# 'Let's All Hate Toronto'



## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

The dislike of Canada's biggest city, Toronto, in the rest of the country runs so deep that a filmmaker has made a documentary about it.

"People in Toronto are soulless, one-eyed corporate zombies," Joey Keithley, of the Vancouver punk band D.O.A., says in the film, "Let's All Hate Toronto."

The 73-minute film, which premieres at Toronto's Hot Docs documentary festival next week, follows a character called Mister Toronto, who embarks on a cross-Canada trip brandishing a sign that reads "Toronto Appreciation Day" and steels himself for the onslaught.

*Click here to read more "'Let's All Hate Toronto'"*


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## John Clay (Jun 25, 2006)

I suppose it all evens out though, since many Torontonians have great dislike for the Prairie provinces.

I look forward to watching this film.

Edit:

Link to Hot Docs page for it:
Hot Docs: Canadian International Documentary Festival Presents : Let's All Hate Toronto


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## absolutetotalgeek (Sep 18, 2005)

:lmao: :lmao: That's great.


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## JumboJones (Feb 21, 2001)

The rest of Canada? I thought Toronto was Canada.


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## absolutetotalgeek (Sep 18, 2005)

Well some people think Quebec is in Canada. OOOOH!!!


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Toronto is the slightly embarrassing, rather spendthrift suburb of Mississauga


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## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

A great line I heard once is that Toronto is the cleanest and safest American city on the continent. Oh yeah, I went there. beejacon


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## GratuitousApplesauce (Jan 29, 2004)

Can I say for the record that I don't hate Toronto. I haven't been there now since '94 but I lived there for a few years and think it has many good points. A nice place to visit, but I wouldn't want to live there — anymore. Now that I've connected with the Gulf Islands I couldn't see living anywhere else.

I feel like the main problem with Toronto, one shared by most large cities, is that many of it's citizens become so immersed in the city that they can't seem to look beyond it's borders. You can see the same arrogance to greater or lesser degrees in large cities everywhere, London, New York, even Vancouver. It just goes with becoming the biggest city in a country or region.


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## PenguinBoy (Aug 16, 2005)

ShawnKing said:


> "People in Toronto are soulless, one-eyed corporate zombies,"


I thought those folks all moved out here


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## SINC (Feb 16, 2001)

I always enjoyed my visits to Toronto, outside the boardroom that is.


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## Myradon (May 13, 2005)

I've only visited Toronto's airport, but it did have the rudest staff I have ever encountered while traveling. That includes the folks at Australian airports :/

As a city, and as for the people at large, I reserve judgement.


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

Beej said:


> A great line I heard once is that Toronto is the cleanest and safest American city on the continent.


Most Americans who have visited Canada have visited Toronto and they are all impressed by how "clean and safe" the city is.


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

GratuitousApplesauce said:


> Can I say for the record that I don't hate Toronto.


Neither do I - I just think there are so many better places to live. 


> You can see the same arrogance to greater or lesser degrees in large cities everywhere, London, New York, even Vancouver.


Wait a minute - New York *deserves* its arrogance.


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## absolutetotalgeek (Sep 18, 2005)

> Wait a minute - New York *deserves* its arrogance


Sure, being the most polluted city in America will do that, sweet party on NYC!


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

absolutetotalgeek said:


> Sure, being the most polluted city in America will do that, sweet party on NYC!


Huh? Who said NYC was the most polluted in America?


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Good for you, ShawnKing. We need to rally round NYC and defend her honor. Greatest city in the world. "Death before dishonor".

Paix, mon ami.


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## absolutetotalgeek (Sep 18, 2005)

I saw it on a news site, some report about emissions or something or other being higher because of all the buildings and how emission have risen like 10% or something. I'll try and find it again. To be fair, haha, I think it was referring to emissions only. 

In trying to find where I saw that I came across another blurb about how Butte Montana may be number 1, something about Toxic waste. Hmmm....

Not to start anything here, but why exactly is NYC the 'greatest' city in the world?


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

"Not to start anything here, but why exactly is NYC the 'greatest' city in the world?" I should have written that New York City is The Greatest City in the World. Mea culpa. I stand corrected.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Personally, I don't hate TO, GTA, or people from TO/GTA. It's a nice small city. 

Personal disclosure -- I LOVE Montreal. Best city in Canada.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

> 'Let's All Hate Toronto'


OK


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Now, now, Ottawaman. Lest we forget, the Sens are in the Stanley Cup playoffs and the Leafs are not. Play nicely with your neighbors.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

DR G, Ottawa is the home of a very large 5th column of Toronto fans. they come to all the Ottawa/ Toronto games. Unlike you they do not embrace the new home that is their economic benefactor.
They take great pleasure in the fact that they have spoiled our playoff hopes in recent years.
They must pay!
If my chest were a cannon , I would shoot my heart at them (or words to that effect)
Cheers,
OM


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## gwillikers (Jun 19, 2003)

I refuse to discriminate against Toronto alone. Instead, I hate Leafs fans no matter where they reside.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

gwillikers said:


> I refuse to discriminate against Toronto alone. Instead, I hate Leafs fans no matter where they reside.


lol


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

gw, if you and O-man can't stop throwing sand at TO and Leaf's fans, I am going to have to ask both of you to get out of the sandbox.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

A man must hold true to his beliefs, no matter what the risk. Do what you must Dr G.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

O-man, you were warned. Two minutes in the "time out" corner. Once more, and there will be no snacks for you during recess.


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

Sounds like a lot of people have Toronto envy.


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## Gerbill (Jul 1, 2003)

Naw, I don't hate Toronto. I've only visited once, and was especially impressed with the air pollution and the irritating black squirrels, but we have both of those items right here in BC as well, just not to the same extent


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

Wanna hear some trash talk about St, John's instead?


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

guytoronto said:


> Sounds like a lot of people have Toronto envy.


says the man with a giant phallic image as his avatar


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## gwillikers (Jun 19, 2003)

Dr.G. said:


> gw, if you and O-man can't stop throwing sand at TO and Leaf's fans, I am going to have to ask both of you to get out of the sandbox.


But it's fun! :lmao:


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Two minutes for you as well, gw.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

Dr.G. said:


> Two minutes for you as well, gw.


Sounds like enough time for a beer GW, cheers


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

There shall be no beer in the time-out corner, O-man. Any more from you will get you five minutes in "The Den o' Doxies". You do NOT want to be sent there. Trust me on this fact of life.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

but I'll bring Kibble-Doxie manna


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

They are fed only natural food, NOT Kibble.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

Pssst Kibble is manufactured in Toronto Dr G.
The new sodom and gomorrah


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

That's it, O-man. Five minutes in "The Den o' Doxies", aks "Little Debbie's Den o' Doom". You were warned. Keep in mind that these doxies are from Chicago ............. south Chicago ................ the tough part of town.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

Should I lay down so they can bite my ankles?


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Keep it up, and I shall throw some pessimistic Leafs fans into the pit.


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

Dr G, if I should fall to your dreaded hound's o' hell, my cat Max and the ghost of my old dog Chico the German shepard, will combine forces to avenge my downfall. 
You do not wish to have this unholy alliance visited upon you (or the doxies


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

It is written, "Blessed are the doxies, for they shall inherit the earth." As well, it is written that "He that troubleth his own house shall inherit the wind; and the foolish shall be servant to the wise of heart."


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## Ottawaman (Jan 16, 2005)

Yes, and it is also written by the wise sages MACLEAN AND MACLEAN; "What do you do on a lonely night in Toronto?"


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

toronto.com, Toronto Club Guide, Lounges, Nightclubs, Nightlife, Pubs, Club Events, DJ's, Live Music, Dance Clubs & more


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

NYC & Company: New York City's Official Tourism Website for Tourists, Journalists, Travel Professionals, and Meeting Planners


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## imactheknife (Aug 7, 2003)

Gerbill said:


> Naw, I don't hate Toronto. I've only visited once, and was especially impressed with the air pollution and the irritating black squirrels, but we have both of those items right here in BC as well, just not to the same extent


ever seen the squirrels in Waterloo? man there like Small dogs....GRRRR...and there everywhere...must be something in the water....

I actually like Toronto...I like the oldness and the history...I do hate the smell of downtown but that goes for most big cities...

The part about TO that I don't like is a lot of people think very HIGHLY of themselves when your there....and it's that ignorance I dislike...I met a guy in Collingwood and he was like YEAH I am from the CITY....and I didn't know what he was talking about...so I was like COOL which one? and he was like TORONTO man! and I bowed down and kissed his feet...or felt like I had too! I said man I from Calgary the best City in Canada and he freaked out and left....HEHE


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## mrjimmy (Nov 8, 2003)

imactheknife said:


> I actually like Toronto...I like the oldness and the history...I do hate the smell of downtown but that goes for most big cities...


I basically live in downtown TO and I remember the first time going to NYC and thinking how much it stank (except the Upper East Side of course...). Although it's New York City, it's forgivable.

I have never found Toronto to have any definable stench. Of course lower Spadina can be rank at times but other than that...


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

Dr.G. said:


> Good for you, ShawnKing. We need to rally round NYC and defend her honor.


Well, NYC doesn't need any defending from me - I'm just trying to get facts. 

I agree NYC isn't the cleanest city in the world but "the most polluted"? Hardly. Although, on any given day in July, it can smell awfully ripe.


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## mrjimmy (Nov 8, 2003)

New York is nothing compared to Mexico City.


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

absolutetotalgeek said:


> Not to start anything here, but why exactly is NYC the 'greatest' city in the world?


Ever been there? 

NYC has an energy and a vitality I've never felt from any other city in the world (and I've been in a lot of "world cities").

Everything you want (culturally) is in NYC - art, music, theater, sports, nightlife, etc. NYC *doesn't* have the breadth of outdoor activities that a Vancouver has but it all depends on what you want.

My wife and I went to the Guggenheim Museum for the first time to see an exhibit:








Amazing artwork, amazing building. We leave and we're walking along 5th Avenue, next to Central Park when I look down a side street and see this sign:








We walk down to the gallery and there's another exhibit - this one of Van Gogh and the artists he influenced. We didn't even know it was in town (it had started the day before).

That's the kind of city NYC is - you can just be walking around and have the most amazing experiences. 

So far in New York, I've met Judd Hirsch:








Jerry Rice:








(My wife was *very* excited about that one  )
Greg Anthony - formerly of the Vancouver Grizzlies and now of ESPN:








And played Madden 07 with New York Giants Defensive End, Osi Umenyiora:








(Who really isn't all that big  )

I've seen more Broadway plays in the past 6 months than I have in my entire life (well, that's not really fair....I'd never seen a one until I got here  ) and will finally get to a New York Yankees game sometime this summer. 

NYC may not be *the* "Greatest City in the World" but it sure as heck is Top 3.


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

Ottawaman said:


> If my chest were a cannon , I would shoot my heart at them (or words to that effect)


Yeah - but you'd only do it once.


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

imactheknife said:


> I actually like Toronto...I like the oldness and the history...


If you like history - go East, young man! 

You can get to Halifax (a very historic city) but across the pond is where "history" really begins.

I was in London, England last year for the MacExpo and we had beers in a pub that had a sign outside that said, "Rebuilt - 1667" (!)

People had been getting drunk in that place *200* years before Canada was a country!


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

mrjimmy said:


> New York is nothing compared to Mexico City.


"Nothing"? In what way?


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## mrjimmy (Nov 8, 2003)

ShawnKing said:


> "Nothing"? In what way?


I should have been more clear - as far as pollution and 'stink'.

You are quite an NYC booster. I love it as well. I have a good friend living there whom I visit quite often.

Although comparing NYC with Toronto is like comparing apples and oranges. Two totally different beasts.


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## djstp (Mar 10, 2006)

mrjimmy said:


> New York is nothing compared to Mexico City.



comparing any one city to another is like comparing rocks on a beach....


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## mrjimmy (Nov 8, 2003)

Not when it's pollution and stink you are talking about.


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

NYC does have a lot going for it and astoundingly I have found the people in its bars more friendly and open to conversation than in Toronto

Toronto spends too much time comparing itself to other cities and classifying itself as a "world class city"

Toronto is cleaner and safer than NYC, but how safe is any big city?
Unfortunately Toronto never got around to building a proper subway system and we now see the bad traffic jam resulting in some of the longest commute times in North America

NYC has something to offer everyone
pizza like you've never had pizza in Toronto
bars like McSorley's
Leshko's deli/restaurant
museums up the wazoo as mentioned earlier in this thread

but of course you need to be a "city person"

Toronto will be paying for their lack of subways and I don't know if the LTRs proposed for the city are too little too late

you do see a lot more garbage on the streets in NYC than in Toronto

one of neatest things I ever remember about NYC is in Manhattan (where I spend 99% of my time) seeing umbrella sellers pop out on almost every corner when it starts to rain

it was something out of sci-fi movie...


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## mrjimmy (Nov 8, 2003)

MACSPECTRUM said:


> Toronto is cleaner and safer than NYC, but how safe is any big city?


I'd actually stick my neck out and say Manhattan is now safer than TO.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

New York, NY -- so nice, they named it twice.


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

Dr.G. said:


> New York, NY -- so nice, they named it twice.


"The City So Nice They Named It Twice"


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Very true, Michael. Very true.


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

mrjimmy said:


> I should have been more clear - as far as pollution and 'stink'.


Ah.


> You are quite an NYC booster.


LOL Not at all. I just like the city. But I like Halifax, San Francisco, London, Paris, Tokyo and Vancouver more.


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## ShawnKing (Mar 21, 2005)

Dr.G. said:


> New York, NY -- so nice, they named it twice.


Or, as New Yorkers say, "They named it twice but only paved it once." 

NYC has some of the nastiest roads you'll ever drive on.


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

ShawnKing said:


> But I like Halifax, San Francisco, London, Paris, Tokyo and Vancouver more.


There's just no accounting for some tastes.


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## Lawrence (Mar 11, 2003)

Having been born in Toronto and forced to live and work here
I have noticed that Toronto has lost a lot of its culture,
It's a city that doesn't know who they are and the have nots want what the haves have.

Whatever that is.

People don't drive in Toronto, They just hog the road.
Went to Windsor Ontario last month and felt a lot more comfortable there than here.
If given the choice I'd move out of Toronto if I could.

Dave


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

"NYC has some of the nastiest roads you'll ever drive on." ShawnKing, you obviously have never driven in St.John's. Joggers have been lost in our infamous potholes.


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

Dr.G. said:


> "NYC has some of the nastiest roads you'll ever drive on." ShawnKing, you obviously have never driven in St.John's. Joggers have been lost in our infamous potholes.


joggers in NL have also been known to be lost due to jiggers of screech


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

Michael, have you ever had homemade Screech? It is called "Block and Tackle". After a few drinks of that brew, if you are still able to walk a block here in St.John's, and not fall into a pothole, you are able to tackle anything a St.John's winter can throw at you.


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## gwillikers (Jun 19, 2003)

Dr.G. said:


> "NYC has some of the nastiest roads you'll ever drive on." ShawnKing, you obviously have never driven in St.John's. Joggers have been lost in our infamous potholes.


I thought that the pothole crown went to my hometown of Regina.
A great city in which to sell/install shocks and struts for sure.


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

gw, my wife has relatives from Regina, and when they came here to St. John's to visit us one spring, they were amazed at the depth and width of our potholes. Thus, we keep the prize for the worst weather in Canada, and the biggest/deepest potholes.


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## gwillikers (Jun 19, 2003)

Dr.G. said:


> gw, my wife has relatives from Regina, and when they came here to St. John's to visit us one spring, they were amazed at the depth and width of our potholes. Thus, we keep the prize for the worst weather in Canada, and the biggest/deepest potholes.


Well heck Dr. G, lets invest in a St. John's automotive suspension shop then! :greedy: :lmao:


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## Dr.G. (Aug 4, 2001)

gw, all such repair shops are owned and operated by the City of St.John's. They were socialized about 38 years ago when it was discovered how much money could be made here, especially since the infrastructure budget for road repairs never gets above $73.81. Of course, we don't have any property taxes here in St.John's because of this arrangement.


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## Zoiks (Sep 5, 2005)

guytoronto said:


> Sounds like a lot of people have Toronto envy.



GuyToronto, you are a very dry, sarcastic, funny man. When I'm old and grumpy, can we hang out on the same porch in our rocking chairs and tell stories 'like how it used to be' while watching the world go by?

That would be fun!


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## Max (Sep 26, 2002)

dolawren said:


> Having been born in Toronto and forced to live and work here
> I have noticed that Toronto has lost a lot of its culture,
> It's a city that doesn't know who they are and the have nots want what the haves have.
> 
> ...


Can't say as I agree to this at all. I too was born here. Moved away in the mid-80s and returned nearly 8 years later. Not a bad place at all. I don't think the city has lost a lot of its culture. I don't even know what that could possibly mean. It's a _city_. There are millions of people in the GTA... there's culture up the wazoo. I would instead say that the city's culture is evolving, but that's to be expected; any healthy city must adapt to new circumstances or die. I find much to celebrate in Toronto. Last night I was on the Danforth - went to Allen's for a birthday dinner for an old university friend, then popped next door to the Dora for a Kilkenny... both places were hopping, the sidewalks were streaming with people ought for dining and partying... I dunno, it seemed pretty cool to me. I mostly applaud the changes this city has gone through in the years I've been alive. The pathetic days of _Toronto the Good_ and _Toronto the Dull_ are long gone. We could still use a whole host of improvements, sure. But I don't feel any great angst over what this city has become, or what's in store for its future. You speak of economic disparities - the have-nots coveting what the haves enjoy - but that's an old story and I've seen it in other cities. I don't think Toronto is any different.

As for Windsor, it's a smaller place... bound to be slower, more sedate. Drivers are probably more relaxed, I'm sure, but that's because there's not millions of them all trying to use the same over-crowded highways and arterials. I mean, it's just not a fair comparison to make. I'd like to see how well Windsorites would do on Toronto's roads - would they retain their gentle composure?

I do agree that driving in this city has become pretty hairy. I noticed this when I moved back to the city. The number of cars tearing through intersections, making a hasty left on an amber, then a red... it's insane. That part of it I find appalling, but I suppose it's made a better defensive driver of me. The silver lining, I suppose.

Finally, I am sorry you feel trapped in Toronto. You ought to do yourself a favour and do something to alleviate that feeling. Life is too short... if a place is sucking the soul out of you, you should try as much as possible to leave it, period. Lots of worthy destinations to check out... plenty of Canadians are feeling the tug of the cities rising in the West, flush with cash, opportunities and a sense of a new frontier awaiting. Or you could simply relocate to a much smaller community. There are plenty of cool little towns and hamlets in southern Ontario, within two or three hour's driving distance from Toronto... big cities are certainly not suited to everyone's nature.


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## Ohenri (Nov 7, 2002)

guytoronto said:


> Sounds like a lot of people have Toronto envy.


Agreed. GT, we need to hang out indeed.

Can't believe what I'm hearing. Hey, all depends what ppl value for lifestyle. That's really it. You like the quieter life, you can hang in any other city. 

I love Toronto. I lived on Queen W for years (until last sept) and I miss it dearly. I'm only 10 mins away, but it's just not the same... LOL.

In any case, 416 all day. 

H!


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## kevs~just kevs (Mar 21, 2005)

i'm bored so i thought i'd open this can of worms again...

I'm from Peterborough but I've been an east end Toronto (beaches) boy for the last 5 yrs, the beaches are a gorgeous place to live, but a little far from certain things if you don't have a car. We moved further west into the downtown this past winter and now I feel like I know what people mean when they say Toronto is dirty. I still love this city though. I love that for $100/month I can have unlimited travel from Scarborough to the border of Massasauga or from The harbor to Yonge and Steels and every where in-between. I love that if we want to try something different for dinner we have more options then we know what to do with. I love that I can experience different cultures to an extent by walking down a particular street. I love that I can be on a subway car with 50 other people and be the only one speaking English (happened this morning). To me that's just really cool. That's the T.O. that I know and love. In my opinion people see what they want to see in order to satisfy there preconceived idea's about this city, myself included.


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