’re seeing those policies he’s been pushing coming to roost. Now all he’s doing is being a sick about cherry picking stays to whine that there’s no crisis. What sort of low life does this? I’ll say it again, go to the ERs for yourself asshole. Video yourself. We’re waiting…
> 
> only a numbskull would compare conditions like obesity and the disease of addiction to the, what shall we call it… the disease of stupidity?


He just doesn’t get it, does he. It’s not like there’s a shortage of information available.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> He just doesn’t get it, does he. It’s not like there’s a shortage of information available.


Im just calling him out for what it is. Trolling. 

Useless. If he wants "reasonable discussion", I'll back off.


----------



## Macfury

For some time there was. That's why you were unable to answer simple questions about your own province's ICU system.


Freddie_Biff said:


> It’s not like there’s a shortage of information available.


----------



## groovetube

I think it’s because we’re aware you’re simply being a troll. Try joining the conversation without obvious attempts at derailing things for once.


----------



## MacDoc

Despite her best efforts 









Florida vaccine advocate loses 6 unvaccinated family members to Covid-19 within 3 weeks


After months of knocking on doors in the neighborhoods of Palm Beach County, Florida, trying to convince members of the community to get vaccinated, Lisa Wilson said she lost six members of her family to Covid-19 in a three-week span.




edition.cnn.com


----------



## groovetube

O’Toole announces this morning that he would never have allowed the delta variant into Canada.

he then went on to brag about being able to walk on water.


----------



## Macfury

MacDoc said:


> Despite her best efforts


A massive — and often well-earned — mistrust of government is hard to overcome.


----------



## groovetube

Often fueled by far right wing politicians, all fully vaccinated ironically.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> O’Toole announces this morning that he would never have allowed the delta variant into Canada.
> 
> he then went on to brag about being able to walk on water.


What a tool. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Macfury

Playing the same game with the name "Trudeau" renders even more unfortunate results.



Freddie_Biff said:


> What a tool.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> What a tool.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sadly there’s enough dummies who’ll actually buy it. Maybe a few here?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Sadly there’s enough dummies who’ll actually buy it. Maybe a few here?


I wouldn’t be surprised.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> I wouldn’t be surprised.


That’s why O’Toole pulled that stunt. He knows his supporters well. I saw someone today on social media declaring that the surge in covid cases was ‘because Biden let it all in through the borders’. How did this tool get this idea? Republican politicians, who know their base very well, and that they are dumb enough to actually believe this crap, and it helps get them elected.

we have a member here, desperate for people’s attention asking no, demanding answers to ridiculous questions that have already been answered several times, because he’s bought into this idea that somehow, this recent surge is a bit of an overreaction because tell me the number of beds! So I can wind people up in circles like a dumbass.

Meanwhile, in the real world, another province comes to its senses:'The time for patience is now over': Sask. premier announces masking order, vaccination rules
If only, they would have answered macfurys incessant questioning they would have seen the light!

so goes the conversation at ehmac. I doubt it posts anywhere else because it would be laughed at or eaten for breakfast anywhere else.


----------



## MacDoc

Goverment is not the science and medical community as Fnord so ably demonstrated.


----------



## Macfury

The science and medical community was as wavery as the refracted air over a hot road in summer. Many of the members are carrying water for political allies.



MacDoc said:


> Goverment is not the science and medical community as Fnord so ably demonstrated.


----------



## groovetube

MacDoc said:


> Goverment is not the science and medical community as Fnord so ably demonstrated.


You'll never get through to these idiots. They've been given an enemy and the reasons to be afraid. They're even taking horse dewormer and swallowing iodine for god's sake. This is who you're trying to reach. They dont care. They aren't capable of understanding what science is, and are constantly flabbergasted at how science updates its findings and recommendations as more clinical trials finish, and they analyze the data. "Oh mah gawd WUT we gotta wear masks?? GODDAM FAUCI!" Peer reviewed science is pretty much witchcraft to these fools, and they'll never understand or accept any of it. They’ve been brainwashed by fully vaccinated right wing douchebags using them to cause **** and get support to be elected. Hard to imagine it’s come to this, but here we are.


----------



## groovetube

And while we have a nincompoop winding people up with demands to answer his questions about the number of beds, we have the real world. Obviously, there are more patients than there are beds to put them, as they are now considering airlifting to Ontario!









'We need to bend that curve': Alberta could transfer ICU patients to Ontario as hospitalizations near 900


Alberta is considering transferring ICU patients to other provinces as the fourth wave puts its health-care system under 'extreme pressure.'




edmonton.ctvnews.ca





I have many many friends in Alberta as well as family, I sincerely hope they can get this under control.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> And while we have a nincompoop winding people up with demands to answer his questions about the number of beds, we have the real world. Obviously, there are more patients than there are beds to put them, as they are now considering airlifting to Ontario!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 'We need to bend that curve': Alberta could transfer ICU patients to Ontario as hospitalizations near 900
> 
> 
> Alberta is considering transferring ICU patients to other provinces as the fourth wave puts its health-care system under 'extreme pressure.'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edmonton.ctvnews.ca
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have many many friends in Alberta as well as family, I sincerely hope they can get this under control.


Yeah, I heard about that. Can you imagine your family member has to three provinces away and then die in the hospital by themselves? Thanks Kenney.


----------



## FeXL

Shoulda got the shot...



Freddie_Biff said:


> Can you imagine your family member has to three provinces away and then die in the hospital by themselves?


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Shoulda got the shot...


Don't be so harsh, FeXL. There's nothing like a challenging medical situtation to bring out the apocalypse in the susceptible. 

Imagine these keyboard jockeys pumping out their fire and brimstone during the Spanish Flu. They might not have survived the beatings.


----------



## groovetube

Dont be so hard yourself macfury. A lot of people have fallen for the apocalyptic conspiracy theories of this all being an elaborate hoax and the vaccines causing mass death. A quick scan of social media shows the 'keyboard jockeys' you speak of are still in a rage passing all sorts of theories while the rest of us are dealing with what’s actually happening on the ground.

This sort of thing did indeed occur back in the 1918 flu, and all the conspiracy types aren't remembered well. Not sure how many received 'beatings' however.


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> Don't be so harsh, FeXL. There's nothing like a challenging medical situtation to bring out the apocalypse in the susceptible.


I recall reading a book years ago based on a segment of Art Linkletter's _House Party _TV show titled *Kids Say The Dardest Things*.

One little boy wanted to be a doctor when he grew up and Art asked him how he would cure various ailments*. *His reoccurring answer was with "a shot", no matter the mildness or severity of the disease Art noted. In a moment of exasperation Art finally asked, "What if they had a runny nose?" The boys response? "I'd wipe it."

I wonder if the young lads name was Fauci? 'Cause no matter what strain of Chinese coronavirus you have, from Alpha to Mu and beyond, his response is yet one more "vaccine".

Ran across this comment over at JoNava:



> “The protected need to be protected from the unprotected by forcing the unprotected to use the protection that didn’t protect the protected.”


<sniff> 'Bout right...


----------



## groovetube

It’s about reducing the impact of the unvaccinated overwhelming our hospitals. Not protecting the vaccinated. I guess some are too enthralled with what they’re being told on social media and their local coffee shops (or wherever) You would think the current crisis in Alberta would make this clear, but I guess some have far too much personal pride to admit they were wrong about this. Unfortunately Kenny took too long to admit he was wrong and people are now losing their lives. But, at least he did admit it.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> I recall reading a book years ago based on a segment of Art Linkletter's _House Party _TV show titled *Kids Say The Dardest Things*.
> 
> One little boy wanted to be a doctor when he grew up and Art asked him how he would cure various ailments*. *His reoccurring answer was with "a shot", no matter the mildness or severity of the disease Art noted. In a moment of exasperation Art finally asked, "What if they had a runny nose?" The boys response? "I'd wipe it."
> 
> I wonder if the young lads name was Fauci? 'Cause no matter what strain of Chinese coronavirus you have, from Alpha to Mu and beyond, his response is yet one more "vaccine".


I fail to understand the disparaging of naturally developed immunity. Normal quarantine involves placing people susceptible to death in isolation. Instead we've seen the failure of trying to isolate everyone. Given the profile of people likely to die — the elderly and ill, plus the obese — developing natural immunity would have offered far greater protection among low-risk populations at no cost. Average age of COVID death in Alberta has been holding at 79 to 80 years old.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> Ran across this comment over at JoNava:
> 
> “The protected need to be protected from the unprotected by forcing the unprotected to use the protection that didn’t protect the protected.”


Mostly the fallout from this Tweet by the nimble-minded Kamala Harris:








:


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> I fail to understand…


I think we got it in the first few words

LOL


----------



## Macfury

The new names for these drugs certainly show who has gone to marketing school.

I always liked the name of the Russian drug, Sputnik 5. COMIRNATY and Vaxzevria are true marketing failures. The winnah is... Moderna's SpikeVax!


----------



## MacDoc

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-severe-outcomes-covid-vaccination-1.6178449


----------



## FeXL

Macfury said:


> I fail to understand the disparaging of naturally developed immunity.


Ditto. I fail to understand the logic in the lion's share of the Chinese coronavirus decisions. Far more about politics & control than healthcare. Idiots, the most of them. As are their _sycophantic_  defenders...

Sent a sayonara letter to my MLA late Wed evening after the announcement. Still haven't received the courtesy of a reply. I keep kidding myself it's because he's so busy answering all the others who beat me to it. 

The races were good. Ended up going late because qualifying had been rained out the day before & they had to run both that & eliminations in one day. Some of them running low 7's at close to 200mph!

Gotta go grab a shower, have a few gov't dictats to break this weekend, along with attending a couple superspreader events. You know the type, massive birthday party on Nantucket Island, a fiery but mostly peaceful protest in Chicago, that sort of thing.


----------



## groovetube




----------



## groovetube

Indeed! Fire off those angry emails to your MLA! How dare they try to implement the policies that are working in other provinces that are keeping the impact to hospitals lower and avoiding lockdowns! Don’t they understand FWEEEEEUMB???

I mean, seriously!! How dare!


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> Sent a sayonara letter to my MLA late Wed evening after the announcement. Still haven't received the courtesy of a reply. I keep kidding myself it's because he's so busy answering all the others who beat me to it.


Maybe they had to pass the letter on to the RCMP. Just based on your posts here I'm sure it reads well...


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> I fail to understand the disparaging of naturally developed immunity. Normal quarantine involves placing people susceptible to death in isolation. Instead we've seen the failure of trying to isolate everyone. Given the profile of people likely to die — the elderly and ill, plus the obese — developing natural immunity would have offered far greater protection among low-risk populations at no cost. Average age of COVID death in Alberta has been holding at 79 to 80 years old.


I'd argue the only Canadian success in addressing COVID was the ability to isolate everyone. Canadians en mass listened and stayed home for the most part. The rest of the plan was abysmal. Numbers reflect that more than any other measure.


----------



## FeXL

Well, hullo, DH! 

Still smarting from your public humiliation on the GHG thread, so you figger you'll try your luck elsewhere? Fine. 

Man, sure is a lot of interest in little ol' Alberta's Chinese coronavirus numbers, no? Curious nobody is talking about Israel or India or Sweden. Lemme guess, those kind of success stories don't show up on the list of Prog-approved "news" sites...

At any rate, thx for the pretty graph from MotherCorpse. What it throws into sharp relief is that, despite people being partly & fully vaxed, more than 74/100,000 Albertans still contract the virus. If you believe that all these people were actually admitted to ICU (and here, from, of all places, the _Atlantic_!) for Chinese coronavirus, that is.

Just eyeballin, looks like under 10% for Alberta. 'Bout double that in Saskatchewan. Israel? Nearly 60% have been _fully_ vaccinated.

Huh.



MacDoc said:


> Blah, blah, blah...


----------



## FeXL

For what? Telling him that Kenney & Hinshaw are a couple of ****ing idiots? Bring it...



smashedbanana said:


> Maybe they had to pass the letter on to the RCMP. Just based on your posts here I'm sure it reads well...


----------



## Macfury

Yes, MacDoc, the elderly are also the largest group being admitted to ICUs. If you also adjust for obesity and pre-existing conditions, you'll see a pattern I think.


----------



## FeXL

Thousands of small businesses closed. Parents & grandparents unable to see their children & grandchildren. Children's sports shut down while pro's/semi-pro's carried on. Families of deceased people unable to have closure via a simple funeral. Depression & suicide rates at all ages skyrocketing. Children's education and socialization, especially those in elementary school and younger, suffering. Airports & Roxham Rd _never_ closed, bringing in Chinese coronavirus infected by the thousands all the while the rest of us were good little quiescent Canadians. Watching our betters not wearing masks, despite mask mandates. I could go on at length.

Yeah, that's _some_ success story.



smashedbanana said:


> I'd argue the only Canadian success in addressing COVID was the ability to isolate everyone.


----------



## MacDoc

> Well, hullo, DH!
> 
> Still smarting from your public humiliation on the GHG thread, so you figger you'll try your luck elsewhere? Fine.


ROFL...no public here just two denidiots on two fronts. The GHG wars were fought and won long ago by the science community ...I'm just shocked anyone is hanging on to a failed GHG denial meme.....like that Japanese soldier 

What to do about the problem still remains open to engineering solutions which Alberta might have a role to play....after stepping around the denier turds littering the landscape.
These days there's fine chance they are corpses from covid denial. Lots of those in the news.
Seems to go with the mindset.

Time for you to move on....
you are lagging even your provincial hosts and your federal fellow travelers on both fronts.

What are you going to tout next ?
...flat earth? Fake moon landings?? 9/11 conspiracy? QAnon?
I suppose class clowns are de rigueur in all forum
..they pose like they know what they are talking about ...much to our amusement.

Isn't really annoying to you when the world moves on without you ☕


----------



## Macfury

The GHG wars were fought by grifters who tax the middle class to feather their nests. They're being exposed daily for the frauds they are by real world data.



MacDoc said:


> ROFL...no public here just two denidiots on two fronts. The GHG wars were fought and won long ago by the science community


----------



## groovetube

Does anyone, think Kenny gives two ****s about some stinky arsed loud fart from the south?

BAH HA HA HA. Nope.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> The GHG wars were fought by grifters who tax the middle class to feather their nests. They're being exposed daily for the frauds they are by real world data.


Real world data???

AH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA


----------



## groovetube

I think macfury should WRITE HIS MPP TOOOO!!

yeah give them a piece of your mind! I knew these two were idiots before but man, this is priceless.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> View attachment 94152
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-severe-outcomes-covid-vaccination-1.6178449


Did you read that Alberta has had over 2000 news cases of CoVid in the last 24 hours? We’ll be triaging and sending patients three provinces away to Ontario soon. Stats over the last 120 days are not all that relevant at the moment.


----------



## FeXL

When even the FDA is back-pedaling...

*FDA advisory panel rejects widespread Pfizer booster shots to most Americans, endorses only for elderly, high-risk*




> Dealing the White House a stinging setback, a government advisory panel overwhelmingly rejected a plan Friday to give Pfizer COVID-19 booster shots across the board, and instead endorsed the extra vaccine dose only for those who are 65 or older or run a high risk of severe disease.


Brain dead response from the Chattering Class LLDB in 3, 2...


----------



## FeXL

Did you read that the PCR tests used to detect Chinese coronavirus produce up to 90% false positives?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Did you read that Alberta has had over 2000 news cases of CoVid in the last 24 hours?


----------



## FeXL

It's all coming back to me now...

Deny, distract, deflect.

Even when shown the error of your ways with your own Bible. 



MacDoc said:


> ROFL...no public here just two denidiots on two fronts.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Did you read that the PCR tests used to detect Chinese coronavirus produce up to 90% false positives?


Nope. Doesn’t really matter, though, when you’re health car system cannot handle the influx of new coronavirus patients, mainly unvaccinated. Pretending it’s all a hoax to force your compliance will not so be the problem. Covid19 is quite real whether you believe in it or not. Get vaccinated if you haven’t already.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Dude. They don’t care. You can tell them until you’re blue in the face. They’ll only laugh at you, barrage with more stupidity and stomp around like they win or something. Look at the total imbecile quoting the Israel ‘60% vaccinated’ thing. Obviously this fool never stopped to actually read more about those figures to understand the figures and learn that there’s a much larger story inside that tells a completely different story that he’s selling. That’s because it doesn’t read, it merely stomps its feet and posts headlines and thinks that it won the argument. It’s a moron.
> 
> And it’s mewling little bum buddy will be on you stat demanding you answer it’s incessant questions about how many beds does such and such hospital have.
> 
> guess that’s the price you pay for having a ‘web address’


Yes, but they’re fun to laugh at. Don’t expect any kind of informed intelligent response however.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Yes, but they’re fun to laugh at. Don’t expect any kind of informed intelligent response however.


Now it’s spewing unintelligible nonsense. The same debunked horse****. It doesn’t realize what an idiot it looks like doing so.

WAH the fda is backpedaling! No it bloody well ain’t you drama Queen, put down the horse dewormer and at least try to pay attention.


----------



## groovetube

FeXL said:


> It's all coming back to me now...
> 
> Deny, distract, deflect.
> 
> Even when shown the error of your ways with your own Bible.


Sounds like someone needs to write their MLA! You tell’em bub! Make sure you fart extra loud while yer at it!

BAH HA HA HA HA


----------



## groovetube

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/alberta-vaccinations-triple-1.6180529



Oh RLLY??

what is it with far right wing nut jobs that have to be dragged kicking and screaming to how to avoid overwhelming their hospitals and avoiding lockdowns?


----------



## groovetube

On the subject of Israel. Sometimes looking at just the headlines is for the feeble minded. Looking further into the numbers and understanding them, requires some reading, and some critical thought. But you'll still see them quoting surface stats and screaming victory, no matter how much reasoning you try to engage in. The only recourse, simply laugh at them.

From the Washington Post, which should make a few literally lose their ****.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/08/31/covid-israel-hospitalization-rates-simpsons-paradox/




> Is the vaccine wearing off? It’s an exhausting thought for those of us who believed the battle against covid-19 would be won once enough needles plunged into enough arms. But outbreaks of the delta variant have blossomed even in places with high levels of vaccination, including Israel, Britain and my own home of Madison, Wis. Recent reports from Israel that nearly 60 percent of people hospitalized with severe covid-19 were fully vaccinated raised particular alarms about the limits of the protection that vaccines provide.
> 
> While there is other evidence that the vaccines’ protection against _infection_ (not severe illness) declines over time — and also some evidence that booster shots work — we shouldn’t be overly concerned about the Israeli hospitalization statistics. The explanation involves a famous old statistical curveball called “Simpson’s paradox” — which isn’t really a paradox at all. It’s just a reminder of why you have to be careful with data.
> Simpson’s paradox is a warning that the whole of the data often looks weirdly different than the sum of its parts. In the case of Israel — as a number of epidemiologists and other scholars have pointed out — what explains the surprising hospitalization figures is largely the relative ages of vaccinated and unvaccinated people. The University of Pennsylvania biostatistician Jeffrey Morris wrote an especially thorough and widely shared blog post making this point — although the post was not shared nearly as widely as the worry that vaccines aren’t helping you stay out of the intensive care unit. Anxiety travels halfway around the world while a spreadsheet is still getting its boots on.
> Remember that a lot of Israelis are vaccinated, around 80 percent of the adult population. That’s important. If _everyone_were vaccinated, then all hospitalized people would be vaccinated — and that obviously wouldn’t mean vaccination was useless. In real-life Israel, as of Aug. 15 — using Morris’s summary of official data — 301 fully vaccinated people had an illness severe enough to require hospitalization. They represented just 53 out of every million fully vaccinated Israelis. At the same time, 214 hospitalized people were not vaccinated. Those people made up a much bigger fraction of the smaller population of unvaccinated people: 164 out of every million. So an unvaccinated Israeli is about three times as likely to end up in the hospital as their vaccinated compatriot.
> 
> But that’s not as impressive a difference as you might expect, is it? When we get that shot, we’re hoping for and expecting a lot heftier risk reduction than a factor of three. The really counterintuitive nugget at the heart of Simpson’s paradox lies deeper. I learned last summer, from mathematician Dana Mackenzie, a way to make the power of the “paradox” really clear. It has to do with racial differences in rates of covid-19 infection and deaths.
> 
> 
> As of July 2020, Mackenzie noted, confirmed cases of covid‑19 in the United States broke down along racial lines like this: 34.6 percent were Hispanic, 35.3 percent were non-Hispanic White and 20.8 percent were Black.
> The distribution of _deaths_ from covid‑19 looked different, however: 17.7 percent were Hispanic, 49.5 percent were non-Hispanic White and 22.9 percent were Black.
> These numbers are startling on their face if you know anything about health disparities in the United States, which in almost all cases involve differentially bad health outcomes for people of color. Why was the proportion of White deaths so high?
> 
> The answer is simple. White people with covid‑19 are more likely to die of covid‑19 because old people with covid‑19 are more likely to die of covid‑19, and White people tend to be old (relative to non-White people). Break down cases by age groups and things look completely different, Mackenzie noted. Among Americans between 18 and 29, in July 2020, White people made up 30 percent of covid‑19 cases but just 19 percent of the deaths. Among people 85 and up, 70 percent of covid‑19 cases and 68 percent of deaths were White people. In fact, within _every single_ age band of adults recorded by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, a covid‑19 case in a White person was less likely to be fatal than it would be for the typical American that age. Yet when you combine the groups together, the disease appears to be falling harder on White people because it was so much likelier to be fatal for the elderly, a group made up of a larger share of White people.
> Something very similar is happening in Israel. Vaccinated Israelis, like White Americans, are older as a group than unvaccinated Israelis. And _that’s_ why they’re going to the hospital at a rate higher than you might naively hope. Among Israeli adults under 50, as of Aug. 15, 3.5 million were vaccinated and 1.1 million were not. That’s still a considerable number of vaccine holdouts. Among those 3.5 million vaccinated younger people, just 11 were hospitalized — about three per million. Meanwhile, of the unvaccinated in this age range, 43 were in the hospital, or 39 per million.
> Note that hospitalizations of young people for both the vaccinated and unvaccinated are low, because younger people rarely suffer the severest illness from covid-19. Still, vaccination reduced the rate of hospitalization more than 10-fold in the population under 50.
> 
> Now look at the population 50 and older. There are 2.1 million vaccinated Israelis over 50, and 290 were in the hospital Aug. 15. That’s 136 per million, a rate that dwarfs anything younger people are experiencing. And unvaccinated older Israelis? There are very few people in that category: just 186,000. But of that group, 171 were hospitalized — a grievously higher rate of 919 per million. In the older population, vaccinated people were less than one-sixth as likely to be hospitalized as the unvaccinated.
> 
> 
> Clearly, the vaccines are impressively effective. Still, overall, more vaccinated Israelis were in the hospital than unvaccinated ones. This is a natural consequence of the fact that if you prioritize the most vulnerable people for vaccination — which is what you should do — then vaccinated people will be disproportionately drawn from the vulnerable population. That means more of them than you might otherwise expect will end up sick. (Since Aug. 15, the picture has changed somewhat: Israel now has more unvaccinated hospitalized patients than vaccinated hospitalized patients, possibly related to the rollout of booster doses at the end of July.)
> Compare the situation in Israel with that in Oklahoma, whose weekly epidemiology and surveillance report gives an admirably thorough breakdown of the state of the pandemic. In Oklahoma, nearly a quarter of people over 65 are not fully vaccinated, a far higher proportion than in Israel. That means there’s a huge reservoir of Oklahomans who enjoy neither the protection of youth nor mRNA technology. And that results in a lot of hospitalization in unvaccinated people. So in Oklahoma, fewer than 1 in 10 people hospitalized with covid-19 are vaccinated. That makes the vaccine look better at a glance than the statistics from Israel. But from the standpoint of public health, you’d still rather be in Tel Aviv than Tulsa.


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> Thousands of small businesses closed. Parents & grandparents unable to see their children & grandchildren. Children's sports shut down while pro's/semi-pro's carried on. Families of deceased people unable to have closure via a simple funeral. Depression & suicide rates at all ages skyrocketing. Children's education and socialization, especially those in elementary school and younger, suffering. Airports & Roxham Rd _never_ closed, bringing in Chinese coronavirus infected by the thousands all the while the rest of us were good little quiescent Canadians. Watching our betters not wearing masks, despite mask mandates. I could go on at length.
> 
> Yeah, that's _some_ success story.


Good work reading what I said.

Cocked and ready to pounce as usual.

I said isolation was the only measure that worked, and it worked because Canadians did it. Not because the government had anything to do with it.

But ya hang all that on what I said. Even airports. 

I'll play your game.

You aren't dead, have long haul or any loss of smell or taste. Why's that?


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> Did you read that the PCR tests used to detect Chinese coronavirus produce up to 90% false positives?


Nonsense!

Produce a source that isn't a reddit thread.


----------



## groovetube

They’ve been trotting out a pile of nonsensical crap and repeating it for months. Not once have any of them produced any credible sources, instead crying about ‘government control’ or some feeble excuse about some narrative that never gets explained, shown, much less proven in any way. They act as though the medical community and the government are all one in the same. That right there should illustrate what geniuses they really are.

The situation in Alberta is a hard blow to their theories. But I wouldn’t expect any back pedaling whatsoever from these guys. Jason Kenny may have admitted his error but these guys won’t. I’d love to see what they do with the ‘letter’ arriving at the MLA’s office. My guess is when they see the sender it’s filed under “G”


----------



## FeXL

Our famous gov't controlled healthcare system has had near two years to prepare for this. And, instead, what have they done? Ignored all data & rational conversation on therapies outside of ****ing untested "vaccines". If, _if_, they were truly interested in reducing the numbers of sick, hospitalized & dead, they'd be throwing everything they had at this, including "horse dewormer", instead of putting all their eggs in one untested, very questionable basket.

What are they afraid of, Freddie? Looking like fools after investing so much time pushing the narrative? 'Cause right now, by ignoring working alternative treatments, they are putting people in those precious ICU's and killing others. That's what concerned citizens should be looking at now, not some ginned up ICU capacity number.

As far as your comment about "mainly unvaccinated" is concerned, the number of vaccinated being treated is rising the world over because the efficacy of the "vaccine" is short-lived. Hence the booster shots. In Florida (among several other states), they've been using an alternative treatment called monoclonal antibodies and Gov DeSantis notes that over 50% of the patients were fully vaccinated. Of course, Dementia Joe has just caught wind of this and has taken control of the supply situation. What could possibly go wrong?

One more thing: I can deal with rational converation on the topic, pro or con. However, if anybody seriously thinks that all the name-calling, mocking, yelling, screaming, lockdowns, passports, mandates, etc., are going to push me any closer to getting a "vaccine", they are sorely mistaken. All it will do is shore up my resolve.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Nope. Doesn’t really matter, though, when you’re health car system cannot handle the influx of new coronavirus patients, mainly unvaccinated.


----------



## FeXL

You wanna pick that scab? Fine. **** you. In January my family was prohibited _by the ****ing gov't_ the closure of a funeral for a loved one with more than 10 people attending, _including_ the ****ing preacher. That doesn't cover my immediate family, let alone distant family or friends. Don't tell me the gov't had nothing to do with anything.



smashedbanana said:


> I said isolation was the only measure that worked, and it worked because Canadians did it. Not because the government had anything to do with it.


Well, it sure as **** wasn't because I was locked down, I'll tell you that.



smashedbanana said:


> You aren't dead, have long haul or any loss of smell or taste. Why's that?


----------



## FeXL

First, you won't find me quoting reddit as a source, ever. I do not go there.

Second, I don't need to provide a source. I've been given absolution by none other than our very own, Freddie Biff. He's noted on these boards more than once that nobody reads my posts.

Third, I find it interesting that there are so many out there who see themselves as informed on the topic and yet, they actually know very little about it outside of their Prog approved reading list. None of this is news, people. Some of it has been known for well over a year. If you didn't know about the inaccuracy of PCR tests, maybe you should question where you get your information from.

Fourth, here's your links. I hope a study conducted by the NYT is considered acceptable:
*Up to 90% of PCR Tests for COVID-19 May Be False Positives*
*Fauci knew PCR tests up to 90% false positives in March 2020 and didn’t speak up*
*“Worthless PCR Tests for COVID. “Almost all” PCR Tests Produce False Positives”*

Re: 2nd headline. I believe it's inaccurate in the sense that although Fauci was made aware of the false positives very early on, the data on the 90% number wasn't reached until later.



smashedbanana said:


> Nonsense!
> 
> Produce a source that isn't a reddit thread.


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> You wanna pick that scab? Fine. **** you.


Nice!

It’s all my fault eh. Cool to talk to me that way?

You are repugnant. Get bent!


----------



## groovetube

They complain because I’ve been handing that crap back in their face. I recall the bragging about “giving as good as it’s given”. Apparently, the crying starts when you talk back at them the same way, using the same trolling techniques, even their very words. Amazing how they suddenly get so thin skinned they lash out.

he declares he doesn’t need to provide sources. Well of course he did. Then he goes on to provide bull**** links, the NYT one isn’t actually a NYT link, of course, but some nonsensical website that incorrectly summarized a NYT article from aug 2020 about the sensitivity of PCR tests which didn’t say at all that 90% of PCR tests were all ‘false positives’. But these idiots never read past the headlines and then declare they don’t need proof.


----------



## FeXL

Oh, I know, I know: VICTIM!!! Start losing the argument & suddenly you're the affronted one. LLDB did it for years on these boards.

Lessee, how did this go?

First you make some BS claim about how all us good little Canucks _voluntarily_ isolated & locked ourselves down and how good it was for _everyone_.
Next, I give you a number of examples illustrating precisely why it wasn't good for most people, why it was gov't mandated, plus shining bonus examples of gov't hypocrisy during the mandates.
Then you come back citing the same argument.
Then I give you an example of a particular sore spot with me, _again_ illustrating the fact that there was gov't interference from day one, and again, refuting your original claim.
And, because of that, I'm the bad guy.

Is that about right?

Fine. I can live with that.

You push & you push & you push and then you feign wonderment when you get a reaction. 

FWIW, at no point did I put any of this on you. Clearly my posts pointed the finger directly at, you guessed it, the _gov't_.

Enjoy reading the links about PCR test uselessness.



smashedbanana said:


> Nice!
> 
> It’s all my fault eh. Cool to talk to me that way?
> 
> You are repugnant. Get bent!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Our famous gov't controlled healthcare system has had near two years to prepare for this. And, instead, what have they done? Ignored all data & rational conversation on therapies outside of ****ing untested "vaccines". If, _if_, they were truly interested in reducing the numbers of sick, hospitalized & dead, they'd be throwing everything they had at this, including "horse dewormer", instead of putting all their eggs in one untested, very questionable basket.
> 
> What are they afraid of, Freddie? Looking like fools after investing so much time pushing the narrative? 'Cause right now, by ignoring working alternative treatments, they are putting people in those precious ICU's and killing others. That's what concerned citizens should be looking at now, not some ginned up ICU capacity number.
> 
> As far as your comment about "mainly unvaccinated" is concerned, the number of vaccinated being treated is rising the world over because the efficacy of the "vaccine" is short-lived. Hence the booster shots. In Florida (among several other states), they've been using an alternative treatment called monoclonal antibodies and Gov DeSantis notes that over 50% of the patients were fully vaccinated. Of course, Dementia Joe has just caught wind of this and has taken control of the supply situation. What could possibly go wrong?
> 
> One more thing: I can deal with rational converation on the topic, pro or con. However, if anybody seriously thinks that all the name-calling, mocking, yelling, screaming, lockdowns, passports, mandates, etc., are going to push me any closer to getting a "vaccine", they are sorely mistaken. All it will do is shore up my resolve.


Sorry to hear you feel that way, but I believe I was already aware. Will vaccine passports affect your resolve? I would find ha I g my movements severely limited would be a good motivator to get “the jab.” More than a hundred dollar bribe would.


----------



## FeXL

Just a bunch of links. Read or ignore, at your leisure.

*At long last, there might be a COVID treatment leftists won't denigrate*

The above one is really funny, becasue the new treatment contains a protease inhibitor. Curiously, so does "horse dewormer"... But it's OK! Pfizer is making this one.

*NPR KEEPS UP THE PANIC PORN*

*If you like compulsory vaccinations, you'll love child labor and the Espionage Act*

*Soaring through the roof: Vaccine deaths skyrocket*

*The Pandemic – A Counter To The Narrative*

*Huge global media campaign promotes lies against safe and effective Ivermectin*

Huh. No wonder the Progs can't find any info on the Prog-approved reading list...

*“Two Faces of Fauci” — The Structure of the Pseudo-Scientific Covid Revolution*

*Study: Ivermectin ‘Exhibits Efficacy’ as Therapeutic for COVID*

*The Morning Briefing: COVID Panic Merchants Might Want to Try Not Lying*

*The Meaning of the FDA Resignations*




> How significant is it that the two top FDA officials responsible for vaccine research resigned last week and this week signed a letter in _The Lancet _that strongly warns against vaccine boosters?


Interesting, especially in light of the later news that the FDA didn't give full approval to boosters.

*Don't freak out about hospitals filled with COVID patients*

*Herron long-term care residents died of thirst, malnourishment, Quebec coroner’s inquest told*

*Oxford Study: Fully Vaccinated Healthcare Workers Carry 251 Times Viral Load, Pose Threat to Unvaccinated Patients, Co-Workers*

*“Rare”*

*Uttar Pradesh, India Announces State Is COVID-19 Free Proving the Effectiveness of “Deworming Drug” IVERMECTIN*

*Republicans in at least 26 states have rolled back public health powers amid pandemic*

It's a start...

*DEBUNKED: Researchers Say ‘Roughly Half’ Of Reported COVID Patients Were Admitted To Hospitals For ‘Another Reason’*

*Theresa Tam admits there is no evidence vaccine passports work*

Huh. A complete absence of evidence has never stopped the left from making evidence-based policy before...

*‘Science,’ They Said*

*When 19% Of New Covid Cases In 12+ Are Fully Vaccinated*

*Despite Despotic Measures, COVID Deaths Much Higher One Year Later*

*When It Comes to the Delta Variant, the Kids Are All Right*

*Good News!*




> Researchers in Israel reported on Wednesday that a third dose of the Pfizer-BioNTech coronavirus vaccine can prevent both infections and severe illness in adults older than 60 for at least 12 days.


Woohoo!

*Anthony Fauci Dismissed Masks in 2019 as a ‘Paranoid’ Tool*

*Another COVID ‘Fact’ Turns Out To Be A Wild Exaggeration*

Further on the _Atlantic_ article.

*Biden cuts off Republican states' supply of an important COVID treatment*

Further on Biden controlling the monoclonal antibody.

*Safe And Effective ®*


----------



## groovetube

It screams about others playing victim, but let’s all remember, he was the one with THE most epic drama Queen victim! display after his thread title was edited in this forum’s history. Always the first one to create threads, sometimes enmasse sounding like a forlorn deaf Siamese cat (I have one here so I know what they sound like!) screaming it’s poor little heady off.

God your pathetic.


----------



## groovetube

Whad I tell ya. All anyone is gonna get, is a total barrage of googled nonsensical BULL**** links and then some pathetic victory dance like it won.

Moronic. And totally useless.


----------



## FeXL

Not going to change a thing. Why? 'Cause I still don't trust the "vaccine". I'm not anti-"vaccine". I'm anti-untested "vaccine". No one knows the long-term effects of any of these. Nobody. Come up with a fully tested treatment with full approval and a history of safe, long-term use, I'm probably interested. Can you imagine the ****-show if this turns into another thalidomide?

As I noted earlier, I've still got places to ride. If craft breweries start asking for them, no biggie. I have half a dozen or so friends who brew a decent craft beer. I can brew myself, it wouldn't take much to get a batch going. We'll all sit together and ROTFL at the businesses shooting themselvs in the foot. What I can't pick up myself, I'll get delivered: groceries, sundries, supplies, tools, lumber, whatever. Amazon doesn't require a mask, a vax or a passport. I'd far rather support local but if they don't want my un-vaxxed $$, fine. Again, the businesses who follow this without protest will soon follow those the gov't has already killed off. I can still hit the mountains & hike, cave, climb, cross-country ski, canoe. I have lots of friends in different trades who are more than willing to come over & fix things for beer or cash that I can't take care of myself. Growing up in a farming community I have friends who, for beer or cash or just a good, home-cooked meal, will help out when needed, as well. We can buy a side of beef from one of them & grow our own veg. We already can a lot of fruit. I frequently bake my own bread. If push comes to shove and things get really ugly, I've got a sweet little piece of land with readily-accessible water where I could raise livestock & live off-grid. I could fish & hunt off my front doorstep.

The people who will suffer most from a passport are urban dwellers who have no one and/or no knowledge to fall back on. Frankly, that's fine with me because they are they ones begging for lockdown procedures in the first place. Give them what they want, good & hard.

On this we agree: the hunnert $ bill, as well as vaccine lotteries and various other attempts to woo the unwashed masses, are a crock. IMO, it completely & entirely delegitimizes the so-called reasons to get jabbed. If this is truly an international emergency, so be it. Don't cheapen that message by turning it into a game.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Will vaccine passports affect your resolve? I would find ha I g my movements severely limited would be a good motivator to get “the jab.” More than a hundred dollar bribe would.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

FeXL said:


> Not going to change a thing. Why? 'Cause I still don't trust the "vaccine". I'm not anti-"vaccine". I'm anti-untested "vaccine". No one knows the long-term effects of any of these. Nobody. Come up with a fully tested treatment with full approval and a history of safe, long-term use, I'm probably interested. Can you imagine the ****-show if this turns into another thalidomide?
> 
> As I noted earlier, I've still got places to ride. If craft breweries start asking for them, no biggie. I have half a dozen or so friends who brew a decent craft beer. I can brew myself, it wouldn't take much to get a batch going. We'll all sit together and ROTFL at the businesses shooting themselvs in the foot. What I can't pick up myself, I'll get delivered: groceries, sundries, supplies, tools, lumber, whatever. Amazon doesn't require a mask, a vax or a passport. I'd far rather support local but if they don't want my un-vaxxed $$, fine. Again, the businesses who follow this without protest will soon follow those the gov't has already killed off. I can still hit the mountains & hike, cave, climb, cross-country ski, canoe. I have lots of friends in different trades who are more than willing to come over & fix things for beer or cash that I can't take care of myself. Growing up in a farming community I have friends who, for beer or cash or just a good, home-cooked meal, will help out when needed, as well. We can buy a side of beef from one of them & grow our own veg. We already can a lot of fruit. I frequently bake my own bread. If push comes to shove and things get really ugly, I've got a sweet little piece of land with readily-accessible water where I could raise livestock & live off-grid. I could fish & hunt off my front doorstep.
> 
> The people who will suffer most from a passport are urban dwellers who have no one and/or no knowledge to fall back on. Frankly, that's fine with me because they are they ones begging for lockdown procedures in the first place. Give them what they want, good & hard.
> 
> On this we agree: the hunnert $ bill, as well as vaccine lotteries and various other attempts to woo the unwashed masses, are a crock. IMO, it completely & entirely delegitimizes the so-called reasons to get jabbed. If this is truly an international emergency, so be it. Don't cheapen that message by turning it into a game.


So how many years are you willing to wait before the CoVid vaccines are approved to your satisfaction? What if you contract Covid and die in the meantime while you’re waiting? I understand the thalidomide concerns, certainly, but I think this is watched a lot more closely worldwide. There are billions of people who have been vaxxed already which provides a very good reference for the vaccines’ effectiveness. I know it gives me much reassurance when I go in to work with people every day.


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> The people who will suffer most from a passport are urban dwellers who have no one and/or no knowledge to fall back on. Frankly, that's fine with me because they are they ones begging for lockdown procedures in the first place. Give them what they want, good & hard.


Ever had an accurate replica of a light sabre waved in your general direction? There are some real urban badasses begging for passports!


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> Oh, I know, I know: VICTIM!!! Start losing the argument & suddenly you're the affronted one. LLDB did it for years on these boards.
> 
> Lessee, how did this go?
> 
> First you make some BS claim about how all us good little Canucks _voluntarily_ isolated & locked ourselves down and how good it was for _everyone_.
> Next, I give you a number of examples illustrating precisely why it wasn't good for most people, why it was gov't mandated, plus shining bonus examples of gov't hypocrisy during the mandates.
> Then you come back citing the same argument.
> Then I give you an example of a particular sore spot with me, _again_ illustrating the fact that there was gov't interference from day one, and again, refuting your original claim.
> And, because of that, I'm the bad guy.
> 
> Is that about right?
> 
> Fine. I can live with that.
> 
> You push & you push & you push and then you feign wonderment when you get a reaction.
> 
> FWIW, at no point did I put any of this on you. Clearly my posts pointed the finger directly at, you guessed it, the _gov't_.
> 
> Enjoy reading the links about PCR test uselessness.


No it's not about right at all.

You don't get a pass on any of your behaviour. You don't get to just say **** you and then pretend I'm the one with the issue. That doesn't stand in the real world. Unless maybe you do get punched in the face a lot. 

I commented about something MF said. Not you. 

I said Canadians isolated and but extension that was the only successful measure that had impact on COVID numbers. Did I even say voluntary? Nope! But it wasn't exactly involuntary either. There were no military blockades or gestapo like organizations to rat out your neighbors. By and large Canadians saw the reasoning and took on the heavy lifting. As you mentioned there were many, many side affects. But I was discussing in terms of covid effacy and you knew that.

I didn't even say anything positive about the government. I said that the "plan" was abysmal.

I'm not reading anything about PCR tests so not even sure what you are getting at there. I'm sure your links are super solid though. Just like your stuff on VAERs.


----------



## groovetube

God this is ridiculous. On one hand we have a loud mouthed drama Queen barraging people with nonsense repeatedly, on the other we have a troll prancing with glee that everybody somehow really wants all this lockdown vaccine passport stuff.

Glad to see the regular usuals so into ‘reasonable discussion’.

Meanwhile, in the real world, the majority of us are just trying to navigate a really ****ty world pandemic and try to get back to a sort of normal without killing more people than nessecary. God is that too much to ask??


----------



## MacDoc

Covid is spinning up a humour genre











> BALTIMORE—A new study released Friday by researchers at Johns Hopkins University revealed that the novel coronavirus Covid-19 was frequently fooled by fake vaccine cards. “We found that when presented with a counterfeit vaccination card, Covid-19 was unable to distinguish it from the real thing approximately 7 out of 10 times,” said researcher Sharon Hirschinger, who noted that the study provided “strong and promising evidence” that the falsified records could provide significant protection against the novel coronavirus when presented by unvaccinated individuals gathering at restaurants, concerts, nightclubs. “It’s easily deceived. Just flash your card and the virus won’t know the difference. In terms of reducing the risk of contracting Covid-19 and experiencing its most severe symptoms, including hospitalization and even death, this study confirms that fake vaccination cards are practically the next best thing to getting vaccinated.”


----------



## Macfury

MacDoc said:


> Covid is spinning up a humour genre


It has been for some time!









Biden Unveils Six-Point Plan To End COVID, America As We Know It


WASHINGTON, D.C.—President Joe Biden unveiled Thursday an ambitious six-point plan to both end the threat of COVID-19 and completely dismantle the liberty-loving United States as we all know it.“We face two big threats,” Biden said at a press conference, “the coronavirus and individual freedom...




babylonbee.com


----------



## groovetube

Except one was actually funny, the other just some right wing slugfest rather than humor.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> Covid is spinning up a humour genre


That’s pretty witty! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Macfury

Looks like this guy with the "scietist" sign has come clean. He was a ringer who spelled it that way on purpose.


----------



## MacDoc

> Italy requires COVID-19 pass for *all workers* beginning Oct. 15











As Alberta’s health-care system faces collapse, one ICU doctor is taking his battle outside the hospital’s walls


Dr. Darren Markland is sad and frustrated even as he devotes more time to caring for COVID patients. But “never did I think people would be mad at me” for doing my job.




www.thestar.com


----------



## MacDoc

This nonsense about "experimental" is getting old

Experimental?  ...hardly..go to some quality sources









The tangled history of mRNA vaccines


Hundreds of scientists had worked on mRNA vaccines for decades before the coronavirus pandemic brought a breakthrough.




www.nature.com






snip


> *The big question*
> Was the science behind the COVID-19 vaccines rushed?
> 
> *The quick answer*
> The science behind the new COVID-19 vaccines has not been rushed. In fact, these vaccines are building on decades of scientific research.
> 
> The story involves hundreds of people all over the world and highlights the importance of fundamental and applied research. Advancements in our understanding of messenger RNA (mRNA) and its potential for use in medicines, along with the creation of new technologies over the last 30 years, made these vaccines possible. Recent research on coronaviruses, in particular, made these vaccines effective.


lots more




__





The long road to mRNA vaccines - CIHR







cihr-irsc.gc.ca


----------



## TiltAgain

FeXL said:


> Just a bunch of links. Read or ignore, at your leisure.
> 
> _SNIP_
> 
> *Uttar Pradesh, India Announces State Is COVID-19 Free Proving the Effectiveness of “Deworming Drug” IVERMECTIN*
> 
> _SNIP_


I have nothing to contribute to this debate; but I do have a comment on this link you included.

Uttar Pradesh is a state ruled by the same militant-religious fanatic ruling party in power the federal government. They are the same party who propagate that drinking cow-urine prevents/cures any disease that ever existed or will exist.

The people of UP are also among the least educated and among the poorest in the country and they're kept that way by the government because they are also the most populous state and are the major vote-bank in the country.

They're (both the people of UP and the political party) as militantly fanatic and fundamentalist and ruthless about propagating Hinduism as are the people the world refers to as Mulsim-terrorists and fanatics - to the extent of blatantly lynching and doing other despicable things to anyone whose opinion does not very vocally mirrors theirs. And they will do this openly in broad daylight with hundreds of witnesses with video evidence and they will never ever get arrested or prosecuted.

The media (all of them) in India have also been muzzled to such an extent that if they (or anyone in UP) says the sun rises in the East, it is enough to convince me that it rises in the West.

Any person (journalist or otherwise) who says anything that is not gushingly positive about the government and the politicians of the major party will immediately get raided by the Income Tax department, the Intelligence Department, by the cops, by anybody and everybody, they will find that they're charged with an archaic British-era Sedition law that charges the persons with treason against the country, for which they can be kept in prison for any amount of time with no appeal even for bail or even to be heard in a court of law etc.

The publication's licence or TV stations will suddenly and immediately be revoked and will never be reinstated.

Courts are no help because the government has that too under captive control.

So, any link you show about UP (or a neighbouring state "Bihar") needs to be outright disregarded as 100% false.

I have no comment or opinion about any of the other links or even the debate in this thread.

Cheers


----------



## Macfury

We know mRNA technology has been around for awhile, MacDoc. It doesn't mean that all mRNA drugs rushed into production will demonstrate a long-term safety profile without appropriate trials.

Your straw men are getting old.



MacDoc said:


> This nonsense about "experimental" is getting old
> 
> Experimental?  ...hardly..go to some quality sources
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The tangled history of mRNA vaccines
> 
> 
> Hundreds of scientists had worked on mRNA vaccines for decades before the coronavirus pandemic brought a breakthrough.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nature.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> snip
> 
> lots more
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The long road to mRNA vaccines - CIHR
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cihr-irsc.gc.ca


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> Looks like this guy with the "scietist" sign has come clean. He was a ringer who spelled it that way on purpose.


"has come clean"? HAH! Everyone knew the day of. It was on the news. He didn't hide the fact he was spoofing. See this is why you shouldn't be posting humor links...


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> We know mRNA technology has been around for awhile, MacDoc. It doesn't mean that all mRNA drugs rushed into production will demonstrate a long-term safety profile without appropriate trials.
> 
> Your straw men are getting old.


First, learn the definition of straw men before trying to use it. Second, you and your pals are full of ****. As someone who likely got the jab, what the hell are you on about? And on top of that, you and your pals are pushing other drugs such as the monoclonals that not only do not have long term safety profiles but are still only emergency use authorized. The amount of safety data on the vaccines dwarf those, and that's the understatement.

So can the brainless stupidity.


----------



## groovetube

TiltAgain said:


> I have nothing to contribute to this debate; but I do have a comment on this link you included.
> 
> Uttar Pradesh is a state ruled by the same militant-religious fanatic ruling party in power the federal government. They are the same party who propagate that drinking cow-urine prevents/cures any disease that ever existed or will exist.
> 
> The people of UP are also among the least educated and among the poorest in the country and they're kept that way by the government because they are also the most populous state and are the major vote-bank in the country.
> 
> They're (both the people of UP and the political party) as militantly fanatic and fundamentalist and ruthless about propagating Hinduism as are the people the world refers to as Mulsim-terrorists and fanatics - to the extent of blatantly lynching and doing other despicable things to anyone whose opinion does not very vocally mirrors theirs. And they will do this openly in broad daylight with hundreds of witnesses with video evidence and they will never ever get arrested or prosecuted.
> 
> The media (all of them) in India have also been muzzled to such an extent that if they (or anyone in UP) says the sun rises in the East, it is enough to convince me that it rises in the West.
> 
> Any person (journalist or otherwise) who says anything that is not gushingly positive about the government and the politicians of the major party will immediately get raided by the Income Tax department, the Intelligence Department, by the cops, by anybody and everybody, they will find that they're charged with an archaic British-era Sedition law that charges the persons with treason against the country, for which they can be kept in prison for any amount of time with no appeal even for bail or even to be heard in a court of law etc.
> 
> The publication's licence or TV stations will suddenly and immediately be revoked and will never be reinstated.
> 
> Courts are no help because the government has that too under captive control.
> 
> So, any link you show about UP (or a neighbouring state "Bihar") needs to be outright disregarded as 100% false.
> 
> I have no comment or opinion about any of the other links or even the debate in this thread.
> 
> Cheers


Thanks Tilt. This isn't a surprise to me, but great to hear this from someone who knows. Thankfully these guys haven't been pushing drinking cow-urine, but there's still time I guess  Cheers.
.
.
.
.

Still awaiting actual proof that India cured their population of covid with horse dewormer. I'm sorry Ivermectin!  All we've seen so far, is pathetic right wing mouth pieces pushing nothing but unsubstantiated nonsense quoting "some doctor", often we discover is twisted crap to get clicks. This is not proof.

Let's see some real, peer reviewed science, the clinical trials. We have a mealy mouthed little **** running around here mewling about how the vaccine doesnt have enough clinical trials or a safety profile for him (idiot) but wants to push Ivermectin without so much as a shred of real peer reviewed science. Or other drugs that have even less clinical data and aren't even fully authorized yet. Said idiot is likely vaxxed!! HA HA HA HA! So lets end the stupidity here.

Put up, or shut up. Barrages of bull**** links will just show you have zero.


----------



## groovetube

Apparently Tucker Carlson of Fox News is obsessed with this story


----------



## MacDoc

Maybe he has shares in a funeral home...


----------



## MacDoc

0uch


> *Premier Jason Kenney implored to seek military backup as Alberta health-care system crumbles
> 
> 'The tank is empty. The well is dry,' states letter from four union leaders*
> CBC News · Posted: Sep 19, 2021 9:47 AM MT | Last Updated: 2 hours ago
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dr. Ayesha Khory is pictured in the moments before intubating a COVID-19 patient in an Alberta intensive care unit. Unions representing health-care workers say support from the military and Red Cross is necessary. (AHS)
> 913
> comments
> With Alberta's health-care system "collapsing right in front of our eyes," the leaders of four unions representing thousands of health-care workers are calling on Premier Jason Kenney to ask for help from the military and Red Cross.
> "There are no more nurses in our province who can be deployed. There are no more paramedics. There are no more respiratory therapists. There are no more support staff," states the Sept. 18 letter to Kenney, which implores him to make a formal request for help from Prime Minister Justin Trudeau.
> "The tank is empty. The well is dry."


----------



## FeXL

It's my understanding that final testing won't be completed until 2023. Personally, I'm going to need 5 years minimum after that before I have any confidence that the current vaccines aren't going to cause long term harm. I'm fairly confident other options will be available long before that, including trust in HCQ & "horse-dewormer". 

If I contract it, I'll deal with it the best I can with what I have available at the time. Survival rate for my age group is good. If I do contract it, at least I'll have the antibodies which is far more effective against future infections than any "vaccine". If it kills my ass, then I guess it was my time. I noted earlier, I'm not going to live my life in abject terror. I honestly don't personally know anyone who has died from Chinese coronavirus (not that it would change my opinion on the "vaccines"). Friends of friends only. I do know probably a couple dozen who were infected and their symptoms ranged from very mild to severe, with the severe the minority. Most of them ranged in age from 40 to ~60, with a couple children and a few 20-somethings.

As to your observation about effectiveness, from what I read the "vaccine" _can_ reduce your chances of becoming infected and _can_ reduce symptoms but it does _not_ prevent you from contracting it, depending on who you believe. The efficacy wears off after a few months, requiring boosters which means even more toxic spike proteins gathering in your organs, something I am most defintely _not_ comfortable with. And, every time the virus mutates, it's questionable how effective the jab will be (see delta in Israel). Yes, billions of people who have been vaccinated in less than a year and, frankly, the short term data is something less than reassuring. More people have died from Chinese coronavirus jabs than any other vaccine, ever. And there's _still_ no long term data.



Freddie_Biff said:


> So how many years are you willing to wait before the CoVid vaccines are approved to your satisfaction? What if you contract Covid and die in the meantime while you’re waiting? I understand the thalidomide concerns, certainly, but I think this is watched a lot more closely worldwide. There are billions of people who have been vaxxed already which provides a very good reference for the vaccines’ effectiveness. I know it gives me much reassurance when I go in to work with people every day.


----------



## FeXL

TiltAgain said:


> I have nothing to contribute to this debate; but I do have a comment on this link you included.


Hey, Tilt!

'Sup?

Appreciate the feedback, thx.

Any plans to head back to Canuckistan soon? Way overdue for beer, it's been too long.

Take care.


----------



## groovetube

First off, no one taking the vaccine is living in abject terror. Don’t be such an idiot. Second, the vaccine efficacy does not get lost after a couple months. That’s pure bull****. There’s a reason the FDA rejected that. Lastly, no one is forcing you to take the vaccine. That’s the rub here. Don’t want it? Don’t take it. Don’t act like it’s some kind of gestapo nonsense that’s just being a pure drama Queen. But the medical experts have called for guidelines to be followed, since the sort of **** you and your pals have supported has clearly resulted in a major healthcare crisis in your province, so you will have to abide by said policies. Should you contract it, good luck. I’ve lost 3 good friends in our age range. One had amputations until he died, and he was only 41 no health problems whatsoever. Another was dead in 8 days. He was a great guy and a great singer. I can’t say I understand why someone would be more concerned about a vaccine that has a mountain of safety data at this point and falls for a bunch of right wing nonsense about it, but will gladly have a drug with far less safety data and only emergency authorized pumped into their veins, but that’s your choice. And still is. 

I will however, go after pure bull****. Such as the pure bull**** about the number of people dying from the vaccine. Just stop spreading these pathetic unsubstantiated craps. You haven’t posted a single shred of anything credible to prove any of it. Zero.


----------



## groovetube

I’m sure we’ll see a barrage of ‘links’ to right wing conspiracy nonsense sites declaring the vaccines a failure, despite a mountain of evidence in the real world that says otherwise (gotta keep that click revenue pumpin!) there are a few relatively reasonable explanations on the topic of lowering antibodies and the topic of boosters out there by medical experts worth noting. This is a decent explanation. 'Waning immunity?' Experts say term leads to false understanding of COVID-19 vaccines

While there’s plenty of the chicken little stuff being sent around the facebooks, all those piles of links are pretty much, worthless. The game seems to be about who can yell loudest in the conspiracy theory world. Intelligent!


----------



## groovetube

Ha ha ha!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> 0uch


Thanks, Jason Kenney. What a cluster****.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> I’m sure we’ll see a barrage of ‘links’ to right wing conspiracy nonsense sites declaring the vaccines a failure, despite a mountain of evidence in the real world that says otherwise (gotta keep that click revenue pumpin!) there are a few relatively reasonable explanations on the topic of lowering antibodies and the topic of boosters out there by medical experts worth noting. This is a decent explanation. 'Waning immunity?' Experts say term leads to false understanding of COVID-19 vaccines
> 
> While there’s plenty of the chicken little stuff being sent around the facebooks, all those piles of links are pretty much, worthless. The game seems to be about who can yell loudest in the conspiracy theory world. Intelligent!


The vaccines are by far the best antidote so far. Far better than horse dewormer and fish tank cleaner, for example, or gargling with iodine. I wonder if conspiracy theorists even know what’s in ivermectin? I sure don’t.


----------



## FeXL

One more thing on effectiveness.

If you do come across a suspected idiot spouting off that the "vaccine" doesn't lose efficacy, ask them, "Why booster shots then?" While they are sputtering about that, show them this little gem from none other than that holiest of Chinese coronavirus resources, the CDC:


> In contrast, a “booster dose” refers to another dose of a vaccine that is given to someone who built enough protection after vaccination, but then that protection decreased over time (this is called waning immunity).


If they're still mouthing off, then you have a confirmed idiot on your hands. 



Freddie_Biff said:


> There are billions of people who have been vaxxed already which provides a very good reference for the vaccines’ effectiveness.


----------



## FeXL

Can't claim to speak for conspiracy theorists, but I do know ivermectin has protease inhibitors, the same as Pfizer's newly developed treatment. Curious, that...



Freddie_Biff said:


> I wonder if conspiracy theorists even know what’s in ivermectin? I sure don’t.


----------



## groovetube

FeXL said:


> One more thing on effectiveness.
> 
> If you do come across a suspected idiot spouting off that the "vaccine" doesn't lose efficacy, ask them, "Why booster shots then?" While they are sputtering about that, show them this little gem from none other than that holiest of Chinese coronavirus resources, the CDC:
> 
> If they're still mouthing off, then you have a confirmed idiot on your hands.


Stuck a nerve did I! BAH HA HA HA HA. How long will it be before you start talking up the virtues of cow urine?
You’ve lost credibility with all the lunatic right wing conspiracy theories a long time ago. So your belly aching is worthless around here. ‘cept maybe your mewling little pal who should along here any minute now…


----------



## groovetube

Speaking of mewling little trolls…










BAH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA DUMBASSES! Y’all bein played! HA HA HA HA HA


----------



## TiltAgain

FeXL said:


> Hey, Tilt!
> 
> 'Sup?
> 
> Appreciate the feedback, thx.
> 
> Any plans to head back to Canuckistan soon? Way overdue for beer, it's been too long.
> 
> Take care.


Hey old friend 

All as well here as can be, with all the usual clowns (including me) doing the usual things.

Nah, no specific plans to move back - cannot afford to live there without a high income. Cheaper to live here as an unemployed loafer 

Doing a lot of road-trips, following all safety precautions of course - and am now buying an off-roader Wrangler knock-off.

Beers yeah - I still reminisce with my wife about our meet where KC4 showed up too.

I am quite enjoying the back-and-forth here in this thread.

Cheers man


----------



## TiltAgain

groovetube said:


> _SNIP_
> 
> Still awaiting actual proof that India cured their population of covid with horse dewormer. I'm sorry Ivermectin!  All we've seen so far, is pathetic right wing mouth pieces pushing nothing but unsubstantiated nonsense quoting "some doctor", often we discover is twisted crap to get clicks. This is not proof.
> _SNIP_


There's no proof that India has "cured" Corona, whether with Ivermecin or anything else. In fact, other than that one link FeXL posted re. Uttar Pradesh, I have not heard any news here on TV or even among the people (friends, relatives, social circle etc.) even mention Ivermectin anywhere. India is a place where even the smallest rumour gets discussed thoroughly by everybody on WhtsApp or in person, so the absence of any mention of Ivermectin in that grapevine is unusual if the quoted newspapers did mention it.

And that same link mentioned the State of Kerala having the highest Covid numbers. One fact that is well-known here is that Kerala is the only state in India that actually not only does rigorous testing, but publishes actual numbers whereas the other states openly produce false numbers to make the government look good. Kerala by the way is not ruled by the fundamentalist party I mentioned earlier.

Uttar Pradesh has put in a rule (all unofficial of course) that no positive tests are to be given - all test results necessarily should show a negative result. How do I know this? Friends of ours in Uttar Pradesh had symptoms got themselves tested, were given a negative report and told verbally by the doctor "You are actually positive, but we are told not to give positive results, so please isolate and take the usual precautions."

Cheers


----------



## Macfury

FeXL said:


> I noted earlier, I'm not going to live my life in abject terror.


I see that a lot among the "vax-holes." They try to hide their stark, raving fear under a flag of patriotism, civic-mindedness... or cat-spitting, windmill-armed attacks against anyone who didn't do as they did.


----------



## Macfury

As a Nobel-prize winning drug, it's worth reading up on.



Freddie_Biff said:


> I wonder if conspiracy theorists even know what’s in ivermectin? I sure don’t.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> As a Nobel-prize winning drug, it's worth reading up on.


Not really. I have no intention of taking horse dewormer. Thanks for the suggestion though.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I see that a lot among the "vax-holes." They try to hide their stark, raving fear under a flag of patriotism, civic-mindedness... or cat-spitting, windmill-armed attacks against anyone who didn't do as they did.


And what did you do, Macfury? Did you finally cave and get the vax? Are you a hypocrite who preaches one thing and does another?


----------



## Macfury

Why would learning about a life-saving drug mean you would have to take it? Ivermectin has cured thousands of people of blindness and parasitic infections. You might not laugh so hard if you were living in countries where you could die of these diseases.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Not really. I have no intention of taking horse dewormer. Thanks for the suggestion though.


----------



## Macfury

I don't preach anything. Get it if you think the benefits outweigh the risks. The end.



Freddie_Biff said:


> And what did you do, Macfury? Did you finally cave and get the vax? Are you a hypocrite who preaches one thing and does another?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I don't preach anything. Get it if you think the benefits outweigh the risks. The end.


Why are you so afraid to divulge this? Interesting.


----------



## groovetube

TiltAgain said:


> There's no proof that India has "cured" Corona, whether with Ivermecin or anything else. In fact, other than that one link FeXL posted re. Uttar Pradesh, I have not heard any news here on TV or even among the people (friends, relatives, social circle etc.) even mention Ivermectin anywhere. India is a place where even the smallest rumour gets discussed thoroughly by everybody on WhtsApp or in person, so the absence of any mention of Ivermectin in that grapevine is unusual if the quoted newspapers did mention it.
> 
> And that same link mentioned the State of Kerala having the highest Covid numbers. One fact that is well-known here is that Kerala is the only state in India that actually not only does rigorous testing, but publishes actual numbers whereas the other states openly produce false numbers to make the government look good. Kerala by the way is not ruled by the fundamentalist party I mentioned earlier.
> 
> Uttar Pradesh has put in a rule (all unofficial of course) that no positive tests are to be given - all test results necessarily should show a negative result. How do I know this? Friends of ours in Uttar Pradesh had symptoms got themselves tested, were given a negative report and told verbally by the doctor "You are actually positive, but we are told not to give positive results, so please isolate and take the usual precautions."
> 
> Cheers


I was pretty sure of that, but when someone repeatedly and loudly makes these declarations, I like to see real facts. But I always find the request for real facts often leads to, well, this 

I have heard some of the same things you've mentioned from friends who travel to India often for family and business. It sounds incredibly dicey, and truly hope you are doing well. It makes one really glad to live in a country like Canada, with hopefully a government that takes people's lives seriously. We have a situation here in Canada in Alberta where they have a provincial government that put politics over people's lives, and we are witnessing the results in real time, despite a few here who are doing their best to deflect and try to change the subject with all kinds of the same kind of nonsense that you are describing. We may end up with a federal leader today that subscribes to some of that similar crap, so these supporters better hope their lives or that of their loved ones and friends aren't lost due to that. This virus has shown time and again, it really doesn't give a rats ass what your politic is. For me, it's unfortunate to say the least, to see many who at the time of death expressing that they wished they didn't listen to the lies, and got the vaccine. This is one reason why I speak out, and I have absolutely no respect for those who got the vaccine, but continue to push these lies. It's disgusting!

Cheers.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Hypocrites.


It's beyond hypocrites. It's people's lives. They hide behind this 'its their choice', yet they participate in pushing these lies encase making it difficult for many to discern between fact and fiction. Many are dying because of it. Perhaps it isn't illegal to do that, but I do believe in a karma for these types of people.


----------



## Macfury

I'm very selective in the information I share with people who do not have my best interests at heart. 

I've never told anyone to take Ivermectin or any other drug, but I have noted that the two shots appear to keep vulnerable populations from dying or winding up in the ICU. What more do you want?



Freddie_Biff said:


> Why are you so afraid to divulge this? Interesting.


----------



## groovetube

that has to be about the most cowardly back-pedalling post as Ive ever seen out of you macfury. Sorry but there's pages of you winding people over ivermectin.

Either own it or just bloody well stop it. BTW I think we've figured out you're one of those who got vaxxed but are like those Fox News hosts, pulling the whole 'think for yourself' bull****.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Why are you so afraid to divulge this? Interesting.


There's really only one reason. 🤡


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> I see that a lot among the "vax-holes." They try to hide their stark, raving fear under a flag of patriotism, civic-mindedness... or cat-spitting, windmill-armed attacks against anyone who didn't do as they did.


I find this push back interesting.

What makes someone a vax-hole? 
Where does own's business and society, the greater good, or nationalism diverge or meet? 
If this was 1939 and people were pushing to join the war effort would they be -holes as well?


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> What makes someone a vax-hole?


It already has a definition:

vaxhole
A person who intentionally gloats or brags about their vaccination status in order to signal to others their moral superiority. Individuals who display this characteristic have a propensity to also display narcissism.
That customer came up to me and rambled on for five minutes about how they just got the covid vaccine and how important it is and how people who don't get it are evil. What a vaxhole.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> I find this push back interesting.
> 
> What makes someone a vax-hole?
> Where does own's business and society, the greater good, or nationalism diverge or meet?
> If this was 1939 and people were pushing to join the war effort would they be -holes as well?


Calling a COVID shot a "death jab" makes you a different type of hole.


----------



## groovetube

Well, I don’t see anyone feeling morally superior or ‘bragging’ they got the vaccine. Perhaps something the person throwing the term is projecting? So it’s curious this term ‘vax-hole’. It may say more about the person tossing the term than the people they’re mad at.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> As a Nobel-prize winning drug, it's worth reading up on.


So mr. 'Im not suggesting people take Ivermectin'... why would someone, in a covid virus thread no less, wish to 'read up on' Ivermectin?

Given that likely at this point, most people here are already quite aware that there is a human version that has been in use treat parasites, and that there hasn't been any real peer reviewed science showing that it has any efficacy in treating covid. Oh. You were just you know, sayin. Riiiiiight.

It seems to me, that you, as you have always done, are playing the troll card as usual, and when called on it quickly back pedals. Except I think we've all seen the antics...


----------



## FeXL

What? Masks not working?

*At least 860 people have died of COVID-19 in Ontario hospital outbreaks. What we now know about the 'unmitigated tragedy’*




> The total, contained in a Public Health Ontario (PHO) epidemiological summary updated earlier this month, means Ontario hospitals have been the province’s second-deadliest setting for COVID-19* outbreaks* in the pandemic


Bold mine.

h/t SDA, who noted, "It’s not the local hardware store and coffee shop?"

Exactly.

This comment nails it:



> So, is Alberta any different? The ‘pandemic’ a management problem. They are trying to misdirect, but it is bureaucratic mismanagement and CYA at the heart of it,


I found this response interesting, as well:




> Death percentages for Alberta of the vaccinated, over the last few months, as per AHS statistical data offered on their website:
> June – 23.44% (15 of 64),
> July – 28% (7 of 25),
> Aug – 45.76% (27 of 59),
> Sept (so far) – 41.88% (49 of 117).
> The majority of these deaths are in the 70+ and 80+ category. If you compare the daily ICU numbers by age group, against the daily change in deaths, it is noticeable that many in this age group that die do not make it into the ICU which raises some questions.
> Is part of this latest crises one of Covid-19 and break through cases in care homes? Are these people that are dying first in a home, and then being determined as Covid-19 cases post-mortem?




Nearly 1 in two in Aug/Sep. And, _and_, the "vaccinated" carry a viral load of COVID-19 251 times greater than the unvaccinated...potentially transforming them into presymptomatic superspreaders.



> This phenomenon may be the source of the shocking post-vaccination surges in heavily vaccinated populations globally.


Just who is infecting whom here?


----------



## groovetube

If you would have read the information I posted earlier using the example of Israel, it talks about why it seems that there is a higher percentage in the older age group that die even though they are vaccinated. You can’t just take numbers like that and draw conclusions without understanding them first. But if the premise one begins with is ‘vaccines don’t work’, it’s easy to pick off stats like those and make them suit. It does little to prove very much.

And I’m afraid ‘dr rich swier’ is hardly a credible source on, well pretty much anything. But he sure seems a fav of the lunatic anti-covid-vax right.


----------



## smashedbanana

FeXL said:


> Nearly 1 in two in Aug/Sep. And, _and_, the "vaccinated" carry a viral load of COVID-19 251 times greater than the unvaccinated...potentially transforming them into presymptomatic superspreaders.
> Just who is infecting whom here?


The paper's own authors have said their paper has been misrepresented. 

Study on breakthrough delta cases in Vietnam misrepresented online


----------



## groovetube

smashedbanana said:


> The paper's own authors have said their paper has been misrepresented.
> 
> Study on breakthrough delta cases in Vietnam misrepresented online


This seems to be a pattern. Wasn’t there another recent declaration that was based on a total misrepresentation of another paper with the author themselves speaking out on?


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> Why would learning about a life-saving drug mean you would have to take it? Ivermectin has cured thousands of people of blindness and parasitic infections. You might not laugh so hard if you were living in countries where you could die of these diseases.


Ivermectin has a very cool story. I mean who spends their time in the wild looking for bacteria, then finds it on a golf course. In short order collaborates with the world's for most expert on parasitic infections then into synthesis, trials, and then a truly effective treatment for parasitic infections. Thousands of people have been saved or had their lives improved by it.

Read as you want. But let's not kid ourselves. There are thousands of pharmaceuticals with interesting histories. We are not bringing this to the forefront because of it's story.

A study was done and it killed COVID19 in a petri dish.
That same study that said a toxic to lethal amount of Ivermectin would be needed in a human to be even possibly be effective.

Studies continue with Ivermectin. As they do with other antivirals (without the internet's help).


----------



## smashedbanana

groovetube said:


> This seems to be a pattern. Wasn’t there another recent declaration that was based on a total misrepresentation of another paper with the author themselves speaking out on?


Misrepresenting data has been pretty common. At least 2 papers that I know of. Add that to the withdrawn studies, the ones labelled irresponsible by peer review, and the ones with ethical concerns.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

And the hits just keep coming.


----------



## TiltAgain

groovetube said:


> _SNIP_
> 
> I have heard some of the same things you've mentioned from friends who travel to India often for family and business. It sounds incredibly dicey, and truly hope you are doing well.
> 
> _SNIP_
> 
> We have a situation here in Canada in Alberta...
> 
> _SNIP_
> 
> We may end up with a federal leader today that subscribes to some of that similar crap, so these supporters better hope their lives or that of their loved ones and friends aren't lost due to that._SNIP_


Yes, we are doing well, thank you for asking. We live in the southern part of India, far away from the uneducated and crass uncultured imbeciles of the North.

I am well aware of the Alberta situation - have been following it and the Ontario situation since I have nephews living in these provinces 

RE. a new Federal leader, I mailed in my vote and am eagerly watching the situation there too due to the same nephews 

Cheers


----------



## Freddie_Biff

TiltAgain said:


> Yes, we are doing well, thank you for asking. We live in the southern part of India, far away from the uneducated and crass uncultured imbeciles of the North.
> 
> I am well aware of the Alberta situation - have been following it and the Ontario situation since I have nephews living in these provinces
> 
> RE. a new Federal leader, I mailed in my vote and am eagerly watching the situation there too due to the same nephews
> 
> Cheers


Meet the new boss! Same as the old boss!


----------



## groovetube

TiltAgain said:


> Yes, we are doing well, thank you for asking. We live in the southern part of India, far away from the uneducated and crass uncultured imbeciles of the North.
> 
> I am well aware of the Alberta situation - have been following it and the Ontario situation since I have nephews living in these provinces
> 
> RE. a new Federal leader, I mailed in my vote and am eagerly watching the situation there too due to the same nephews
> 
> Cheers


Glad to hear. Yeah there are some provinces who get it, others unfortunately no. Unfortunate for the people who will have long standing health issues after recovering and those who die. Not to mention those who have had surgeries cancelled etc.

Yet another minority government pulling the trigger to try and get a majority. Useless in the end. People tend to support it if their party pulled it and gets ahead.


----------



## Macfury

I think it's a shame that such a drug is mow maligned as "horse medicine." That's why I brought up its history as a human grade, Nobel-prize winning pharmaceutical.



smashedbanana said:


> Ivermectin has a very cool story. I mean who spends their time in the wild looking for bacteria, then finds it on a golf course. In short order collaborates with the world's for most expert on parasitic infections then into synthesis, trials, and then a truly effective treatment for parasitic infections. Thousands of people have been saved or had their lives improved by it.
> 
> Read as you want. But let's not kid ourselves. There are thousands of pharmaceuticals with interesting histories. We are not bringing this to the forefront because of it's story.
> 
> A study was done and it killed COVID19 in a petri dish.
> That same study that said a toxic to lethal amount of Ivermectin would be needed in a human to be even possibly be effective.
> 
> Studies continue with Ivermectin. As they do with other antivirals (without the internet's help).


----------



## MacDoc

It IS horse medicine. And effective for parasites. Not to prevent or cure Covid.


----------



## Macfury

It is not primatrily "horse medicine. "It's on the WHO's list of "essential medications"— for humans.

And I did not say that I posess knowledge that it could cure or prevent COVID.



MacDoc said:


> It IS horse medicine. And effective for parasites. Not to prevent or cure Covid.


----------



## smashedbanana

Macfury said:


> I think it's a shame that such a drug is mow maligned as "horse medicine." That's why I brought up its history as a human grade, Nobel-prize winning pharmaceutical.


Fair point.

Horse dewormer makes for a more sensational headline I guess.


----------



## MacDoc

BTW the drug is not maligned ....my partner has prescribed it for appropriate use...people that take the drug for Covid are maligned.









sorryantivaxxer.com | stories of anti-vaxxers who died from COVID.


They thought COVID was a scam, until they lay dying from it. sorryantivaxxer.com tells their story using their own facebook and twitter posts.




www.sorryantivaxxer.com


----------



## groovetube

I think it’s because the misinformation like the other poster has been so furiously spewing here, has been sprayed all over the right wing lunatic sites, so much so that poison centers everywhere are overwhelmed with calls because these ignoramuses are actually buying horse dewormer and clearing out animal medicine supply places.

so one never knows what a right wing type spewing this **** is referring to.

I do enjoy the back pedaling after the attempted windups.

If there is some promise then by all means, run the clinical trials, let’s get peer reviewed science. But so far from what I have seen, subsequent trials has turned up nuthin.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> It is not primatrily "horse medicine. "It's on the WHO's list of "essential medications"— for humans.
> 
> And I did not say that I posess knowledge that it could cure or prevent COVID.


Parasites are considerably different from the CoVid virus LOL.  Ivermectin is primarily for horse parasites. Definitely not Covid. Give it up already.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Parasites are considerably different from the CoVid virus LOL.  Ivermectin is primarily for horse parasites. Definitely not Covid. Give it up already.


Bu-but dr iron horse discussed the importance of protease inhibitors!!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

That don’t do much for me.


----------



## groovetube

I mean all those things that have protease inhibitors in them, curious in’it?


----------



## MacDoc




----------



## Macfury

Even if you can't fix it, you can export it Oz!



MacDoc said:


> View attachment 94171


----------



## smashedbanana

Freddie_Biff said:


> Parasites are considerably different from the CoVid virus LOL.  Ivermectin is primarily for horse parasites. Definitely not Covid. Give it up already.


I don't think that's true. I think it was synthesized for human use first. Then animal use. Curiously there is a formulation that is used to kill ants.

I think it's been referred to as horse deformer for affect but also because that's the over the counter version people can buy. Like those aquarium tablets that were popular for a little while.


----------



## groovetube

smashedbanana said:


> I don't think that's true. I think it was synthesized for human use first. Then animal use. Curiously there is a formulation that is used to kill ants.
> 
> I think it's been referred to as horse deformer for affect but also because that's the over the counter version people can buy. Like those aquarium tablets that were popular for a little while.


Actually no. It was used in vet medicine first, humans later. But to be fair, that doesn’t diminish its effectiveness in humans for which it was intended. I tend use ‘horse dewormer’ in response to the barrage of misinformation and feet stamping.

If it did show effectiveness, it would be in use just as dexamethasone a cheap steriod found to have some effectiveness, and some of the antiviral, monoclonal antibodies they are using. I’m pretty sure all those exhausted medical staff having given their all the past 19 months would welcome any other off label drug with a safety profile that had a proven effectiveness. It seems insane that anyone could pass this off as some conspiracy. But here we are. What I’ve gone after macfury for, is he continually tries to turn the conversation from whether ivermectin has any proven efficacy in treating covid into some argument about whether ivermectin is a good drug that is very good at what it is intended for, which I don’t think anyone here is actually arguing. But, that’s what he does. 



> Merck began marketing ivermectin as a veterinary antiparasitic in 1981.[7] By 1986, ivermectin was registered for use in 46 countries and was administered massively to cattle, sheep and other animals.[61] By the late 1980s, ivermectin was the bestselling veterinary medicine in the world.[7] Following its blockbuster success as a veterinary antiparasitic, another Merck scientist, Mohamed Aziz, collaborated with the World Health Organization to test the safety and efficacy of ivermectin against onchocerciasis in humans.[62] They found it to be safe and effective, triggering Merck to register ivermectin for human use as "Mectizan" in France in 1987.[62] A year later, Merck CEO Roy Vagelos agreed that Merck would donate all ivermectin needed to eradicate river blindness.[62] In 1998, that donation would be expanded to include ivermectin used to treat lymphatic filariasis.[62]


I know that’s Wikipedia but the same info can be found elsewhere.


----------



## Macfury

smashedbanana said:


> Curiously there is a formulation that is used to kill ants.


Canine heartworm medicine as well. 

Some of the properties of soil organisms are quite amazing. Check out this system developed by a Canadian company, Bee Vectoring Technologies, which uses bees to distribute a naturally-occurring soil fungus that destroys harmful plant parasites:





__





Biological control, pest & disease management | Bee Vectoring Technology


Bee Vectoring Technology (BVT) uses commercially reared bees to provide highly targeted pest and disease management solutions through biological control.




www.beevt.com


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Canine heartworm medicine as well.
> 
> Some of the properties of soil organisms are quite amazing. Check out this system developed by a Canadian company, Bee Vectoring Technologies, which uses bees to distribute a naturally-occurring soil fungus that destroys harmful plant parasites:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Biological control, pest & disease management | Bee Vectoring Technology
> 
> 
> Bee Vectoring Technology (BVT) uses commercially reared bees to provide highly targeted pest and disease management solutions through biological control.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.beevt.com


Ummm, that’s great. But where is the research showing how effective it is at treating Covid19 in humans?


----------



## Macfury

Sorry to dash your hopes, but I'm not sure it can do that.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Ummm, that’s great. But where is the research showing how effective it is at treating Covid19 in humans?


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Ummm, that’s great. But where is the research showing how effective it is at treating Covid19 in humans?


He was merely only in to wind people up. Now he’s back pedaling. ‘Bu-but I never said….’ Yeah STFU troll…

as I pointed out in my last post on ivermectin, he tried to make the argument about whether there was a safe human version of the drug that was effective intreating parasites. No one was disputing that. It’s just his thing… 

This is why ehmac frustrates most and it’s turned into this nonsense. But, it’s always someone else’s fault. If it isn’t me, it’s you, cubamark, or whomever is trying to participate at any point in time.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Sorry to dash your hopes, but I'm not sure it can do that.


My hopes? I thought you were promoting ivermectin as the miracle alternative to vaccines!


----------



## Macfury

I've never said anything about that.



Freddie_Biff said:


> My hopes? I thought you were promoting ivermectin as the miracle alternative to vaccines!


----------



## MacDoc

Then why the **** even bring it up ....as usual...per troll.


----------



## groovetube

Macfury said:


> I've never said anything about that.


You’ve spent pages extolling the virtues of this drug in a thread on covid, in support of your pal iron horse who has barraged us with fake links about it curing India’s population of covid.

so yeah you did. Busted!


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> I've never said anything about that.


Hey Groove! Here comes the windup again.  You’re right. So predictable.


----------



## groovetube

He’s been puking this childish transparent **** for years. ‘Who me?’. As if no one notices.

It’s why I simply mock him. Taking anything it posts seriously is a waste of time. I think most members historically here have given up trying to have any reasonable interaction with this idiot.


----------



## Macfury

I didn't bring it up. I was responding to Freddie's posts referring to it as "Horse Dewormer". It's a more remarkable medication than that, as you well know.

But if you can find a post of mine where I instruct people to use this drug inappropriately, I will certainly take it down.



MacDoc said:


> Then why the **** even bring it up ....


----------



## groovetube

Still trying to save face.

The mark of a real troll.


----------



## groovetube

While we have captain ‘I never said that’ busy back pedaling from his trolling…

This was interesting 









Covid: Immune therapy from llamas shows promise


An immune therapy derived from llama blood shows "exciting potential" in early coronavirus trials.



www.bbc.com


----------



## MacDoc

The Unbelievable Grimness of HermanCainAward, the Subreddit That Catalogs Anti-Vaxxer COVID Deaths


This is not a forum that attempts to change minds. It’s much darker.




slate.com


----------



## Macfury

I know a website for really fat people who ate themselves to death, MacDoc! 



MacDoc said:


> The Unbelievable Grimness of HermanCainAward, the Subreddit That Catalogs Anti-Vaxxer COVID Deaths
> 
> 
> This is not a forum that attempts to change minds. It’s much darker.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> slate.com


----------



## MacDoc

100% irrelevant ...shows you still don't get it. ☕


----------



## Macfury

The science showed them that all they needed to do was to stop putting all of this food into their stomachs, yet they became heavier and heavier until they died. They could have lived, but no...



MacDoc said:


> 100% irrelevant ...shows you still don't get it. ☕


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> 100% irrelevant ...shows you still don't get it.


Anything to misdirect.


----------



## groovetube

Is anyone surprise at the childish antics?

disturbing link macdoc. But a reality none of these dimwits seem aware of.


----------



## MacDoc

nail in the coffins of the anti-vaxxers in Canada





__





OHRC Policy statement on COVID-19 vaccine mandates and proof of vaccine certificates | Ontario Human Rights Commission







www.ohrc.on.ca





Might even be literal in some cases.


----------



## Macfury

The Ontario Human Rights Commission is not a federal organization.



MacDoc said:


> nail in the coffins of the anti-vaxxers in Canada


----------



## groovetube

Troll fail.


----------



## MacDoc

This one needs curbing in the worst way









CNN reporter tracks down doctor spreading dangerous lies - CNN Video


CNN's Nick Watt takes a look at Dr. Simone Gold, the emergency room physician that tours the country spreading coronavirus lies and was even charged for her role in the Capitol insurrection.




edition.cnn.com


----------



## MacDoc

> *Exemptions for COVID-19 vaccination 'exceedingly rare' as Alberta set to implement vaccine passport program*
> The College of Physicians and Surgeons in Alberta has developed a guide for physicians on exemptions, which states an exemption is "expected to be exceedingly rare" and "a patient’s or physician’s individual moral objection to vaccination is not considered sufficient clinical rationale for exemption of vaccination against COVID-19."


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Good.


----------



## groovetube

Quebec swiftly passes new bill to prohibit anti-vaccine protests near schools, hospitals


After just a few hours of debate, Quebec's National Assembly voted unanimously Thursday evening to pass a new bill that would prohibit anti-vaccine protesters from demonstrating near schools, daycares, and hospitals -- an offence punishable by a fine of up to $12,000.




montreal.ctvnews.ca





Thousands in fines? How about hog tied and a few months in covid hotel as a bonus. Or maybe a year community service work as a janitor in the covid wards in hospitals.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Good.


It’s funny, all the people on Facebook all outraged declaring that they will take their business elsewhere or eat at home because businesses are requiring vaccine proof. The 80 some percent of us are like yeah, that’s the idea man! Ha ha ha.

hearing more and more bands replacing members that won’t get vaxxed. Means more work for others


----------



## MacDoc

Good info









I'm vaccinated. What's my risk of catching COVID and passing it on?


How well are the COVID-19 vaccines working at preventing people from getting sick? And if you do get infected after being vaccinated, how likely are you to pass the virus onto someone else? Here's what we know.




www.abc.net.au


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> It’s funny, all the people on Facebook all outraged declaring that they will take their business elsewhere or eat at home because businesses are requiring vaccine proof. The 80 some percent of us are like yeah, that’s the idea man! Ha ha ha.
> 
> hearing more and more bands replacing members that won’t get vaxxed. Means more work for others


McCartney does not hire anybody in his band that isn’t vegan.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> Good info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm vaccinated. What's my risk of catching COVID and passing it on?
> 
> 
> How well are the COVID-19 vaccines working at preventing people from getting sick? And if you do get infected after being vaccinated, how likely are you to pass the virus onto someone else? Here's what we know.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.abc.net.au


The vaccines do a much better job than they’re sometimes given credit for.


----------



## groovetube

Once a in it’s pointed out in amongst the constant barrage of misinformation that vaccinated people are less likely to get infected, and they are finding that often the ones that do are infectious for a shorter period of time.

the dummies still repeating the Israel talking point given to them without actually thinking that one through.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> McCartney does not hire anybody in his band that isn’t vegan.


in this case, bands aren't booked on festivals or large events unless all personnel are fully vaxxed


----------



## groovetube

'People will suffer and will die': Emergency doctor says some health triage has begun in Alberta


The head of emergency medicine for the Alberta Medical Association says major components of triage have already begun in Alberta.




edmonton.ctvnews.ca





I think macfury needs to call them and set them straight! ‘How many beds do you have???’ ‘I demand answers!’ 

Apparently the military is sending in help, so much for the ‘masks don’t work-vaccines kill’ crowd. See all you have to do is wait out these dimwits, the truth comes out in the end. They’ll just deny it anyway but we all know what’s happening on the ground now.

Then we have this:








'Vigilante treatments': Anti-vaccine groups push people to leave ICUs


As the anti-vaccine movement escalates its rhetoric, doctors warn that they're dealing with the fallout: "They’re starting to target people, the messengers — nurses and doctors."




www.nbcnews.com





wow.



> Others are turning away from hospitals altogether. In recent weeks, some anti-vaccine Facebook groups and conspiracy theory influencers on the encrypted messaging app Telegram have offered instructions on how to get family members released from the hospital, usually by insisting they be transferred into hospice care, and have recorded those they’ve successfully removed from hospitals for viral videos.


Well, I suppose the silver lining here is, these folks will not be taking up an ICU bed or a ventilator, and just die at home.



> Some people in groups that formed recently to promote the false cure ivermectin, an anti-parasite treatment, have claimed extracting Covid patients from hospitals is pivotal so that they can self-medicate at home with ivermectin. But as the patients begin to realize that ivermectin by itself is not effective, the groups have begun recommending a series of increasingly hazardous at-home treatments, such as gargling with iodine, and nebulizing and inhaling hydrogen peroxide, calling it part of a “protocol.”
> 
> On Tuesday, the Asthma and Allergy Foundation of America put out a warning against nebulizing hydrogen peroxide.


Incredible how stupid people can be. At one point I had a real winner following me around into the Shang insisting I had my friend who was unfortunately in hospital with covid go home and take Ivermectin. The lengths these numbskulls will go tp spread their life threatening crap is disturbing. I think for the ones actively engaged in spreading this misinformation and convincing people to not go to hospital and use their covid treatment advice, there needs to be some legal consequences for these people who are going that far.


----------



## groovetube

Man protesting vaccine passports at Tim Hortons likens himself to Rosa Parks


People took to Tim Hortons in Oshawa this week to protest Ontario's new vaccine passport legislation. Businesses in Ontario are now required to ask...




www.blogto.com





Wow. His "Rosa Parks" moment. That is seriously, how delusional these freaks are.



> He says staff members asked for his vaccination status and he refused to give it.
> 
> "Why would I give some random stranger personal medical information?"


Ha ha! Where have we heard this before? (hint, people who have been vaccinated capitalizing on this...)


----------



## MacDoc

Good news on treatment








A daily pill to treat COVID could be just months away, scientists say


At least three promising antivirals for COVID-19 are being tested in clinical trials, with results expected as soon as late fall or winter.




www.thestar.com


----------



## groovetube

We need all the help we can get. Vaccines is the path out of lockdowns and saving lives, but covid will not go away and there’s still a lot of vulnerable people. Always glad to hear treatment trials showing more promise. Unfortunately there’s too many really stupid people which makes the situation a lot worse.


----------



## MacDoc

Christian Persecution: Fauci Targets Church Choirs - Singers Spread Covid (Video) - RAIR


Fauci also endorses boosters for all, vaccines for children and government control over the private sector on pandemic response.




rairfoundation.com


----------



## Macfury

You're right MacDoc. Fauci has been incoherent and inconsistent for the past two years. The US can do better.



MacDoc said:


> Christian Persecution: Fauci Targets Church Choirs - Singers Spread Covid (Video) - RAIR
> 
> 
> Fauci also endorses boosters for all, vaccines for children and government control over the private sector on pandemic response.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rairfoundation.com


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Went out for dinner with the family and grandparents tonight. Chianti’s on Whyte Avenue—one of our favorites. Everybody is vaccinated and we all had our cards, so no problems. It really is such a relief when you know you’re following the rules and so is everyone else on the premises. Just like old times.


----------



## Macfury

Who is Sonia?


----------



## MacDoc

> *Young COVID patients showing up confused, sweaty and grey, rural Alberta doctor says*
> 
> Anesthesiologist Dr. Everett Zdrill of Edson, Alta., says the current wave of COVID-19 patients in the province is younger and becoming 'sicker with COVID in numbers we've never seen before.





https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1952404547818



100% unvaccinated ....


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Went out for dinner with the family and grandparents tonight. Chianti’s on Whyte Avenue—one of our favorites. Everybody is vaccinated and we all had our cards, so no problems. It really is such a relief when you know you’re following the rules and Sonia everyone else on the premises. Just like old times.


Yep. Walked into my gym yesterday, all members are prescreened with our vaccination proof so we just beep our cards in. It is the reason I decided to go knowing everyone is masked and vaccinated. There’s a way out of this without lockdowns and back to a sense of normalacy.

I am grateful for the medical experts working tirelessly on this to steer us out of this insanity.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Who is Sonia?


Sonia was the waitress. She was awesome.


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1952404547818
> 
> 
> 
> 100% unvaccinated ....


That Covid party in Edson where young people try to get CoVid on purpose to build natural immunity doesn’t help matters. They’ve started the triage protocol in Alberta now.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> That Covid party in Edson where young people try to get CoVid on purpose to build natural immunity doesn’t help matters. They’ve started the triage protocol in Alberta now.


What??? Triage? How many beds do they have? Let a couple forum dimwits solve this issue for Alberta once and for all!


----------



## Macfury

I hope she got a fat tip!



Freddie_Biff said:


> Sonia was the waitress. She was awesome.


----------



## groovetube

COVID-19 hospital occupancy down as Quebec reports 719 new cases


Quebec reported 719 new COVID-19 cases Sunday as a recent rise in hospitalizations appeared to slow over the weekend.




montreal.ctvnews.ca





Hmmmmm. I wonder what it is that Quebec and Ontario has done differently than Alberta. Gosh what could it be.

maybe starting with laughing at dimwits who spend their days quoting discredited doctors from YouTube and listening to the real medical experts for starters…


----------



## groovetube

Ha ha. Silence. The best that you’ll see is some pathetic windup. While these jokers LOL and stamp their feet with googled nonsense to support their premise, Alberta’s healthcare system is in crisis with the unvaccinated.

And all they have now is some googled headlines of articles none of them have actually read. The sad part is, there’s still too many that have bought in to their insanity, and will get their turn soon enough at an ICU nearest them. Unless it’s full and they get air lifted to another province…


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Ha ha. Silence. The best that you’ll see is some pathetic windup. While these jokers LOL and stamp their feet with googled nonsense to support their premise, Alberta’s healthcare system is in crisis with the unvaccinated.
> 
> And all they have no is some googled headlines of articles none of them have actually read. The sad part is, there’s still too many that have bought in to their insanity, and will get their turn soon enough at an ICU nearest them. Unless it’s full and they get aiisted to another province…


Or triaged out of the system. Use that natural immunity!


----------



## MacDoc

Ouch


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/unvaccinated-sask-covid-deaths-1.6191446


----------



## groovetube

I find it incredible how these fools refuse to listen to the doctors right on the front line, but just lose their **** when they find one doctor who discovers and on youtube. Just incredible the level of stupidity. Until one of them ends up facing a medical staff ready to intubate you.


----------



## MacDoc

ummmm Intubate perhaps... 

and what sort of idjit risks his doctors licence.



> Ontario's medical regulator has barred a family doctor from providing exemptions for COVID-19 vaccines and face masks, alleging that he has deliberately spread misinformation about the ongoing pandemic.
> The College of Physicians and Surgeons of Ontario says that Dr. Patrick Phillips — who is based in the rural community of Englehart, about 45 kilometres south of Kirkland Lake — is "incompetent" and that he has engaged in "disgraceful, dishonourable" conduct.
> The college said the allegations against Phillips have been referred to its disciplinary tribunal.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/patrick-phillips-covid-19-misinformation-college-1.6191906


----------



## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> Ouch
> 
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/unvaccinated-sask-covid-deaths-1.6191446


But it’s all about personal choice, isn’t it? Surely the average unvaccinated citizen must know more than a doctor who’s devoted his or her life to medicine.


----------



## groovetube

MacDoc said:


> ummmm Intubate perhaps...
> 
> and what sort of idjit risks his doctors licence.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/patrick-phillips-covid-19-misinformation-college-1.6191906


Ah autocorrect strikes again! Edited.

and I saw that about that doctor. That’s what I was referring to earlier. All the thousands and thousands of doctors nurses all the medical experts all working tirelessly, all of them saying the same thing, but these drooling fools are taken by a handful that found fame by realizing there’s a lot of really stupid gullible people out there.


----------



## groovetube

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/alberta-saskatchewan-lockdowns-cma-1.6193631



Freddie, what’s happening there? Any sign this is peaking yet?


----------



## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/alberta-saskatchewan-lockdowns-cma-1.6193631
> 
> 
> 
> Freddie, what’s happening there? Any sign this is peaking yet?


I heard it on the radio this morning. CMA guy says we’re not doing enough to prevent a catastrophe but Kenney and the UCP want to take a wait and see approach apparently. I don’t know what they’re waiting for, but supposedly Kenney does not want to “punish the vaccinated.” The guy just doesn’t get it.


----------



## Macfury

Are you advocating for locking down vaccinated people?



Freddie_Biff said:


> I heard it on the radio this morning. CMA guy says we’re not doing enough to prevent a catastrophe but Kenney and the UCP want to take a wait and see approach apparently. I don’t know what they’re waiting for, but supposedly Kenney does not want to “punish the vaccinated.” The guy just doesn’t get it.


----------



## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> I heard it on the radio this morning. CMA guy says we’re not doing enough to prevent a catastrophe but Kenney and the UCP want to take a wait and see approach apparently. I don’t know what they’re waiting for, but supposedly Kenney does not want to “punish the vaccinated.” The guy just doesn’t get it.


Oh man. You seriously have the dumbest premier in Canada. I thought we did with Ford, but he has been curiously quiet and he wasn’t stupid enough to pull the mask requirements and open full wide like Kenny did.

almost 2 years in, and dumb people are still yammering. It’s too bad because lockdowns likely wouldn’t have been even hinted at had Kenny simply took a more cautious approach as we did here. I really hope things improve.


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## MacDoc

We lock down an entire city for 3 days for one case MF ...as a result we have none in Queensland cept for the occasional stray from a neighboring state.
Queensland is the same population as Alberta and much larger.









vs


> *Since yesterday’s update, 34 Albertans died from COVID with 12 in the Central Zone, 10 in the Edmonton Zone, six in the Calgary Zone, four in the Central Zone, and two in the South Zone. *To date, 2,697 people in the province have died as a result of the pandemic.
> The deaths in the South Zone were for residents of Cardston County and the County of Newell.
> Below are graphs showing how COVID-19 in Alberta has trended since the start of the pandemic, which can also be accessed with more detail here.


You still seem to fail to understand what public weal is. Nothing new there. ☕


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## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> Oh man. You seriously have the dumbest premier in Canada. I thought we did with Ford, but he has been curiously quiet and he wasn’t stupid enough to pull the mask requirements and open full wide like Kenny did.
> 
> almost 2 years in, and dumb people are still yammering. It’s too bad because lockdowns likely wouldn’t have been even hinted at had Kenny simply took a more cautious approach as we did here. I really hope things improve.


Likewise. I’m not sure what options are left if vaccinations aren’t making enough of a difference.


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## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> Likewise. I’m not sure what options are left if vaccinations aren’t making enough of a difference.


Tough one. Masking, and having some common sense restrictions (capacity etc) would be a large help, but Kenny pulled that back in July. We listened to the numbskulls tap dancing about lockdowns, masking that didn’t work, vaccinations, ‘freedumb’ and all the rest of it. But the glaring difference between Alberta and Ontario is something you’ll never see them admit. Just some useless drive by idiot questions to wind people up. Who’d a thought?  

Once again, these doofuses get their asses handed to them. Wonder if we’ll hear about gargling iodine next?


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## Macfury

Yes, you certainly do.



MacDoc said:


> We lock down an entire city for 3 days for one case MF ...


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## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> Yes, you certainly do.


And who’s got a better handle on the pandemic so far, Macfury? Canada, the US or Australia?


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## Macfury

None of them. The authoritarianism in Australia is ludicrous.



Freddie_Biff said:


> And who’s got a better handle on the pandemic so far, Macfury? Canada, the US or Australia?


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## groovetube

The troll is getting desperate. It was horribly wrong on Alberta now it’s going after Australia. I wouldn’t give it any oxygen.


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## MacDoc

Pleasant surprise


https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/youtube-anti-vax-1.6193392


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## MacDoc

**** right off - you are so delusional MF....any rights you think you might be entitled to STOP when you are potentially infectious to others when a vaccine is available and refuse.
Just happens that Australia and NZ enforce that reality.


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## Macfury

I know you believe that MacDoc, just as you told us you had a right to drive while using a cellphone because it was no danger to anyone else. You brandish "the public weal" like a weapon — whenever you already agree with the policy beforehand.



MacDoc said:


> **** right off - you are so delusional MF....any rights you think you might be entitled to STOP when you are potentially infectious to others when a vaccine is available and refuse.
> Just happens that Australia and NZ enforce that reality.


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## Freddie_Biff

Macfury said:


> None of them. The authoritarianism in Australia is ludicrous.


Wrong. The stats for Australia blow the US and Canada out of the water, precisely because they lock down when they have to. **** libertarianism.


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## groovetube

He’s just a dumbass troll. We have the clear example of Alberta right under our noses and he knows it, so he’s just angry.

so he’s just bored and being a total dick. Remember, this is the same chicken little that cried about Canada not getting more than 20% of the population vaccinated until mid October, while getting into bed with the anti-covid-vax trolls here and not admitting that he himself is vaccinated…


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## groovetube

'It's really scary:' Alberta physicians face more aggressive, misinformed patients


'They mostly comment on my brown skin and hijab. I'm also Muslim ... so they come to religion and they get personal with that'




nationalpost.com





Given the toxic nonsense spewed in this thread,
This is hardly a surprise.


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## Macfury

If your only metric for success is hard COVID stats, then authoritarianism is exactly what you're looking for, Freddie.



Freddie_Biff said:


> Wrong. The stats for Australia blow the US and Canada out of the water, precisely because they lock down when they have to. **** libertarianism.


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## groovetube

No one gives a **** about your childish taunts.


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## Freddie_Biff

groovetube said:


> No one gives a **** about your childish taunts.


And the guy won’t even comment on whether he got vaxxed or not. Such a coward.


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## Macfury

As an EhMac Influencer, I have to be careful about what I say.



Freddie_Biff said:


> And the guy won’t even comment on whether he got vaxxed or not. Such a coward.


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## groovetube

Oh you influenced ehmac alright. So much so few ever tread back here! LOL


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## groovetube

Freddie_Biff said:


> And the guy won’t even comment on whether he got vaxxed or not. Such a coward.


Everyone knows he’s a troll. I enjoy rubbing its face in it.


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## MacDoc

Meanwhile consequences mount.



> *Kingston, Ont., pub loses liquor licence for breaking pandemic rules*
> *J.A.K.K. Tuesdays said on Facebook it refused to ask for proof of vaccination *
> CBC News · Posted: Sep 30, 2021 12:11 PM ET | Last Updated: 3 hours ago





https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/jakk-tuesdays-kingston-vaccine-liquor-license-1.6195118


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## Macfury

Government has certainly decimated businesses. But there is mass civil disobedience in Toronto among restaurateurs, so there's hope!



MacDoc said:


> Meanwhile consequences mount.


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## groovetube

'_mass_' civil disobedience! AH HA HA HA HA

A handful of doofuses who think they matter in the face of an overwhelming majority who are vaccinated. Try again troll boy.


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## Freddie_Biff

To those armchair critics who think they know so much, please read this account from an actual ICU doctor to see what the CoVid ICU experience is like. 


















































If you still have loved ones/people you care about who refuse to get the COVID-19 vaccine, sit them down and have them read this entire thread from Dr. Darren Maryland.

No one should die like this. We can prevent it.

- from Opposition Leader Rachel Notley’s Facebook page


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## MacDoc

Ugh that is very dire ...depressing
do you have a link to the original?

pretty permanent state of affairs....boosters to the future  https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.09.28.21264260v1.full.pdf


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## Freddie_Biff

MacDoc said:


> Ugh that is very dire ...depressing
> do you have a link to the original?
> 
> pretty permanent state of affairs....boosters to the future  https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.09.28.21264260v1.full.pdf


I pulled it from Rachel Notley’s post. Maybe if you look up the doctor’s name on Twitter?
Darren Markland @DrDagly is his name.


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## groovetube

I’ve read this same description of dying over and over. It doesn’t matter how many doctors from ICUs describe this, people aren’t getting it. It was described to me by family of friends I knew who died of covid. If you’re unvaccinated and over 50, good luck. It’s a gamble. And if you don’t die, you risk having damaged lungs for life perhaps damaged organs reducing your life expectancy. Yeah you don’t hear that part much in the news. I know a few. Recently there was someone we know who works in hospital north of the city who told us of a 20 yr old hockey player who’s lungs are now damaged he can no longer play.

preventable yes. What’s hard to prevent, is the stupidity and misinformation.


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## VSAdmin

Ok, this thread has run its course and shutting it down since not Mac-related.

We have 15+ reports in this thread and looking to recruit moderators to help out. 

Jeff


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