# Need help DECIDING!!!



## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Hi, I am a 12 year old kid (an apple fanatic) and I would love to get my first apple computer. I have thought between the mac mini, the imac and the emac. I am on a super tight budget and need help deciding. If you dont know how intense of an apple fan i am, I have owned 5 ipods throughout my life, I was number 638 in line at the apple store when it opened and I am planning to work at the apple store as soon as I turn 18.

I appreciate your help,

Daniel


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

With the phrase, "on a super-tight budget," it leads me to believe that your best bet would be the Mac mini, considering its the cheapest of your 3 options. However, if you don't already own a keyboard, mouse, and monitor, the Mac mini will quickly enter eMac land in terms of price, and make the eMac the better choice. Do you already have the KMM combo?


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## PirateMyke (Jul 14, 2005)

eMac

p.s. good luck kid, i remember when i was like you all excited about my first mac... and now im 18... and really... i still haven't gotten my dream machine


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thanks for the luck. I have a PC with a keyboard and mouse and monitor, I know the monitor will work, but will the keyboard and mouse? And what id the KMM combo?


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

audiodan said:


> Thanks for the luck. I have a PC with a keyboard and mouse and monitor, I know the monitor will work, but will the keyboard and mouse?


If they're USB-based, yes. PS/2 isn't going to cut it.  (unless you have an adaptor, but I couldn't verify if Macs support PS/2 > USB adaptors.)


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Nope, they aren't USB based. What system do you use Lars?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

and I will ask again, what is the KMM combo?


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## mr.steevo (Jul 22, 2005)

audiodan said:


> I am on a super tight budget and need help deciding.... I am planning to work at the apple store as soon as I turn 18.


Hi,

eMac gives the best speed for the money. My friend has a 1ghz that is significantly faster than my 1ghz iBook. The eMac also is later in its life cycle and has the bugs worked out. Compared to the mini the eMac has a better graphics card, faster hard drive, larger hard drive max, and is less likely to get knocked off a desk. The mini has a tested RAM limit of 1gb but I read on one of these boards that the eMac can accomodate 2gb.

Of course you may just like the look of the mini.

Super tight budget means to me that the iMac is really out of the question.

Also, can't you work at 16?

s.


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

See my sig. 

KMM - Keyboard, Mouse, Monitor.


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## jonmon (Feb 15, 2002)

5 ipods?!

wow you must have generous parents and/or grandparents


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I have about $519 and a mom contibution, but I need a mouse and keyboard. The people at apple say I can drop in my resume at 18


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Jonmon, I have actually made my ipod money by selling things on ebay. By that I mean buying stuff cheap and reselling it for more


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

USB keyboards and mice are cheap - like $15 a piece. Buy the Mac mini. You got the monitor, and the keyboard/mouse are cheap parts to get your hands on.


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## mr.steevo (Jul 22, 2005)

audiodan said:


> and I will ask again, what is the KMM combo?


I think he meant KMV (keyboard mouse video) KMM could mean keyboard mouse monitor. If you have those then the mini is usable imediately, otherwise you have to buy the things. As your plugs are not USB you will have to buy them for the mini. Not a big deal $10 for a mouse $40 for a keyboard.

s.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Where can I get keyboard and mouse for 15 dollars earch? and does the mac mine even have enough USB ports for em? Because, I wanna transfer some tunes from its itunes to ma ipod as well, will it be able to house 3 USB ports?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Where can you get a mouse for $10, the cheapest I saw on apple.ca was 20 bucks


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## mr.steevo (Jul 22, 2005)

audiodan said:


> Where can I get keyboard and mouse for 15 dollars earch? and does the mac mine even have enough USB ports for em? Because, I wanna transfer some tunes from its itunes to ma ipod as well, will it be able to house 3 USB ports?



http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1474174&sku=D15-1044

iPod should use fireWire

s.


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## uwbill (Feb 9, 2005)

just to confirm that Mac Mini does support ps2 -> usb adapter.

I have a Mac Mini hooked up with my Samsung 172N monitor and a nobranad $5 windows keyboard, plus a Logitech mouse. The keyboard (PS2) connects to the USB hub with an adapter. It works fine!!!

Running tiger with the 256mb ram, ok if you just browse and check emails. but quite frankly, i'm a lot more satisifed when using my PBook with 768MB ram but 1GHz cpu.


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## uwbill (Feb 9, 2005)

btw, go to craigslist.org and you can find tons of cheap stuff, 2nd hand


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Wow that cheap


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## ncoffey (Apr 6, 2005)

Well, the mac mini is $629 plus tax. You could add on $104 for the apple keyboard and mouse combo or, you could go to your local futureshop or less well known computer shop and probably spend about 50 bucks on a usb keyboard/mouse combo.


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## ncoffey (Apr 6, 2005)

audiodan said:


> Where can you get a mouse for $10, the cheapest I saw on apple.ca was 20 bucks


http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/pr...angid=EN&sku_id=0665000FS10063393&catid=14266

They don't have any available online, but they're in stock in my local futureshop.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thank you guys soooo much you are sooooo helpful!


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## DoNotPokeTheScreen (Jun 9, 2005)

I personally think the eMac is a lot better than mac mini... just because i own an eMac  

The mac mini houses all laptop hardware, which means even though the processor speed is the same or higher than the eMac, it will still perform subpar compared to the eMac, since the eMac uses actual desktop components... it has a faster hard drive at the very least.

eMac is beautiful!! i love mine! but damn, the mac mini sure saves a lotta space... i want that too...


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

If I get the emac, I will need twice the money I have! I would rather get the cheaper thing to start me off. Maybe when I am 18 and working for apple I will get the 30" display with a powermac! hehehe (im a dreamer)


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Hey there, audiodan. Welcome to ehMac 

audiodan, I suggest at least getting an Apple pro keyboard. Reason being that it has two USB ports on it, one of which that you plug your mouse into. The net result will be two free USB ports for your printer, camera, whatever. Also, the Command key (on either side of the Apple keyboard's spacebar) will be consistent with the OS, versus having to use the ALT key on a Windows system, if I recall correctly.

You can use whatever USB mouse you want -- an right-click works! 

If you're buying a NEW Mac Mini, they are shipping with 512MB RAM; the minimum amount for comfortable use. The original Mac Minis, updated a couple of months ago, had 256MB RAM.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Im soooo confuzzeled! Tell me, how does this look? http://www.craigslist.org/sfc/sys/99960002.html


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

audiodan said:


> Im soooo confuzzeled! Tell me, how does this look? http://www.craigslist.org/sfc/sys/99960002.html


Not a bad price considering it includes a display, but that G4 is mightly slow compared to today's standards and applications.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

considering its extras, and my usings, should i look interested in it? Is it good quality for a beginer?


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## mr.steevo (Jul 22, 2005)

audiodan said:


> If I get the emac, I will need twice the money I have!



Then you've answered your question.

s.


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## monokitty (Jan 26, 2002)

audiodan said:


> considering its extras, and my usings, should i look interested in it? Is it good quality for a beginer?


What do you want to use your Mac for? (the biggest and most important question when picking a new machine.)


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I would use it for games, email, and exploring the system


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

and especcially MSN


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I have made a mistake in an earlier post, I have $571 to spend


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I figure, with taxes (stupid government and there 15 per cent) I am about 186.79 dollas away from a mac mini and this set of wireless keyboard and mouse. http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/pr...d=0665000FS10063393&catid=14266&test_cookie=1


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

What would you do in my situation?


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## DoNotPokeTheScreen (Jun 9, 2005)

well that's not far... only 186... your mom can cover that for you perhaps : )

somebody posted this already, but Apple Keyboard is strongly recommended.


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## tintin (Sep 19, 2005)

You don't need to spend more than $20 on a USB wireless keyboard and mouse.

www.cwo.ca

$17 for a Microsoft keyboard / mouse combo.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

What is the difference between the apple keyboard an the 1 i am think of (other than the USB bit)? And my mom says "It will take a few mothnes for me to contribute, talk to your dad about it" and ma dad is all like "I think its a waste of money, a comp uter is a computer"


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## tintin (Sep 19, 2005)

Of course, for $571 you could just skip the mac and build a kick-a$$ Windows system 

Just kidding folks. I've been an Apple user since 1983 and my II+. I'm in the market now for my 4 year old's first - looking for an iMac DV G3 400 or something like that if anyone has any leads.

[email protected]


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Logitech Cordless Freedom? 14 99?
http://www.cwo.ca/micekeyboards.php#combo


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## draz (Jun 13, 2005)

Where are you located? B/c that system was in the US. (i figure you are somewhere in Canada but could be wrong)

I think the cooler of the machiens would be the mini which would also have a higher resale value in the future. For when you get your 30" display and G5. In criagslist you can search by city - on the right hand side of the page. Look for your local city and check every day at lunch. Also you can place a want ad for an apple computer in your price range anonymously on your local craigslist for free.

The other thing you could consider is a used iBook..as some go for fairly cheap ($400 range)

Hopefully one of the ehmac members in your area might have a spare keyboard or mouse lying around they coudl give to a future mac afficionado. (Unfortunatelly i just gave away the mouse that came with my G5 otherwise it could have been yours) I personally prefer the trackballs. 

But take your time in buying your rig and always consider a used set up. They are often much cheaper then new. If you are in the Toronto area and are having trouble finding anytihng PM me and i can mention it to some of the guys from work who often sell their gear used.

Good luck.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I am in toronto, do you think you can get me a keyboard and mouse for a mac? that would be great! Thanks


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

that would make me only 150 short!


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## draz (Jun 13, 2005)

Keyboard no, but i will check at work Tomorrow to see if we have any spares.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thank you so much


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## draz (Jun 13, 2005)

As well CWO has some for $3.99!! But i am sure that someone on this board has a spare Dell keyboard lying around.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I have a dell keyboard right here, but sadly it isnt USB and i cant be bothered to go out and buy 1


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

What is the adapter called anyway?


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## Daktari (Feb 21, 2005)

audiodan said:


> I figure, with taxes (stupid government and there 15 per cent) I am about 186.79 dollas away from a mac mini and this set of wireless keyboard and mouse. http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/pr...d=0665000FS10063393&catid=14266&test_cookie=1


_System Requirements: IBM Compatible, Win98/ME/2000/XP, Available USB Or PS/2 Keyboard Port, PS/2 Mouse Port, CD-ROM Drive _

I don't think that its supported on the Mac platform, unless somone one can prove otherwise.

As an aside its nice to see a 12 year old who is polite unlike some of the less mature posters spread over the internet who act less than my shoe size in age. 

Welcome to ehMac audioDan!


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Daktari said:


> As an aside its nice to see a 12 year old who is polite unlike some of the less mature posters spread over the internet who act less than my shoe size in age.


And suspiciously excellent grammar. You sure you're not thirtysomething, audiodan??  You have NEVER expressed yourself in the following manner (actual copy-paste from an ehMac classified ad enquiry):

_"what part of Toronto are u in becuase im not from Toronto but im less than an hour out of Toronto so i will keep in touch im not completly sure yet"_

WOW! That's pretty bad!

Okay, you have about $570.00, and you want to do internet, and games... on a Mac 

First off, I'd suggest saving MORE money until you can afford a viable solution. A Mac Mini -- which you can't afford at $629.00 -- is a closed system that is underpowered graphically to really play games on. Sure, my son plays Jedi Academy and Indiana Jones on our Mini, but you really need 64MB GPU MINIMUM for the future. The tough thing is that, with that amount of money and type of intended use (the gaming part), you'll get a weak solution with almost every option you'd consider. For example, you could spend that on this used Mac Mini (going over your budget a little bit for taxes -- but take more time to maybe find other Minis in ehMac's classifieds), but as I said you're stuck with the graphics card or any other aspect of the Mini except for RAM. So, heavy gaming is a problem. You'd also still need an Apple keyboard. BUT, the CPU speed on the Mini is great, and the hard drive capacity is decent when compared to cheap used Powermacs. Also, with the Mac Mini, you get a great software bundle: iLife 05, Appleworks for your homework and school projects (it also reads/writes Word/Excel files as well) and a couple of obscure but decent games. The crime that Apple committed with the original Mac Mini is the 256MB RAM. 512MB is a comfortable minimum. You'd get by on the web thing with 256MB. But gaming? Don't think so. And if you wanted MORE RAM in a Mini, you'd have to pitch the original stick of 256MB because there is only ONE RAM SLOT in the Mini.

Now, there's the option of a cheap Powermac. You can get in on one CHEAP and upgrade anything on them over time as you can afford to (like I have done with my old Powermac). BUT, like I said there's no perfect solution within your budget, because an old "Sawtooth" Powermac's stock CPU & GPU would be too slow to run most modern games. Also, the cost of upgrading an old Powermac to equal a Mac Mini would be MORE than the price of a Mac Mini, itself. And yet, you can upgrade a Powermac to absolutely _smoke_ a Mac Mini. BUT, the software bundle would be lacking when compared to a Mac Mini or any recent i/eMac (BTW, I recommend NOT getting a laptop, as someone suggested previously).

*So*, I'd say to save your money until you can afford an entry-level G5 iMac, or Powermac with a minimum 800MHz CPU (which you;d still want to upgrade, but at least the GPU and optical would work for you). But if you WANT TO BUY NOW, some options are:

A Mac Mini would still blow your budget by a little bit, and you'd get a fast CPU, CD burning/DVD reading, a great software bundle, but a slow drive, minimal RAM and a sub-standard _non-upgradable_ gaming GPU. I would factor in an Apple keyboard and a USB mouse of your choosing. But hey; this guy is selling all you need, "throwing in" a 10GB iPod. Maybe he could be convinced to sell it WITHOUT the iPod at a price closer to your own (still surely over you $570.00, however)?

As for a used eMac of some sort, you'll get a slower non-upgradable CPU than the Mini, faster drive -- but everything else about the same --, the software bundle, keyboard, mouse and a 17" CRT (which you already have). At your budget, however, you would be leaving yourself with a comparatively slow, _non-upgradable_ CPU and GPU. To get an eMac with decent speed in these two areas would cost almost double your budget... at least a third more, anyway. I'd pass on an eMac given your CURRENT $$.

That leaves the option of a used Powermac: slow CPU, GPU, variable feature sets regarding optical drives, hard drives, RAM and software, possibly incapable of the gaming right off the bat, but offering the potential for great performance over time. Also, you can upgrade many components using PC parts (as I'll show, later). While it does get you on board the Apple Bus right now and UNDER budget and allowing you maybe an upgrade of something right off the bat, the ultimate price will be beyond an eMac... but it'll smoke an eMac. The choice is yours. Some Powermacs I found here at ehMac -- and for sale in Toronto:

G4/450 AGP graphics for $400.00. Upsides: Already has a very decent 640MB of RAM, a CDRW (you didn't mention the need -- but who DOESN'T need that?) and Mac OS X Panther (the previous version of Mac OS X). Downsides: insufficient CPU and GPU. Many modern games are now shipping on DVD. Hard drive on the small side.

G4/400 AGP graphics for $360.00. Upsides: Cheaper! In either case, with a 400 or 450MHz CPU you won't be gaming without CPU & GPU upgrades ANYWAY. But, you'll eventually be able to get a CPU upgrade faster than any newer _used_ Mac you can currently afford. So, the $40.00 you save on this one can go towards the upgrades. Other upsides: comfortable 40GB minimum drive size, DVD readability. Downsides: insufficient CPU & GPU. RAM is low, but you could get by with it for the web, as you can't play games on this as it is.

Possible upgrade solutions for either:

The American seller, Other World Computing, have WONDERFUL pages of stuff that you can drool over, just to get an idea of what's available for upgrading older Macs. You can also buy from them, as I did my dual 1.3GHz upgrade almost two years ago. There is also Small Dog Electronics in the US. At least see what is available, do the conversions, then consult Canadian retailers and see:

MacDoc can be difficult to get (and keep) in touch with, but off the cuff he's the "local guy" with the upgrade stuff. Carbon Computing is more dependable, but their _listed_ stock is pretty current (no "oldie finds" like MacDoc's ATI 9000 cards), and their CPU upgrade prices are ridiculous! Accurate Technologies are worth a call. I have NEVER dealt with them, but their pries are more reasonable. You can consult other dealers as well.

Components to consider:

MacDoc lists on his site a 64MB Radeon 9000 GPU for $99.00. That'll do.

A decently sized hard drive to add to a 20GB drive Mac -- but you could pass on this for now if you bought the used Powermac with the 40GB drive. For the other the minimum would be 40GB a Western Digital 7200rpm 8MB cache for $64.99 at PC store Canada Computers. Keep in mind that the ATA66 bus on these old Macs can only handle up around a 128GB drive. It won't any drive space beyond that. Go for a drive with an 8MB cache.

Also at Canada Computers, a swanky Pioneer dual layer DVDRW -- for only SIXTY BUCKS!!

A 512MB stick of RAM for CANADIAN$72.00. Again, get a sense of price here, then look around Canadian for a deal... or buy US as I have. If dad protests, coerce your favourite uncle's credit card into the job!

And as for which CPU upgrade to shoot for at some point? The fastest you can afford -- and don't bother with dual CPUs for gaming scenarios, just a fast single CPU. How about a butt-kicking 1.8GHz CPU? _ZOOM!_ But those CPUs are NOT cheap. So, you may be able get a Powermac today and upgrade one or two things, but not ALL the things for satisfactory performance RIGHT NOW.

Final word: save your money until you're ready to make the right purchases. The speed and feature sets you are considering today will only be cheaper tomorrow. like, imagine how cheap those 400MHz Powermacs -- cabpable of handling BIG CPU upgrades -- will cost three months from now? Or, how much closer would you be to a new G5 iMac by then?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thanks for the advice


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

and I am sure I am 12


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> and I am sure I am 12



LOL! Well, you're doing great  And if you can read through all that stuff I tossed up, you're DEFINITELY doing great for 12


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thank you Macaholic. Tell me, does this look good? http://www.ehmac.ca/classifieds/showproduct.php?product=3452


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## autopilot (Dec 2, 2004)

Kind of off-topic, but don't you have to acknowledge that you are 13 or older to sign up as a member here?


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## elmer (Dec 19, 2002)

or to sell things on eBay??


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I used a fake age, and I use my fathers acount to buy and sell on ebay


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## elmer (Dec 19, 2002)

12 years old and you're already joining a cult...


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

elmer said:


> 12 years old and you're already joining a cult...


Attaboy! 

_"And I shall call him... *MINI*-Macaholic!"_


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thank you Macaholic. Tell me, does this look good? http://www.ehmac.ca/classifieds/sho...hp?product=3452


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> Thank you Macaholic. Tell me, does this look good? http://www.ehmac.ca/classifieds/showproduct.php?product=3452


The other one -- only $40.00 more -- has a good load of RAM. If you added 512MB to the one you're looking at, it would cost MORE than the other one in total. OS X _really really_ likes RAM. Plus, the CPU is a tad quicker, which can't hurt until you upgrade it. The other one has a CDRW as well. Even though big games come on DVD, the price of that Pioneer dual-layer DVD burner is CHEAPER than a 512MB stick of RAM... and you won't be playing "big games" on either of those macs for a while. So, your better bang-for-the-buck might in fact be the other one. As for the bigger drive on the one you're looking at, that's nice to have, but there are so many cheap and big drives you can ADD TO THE 20GB internally that, unless YOU KNOW you're going to hit the wall on that 20GB right off the bat, there are flexible, inexpensive options.

And maybe either seller will take a young Mac hatchling such as yourself to heart and cut you an extra break??

Keep in mind that any Powermac does not usually come with iLife media creation software (iTunes is free, however), nor might they come with a mini-office suite such as Appleworks. There are, however, free alternatives for word processing and spreadsheet uses, should you need that.

So, for web stuff, iTunes, homework, maybe some (slowish) iPhoto work, either are a good way to go for one chomping at the bit as you are. You'll have extra money for a drive or a burner... but keep in mind those ATI Radeon cards that MacDoc (or perhaps other retailers) might have. They won't be readily available for long on the market, and discontinued GPU cards are tough to come across. CPU upgrades are plentiful, however. So, you have time for THAT.

Anybody else have thoughts on this?? Just want to make sure that I don't lead the kid down the wrong path.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Macaholic, DO you have an extra keyboard and mouse for a mac hatchling? I am asking because this would bring me so much closer to my mac mini. It doesnt have to be the newest thing as long as it works. Thanks


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

and I just saw this pic. Is it real or photoshoped?http://www.ehmac.ca/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=954&size=big&sort=1&cat=500


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## Applelover (Mar 6, 2005)

autopilot said:


> Kind of off-topic, but don't you have to acknowledge that you are 13 or older to sign up as a member here?


I'm sure we can make an exception in his case.....he has the maturity of a 30yr old.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

thanks applelover


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I think I should buy apple stock, then when it grows, sell it and buy a mac mini! heres why 
http://www.nyse.com/about/listed/lcddata.html?ticker=AAPL&fq=D&ezd=1Y&index=5


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> Macaholic, DO you have an extra keyboard and mouse for a mac hatchling? I am asking because this would bring me so much closer to my mac mini. It doesnt have to be the newest thing as long as it works. Thanks


Sorry, but I don't. I had a mouse, but it went to a niece's setup.

(BTW... shouldn't you be at school??)


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> and I just saw this pic. Is it real or photoshoped?http://www.ehmac.ca/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=954&size=big&sort=1&cat=500


Could be a legit Windows Vista beta. But that Apple "Hot News Headline" about Microsoft and Google?? Not quite real.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I should be at school, but I just got ma hep B shot and got a fever and a huge head ache


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Macaholic, do you have an extra keyboard?


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

audiodan said:


> Im soooo confuzzeled! Tell me, how does this look? http://www.craigslist.org/sfc/sys/99960002.html


As some pointed out, that is of course San Francisco.

I would strongly advise a 12 year old from dealing on craigslist in any case.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I will ask... DOES ANYBODY HAVE A MOUSE AND/OR KEYBOARD THAT USES PS2 CONNECTION A MAC HATCHLING CAN USE???


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> Macaholic, do you have an extra keyboard?


I'm using both keyboards: my Powermac, and my Mac Mini. No extras.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

oh...


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

OMG OMG!!!! LOOK AT THIS! I THINK THIS MIGHT BE THE ONE!!! one little thing... what does o b o mean? http://toronto.craigslist.org/sys/99367460.html


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

If it weren't for the waiting period for the stock to appreciate enough to cover broker's fees both when you buy and sell, you might have something there...



audiodan said:


> I think I should buy apple stock, then when it grows, sell it and buy a mac mini! heres why
> http://www.nyse.com/about/listed/lcddata.html?ticker=AAPL&fq=D&ezd=1Y&index=5


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> I will ask... DOES ANYBODY HAVE A MOUSE AND/OR KEYBOARD THAT USES PS2 CONNECTION A MAC HATCHLING CAN USE???



BTW, what you need are keyboard & mouse *with USB connections*. You probably know that, and you posting for PS2 gear is a little brain fart 

In case you're interested, here are my setups: mine and the family's.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Macaholic said:


> Okay, you have about $570.00, and you want to do internet, and games... on


I won't quote the whole message. It's his first, long, detailed reply.

Another candidate for post of the month, both from the same author, no less.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

DOnt the apple keyboard and mouse connect to the back in p2s slots?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

and nice setup!


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

HowEver said:


> I won't quote the whole message. It's his first, long, detailed reply.
> 
> Another candidate for post of the month, both from the same author, no less.


LOL! And the first one??

Hey, you can certainly play some great games on a Mac -- if you have the horsepower. If one was an absolute game fanatic, however, I would definitely recommend a PC. The titles are all there. A much better bang-for-the-buck, hardware-wise. But also more of a hassle. For some folks, that's almost an advantage. Some people (especially teens -- and perhaps "tweens") LOVE tinkering with PCs. There comes a point where some grow to hate it, ad that's usually when a jump to the Mac platform is considered (or at least to Linux).

This guy has presumably checked out Mac OS X and is interested in it, or his sig wouldn't be so desperate. I can't help but wonder how the peer criticism of such a move to a Mac would be at his age, however. The Mac platform has many subtleties that a bunch of young people slamming their own PCs together and trading warez wouldn't bother to see. And yet, here he is! Maybe that iPod Halo Effect is actually WORKING??


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

The iPods are what got me interested in apple. I looked around to find how amazing all their products are and found em! My friends are gonna like live at my place cuz of ma mac. The fact that you can make music on garage band has pursuded most of em to get into apple to!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

When I get my mini, what programs should I start to play with? I already know to tinker with garage band and iPhoto. What else is fun? Dont forget, I have never owned a mac before so I dont know its fun programs


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> DOnt the apple keyboard and mouse connect to the back in p2s slots?


No dude. They're USB, and the Apple keyboard has TWO USB ports on it. That's one reason why they're a perfect match for a Mac Mini, as you can plug a USB mouse into THE APPLE KEYBOARD, and then plug JUST THE KEYBOARD into the Mac. That leaves the other of the two USB ports ON THE MAC available, PLUS the second USB port on the keyboard, itself... which leaves you with two USB ports OPEN.

Got it?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

i got it


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Then I figure, I am about $200 (with tax) away from a mac mini, keyboard and I hope I can find a free USB mouse from a nice ehmac user.


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## minnes (Aug 15, 2001)

I think a new mini might be a better all around experience for you.
It comes with all the newest iLife apps, iPhot, iMovie, iTunes, etc
plus OS 10.4 
plus a guarrenteee for a year
The place I work at has used keyboards and mice for $5 each, Im in Hamilton, if you are ever out this way .
If you buy used, make sure you go in person and test it there and check to see if everything is as it should.
I wouldnt buy a used mac under 700mhz, if you expect to use it for more than web and office type apps. or modest game or graphics work.
512 MB ram is the minumum comfortable working ram,
you also need a 32mb video card to get any of the quartz or core image effects to work in the Finder.
by the way, OBO means or best offer

-mark


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Does anybody know if this works? If I get a mac mini, I think I will get this if I get confused with the tiger system. http://www.lismoresystems.com/


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Is ther something like http://www.lismoresystems.com/ but flipped around? Because I wanna try tiger before I buy it


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

minnes, are the mice and keyboard at your work apple? If so, how old are they. Does the keyboard have the 2 USB ports on the back?


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## minnes (Aug 15, 2001)

they are not apple
they have some used usb KBs and mice though
they are the usual PC style usb models, I dont think they have extra ports
I have seen usb hubs in surplus stores for around $5 to $10 with 4 usb ports


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

HOw does this seem? http://toronto.craigslist.org/sys/98415726.html


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> When I get my mini, what programs should I start to play with? I already know to tinker with garage band and iPhoto. What else is fun? Dont forget, I have never owned a mac before so I dont know its fun programs


So, are you going for a Mini? If you can swing that, money-wise, that's the best way to go. The games aspect will be weaker, but at least you'll be able to play more of them than you would with an old Powermac's stock CPU. Are you looking at A NEW Mac Mini (with 512Mb RAM), or a used one (potentially 256MB RAM, stock)? If you want to do Garageband, you'll want 512MB MINIMUM. A gig would be ideal. But all this will cost MORE than $570.00, starting with the Mac Mini itself. You'll get a great software bundle with the Mini that you wouldn't get with an old Powermac.

"Fun things" to do, eh? Well, what "fun things" you do on a PC, you can do with a Mac (except for virus scanning). So, start from there. I don't think running "Guest PC" constitutes "fun", however  How about making up some whacked-out comics with pictures of you and your friends/teachers/whomever with the OS X program, "Comic Life"?

http://plasq.com/comiclife/

And, auddiodan, I can't read this article and not think of you and your friends:

http://www.computeractive.co.uk/computeractive/features/2142717/apple-mac-return-mac

Minnes, my suggestion to purchase an older Powermac only works if audiodan eventually buys a CPU. And it only makes sense of the purchased CPU is faster than a 1.25GHz G4 (Mac Mini). So _if_ the intention was to buy a Powermac to put *a faster* CPU in, then I'd say that buying a 700MHz G4 Powermac might be a waste and the money can go into other components or towards a big CPU upgrade. But I could be wrong!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

yup, macaholic, can you, the expert, tell me how this seems? http://toronto.craigslist.org/sys/98415726.html


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> HOw does this seem? http://toronto.craigslist.org/sys/98415726.html


It seems like A BAD way to go, audiodan.

(just a note: I aint the only expert around here!  I'm just one of them who has given his time to you. I certainly don't know EVERYTHING about the Mac platform)


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Why would you say that?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

And mac seniors, please refer your friends to this thread of mine. http://www.ehmac.ca/showthread.php?p=287184#post287184


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

You need to step back and determine if you really want a Mac. You say that you want a Mac, but want to try Tiger first. You say that if you can't deal with the Mac OS, you might use a windows emulator.

Do you want the Mac of the OS or for the hardware design? If you want it for the hardware design, you need to educate yourself more on it. Apple systems will work with non-Apple peripherals (like Logitech mice and keyboards). USB of course. PS/2 is a PC connection, not Mac.

Your are on a budget (from the looks of it, just shy of $600). Quit wasting your time trying to shop for a used system. You won't get a warranty. You won't get software (legal, that is). You won't get support.

Save your money. You will need a entry level Mac mini with a USB/PS2 Adapter (to use your existing keyboard and mouse). Your existing monitor will work fine.

After taxes, you are looking at around $750. If you don't have the money, then keep saving up. You will only face frustrations as a new Mac user if you get a used computer.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

What adapter can I use to turn my keyboard and mouse to USB?


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> Why would you say that?


Because it is too old of a closed platform -- a laptop -- to invest in. Also, this is now the first time you've pondered the notion of a laptop, whereas any of your needs you've expressed to date don't suggest the need for one. Remain focused, my young padawan.










You cannot easily upgrade ANYTHING on it.

The CPU is a G3, not a G4. OS X runs better on a G4. There are no CPU upgrades available for it.

The optical drive is dated -- and non-upgradable short of MAJOR surgery.

The hard drive is small -- and non-upgradable short of MAJOR surgery.

The GPU is dated and non-upgradable.

If you want to spend that little money, get a powermac that you can build on. But honestly, you're pretty close to a Mac Mini that would carry you along for a while (gaming would probably feel the pinch first). To get a mac Mini, you're looking at $629.00 plus tax. if you saved for a few months more and worked on extra chores/whatever at home/neighborhood, you could perhaps swing it in a couple of months -- and the Minis might be speed/feature-bumped by then. if you went with a Powermac and upgrading it, you would eventually spend the price of a new eMac, but would have a superior system.

Ponder this, you must.


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Quick math:

Mac Mini: $629.00+tax=$722.20
Cheap USB keyboard, mouse and USB hub= app. $60.00 taxes included
*TOTAL: a rounded-off $800.00*

G4/450 Powermac: $360.00

64MB Radeon 9000 GPU (better than Mini): $115.00 incl. taxes (http://www.macdoc.com/)

512Mb RAM stick CAN$72.00+app.$15.00 shipping (always go for United States postal service if you can)+CANtax=app. CAN$100.00 ( http://www.ramseeker.com/scripts/sortModelDetails.php?modelId=8&sortSize=512mb ). Might find good deal, locally.

Single 1.7Ghz G4 bought locally (for example) for $575.00
*TOTAL: $1,150.00*

1.42GHz G4 eMac with combo drive and similar GPU: _same price with taxes_. like Mini, however, includes great software bundle.

The upgraded Sawtooth will be faster -- but I didn't factor in an additional hard drive or new optical on the Powermac. Adding those will put the Powermac up to about $1,300.00. That's close to a G5 iMac, but over $500.00 away from that iMac with taxes.

Options as I see them:

1) Build a Powermac over time as you can afford it.

2) Bite the bullet now (money-wise) for a closed Mac Mini.


EDIT: a note about those CPUs, the Mac Mini and eMac's CPUs do not have L3 cache. The Powermac's CPU upgrade has 2MB of it. This results in faster iMovie/iPhoto renders and Garageband performance. Despite this, I also want to note that I always complimented the software bundle of the Mac Mini in this thread.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I think I will go for the mini, and the keyboard, but I want to find a nice ehmac member to donate a USB mouse


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Do you have connections? I will use any USB mouse (as long as it is not a pocket mouse)


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Surely, someone will have a PS2->USB adaptor, your own mouse could connect into the Apple keyboard and you're a still not shy a USB port.

EDIT: Or, get a cheap mouse, new:

http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProduct&cmd=pd&pid=006311&cid=PE.124


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Will I need 2 USB to PS/2 Adaptors for my keyboard and mouse?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

How is this? http://cgi.ebay.ca/USB-to-PS-2-PS2-...812880579QQcategoryZ33964QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

audiodan said:


> How is this? http://cgi.ebay.ca/USB-to-PS-2-PS2-...812880579QQcategoryZ33964QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


Yes, that's what you need. I've seen it in shops all over town for about $20.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Which shops?


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> How is this? http://cgi.ebay.ca/USB-to-PS-2-PS2-...812880579QQcategoryZ33964QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem



_BINGO!_ That'll do the job.

if you end up going with a "Windows keyboard", you may want to look into this little hack:

http://doublecommand.sourceforge.net/


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

That would work, BUT I have NEVER touched an apple keyboard (except at the apple store) SO I dont know what the things i have changed will do!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

YAY...I am only 175.35 bucks away
im sure I will be able to find babysiting job that will give that money. I think ill have the mac mini in a few monthes


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

audiodan said:


> Which shops?


You need to visit the other Apple resellers in your community. In downtown Toronto, you'll find CPUsed, Computer Systems Centre, Carbon Computing, Click On Macs, Solutions In Computing, and more. Your best source for information is from these guys. Take a notepad, and make notes. If there is one thing that I hate the most about customers, it's when they ask the same question over and over and over again.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Can I buy it for 20 at the apple store?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Hey guys, got some bad news
Ma moma broke her promise of donating. I am 175 dollas away and think the only way of getting the money is babysitting for it. If anyone has children, I will happily babysit. As you know, people on this thread say i have the maturity of a thirty something year old. Keep this in mind. Thanks


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## PirateMyke (Jul 14, 2005)

if you lived near me you could babysit my iMac... it's a G3 thou... but it's to be upgraded soon anyways!!!.... watchout... she bite's!!!!

P.S. Good luck dude with your hole money thing... maybe try selling your old PC to a friend for 100-200 bucks!!!



good luck


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Parents are evil.

You know what to do.











totally, absolutely, completely KIDDING!


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## PirateMyke (Jul 14, 2005)

Macaholic said:


> Parents are evil.
> 
> You know what to do.
> 
> ...



holy crap man... iv seen some weird posts... but dude thats a little CRAZZZZZZZZZZIE!!!!!

anyways... 

...good day


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

lol
Macaholic, How old are your kids?


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> lol
> Macaholic, How old are your kids?


I have an eight year old son


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

PirateMyke said:


> holy crap man... iv seen some weird posts... but dude thats a little CRAZZZZZZZZZZIE!!!!!
> 
> anyways...
> 
> ...good day



Great.

The "Nightmare Before Christmas" dude thinks _I'm_ wierd.


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Hey!

It looks like the Mac Mini has been updated!

http://www.ehmac.ca/showthread.php?t=31710

The CPU speed bump is no great shakes, but the 64MB of video RAM is great. Apple's website still lists the old specs, but this person said they got the new one.


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## i stole this name (May 9, 2005)

I certainly hope its a 5400rpm drive now.


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Me too! That would make it pretty well perfect for its intended use and price-point.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Macaholic, Would you consider letting me babysit your son when you need help? Remeber, people thought I had the matureity of a 30 year old!


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Sorry, little buddy, but I would only take a babysitter on personal references -- and be local to me.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Alright, I think I am getting a G4 POWERMAC!!!! http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powermac_g4/stats/powermac_g4_466.html thats its specs. Im gonna pay 550 for that, the monitor, mouse, keyboard and Im gettin him to upgrade to 512 ram


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Macaholic, How does it seem?


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

With upgrades to the Mac Mini pending, it could weaken the argument for the upgraded Powermac. Also, did you read my "quick math" post the upgrade costs? How did that strike you?

I now you want a Mac _now_ (or rather, yesterday), but just hang tight to see if the Mac Mini gets some good feature bumps and decide whether or not you should hold out saving more money for it. Christmas is coming soon. Perhaps you can simply ask for donations to the Mac Mini cause??


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

The thing is, the power mac includes EVERYTHING! EVEN ILIFE! And last thing, how much is the memory prices at apple? Im gonna buy the pwrmc 4 510 then buy ram


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

As in How much is Ram (512 MB)


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## minnes (Aug 15, 2001)

Apple has lousy prices for Ram
buy it elsewhere
it is just standard ram anyway, Im using cheap generic ram in powermac 1.25 and it is perfect
just get a guarrentee with it and your fine


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Which version of iLife? What version of OS X? Does it include Appleworks or similar, by chance?

What are the complete specs of this system?

DON'T buy RAM from Apple. Actually, they only sell RAM as part of a build-to-order new Mac Purchase. What I usually do is start at this American site:

ramseeker.com

and then shop Canadian, looking for the closest price.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Which place will install it and is cheap?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

OS 10.2 and im not sure about ilife. the specs are at http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powermac_g4/stats/powermac_g4_466.html


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## minnes (Aug 15, 2001)

someone is selling a mac mini in the trading post right now
take a look, but trread carefully
only buy in person and take an adult with you if you strike a deal

ram is very eassy to put in yourself
but the mac mini is a little tougher to put ram in due to the snapping tabbed case


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

BUt where will install it for free if I get it there


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## nxnw (Dec 22, 2002)

Don't get the G4.

The bottom of the line Mini (especially when the pending bump becomes official) will include 512 MB ram, a bigger (and POSSIBLY faster) hard drive, a faster and newer burner that reads DVDs, a much better video card, faster USB, a much faster processor, Tiger, and iLife. It's also silent, small, and has a warranty. There will also likely be sell-off deals on the current minis, when the bumps go on sale. Even Apple sells the wired keyboards for $39.00, and you can utilise your ebay prowess to get something cheaper if a few dollars is an issue. 

It's a no brainer. Get a Mini.

Seriously - for $550, I'd be tempted to sell you my G4 400 (which has a 7200 RPM 40GB drive, 640 MB of RAM, an 8x pioneer DVD burner and Radeon 9000 video card) - no KMM, though, and get myself a mini.

But don't do it. Get the Mini.


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

nxnw said:


> Don't get the G4. Get the Mini.


I agree.

Audiodan, you PM'd me, saying that you were going to keep your PC for gaming. Given this, if you're looking for a Mac for the web and iLife alone, *then the Mac Mini is the hands-down winner* -- especially if the rumored improvements materialize.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

But, I dont have that money! Or Keyboard, or mouse! And can I upgrade the G4's Prosseor speed (Mhz)?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

or Ghz?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

How much will this cost?


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## moonsocket (Apr 1, 2002)

Sell your PC, get the Mini, buy an XBox 360 or PS3 for gaming.  By the time they come out you should have enough saved to buy one.


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## moonsocket (Apr 1, 2002)

You could always sell your ipod too. I'm sure you don't need that.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Moossocket! You Are A F****** Retard!! Im Not Selling My Pc Or Ipod!!!!!


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## moonsocket (Apr 1, 2002)

You don't really need a PC. A Mac can do everything and more your PC can. As for the iPod, it'll only damage your hearing. You're too young to go deaf.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Yo, ma mom doesnt know how to use a mac and she doesnt want to learn, so shes keeping the PC. Music is my life! I am keeping my ipod!


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## moonsocket (Apr 1, 2002)

At first I thought you said Yo Ma Ma the cellist.

Anyhow, I didnt realise you have to keep the PC. I know how moms can be. i'm married to one!

Music is also my life. I'm going deaf now and I wouldn't change a thing


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

audiodan said:


> Moossocket! You Are A F****** Retard!! Im Not Selling My Pc Or Ipod!!!!!


That's that 30 year old maturity shining through.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Yup


guytoronto said:


> That's that 30 year old maturity shining through.


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## BlueMax (Aug 8, 2005)

Hey moonsocket... good job ignoring the flame and moving on with a smile! 10 points!


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

BlueMax said:


> Hey moonsocket... good job ignoring the flame and moving on with a smile! 10 points!


problem is, audiodan was out of line


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> How much will this cost?


Check the links I provided earlier in this thread. Generally, an upgrade worth laying the money down in the first place (meaning, you might as well go big whenever you can afford it for THE POINT of getting GREAT speed) would run you over $500.00. Check the links.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

I have nothing against 12 year olds, but this thread has clearly outlasted its usefulness.




Macaholic said:


> problem is, audiodan was out of line


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## imeldamac (Aug 20, 2005)

Anyone ever read Armistad Maupin's The Night Listener? There are some potentially useful insights for this thread.


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## DBerG (May 24, 2005)

audiodan said:


> Moossocket! You Are A F****** Retard!! Im Not Selling My Pc Or Ipod!!!!!


Stay nice dude, even in jokes. For swearing and stupid stuff, get a Mac and open iChat, then type Command + Shift + G and type ehmac : welcome to the official ehMac Chatroom with no moderators!!

Anyway, in march I was like you (older, but still a teen with a small amount of money) and I worked, and worked, and worked, and Windows pissed me so much that I finally bought a Oh-My-God-This-Is-Soooo-Fast-And-Sooooo-Great,-Its-Just-Working-iBook G4. I was tempted to sell the iPod too, don't. Mac and iPod = lovers. Don't separate them. Don't break a love story. And if you need further help in your switch, PM me, I'm 15, I understand what you feel. (Apple-fan stuff).  
Anyway welcome to ehMac! The one and only! (Quoted from Chealion)


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

imeldamac said:


> Anyone ever read Armistad Maupin's The Night Listener? There are some potentially useful insights for this thread.


Weird, man. Weird.


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

HowEver said:


> I have nothing against 12 year olds, but this thread has clearly outlasted its usefulness.


I think HowEver's right.

audiodan, we've gone around the thing a gajillion times. All the info and options and pros and cons you need to consider are here. Only you are most aware of your situation, both in requiring Windows hardware at home for others or gaming, the option to sell the iPod, your current money situation, the choice of the short-term benefits and economics of a Mac Mini versus the long term expenditure of a monster CPU upgrade, and your whatever your capacity to be patient is at this time, whether to save or splurge.

All the options are before you. It's your call, lad  Good luck, and let us know AFTER you've bought whatever it is you've chosen.


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## elmer (Dec 19, 2002)

CPU MHz upgrade = $500

XBOX 360 Premium Bundle - Releasing November 2005 = $500

Buying a low-end PowerMac so you can upgrade the processor is only worth it for special circumstances. Here are some I can think of:
- you need to run OS 9 or use OS 9 peripherals
- you need some PCI slots
- you need space for multiple hard drives or SCSI
- you want to duplicate a much-loved system that just died
- you want to join the club of owners of these types of machines - a very prestigious club, it must be said

If you already had an old PowerMac, it might be worth the money to buy a CPU upgrade, but this is chiefly because the PowerMac itself is not worth selling. Ask Macaholic if he would consider it cost-effective to build his FrankenMac from scratch all at once, or even almost all at once. I believe he's already answered this question in the negative, but I can't find the thread.


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

The answer is "no"; I wouldn't build one from scratch anymore, given that the cost would put you into G5 iMac territory, and a G5 iMac would beat most dual CPU Powermacs in most -- but not all -- situations.

Given the needs of audiodan, dual CPUs are not crucial, and therefore throws the whole notion of upgrading to a FAST single CPU into question, as there are plenty of compelling packages out there with FAST single CPUs (Mac mini, eMac, and of course G5 iMac). The only reason I (grudgingly) suggested upgrading a Powermac is because audiodan is too impatient to wait it out for a Mac Mini. That's short-term gain for long-term pain.

I have owned my old Sawtooth G4 Powermac for YEARS, upgrading here and there when deals fell into my lap (likee the Radeon 9000 for $179.00 over two years ago) -- and upgraded during times when Apple's new stuff wasn't as compelling within the same price range as they are today.


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

BTW, I have to admit that, aside from my professional needs being served by Frankenmac, some upgrades are completely for the point of _just doing them_ in order to fly in the face of the old PC zealot saw, 'macs can;t be upgraded". if I were to go through my specs and say strictly what is and is not needed for the type of work I typically do, it would go like this:

*NEEDED:*
DUAL 1.3GHz G4s
2GB RAM
Pioneer DVR-106
ATI Radeon 9000 Pro AGP 64MB (_dual head_, and Quartz Extreme needs 32MB per display)
dual 17" NEC TFTs
260GB of drivespace, with the stock ATA66 drive bus being sufficient

*Extras I tossed in for fun:*
I have about 100GB more drive space than I really need
ATA133 PCI card
Radeon PCI 32MB


Cost to build Frankenmac's NEEDED components in today's dollars and market:

Old Powermac: $400.00
1.5GB RAM kit to go to 2GB: CAN$280.00 incl. shipping and taxes
Dual 1.3GHz G4 w/2MB L3 cache/CPU _or_ dual 1.8GHz G4 with NO L3 cache CAN$839.50 incl. shipping and taxes
ATI Radeon 9000 Pro 64MB dual head: $115.00 w/ taxes
TWO 120GB internal drives for $218.15 w/taxes
Dual-layer DVD burner: $69.00 incl. taxes

*GRAND TOTAL FRANKENMAC CREATION...* TWO GRAND


*EDIT: comparison to G5 iMac*

2Ghz G5 iMac:
512MB DDR400 SDRAM
160GB Serial ATA drive
SuperDrive (DVD+R DL/DVD+RW/CD-RW)
ATI Radeon 9600 with 128MB DDR Video Memory
Keyboard and Mouse + Mac OS X - U.S. English
56Kbps Modem
17-inch widescreen LCD
*total w/ taxes:* $2,126.35

Add 2GB RAM (this is for my needs): app. CAN$270.00

GRAND TOTAL: $2,400.00

The iMac will be quicker in almost every CPU chore.
The iMac has better graphics.
The iMac has a faster drive buss.
The iMac has a fresh and complete software bundle -- as does the Mac Mini.
The iMac has faster USB.

Frankenmac has greater disk capacity.
As Elmer mentioned, Frankenmac has PCI slots and boots into OS 9 for those who need it.

Both have the same optical drive.
Both can run dual monitors (spanning on iMac via shareware)


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

That's it for me in this thread.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Guess What? I GOT A MAC MINI!!!!!!!! http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5106870604&rd=1&sspagename=STRK:MEWA:IT&rd=1
I told my dad to bid for me cause I was supposedly going to be asleep. Only problem, he went 66 dollars US over my budget!! Uh oh is right! I havent spoke to him yet cause I am supposedly asleep! I hope he plans something good! I HAVE A MAC! I still cant get over it!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

OMG!!! I just got an email from him! HE says he will contribute 100 CAD!!! THATS 86 USD!! OMG!! Tommorrow I will thank him so many times (not tonight though cuz i am asleep)!!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I would like to thank two people! Macaholic and my father. Macoholic for giving me the advice and my father for contributing! Thank you!


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

Gee... I'm _right up there_ with dad! 

Way to go!  Let us know when you get it!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I will! I am hoping he will include the adaptor to connect to PC monitor! If he doesn't, can I get one at the apple store? If so how much will it cost? If not, where can I get it and for how much? Thanks guys


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

I thought this thread was closed.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

No, Macaholic said he just wouldnt contribute any more


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## DBerG (May 24, 2005)

Eh??? That information is not given on ebay? Inspect the item before buying anything.


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

audiodan said:


> No, Macaholic said he just wouldnt contribute any more


Well, now that you're DOING something, the dead horse aint so beaten, now 

The DVI->VGA adaptor is stock with every Mac Mini. I can't see him not giving it to you. if it doesn't come with the bundle, ask him for it. He did answer questions in the ad that a keyboard and mouse were included. That's great!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Ya! He seems like he uses an apple display, so he might of thrown out the adaptor. See, I use fire wire to connect my ipod to my PC, therefor, I threw out the adaptor for the other thing (forgot what it is)! Oh well, I can just buy one from the apple store hopefully!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

How much do these adaptors cost new?


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## PirateMyke (Jul 14, 2005)

audiodan said:


> How much do these adaptors cost new?


20-30 bucks... but im sure somone here has one and dosent use it 

i'd give you mine ... but i havent got my mac mini yet and wont be till 3 weeks or so... ask around thou


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Mike, I bought mine off ebay so I am guessing I wont get it for a month now! Do you think you could save it for me? Thanks


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Guess What guys??? My Mom revealed shes gonna get me a 20" Apple Display for Hanukkah!!! Also, I found a cheap DCI to VGA adaptor!!! Only 6 bucks!!! My Mac minis coming in a week!!! One question? How will I connect to the internet? I use Sympatico light on my PC, can I use this on the mac? It has a router and everything I think!!! I will need your help, cause I NEED internet. BTW I found a macworld CD!!! Now I will have something to play with without spending large sums of money on new games!!!

I have a huge gaming library. Which gaming companies will be compatible with macs??? Thanks!!!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I know blizzard will, but what else?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I need help with internet. Can a mac expert help?


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## minnes (Aug 15, 2001)

Sympatico DSL works very well with Macs, I'm on it now.
You need no installation of software, just configure your control pane in system prefs in the network pane. select PPoe and put in your user name and pass.
no problem at all


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Alright, but what games will work on mac? Other than Halo and Blizzard?


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## DBerG (May 24, 2005)

audiodan said:


> Alright, but what games will work on mac? Other than Halo and Blizzard?


Two things.
First, useful one : versiontracker.com 
Second : Relax, man! Don't flood like I used to do the first month I was here.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

alright lol


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

yes. check versiontracker, which is handy as an overall software update portal.

Two off the main companies that port games to the mac platform are:

Aspyr:
http://www.aspyr.com/

and Macplay:
http://www.macplay.com/

Although the PC has the far netter catalogue of compatible games, the impression that the Mac platform "has no games" because the ORIGINAL creators of a game are NOT the ones that actually do the port (or conversion to) the Mac platform. The above companies usually do it for them. For example, EA games usually uses Aspyr for their mac porting. So, in essence EA Games "does" offer some of its games for the Mac. But you will not see any evidence of this at THEIR site.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Arghh. I am on pins and needles! I won it on the second and its now the 23rd! What should I do? I just contacted the seller today. He said it would take 7 to 10 days and its taken 21! What should I do?


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

I haven't used eBay enough to offer insight here, but this doesn't sound good at all.  others will surely post with their (hopefully experienced) opinions as to hat you should do. I hope you didn't get ripped off.


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

Hey Audiodan!

If the seller had a little shield beside their name, they are considered a secured seller, and you can get your money back from paypal, if that's how you paid for it. You can put in a complaint through both ebay and paypal. I once had a problem with a seller and threatened to place a complaint on both websites if he didn't ship it, and just the threat got him to send it.

If you have any questions emai me...

Good Luck!!!


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## TrevX (May 10, 2005)

I checked the seller's feedback and its mostly positive, but there are some comments in there about slow shipping. He has come through on every item he has sold according to the feedback, but I would email him again and ask him what the hold up is. Also ask for a tracking number for the shipping company he uses. If he doesn't come through, file a complain with eBay and Paypal (if thats the method you used to pay) and let them handle it.

Trev


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thanks guys! I have emailed him asking for when and/ if he shipped it. I also asked for the tracking number. I know that shipping can be slow, but 3 times expected time? Please, I know some BS when I see it.


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## mac_geek (May 14, 2005)

My experience with eBay has been varied.. but many a time, when I've expected something within a week, it's often taken longer.

I wouldn't worry yet, based on the sellers profile. I've yet to have had a truly bad transaction on eBay.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I am trying to not worry but it is so hard! I cant wait for my mac mini!


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## TrevX (May 10, 2005)

audiodan said:


> I am trying to not worry but it is so hard! I cant wait for my mac mini!


You may also want to steer clear of any seller who is relatively new like this guy. He only has 25 transactions under his belt. While his feedback is generally good, he's still new and you should be careful. Look for people with a lot more transactions when purchasing computer equipment, and make sure to read his/her feedback before bidding. Its also a good idea to ask questions before hand, like whether or not he is going to include the DVI-to-VGA adapter, etc.

Trev


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Barn door/horse.

That said, for a transaction like this you should also obtain verifiable informaiton about who the seller is, and then verify it. 




TrevX said:


> You may also want to steer clear of any seller who is relatively new like this guy. He only has 25 transactions under his belt. While his feedback is generally good, he's still new and you should be careful. Look for people with a lot more transactions when purchasing computer equipment, and make sure to read his/her feedback before bidding. Its also a good idea to ask questions before hand, like whether or not he is going to include the DVI-to-VGA adapter, etc.
> 
> Trev


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## TrevX (May 10, 2005)

HowEver said:


> Barn door/horse.
> 
> That said, for a transaction like this you should also obtain verifiable informaiton about who the seller is, and then verify it.


Agreed. You can have an extremely excellent experience on eBay as long as you do the research beforehand. I've purchased dozens of items on eBay and have always had a wonderful experience. I usually stick to power sellers (even if it costs more) because I know that they are trust worthy, or at least moreso than the other guy selling for the first time.

Trev


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I agree completly. This guy knows squat about macs and even less about grammer! I asked him "This item includes Mouse KB and everything in original box. Am I correct?" and he replies "yes.comes with recovery cd, mouse keyboard" He doesnt say it comes with everything in box though! I am so confuzzled!


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## Macaholic (Jan 7, 2003)

"Everything" in the Mac Mini box -- aide from the Mini itself -- includes the power supply, the restore CD, a manual, the warranty... and stickers. Seems like he covered the important things, plus the added keyboard/mouse.

Now, you just need to get the things...


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## RISCHead (Jul 20, 2004)

Too big a thread for me to read through, so apologies if this has already been stated before or if a buy decision has already been made  

Its intended use wasn't clear to me, just the super-tight budget aspect.
Assuming its for general purpose usage and school work, I would look at the huge selection of used Macs on this site or contact MacDoc or any of the other authorised resellers to see what fits best in terms of requirements/price.

There's generally no need to be at the cutting edge on a tight budget and low requirements.

Again, I apologize for being redundant if this has already been stated.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

I GOT IT I GOT IT I GOT IT!!! Only thing is, I CANT USE IT I CANT USE IT I CANT USE IT!!! It didnt include the DCI to VGA adaptor. Well, my mos comin at 6 then we are gonna rush to a store I know and buy it for $6! Can't wait!


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## DBerG (May 24, 2005)

This thread has already too much posts, audiodan, please don't spam like that. I used to.

Anyway, good luck with your Mac Mini.


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## singingcrow (May 6, 2005)

Congrats Audiodan!!!!

I hope it's everything you were hoping for!!!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thanks! I am using it, I just got back! I AM SO HAPPY!!!!


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

That's great news. Use it in good health, as they say. Keep us posted, and given that this is "your thread" kind of, ignore the remarks about posting too much here. It's fine with me, and if I don't want to read it, I won't. This thread has kind of grown on me, as well as being educational.




audiodan said:


> Thanks! I am using it, I just got back! I AM SO HAPPY!!!!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Yup, I know I will sound like a noob asking this, but, how do I delete stuff from the trash?


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Is there anyway?


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## CN (Sep 3, 2004)

Hold down control and click your mouse while inside the trash window (sort of like right clicking  ) there will be an option to "Empty Trash" which is what you want to do so click on it. You might want to note that it will erase all the files in the trash, and you can't just choose certain ones to delete, they all go.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thanks!!! What else should I knowÉ
And why does this e with an acsent show up when I press different buttonsÉ Its really confusing me!


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## CN (Sep 3, 2004)

sounds like you have it set to the canadian keyboard...I think you can turn it off some way within that keyboard, but if you just switch to US keyboard you'll be fine:
System Preferences>International>Input Menu (tab)>Select US rather than Canadian which I suspect is now selected.

You don't have to ask every question here on ehMac. The Help menu provides very good answers with only limited searching. It was a very effective tool when I was learning and I'm sure you'll think so too.


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thanks? I works!!!


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## audiodan (Sep 26, 2005)

Thanks? It works!!!


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