# More Confirmation of Bell/Telus New Network



## DavidH (Jan 4, 2009)

Below is a quote from the Globe and Mail Business Section (see last paragraph).
Bell has signed a reciprocal agreement with AT&T to use the NEW Bell HSPA Network (4G - LTE) before the end of the year.

Quote:
"Bell said it has signed a reciprocal wireless roaming agreement with U.S. wireless giant AT&T. The deal will let AT&T wireless customers roam on Bell Mobility's new HSPA network, which is expected to launch before the end of the year, and give Bell customers access to AT&T's networks in the United States."
Link: BCE reports $346-million profit - The Globe and Mail

DavidH


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## chas_m (Dec 2, 2007)

That's great, but it doesn't mean they will carry the iPhone. At least, not for a year or so (when the next model comes out).


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## DavidH (Jan 4, 2009)

*Competition*

I agree Chas, it does not mean the iPhone.
I am just glad there will be some "Rogers" competition.
Competition is generally good for us consumers.

DavidH


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

*More Competition*

We can also expect Globalive and DAVE to be operational in major cities in 2010.
All GSM networks - lower prices and no contracts!


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## VNJ85 (Feb 24, 2006)

w/e as soon as we get GSM you can get any unlocked phone.. i like the possibilities.


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## KMPhotos (Jun 17, 2008)

It'll be nice to have competition but I'm not sure how much the pricing will improve. I get the feeling there are a lot of people that think prices will drop drastically, but I doubt that will happen. Maybe we'll be able to save a couple dollars here or there, but I have a feeling prices will still be similar to what they are now. 
As for new carriers saying no contracts, well if they ever get thd iPhone then people will have fo pay full price for it. While that may be fine for some - the majority will not care about contracts and only see $300 vs. $800. A lot of people don't have the money to just drop $800 or pay full price for phones.


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## bsenka (Jan 27, 2009)

I just hope they start working on coverage outside of major centres so that that service will be of any use to people who don't spend all of their time in the city.

As it is right now, I couldn't get an iPhone if I wanted to, because Rogers coverage just about everywhere I go is either sparse or non-existant. MTS has great coverage in manitoba, but is sticking with the current generation CDMA, and has no immediate plans to upgrade. Telus USED TO have great coverage, but that was primarily because they had a sweetheart piggyback deal with MTS. They've since had a falling out, and voice coverage outside the city for Telus is now spotty, and data coverage is non-existant.


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

bsenka said:


> I just hope they start working on coverage outside of major centres so that that service will be of any use to people who don't spend all of their time in the city.
> 
> As it is right now, I couldn't get an iPhone if I wanted to, because Rogers coverage just about everywhere I go is either sparse or non-existant. MTS has great coverage in manitoba, but is sticking with the current generation CDMA, and has no immediate plans to upgrade. Telus USED TO have great coverage, but that was primarily because they had a sweetheart piggyback deal with MTS. They've since had a falling out, and voice coverage outside the city for Telus is now spotty, and data coverage is non-existant.


Rogers has just entered an agreement with MTS to co build a 4G network in Manitoba.
This has to bother Shaw. Believe it or not things will improve throughout Manitoba. The deal was signed in the last 2 weeks.


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## bsenka (Jan 27, 2009)

jimbotelecom said:


> Rogers has just entered an agreement with MTS to co build a 4G network in Manitoba.
> This has to bother Shaw. Believe it or not things will improve throughout Manitoba. The deal was signed in the last 2 weeks.


That is good news! Thanks for the tip!!

Found the link:

mts.ca - About MTS Allstream



> Once complete the HSPA network will provide the widest available coverage in Manitoba and deliver next-generation broadband mobile services to 97% of the population. We expect the majority of the population to be covered by the end of 2010.


Really good news. My Telus contract is up in a year, and I've never been happy with them compared to the service I got with MTS. If MTS is HSPA by then (or at least has the deployment well underway), I'm in.


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## tilt (Mar 3, 2005)

I don't know if this is related - I got an email today from my company's IT guy about my work phone (TELUS), saying that now that Bell and TELUS share towers it is suggested that we upgrade our phones by dialling asterisk follwed by a five digit number etc.

I did that and my phone got "programmed" to join both Bell and TELUS towers.

I tried doing the same thing on my personal cell phone (Bell), but got an error message 

Cheers


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

tilt said:


> I don't know if this is related - I got an email today from my company's IT guy about my work phone (TELUS), saying that now that Bell and TELUS share towers it is suggested that we upgrade our phones by dialling asterisk follwed by a five digit number etc.
> 
> I did that and my phone got "programmed" to join both Bell and TELUS towers.
> 
> ...


Yes this is indicative of Telus and Bell collaborating on their 4G build; you might as well have roaming agreements in place for the legacy CDMA customers. Judging from your experience it seems that they are working on business aggregate accounts in order to gain the largest volume of roaming charges and then they'll look after individual consumers.


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

*Cable company wars*

One thing that is becoming obvious to me but has so far been over looked by the business press is that Rogers and Shaw appear to have started a war against each other.
It looks like Jim Shaw waited for Ted Rogers to die before establishing a presence in South Western Ontario with the acquisition of Hamilton's Mountain Cable. 

Ted Roger Jr. has responded with the MTS deal to build 4G in Manitoba where Shaw has a presence.

Shaw has spectrum but has chosen to stay out of building it thinking that they will snap up Globalive or DAVE when they go into creditor protection down the road; in the interim Rogers continues to build out a great 4G network and will be leaps and bounds ahead of the Shaws.

It's a good ol' dick swinging match that is going to get very very interesting to watch over the next year.

The Telcos have to love the cable family feud.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

jimbotelecom said:


> It looks like Jim Shaw waited for Ted Rogers to die before establishing a presence in South Western Ontario with the acquisition of Hamilton's Mountain Cable.
> 
> The Telcos have to love the cable family feud.


Cable is turning into the same, homogenized poop as the cell phone companies turned into. Some of my friends are affected by the Shaw takeover, and once all approvals are in place, they will have to shop for different service suppliers, since Shaw will be capping and throttling the internet service, and one will expect the fees to at least double, to match Rogers.

This country needs more competition, not less - but our Government continues to cave in by allowing massive levered buyouts that ruin competition and business.


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

EvanPitts said:


> Cable is turning into the same, homogenized poop as the cell phone companies turned into. Some of my friends are affected by the Shaw takeover, and once all approvals are in place, they will have to shop for different service suppliers, since Shaw will be capping and throttling the internet service, and one will expect the fees to at least double, to match Rogers.
> 
> This country needs more competition, not less - but our Government continues to cave in by allowing massive levered buyouts that ruin competition and business.


I agree wholeheartedly. The cable companies gouge at all opportunities. I think one thing that would help is if the cable companies were forced to wholesale their cable modem service so that ISP's could have access to them like Telco DSL.

I also think that the CRTC or perhaps Industry Canada should force the cable co and the Telcos to upgrade their networks to support IPv6 which would allow for a ton more of addressing space and it would allow for address portability.

We are a gutless country when it comes to encouraging competition but at least I can point it out and complain about it here.

I hate the Telco and Cablecos because they have been gouging us for years. They should return some of their outrageous monopoly-duopoly profits to consumers. 
How about 24 months of free internet and cell service for $20 per month with unlimited calling within Canada - any takers?


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## bsenka (Jan 27, 2009)

EvanPitts said:


> Cable is turning into the same, homogenized poop as the cell phone companies turned into. Some of my friends are affected by the Shaw takeover, and once all approvals are in place, they will have to shop for different service suppliers, since Shaw will be capping and throttling the internet service, and one will expect the fees to at least double, to match Rogers.


Shaw's cable TV prices are way too high for what you get, but their internet service is pretty good. It's really fast, rock solid reliable, and I've had no download limits or throttling issues to speak of.


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## okcomputer (Jul 18, 2005)

tilt said:


> I don't know if this is related - I got an email today from my company's IT guy about my work phone (TELUS), saying that now that Bell and TELUS share towers it is suggested that we upgrade our phones by dialling asterisk follwed by a five digit number etc.
> 
> I did that and my phone got "programmed" to join both Bell and TELUS towers.
> 
> ...


Interesting.

In Nova Scotia, Bell/Telus towers are one and the same - Telus signed a tower-sharing deal with Aliant/Bell when it first opened up shop here.

It's really annoying that CDMA coverage here is leaps and bounds over Rogers'. I was away for 3 days in a place where Rogers has absolutely no service and my wife had 4 bars with Telus/Bell.


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

bsenka said:


> Shaw's cable TV prices are way too high for what you get, but their internet service is pretty good. It's really fast, rock solid reliable, and I've had no download limits or throttling issues to speak of.


Shaw's internet service has a stellar reputation because it is extremely well engineered with hundreds of direct peers in the main NAP's in the U.S. at New York Chicago and Seattle. In fact they are often one of the main suppliers for many BGP4'd ISP in Canada.
Their TV is a rip off.


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## EvanPitts (Mar 9, 2007)

jimbotelecom said:


> I think one thing that would help is if the cable companies were forced to wholesale their cable modem service so that ISP's could have access to them like Telco DSL.


The DSL people are all having problems with Bell's throttling and capping policies, especially now that UTOS has been rolled out in some places, and is spreading like a plague. The topology of the cable system is quite restrictive, because the "upload" channel is only 4 MHz wide, and not only does every Internet user in a neighbourhood get to share that, so does everyone that uses the digital tv guide and VOD services.

The only real path away from that is to treat Internet like a public utility, and convert the system to Fiber Optic, where people can get some real services and bandwidth.



> I also think that the CRTC or perhaps Industry Canada should force the cable co and the Telcos to upgrade their networks to support IPv6 which would allow for a ton more of addressing space and it would allow for address portability.


That would be a start, but I also think that we need to have a whole and entirely fair system put into place, based on Fiber Optic, with an emphasis on servicing outlying areas, and with service provided for whatever OS on whatever computers, with a real policy put into place where technology would be Open Source / Open Standard, with a major move away from the proprietary. We also need to consider the implementation of wireless services, like WiMax, and making sure such service is available to regular people, rather than the elites that can afford what amounts to the most expensive and most mediocre services in the world.



> I hate the Telco and Cablecos because they have been gouging us for years. They should return some of their outrageous monopoly-duopoly profits to consumers.
> How about 24 months of free internet and cell service for $20 per month with unlimited calling within Canada - any takers?


The Government allowed for Bell to build a monopoly, but regulated it - so it was fair, and through various plans, under serviced rural districts were given a fair chance as well. Then the Government decided that regulation was too much effort, so they have allowed Bell, as a monopoly, to instate UTOS, by which Bell can decide on the terms of service. Thus, under UTOS, Bell can charge a customer $120 for a long distance call - unless you subscribe to some long distance plan - and the charges are unilateral, with the customer only getting the choice of being gouged by Bell, or not having a phone.

Cable companies were in the same boat, where they had monopolies over various areas. However, people did have a choice, they could put up an antenna. So at least the patina of competition kept cable prices down. This has changes, since the US no longer has broadcast TV - removing that choice, a choice we loose in two years. It's cable or bust.

I think mobile Internet is just a huge cash grab on the part of the companies - cash they use to buy out the remaining competition. It's sad to see independents like Mountain Cablevision go - they had long offered decent service at competitive prices, without gouging or corporate silliness. They even had an office where you could go and actually talk to someone - like in the good old days when even Bell had such levels of service.

With Shaw walking in, it's not a good thing, especially when they begin to throttle and cap. And really, the only reason why any of these companies can get away with shenanigans like "deep packet inspection", "throttling", arbitrarily capping services, or blatant acts of false advertising is because there is no competition.

It's the same as our gas prices. What can one expect when the nation relies on four refiners who have polished their collusion to a high, mirror like gloss?


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## DavidH (Jan 4, 2009)

*Another Report*

Here is another report from Electronista regarding the AT&T and Bell roaming deal.
Mentioned in the report is a rumour of an iPhone in the Fall?

Electronista | Bell HSPA to allow AT&T roaming, due in fall

This story continues to be interesting to follow.

DavidH


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## Puccasaurus (Dec 28, 2003)

EvanPitts said:


> However, people did have a choice, they could put up an antenna. So at least the patina of competition kept cable prices down. This has changes, since the US no longer has broadcast TV - removing that choice, a choice we loose in two years. It's cable or bust.


This is news to me and my trusty antenna  The US has stopped analog broadcasting in favour of all-digital signals - and they look great, even here in Toronto. I surely don't feel like paying for cable when I get about 20 digital & HD signals for free over the air.


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

Puccasaurus said:


> This is news to me and my trusty antenna  The US has stopped analog broadcasting in favour of all-digital signals - and they look great, even here in Toronto. I surely don't feel like paying for cable when I get about 20 digital & HD signals for free over the air.


You're lucky in Toronto that you can pick up that many channels via an antenna; the U.S. policy forced a digital transmission upgrade which meant that everyone who was picking up analog channels needs to buy a digital set top box @ ~$100.


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

EvanPitts said:


> The only real path away from that is to treat Internet like a public utility, and convert the system to Fiber Optic, where people can get some real services and bandwidth.


Again I have to agree here. This is difficult to achieve because the large corporate entities create all kinds of barriers to entry.

Here in Ottawa CANARIE put together an initiative to dark fibre together a small community but when it came to peering internet connectivity all of the players - Bell, Telus, Rogers, Allstream, Primus, etc., refused the peering request. The project has fibre going into homes and has robust connectivity home to home but has no internet cloud connectivity. To me, this illustrates collusion on the part of the carriers to prevent the development of an open source environment.

The CRTC should regulate here and force the carriers to provide internet connectivity at a moderate cost that can be shared by the home owners - say $30 per Mbps tabulated on a burstable usage per month.

I also agree with you Evan that Shaw taking over Mountain Cable is not a good thing. Shaw are throttling thugs just like the Telcos.


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## bsenka (Jan 27, 2009)

jimbotelecom said:


> Shaw are throttling thugs just like the Telcos.


I hear people say that all the time, but I sure have not seen any evidence of it. My downloads are always really fast, and they constantly get faster. If anything, P2P use is faster now than it was even 6 months ago.


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

bsenka said:


> I hear people say that all the time, but I sure have not seen any evidence of it. My downloads are always really fast, and they constantly get faster. If anything, P2P use is faster now than it was even 6 months ago.


Interesting bsenksa I only say this because Shaw went in front of the CRTC in July and says that they do throttle. It's possible that in Winnipeg they treat you differently. Are there any Shaw users in Alberta or B.C. that have no complaints?

On the positive side Shaw are known in the industry for having the best internet transit in Canada and possibly north America because of their 800 or so direct peers at the major NAPs.


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## corey111 (Jul 9, 2007)

I hate to be one of "those people" but...
I was on the phone on behalf of a less tech friendly friend with Telus trying to cancel her account. She wants an iPhone.
So they kept saying over and over again that they will definitely be getting iPhone in October. 
I know when you call in to cancel an account, those job of the rep you talk to is to keep you on their company and keep sending them money.
But this rep was 100% sure that they were getting it in Oct.
I asked if there was anything official they could show me to guarantee this, they said no. But the network has been built and is waiting for roll out.


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## danalicious (Nov 16, 2008)

jimbotelecom said:


> Are there any Shaw users in Alberta or B.C. that have no complaints?


We used Shaw when we lived in Calgary and now use it here in BC. We have never had an issue with any service. In fact, when I called to talk to them about reducing my bill they were incredibly helpful. Of course, they upsold me and gave me months of reduced fees


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## Puccasaurus (Dec 28, 2003)

jimbotelecom said:


> You're lucky in Toronto that you can pick up that many channels via an antenna; the U.S. policy forced a digital transmission upgrade which meant that everyone who was picking up analog channels needs to buy a digital set top box @ ~$100.


Well, people with older TVs need a set top box, but most recent TVs already have the necessary ATSC tuner. All I did was plug in an antenna to my TV and voila! I am lucky in the sense that I have a great location for receiving broadcast TV - a high elevation and an unobstructed view of the CN Tower. I just need to upgrade my antenna from this dinky RCA model


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## jimbotelecom (May 29, 2009)

*Bell Telus merger predicted by Royal Bank*

Bell and Telus will merge within 2 years, RBC predicts


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## whatiwant (Feb 21, 2008)

jimbotelecom said:


> Bell and Telus will merge within 2 years, RBC predicts


I feel sorry for Telus employees (within 2 years)


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## jeso (Aug 13, 2009)

this i captured 3 days ago... google that... i checked this only after i saw a guy with unlocked rogers and fido phones that had bell as the carrier when i opened it...


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