# Cars in Canada!



## Adrian. (Nov 28, 2007)

So I am in Mexico right now for a couple months and have noticed (I haven't been here for about 6 years) and I cannot help but notice all the different makes and models of cars they sell here. It is wild! Here there is what we have in Canada: All the American companies, VW, all the Japanese, BMW, Mercedes, Volvo, Audi, Jag, Range Rover etc but they have so many European cars its not even funny. There is Renault, Seat, Peugeot, Fiat and Citroen. Also, they sell the Chinese made cars! They are sold through a Leon's or The Brick equivalent type of store.

When I was here many years ago the market was dominated by Americans, VW, Nissan and the premium European manufacturers. Now there is probably every car maker here in the world selling in this country.

Considering the Canadian perspective two things immediately popped into my head: Due to the market competition cars here are a lot cheaper. A fully loaded 2009 Honda Accord here 33,000 roughly w/ tax, in Canada the car is roughly 45,000 dollars (both cars without accessories)! Wooooow that is a big difference!

Also, considering our increasingly rising price of gasoline and our dependence on cars, why aren't these SUPER efficient European cars being sold in Canada! We are depending on car makers in Canada to give us all these hyrbid and super efficient diesel cars and they are not really providing. They already damn exist! We oooohhh and awww at the size of the smart car in Canada when these other Europeans have been selling similar cars for ages.


This has fully confirmed my belief that our government is well under the wings of GM, Dodge and Chrysler. Same deal for the Americans down south; so much for free capitalism.

If I had the money I would buy a whole bunch of these and import them into Canada!

That was my somewhat informative rant! (with lots of exclamation marks  )


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## Jason H (Feb 1, 2004)

I think we need to start our own canadian car company. Use one of the car factories that gm is closing somewhere in Canada and licence designs and engines from other companies. We can make a fortune.


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## Lawrence (Mar 11, 2003)

Trouble with importing cars from Mexico is that they aren't designed for Canada,
Now...Scooters on the other hand...I'd love a Mexican Honda Cub.

Dave


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

I wonder if you are a bit out of touch - I think the prices have dropped pretty dramatically now.
So much so that cross border has effectively stopped AND a number of car suppliers in Canada are geared up for a record year. ..go figure


From Mississauga Honda
Accord Sedan..... LXAccord Sedan.... EXAccord Sedan...EX-LAccord Sedan EX V6......Accord Sedan EX-L V6
Price	$ 25,090.......$ 27,490..............$ 29,890.....................$ 31,690.......................$ 34,990


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

I bet the safety standards are a lot less in Mexico, if not entirely missing.

No rust does make a car last a long, long time.

Just check out the antiques on the roads in Cuba.


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## CubaMark (Feb 16, 2001)

Jason H said:


> I think we need to start our own canadian car company. Use one of the car factories that gm is closing somewhere in Canada and licence designs and engines from other companies. We can make a fortune.


We have one - in Québec. But, until recently, they could only sell their cars in the USA, as Canadian transport law effectively banned 'em:

ZENN Motor Company

I think they're now available in BC, but nowhere else...


M


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## Jason H (Feb 1, 2004)

CubaMark said:


> We have one - in Québec. But, until recently, they could only sell their cars in the USA, as Canadian transport law effectively banned 'em:
> 
> ZENN Motor Company
> 
> ...


I just saw one of those in a commercial for a seniors residence in Seattle. 

Thats not even close to what I'm suggesting however. I'm talking about cheap fuel efficient cars, and keeping some jobs here.


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## Jason H (Feb 1, 2004)

Not to mention the zen car is absolutely useless for 99% of this country (geographically, not population wise). 

To get to anything from where I live you need to drive on a road with a speed limit of 80, where traffic moves at 100 usually. 

I want a large sedan with a small diesel. It wont be a speed demon, but it will move fast enough and still be efficient!


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Mark, ZENN cars are now legal in Manitoba as well. Since I could not buy one here in St.John's, I decided to buy stock in the company, when it dipped below $3 a share. I also bought stock in a small BC company called Western Wind Energy for about $1 about a year ago, during one of our typical wind storms. A local CBC Radio 1 commentator joked that NL would not need any oil if we could only harness the force of the winds that rage over our province for most of the year. This company is now setting up wind turbines in California .......... but not NL.  Western Wind Energy

Still, if we can't buy their products, we can at least support a company like ZENN or Wester Wind Energy by buying their stock.


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## madhatress (Jul 22, 2007)

Dr.G. said:


> Mark, ZENN cars are now legal in Manitoba as well. Since I could not buy one here in St.John's, I decided to buy stock in the company, when it dipped below $3 a share.


Thanks Dr. G. I didn't know that Zenn was a publicly traded company. I'll have to check out their stock


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

My business associate is closely involved with Zenn and has done well with shares.

Here's the kicker with Zenn.....it COULD be a 1950s IBM play.

The reason being is that they have the world wide small vehicle contact for a potential category buster in the form of a super capacitor that has been developed by the very secretive EEstor,

The latter has funding from Klein Perkins and recently a contract with Lockheed for exclusive military use and the founders have pretty deep science creds.

My associate says the EEstor product is real tho release to production has been slow due to ramping up manufacturing techniques in volume from prototype.

You can chase the rumours about the web but if it pans out it WILL replace the internal combustion engine for small vehicles - that's what they are aiming at.

250 mile range 5 minute recharge, million cycles - same cost or less than a 4 cylinder and 1/2 the weight.

There is nothing of a breakthrough in physics - it's the manufacturing of the supercap membrane to high standards of purity that is the key...and the delay in ramp up tho apparently they now are satisfied with the purity in bulk.

The prime founders of EEstor are exIBM/Xerox Park storage engineers so they have the right chops for this.

Zenn was just in the right place at the right time as EEstor needed a contract to get the round VC funding from Klein Perkins.

So...there's the brass ring.

Zenn's alternative is some new tech on lithium.

Ontario is being seriously stupid on alternative vehicle promotion. 

The barriers in licencing and insurance are just plain stupid. I doubt we'll see a Tata anytime soon.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

It's a good company for a long-term hold due to their battery technology. From what I have been reading, the stock could triple in the next 5 years, or go back to $1. I have most of my holdings in strong companies, so 5% of my portfolio goes to small Canadian companies that are environmentally friendly. We shall see.

reportonbusiness.com: Stock Quote


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Sadly, the CEO of ZENN said that they might be forced to move out of PQ if there is no way they can ship their cars for sale in Canada. It would make more sense to relocate to Mexico (as Ford just did with its revamped Fiesta line) and ship to the sunbelt states in the US and Europe.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Check out the Rick Mercer Report video clip from Nov. 20th, 2007 "Rick drives an electric car", which is a ZENN car.

CBC Television - Rick Mercer Report

YouTube - ZENN on the Rick Mercer Report


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## kps (May 4, 2003)

Adrian. said:


> but they have so many European cars its not even funny. There is Renault, Seat, Peugeot, Fiat and Citroen. Also, they sell the Chinese made cars! They are sold through a Leon's or The Brick equivalent type of store.


Okay, who here remembers the Yugo, the Lada and the Skoda...raise your hand.


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## Mississauga (Oct 27, 2001)

Jason H said:


> I think we need to start our own canadian car company. Use one of the car factories that gm is closing somewhere in Canada and licence designs and engines from other companies. We can make a fortune.


And let's call that car Bricklin!


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## Lawrence (Mar 11, 2003)

You can buy a Piaggio Ape in Canada now at Vespa Burlington,
But...It's diesel and it can't go that fast, So no highways or even the expressways.

Dave


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## Lawrence (Mar 11, 2003)

kps said:


> Okay, who here remembers the Yugo, the Lada and the Skoda...raise your hand.


Hand up...and I even remember the Dacia wagon, Now that was a nice car,
Renault Le Car and the Citroen 2CV6 were other fine alternatives. (Drove a CV2 in Europe in 1979)

But...I always wanted a Mini Cooper Woody Wagon, Maybe someday.

Dave


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

kps said:


> Okay, who here remembers the Yugo, the Lada and the Skoda...raise your hand.


Both Yugo and Lada used old Fiat tooling. The Yugo factory was one of the first places to be bombed out of commission during the Civil War, being as it was right on the line between the Serbs and the Bosnians. Of course the Yugo was a terrible car - so was the Fiat 10 it was based on, however, the same basic car is still in production in India, since India had purchased even older tooling from Yugo in the 80's.

The Lada is still in production in Russia, and because of the new market conditions, they stopped exporting because of local demands. However, the holding company folded, and the car is now made under a different name. A spin off company that makes heavy trucks, I think they are called the Kazan, are very rugged vehicles intended for use in Siberia, but are also the winners of some of the recent Dakar Rally races.

Skoda is now a part of Volkwagen AG, and their Octavia is a fairly popular sedan in Europe. Despite their crude construction during the Soviet days, the Skodas were pretty tough vehicles, and the Skoda firm has long been noted for their excellence in machining - they were a prime contractor for the Tiger Panzer of the Second World War. They also have a fair sized spin off business in Hungary, where they build engines for Mercedez-Benz as well as making some rather tough forest fighting equipment. Skodas were also long popular in Rally racing, some of their vehicles even survived the rather barbaric Sofia Rally (a rally that made the East Africa Rally look like a Sunday drive...). That rally was so tough that one time, six cars made it to the end - leading the organizers to make the next year's rally even tougher...

For most European manufacturers, the AutoPact presented a rather large problem because import tariffs were so high. Volvo set up an assembly plant in Halifax to get around the problem, but most other marques simply just concentrated on other markets where they did not face such difficulties. Too bad, because we did miss out on some rather good cars, like the Citroen. And the Smart barely made it into the market here - though it has faced an incredible amount of opposition in the US - mostly because they will sell millions of them in places like LA and NYC - and the Big Three have nothing to counter it with. (The Big Three still have nothing to counter the Corolla and the Civic with after what, thirty five years!)


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

dolawren said:


> ...Dacia wagon, Now that was a nice car,
> Renault Le Car and the Citroen 2CV6 were other fine alternatives. (Drove a CV2 in Europe in 1979)


Almost forgot the Dacia - it could have been a good seller here - it was a better car than say, the Dodge Arrow. The Le Car, considering that it was a small car, was much like driving down a road while sitting on a couch. The French always had the best suspension systems. The Peugeot was even more comfortable (though their diesel was an ecologoical disaster). A few nutters do operate their Deux Chevaux in these parts, but the three lug nuts per wheel always freaks me out. Being able to pull the seats out for a picnic was quite a feature.

And talking retorgrade, I had an uncle who had a Ford Anglia - very strange beast that still had a torque tube. They also has a Thames panel wagon, which was also fairly retrograde.


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## jeepguy (Apr 4, 2008)

I think one of the problems here was we use so much salt in the winter, and at the time they rusted like they had cancer.


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

Adrian. said:


> If I had the money I would buy a whole bunch of these and import them into Canada!


only one problem with that idea, you can't import(except the US) any car into Canada that is 15 years old or younger. How do you think all those 15 year old Nissan Skylines are getting in?

Laterz


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## Adrian. (Nov 28, 2007)

K_OS said:


> only one problem with that idea, you can't import(except the US) any car into Canada that is 15 years old or younger. How do you think all those 15 year old Nissan Skylines are getting in?
> 
> Laterz


With all due respect, I think you are wrong: NAFTA. My dad brought his car when he moved back to Canada 3 years ago. They drove. He just imported it into the country and paid the 15% of the book value of the car.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

K_OS said:


> you can't import(except the US) any car into Canada that is 15 years old or younger.


Complete bullcrap. My own car is a US model less than 15 years old. I brought it in 2 years ago. All you have to do is meet emission and safety standards.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

jeepguy said:


> I think one of the problems here was we use so much salt in the winter, and at the time they rusted like they had cancer.


Like the original Hyundai Pony. My mechanic bought one years ago because they were cheap for tooling around to pick up parts, and he really went to town with the Krown because it is still on the road, with little rust (and little paint!) Nasty cars - but they disappear quickly from junkyards because they have Weber carburetters. A dozen Pony's = enough carburetters for 1 Ferarri!

The Hammer uses pure salt on the roads. I live on an official emergency snow route, which is supposed to be the first roads cleared during any snowfall - and I have not seen a plow go up or down the street in at least four years. Now the trucks go up and down, but I have never seen the plow actually in the down (ie. doing something) position. And for a four lane street, it gets very narrow by March, perhaps a lane wide. If you meet someone half way, then it is a long reverse up the street to let them by. Of course they do not want to plow, it would move the six inches of salt that they put down on the road to start with.

They are also using this salt slime stuff, which they put like an inch down, and the cars spray it all over the place. I went through six gallons of windshield fluid this winter because it was so bad this year with that salt slime.

And whatever parts of the car aren't destroyed by corrosion, they will be destroyed by the monster pot holes that are all over the place. It is so bad here that the City received "emergency funds", and is planning on paving the worst 37 miles of roads this summer. One day I saw a fire truck buried in a pot hole with a broken axle...


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

rgray said:


> Complete bullcrap. My own car is a US model less than 15 years old. I brought it in 2 years ago. All you have to do is meet emission and safety standards.


As K_OS said - you can not import a car to Canada, with the exception of the United States. Any car that is manufactured in Canada or the United States, that is registered for use in Canada, can be imported duty free (but one will have to pay the appropriate taxes). Other manufacturers can and do register cars for import, and will have to go through the regular compliance testing that is mandated.

As for meeting emissions on exotic cars... There are ways of bringing cars in through the "grey market", but it really is too much of a bother except for the collector who is prepared for the red tape. A grey market importer will bring the car into compliance with all regulations, but these cars do not have to be submitted to crash testing. It is complex, and hence, most makers do not bother with such things unless the vehicle is exotic enough to command large dollars.

Cars that do not go through the grey market channel can only be imported after fifteen years, and that applies to right-hand drive vehicles as well.


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## Adrian. (Nov 28, 2007)

Just to note, I was kidding about importing them. :lmao:


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## Andrew Pratt (Feb 16, 2007)

I believe the issue with many of the small euro cars is the bumper's fail to meet our safety requirements. I've love to see more of the hatchback's Europe gets as we seem to get the same boring old engines and stale designs.


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## K_OS (Dec 13, 2002)

rgray said:


> Complete bullcrap. My own car is a US model less than 15 years old. I brought it in 2 years ago. All you have to do is meet emission and safety standards.


*did you notice that I put except from the US in brackets?*

really then why can't my friend import his 1995 VW Bug from Mexico as well I have tried several times to import 2 original 1999 Austin Mini's from England. Before anybody jumps on me one more time about this note that I have imported cars from Portugal, France, England, Italy, Australia and Japan so I know a bit about importing cars. Actually now the bar is set at 20 years so I don't have to meet emissions and safety in Ontario.

Laterz


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## Adrian. (Nov 28, 2007)

My dad brought a 2004 BMW 5 series from Mexico into the country without much problem.


I know there is some latitude figure where cars that are made for sale there do not have the seals around the windows etc, that we have north of that parallel for winter conditions and heating purposes. That line is somewhere in Kansas or something like that.


My experience was that it was fine to bring my dads car (bought in Mexico) to Canada with import documents and and taxes.


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## ErnstNL (Apr 12, 2003)

I bought my brand new Lada in 1980. Bias ply tires, manual choke. 4 speed manual tranny. It was a fun car. $4995.00. I switched out a few parts like the headlights, added radial tires, a radio! Easy to fix myself and Canadian Tire carried replacement parts. LOL.
I drove from NL to Ontario and back in it and never gave me trouble. 
It started to leak oil after 30k and I sold it cheap.
My Lada was a Fiat 124 sedan clone. 
Anyone drive a 124 Sport? That was a blast to drive. 


List of cars admissible for import to Canada from the US.
http://www.tc.gc.ca/roadsafety/importation/VAFUS/list/VAFUS.pdf

The trouble is trying to find a U.S. dealer willing to sell you a vehicle. It seems a lot of US dealerships won't sell to Canadians due to the paperwork and a "handshake" agreement to not infringe on their northern neighbors' business.


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## jeepguy (Apr 4, 2008)

ErnstNL said:


> I bought my brand new Lada in 1980. Bias ply tires, manual choke. 4 speed manual tranny. It was a fun car. $4995.00. I switched out a few parts like the headlights, added radial tires, a radio! Easy to fix myself and Canadian Tire carried replacement parts. LOL.
> I drove from NL to Ontario and back in it and never gave me trouble.
> It started to leak oil after 30k and I sold it cheap.
> My Lada was a Fiat 124 sedan clone.
> ...


here check this out!!

YouTube - saut de lada 4*4


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## PoliceDog (May 1, 2008)

ErnstNL said:


> "...Anyone drive a 124 Sport? That was a blast to drive....
> 
> The trouble is trying to find a U.S. dealer willing to *sell *you a vehicle...."


Fiats? Drove 'em all - I used to work on the Fiat advertising account when they were still sold in Canada.  (*F*ix*I*t*A*gain*T*ony!  )

The X-1/9 was a blast. If that thing had been sized about 25% bigger and decent QC and F/F - they could have sold a ton!

I remember one of the last print campaigns in which Fiat Canada offered huge trade-in discounts on new Fiats - just to get the old rust buckets off the roads and out of the public eye.

I also worked with Hyundai Heavy Industries of Korea when they decided to bring what was basically a 6-year old Fiat to Canada.  Wrote Press Releases with the newly-appointed President of Hyundai Canada - on Christmas Day - in some high-rise apartment on Sheppard in Toronto. Strongest memory: teaching people how to pronounce "Hyundai" -- "...rhymes with Sunday!" LOL!

And in the end, Hyundai came up with a winner. Read some of the more recent reviews from some of the most cynical U.S. automotive writers.


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## Adrian. (Nov 28, 2007)

Hyundai makes some nice cars. I think it is the Sonata I was about a week ago and I must say it was a pretty luxurious car. Brand aside I would say it could possible compete with a BMW 745 or the likes. At less than half the price of a beamer you can't beat it.

The Veracruz is very nice as well.


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## jeepguy (Apr 4, 2008)

PoliceDog said:


> Fiats? Drove 'em all - I used to work on the Fiat advertising account when they were still sold in Canada.  (*F*ix*I*t*A*gain*T*ony!  )
> 
> The X-1/9 was a blast. If that thing had been sized about 25% bigger and decent QC and F/F - they could have sold a ton!
> 
> I


I think it would sell good now, especially with the gas prices climbing by the minute.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

If anyone saw the GM press conference this morning, it looks like the big General is going down big time. Another thousand out of work in Oshawa, and no indication that their bleeding will come to an end. So much for making fast profits on obsolete vehicles and even more ancient engine technology. Half their sales disappeared when gas went over the $1.20/liter mark. And they are finally scrapping the Aveo, which was little more than a crummy reheat of the venerable Chevette. Chevettes were kind of crude, but at least they were cheap.

GM made a lot of mistakes. Thinking about the FIAT X-1/9... GM kind of cloned it with the Fiero, and the early Fiero's were a disaster, with engine fires and such. But once they worked it out, and started putting in a decent V-6 engine - they scrapped it. Not that the Fiero would be a million car per year seller, but GM completely abandoned a market that became inhabited with cars like the MR-2 and the Miata.

GM also had a winner with the Hummer, at least in that price category. Then they came out with that fake H2 garbage, a Tahoe in disguise with glued on plastic parts, really something not to take off road. No wonder why they are going down.

Everyone was making fun of cars like the Scion and Element, but considering that Ford is bringing the Flex out, while GM, they have nothing. They never did bring out their cool looking pickup truck that they were using to "create interest". Sure, people were interested, but a trip to the local GM dealership soon knocked out any enthusiasm. At least at Ford you could buy an SVT Lightning if so inclined.

The Lada Neva 4x4 was very much like driving a tractor, loud and nasty but at the same time a blast to go off road in because really, if you broke something, anyone with some decent welding skills could put it back together. In fact, I think it actually used a tractor drivetrain. The old International Scouts were quite the vehicle in the off road class, very primitive but very fun at the same time.


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## rebekahqc (Apr 27, 2008)

WOW, I didn't know we had and electric car company in Quebec. I drive a Prius and love it. It is a 2001 with over 100,000K and still rolling along getting 6L/100K
I would love to have the fully electric car option.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

Speak to GM about that one.

They were way ahead of the curve on that one.

About 20 years ago.

Then California relented on emission standards, and they junked the entire program.

Literally.


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## jeepguy (Apr 4, 2008)

EvanPitts said:


> GM also had a winner with the Hummer.


One slight correction
Hummer is made by AM General and sold by GM. GM had a license agreement for the "HUMMER" name which they bastardized. I visited the plant once when I was working in the auto industry, I worked on some electronic stuff for them, my friend still does design work for them. It was amazing to see so many in one place.

We use to call the Fireo, the Flamereo. It's amazing that they have all but disappeared considering they were plastic.


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## Jason H (Feb 1, 2004)

Adrian. said:


> Hyundai makes some nice cars. I think it is the Sonata I was about a week ago and I must say it was a pretty luxurious car. Brand aside I would say it could possible compete with a BMW 745 or the likes. At less than half the price of a beamer you can't beat it.
> 
> The Veracruz is very nice as well.


Sonata vs a BMW 745? I think not.
Perhaps 3 series.


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## Adrian. (Nov 28, 2007)

Jason H said:


> Sonata vs a BMW 745? I think not.
> Perhaps 3 series.


I've been in both and I can say that the fully loaded Sonata is definitely very nice on the inside. The outside and drive are an entirely different matter. I would never get a 745 anyways...its a grandpa car. For the price I could be in a Nissan GTR or half way to a Spyker:clap: .


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Adrian. said:


> ...its a grandpa car.


And just what's wrong with my car?


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

The new Hummers (the H2) are made by GM - as they are nothing more than a different body draped over a Denali. The originals were cool, way over the top; the new ones, I don't think I'd even take them on a gravel driveway. I have never seen the H3 around, perhaps as popular as the Lincoln Blackwood.

They had quite a problem with engine fires on the early Fieros, but GM pretty much had all of that sorted out by the time they were using the V-6, so of course, being GM, they cancel the whole project. However the process lived on, as the techniques were used to built the Saturn. (which oddly enough, also had a problem with engine fires.)

AMC (if anyone remembers them) used to sell a car called the Fuego, Spanish for Fire, and of course, like all other cars named after fire, they also had engine fire problems. Well, perhaps the Firebird didn't have engine fires, but it was just a rebadged Camaro.

And they were saying on the radio that GM hasn't had a profit since 1994, maybe they shouldn't have put Asuna out of business so quickly???


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## Andrew Pratt (Feb 16, 2007)

They also said the shareholders were upset that the CEO of GM made almost 16M last year...seems a lofty pay scale for a GM presiding over a money loosing company!


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

The Sonata competes with the Camry, Accord, 6, Altima, G6, Fusion, etc. It is no where near Bimmer territory. 

The new Genesis that's coming out soon on the other hand is supposed to have the power and handling of a 5 series, have the amenities and finish of a 7 series, but have a price of a 3 series. That's how marketing describes it at least. I think it's time for Hyundai to create a luxury division instead of trying to cram everything under their one brand name. Just like VW with the Jetta and the failed Phaeton.


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## jeepguy (Apr 4, 2008)

EvanPitts said:


> I have never seen the H3 around, perhaps as popular as the Lincoln Blackwood.


I've only seen one (H3), and I drive 200km a day. My wife refers to the H2 as the wannabe. I don't think I've seen a Blackwood, and yesterday I saw a Lincoln Zephyr, they used to have Mercury Zephyr back in the late 70's early 80's.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

iJohnHenry said:


> Speak to GM about that one.
> 
> They were way ahead of the curve on that one.
> 
> ...


Yeah those EV1's were loved by all their owners. Of course the owners couldn't buy them, only lease them. And I believe every one went to the crusher (except for the odd disabled one in a museum), even though many owners wanted to buy them at any price. GM's idiotic management couldn't see the future.


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## Adrian. (Nov 28, 2007)

American cars devalue way too fast!

Hey Sinc,

Why not pull up your knee socks and get an Alpina B7:

YouTube - Roadfly.com - Racing in a 2007 BMW Alpina B7

It puts hair on your chest thats for sure!

Cheers


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

Adrian. said:


> American cars devalue way too fast!
> 
> Hey Sinc,
> 
> ...


I had my time in my teens and twenties driving plenty of fast cars in my day. Kinda grew up on stock car dirt tracks.

Ran funny cars at the strip with over 600 HP at one time too.

But those days are over and my little Suzuki Grand Vitara Limited 4 x 4 serves my purposes quite well.

As for a Beemer or Mercedes, sorry but I find them to be over rated, over priced status symbols.


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## jeepguy (Apr 4, 2008)

Adrian. said:


> American cars devalue way too fast!
> 
> Hey Sinc,
> 
> ...


I see at least 1 guy a day getting the Hook, from the OPP on the 400 for doing 50km over the limit.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

jeepguy said:


> I've only seen one (H3), and I drive 200km a day. My wife refers to the H2 as the wannabe. I don't think I've seen a Blackwood, and yesterday I saw a Lincoln Zephyr, they used to have Mercury Zephyr back in the late 70's early 80's.


We used to have a customer that got suckered, urr, purchased a Blackwood. It was basically a Ford Excursion, but it had this dinky sized box at the back, so it was kind of like a gaint SUV / fake pick-up truck. What was really sad was the customer wanted to take a patio set up north, but could only fit half if it in the giant 12MPG Blackwood - while I mounded two complete sets plus extra chairs into a Mazda MPV (when they were quite a bit smaller than now).

They are rare, and I think Ford only managed to sell about 2,500 of them across North America. I have no idea what they were thinking, since the box impeded access to the rear storage area inside, and the box was perhaps 2" long, and could barely hold a weeks worth of groceries. Come to think about it, the dude couldn't even pick up both of his computers with monitors in the same trip. It was just a bad idea.


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## iJohnHenry (Mar 29, 2008)

They actually got a woman this time.

On High.35, speed limit 80, doing 131.

Bye bye car.

Hello 7 day licence suspension.


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## PoliceDog (May 1, 2008)

jeepguy said:


> " ...My wife refers to the H2 as the wannabe....."


Then she probably considers the H3 as the "Wannabe Grande"? I love threads like this - especially hearing again and again the sheer "hatred" that people have for some vehicles because of looks, assumptions, myths, etc. My wife said there's no passion left in the world - she's never stood around a parked H2 surrounded by a group of strangers all slagging this tarted-up Tahoe, the owner, his kids, his mother.


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## PoliceDog (May 1, 2008)

Jason H said:


> Sonata vs a BMW 745? I think not...


Yes, that might be a bit of a stretch. LOL (My sister owns one, my son the other.) But the current Sonata is light years beyond the original and most automotive journalists have given it their blessing as a true "bargain" when ranked against Honda and Toyota, the "standards".


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## jeepguy (Apr 4, 2008)

PoliceDog said:


> Then she probably considers the H3 as the "Wannabe Grande"? I love threads like this - especially hearing again and again the sheer "hatred" that people have for some vehicles because of looks, assumptions, myths, etc. My wife said there's no passion left in the world - she's never stood around a parked H2 surrounded by a group of strangers all slagging this tarted-up Tahoe, the owner, his kids, his mother.


It has nothing to do with looks, it has to do with Original HumVee open top as opposed to a Hummer (h2,h3) in name only. Having done design work on the originals they are night and day apart, if GM had made it Open Roof they may have been forgiven. There's nothing like driving with no doors and the roof off, and if you are brave enough with the windshield down.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

jeepguy said:


> It has nothing to do with looks, it has to do with Original HumVee open top as opposed to a Hummer (h2,h3) in name only.


Not to mention that the military version is really cool, and at least in the US, the bulletproof Kevlar body and gun mount would be very handy for Sunday drives in Detroit. The H2 and H3 are just to commercial, like, why did they paint them with shiny paint and put chrome all over it? It should be very basic, olive drab or beige flat paint, maybe a rubber mat on the floor to protect the metal. It should make you want to go off road. Most people with the consumer versions will never go off road, let alone go on a gravel road. If GM sold the HumVee, they would be making some money.

But then again, I might have considered a GM if not for the crummy Corsica that I had. That car had so many defects and so many breakdowns that I just gave up on GM entirely. It would be simpler just to list what I didn't replace on that piece of junk: the windshield, the right tail light, the radiator and the seats. (Some items were replaced by the insurance company after a clueless chick ran into my car, not noticing the fact that I was stopped at a stop sign, so perhaps those parts were not GM's fault. But then again, she was driving a GM that they had to write off because it shoved the engine back into the firewall and broke the car up pretty badly. And that was one sad GM, considering that it lost so badly to a Corsica. GM - innovators in flimsiness.)

Next to oil changes and those things noted in the service manual, I have never had any repairs done in six years on my Corolla, and except for a roofing nail in my tire in February, nothing done on my Matrix. Not even a light bulb.


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## PoliceDog (May 1, 2008)

jeepguy said:


> It has nothing to do with looks, it has to do with Original HumVee open top as opposed to a Hummer (h2,h3) in name only. Having done design work on the originals they are night and day apart, if GM had made it Open Roof they may have been forgiven. There's nothing like driving with no doors and the roof off, and if you are brave enough with the windshield down.


I had a silver H1 wagon for a while (long before the H2 was a gleam in a marketer's eye). For what it was, the ride and handling were outstanding. The seats were....well, you better have a butt like a teenage ballerina!  

Of course it's about "looks" when it comes to the unwashed masses; of course the H1/H2/H3 are "night and day apart". I understand. Tell this to the Birkenstock Brigade and you'll just get blank looks. When I had it, it was a working truck - I used the roof of the wagon as a raised photo platform. The guy down the street has his restaurant logo plastered all over his H2. If that works for him, good.

Let me see if I can find that H2 website I mentioned...


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## PoliceDog (May 1, 2008)

Here ya go!  

FUH2 | **** You And Your H2

My favorite "I Hate Hummers!" website.

(I'm still waiting for the photo-posting of some skinny surfer flipping off a parked H2 - while the 350-pound rapper/fullback owner is having his lunch inside  )

[edit: Oops, sorry about that. For once I'm glad the forum software is set up the way it is. My apologies to anyone who may be offended. ]


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