# The Headbut



## comprehab (May 28, 2005)

Zidane did something disgusting out on the field, in his last game in a French jersey.... He brutallu headbutted an Italian player in the chest. Neither of the players were involved in play when this happened and the referee did not see it. THe linesman caught it and Zidane recieved a red card.

Videos should surface soon enough.


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## Snapple Quaffer (Sep 2, 2003)

Crazy crazy crazy!

Oh, Zizou
Watchou do?


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## SoyMac (Apr 16, 2005)

A disgusting act of childishness, in Zidane's last game before retirement.
I wasn't strongly rooting for the Italians over the French until that moment.
I guess it's good that the world got to see Zidane's true character before he went on to make millions in endorsements. 
_
"One's character is not shaped by adversity. It is revealed by it."_


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

There's no question that he headbutted the Italian player, he clearly did. The question is why would one of the most experienced players in the game do such a stupid thing? There's no possible excuse, but these players spend a lot of time and effort psyching each other out, and perhaps somebody said something that made Zidane snap this time? There were words exchanged just prior.

No excuse, it was perhaps even more disgusting than Rooney stepping on the Portugal player's protective cup, since a head butt to the heart can be deadly, even to the great Italian actors on the field.


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## comprehab (May 28, 2005)

HowEver said:


> There's no question that he headbutted the Italian player, he clearly did. The question is why would one of the most experienced players in the game do such a stupid thing? There's no possible excuse, but these players spend a lot of time and effort psyching each other out, and perhaps somebody said something that made Zidane snap this time? There were words exchanged just prior.
> 
> No excuse, it was perhaps even more disgusting than Rooney stepping on the Portugal player's protective cup, since a head butt to the heart can be deadly, even to the great Italian actors on the field.


I don't think anyone was questioning it....

Zidane was being held...and then words were exchanged. In the WC thread someone said he was called a "terrorist"....Whatever


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

just before then i saw the italian player look like he pinched zidane's breast which probably didn't make him too happy

the italian player went down like he'd been shot

if you look closely at the replay you can see the italian player self recoil

and why didn't the linesman catch it right away?
interesting how the call was made AFTER the replay in the stadium\

one should also note that the fans loudly whistled (european version of booing) at the italian players after that incident showing their displeasure with the italian side

very poorly refereed game
there should have been a 2nd penalty kick for france in the 2nd half

the french clearly outplayed italy for the majority of the match


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## comprehab (May 28, 2005)

I don't think he pinched Zidane, but was rather holding him. While that is not exactly fair play, it doesn't deserve a potentially lethal blow to the chest.

I would go down like I had been shot too- Zidane is a lot scarrier than any bullet I've ever seen.

Whatever..

THe referee didn't speak to the linesman until after the play... there is no flag call for "headbut to the chest on the other side fo the field" 

You were able to detect whistling over the loud screams... THX dolby delight, I'm watching the next game at your place. Besides, what makes you think they were whistling at the Italians....goof. Everyone in that stadium was disgusted with the FRENCH (Zidane). 

That was one of the best referees, and a very well reffed game. He let the players play for the most part, with the exception of getting France's first dive wrong. 

Italy outplayed France by a long shot for the first half, and then took on a more defensive game.


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

comprehab said:


> You were able to detect whistling over the loud screams... THX dolby delight, I'm watching the next game at your place. Besides, what makes you think they were whistling at the Italians....goof. Everyone in that stadium was disgusted with the FRENCH (Zidane).


Whenever the Italians touched the ball, they booed. When the French got the ball, it stopped.


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## comprehab (May 28, 2005)

Vandave said:


> Whenever the Italians touched the ball, they booed. When the French got the ball, it stopped.


Excellent analysis of the game Vandave! :clap: :clap:

Just goes to show how low those French fans are.


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## Flipstar (Nov 7, 2004)

comprehab said:


> Excellent analysis of the game Vandave! :clap: :clap:
> 
> Just goes to show how low those French fans are.


Alright, we get it. You're PRO-ITALY.. Now stop flaming everyone's posts.:lmao:


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

Vandave said:


> Whenever the Italians touched the ball, they booed. When the French got the ball, it stopped.


that's the same that i saw and heard on my television
perhaps comprehab had the volume turned down?


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

> potentially lethal blow to the chest.


in soccer a "leathal blow" could come from a sneeze, but amazingly the italian player recovered after lots of tv closeups

it's just disgusting how much the players dive and this on such a grand world stage

i dare say a few "divers" are not going to get such warm welcomes when they return to their club teams, unless of course their club team is in their own country

rinaldo, you listening?


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## mbaldwin (Jan 20, 2003)

Wow! Wikipedia is fast...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marco_Materazzi


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## overkill (May 15, 2005)

How unfortunate for a career to probably be remembered for that. Zidane should not have done what he did and paid the price for it.

I think the ref did a good job for the most part of the game. Questionable call on the France penalty, but I agree that there was contact on the play and he did miss the second penalty in the second half, but these things happen in any soccer game. The ref's handled the situation appropriately and Zidane was carded and sent off after final consultaion between ref and linesman.


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

mbaldwin said:


> Wow! Wikipedia is fast...
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marco_Materazzi


the head butt was over reaction, but the italian player definitely took a dive
i've played contact sports and that head butt would hardly put me down on my a$$
unless of course i was a fit, young soccer player wearing 1.25" cleats


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## comprehab (May 28, 2005)

You never cease to amaze me MS.

A blow to the chest like that often results in a cardiac contusion. 

If you were playing a contact sport not only would you be wearing more than a skin tight shirt, but you would also be anticipating the attack. 

Zidane attacked without warning. What ever Materazzi said, it must have been pretty good.

Zidane ended his professional career on a disgusting note.


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## dubplatepressure (Jun 15, 2006)

Geez... these discussions really get heated, dont they? 

I'll admit the head butt was pretty bad... it was blatant, ugly and inexcusable and he no doubt deserved a red card _regardless_ of how the italian player went down.

Under the circumstances, and given the amount of fall-down-and-grab-your-ankle-and-roll-on-the-ground football that had been played all tournament, I'd say it was nothing unusual (the fall). At least he actually had something to fall down for, for once. 

I thought although the first penalty which resulted in Zidane scoring on the free kick was more dive then penalty, the missed call in the box in the second half should have been. After viewing the replay it's clear the italian player got nothing of the ball and all of the body - a clear taker down. However, it wasnt called, for one reason or another. C'est la vie.

Overall I thought the french played a more offensive game, and Italy more or less focused on containing. I actually fell asleep for a few minutes late during the second half and awoke for the Zidane headbutt.

....I can only wonder 'What the hell was he thinking?'


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

comprehab said:


> You never cease to amaze me MS.
> 
> A blow to the chest like that often results in a cardiac contusion.
> 
> ...


with italilan players a sneeze causes them to fall like they've been shot
i've been hit in the chest many times playing sports without any protective gear and the reaction to that head butt was overly dramatized like bad acting

please don't make out like zidane attempted to murder someone

obviously your sports playing only dealt with chess and/or tiddly winks


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

MS, I'm just wondering, why are you here? If you care so little for what anyone other than you is saying.

Despite what you think you know about sports, and despite the propensity of soccer players to dive, people do have heart attacks from this kind of injury.


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## mikeinmontreal (Oct 13, 2005)

MacSpectrum, the only comments you've posted re: the World Cup are Italians this, Italians that. If you don't like Italians, keep it to yourself. No one makes fun of your tin-foil fetish. Now wrap yourself up in some and cook at 450.


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## milhaus (Jun 1, 2004)

comprehab said:


> Zidane ended his professional career on a disgusting note.


I'd say that Golden Ball is a pretty good way to end your career. I just love how you don't wait for the other side of the story to come out before passing judgement. If somebody called me a *****, I'd do the same. But I guess Caucasians don't have to worry about that.


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## dona83 (Jun 26, 2005)

I play goal in hockey, a hard slap shot to the chest is pretty painful even with the chest pad, I had to spend a few seconds to regain my breath. I'm sure Zidane was provoked but definitely did not take the high road out. It wasn't acting, it definitely looked painful.


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## maximusbibicus (Feb 25, 2002)

milhaus said:


> I'd say that Golden Ball is a pretty good way to end your career. I just love how you don't wait for the other side of the story to come out before passing judgement. If somebody called me a *****, I'd do the same. But I guess Caucasians don't have to worry about that.


I am hoping the other side does come out. I am sure ZZ has participated in his share of trash talking on the field. The Italian player musts have said something really bad to provoke that type of response, especially considering the circumstances in the game....extra time, France on the attack, Italians playing for the penalty kicks....

If it is a racial slur, I can somewhat understand the response. Any man proud of his heritage would have a tough time walking away from that. 

Tragic end to a remarkable career. Sadly, this is what the casual (maybe some hardcore too) soccer fan will always think of when they hear the name Zidane.


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## milhaus (Jun 1, 2004)

What makes me even more ill is that I've heard that the Italian Justice minister is now calling for amnesty for the Italian teams involved in the match fixing scandal, as a reward for their world cup success. Way to go Italy! Lets reward cheats who win!!


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## JPL (Jan 21, 2005)

I can't begin to imagine what could have been said to provoke that kind of response from a mature, world class player who has heard it all on the field. There can be no excuse for that response, some very serious action has to be taken against ZZ. It is most unfortunate that a great player ends his international career in such a manner.


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

JPL said:


> I can't begin to imagine what could have been said to provoke that kind of response from a mature, world class player who has heard it all on the field. There can be no excuse for that response, some very serious action has to be taken against ZZ. It is most unfortunate that a great player ends his international career in such a manner.


I read that he called him a terrorist. Zidane is from Algiers and has a Muslim background.


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## SoyMac (Apr 16, 2005)

milhaus said:


> ... I just love how you don't wait for the other side of the story to come out before passing judgement. If somebody called me a *****, I'd do the same. But I guess Caucasians don't have to worry about that.


Somehow I don't think you _would_ do the same, no matter what an opposing player called you.
Imagine, Milhaus, you're a seasoned, professional athlete, at the height of your spectacular career. You're about to win the world cup, the apex of 15 - 20 years hard work, and all someone has to do is call you a name, a racial slur, says "*****", makes a comment about your Mom's boots, and that would excuse you to let down your team mates, your fans, your country? 
Really? 

I'm just askin' is all.

And more to the story; I read in yesterday's Ottawa Citizen coverage that Zidane has been red carded for head-butting opposing players more than once in the past.


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

HowEver said:


> MS, I'm just wondering, why are you here? If you care so little for what anyone other than you is saying.
> 
> Despite what you think you know about sports, and despite the propensity of soccer players to dive, people do have heart attacks from this kind of injury.


and as soon as you show me proof that professional soccer players have died from said injury, i might agree with you


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

dona83 said:


> I play goal in hockey, a hard slap shot to the chest is pretty painful even with the chest pad, I had to spend a few seconds to regain my breath. I'm sure Zidane was provoked but definitely did not take the high road out. It wasn't acting, it definitely looked painful.


a slap shot with a frozen hockey puck is hardly a comparision for the head butt by zidane

was it wrong of him to do it? yes
did the italian player overreact? yes
in the NFL and NHL players get penalties for making racial slurs

soccer referees are so often so far away from the play making it very difficult for them to make the correct, if any, call


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

SoyMac said:


> Somehow I don't think you _would_ do the same, no matter what an opposing player called you.
> Imagine, Milhaus, you're a seasoned, professional athlete, at the height of your spectacular career. You're about to win the world cup, the apex of 15 - 20 years hard work, and all someone has to do is call you a name, a racial slur, says "*****", makes a comment about your Mom's boots, and that would excuse you to let down your team mates, your fans, your country?
> Really?
> 
> ...


go onto a CFL, NFL, NBA field/court and call someone the n word and see what happens

and to think the motto of this world cup was racial tolerance


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

milhaus said:


> But I guess Caucasians don't have to worry about that.


How so?


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

MACSPECTRUM said:


> and as soon as you show me proof that professional soccer players have died from said injury, i might agree with you


I watched the UFC on Saturday night. Even they don't allow headbutts.

I doubt anybody has died from this type of assault playing soccer because it probably was the first time somebody did it.

There is no excuse for this type of violence. I don't care what Materazzi said or did before.


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

more comments from around the world and Zidane wins player of the tournament award

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,19748012%5E23209,00.html



> "Something must have been said to Zidane," Germany's two-time Cup winner Franz Beckenbauer said. "He is actually a reserved and inoffensive person."
> 
> Materazzi refused to comment about what transpired between him and Zidane


and it looks like none of the referees actually saw the head butt and were informed by somone watching a monitor
now if they can use video replay for that, they should use it all the time

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,19747515%5E23209,00.html



> According to both coaches, Luis Medina Cantalejo, the fourth official, and the man who gave that penalty against Australia, continued his role as Italy's good luck charm.
> 
> They say Cantalejo saw Zidane thrust his head into Marco Materazzi's chest on a small television screen on the sideline and informed Argentine referee Horacio Elizondo.
> 
> ...


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## modsuperstar (Nov 23, 2004)

That call definitely did seem fishy at the time. If one of the refs had seen it the card would have come out a lot quicker. While it's indisputably a foul, by rights it should have been a non-call if none of the referees saw it. It happens in hockey as well, as there is no way to discipline someone without seeing what happened. These types of things happen and typically result in lengthy suspensions after the fact by disciplinary commitees. This is a Brett Hull foot-in-the-crease kind of officiating blunder on FIFAs part that just makes the game look bad.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

About consulting the fourth referee... perhaps.

But anyone watching the game clearly saw that the call was made after the main referee walked over to the linesman, who would have been asked if he had seen the action by Zidane. Only after that was the red card shown to Zidane.

If Zidane says why he did it, and the Italian player concurs, then we'll know why; not any other way, as they were the two involved. Of course, this isn't likely to happen.

It remained a very interesting game to watch.


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## SoyMac (Apr 16, 2005)

MACSPECTRUM said:


> go onto a CFL, NFL, NBA field/court and call someone the n word and see what happens...


I don't know - what do you think would happen?
Would a veteran pro basketball star throw away the NBA finals if someone called him a N****R?

Anyone?

And maybe milhaus is right. I'm pink. I don't ever have to worry about the strictly personal effects of racism. 

But what do you folks think - should a seasoned, pro athlete be excused for throwing away the ultimate goal, everything for everybody who works for and supports his (her) team, because of a possible racial epithet?


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

SoyMac said:


> And maybe milhaus is right. I'm pink. I don't ever have to worry about the strictly personal effects of racism.


There are lots of 'pink' people that are affected by racism. Racism isn't one directional, it's multidirectional.


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## mikeinmontreal (Oct 13, 2005)

Well, I am a caucasian, but being half Quebecois (French Canadian) and half Italian, I have been subject to some degree of racism right here on Ehmac, though not directly. Oh sure, many will say that they are biased against the Italian soccer team only, but the manner in which they vent and bitch and complain about the Italian soccer team, there must be a little more resentment hidden under there. And I have seen some anti-Quebec commentary, but not at the same level of that of the Italian soccer team. And for your francophobe WASPs, you can be Quebecois and Canadian at the same time.


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## Frank E (Mar 17, 2004)

Italy WON the game, They are the WORLD CHAMPIONS.
4 World Cup championships out of 18. Pretty nice ratio.

On they other hand I remember when I was a boy in Toronto the vicious racism of many people toward the Italian community. I guess some things never change.


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

mikeinmontreal said:


> I have been subject to some degree of racism right here on Ehmac, though not directly. Oh sure, many will say that they are biased against the Italian soccer team only, but the manner in which they vent and bitch and complain about the Italian soccer team, there must be a little more resentment hidden under there.


I hope you don't feel that way about any of my posts which were critical of the italian team. They played well in the final game and there wasn't too much acting and diving (I gues you need the ball to do that  ). But, there was a lot of it in the preliminaries, especially against the US. I think the team rightfully deserved criticism.


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Seeing more dives by one team or another has very little to do with racism, it has to do with the sport. Things may be perceived a certain way but keep in mind that some people have watched every game in the tournament and their opinion is based on what has been seen to happen. There were worse offenders than Italy, but there were some teams that *never* dived: the U.S. team is one of those. (And the Italian team had the player who was carded and then suspended for 4 games at the World Cup for elbowing the American player in the face--you know, the player that was bloodied by the elow, the one with the steel plate in his face.)

It's also unfortunate that the cheating going on by team owners in Italy is casting aspersions on the Italian players and their national team. Again, this could happen anywhere and all concerned should be considered innocent until proven guilty (unless they're French, where there is a presumption of guilt and the onus is on the defendent to prove innocence).

Very few international players avoid getting carded at some point. Usually it just means they are playing as hard as they should.

The Zidane incident is something else again.


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## imachungry (Sep 19, 2004)

SoyMac said:


> I don't know - what do you think would happen?
> Would a veteran pro basketball star throw away the NBA finals if someone called him a N****R?
> 
> Anyone?
> ...


Bang on. The rest is meaningless talk. Jordon would NEVER have done such a thing.


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## SoyMac (Apr 16, 2005)

I hesitate to post this first part of the response, because I really don't want this thread to derail into a discussion about the nature of/breadth of racism. I want to learn more about athlete psychology in professional sports. So Vandave, I'll reply to your last post, and then I won't say any more about my status as a pink, non-athletic Canadian:


Vandave said:


> There are lots of 'pink' people that are affected by racism. Racism isn't one directional, it's multidirectional.


Of course. That is stating the obvious. 
That's why I said "_*I*_ don't ever have to worry about the _*strictly personal*_ effects of racism".

I regret that my sentence structure derailed the discussion from whether you think professional athletes should be expected to maintain control of their emotions for the good of the team, or they should let fly an angry response to a despicable comment/gesture/symbol, no matter what the cost to their fans and teammates.

Anyone here involved in pro sports? What's your take? I'm curious if anyone else agrees/disagrees with imachungry.


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## modsuperstar (Nov 23, 2004)

imachungry said:


> Bang on. The rest is meaningless talk. Jordon would NEVER have done such a thing.


I think the difference here is that the jab seemed a little more personal then someone dropping the N-bomb on black athletes. Colour of skin is abundantly apparent to anyone, same as if someone is tall, short, fat or skinny. The difference here is that the Italian player, and I'm working on media heresay, called Zidane a "terrorist". Now to call him a terrorist means he knows more about Zidane and his heritage and religion than just a superficial observation by looking at him. It was obviously a personal dig designed to illicit a reaction, and he got just what he wanted.


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## Snapple Quaffer (Sep 2, 2003)

Quote from HowEver's last post:



> Things may be perceived a certain way but keep in mind that some people have watched every game in the tournament and their opinion is based on what has been seen to happen.


Exactly!

And perhaps also bear in mind that there are many, of which happy band I am one, who have watched World Cups since the early 70s (and before), and we have almost a folk-memory the same cynical, disgusting cheating that has led to 'victories' in the past. Who, for instance, can forget the inspired and magnificent 'Hand of God' in the 1986 WC?

One becomes accustomed to seeing the same national teams, over time, in varying degrees of consistency, displaying their talented inventiveness for overcoming the tiresome rules and regulations that hamper their progress. This dreary spectacle, if discussed should really _not_ draw the accusation of racism. 'Bias' is the word I would use.


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## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

Take a look at the videos, e.g. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPTIT0IaHko . It was a very stupid thing to do and there are no excuses. He should have walked away regardless of what was said. There were thousands on cameras on the guy, there were a few minutes to go and he was the captain of the team. He took a determined and indefensible action. Zidane's penalty was appropriate and the Italians won the shoot out with a perfect 5 for 5. It's just a shame that his actions affected the outcome for so many on his team - they were playing better than the Italians. The penalty shootout is about composure and retaining your cool in a challenge heavily weighted to the kicker. What Zidane did 20 mins before the penalty shootout was to drop his pants and kick the ball out of the stadium. Football is supposedly called sport......

Players do stupid things. They should be and are penalized (witness Beckham against Argentina in 1998). A shame, but then these actions remind equally fallible fans that the players are also of the same, imperfect species.


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## djstp (Mar 10, 2006)

this is really funny

http://widelec.org/zidane.html


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## modsuperstar (Nov 23, 2004)

djstp said:


> this is really funny
> 
> http://widelec.org/zidane.html


It is things like this that make me love the internet.


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## gnatsum (Apr 10, 2005)

Frank E said:


> Italy WON the game, They are the WORLD CHAMPIONS.
> 4 World Cup championships out of 18. Pretty nice ratio.
> 
> On they other hand I remember when I was a boy in Toronto the vicious racism of many people toward the Italian community. I guess some things never change.


this has nothing to do with racism against italians. I personally am surprised to see so many Italia supporters on this thread. come hang out with me and my friends and you'll realise why many people hate the Italian and Portuguese teams. they are commonly known as "high paid actors" here. not sportsman, just a whiny bunch whose heads are bigger than the stadium. and great of all things the game is down to chance and chance said France would Lose, not Italy would win. a shootout is not a just way to name the winner of a World Cup. This is no rushed game where you need to decide a winner. Clearly France had the game. in the two extra periods they had possesion most of the time. 

now back to Zidane's Headbutt. 

Materazzi OBVIOUSLY Deserved it. just like all you people have said. why would such a "seasoned" or "professional" do that? think hard. he's no rooney. he IS seasoned and he IS a professional. and people sometimes ask for it. 

you are all supporting the one thing which most soccer fans HATE about the italian team. they are violent and provocative. yet when ANYTHING happens to them, they are on the floor rolling about, CRYING about it like SPOILED LITTLE BRATS.

MATERAZZI DESERVED IT.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

I find it ironic that a headbutt causes such uproar in a country whose national game is incredibly violent.........all the time.

High level athletes are high strung and driven - some react very violently when provoked....sounds like a description of a cross section of **** sapiens.


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## milhaus (Jun 1, 2004)

Vandave said:


> How so?


I'm sorry, but as a Caucasian living in NA, you simply can't understand the impact or effects of racism, especially the institutional and cultural. It would be like me professing to feel the effects of gender discrimination. Don't even bother.


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## milhaus (Jun 1, 2004)

djstp said:


> this is really funny
> 
> http://widelec.org/zidane.html


I have to give the guy credit. Very nicely done.


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## comprehab (May 28, 2005)

milhaus said:


> I'm sorry, but as a Caucasian living in NA, you simply can't understand the impact or effects of racism, especially the institutional and cultural. It would be like me professing to feel the effects of gender discrimination. Don't even bother.


Not true at all....but by all means, keep on digging.


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## iMatt (Dec 3, 2004)

MacDoc said:


> I find it ironic that a headbutt causes such uproar in a country whose national game is incredibly violent.........all the time.


C'mon, Doc, curling isn't THAT bad.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

:clap: smartass


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

comprehab said:


> Not true at all....but by all means, keep on digging.


Ya, keep digging milhaus. Or better yet, try to dig into some history books.


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## MannyP Design (Jun 8, 2000)

milhaus said:


> I'm sorry, but as a Caucasian living in NA, you simply can't understand the impact or effects of racism, especially the institutional and cultural. It would be like me professing to feel the effects of gender discrimination. Don't even bother.


Where's the smiley?

Oh wait, you're serious. Well, I guess you have a lot to learn milhaus.

A LOT to learn.


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## SoyMac (Apr 16, 2005)

MacDoc said:


> I find it ironic that a headbutt causes such uproar in a country whose national game is incredibly violent.........all the time...


Yeah, I was thinking that myself.  

Here's a scenario that makes me wonder about what is an effective psychology for athletes (and I guess it crosses sport types and oceans too):
We found out after The Hurricanes won the cup that some players on both sides played games in the play-offs with fractures. They knew thay were injured but played through. Wow. They didn't want the opposing team to know, so 1. they wouldn't be physically targeted, and 2. they didn't want to give a psychological edge to the opposing team. And yet in European soceer, injuries are _faked_ all the time. I wonder if that ultimately gives the opposing team a stronger edge. "Hey, we're tougher!" (Well, I guess the fate of the non-diving Americans might answer that one.) What do _you_ think?

The other scenario that Zindane's outburst reminds me of, was the game in which Chris Neil taunted the opposing goalie, and then trash-mouthed the opposing tough guy just before the puck dropped. It was late in the season and a pretty important game. Opposing toughy (I can't even rememebr the team, never mind the player) immediately lit into Neil, who quickly dropped to the ice, and curled protectively with his arms over his own head.
The Sens went on to play the last 5 minutes with a man advantage, and easily one the game. Many people, Grapes included, said that what Neil did was sneaky, unsportsmanlike, cowardly. But I thought it was brilliant. No-one forced opposing toughy into taking a penalty, he walked into it himself. Neil's clever actions won the Sens the game, just by using a few seconds of harmless posturing and lippiness, to the Sens' psychological advantage.
Am I wrong to make this comparison to the Zidane situation?
Who was responsible for Zidane's headbutting behaviour, and France's eventual loss - the loss of a game France mostly controlled? Materazzi? Is he responsible for Zidane's actions?

So I guess my question for you isn't just about effective athlete psychology, but also about responsibilty.
Hello?


----------



## SoyMac (Apr 16, 2005)

_Originally Posted by MacDoc
I find it ironic that a headbutt causes such uproar in a country whose national game is incredibly violent.........all the time..._


iMatt said:


> C'mon, Doc, curling isn't THAT bad.


iMatt, You silly nut!
MacDoc is talking about *Synchronised Swimming!*
(and Synchronised Swimming actually _is_ a Canadian invention. But c'mon, neighbours. That's no reason to hate _all_ Canadians.)


----------



## Hypno (Sep 27, 2003)

gnatsum said:


> Materazzi OBVIOUSLY Deserved it. just like all you people have said. why would such a "seasoned" or "professional" do that? think hard. he's no rooney. he IS seasoned and he IS a professional. and people sometimes ask for it.
> 
> you are all supporting the one thing which most soccer fans HATE about the italian team. they are violent and provocative. yet when ANYTHING happens to them, they are on the floor rolling about, CRYING about it like SPOILED LITTLE BRATS.
> 
> MATERAZZI DESERVED IT.


gnatsum, i must say you really are a donkey for saying that the players are crying spoiled little brats. I have watched all the games in this world cup and must say i have seen more crying and players whining to refs from other teams then i did from the World Champs! This is all a stereotype of the italian team and it is all you haters have to flame a world class team and nation!
Maybe Materazzi did say something and anyone who plays sports knows that words are always exchanged between players and tempers flair but you must remember that Zidane has a history of using his head for the wrong reasons. 

Italians have passion! heart! and culture and are a very proud people and the world would be a better place if others had those values...i must admit that ital-canadians are not a good representation of the people of Italy.

I congratulate the Italian team for a great World Cup!!


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## milhaus (Jun 1, 2004)

Vandave said:


> Ya, keep digging milhaus. Or better yet, try to dig into some history books.


Believe what you want . . . I have read enough history and cultural theory to know the difference between race and ethnicity, something you don't seem to understand. But hey, I don't expect much from web discussions . . . Look it up, and preferably not on Wikipedia.


----------



## milhaus (Jun 1, 2004)

« MannyP Design » said:


> Where's the smiley?
> 
> Oh wait, you're serious. Well, I guess you have a lot to learn milhaus.
> 
> A LOT to learn.


I guess we don't understand the difference between sympathy and empathy here either.


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## guytoronto (Jun 25, 2005)

milhaus said:


> Look it up, and preferably not on Wikipedia.


What's wrong with Wikipedia?


----------



## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

guytoronto said:


> What's wrong with Wikipedia?


It disagrees with milhaus? Just a guess....


----------



## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

milhaus said:


> Believe what you want . . . I have read enough history and cultural theory to know the difference between race and ethnicity, something you don't seem to understand. But hey, I don't expect much from web discussions . . . Look it up, and preferably not on Wikipedia.


I guess you missed my posting in the other thread where I made that point.

What does this comment have to do with your opinion on the lack of racism against caucasians in North America?


----------



## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

Maybe everyone should watch some Shaolin Soccer.


----------



## overkill (May 15, 2005)

Beej said:


> Maybe everyone should watch some Shaolin Soccer.


Yes, Shaolin will teach discipline and super duper kicks that will shatter walls and pave a path of destruction!


----------



## dubplatepressure (Jun 15, 2006)

Vandave said:


> What does this comment have to do with your opinion on the lack of racism against caucasians in North America?



This is why I love the internet.... only here can a thread about a head butt in a soccer match turn into a political debate of this magnitude.


----------



## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

overkill said:


> Yes, Shaolin will teach discipline and super duper kicks that will shatter walls and pave a path of destruction!


No dives or trash talk either. If you get injured, it's because someone kicked a hyper-speed fire-encased shot at you. No dishonour there.

http://www.apple.com/trailers/miramax/shaolin_soccer/viewingpage.html


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

I'm sure you mean "magnitude" in a wrong end of the telescope kind of way.




dubplatepressure said:


> This is why I love the internet.... only here can a thread about a head butt in a soccer match turn into a political debate of this magnitude.


----------



## overkill (May 15, 2005)

More Shaolin discipline is needed!


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## dubplatepressure (Jun 15, 2006)

HowEver said:


> I'm sure you mean "magnitude" in a wrong end of the telescope kind of way.



I mean whatever gets me out of work early.... gaaaaaaaaaawwwd. 45 minutes left.



Ahh Zidane... you fool.:lmao:


----------



## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

Fool, or the best player of the tournament:

http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com/06/en/w/gball/index.html



> *GOLDEN BALL AWARD WINNER
> French playmaker Zinedine Zidane has received the adidas Golden Ball award after being voted player of the tournament by the accredited journalists present at the Final of the 2006 FIFA World Cup™ on 9 July.*


----------



## gnatsum (Apr 10, 2005)

HowEver said:


> Fool, or the best player of the tournament:
> 
> http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com/06/en/w/gball/index.html


nice post 

Hypno: i guess a lot of people are fools then to hate the Italian soccer team. i guess rolling on the floor and whining about everything that touches them is good sportsmanship. maybe they'd make better basketball players. now THAT's a whiny bunch.


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## overkill (May 15, 2005)

Fabio Cannavaro really should have won the Golden Ball award in my opinion, but Zidane did have a solid tournament to compliment his solid head shot. Looked like a finishing move from Mortal Kombat


----------



## comprehab (May 28, 2005)

Agreed-Cannavaro should have got it, but let the baby have his bottle.


----------



## Snapple Quaffer (Sep 2, 2003)

Hey, fair doos!

Cannavarit both ways - Cannavaro got his mitts on the World Cup!


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Seems there is more to come












> Fifa investigates Zidane red card
> 
> Zidane reacted to Materazzi's insult by headbutting the defender
> Fifa is to investigate Zinedine Zidane's dramatic sending-off during Sunday's World Cup final in Berlin.
> ...


----------



## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

This matter will be forgotten long before it's "proven."



> "He said 'if you really want my shirt, you can have it later.'


This actually seems like a pretty amusing and even decent offer. Zidane might otherwise have exchanged his shirt with the Italian captain, not some mid-level player.


----------



## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

HowEver said:


> This matter will be forgotten long before it's "proven."


I don't think it will. I think FIFA will have to look into it and it shouldn't take a long time to do it. There is only so much evidence to collect.

Apparently a lip reader was able to figure out what he said (i.e. son of a terrorist whore). Zidane will give his side of the story within a week or two.

If he did say that, it was really the worst possible thing to say to Zidane. He offended his mother, his racial background (muslim family) and the people of France who are struggling with racial issues right now. I don't see that going away as this is symbolic of a much larger issue.

If Materazzi said that, he should be suspended for a long time. It looks really bad on FIFA given their recent campaign against racism.


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

On top of that Zidane's mother had just been taken to the hospital *that day!!.* 
••

However I saw the incident covered by HD before the red card and there is no question it escalated - I suspect the shirt comment was the original reaction by Zidane ........then as I recall there were a couple of exchanges then boom.

Anyone have a video clip? - body language will tell much.


----------



## comprehab (May 28, 2005)

Macdoc, seems like all videos have been removed from the net...I had a few linsk yesterday, but now they are all turning up as "This video has been removed at the request of copyright owner FIFA 2006 because its content was used without permission"

The way I remember it... Materazzi holding Zidane's shirt, a few words exchanged, then Zidane walks forward a few steps, turns around, and wihout warning went in for the headbut.


----------



## 20DDan (May 2, 2005)

Personally if the player DID insult Zidane's mother, diss his background, and call him a terrorist I think that guy should get kicked out of the sport! Period! That's three of the most sensitive things to diss someone with! As for Zidane's red card and the end to his career... Eh I understand why he reacted the way he did! I almost killed a guy who dissed my mother. You dont go there!


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## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

comprehab said:


> The way I remember it... Materazzi holding Zidane's shirt, a few words exchanged, then Zidane walks forward a few steps, turns around, and wihout warning went in for the headbut.


Without warning? I'm pretty sure nobody warns their opponent before a headbutt. Kind of defeats the purpose.

Seriously, though, Zidane's Golden Shoe award will make up for his red carding.

Nothing, though, will ever make up for France losing. He takes partial responsibility for that with him.

It seems, too, more that France lost than that Italy won. Both great teams, and the Italian defence was masterful, but they had more shots on goal in the penalty kick part of the game than the 2 hours preceding.


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## comprehab (May 28, 2005)

The warning I was referring to was some kind of a facial expression or some body language..... He seemed to have no emotion as he turned and speared Materazzi.


----------



## HowEver (Jan 11, 2005)

I agree with that. I'd say I never expected to see anything like it, but there was that earlier headbutt by Figo on Rooney.



comprehab said:


> The warning I was referring to was some kind of a facial expression or some body language..... He seemed to have no emotion as he turned and speared Materazzi.


----------



## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

7gabriel5elpher said:


> Eh I understand why he reacted the way he did! I almost killed a guy who dissed my mother. You dont go there!


I hope that's an exaggeration. Physical reaction to a verbal stupidity, short of a threatening one, is not warranted. Sports or not, the other player may have "deserved" it, but the reaction is idiotic, especially for a captain.


----------



## SoyMac (Apr 16, 2005)

7gabriel5elpher said:


> Personally if the player DID insult Zidane's mother, diss his background, and call him a terrorist I think that guy should get kicked out of the sport! Period! That's three of the most sensitive things to diss someone with! As for Zidane's red card and the end to his career... Eh I understand why he reacted the way he did! I almost killed a guy who dissed my mother. You dont go there!


So, does anyone else here agree that Zidane was correct in costing his tream, his fans, and his country, the soccer world cup because he didn't keep his cool in response to trash talk?
And should there be censorship of which subjects may be breached in trash talking, with FIFA sanctions in response?
I'm very curious - Comments?


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Without warning is an odd term...my sense was he had had enough - the exchange took some time - no question in my mind the Italian was baiting him and was shocked as hell when he got well nailed for it.
He got hammered pretty well and he's not a small guy....if what is attributed to him saying is true I'm not one bit surprised Zidane reacted as he did. Zidane properly got red carded for the action but there should be more severe sanctions for Materazzi given the "no racism" campaign Fifa undertook.
••

SoyMac - why use the term "was he correct" here. It's too loaded.
Were his actions understandable I would think is the better phrasing.

All people make errors, some provoked some unprovoked. This one clearly was provoked and from what I saw and now understand the content of the baiting to be......a very human reaction. Regrettable maybe but as the other poster said "You don't go there".

That kind of racial and personal baiting has no part in any sport - psyching and gamesmenship is one thing - racial slurs and family insults there should be zero tolerance.

Materazzi was representing Italy........


----------



## gnatsum (Apr 10, 2005)

"I am ignorant, I don't even know what an Islamic terrorist is; my only terrorist is her," he said pointing to his 10-month-old daughter.

this quote says a lot on it's own. 

Comprehab, He gave no warning because he's a seasoned professional 

Soymac, france can win without Zidane too i'm sure. i would question why they removed Henry before Zidane was removed?!?! him and Zidane play like their minds are connected.


----------



## SoyMac (Apr 16, 2005)

Was it understandable that Zidane cost his tream, his fans, and his country, the soccer world cup because he didn't keep his cool in response to trash talk?


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Depending on what Materazzi said said....yes. There is some stuff you don't shrug off period and there are some hot buttons best not pushed. Passion for a very physical game the game and a "passionate physical response to an insult" are hardly odd bedfellows.
I'll be interested to see what Fifa does.


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## SoyMac (Apr 16, 2005)

gnatsum said:


> ...
> Soymac, france can win without Zidane too i'm sure. ....


Yeah, good point. But I guess now we'll never know if France _could_ have won _with_ Zidane.


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## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

Maybe we should consider this in terms of what could have been done. 

As in, "Zidane showed remarkable restraint in not biting off a piece of ear."

There, now I'm impressed that he only delivered a headbutt in response to as yet unknown words. 

Soymac: I'd say it was understandable and incompetent and stupid.


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

I think it would be a grand gesture for FIFA to mike all of the players. An insult scale would be developed to decide what sort of physical response is appropriate to each grouping of insults. Players who exceed the recommended violent response would be penalized. Those who show restraint in their violent response (say a kick to the shins, when a blow to the solar plexus is appropriate) would receive a free kick--at their opponent, off-camera, so as not to glorify the violence.


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## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

The microphones are a good idea MF, otherwise the less honourable players would recoil and pout over fabricated insults in the hopes of drawing a penalty.

Recoil --> pout --> look around for the ref's attention --> if none, fall to the ground and roll around while grasping a randomly selected appendage --> look around for the ref's attention --> if none, stand up and prepare to repeat in 5 minutes


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## Macfury (Feb 3, 2006)

Exactly, Beej. Another important aspect of the rules, would be to have the person on the receiving end immediately repeat the insult to the referee and explain how his feelings were hurt, in order to ensure the recipient actually heard the insult and understood the harm it was intended to convey. Why offer a free kick to someone if that person's feelings weren't really hurt.

There would have to be a category for "nonsense insults" designed to offend, but not in the common vernacular. 

Refereee: What did he say?
Giuseppe: I don't know what he say. 
Referee: You feel bad?
Giuseppe: Kinda.
Referee: Mystery insult penalty!!


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

what I find most interesting is that the red card was given AFTER the replay of the head butt on the stadium monitor

the story I posted earlier in this thread indicates that the 4th ref (a sub) saw the head butt on a television screen and then he informed a linesman who then told the ref

if refs are to use "instant replay" for that incident then it should be used throughout the tournament especially for calls in the penalty area

all penalty kick awards should be reviewed on instant replay as they almost always result in a goal and therefore usually dramaticaly impact on the game

anyone remember australia/italy?


----------



## miguelsanchez (Feb 1, 2005)

What language are these players speaking? Supposedly Materazzi insulted Zidane in Italian, but Zidane speaks French, and probably Algerian Arabic, and maybe a little Spanish since he plays in Madrid, but is there a common language of insults? "Tu madre" I guess works in many Latin-based languages.

Also, in the Toronto Star today, another way to look at it:

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Co...ageid=968332188492&col=968793972154&t=TS_Home


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## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

SoyMac said:


> Was it understandable that Zidane cost his tream, his fans, and his country, the soccer world cup because he didn't keep his cool in response to trash talk?


I don't think he cost France the cup. They didn't lose with 10 men on the field. Italy scored every penalty shot they took. Zidane almost missed the one he took in the first half.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

MS the 4th referee is assigned to watch players away from the play and he claims he saw the entire incident directly.

••

Beej - incompetent hardly applies - he's not that in any way shape or form - stupid is also a odd term for his response - if anything both those terms apply to the Italian player for the level and content of baiting - it's not like Zidane started this.

Regrettable and impulsive perhaps for Zidane.


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## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

MacDoc said:


> Beej - incompetent hardly applies - he's not that in any way shape or form - stupid is also a odd term for his response - if anything both those terms apply to the Italian player for the level and content of baiting - it's not like Zidane started this.
> 
> Regrettable and impulsive perhaps for Zidane.


Think of incompetent and stupid, as labels for the act, within the context of leadership and winning the world cup match. Stupid may well apply to the headbuttee, but if rattling your opponent is the goal of trash talk, the label seems wrong. Words involving ass come to mind to describe him, assuming what he said is as people are claiming.

While 'standing up for himself' may sound all well and good, and there is the claim that it didn't matter that he was red-carded or it may have been a good thing, there's also the very real 'regrettable and impulsive' act that showed poor leadership (unless headbutting a**holes is leaderly) and consideration for the team's fortunes. Incompetence and stupidity. The alternative analysis may apply but, for now, it seems like more of a convoluted explanation for what looked like an act of passion, not analysis. Maybe further information about his injury or thoughts will surface to help clear things up.


----------



## Vandave (Feb 26, 2005)

Beej said:


> While 'standing up for himself' may sound all well and good, and there is the claim that it didn't matter that he was red-carded or it may have been a good thing, there's also the very real 'regrettable and impulsive' act that showed poor leadership (unless headbutting a**holes is leaderly) and consideration for the team's fortunes. Incompetence and stupidity. The alternative analysis may apply but, for now, it seems like more of a convoluted explanation for what looked like an act of passion, not analysis. Maybe further information about his injury or thoughts will surface to help clear things up.


I think it comes down to personal philosophy and beliefs. Some people believe violence is never acceptable or in the most extreme of events. Other people believe violence is justified after a personal verbal assault.

As I said before, I think Materazzi insulted more than just Zidane. He insulted his mother, a religion and a nation (assuming what the lip readers say is correct). I can understand his anger.

I think the Toronto Sun article is pretty good. Materazzi crossed the line and Zidane responded right away, directly without being a weasel about it. Although I am on fence about whether he would be justified in assaulting somebody, I have some respect for the way he did it.


----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

MacDoc said:


> MS the 4th referee is assigned to watch players away from the play and he claims he saw the entire incident directly.
> 
> ••
> 
> ...


article i read stated the french coach claimed the 4th ref saw the play on a monitor

with all the "stoppages" in soccer, surely they can use video replay
ALL awarded penalty kicks should be subject to video replay
FIFA needs to get into the 20th, nevermind 21st century


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

Vandave said:


> I think it comes down to personal philosophy and beliefs. Some people believe violence is never acceptable or in the most extreme of events. Other people believe violence is justified after a personal verbal assault.
> 
> As I said before, I think Materazzi insulted more than just Zidane. He insulted his mother, a religion and a nation (assuming what the lip readers say is correct). I can understand his anger.
> 
> I think the Toronto Sun article is pretty good. Materazzi crossed the line and Zidane responded right away, directly without being a weasel about it. Although I am on fence about whether he would be justified in assaulting somebody, I have some respect for the way he did it.


zidane was punished for his bad action(s)
materazzi was rewarded for his



> 2006 FIFA World Cup™ motto: "A time to make friends™".


yeah, right


----------



## used to be jwoodget (Aug 22, 2002)

I find it remarkable that people are finding excuses for inexcusable behaviour. He flipped, he's human. What Materazzi said is irrelevant. All the analysis has shown is that lip-readers are about as reliable as weather forecasters. Materazzi may well be a nasty piece of work, but he did not inflict physical violence on another player. Imagine if Zidane was a riot policeman with a weapon in his hand. There is NO excuse for instigation of physical violence on a soccer field or a street.

Another way of thinking about this is how many times did Zidane or any other player utter profanities or jibes during the World Cup? We have no way of knowing nor of how many instances of restraint were practiced by those being offended. The simple and irreputable fact is that Zidane chose to head butt a player in an opposing team and that it was witnessed.

I have no respect for Zidane because of the action he chose to take. But that doesn't mean I necessarily have any more respect for Materazzi - it's simply not relevant.


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## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

in the end italy wins the world cup and both of those players are jerks


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## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

Vandave said:


> I think it comes down to personal philosophy and beliefs. Some people believe violence is never acceptable or in the most extreme of events. Other people believe violence is justified after a personal verbal assault.
> 
> As I said before, I think Materazzi insulted more than just Zidane. He insulted his mother, a religion and a nation (assuming what the lip readers say is correct). I can understand his anger.
> 
> I think the Toronto Sun article is pretty good. Materazzi crossed the line and Zidane responded right away, directly without being a weasel about it. Although I am on fence about whether he would be justified in assaulting somebody, I have some respect for the way he did it.


Fair enough, and a good opening distinction. Thanks.


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## ArtistSeries (Nov 8, 2004)

Beej said:


> Fair enough, and a good opening distinction. Thanks.


Senseless violence is always funny and a key componant to comedy.


----------



## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

ArtistSeries said:


> Senseless violence is always funny and a key componant to comedy.


That video game was quite funny. I'm sure the talk show writers got some mileage out of it too. El Kabong strikes again! Cue sound effect.


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## Snapple Quaffer (Sep 2, 2003)

Zinadine Zidane, a scaled-down Billy Budd on the football field.

S**t-heads always foul life up for those around them. It's their only 'skill'.


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## overkill (May 15, 2005)

MACSPECTRUM said:


> in the end italy wins the world cup and both of those players are jerks


agreed!


----------



## Fink-Nottle (Feb 25, 2001)

*Materazzi is selling the shirt!*


----------



## comprehab (May 28, 2005)




----------



## MACSPECTRUM (Oct 31, 2002)

Snapple Quaffer said:


> Zinadine Zidane, a scaled-down Billy Budd on the football field.
> 
> S**t-heads always foul life up for those around them. It's their only 'skill'.


the winner of the best player of the tournament hardly has fouling up life for others as his only skill


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## Snapple Quaffer (Sep 2, 2003)

My poorly worded post - I didn't mean Zizou by that last bit.


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## overkill (May 15, 2005)

comprehab said:


>


ah pure genius...well done :clap: :clap: :clap:


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

BTW Zidane apologized but "no regrets".












> *II'm sorry but no regrets - Zidane*
> 
> Zidane has spoken about his sending-off for the first time
> Zinedine Zidane has apologised for his headbutt on Italian defender Marco Materazzi in Sunday's World Cup final.
> ...


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/world_cup_2006/5169342.stm

'bout right in my mind. :clap:


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Then there is this



> *Mad Materazzi *
> By Phil McNulty
> Chief football writer
> 
> ...


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/world_cup_2006/5168606.stm

I know which one gets my vote as classier player......


----------



## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

A bit more today


> In his appearance on the television station Canal Plus, Zidane apologized to his fans and to the children who watched him receive a red card and get expelled from the game, but said he does not regret his actions.
> 
> "I know it happened 10 minutes before the end of my career during the final of the World Cup and that it shouldn't have happened," he said. "But I cannot regret what I did because that would mean that [Materazzi] was right to say what he said.
> 
> ...


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060713.wxwczidane13/BNStory/Sports

That's certainly the pattern I saw - an escalation over a few exchanges ( short time frame) and then Zidane clearly had enough and reacted.
I seem to recall Zidane started to turn away then reacted to something. Too bad the video is awol.


----------



## Roosterboy (Jun 10, 2006)

*Did we all Miss the Point*

FIFA is a joke!
I will not excuse ZZ for his actions. However, this BS will continue as long as FIFA sticks it head in the sand. So much for the "SAY NO TO RACISM" banner the players all posed behind in the quarter finals. The diving, the acting and the on field crap has to end. Simple choice, let them solve their problems like the NHL (fighting, put up or shut up) or FIFA takes a hard line and bans players who detract from the "beautiful game". First offence 25 games, second 50 games and third you're done. I know some will call it gamesmanship, I call it cowardess. Play the game. C. Ronaldo winking after baiting Rooney into being stupid, news flash he is a head case to begin with doesn't take much. As for the people who badmouthed the referees try it. Those men and women now as they climb the ranks are world class athletes in their own right and each of them is smart enough to make decisions in a split second and raely make mistakes. Last point shame on the Italians for their behavior.


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

Good post :clap:


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

More- the pendulum seems to be swinging ...



> Fifa opens inquiry over Materazzi
> 
> Materazzi scored Italy's first-half equaliser in the final
> Italy defender Marco Materazzi faces disciplinary proceedings regarding his conduct in the World Cup final.
> ...


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/world_cup_2006/teams/italy/5177140.stm


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## modsuperstar (Nov 23, 2004)

I think this pretty much sums up the whole headbutting fiasco quite hilariously

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/07/13/zidane_headbutt_outrage/

Glasgow Handshake, that's gold


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## MacDoc (Nov 3, 2001)

THAT is hilarious. The headbutt heard around the world :clap:


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## mikeinmontreal (Oct 13, 2005)

I also like the Ronaldo Ebay auction item found on the same page on the website posted.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/07/05/ronaldo_transferred/


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## overkill (May 15, 2005)

modsuperstar said:


> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/07/13/zidane_headbutt_outrage/


Sad but true.


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## Kosh (May 27, 2002)

miguelsanchez said:


> What language are these players speaking? Supposedly Materazzi insulted Zidane in Italian, but Zidane speaks French, and probably Algerian Arabic, and maybe a little Spanish since he plays in Madrid, but is there a common language of insults? "Tu madre" I guess works in many Latin-based languages.


Zidane also probably knows a little Italian or Materazzi knows a little French. My Italian friend tells me it's easy to learn the other language once you know Italian or French.

I think this whole head-butt thing has been blown out of proportion. Yes, it's bad sportsmanship, but the Italian wasn't even hurt. It was nothing like the Bertussi incident. Of course when it's an incident in the most watched event on the planet, I guess it's gonna be analyzed under a microscope by everyone.


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## Beej (Sep 10, 2005)

http://www.cbc.ca/story/sports/national/2006/07/20/zidane-materazzi-fifa.html

.......
FIFA launched its investigation into both players after Zidane rammed his head into Materazzi's chest in the final. Zidane said Materazzi used racist remarks and that he insulted his mother and sister, but he refused to reveal the exact words used.

Materazzi admitted to insulting Zidane, but claimed he never uttered anything defamatory about his mother.

"In their statements, both players stressed that Materazzi's comments had been defamatory but not of a racist nature," FIFA said Thursday.
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