# Thinking of changing banks. Advice?



## moonsocket (Apr 1, 2002)

HI All

We are thinking of changing banks. Our current bank, Bank of Montreal , is pretty crappy lately.
Thinking of Credit Union. I know TD has the shuffle offer on right now but are they any better than BOM?

We have a chequing and savings account, 1 credit card with bank of montreal and one with royal bank. We don't make alot of money and never have any money in the bak at the end of the month, although we hope to start saving soon as we are getting tired of renting(crappy lanlords)

Anyhow, any help would be appreciated. Ive asked sveral people I know and they all say the same thing "Banks are all the same. It doesnt matter who you are with" I don't believe that though.

Cheers and TIA

Chris


----------



## NewBill (May 29, 2005)

Been with Pcfinancial (President's Choice financial offered through the Canadian Superstores) No fee bank card and some "points" towards groceries incentives. The bank card is serviced by CIBC outlets. It's ok especially since we do the bulk of our groceries through there anyway. We have other businsss ... mortgage etc elsewhere depending on the best rates we could find at the time.


----------



## moonsocket (Apr 1, 2002)

So if you use your PC bank card you get PC points?


----------



## Mrs. Furley (Sep 1, 2004)

I'm also thinking of switching banks and am leaning towards PC Financial. Yes, it's still a bank (they all suck) but I've heard only good things about PC.

If not PC, then a credit union might be a good choice, from what I've heard.


----------



## NewBill (May 29, 2005)

PC points: Get a few bucks off groceries occasionally. There are a few other incentives. Not really worthwhile unless you happen to do business with them already. The 4.5 cents per litre in a coupon form at their gas pumps doesn't hurt either especially since our current rate is 96.9 and has been over a dollar a couple of times. Despite the no fee bank card I find myself carrying cash again, or getting cash back at the retailer. Bank services have become very very strange.


----------



## dido56 (May 18, 2005)

I'm with PC bank too. I'm a student, so I need to save all the money I can! I find them pretty good, as mentioned, no fees, at all, it's not a gimmick, unless you use non-CIBC or PC bank machines. Think about it for day-to-day banking (a chequing account is free). Since there is no limit on the number of transactions you can make with your debit card, you don't end up paying extra fees. Also, CIBC has good coverage for bank machines (at least here in St. John's) ... some other banks are not as practical since they sometimes have only 1 or 2 atms in the entire area. Not sure on the PC points, I don't pay attention to them myself.


----------



## poisonmonkey (Sep 20, 2004)

Hey Moonsocket, here is a half decent look at "high interest" banks:

http://www.redflagdeals.com/deals/main.php/articles/savings1/


----------



## da_jonesy (Jun 26, 2003)

Mrs. Furley said:


> I'm also thinking of switching banks and am leaning towards PC Financial. Yes, it's still a bank (they all suck) but I've heard only good things about PC.
> 
> If not PC, then a credit union might be a good choice, from what I've heard.



FYI... PC Financial is a subsidiary of CIBC (read the fine print). Essentially it is an affiliate bank of CIBC. Bank affiliates is very common in the US but less so here.


----------



## moonsocket (Apr 1, 2002)

Thanks everyone.

poisonmonkey, I will read up on that. Thanks!


----------



## NewBill (May 29, 2005)

da_jonesy said:


> FYI... PC Financial is a subsidiary of CIBC (read the fine print). Essentially it is an affiliate bank of CIBC. Bank affiliates is very common in the US but less so here.


 No need to read the fine print it is advertised quite clearly as being a service by CIBC. It is serviced by CIBC as mentioned here already. However it remains true that online banking services and purchases earn points and have no fees. Bank machines have no fees as well. It feels a bit like coupon clipping but there it is. No issue here.


----------



## blue sky (Oct 24, 2003)

If most of your transactions are local, consider switching to a credit union. You should receive very good service and competitive rates. As well, belonging to a credit union, you become an owner, sharing in the profits of the credit union.

While your dividends may not be high at the beginning, as you build your assets (and liabilities => mortgage/loan), your dividends will increase.

With bank mergers inching back on the agenda :


> Ottawa — Finance Minister Ralph Goodale left the door open Monday for a possible release this year oflong-delayed bank merger guidelines, saying he is consulting MPs to see whether Parliament is now more receptive to a debate on the issue. “The atmosphere around this place was pretty toxic for a few weeks,” Mr. Goodale said. “That seems to have subsided a bit. I don't want to jump to any conclusions. But perhaps there's a bitsweeter atmosphere now.”


...don't expect service at the banks to improve (or service charges to decrease).


----------



## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

*read the small stuff in PC financial*

My daughter did her banking through PC. She eventually had to open an account at a regular bank (Scotia on her campus). The issue with PC was that any deposited cheques including email transfers had to endure a 5 day waiting period... You students, and indeed most of the rest of us, would find this intolerable. The only thing that got through were electronic transfers. If I sent money to her PC - 5 days later she could use it. You don't ask your parents for money 5 days before you need it - one procrastinates right down to the wire. Money sent to her "regular" account is available immediately.

My advise is to look very carefully at the real limitations of virtual banks (like PC) - the so-called 'higher' interest is pretty snivelling anyway. Credit unions are a good idea but make sure you can get FULL services in the modern sense, ie. full web access, etc., wherever you go. I lean towards *developing a relationship* with the local branch of one of the main banks is the best o/all answer. Banks like (which means better rates) people they know! And it pays to get to know them before you need them. I can do anything from anywhere with my setup. Analyse the service charges (packages too). IMHO&E, the benefits outweigh the (surprisingly small) difference in cost.


----------



## retrocactus (Jun 17, 2003)

Most banks have the deposit hold until you are better known with them...especially as a student with no credit history. You can usually just call and get the hold lifted after a period of time.

We've been using PC for years and have loved the fact that we never pay bank fees...that alone should make any student happy.

Aside from having to sign a loan or mortgage document, doesn't everyone do their banking online? Do you really need a local branch? Every 7-11 in Canada has an ATM that I can use for free, not to mention any CIBC or Real Canadian Superstore.


----------



## simon (Nov 2, 2002)

Small Town Credit Union - the best bet.

I've been with credit unions for over 12 years and they actually treat me like a client ... not a numbered account where my service is based on how much money I have borrowed or how much I have in the account at that particular time. They tend to be more flexible in their rules too. I have instant access to my deposits and I can't say the same for any of the major banks (when it comes to a business accounts - TD/CanadaTrust were the worst holding cash deposits for 7 days until they cleared - huh? that was a CASH deposit)


----------



## Wolfshead (Jul 17, 2003)

I use PC and ING - very pleased with both of them. So far.


----------



## iGeeK (Jan 27, 2003)

I have been a credit union customer and a bank customer for a long time. While I still need to retain my accounts at CIBC for the sake of convenience, I do less and less business with them. And what I do, I do online. I though about switching to a different bank because I am very dissatisfied with some of CIBC's practices, but it makes no sense to hop from a lame donkey to a lame mule (i.e another bank). As for my community organization, it has accounts with BoM and we are definitely thinking of moving them, because the service has been dismal over the years and is getting worse. When I terminated a safety deposit box contract at CIBC it at least stayed terminated. Whereas with BoM we have a history of them reactivating our SDB's years after they have been eliminated, and then it takes weeks or sometimes months to resolve the issue. We always get the money back, but who needs the recurring hassle? 

After 25 years of being a CU member, I have absolutely nothing bad to say about mine.

iGee/<


----------



## rgray (Feb 15, 2005)

retrocactus said:


> Most banks have the deposit hold until you are better known with them...especially as a student with no credit history. You can usually just call and get the hold lifted after a period of time.


4 years and many calls... they never seemed to get past the student bit.



retrocactus said:


> Do you really need a local branch?


99% of the time, probably not. It is the 1% that can save hours/days/or even a whole project. I had a problem with my credit report which had defied hours over days of my best efforts - resolved in minutes *at the branch*. 

Sure it is cool not to pay fees especially as a student, but when you want to start a business or get a mortgage or negotiate your student loan it is _a very good thing_ to be recognised, particularly if what you want to do is (even) slightly out of the ordinary. I am at the other end - I am close to getting an even better deal on service charges because of my (ahem) advancing age.... I have had some good money advice from my banker, and enough road rash off life's highway to know good advice from bad.

Everybody's mileage and needs vary!


----------



## retrocactus (Jun 17, 2003)

rgray said:


> I am close to getting an even better deal on service charges because of my (ahem) advancing age


Yeah, hehe...I guess that's one thing the students can look forward to...eventually they get a big break...just takes awhile.


----------



## ThirtyOne (Jan 18, 2003)

I think rgray has the right idea and the best advice: develop a relationship. Not just with a bank, but with a branch. I opened my first Canada Trust account when I was a kid, and was fee exempt. Now (many, many, many years later) I should be paying monthly fees on my accounts, but the manager at the branch agreed to grandfather the fee exemptions for all my accounts (even after TD took them over) because I've been a customer for such a long time. Developing a personal relationship is the way to go, regardless of what bank you choose.


----------



## ErnstNL (Apr 12, 2003)

I found PC customer service poor. Not recommended.

I've had problems with them. I thought it would be great to start an account with PC; free chequing account, Mastercard etc...I filled out the applications at the kiosk and everything was fine until I had to activate my account, 
using the 1-800 number. 

I thought everything was OK until I got my free cheques. 
They mis-spelled my name on my cheques. Cheques are useless. I thought it would be easy to fix. Not really. My applications have the correct spelling of my name, I have copies.
My first statement was a shocker:
My 2 accounts were now in my new mis-spelled name. I've tried 3 times to get them to correct the situation. It's still not resolved. 
The PC reps at the kiosk were very helpful in trying to convince their head office to make the changes. I faxed pertinent documentation, the reps vouched for me etc...The head office won't admit it was their mistake and still haven't corrected the situation. 

It would be easy to cancel the accounts and re-apply. If I did that, I think a few flags would be raised at their head office and it would affect my credit rating. 
It's matter of principle now. 

So, to all the fans of a "virtual" bank, kiosk banking and online banking : BEWARE.


----------



## Hangman (May 31, 2005)

PC bank will really charge you an arm & a leg for bounced payments. When I was with the Royal Bank, I missed a mortgage payment a couple times and I think they only charged me $25. They would also give me almost a days grace before bouncing a payment in case I was able to get the money in the account soon enough. Not so, with PC bank. I was $10 dollars short for a mortgage payment once, (even though I got the money in the account later that evening) and they counted that as a missed payment. You know how you'll see on your bank statement that the money goes out then is put back in (if you've ever had the misfortune of insufficient funds). PC didn't even do that. They just looked at my account early in the day, saw the money wasn't there, and charged me about $70 for a missed payment.  
It also sucks if you ever need to get a money order or certified cheque.


----------



## iPetie (Nov 25, 2003)

I've experienced all of them pretty much including PC which was great unless any issue showed up. Try to buy a house or a car and get a chunk of money moved in any reasonable time period. Poor C/S as well.
We use the Credit Union now, and it is really nice. As long as we have a balance of $1000 there are no service charges. They treat you much differently when you're an owner and not a slave to a bank. And don't kid yourselves, that is exactly what the Banks think of us little folk.


----------



## Sonal (Oct 2, 2003)

I've been extremely pleased with ING Direct. I love online banking,

My chequing account and business account are through CIBC. I wouldn't necessarily recommend them, however--I find them neither particularly better or worse than the other big five banks. Started with them because I had to when I (briefly) worked at CIBC--ah, the glorious days of service-charge free banking.

Technically, due to my small business account, I have a personal relationship with a CIBC banker, which means on the rare occasion that I go into a branch, I don't have to stand in line--I can go into the back and sit in a chair. I wouldn't say that this has really been to my benefit however, since the only times I've had to enter a branch since opening the account 8 years ago were:
1) Opening my business account
2) Going back in to sign a paper for my business account that they missed
3) Checking on an ATM error since it debited my account but didn't give me any cash
4) After applying over the phone for a line of credit on my personal account and expecting the paperwork to be mailed to me for my signature, business banking got wind of this, and called me to come in. Thinking there was a problem, I did. Nope--they just wanted to give me a more personal experience--called telephone banking to cancel my line of credit so they could issues it. While it sped up the process (I could sign right there instead of waiting for the mail), it required more of my time to get there, wait for my banker to be free, listen to them argue with telephone banking, and then sign the paperwork. 

I love online banking. 

And did I mention I earn more interest in my couple of months with ING than my entire 8-year span at CIBC?


----------



## Mad Mac (Mar 13, 2005)

You have to watch Credit Unions, they are run under different rules then regular banks. Lets say you have a home loan witha CU and you miss a payment, they can demand full payment a "bank" can not. Same goes for a line of credit if they want full payment they can force you to pay it. Mine also tends to move money around and take payments that are not preapproved and not me about.


----------



## autopilot (Dec 2, 2004)

I have had a great experience with PC after a so-so relationship with CIBC and a fees nightmare with a BMO account.

I love the no fees part of PC, and you can use CIBC's bank machines, which are everywhere, for just about everything including deposits and bill payments. Deposits are no problem; anything over $1,000 gets held for 5 days, but if you split up the deposits (and leave 1 day in between), no problem.

I especialy liked that I could replace my lost bank card at a kiosk at a Loblaws on a Sunday!

Thumbs up for PC from me.


----------

