# Holt Renfrew confirms Canadian iPhone?



## Gene Rayburn (Jun 30, 2007)

Exclusive: Holt Renfrew Insider Says iPhone Coming to Canada in Two Weeks

Digital Journal - Exclusive: Holt Renfrew Insider Says iPhone Coming to Canada in Two Weeks


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## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

Oh sure. Right.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Well I'm convinced NOT! After all Holt Renfrew is such a huge player in the electronics industry NOT!

Maybe ther is a new iPhone cosmetic of some sort...


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## Gene Rayburn (Jun 30, 2007)

rgray said:


> Well I'm convinced NOT! After all Holt Renfrew is such a huge player in the electronics industry NOT!
> 
> Maybe ther is a new iPhone cosmetic of some sort...


While you're right, at the same time from what I remember Holt Renfrew has always been interested about the iPhone in this country. Don't ask me why, or how I remember this, but I have the recollection that they had some interest (if this article said that HBC/The Bay (for example) confirmed this then yeah I'd be much more skeptical)

As for this rumour in general, I dunno. I'd sure like it to come true  (except for the $799 part)


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

.


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## adagio (Aug 23, 2002)

Retailing for $799 across the country. ??????


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## adagio (Aug 23, 2002)

HowEver said:


> It's March 32nd apparently.
> 
> And for $799, who wouldn't jump at the chance to own the device?
> 
> What people won't do to drive traffic to their websites...


We think alike.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

,


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

rgray said:


> Well I'm convinced NOT!


The 90s called. They want their cliche back.

And Holt Renfrew is full of it.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

I'm very excited by this. Holt Renfrew's aggressive expansion into eight cities across Canada makes them the perfect partner for Apple in this venture.


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## emalen (Oct 10, 2004)

A few reasons why I reject this notion.

1) Holt Renfrew? HUH! Oh wait, they have a glorious history of selling electronics.

2) $799..... Even with our dollars equal, I expect the iPhone to be priced at 599.

3) Holt Renfrew... again... dumbest idea ever.


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## adagio (Aug 23, 2002)

HowEver said:


> They should have said, "Retailing for $399 across the border."


Maybe Holt Renfrew will be releasing a diamond encrusted version for $799. :lmao:


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

adagio said:


> Maybe Holt Renfrew will be releasing a diamond encrusted version for $799. :lmao:


Free jar of nail polish and a coupon for $10 off your next bra with each iPhone.... :clap:


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## Mississauga (Oct 27, 2001)

Macfury said:


> I'm very excited by this. Holt Renfrew's aggressive expansion into eight cities across Canada makes them the perfect partner for Apple in this venture.


Sure, why not? I mean, doesn't everybody shop there for technology?


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## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

My guess is that the HR official who leaked this doesn't know an iPhone from a coathanger at the Sally Ann. If anything, it's likely that it's the Prada knock-off phone they will be selling.


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## madgunde (Mar 10, 2006)

(( pg )), good call.

As for pricing, logic dictates that the iPhone will be $449 in Canada, since that's how much the iPod touch 16GB is, which sells for the same price as the iPhone in the US.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

Try to imagine a 'genius bar' at H-R.............  

The concept deserves its own sit-com. :clap: :clap:


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## Mississauga (Oct 27, 2001)

(( p g )) said:


> My guess is that the HR official who leaked this doesn't know an iPhone from a coathanger at the Sally Ann.


Good one!!!


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

Silliest rumour ever. It's so obvious somebody's having some fun (and making fun of Engadget's willingness to parrot faux-insider nonsense?), I can't believe anyone would believe this for half a nanosecond.


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## Gene Rayburn (Jun 30, 2007)

The original writer of the story followed up with this comment:



> Thanks everyone else for your comments with regards to Holt Renfrew carrying the iphone.
> 
> As we mentioned in this story, it's purely speculation right now and a two week window does seem short even to us. We've done more follow-ups since yesterday and we have had more Holt Renfrew insiders turn to us to say this is very likely going to happen. We'll now have to wait to see if it actually happens.
> 
> ...


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## mirkrim (Oct 20, 2006)

Even if this is true, the $800 price tag is completely ridiculous.


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## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

> *...but the rumour mill is in full swing in Canada.*


Duh.


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## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

mirkrim said:


> Even if this is true, the $800 price tag is completely ridiculous.


Not by H-R's usual standards!!!


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

The $799 price might be because there'll be no contract and Holt's had to spring like an extra $400 to Apple and AT&T for the two years worth of lost revenue. $799 with no contract is a good price for the iPhone.


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## The Doug (Jun 14, 2003)

dona83 said:


> The $799 price might be because there'll be no contract...


And it will come in a _fahbulous _plaid pouch.


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## tacsniper (Aug 27, 2007)

Very wierd how a high end clothing store will sell electronics.... and I thought Apple always want a share of the plans that people sign with their contract... I mean its the same with AT&T and O2... so this doesn't make sense that Apple will do with HR which isn't even a service provider. Using this phone on Rogers w/o a competitive data plan like AT&T will not make use to the full potential of this device, so I can't see how Apple is partnering up with HR. Unless HR just ordered a ton of iPhones through Apple and just reselling it in Canada all on its own hoping to rack a profit of $400/phone. And then wait until those rich ladies buy the phone and find out it doesn't work! Then they go online and find out you have to hack it and go all crazy 'cuz they don't know how to do it and go back to HR for a refund!


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## a7mc (Dec 30, 2002)

This is perhaps the most bizarre rumour I have ever heard. Why is it bizarre? Because there's just enough plausible information to make it potentially true (as odd as it would be). If Apple DID sell through a non-cell provider, it would have to recoup it's costs, and the $799 tag sounds about right. HR is high end fashion, and cell phones are increasingly becoming fashion accessories, so why not? And you know HR could offer their own line of high end cases.

Is it likely? Hell no. But it is a strangely amusing plausible rumour.

A7


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

.


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## fyrefly (Apr 16, 2005)

HowEver said:


> You realize that Apple's price is $399, no contract?


$399 with no contract only if you read enough websites that tell you how to "hack" the iPhone to activate it without going through AT&T/iTunes. 

I believe that recently, many on this board have come down hard on the people who have "hacked" their iPhones.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

You can still buy it for $399, regardless if you sign up with AT&T or not, I believe that's the point HowEver is making.

Thinking that the extra $400 would go to Apple and AT&T is a really silly thought. It really makes little sense. Lost revenue? This is Canada.. whatever is sold here, isn't affecting the American company AT&T one bit.. and Apple makes it's profit no matter who the iPhone is sold to, and by who.

The whole rumour is pretty rediculous. If it doesn't require a specific carrier, then what, is it going to be unlocked? No.... so why would it then be exclusively offered by what is essentially a clothing store? Absolutely no reason at all. Oh, is Holt's going to launch their own GSM network in Canada? Yeah, that's even more out there than the supposed $799 price tag.


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## Gene Rayburn (Jun 30, 2007)

A poster at MacRumors claimed to call Holt Renfrew and this is his description of what they told him:



> i just got off the Phone with holt from the one in yorkdale mall!
> 
> and they said its going to be $499 at rogers ($799 with a expensive case at holt) for rogers canada...kinda unlocked the man said(but only for rogers) and there will be no special iPhone plans at all he said...basically you can just use it on rogers thats it...nothing special...and he said end of october
> 
> he told me this on the phone...so i guess it could be real


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

lol.... so they've given up entirely on Rogers to do anything special for the iPhone data rates.... and they're just saying do what you like, we'll let Rogers sell it now but that's it.. hahahah, that's rich.

"kinda unlocked.. but just for Rogers"... ok, that makes little sense too. they're not going to let it be unlocked, period. not with what they've been doing with the software update n all that stuff.... so it'd be Rogers locked.

how curious...


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## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

Gene Rayburn said:


> quoting your source: "he told me this on the phone...so i guess it could be real"


Come on. Be serious... :0


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

yeah, seriously.. still about as believeable as the guy who posted on the first day of the iPhone software update that he updated his unlocked iPhone and everything still worked fine... and then post after post of people complaining that theirs were now 'bricked'..... lol.... like I've said before, I don't trust anything I read on the web anymore.


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## Gene Rayburn (Jun 30, 2007)

(( p g )) said:


> Come on. Be serious... :0


heh, yeah, kinda low standards on his part. But I'm just postin what I find


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## ericlewis91 (Jul 12, 2007)

*ok*

i hope this is real..i want the wifistore! on unlocked


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## zlinger (Aug 28, 2007)

I heard that 7-11 will also be selling iPhones in Canada. $449 and you also get a free Big Bite Hot Dog and a tasty Slurpee.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

it's true, i just got off the phone with the 7/11 at danforth/donlands... i asked if they'd substitute with taquitos and he pretty much yelled at me... NO SUBSTITUTES.

screw that.


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## jackyk (Jun 22, 2005)

just got back from The Source after buying a soldering iron for the headphone mod...

She caught a glimpse of my iphone and we started talking. She said that touch ipods and the iphone were coming before christmas. And that you can preorder them online. I think she meant the touch ipods though.

I asked her the price of the iphones and she said 600ish or something.


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## tacsniper (Aug 27, 2007)

zlinger said:


> I heard that 7-11 will also be selling iPhones in Canada. $449 and you also get a free Big Bite Hot Dog and a tasty Slurpee.


 now thats a steal!! Compare to $799... I will take the Big Bit + Slurpee and save myself $350 rofl a very nice one tho..... :lmao:


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## tacsniper (Aug 27, 2007)

jackyk said:


> just got back from The Source after buying a soldering iron for the headphone mod...
> 
> I asked her the price of the iphones and she said 600ish or something.


I think someone needs training on their products.... oh wait... they don't have iPhones, nor will they during xmas!


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

kloan said:


> You can still buy it for $399, regardless if you sign up with AT&T or not, I believe that's the point HowEver is making.
> 
> Thinking that the extra $400 would go to Apple and AT&T is a really silly thought. It really makes little sense. Lost revenue? This is Canada.. whatever is sold here, isn't affecting the American company AT&T one bit.. and Apple makes it's profit no matter who the iPhone is sold to, and by who.


But isn't Apple getting part of the monthly fees paid to AT&T (and presumably O2 in the UK)? If that's true, Apple *is* losing revenue whenever somebody unlocks an iPhone and uses it on an "unauthorized" network. That would also explain a higher sticker price for an unlocked iPhone.



> The whole rumour is pretty rediculous. If it doesn't require a specific carrier, then what, is it going to be unlocked? No.... so why would it then be exclusively offered by what is essentially a clothing store? Absolutely no reason at all. Oh, is Holt's going to launch their own GSM network in Canada? Yeah, that's even more out there than the supposed $799 price tag.


I do agree that the rumour is ridiculous, though. Some kind of tie-in or promo with Rogers and HR? OK, maybe, though even that much sounds far-fetched. If there's a grain of truth to it, I'll bet the "Holt Renfrew insiders" who are blabbing don't really have much idea what they're talking about. The real story, if there is one, will surely turn out to be way different.

But the whole "unlocked iPhones for $799 at Holt Renfrew" thing is just silly because, well, if Apple wants to sell unlocked iPhones, why not just sell them through apple.ca? Why not just allow Rogers, Fido, Virgin or whomever to buy them in bulk, no strings attached?


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## madgunde (Mar 10, 2006)

The reason Apple is getting kickbacks on the monthly subscriber fees is because the iPhone's price is not subsidized. Every other cell phone out there sells for a couple hundred dollars less because the carrier is subsidizing the retail price to attract customers. Apple has convinced carriers to give them a cut of the profits instead of using that money to discount the retail price. So if Rogers wasn't going to give Apple a profit sharing arrangement, that would make the iPhone cheaper, not more expensive, or at a bare minimum, it would make the iPhone the same price relative to other Apple products sold in Canada.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

iMatt said:


> But isn't Apple getting part of the monthly fees paid to AT&T (and presumably O2 in the UK)? If that's true, Apple *is* losing revenue whenever somebody unlocks an iPhone and uses it on an "unauthorized" network. That would also explain a higher sticker price for an unlocked iPhone.


The only way it would affect them is if they were selling the iPhone locked to a specific carrier in Canada and people were buying them, unlocking them and using them with the other guy.. keeping in mind we only have Fido/Rogers... so they'd be losing out from a contract kickback. But for people unlocking and using their iPhones up here doesn't make any difference whatsoever to Apple's profits down south. In fact, it just adds to it. The more iPhones they sell, the more they make.

That's my whole point with the comment about inflating the price $400 to make up for the 'lost profits' from signing an AT&T contract... that's US, it makes no difference up here.

Because of the way they're responding to unlocked iPhones with their update(s), I don't see them offering unlocked iPhones in the near future.


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## groov2485 (Sep 26, 2007)

I've got to agree this is a pretty odd rumor considering Apple forcing everyone else to offer unlimited data plans.

Unless HR has started installing cell towers using some type of cloaking device, I don't see this being real. Other than maybe they will start selling unlocked iPhones like the guy at the cell phone store on Whyte that is trying to hawk them for $3,000.


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

madgunde said:


> The reason Apple is getting kickbacks on the monthly subscriber fees is because the iPhone's price is not subsidized. Every other cell phone out there sells for a couple hundred dollars less because the carrier is subsidizing the retail price to attract customers. Apple has convinced carriers to give them a cut of the profits instead of using that money to discount the retail price. So if Rogers wasn't going to give Apple a profit sharing arrangement, that would make the iPhone cheaper, not more expensive, or at a bare minimum, it would make the iPhone the same price relative to other Apple products sold in Canada.


No doubt a carrier would treat the iPhone the same as any other handset if given the chance. That's not the same as selling an unlocked phone, though, and the lack of guaranteed monthly revenue for the seller of such a phone does imply a higher upfront price.


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

kloan said:


> But for people unlocking and using their iPhones up here doesn't make any difference whatsoever to Apple's profits down south. In fact, it just adds to it. The more iPhones they sell, the more they make.


Every time they sell an iPhone, it's with the understanding and expectation that the buyer will sign a 24-month contract with AT&T. There's planned revenue there, so every time a phone is unlocked (or never activated, for that matter) and not used under an "official" plan, that revenue fails to appear. Doesn't matter where it happens, it still represents a "discount" that Apple didn't intend to give. (Say it's $10 a month for a total of $240: that means they'd have to charge $240 more to make the same money off an unlocked phone.)

Anyway, I don't mean to derail this thread. Just saying the higher sticker price is actually a plausible part of this rumour as long as the phone involved is unlocked. Still a really silly rumour, though.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Yeah, but I still don't see how that makes sense. A person that intends to buy an iPhone and activate it with AT&T is still going to do that, regardless is a Canadian buys one and unlocks it to use it up here. It's not taking away from their sales, it's adding to it.

It's the same logic car salesmen use when trying to get more profit from a sale. Sure, I want it for $1000 less than the other guy.. so does that mean he makes $1000 less if he sells it to me? No. He can sell two cars! The only way it'd affect profit if there were a limited supply, which there aren't.


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## Oakbridge (Mar 8, 2005)

kloan said:


> Yeah, but I still don't see how that makes sense. A person that intends to buy an iPhone and activate it with AT&T is still going to do that, regardless is a Canadian buys one and unlocks it to use it up here. It's not taking away from their sales, it's adding to it.
> 
> It's the same logic car salesmen use when trying to get more profit from a sale. Sure, I want it for $1000 less than the other guy.. so does that mean he makes $1000 less if he sells it to me? No. He can sell two cars! The only way it'd affect profit if there were a limited supply, which there aren't.


Let's use the earlier example of $10 per month that Apple receives from AT&T. 

If the base profit on an iPhone for Apple is $100, and they receive $240 from AT&T over the life of the contract, their total profit for that one phone will be $340. 

If it is sold as an unlocked phone at the same price then Apple will only realise $100 in profit on that one phone. 

So in order for Apple to get the same amount of profit from the unlocked phone, they would need to set the price to be $240 higher.


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## madgunde (Mar 10, 2006)

Oakbridge, I think the point is that having $100 in profit is better than $0 in profit. But on the other hand, unlocked phones aren't just going to Canadians or people in other countries. Plenty of them are being used by people in the US to avoid the AT&T contract or use on an alternate US carrier, in which case, that is lost revenue for Apple since those people would otherwise have signed a contract with AT&T if they were prevented from unlocking.


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## david2673 (Oct 2, 2007)

This is the reply from [email protected]...

Holt Renfrew will not be carrying the iphone. I would check with your
local cell phone dealer.

Holt Renfrew

Personal Shopping, Bloor Street416. 960. 2554 

50 Bloor St. West

Toronto, ON M4W 1A1


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## CdnPhoto (Jan 8, 2006)

david2673 said:


> This is the reply from [email protected]...
> 
> Holt Renfrew will not be carrying the iphone. I would check with your
> local cell phone dealer.
> ...


... and with that, so ends hours of fun/rumors.

Ok, it was WAY too unbelievable to start with.


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## GrapeApe (Aug 4, 2004)

This is easily the dumbest rumour I have heard yet.

For $799 the thing had better be crusted in diamonds.

Not to mention the fact that it would make no sense that Apple would suddenly throw out their entire sales and marketing plan of tying the iPhone to a specific carrier with an unlimited data plan just for Canada.

Personally I can't believe anyone actually printed this rumour.


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## scharlton (Mar 3, 2005)

I know people at Rogers, and I used to work at Rogers.

iPhone is coming out April 2008 at the earliest. And probably later than that.

Solution: 
The Canadian dollar is worth MORE than the U.S. dollar now... so the iPhone is less than $400. To unlock....

a) TurboSIM from pdaplaza.ca (I have mine) will work with 1.1.1 and almost guaranteed future updates, as it doesn't touch the phone itself. You need an AT&T activated SIM though (it can be cancelled after the fact). 

b) iPhoneSIMFree with a downgraded 1.0.2 phone.

c) Buy a used 1.0.2 phone, apply the anySIM unlock, and hope the dev team figures out the 1.1.1 encryption scheme before the end of the year...


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## CdnPhoto (Jan 8, 2006)

I am waiting for a decent EDGE data price from Rogers. I'm not holding my breath though.


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## g.c.87 (Sep 20, 2007)

I'm sticking to my version 1.0.2 iPhone unlocked. Rogers is a bunch of greedy SOBs so don't hold your breath for a Canadian release. Instead, buy one in the US and unlock it up here like I did.


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## TheDirtyOne (Sep 5, 2007)

Written by iMatt: "But the whole "unlocked iPhones for $799 at Holt Renfrew" thing is just silly because, well, *if Apple wants to sell unlocked iPhones, why not just sell them through apple.ca?* Why not just allow Rogers, Fido, Virgin or whomever to buy them in bulk, no strings attached?"

I read the entire thread before writing this because I was looking for at least one person to see it from this perspective. If Apple were to sell unlocked iPhones, it is highly unlikely (never say never) that they would pass it on to a retailer/2nd party to sell their products for them! Marketing wise, there is absolutely no benefit of doubling the price and selling it through an expensive fashion retailer! That sentence alone sounds f'n weird! The product is still riding on it's shock (oooh ahhh) value and the second it was available here, demand would beat out supply. Not to mention the amount of Americans coming over the border for the chance to use their iPhone on T-Mobile with no hack.

Point being, if the iPhone was to be sold in Canada with no carrier agreement, Apple would defintely be the one to sell it.

2nd Point: It's highly unlikely Apple would release the product here without its customers being able to use the device to it's full pontential. (No data plan = No iPhone)


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## T-hill (May 18, 2005)

david2673 said:


> This is the reply from [email protected]...
> 
> Holt Renfrew will not be carrying the iphone. I would check with your
> local cell phone dealer.
> ...


Psh! You're gonna believe them!? What do they know!?

I need to hear an OFFICIAL denial before I cancel my camp out at Holt Renfrew!

:lmao:


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## T-hill (May 18, 2005)

GrapeApe said:


> For $799 the thing had better be crusted in diamonds.


Those would have to be some pretty small diamonds... I'd at least think like a thin layer of gold on the back for $799... Or just diamonds for the Apple logo...


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## GrapeApe (Aug 4, 2004)

T-hill said:


> Those would have to be some pretty small diamonds... I'd at least think like a thin layer of gold on the back for $799... Or just diamonds for the Apple logo...


Some level of bling will be required to get me to pay double the U.S. price.

Perhaps the home button could be a giant sapphire, ruby or some other precious stone.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Oakbridge said:


> Let's use the earlier example of $10 per month that Apple receives from AT&T.
> 
> If the base profit on an iPhone for Apple is $100, and they receive $240 from AT&T over the life of the contract, their total profit for that one phone will be $340.
> 
> ...


You're still missing the point. We're talking about the sales of iPhones in Canada. It doesn't matter who buys what here, it's not going to affect American profits... unless of course Americans start coming here to get unlocked iPhones... lol.... ain't gonna happen.....


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## G-Mo (Sep 26, 2007)

It's not gonna happen...

Digital Journal - Exclusive: Holt Renfrew Insider Says iPhone Coming to Canada in Two Weeks



> We have received word from Mario Manza, Executive Director of VIP Services at Holt Renfrew, that they will not be carrying the iPhone for now. He said he confirmed this information with the buyers this morning and apologized for any misinformation on behalf of the company.
> 
> It sure is a weird scenario: Yesterday we placed cold calls to their accessories department and they were telling everyone the iPhone would be there in two weeks. They were even going so far as taking down phone numbers of people who called, informing them they will call back when it arrives in two weeks. They even quoted the exact price of $799.
> 
> ...


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## david2673 (Oct 2, 2007)

One more reply from Holt Renfrew...

Thank you for your inquiry of the Apple I Phone. I regret that the I
Phone, originally planned for our store this fall will no longer be
available at Holt Renfrew. In fact, due to other obstacles, the phone
will not be here any earlier than January 2008. At that time, it may be
into Canada, however, will not be for sale through us.

We do carry a similar looking phone by LG, the Prada phone. While not as
technically advanced, is still a wonderful fashion phone and I suggest
you take a look at it the next time you're in town.

Please do not hesitate to contact us should you require any further
assistance.

Best regards.
Grace Chan
Executive Assistant to General Manager
Holt Renfrew - Vancouver
(604) 681-3121


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## (( p g )) (Aug 17, 2002)

As I suspected. They're on crack.


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## tacsniper (Aug 27, 2007)

well what did they gain from this? PUBLICITY!


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

The rumour that never happened in the thread that wouldn't die...


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## naftalim (Oct 1, 2007)

I knew it did not make sense the minute I saw this. Aside from all the other factors, the most electronic thing sold at Holts is a *nose hair trimmer*


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## tacsniper (Aug 27, 2007)

naftalim said:


> I knew it did not make sense the minute I saw this. Aside from all the other factors, the most electronic thing sold at Holts is a *nose hair trimmer*


Well I guess now you an add the LG Prada on the list


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## Oakbridge (Mar 8, 2005)

naftalim said:


> I knew it did not make sense the minute I saw this. Aside from all the other factors, the most electronic thing sold at Holts is a *nose hair trimmer*


Not true, when I mentioned this to a customer of mine he said that he has seen unique cell phones in Holt Renfrew in the past, including one he believed to be from Bang & Olufsen. As one of the other posts did point out, they have sold phones from companies like Prada in the past, as well as iPods.


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## Oakbridge (Mar 8, 2005)

kloan said:


> You're still missing the point. We're talking about the sales of iPhones in Canada. It doesn't matter who buys what here, it's not going to affect American profits... unless of course Americans start coming here to get unlocked iPhones... lol.... ain't gonna happen.....


No, I believe that you're missing the point. If I'm selling a product, doesn't matter where I am selling it, only what I am eventually going to see on my bottom line. In the example I provided earlier, the hypothetical example was an overall profit of $340 ($100 from the original sale and $240 over the 24 months of the contract). 

I develop a pricing structure that gives me a certain return for each unit sold. All of my business plans are based on the return I get per unit sold, so if something happens to change that (i.e. phones sold without the AT&T contract), I need to find a way to recoup the lost revenue. In some ways it is no different than dealing with an exchange rate. If the currency in the country I am selling my product in goes down, I need to increase my prices to guarantee that my return stays the same. 

You seem to think that Apple only cares about the profit from the original sale when it has been discussed that Apple is also including the monthly revenues on their books.


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## madgunde (Mar 10, 2006)

Oakbridge said:


> I develop a pricing structure that gives me a certain return for each unit sold. All of my business plans are based on the return I get per unit sold, so if something happens to change that (i.e. phones sold without the AT&T contract), I need to find a way to recoup the lost revenue. In some ways it is no different than dealing with an exchange rate. If the currency in the country I am selling my product in goes down, I need to increase my prices to guarantee that my return stays the same.
> 
> You seem to think that Apple only cares about the profit from the original sale when it has been discussed that Apple is also including the monthly revenues on their books.


But sales to Canadians and other countries aren't even in your business plan, and since you are still making a profit on each unit sold, the net effect in an increase in profit over and above on sales that are over and above what you modeled for.


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## Oakbridge (Mar 8, 2005)

madgunde said:


> But sales to Canadians and other countries aren't even in your business plan, and since you are still making a profit on each unit sold, the net effect in an increase in profit over and above on sales that are over and above what you modeled for.


Yes they are in my business plan because I modelled the units to be sold through US distribution, namely the Apple Stores and AT&T. And now it is distribution in other countries where I am still receiving recurring revenue for a 24 month period. A unit sold is a unit sold, regardless of where it ends up. Apple has wisely tied themselves into the ongoing service contracts and they are planning for that income, because they are not selling the device through any other channels.

Why do you think that cell phone companies give away or discount new handsets at different rates based on the length of contract you sign up for? They are looking at the overall return rate for that unit. Their total revenue for the unit will be more or less the same no matter whether you purchase the unit without a contract, or purchase it with a 1, 2 or 3 year contract. 

Why do you think that printer companies practically give away their printers, because they know that based on their models and forecasts and predictions, each unit sold will result in $xx of consumables. The total revenue they will receive from one unit will be the original purchase price plus the xx.x number of cartridges that they figure the average buyer will purchase.


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## kloan (Feb 22, 2002)

Oakbridge said:


> No, I believe that you're missing the point. If I'm selling a product, doesn't matter where I am selling it, only what I am eventually going to see on my bottom line. In the example I provided earlier, the hypothetical example was an overall profit of $340 ($100 from the original sale and $240 over the 24 months of the contract).
> 
> I develop a pricing structure that gives me a certain return for each unit sold. All of my business plans are based on the return I get per unit sold, so if something happens to change that (i.e. phones sold without the AT&T contract), I need to find a way to recoup the lost revenue. In some ways it is no different than dealing with an exchange rate. If the currency in the country I am selling my product in goes down, I need to increase my prices to guarantee that my return stays the same.
> 
> You seem to think that Apple only cares about the profit from the original sale when it has been discussed that Apple is also including the monthly revenues on their books.


Whatever.


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

Apple receives $9 a month from AT&T in addition to the $399 hardware charge. That's lost revenue for Apple. AT&T makes money off the plans, that's lost revenue for them. This is assuming that Holt is only importing the phones unlocked for Canadian use because we don't have a carrier. But it would make sense if Holt was including a $300 cell phone case. Actually, $300 for a cell phone case at Holt is a bargain, should be $499 for the phone + $1000 for the case = $1499?


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

Digital Journal - Exclusive: Holt Renfrew Insider Says iPhone Coming to Canada in Two Weeks


Oct 3 said:


> While we're still marking this as rumour alert, a Holt Renfrew insider has told DigitalJournal.com the luxury retailer will be carrying Apple's iPhone across Canada by mid-October 2007.


Hmmm...I wonder what happened?


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

guytoronto said:


> Digital Journal - Exclusive: Holt Renfrew Insider Says iPhone Coming to Canada in Two Weeks
> 
> Hmmm...I wonder what happened?


What happened? That's easy. You bumped a dead thread with false or misleading information, and linked to an unsupported story.


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